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POST-MATCH THREAD: Charlton Athletic vs Burton Albion: Saturday 23rd December 2023 | KO 3:00pm

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    Terrible game, we had a lot of possession but no quality in the final third. 

    When was the last time we had a decent game at home with a bit of atmosphere? The club is going nowhere, no identity on or off the pitch
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    NabySarr said:
    SDAddick said:
    ross1 said:
    Surely we will not be getting MA choice of players but Scott's choice, that way, when MA goes and is replaced, the style of play will be decided by Scott who will make sure the new head coach will play the way he wants with the players brought in to play that way
    That is the model of ours and other clubs, yes.
    I think it's supposed to be the model now. 

    It either hasn't been the model, or hasn't been done well enough, in recent years. 

    In the summer we clearly recruited for a 3-5-2, and Holden switched to a 4-3-3 in like the second or third game. And then we brought in Apples who plays 4-2-3-1. And as such, we don't have enough FB cover, especially solid defensive fullbacks, and we don't have a natural right winger.

    By my count we've started: May, TC, Tedic, Leaburn, Kanu, and Rylah at RW in the league. CC has started there in the cup but not sure about the league. We've basically played all of our attackers except Chuks and CBT on the right, which is absolutely the sign of a lack of joined up thinking. 
    Disagree, think we recruited for a 4-3-3. That’s the formation we played throughout pre season. Then we got tonked by Aberdeen and Holden panicked, started the season 3-5-2 against Orient. In five league games he played 3-5-2 four times and 4-3-3 once. As soon as he was gone, Pearce picked a 4-3-3 team.

    Edun and Tennai have historically mostly played traditional full back roles in their careers. I think we were recruited to played right back and left back, not wing back.

    Appleton was brought in because he plays 4-3-3/4-2-3-1 which gels with the recruitment strategy.

    And if we were going for three centre backs as the primary formation, you’d think we’d have signed more than just Jones to add to Hector, Ness and Thomas.
    If you go through our summer signings and our squad in general they have all played or done their best in a 3-5-2. 

    Watson played wing back for MK when they finished 3rd, Edun played a lot at wing back after Appleton left Lincoln and watching him play he’s poor defensively so definitely more suited to wing back. Frasers best spell was in a 3-5-2 at Burton/MK, Camara at Plymouth 3-5-2, Jones at Cambridge 3-5-2, May at Cheltenham 3-5-2 and so on 
    Agree to disagree I suppose. Only Andy Scott will tell you.

    But in my mind, the idea that we recruited for 3-5-2, then played 4-3-3 all of pre season, switched to 3-5-2 for the league games and then Holden got sacked for, in Scott’s words, not sticking to the plan, only to hire a coach who plays 4-3-3… none of that makes any sense.

    Why would we recruit for 3-5-2, then sack Holden who was playing 3-5-2 and replace him with someone who plays 4-3-3. If that’s what happened, Scott is not fit for purpose.

    Edun playing his best season was a traditional left back, despite his weaknesses. Jones spent a lot of time in a two as well as a three and I actually think he’s been way more comfortable in a two since he’s been here.
    Hold my hands up on the formation thing, just watched some highlights back and it is a 3-5-2. Was looking at apps which showed it was a 4-3-3.


    Sigh, this club.
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    NabySarr said:
    SDAddick said:
    ross1 said:
    Surely we will not be getting MA choice of players but Scott's choice, that way, when MA goes and is replaced, the style of play will be decided by Scott who will make sure the new head coach will play the way he wants with the players brought in to play that way
    That is the model of ours and other clubs, yes.
    I think it's supposed to be the model now. 

    It either hasn't been the model, or hasn't been done well enough, in recent years. 

    In the summer we clearly recruited for a 3-5-2, and Holden switched to a 4-3-3 in like the second or third game. And then we brought in Apples who plays 4-2-3-1. And as such, we don't have enough FB cover, especially solid defensive fullbacks, and we don't have a natural right winger.

