I think the fact that he knows America and the way they do things there is relevant to how he has behaved here. In America this kind of thing probably gets received with more enthusiasm especially the bit where he plays the guitar and writes a song for the club and then goes ahead and place it on the pitch. This“Putting yourself out there“ in America probably is the way to set the tone. Here we are slightly more reserved and are slightly more cynical of open displays of emotion like this.
I couldn’t hear any of the Curbs stuff as all the noise around me in the Covered end. The yoofs just carried on singing through it! Fuming disgrace RRR was dropped hopefully a One off
I sat in the Covered End and you can’t hear anything even when there’s no signing.
The poll is on Twitter or Facebook or whatever it is, so it excludes the thousands of Charlton fans who don’t have those things. This kind of creeping cultural apartheid is commonplace sadly, for those who do not wish to enrich those companies or have the competence to use those things. Either way the RRR is in my opinion sacrosanct.
The amount of knicker twisting from our fans at the moment is getting really old. Every single little thing the club does is treated like it’s the worst thing that has ever happened.
Yes TS is an eccentric owner who clearly wants to try different things to engage the fan base and grow that fan base, will all those things work? Definitely not. Has he given us any reason to think he won’t listen to fans when concerns are voiced? Again absolutely not.
We run the risk of coming across as a really entitled fan base when we scream and shout at every tiny thing.
Well exactly this, you would think the blokes who spend half there time passionately complaining about stuff like this lead perfect lives outside of football. It's like you're not allowed to make mistakes these days, learn from them and grow.
There's a productive channel you can now voice issues like this to through the fan advisor, and imagine we lived in a world where those who didn't like what happened yesterday could contact said person with constructive feedback as to where they thought what happened was wrong.
But instead due the tribalism in football we get a bunch of conspiracy theories, name calling, and entitled posts by people who it feels just need something to get angry about.
Is he not allowed to make a mistake? The overreaction on this is ridiculous. It won’t happen again, we move on.
Must admit this sums up how I feel. Not dismissing the mistake, but in general on social media I have seen a few little digs at TS cropping up more recently. Transfers, the way he runs the club (operational structure), his ego etc. I think he’s still learning. Learning what to say and who to say it to (eg, he doesn’t engage with the fans on social media anymore), he might’ve realised that there’s a fair few fans that have taken his words literally with ‘blow the league out the water’, and I think he’s learning that football is bottomless pit of losing money, and is perhaps now being a tad more prudent in how he runs the club.
We’ll always get this showman side from him. Some won’t like it and that’s fair enough, but I do feel some of us have forgotten he’s never run a football club before, and I’m sure he’ll recognize this is a mistake and it won’t happen again
There will be criticism that is fair and criticism that is unfair - that’s just how football and life is. Fact is a number of people did know this was happening yesterday and either felt they couldn’t get this across to Thomas or tried without success. Either is an issue.
I have no time for the “knives are being sharpened” drivel, especially when it comes from posters who lined up behind the spivs/Duchatelet or Southall in the past and called out their critics too.
You can appreciate what Thomas has done and still think he isn’t a “perfect genius“. He’s going to need more investment and that is likely to bring other voices to the table, which may help him.
Someone who knows him better than most told me yesterday that he believes he has cleared out “hangers-on”. Not sure who that is.
What I see is some gimmicky nonsense (e.g. certificates for adult fan groups, 20% drink discount) and continuation of Meire-era mistakes e.g. clumsy pricing structure, Valley Express price hikes, self-defeating cost-cutting at The Valley, Tony Keohane.
Are there good things happening too? Yes, obviously. Adkins looks a decent appointment. Floyd and Harvey may seem trivial but it has a lot of symbolism. Comms improvements, especially Charlton TV last season. We’ll judge football restructuring on outcomes and see what happens with the training ground.
Thomas is evidently an engaging, generous character and will go his own way. I have every respect for what he has done in seeing off the ESI crooks, but he’s not a god and he will make mistakes. There will be criticism. Get over it.
The amount of knicker twisting from our fans at the moment is getting really old. Every single little thing the club does is treated like it’s the worst thing that has ever happened.
