People can moan about Stephans leaving all they like, but without tht poyet never would have been able to break through.. Guess that doesn't fit with the agenda though
People can moan about Stephans leaving all they like, but without tht poyet never would have been able to break through.. Guess that doesn't fit with the agenda though
The old saying 'Behind every cloud is a silver lining' could not have been truer in this instance and I was a Stephens fan even when he was getting pelters on here.
People can moan about Stephans leaving all they like, but without tht poyet never would have been able to break through.. Guess that doesn't fit with the agenda though
People can moan about Stephans leaving all they like, but without tht poyet never would have been able to break through.. Guess that doesn't fit with the agenda though
And how long will Poyet be staying ..... ?
Stephans didn't want to sign a contract so would be gone in the summer anyway, or is that another fact to ignore for the theory ?
People can moan about Stephans leaving all they like, but without tht poyet never would have been able to break through.. Guess that doesn't fit with the agenda though
The facts are, kerm played poker and lost... Yes we could have kept him, but maybe after contract talks it seemed like he wanted out (or the agent) so was best to move on and then Stephans wanted to move back up north so joined Brighton
I don't have any respect for people who cannot grasp that there is a body of opinion that is optimistic about the new owner and doesn't change its mind every time an opposition goal goes in.
I've just altered a few words in Airman's statement to help him see an alternative point of view.
It is reasonable to be optimistic, it is still early days. But I believe that the approach RD has taken since he too over was risky - If avoiding relegation was seen as something that should be avoided at all costs that is. If I run across the road without properly checking, because I am in a hurry to catch a train and a car just misses me,and I catch the train. Does that make the decision the right one! The outcome is not everything.
Kermogant may have played poker, but we both could have lost! I am grateful to Riga - he came in and I was concerned that he would pick the network players. Why? Because the owner was getting upset with Powell for not doing so. Riga clearly agreed that he would get free reign, so he had a freedom Powell didn't have. I think he has been an absolute hero in all of this.
Then we should be grateful to Powell. Why? Because despite having the rug pulled from under him - by both the previous and new owners, there was enough strength left in his squad to keep us up.
Another set of heroes of this season are many of the players. They had to be resillient, cope with a very challenging schedule and show professionalism. It is unfair to pick out any players, but the youngsters have played such an important part. Did we know they would? Could RD honestly calculate that Poyet and Cousins would remain injury free and make the contributions they made?
I can't understand why people can't see this. It is too simplistic to merely judge the end result. My hope is that we have learned some valuable lessons and the mistakes that have clearly been made will be learned from. I think there has clearly been an underestimation of the quality of the division and RD will know much more now.
So I am not going to condem but look critically at the evidence, and pray for positive signs which I accept can now happen. What I would like to see is Riga appointed- he clearly wants the job, so if he isn't there will be a football issue preventing it. I would like to see some of our heroes get new contracts -definitely Morro, Dervitte and Poyet. Then some new signings - a new striker with the right attributes and probably Sordell re-signed too. He seems to be settling in. A creative midfielder and general squad strengthening. If I see that, the future is rosy. But I haven't seen much of that yet so I am glad we have people like Airman ready to challenge if the scenario that is needed doesn't happen.
Addickted was spot on, but lets make this clear - there is a sizeable proportion who both dislike RD and dislike the approach the G21 took and dislike the season ticket boycott - lets have more nuance to the situation. G21's actions were not taken in consultation with the fans and that's the most egregious part of their clique.
The renewal of his season ticket is disappointing - if you have principles then at least stick to them. I think the majority of us are all for multiple points of view and different ways to tackle what is perceived by some as a problem as the dialogue really helps us find a better solution, but at least follow through and/or admit your mistake/retraction. Otherwise, your position is discredited and your character undermined.
It is reasonable to be optimistic, it is still early days. But I believe that the approach RD has taken since he too over was risky - If avoiding relegation was seen as something that should be avoided at all costs that is. If I run across the road without properly checking, because I am in a hurry to catch a train and a car just misses me,and I catch the train. Does that make the decision the right one! The outcome is not everything.
Kermogant may have played poker, but we both could have lost! I am grateful to Riga - he came in and I was concerned that he would pick the network players. Why? Because the owner was getting upset with Powell for not doing so. Riga clearly agreed that he would get free reign, so he had a freedom Powell didn't have. I think he has been an absolute hero in all of this.
