Is there a way of signing Shinnie on a permanent deal in order to free up a load space?
As i understand it Luton are paying the majority of his wages so could we possibly buy him from them and then they give him some dough to be used as wages until the end of the season.
I'm assuming he's out of contract at the end of the season?
I'm all confused!!!
It would be useful if we could do that with Shinnie, but I can't see it happening or being legal.
We need to free up a bit more salary if we want a decent, experienced player in though... (the below is total assumption on salaries, but weirdly fits about right!)
The cap is £48,076.92 a week or £2.5m a year, I make it that if Bogle was on £3k a week we have about £1k a week to play with if we're paying £2k a week for using Stockley. (Some loans may be cheaper - Famewo and Shinnie prime examples, some Perms may be overestimated too!)
Shinnie is on about 4-5k a week, of which Luton are paying the lions share.
Shows how difficult the summer is going to be...... All those 1.7k a week suddenly vanish (bar 2).
The very reason I have been banging the 'IT HAS TO BE THIS SEASON' drum.
I know Sandgaard said he wants it this season or next, but I hope if we fail on either deadline he doesn't lose his vision, sell up and pop off elsewhere.
I reckon we're seeing more of a change in Bowyer's thinking regarding his forwards.
Rather than a big conventional target centre forward type playing with his back to goal, Bowyer always seemed to prefer 2 pacy mobile channel runners, one of whom at least was capable of holding the ball up ..... think Grant & Taylor, for example.
Consequently, preferring to see short passing to feet inside the box, we didn't see so many high crosses into the box - and conventional wingers weren't really part of his gameplan.
Now we've got 2 big target man players in Aneke and Stockley, strong in the air - and players like Schwartz and Washington to feed off them. While Washington is good at running the channel. we've now seen Millar very effective as a wide man.
Could we now see a conventional winger signed to sling in high crosses into the box to feed Stockley/Aneke and Schwartz/Washington to thrive on knockdowns in the traditional striker pairings?
Is there a way of signing Shinnie on a permanent deal in order to free up a load space?
As i understand it Luton are paying the majority of his wages so could we possibly buy him from them and then they give him some dough to be used as wages until the end of the season.
I'm assuming he's out of contract at the end of the season?
I'm all confused!!!
It would be useful if we could do that with Shinnie, but I can't see it happening or being legal.
We need to free up a bit more salary if we want a decent, experienced player in though... (the below is total assumption on salaries, but weirdly fits about right!)
The cap is £48,076.92 a week or £2.5m a year, I make it that if Bogle was on £3k a week we have about £1k a week to play with if we're paying £2k a week for using Stockley. (Some loans may be cheaper - Famewo and Shinnie prime examples, some Perms may be overestimated too!)
Shinnie is on about 4-5k a week, of which Luton are paying the lions share.
Shows how difficult the summer is going to be...... All those 1.7k a week suddenly vanish (bar 2).
If a contract is extended has it come to an end? The EFL statement does not make that clear.
The fact that it got through on 1 vote suggests it will be discussed and voted on again. I do hope so - even if we get promoted, as I don’t think it is good for football.
Is there a way of signing Shinnie on a permanent deal in order to free up a load space?
As i understand it Luton are paying the majority of his wages so could we possibly buy him from them and then they give him some dough to be used as wages until the end of the season.
I'm assuming he's out of contract at the end of the season?
I'm all confused!!!
It would be useful if we could do that with Shinnie, but I can't see it happening or being legal.
We need to free up a bit more salary if we want a decent, experienced player in though... (the below is total assumption on salaries, but weirdly fits about right!)
The cap is £48,076.92 a week or £2.5m a year, I make it that if Bogle was on £3k a week we have about £1k a week to play with if we're paying £2k a week for using Stockley. (Some loans may be cheaper - Famewo and Shinnie prime examples, some Perms may be overestimated too!)
Shinnie is on about 4-5k a week, of which Luton are paying the lions share.