    By my count we've started: May, TC, Tedic, Leaburn, Kanu, and Rylah at RW in the league. CC has started there in the cup but not sure about the league. We've basically played all of our attackers except Chuks and CBT on the right, which is absolutely the sign of a lack of joined up thinking. 
    Disagree, think we recruited for a 4-3-3. That’s the formation we played throughout pre season. Then we got tonked by Aberdeen and Holden panicked, started the season 3-5-2 against Orient. In five league games he played 3-5-2 four times and 4-3-3 once. As soon as he was gone, Pearce picked a 4-3-3 team.

    Edun and Tennai have historically mostly played traditional full back roles in their careers. I think we were recruited to played right back and left back, not wing back.

    Appleton was brought in because he plays 4-3-3/4-2-3-1 which gels with the recruitment strategy.

    And if we were going for three centre backs as the primary formation, you’d think we’d have signed more than just Jones to add to Hector, Ness and Thomas.
    If you go through our summer signings and our squad in general they have all played or done their best in a 3-5-2. 

    Watson played wing back for MK when they finished 3rd, Edun played a lot at wing back after Appleton left Lincoln and watching him play he’s poor defensively so definitely more suited to wing back. Frasers best spell was in a 3-5-2 at Burton/MK, Camara at Plymouth 3-5-2, Jones at Cambridge 3-5-2, May at Cheltenham 3-5-2 and so on 
    Agree to disagree I suppose. Only Andy Scott will tell you.

    But in my mind, the idea that we recruited for 3-5-2, then played 4-3-3 all of pre season, switched to 3-5-2 for the league games and then Holden got sacked for, in Scott’s words, not sticking to the plan, only to hire a coach who plays 4-3-3… none of that makes any sense.

    Why would we recruit for 3-5-2, then sack Holden who was playing 3-5-2 and replace him with someone who plays 4-3-3. If that’s what happened, Scott is not fit for purpose.

    Edun playing his best season was a traditional left back, despite his weaknesses. Jones spent a lot of time in a two as well as a three and I actually think he’s been way more comfortable in a two since he’s been here.
    I’m sorry but you’re talking a load of bollocks. We played 3 at the back all pre-season? Holden played 3 at the back for the first 2 games (in which we did quite well) then switched to 4-3-3 and then back to 3-5-2 for the Oxford game which was a disaster. But for Scott to claim he was surprised at us playing 3 at the back is a load of bollocks, we played it from the first pre-season game to the last and signed players that had played it last season 
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    Gribbo said:
    Thought CBT, Dobbo and May all off the boil today and Hector - Puts in a decent cross to make the goal / Gets caught ball watching for the equaliser.
    He wasn't alone there though was he...
    I never said he was.
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    352 would suit Alfie, and it would suit Hector as it would give him far more licence to bring the ball out.
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    edited December 2023
    We have two winnable games coming up which we have to win. The January business needs to be early, not on deadline day. I can't see either happening.
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    NabySarr said:
    NabySarr said:
    SDAddick said:
    ross1 said:
    Surely we will not be getting MA choice of players but Scott's choice, that way, when MA goes and is replaced, the style of play will be decided by Scott who will make sure the new head coach will play the way he wants with the players brought in to play that way
    That is the model of ours and other clubs, yes.
    I think it's supposed to be the model now. 

    It either hasn't been the model, or hasn't been done well enough, in recent years. 

    In the summer we clearly recruited for a 3-5-2, and Holden switched to a 4-3-3 in like the second or third game. And then we brought in Apples who plays 4-2-3-1. And as such, we don't have enough FB cover, especially solid defensive fullbacks, and we don't have a natural right winger.

    By my count we've started: May, TC, Tedic, Leaburn, Kanu, and Rylah at RW in the league. CC has started there in the cup but not sure about the league. We've basically played all of our attackers except Chuks and CBT on the right, which is absolutely the sign of a lack of joined up thinking. 
    Disagree, think we recruited for a 4-3-3. That’s the formation we played throughout pre season. Then we got tonked by Aberdeen and Holden panicked, started the season 3-5-2 against Orient. In five league games he played 3-5-2 four times and 4-3-3 once. As soon as he was gone, Pearce picked a 4-3-3 team.