Then we should be grateful to Powell. Why? Because despite having the rug pulled from under him - by both the previous and new owners, there was enough strength left in his squad to keep us up.
Another set of heroes of this season are many of the players. They had to be resillient, cope with a very challenging schedule and show professionalism. It is unfair to pick out any players, but the youngsters have played such an important part. Did we know they would? Could RD honestly calculate that Poyet and Cousins would remain injury free and make the contributions they made?
I can't understand why people can't see this. It is too simplistic to merely judge the end result. My hope is that we have learned some valuable lessons and the mistakes that have clearly been made will be learned from. I think there has clearly been an underestimation of the quality of the division and RD will know much more now.
So I am not going to condem but look critically at the evidence, and pray for positive signs which I accept can now happen. What I would like to see is Riga appointed- he clearly wants the job, so if he isn't there will be a football issue preventing it. I would like to see some of our heroes get new contracts -definitely Morro, Dervitte and Poyet. Then some new signings - a new striker with the right attributes and probably Sordell re-signed too. He seems to be settling in. A creative midfielder and general squad strengthening. If I see that, the future is rosy. But I haven't seen much of that yet so I am glad we have people like Airman ready to challenge if the scenario that is needed doesn't happen.
Are we forgetting the Many players we apparently tried to sign only for them to go else where ?. Loanees that refused to sign maybe due to our recent history of not playin loans ? Sordell sitting on a bench while church spends half the season running around like a nutter is a great example
Airman may have done things for the club a few yeaes ago, but I think that's part of the problem. Since being sacked by the club he's looking for self importance and he's trying to get some back by demanding a meeting with the owner. So if he finds anything out he puts it in his little magazine or on here and blows it out of proportion. And most of his posts on here ooze bitterness that's why I'd never by the rag 'voice of the valley'
I preferred airman when he used to come on here an tell us how many away tickets were sold.
Can't we just move on for now and see what unfolds. The low point for me was the Cup defeat and after that relegation looked inevitable but Jose and the players turned things round and the majority of fans got behind them. The football has improved since Jose took over and a bit of optimism has returned. There was a fabulous atmosphere at the Valley on Tuesday!
Looking forward to next season and didn't think I'd say that. I'm very sad that CP has gone but in the end it was for the best given how sour things had turned - many of the reasons for this were beyond his control. Mistakes have been made but let's not keep dwelling on them.
I just don't understand why the majority have to deal in the extremes.
It's not a right or wrong, pro or anti, black or white.
There's a middle ground that is often the quietist as they are not looking to get one over someone and not let it go.
At the moment there are too many people on both sides of this fence and I think if they both put personal differences and deep seated pre-conceptions to one side for a moment they'd realise they are both fighting and arguing for the same thing - just in different (and often aggressive) ways.
The long term prosperity of Charlton Athletic Football Club.
It would be great if the small percentage on here who actually want to do something, rather than just talk/bicker about it, could find a way to work together.
Airman may have done things for the club a few yeaes ago, but I think that's part of the problem. Since being sacked by the club he's looking for self importance and he's trying to get some back by demanding a meeting with the owner. So if he finds anything out he puts it in his little magazine or on here and blows it out of proportion. And most of his posts on here ooze bitterness that's why I'd never by the rag 'voice of the valley'
I preferred airman when he used to come on here an tell us how many away tickets were sold.
No chance of having "Airman" tattooed on your arse, then?
I simply cannot understand the antagonism against RD by the clique here. For God's sake he appointed Riga and in the process "lost" £4m by keeping us up and the two players (YK & DS) in the end didn't want to stay with us preferring the ££s over staying at our club. The only thing that pisses me off is the thought that Kevin Cash and his lackeys, TJ and MS are to be paid that £4m and getting away with all the damage they've caused us and the players contracts being run down (including the above two who jumped ship) - whose fault was it? And Powell, to be honest, although I liked him, his instinct was to defend and go hoof ball and Riga is to keep the ball and play the ball out... And a trite indecisive on the subs, waiting till too late to put them on...
Katrine is far more engaging and willing to muck it in as opposed to TJ/MS who were nowhere to be seen...
So lay off the club as it's moving in the right direction and also Airman Brown who made a sensible decision to renew and hopefully will see the light soon... ;-)
Yup, my cup's half full and I'm not making any excuses for that!