Yes TS is an eccentric owner who clearly wants to try different things to engage the fan base and grow that fan base, will all those things work? Definitely not. Has he given us any reason to think he won’t listen to fans when concerns are voiced? Again absolutely not.
We run the risk of coming across as a really entitled fan base when we scream and shout at every tiny thing.
Well exactly this, you would think the blokes who spend half there time passionately complaining about stuff like this lead perfect lives outside of football. It's like you're not allowed to make mistakes these days, learn from them and grow.
There's a productive channel you can now voice issues like this to through the fan advisor, and imagine we lived in a world where those who didn't like what happened yesterday could contact said person with constructive feedback as to where they thought what happened was wrong.
But instead due the tribalism in football we get a bunch of conspiracy theories, name calling, and entitled posts by people who it feels just need something to get angry about.
Think it’s a bit early to say the “fan adviser” is a “productive channel”.
The amount of knicker twisting from our fans at the moment is getting really old. Every single little thing the club does is treated like it’s the worst thing that has ever happened.
Yes TS is an eccentric owner who clearly wants to try different things to engage the fan base and grow that fan base, will all those things work? Definitely not. Has he given us any reason to think he won’t listen to fans when concerns are voiced? Again absolutely not.
We run the risk of coming across as a really entitled fan base when we scream and shout at every tiny thing.
Well exactly this, you would think the blokes who spend half there time passionately complaining about stuff like this lead perfect lives outside of football. It's like you're not allowed to make mistakes these days, learn from them and grow.
There's a productive channel you can now voice issues like this to through the fan advisor, and imagine we lived in a world where those who didn't like what happened yesterday could contact said person with constructive feedback as to where they thought what happened was wrong.
But instead due the tribalism in football we get a bunch of conspiracy theories, name calling, and entitled posts by people who it feels just need something to get angry about.
Think it’s a bit early to say the “fan adviser” is a “productive channel”.
Why's it not productive in your opinion. Do you think she won't be able to pass on direct information to Sandgaard or someone else in senior management around the dissatisfaction of a large amount of the fan base?
Whether he takes it on board is a different matter.
Either way my point still stands. And it mirrors somewhat, what you said as in there will be fair and unfair criticism. I totally get why people may be aggrieved by what happened yesterday (I don't even think the song should be a thing at all), but the way 'some* individuals go about voicing there criticism, and the sort of stuff they say, I find somewhat mystifying from adults.
The amount of knicker twisting from our fans at the moment is getting really old. Every single little thing the club does is treated like it’s the worst thing that has ever happened.
Yes TS is an eccentric owner who clearly wants to try different things to engage the fan base and grow that fan base, will all those things work? Definitely not. Has he given us any reason to think he won’t listen to fans when concerns are voiced? Again absolutely not.
We run the risk of coming across as a really entitled fan base when we scream and shout at every tiny thing.
Well exactly this, you would think the blokes who spend half there time passionately complaining about stuff like this lead perfect lives outside of football. It's like you're not allowed to make mistakes these days, learn from them and grow.
There's a productive channel you can now voice issues like this to through the fan advisor, and imagine we lived in a world where those who didn't like what happened yesterday could contact said person with constructive feedback as to where they thought what happened was wrong.
But instead due the tribalism in football we get a bunch of conspiracy theories, name calling, and entitled posts by people who it feels just need something to get angry about.
Think it’s a bit early to say the “fan adviser” is a “productive channel”.
Why's it not productive in your opinion. Do you think she won't be able to pass on direct information to Sandgaard or someone else in senior management around the dissatisfaction of a large amount of the fan base?
Whether he takes it on board is a different matter.
Either way my point still stands. And it mirrors somewhat, what you said as in there will be fair and unfair criticism. I totally get why people may be aggrieved by what happened yesterday (I don't even think the song should be a thing at all), but the way 'some* individuals go about voicing there criticism, and the sort of stuff they say, I find somewhat mystifying from adults.