Shows how difficult the summer is going to be...... All those 1.7k a week suddenly vanish (bar 2).
If a contract is extended has it come to an end? The EFL statement does not make that clear.
The fact that it got through on 1 vote suggests it will be discussed and voted on again. I do hope so - even if we get promoted, as I don’t think it is good for football.
It also depends on the proposed bail out from the EPL. The conditions of accepting that are far more punative than the current cap so I can't see anyone who accepts it voting for the cap to be abolished as it would blow an even bigger hole in the division.
Obviously it also matters who gets promoted/relegated in and out of the divison
Remember our total wage bill was 4 times the cap under Roland (I know that includes stuff not in the cap).
A flat wage cap is totally wrong and skews competition. They should have just tightened up FFP and actually enforced it.
Championship clubs are also beginning to moan about it. They want players out on loan, but also need an income from that.
It would be interesting if an extension does not mean that it counts as ‘new’. Running a contract down maybe not as smart as it once was. Unless a player has a binding agreement with a club, a new manager at a club that was interested, or an injury, could mean that no one would be interested in your services at the old wage.
I reckon we're seeing more of a change in Bowyer's thinking regarding his forwards.
Rather than a big conventional target centre forward type playing with his back to goal, Bowyer always seemed to prefer 2 pacy mobile channel runners, one of whom at least was capable of holding the ball up ..... think Grant & Taylor, for example.
Consequently, preferring to see short passing to feet inside the box, we didn't see so many high crosses into the box - and conventional wingers weren't really part of his gameplan.
Now we've got 2 big target man players in Aneke and Stockley, strong in the air - and players like Schwartz and Washington to feed off them. While Washington is good at running the channel. we've now seen Millar very effective as a wide man.
Could we now see a conventional winger signed to sling in high crosses into the box to feed Stockley/Aneke and Schwartz/Washington to thrive on knockdowns in the traditional striker pairings?
It's just a shame Bowyer has a problem with Maddison then. He's the one player I've seen who looks to get a cross in early doors for the strikers. He must be a strikers dream.
Is there a way of signing Shinnie on a permanent deal in order to free up a load space?
As i understand it Luton are paying the majority of his wages so could we possibly buy him from them and then they give him some dough to be used as wages until the end of the season.
I'm assuming he's out of contract at the end of the season?
I'm all confused!!!
It would be useful if we could do that with Shinnie, but I can't see it happening or being legal.
We need to free up a bit more salary if we want a decent, experienced player in though... (the below is total assumption on salaries, but weirdly fits about right!)
The cap is £48,076.92 a week or £2.5m a year, I make it that if Bogle was on £3k a week we have about £1k a week to play with if we're paying £2k a week for using Stockley. (Some loans may be cheaper - Famewo and Shinnie prime examples, some Perms may be overestimated too!)
Is there a way of signing Shinnie on a permanent deal in order to free up a load space?
As i understand it Luton are paying the majority of his wages so could we possibly buy him from them and then they give him some dough to be used as wages until the end of the season.
I'm assuming he's out of contract at the end of the season?
I'm all confused!!!
It would be useful if we could do that with Shinnie, but I can't see it happening or being legal.
We need to free up a bit more salary if we want a decent, experienced player in though... (the below is total assumption on salaries, but weirdly fits about right!)
The cap is £48,076.92 a week or £2.5m a year, I make it that if Bogle was on £3k a week we have about £1k a week to play with if we're paying £2k a week for using Stockley. (Some loans may be cheaper - Famewo and Shinnie prime examples, some Perms may be overestimated too!)
Famewo doesn’t count in the cap.
We’re not paying anywhere near that for Shinnie.
Seems after the latest departures we have somewhere in the region of £4-5K per week to play with. Should be able to get 2 good quality players in for that. Hoping one is a winger.
Prefer Mason Mount if we are to get someone unrealistic from Chelsea.