    Edun and Tennai have historically mostly played traditional full back roles in their careers. I think we were recruited to played right back and left back, not wing back.

    Appleton was brought in because he plays 4-3-3/4-2-3-1 which gels with the recruitment strategy.

    And if we were going for three centre backs as the primary formation, you’d think we’d have signed more than just Jones to add to Hector, Ness and Thomas.
    If you go through our summer signings and our squad in general they have all played or done their best in a 3-5-2. 

    Watson played wing back for MK when they finished 3rd, Edun played a lot at wing back after Appleton left Lincoln and watching him play he’s poor defensively so definitely more suited to wing back. Frasers best spell was in a 3-5-2 at Burton/MK, Camara at Plymouth 3-5-2, Jones at Cambridge 3-5-2, May at Cheltenham 3-5-2 and so on 
    Agree to disagree I suppose. Only Andy Scott will tell you.

    But in my mind, the idea that we recruited for 3-5-2, then played 4-3-3 all of pre season, switched to 3-5-2 for the league games and then Holden got sacked for, in Scott’s words, not sticking to the plan, only to hire a coach who plays 4-3-3… none of that makes any sense.

    Why would we recruit for 3-5-2, then sack Holden who was playing 3-5-2 and replace him with someone who plays 4-3-3. If that’s what happened, Scott is not fit for purpose.

    Edun playing his best season was a traditional left back, despite his weaknesses. Jones spent a lot of time in a two as well as a three and I actually think he’s been way more comfortable in a two since he’s been here.
    I’m sorry but you’re talking a load of bollocks. We played 3 at the back all pre-season? Holden played 3 at the back for the first 2 games (in which we did quite well) then switched to 4-3-3 and then back to 3-5-2 for the Oxford game which was a disaster. But for Scott to claim he was surprised at us playing 3 at the back is a load of bollocks, we played it from the first pre-season game to the last and signed players that had played it last season 
    Scott should have been a lot closer to what Holden was planning (as he now acts like he wasn’t) and then he should have hired a manager that plays 3-5-2 to get the best out of May. 

    We approached loads of managers, Challinor at Stockport plays 3-5-2 and would have been my choice but unfortunately he didn’t talk to us. But that shows the lack of plan from Scott that we were approaching such a variety of managers with different formations, approached Challinor and recruited Appleton who plays a different system. The recruitment/style of play/formation should all be set by him and we should be recruiting managers and players to fit but there seems to be a real lack of joined up thinking and that’s why he’s deservedly being criticised
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    Gribbo said:
    Gribbo said:
    Thought CBT, Dobbo and May all off the boil today and Hector - Puts in a decent cross to make the goal / Gets caught ball watching for the equaliser.
    He wasn't alone there though was he...
    I never said he was.
    No......it wasn't aimed at you, just a general observation...🤷‍♂️
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    edited December 2023
    I am fed up of players losing so many 2nd balls. If they haven't got it they can fcuk off. I have had it up to here with Fraser. As I said last week, a luxury player who gives you no luxury! Appleton had to make offensive subs because we can't sit on a lead but we seemed to sit back all the same! If you can't do it, don't do it.
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    Blimey that was a tough watch. Like everyone else just knew they were gonna nick a goal at the end. I’m not sure we’ve a load of bottlers who don’t care, we just have mainly bang average players that aren’t good enough to get us near the top of the league. Unless that changes in January which let’s be honest is very unlikely then I expect more of the same for the foreseeable.
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    I think we need to give Appleton a window. We can't keep sacking managers. It doesn't work.
    Will he clean it with his head?
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    352 would suit Alfie, and it would suit Hector as it would give him far more licence to bring the ball out.
    Wouldn't suit CBT though and that was the problem once Leaburn got injured we had nobody to hold the ball up alongside May. We also had no wing backs early on.
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    ross1 said:
    Surely we will not be getting MA choice of players but Scott's choice, that way, when MA goes and is replaced, the style of play will be decided by Scott who will make sure the new head coach will play the way he wants with the players brought in to play that way
    That is the model of ours and other clubs, yes.
    So why has Appleton been moaning recently? Surely we replaced Holden with a like-for-like manager, who could use Holden's players like they were his.