Outcomes? If we can’t attribute specific achievements to the fan adviser then it’s not been productive - yet. Currently it’s just a PR gimmick.
This is about the role not the individual, to be clear.
Otherwise I don’t think your comment on how people express themselves is specific to TS, Charlton or football. You should see some of the vituperative, ignorant drivel people post online about local government.
The amount of knicker twisting from our fans at the moment is getting really old. Every single little thing the club does is treated like it’s the worst thing that has ever happened.
Yes TS is an eccentric owner who clearly wants to try different things to engage the fan base and grow that fan base, will all those things work? Definitely not. Has he given us any reason to think he won’t listen to fans when concerns are voiced? Again absolutely not.
We run the risk of coming across as a really entitled fan base when we scream and shout at every tiny thing.
Well exactly this, you would think the blokes who spend half there time passionately complaining about stuff like this lead perfect lives outside of football. It's like you're not allowed to make mistakes these days, learn from them and grow.
There's a productive channel you can now voice issues like this to through the fan advisor, and imagine we lived in a world where those who didn't like what happened yesterday could contact said person with constructive feedback as to where they thought what happened was wrong.
But instead due the tribalism in football we get a bunch of conspiracy theories, name calling, and entitled posts by people who it feels just need something to get angry about.
Think it’s a bit early to say the “fan adviser” is a “productive channel”.
Why's it not productive in your opinion. Do you think she won't be able to pass on direct information to Sandgaard or someone else in senior management around the dissatisfaction of a large amount of the fan base?
Whether he takes it on board is a different matter.
Either way my point still stands. And it mirrors somewhat, what you said as in there will be fair and unfair criticism. I totally get why people may be aggrieved by what happened yesterday (I don't even think the song should be a thing at all), but the way 'some* individuals go about voicing there criticism, and the sort of stuff they say, I find somewhat mystifying from adults.
Outcomes?
Okay, slighty confused. Are you saying that the feedback given to the fan Advisor will or won't find its way to the powers that be?
The amount of knicker twisting from our fans at the moment is getting really old. Every single little thing the club does is treated like it’s the worst thing that has ever happened.
Yes TS is an eccentric owner who clearly wants to try different things to engage the fan base and grow that fan base, will all those things work? Definitely not. Has he given us any reason to think he won’t listen to fans when concerns are voiced? Again absolutely not.
We run the risk of coming across as a really entitled fan base when we scream and shout at every tiny thing.
Well exactly this, you would think the blokes who spend half there time passionately complaining about stuff like this lead perfect lives outside of football. It's like you're not allowed to make mistakes these days, learn from them and grow.
There's a productive channel you can now voice issues like this to through the fan advisor, and imagine we lived in a world where those who didn't like what happened yesterday could contact said person with constructive feedback as to where they thought what happened was wrong.
But instead due the tribalism in football we get a bunch of conspiracy theories, name calling, and entitled posts by people who it feels just need something to get angry about.
Think it’s a bit early to say the “fan adviser” is a “productive channel”.
Why's it not productive in your opinion. Do you think she won't be able to pass on direct information to Sandgaard or someone else in senior management around the dissatisfaction of a large amount of the fan base?
Whether he takes it on board is a different matter.
Either way my point still stands. And it mirrors somewhat, what you said as in there will be fair and unfair criticism. I totally get why people may be aggrieved by what happened yesterday (I don't even think the song should be a thing at all), but the way 'some* individuals go about voicing there criticism, and the sort of stuff they say, I find somewhat mystifying from adults.
Outcomes?
Okay, slighty confused. Are you saying that the feedback given to the fan Advisor will or won't find its way to the powers that be?
I think he's saying that we need to see tangible improvements happen directly as a result of what fans have been suggesting to the fan advisor.
Well indeed, but my point (perhaps does not come across as well as intended) was there's much more productive ways to voice your opinion then throwing your toys out the pram and coming up with all manner of triablist entitled posts.
Whether you get any positive outcomes, only time will tell and ultimately that will be senior management's decision to make - not the "fan advisors" - whose appointment already seems to have falling into what Covered_End_Lad mentioned around fans moaning about every little thing.