No chance. Mount has been playing well all season but someone who could do with a confidence booster would be Timo Werner. We could offer to pay 1% of his wages as a bargaining tool.
Prefer Mason Mount if we are to get someone unrealistic from Chelsea.
Martial has been left out for a few games lately and Mane was only on the bench last week.
Joking aside I would imagine Gilmour will go to either West Brom or Palace, I think both have an available loan space. If its to get a place for the Euros I would imagine he would want/expect regular starts and minimum of top 6 championship.
I'd like to see us sign another player with pace to play down the right, an upgrade on Smyth, basically, or if we're going down the route of playing one pacy winger and one slower but more technical wide midfielder, then get one of those in instead.
I still think, despite all of LBs chat, that a central defender who is at least as good as Inniss and Famewo is needed, someone who can come in and take the position and mean we rely less on Pratley, Gunter and Pearce playing week in week out at centre back
With all this speculation on will we sign this one or that, what's the betting we drag our feet and end up with nothing in the end...... really hope not... Mind you, we have signed scholar Mason Burstow from Welling.
Think its unfair to say we aren't being proactive. I understand the skepticism based on previous transfer windows but I think we're going about our business the right way so far. Shifting Smyth and Bogle while we could was good.
Ultimately it all comes down to the cap. I guarantee we'd have seen a lot more activity the last few days had we not been under these absolutely ridiculous restrictions.
what's the betting we drag our feet and end up with nothing in the end......
Very little chance I'd imagine. If we're unfortunate enough to find ourselves with no further signings this window I think we've all seen that it's unlikely to be because Gallen, Bowyer, or anyone else are not pulling their weight!
Love the optimism but I genuinely think a lot of our fans seem to either be living in Charlton 2004 era or a dreamworld. We are currently league one Charlton.
We had tomori who some fans were saying we Were and shud be going for, a player who is 20M plus bracket in today’s market and has ended up at AC Milan.
Gilmour will have suitors with a number of prem clubs whose team he would get in too, and even if they wanted him being a guaranteed starter there would be 24 teams in the championship before ourselves that’s in England alone. We sadly have to be realistic with targets even more so with the poxy cap situation, bows has said it’s pointless bringing in another Bogle or smyth if they aren’t going to make us better than what we already have but then they are the Calibre we are looking at and we have to find a diamond in the rough (Maddison who makes us better without doubt but attitude don’t seem great so we aren’t reaping rewards currently from that) or we have to find a top end league two or bottom end league one player like a Joe Randall and take a gamble and offer decent wage to fend off champ teams hoping the club and player would want the move and we would potentially gamble with wages if they are young enough in hope we get promoted. But I can’t see them u settling camp to much or taking too many risks like that tbh. Leaves us with only a season pro from lower leagues and not gonna be many of those about wanting a move and club wanting to lose one of their best players. Otherwise we are again reliant on loan market and a championship player who could be another Bogle or prem youngster who could be a Connor Gallagher or quite easily a Dylan levitt. All I know is that gallen and bows will being trying to do what they can and gallens super duper phone will be out in force over the weekend.
Like everyone else it would be fantastic to see another 1 or 2 signings but at the end of the day if that doesnt happen then I think we just have to accept that we have already had a decent transfer window with the signings that we have already made. IMO this has been a good window whatever happens now
There will be plenty of players available, with clubs eager to move people on or wanting to cash in on players out of contract in the summer
In retrospect the September/October window wasn't a total success, which in the circumstances of needing to quickly build a team was inevitable, but so far the January business looks better, with players signed to fill specific roles, rather than just to fill a squad
There will be plenty of players available, with clubs eager to move people on or wanting to cash in on players out of contract in the summer
In retrospect the September/October window wasn't a total success, which in the circumstances of needing to quickly build a team was inevitable, but so far the January business looks better, with players signed to fill specific roles, rather than just to fill a squad
I think in hindsight that was the problem, not necessarily the quality of the players we did get its what we did, or didn't do, with them. Hopefully that's a lesson learnt and we go again.