I just don't understand why the majority have to deal in the extremes.
It's not a right or wrong, pro or anti, black or white.
There's a middle ground that is often the quietist as they are not looking to get one over someone and not let it go.
At the moment there are too many people on both sides of this fence and I think if they both put personal differences and deep seated pre-conceptions to one side for a moment they'd realise they are both fighting and arguing for the same thing - just in different (and often aggressive) ways.
The long term prosperity of Charlton Athletic Football Club.
That's why this is so ridiculous.
That's a great post.
People dont like enforced change, especially when it comes with the deep tribal emotions that accompany football fanatics. People follow football for a variety of reasons, but nearly all do partly out of a sense of belonging to their chosen "tribe". These feelings are particularly prevalent at Charlton considering the history.
Its far more invigorating to take a polar viewpoint than a middle of the road one.
I like this forum for the witty banter and the touching human stories it often details. It is a taste of London for me whilst I am exiled from SE7. Seems many others are of similar ilk
I would echo the sentiments of @WSS and repeat that we are the same tribe and look back to the last few seasons and "one aim".
One point we should all be able to agree on is that under the onwership of TJ and MS we were going to the dogs.
RD provides a real shake up of what we expect from a football club. I dont know if he will be a king or a thief, probably something inbetween actually.
One thing that does provide a comfort is his history in terms of his views and ideologies. The man is clearly fixated with socialism and community. So I trust his motives but he might get it all wrong anyway as he tries to shake up the game.
he wasnt the first and he wont be the last Multi club owner.
Multi club ownership is directly contradictory to most fans' view that their club is "the greatest of them all".
Have a great day out at Blackpool...I am sure come July even those that are contemplating giving up their support will be eagerly anticipating the new season.
In the end, we all talk shite because we would support any owner who buys us a sparkling new Number 9. Football support is crazy because its tradition of history mixed with an incredibly short term view of the future.
Never fight your teammates unless your're Lee Bowyer
So again, Addicketd, how do you come to assert, on here, on Sunday evening - on page 13 of the Kermorgant thread - that I have renewed my season ticket. How else do you know this? Perfectly reasonable question, which you haven't answered.
I'd love to know of all these well known and respected fans who are apparantly no longer considering re-newing their season tickets because of the current 'situation'.
Even after your proposed ST boycott, even you have renewed.
Five named contributors in the current edition - one of whom is positive, one ready to 'wait and see' and at least two others ex employees.
I'm not unaware of the irony of people leaking information about me, but your point about the robustness of the club's internal procedures is nonsense.
An employer seeking to get rid of an employee can pretend black is white until they get before an employment tribunal, because up to that point they are both judge and jury. In this case, the club's process was so robust that it ended up with its own personnel manager who had overseen the process giving evidence on oath that it had not run a fair process, a (then) current member of its board having to lie on oath or explain on oath why he had lied in the internal process and its two most senior officers at the time of the so-called offence - one of whom was my line manager - providing detailed evidence which directly and explicitly contradicted its claims.
As you point out, logically and actually this has nothing to do with the current owner or any current discussion, but because people hold a different view to me they continually return to it in an attempt to undermine me personally rather than address the facts of a particular issue. The fact is that the club could not defend its case before a judge because it was always nonsense. Its process was nonsense and it made a further series of mistakes in taking it forward through a combination of carelessness and because it did not even know its own business. Robust is the last thing its process was. But that has nothing to do with this matter and it is not me returning to it. It's you.
When I started this thread, straight after Chris Powell was sacked, I posed the idea of a season-ticket strike as a question. Leaving that aside, a strike is when you stop doing something for a certain period of time and then resume. It was only ever about timing. In any event, I did not organise and I did not seek to organise a season-ticket strike, which clearly would have needed more than a single thread on here if it was to be taken forward.
I raised the question of whether it was a suitable response to what was happening at the club. I was then contacted by other people who wanted to organise more immediate action. This led to a much larger meeting in the Royal Oak and further conversations between some of those people and the Trust, which continue and have been and remain completely amicable. The immediate issue - RD trying to pick the team - went away, so all parties agreed it was sensible to wait and see what happened over time.