Only time will tell. Though as ever it looks like *some* people are never willing to give anyone that time before making judgements.
Well indeed, but my point (perhaps does not come across as well as intended) was there's much more productive ways to voice your opinion then throwing your toys out the pram and coming up with all manner of triablist entitled posts.
Whether you get any positive outcomes, only time will tell and ultimately that will be senior management's decision to make - not the "fan advisors" - whose appointment already seems to have falling into what Covered_End_Lad mentioned around fans moaning about every little thing.
Only time will tell. Though as ever it looks like *some* people are never willing to give anyone that time before making judgements.
I think you’re falling into the trap of using a forum for expressing opinions to voice concern about people expressing opinions.
I know a number of fans who were quite upset about RRR yesterday, including my daughter who is 22, so it was not just older supporters.
My own view was that it was unlikely to be a recurring problem because the fans won’t have it, regardless of the owner’s preference. And I don’t think he will want to be on the wrong side of the majority on such an issue once he sees that.
Well indeed, but my point (perhaps does not come across as well as intended) was there's much more productive ways to voice your opinion then throwing your toys out the pram and coming up with all manner of triablist entitled posts.
Whether you get any positive outcomes, only time will tell and ultimately that will be senior management's decision to make - not the "fan advisors" - whose appointment already seems to have falling into what Covered_End_Lad mentioned around fans moaning about every little thing.
Only time will tell. Though as ever it looks like *some* people are never willing to give anyone that time before making judgements.
I think you’re falling into the trap of using a forum for expressing opinions to voice concern about people expressing opinions.
I've got nothing wrong with opinion, especially, when funny enough, I agree with the opinion. I've got an issue/concern with how people express opinion - 'typical yank' etc.
But again, maybe I've not be explicit enough about that.
The amount of knicker twisting from our fans at the moment is getting really old. Every single little thing the club does is treated like it’s the worst thing that has ever happened.
Yes TS is an eccentric owner who clearly wants to try different things to engage the fan base and grow that fan base, will all those things work? Definitely not. Has he given us any reason to think he won’t listen to fans when concerns are voiced? Again absolutely not.
We run the risk of coming across as a really entitled fan base when we scream and shout at every tiny thing.
Nail on the head, I know forums are for discussion.. but we definitely lean further to the pissing and moaning side of things on here.
The amount of knicker twisting from our fans at the moment is getting really old. Every single little thing the club does is treated like it’s the worst thing that has ever happened.
Yes TS is an eccentric owner who clearly wants to try different things to engage the fan base and grow that fan base, will all those things work? Definitely not. Has he given us any reason to think he won’t listen to fans when concerns are voiced? Again absolutely not.
We run the risk of coming across as a really entitled fan base when we scream and shout at every tiny thing.
Totally agree. It’s become tiresome. I just hope that TS has thick skin because if he hasn’t and pulls the plug because of these moaners and complainers they will only have themselves to blame .
Speaking as someone who’s been known to dabble in the football song genre on occasion, ( 🙄🤦🏻♂️) firstly I would say, good on him for giving it a go. I can’t think of any other club owner doing that, so it’s not the worst thing an owner could do imho. RD on the other hand danced whether we won or lost. Anyway, I think the ‘mistake’ yesterday was playing it at the wrong time. An emotional return to the Valley should have been accompanied by RRR as the team came out. Addicks to Victory could have slotted in comfortably alongside other songs routinely played at the start like Into the Valley, London Calling and VFR. He would have likely got some praise for his efforts. As for the song itself, it is really tricky to write a terrace anthem because you never quite know what will stick and get taken up by the crowd. My pennyworth on Addicks to Victory would be to focus on that line ‘Addicks to Victory’ right from the start, speed it up a bit, repeat it loads and make that the chant in the hope it catches on.👍🏻 But really what do I know? 🤷♂️
A few good results, some new players in, and it could be a feature.of the pre match or half time, And maybe he should sell it as a download for a fund raiser for a worthy Charlton cause?
Speaking as an "also appearing" (assuming you didn't edit me out completely) I think you just can't beat a bit of Billy Cotton.