Is there a way of signing Shinnie on a permanent deal in order to free up a load space?
As i understand it Luton are paying the majority of his wages so could we possibly buy him from them and then they give him some dough to be used as wages until the end of the season.
I'm assuming he's out of contract at the end of the season?
I'm all confused!!!
Yes we could.
Do we need another short term player? We have 2 for each position as it stands. What we don't have is enough long term players that are good enough.
Signing Shinnie, now on an 18 month contract might not be the best thing to do.
If we bring in another player at all I would like someone that's potentially going to be here a while and grow with us. Unless of course you can get a "silly good loan" that would obviously improve us massively.
Agree with this, Shinnie has shown some nice touches but he’s no spring chicken and I know he’s just come back from injury but he looks a bit pedestrian to me. Need to see a lot more from him if we are to sign him on a perm.
Just to clarify for the lollers, Shinnie has played 11 games was out injured for 8 and came on as sub v Pboro and cocked up for their 2nd goal. He was also blowing out of his arse 2nd half tracking back v Swindon which also nearly cost us. Took his goal well though. My point being let’s make sure that injury has not had a negative effect on this 31 year old before we consider making him permanent like the OP suggested.
Is there a way of signing Shinnie on a permanent deal in order to free up a load space?
As i understand it Luton are paying the majority of his wages so could we possibly buy him from them and then they give him some dough to be used as wages until the end of the season.
I'm assuming he's out of contract at the end of the season?
I'm all confused!!!
Been discussed but I just can't see it working. If we sign Shinnie permanently, we still have to pay him a weekly wage. Is that weekly wage going to be less than what we are already paying towards his wages now? I doubt it.
I think only way this works is if it's for a new signing, not one who we already have and aren't paying much for anyway.
If it helps - everything paid to players counts as "wages" under the cap, no matter what we call it eg bonus/signing on fee/fred... Otherwise the cap doesn't work at all.
Hypothetically: new club agrees transfer fee with parent club, player receives loyalty/termination/bonus/golden goodbye payment from parent club, player signs for new club on £1300/week til the end of the season. Any unwritten accommodation achieved by parent club and new club around the value and/or timing of the termination payment(s) almost certainly outwith EFL rules. The opportunity for the 'transfer fee' to be routed around to the player via parent club from buying club when it is essentially disguised wages is obvious "it's not wages, honest guv"
Is there a way of signing Shinnie on a permanent deal in order to free up a load space?
As i understand it Luton are paying the majority of his wages so could we possibly buy him from them and then they give him some dough to be used as wages until the end of the season.
I'm assuming he's out of contract at the end of the season?
I'm all confused!!!
Yes we could.
Do we need another short term player? We have 2 for each position as it stands. What we don't have is enough long term players that are good enough.
Signing Shinnie, now on an 18 month contract might not be the best thing to do.
If we bring in another player at all I would like someone that's potentially going to be here a while and grow with us. Unless of course you can get a "silly good loan" that would obviously improve us massively.
Agree with this, Shinnie has shown some nice touches but he’s no spring chicken and I know he’s just come back from injury but he looks a bit pedestrian to me. Need to see a lot more from him if we are to sign him on a perm.
Just to clarify for the lollers, Shinnie has played 11 games was out injured for 8 and came on as sub v Pboro and cocked up for their 2nd goal. He was also blowing out of his arse 2nd half tracking back v Swindon which also nearly cost us. Took his goal well though. My point being let’s make sure that injury has not had a negative effect on this 31 year old before we consider making him permanent like the OP suggested.
Yup and do we want him if we go up and do we want another 30+ year old taking up valuable wages if we don't.
We look to have some wiggle room now so unless it freed up a loan space for someone that was so good we couldn't not sign them it's a no for me.