Nobody is or ever has been arguing for the reinstatement of Chris Powell or the return of Yann Kermorgant, just an understanding of what it means for the future of the club they continue to support. The idea that the people in that group cannot have a view and articulate it without claiming to speak for or represent other people is nonsense. They speak for themselves and they will meet and discuss issues as and when they like, just as other people will, including on here.
I find it quite amusing that I am apparently required to answer questions from people who consistently abuse me on here. Why would I take those people, hiding behind their pseudonyms, or their questions seriously? They have a fixed view about me and they are welcome to it. I've no intention of wasting any time on them.
For the record I don't include you in that group, Addickted, hence I respond. But you might answer my question in return?
Airman may have done things for the club a few yeaes ago, but I think that's part of the problem. Since being sacked by the club he's looking for self importance and he's trying to get some back by demanding a meeting with the owner. So if he finds anything out he puts it in his little magazine or on here and blows it out of proportion. And most of his posts on here ooze bitterness that's why I'd never by the rag 'voice of the valley'
I preferred airman when he used to come on here an tell us how many away tickets were sold.
"May have done things for the club a few years ago".
That's twice Airman called me a stooge. On both occasions it was deflection. Avoiding a response when I played back posts to the wider audience. Resurrection of this thread was not a gratuitous act...it was precise and apposite. And it appears to have created an opportunity for others to clear the air. For it needed clearing and we need fans who have concerns about the club direction but have a different approach appropriate for this owner and this century.
My optimism throughout this relegation fight has not been blind but based on observing the football improving and us starting to get lucky. Unlucky teams and managers get relegated! From the sponsors night thread it appears that much of what I have been predicting is in the pipeline or at least the management are looking to execute.
The very eloquent writings of Grapevine49, Mundell Fleming and New York Addick are all based on a rational appraisal of events and future possibilities. As it happens my musings are far more positive than these others but not because the club tell me what to say... it is simply because I don't see why Duchatelet would want to hang around competing with Huddersfield, Millwall and Sheffield Wednesday when we could be challenging Ipswich, Bournemouth and Watford for sixth place some day soon. We are showing 65 point a season form. To achieve 75 points we would have to take 4 or 6 points off of every single club in the bottom half of the table. Contrast that to this season where we lost at home to Millwall, Barnsley and Birmingham. How many additional players do we really need to be able to deliver that? And will Duchatelet and the new management team make it happen?
In summary I have supported CAFC thoughout in my analysis and opinions because I support CAFC.
I think the important stuff will never be answered
The truth about kermy will never really come out in its entirety but I think those who have delved to seek from their own sources will agree that what I posted was closest to the truth
The truth about RD will never come out as he is a successful and well established owner of football clubs
The only way we will form opinion is by watching for ourselves
Very few I speak to give two hoots about his other clubs or other interests but solely about cafc and what he does with us
All the over examining and watching will lead to misguided guesses even if they are made with the best intentions
It will lead you to paranoia and insanity
KM has said and this is a fact
That they miss calculated the quality required
They made some mistakes they tried to get deals over the line
But more importantly that they intend to get our work done early this window by the end of June
The pitch will be fixed
The training ground and academy will be superb
There is season tickets at 150 quid FFs
For an adult
So what if it's next to the away end in the east for people struggling to get by or a family of 4 for example that is the best value ticket I have ever heard of
RD so far has not shown 1 iota to any of you that he is a danger to our club that warrants a view of caution or mistrust
Just sit back and enjoy what unfolds and if and it's a big If in 18months to 2 yrs time he has made some horrific errors and we are looking at football in the lower tiers I will be the first to say I trusted this man and I was wrong
But right now I wouldn't mind RD being my dad I think he has done a great job
My view is that we should consider asking supporters to withhold their season ticket renewals for the time being until we get some clarity about what is going on with our club.
Personally I have no confidence in any of the people running it, including the leadership team as well as the board, and season tickets are the one lever we can pull without being accused of damaging the team. It's just an idea and I'd welcome people's input.
Airman, the above is what you said in a thread that you started.
I am generally in support of you & believe that if it wasn't for your past efforts, along with others, the club may well not exist today.I will always be grateful to you for that.
However, I don't always agree with you.
You know what weight your opinion carries on here & elsewhere & it would be disingenuous to say otherwise (not that you have).
The point is, if you start a thread entitled " Season-ticket strike to bring the owner to the table", you know full well that this will carry more weight than most other posters.