Yesterday was a strangely nostalgic day. Do you remember that evening kick-off in Leeds where you, Dave and myself drove back through the city centre with the windows wound down playing "We sing much louder than you" as loud as the speakers could manage?
Remember it well! 🙂👍🏻 And that was definitely an Oooh Scotty Parker day….
The amount of knicker twisting from our fans at the moment is getting really old. Every single little thing the club does is treated like it’s the worst thing that has ever happened.
Yes TS is an eccentric owner who clearly wants to try different things to engage the fan base and grow that fan base, will all those things work? Definitely not. Has he given us any reason to think he won’t listen to fans when concerns are voiced? Again absolutely not.
We run the risk of coming across as a really entitled fan base when we scream and shout at every tiny thing.
Totally agree. It’s become tiresome. I just hope that TS has thick skin because if he hasn’t and pulls the plug because of these moaners and complainers they will only have themselves to blame .
Doubt if anyone will last long in football (or business) if they can’t take criticism (fair or unfair).
Change the entrance song at any club in this country for an owner's own song, and there would be uproar. Does make me laugh that some on here think a moaning fanbase is something exclusive to Charlton.
Change the entrance song at any club in this country for an owner's own song, and there would be uproar. Does make me laugh that some on here think a moaning fanbase is something exclusive to Charlton.
And a moaning fanbase can be heard and listened to.
Cardiff supporters kicked up enough stink to get their home shirts changed back to blue after the nonsense of changing it to red.
Change the entrance song at any club in this country for an owner's own song, and there would be uproar. Does make me laugh that some on here think a moaning fanbase is something exclusive to Charlton.
And a moaning fanbase can be heard and listened to.
Cardiff supporters kicked up enough stink to get their home shirts changed back to blue after the nonsense of changing it to red.
Exactly. Wonder how many on the bluebirds forum were calling each other entitled for that, 'Just be grateful he's bought us' etc etc
i have to say it’s all a bit much everyone getting precious over a song not being played for what may be a one off at a certain time, it was played while the ex players were introduced for the curbishley stand opening. I wonder how many on here that are up in arms, we’re actually at the game?, if you weren’t then don’t fix.;ng moan, because the bloke that put millions in was. God forbid someone trying something new and upsetting the traditionalists, they might boycott or something. I agree The team should come out to RRR, and then ATR for the 2nd half. But bloody hell the over reaction is just too full of entitlement.TS is trying to make Charlton a good fun place to enjoy and move on from all the shit, and yet people want to continue with negativity and moaning because it suits them.
I wasn't at the game because I am isolating so couldn't be there. Having put thousands into the club over the past thirty years including best part of a grand on season ticket, valley gold I am entitled to have an opinion on someone coming in for 5 minutes and changing a mainstay tradition for a self imposed ego trip. Was Curbishley's day yesterday yet there is TS standing there garnering all the attention.
Do I think he is a bad bloke a'la Southall et el- no of course not. Is he a dour balance sheet weirdo like Duchatelet- no.
And of course he has come in and stopped the club from potentially folding/ facing dire straights which we are of course all grateful for. However, Duchatelet essentially did that to a degree.
What I really don't understand after the past 3 ownerships is how quickly Charlton fans seem to drop to their knees and hero- worship anyone who comes in. Yes he is keeping the club going and has stopped us facing dire straights but that is a symptom of how fucked up modern football is- it doesn't mean they get carte blanche to do what they want or bastardise the traditions of our great club.
I will give TS the benefit of the doubt but I have great concerns that there may be a bit of emperor's clothes here. I don't think he is a wrong un a'la Southall and Nimir but I do think he is perhaps very naïve about football and has massively underestimated what is required to progress a football club in the hugely competitive and pitfall- ridden English leagues.
I have concerns about how long the funding is sustainable, whether he has the funds or the appetite for the reality of the level of spend that is required to get out of this league and then try to even compete, let alone push on, in the Championship and nothing I;ve seen player recruitment wise so far has really given me much confidence in that department and we have started the season after a whole summer to prepare with right backs at left back and no bench.