Comments
I know Sandgaard said he wants it this season or next, but I hope if we fail on either deadline he doesn't lose his vision, sell up and pop off elsewhere.
Rather than a big conventional target centre forward type playing with his back to goal, Bowyer always seemed to prefer 2 pacy mobile channel runners, one of whom at least was capable of holding the ball up ..... think Grant & Taylor, for example.
Consequently, preferring to see short passing to feet inside the box, we didn't see so many high crosses into the box - and conventional wingers weren't really part of his gameplan.
Now we've got 2 big target man players in Aneke and Stockley, strong in the air - and players like Schwartz and Washington to feed off them.
While Washington is good at running the channel. we've now seen Millar very effective as a wide man.
Could we now see a conventional winger signed to sling in high crosses into the box to feed Stockley/Aneke and Schwartz/Washington to thrive on knockdowns in the traditional striker pairings?
The fact that it got through on 1 vote suggests it will be discussed and voted on again. I do hope so - even if we get promoted, as I don’t think it is good for football.
Obviously it also matters who gets promoted/relegated in and out of the divison
Remember our total wage bill was 4 times the cap under Roland (I know that includes stuff not in the cap).
A flat wage cap is totally wrong and skews competition. They should have just tightened up FFP and actually enforced it.
We’re not paying anywhere near that for Shinnie.
Joking aside I would imagine Gilmour will go to either West Brom or Palace, I think both have an available loan space. If its to get a place for the Euros I would imagine he would want/expect regular starts and minimum of top 6 championship.
I still think, despite all of LBs chat, that a central defender who is at least as good as Inniss and Famewo is needed, someone who can come in and take the position and mean we rely less on Pratley, Gunter and Pearce playing week in week out at centre back
betting we drag our feet and end up with nothing in the end......
really hope not...
Mind you, we have signed scholar Mason Burstow from Welling.
Ultimately it all comes down to the cap. I guarantee we'd have seen a lot more activity the last few days had we not been under these absolutely ridiculous restrictions.
Out of the squad and out of contract maybe Fulham will pay him off?
We sadly have to be realistic with targets even more so with the poxy cap situation, bows has said it’s pointless bringing in another Bogle or smyth if they aren’t going to make us better than what we already have but then they are the Calibre we are looking at and we have to find a diamond in the rough (Maddison who makes us better without doubt but attitude don’t seem great so we aren’t reaping rewards currently from that) or we have to find a top end league two or bottom end league one player like a Joe Randall and take a gamble and offer decent wage to fend off champ teams hoping the club and player would want the move and we would potentially gamble with wages if they are young enough in hope we get promoted. But I can’t see them u settling camp to much or taking too many risks like that tbh. Leaves us with only a season pro from lower leagues and not gonna be many of those about wanting a move and club wanting to lose one of their best players. Otherwise we are again reliant on loan market and a championship player who could be another Bogle or prem youngster who could be a Connor Gallagher or quite easily a Dylan levitt. All I know is that gallen and bows will being trying to do what they can and gallens super duper phone will be out in force over the weekend.
If he goes out it’ll be to top 8 championship or struggling premiership.
In retrospect the September/October window wasn't a total success, which in the circumstances of needing to quickly build a team was inevitable, but so far the January business looks better, with players signed to fill specific roles, rather than just to fill a squad
Otherwise the cap doesn't work at all.
Hypothetically: new club agrees transfer fee with parent club, player receives loyalty/termination/bonus/golden goodbye payment from parent club, player signs for new club on £1300/week til the end of the season. Any unwritten accommodation achieved by parent club and new club around the value and/or timing of the termination payment(s) almost certainly outwith EFL rules.
The opportunity for the 'transfer fee' to be routed around to the player via parent club from buying club when it is essentially disguised wages is obvious "it's not wages, honest guv"
We look to have some wiggle room now so unless it freed up a loan space for someone that was so good we couldn't not sign them it's a no for me.