    Or was Holden right and they were crap all along. 
    Holden got the boot because he was meant to be playing 4-3-3 most of the time (I don’t think Scott dictates formation on a game by game basis, but he does expect that we’ll play the formation that’s been recruited for) and Holden wasn’t holding up his end of the deal. And losing games while doing it.

    Appleton probably joined the club thinking he would only have to change formation and tweak a few things and the wins would come. Like most outsiders, he probably saw the names in the squad and assumed we should be top six.

    It’s only now, a few months in, that he’s been exposed to the reality of our deficiencies.
    So,in essence, all will be alright by the end of January once we havecrecruited the 5 or 6 players we need.

    Brilliant. Can't wait to start going again & seeing all those wins. 
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    The club is dying…..couldn’t have been more than 5-6k in the ground…..a team that couldn’t give a shit and owners who are looking to flip for a profit…..Merry fcuking Xmas
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    Its telling that our best spell this season was when Aneke and Leaburn were fit. Midfield is crap though whatever formation we play 
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    se9addick said:
    Chunes said:
    SDAddick said:
    SDAddick said:
    A real boon for those only interested in the team for when they get to call them "gutless" or whatever. A great day for them.



    Sorry, calling out fans is a nonsense. There is not a single fan who think this is a great day. Sure some are more pessimistic/glass half full but no.one.on here wants Charlton to lose.

    I see lots of posters who go to games, pumping their money into the club and totally fed up with another pathetic season, a poor team, a poor manager and a dreadful result (again) against a dreadful opposition (again).

    As Ohhahh regularly points out this is pretty much our worst running league performance ever at the same time our rivals are outperforming. It is hardly surprising fans are fed up.
    I absolutely agree about that today, but there are some on here who literally only post when we have a poor result. It is not their fault, and I didn't say it was. But it has been noteworthy for weeks if not months that some almost celebrate the bad results and are quiet about the good ones. And that is what I find baffling. 
    Honestly, with all politeness, I think you need to pipe down a bit here. You don't get it. Having overseas fans is fantastic but it's a hobby for you at the end of the day. Growing up in SE London, working class, your football team is unexplainable. I mean you didn't get why losing to the Gills was a big deal. You're so welcome as a fan but as the same time you have to have a hint of deference and to be lecturing us on how to support our team is ridiculous. 
    Ridiculous comments. Anyone who is willing to put any of their time in to support this team, from wherever they are in the world, is just as entitled to their view as anyone else. 
    Disagree. It's SDAddick whose comments are ridiculous. If you've gone today you are entitled to moan and whine all you want and to say today's game was a boon for those who want to do so is wrong. He's entitled to his opinion of course but it's easy when you are overseas and not as invested in the games. I don't comment on away performances as I'm not there so how can I? He mentioned fans who only comment on these threads when we have had a bad result and that it's noticeable who they are. Has he ever thought that fans may not comment because they weren't there?
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    It is not the fans who have been or are the problem with this club.
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    ct_addick said:
    The club is dying…..couldn’t have been more than 5-6k in the ground…..a team that couldn’t give a shit and owners who are looking to flip for a profit…..Merry fcuking Xmas
    Not that I agree with your comment regarding the owners, but the idea of "flipping for a profit" is not gonna happen until we are out of this shite league...for anyone.
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    The players must have had their Christmas do this week, going by some of their performances, their still on it!!!
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    We have two winnable games coming up which we have to win. The January business needs to be early, not on deadline day. I can't see either happening.
    Every game is winnable, today's more so than the next two. We know what happened today.
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    We have two winnable games coming up which we have to win. The January business needs to be early, not on deadline day. I can't see either happening.
    We’ve just had 2 winnable games at home and dropped 4 points., my expectations are low, very low.
    So are mine but these games are winnable and we have to win them. That was all my point was. 
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