Yes this is a very negative and pessimistic outlook but after the last 3 owners and seeing the lack of investment in the playing squad which under prior ownerships would likely have caused wider concern and raised further questions.
The bluster and pie in the sky talk of European football etc was a red flag that he didn't get it and whilst optimistic can do positivity has its place it won't get you goals against Accrington Stanley.
I really don't get how people are so quick to elevate new comers to legend status and the "Cult of Sandgaard" means that any of us voicing concerns or criticising things like the replacement of RRR with a vanity project are frowned upon as miserable bastards (not to say that we aren't necessarily).
Don't forget we have put in £5m in season ticket sales so it's not all bankrolled and we are entitled to have a view even if it involves criticising or raising concerns about an owner who seems to have attained messianic status within 5 minutes of rocking up.
I've been following Charlton for 30 plus years through the lows and lows as most of us have and will continue to do so and will care more about it than any non- Charlton fan owner now or in future.
I want to be proved wrong and will happily swallow every word of the above if he delivers but until then whilst grateful he has stopped us going under and is funding us I reserve the right as a paying fan of 30 years to be reluctant to go nuts in on worshipping/ not criticising egotistical stuff like this poxy song.
Please just focus on building the football side of things and the accolades and praise will follow when they have been earnt.
I agree with most of what you have expressed, however everyone is entitled to there opinion, whether they have been a fan for 5 or 50 years, or have spent £50 or £50million. I’ve been a fan for over 40 years but do I think my opinion is more worthy than a 30 year supporting fan,,No. At the moment and I understand the reasonswhy, there seems to be a mantra of guilty and prove yourself to be innocent. Which in my opinion is quite sad. TS as it stands has done absolutely nothing wrong and the smallest issues are being jumped upon. I’m not someone to hero worship anybody as I believe people should be seen as equals, but I also appreciate the man has the clubs interest at heart and until he is proven guilty of not doing this and should be supported. Too many people are very keen to prove why they are charltons no.1 fan on this forum and yet we all spend our time and hard earned money on whichever level of affordability we can. We all want the same outcome and yet a song that HASNT been replaced is getting people on there high horse.
Comments
There's a productive channel you can now voice issues like this to through the fan advisor, and imagine we lived in a world where those who didn't like what happened yesterday could contact said person with constructive feedback as to where they thought what happened was wrong.
But instead due the tribalism in football we get a bunch of conspiracy theories, name calling, and entitled posts by people who it feels just need something to get angry about.
I have no time for the “knives are being sharpened” drivel, especially when it comes from posters who lined up behind the spivs/Duchatelet or Southall in the past and called out their critics too.
Are there good things happening too? Yes, obviously. Adkins looks a decent appointment. Floyd and Harvey may seem trivial but it has a lot of symbolism. Comms improvements, especially Charlton TV last season. We’ll judge football restructuring on outcomes and see what happens with the training ground.
Thomas is evidently an engaging, generous character and will go his own way. I have every respect for what he has done in seeing off the ESI crooks, but he’s not a god and he will make mistakes. There will be criticism. Get over it.
Whether he takes it on board is a different matter.
Either way my point still stands. And it mirrors somewhat, what you said as in there will be fair and unfair criticism. I totally get why people may be aggrieved by what happened yesterday (I don't even think the song should be a thing at all), but the way 'some* individuals go about voicing there criticism, and the sort of stuff they say, I find somewhat mystifying from adults.
This is about the role not the individual, to be clear.
Otherwise I don’t think your comment on how people express themselves is specific to TS, Charlton or football. You should see some of the vituperative, ignorant drivel people post online about local government.
Whether you get any positive outcomes, only time will tell and ultimately that will be senior management's decision to make - not the "fan advisors" - whose appointment already seems to have falling into what Covered_End_Lad mentioned around fans moaning about every little thing.
Only time will tell. Though as ever it looks like *some* people are never willing to give anyone that time before making judgements.
But again, maybe I've not be explicit enough about that.
What a fucking bunch we are eh