Therefore, if you have decided that this was not an action that fans should take in your opinion, then the fairest thing to have done, would have been to start another thread, explaining that this was no longer being considered and fans should renew, or at the very least, make this clear on the same thread.
You should also have told fans that you were proposing to renew, as you have now left yourself open to claims of being a hypocritic.
I presume that the thread must have influenced some people not to renew and therefore it has possibly been damaging to the club. To what degree we can't be sure and that's not to say, that this will not be addressed by people now renewing.
Finally, if you or anyone (and I include myself), starts a thread which may materially effect the club, then I think it's only fair, that it then made clear, if they have had a change of opinion.
It is reasonable to be optimistic, it is still early days. But I believe that the approach RD has taken since he too over was risky - If avoiding relegation was seen as something that should be avoided at all costs that is. If I run across the road without properly checking, because I am in a hurry to catch a train and a car just misses me,and I catch the train. Does that make the decision the right one! The outcome is not everything.
Kermogant may have played poker, but we both could have lost! I am grateful to Riga - he came in and I was concerned that he would pick the network players. Why? Because the owner was getting upset with Powell for not doing so. Riga clearly agreed that he would get free reign, so he had a freedom Powell didn't have. I think he has been an absolute hero in all of this.
Then we should be grateful to Powell. Why? Because despite having the rug pulled from under him - by both the previous and new owners, there was enough strength left in his squad to keep us up.
Another set of heroes of this season are many of the players. They had to be resillient, cope with a very challenging schedule and show professionalism. It is unfair to pick out any players, but the youngsters have played such an important part. Did we know they would? Could RD honestly calculate that Poyet and Cousins would remain injury free and make the contributions they made?
I can't understand why people can't see this. It is too simplistic to merely judge the end result. My hope is that we have learned some valuable lessons and the mistakes that have clearly been made will be learned from. I think there has clearly been an underestimation of the quality of the division and RD will know much more now.
So I am not going to condem but look critically at the evidence, and pray for positive signs which I accept can now happen. What I would like to see is Riga appointed- he clearly wants the job, so if he isn't there will be a football issue preventing it. I would like to see some of our heroes get new contracts -definitely Morro, Dervitte and Poyet. Then some new signings - a new striker with the right attributes and probably Sordell re-signed too. He seems to be settling in. A creative midfielder and general squad strengthening. If I see that, the future is rosy. But I haven't seen much of that yet so I am glad we have people like Airman ready to challenge if the scenario that is needed doesn't happen.
Are we forgetting the Many players we apparently tried to sign only for them to go else where ?. Loanees that refused to sign maybe due to our recent history of not playin loans ? Sordell sitting on a bench while church spends half the season running around like a nutter is a great example
I hope that the club improves the way it conducts its player business. I don't want to hear to the ongoing negotiation. I want to hear positive result. If it doesn't work out, I don't really want to know. I understand that the club wanted to communicate that they were trying to get some players in. All those rejections does not look good. It drove me a bit crazy. It must be possible to conduct the business in a better way.
Leon Best was likely to want to stay up North due to his missus being pregnant, Connor Wickham is doing brilliantly at Sunderland, and a lot of waste of hot air and raising of hopes. (After talking to the parent club) Find out if the move suits. If it doesn't then for whatever reason, it doesn't. The last big squad rebuild was done quickly and without fuss. I am sure there were a few players that were wanted but didn't sign up as well. Avoid contracts being played out in public as well as much as possible (player agents may make this more difficult). As a supporter, I hope that the publicity does not come from the club.
My view is that we should consider asking supporters to withhold their season ticket renewals for the time being until we get some clarity about what is going on with our club.
Personally I have no confidence in any of the people running it, including the leadership team as well as the board, and season tickets are the one lever we can pull without being accused of damaging the team. It's just an idea and I'd welcome people's input.
Airman, the above is what you said in a thread that you started.
I am generally in support of you & believe that if it wasn't for your past efforts, along with others, the club may well not exist today.I will always be grateful to you for that.
However, I don't always agree with you.
You know what weight your opinion carries on here & elsewhere & it would be disingenuous to say otherwise (not that you have).
The point is, if you start a thread entitled " Season-ticket strike to bring the owner to the table", you know full well that this will carry more weight than most other posters.
Therefore, if you have decided that this was not an action that fans should take in your opinion, then the fairest thing to have done, would have been to start another thread, explaining that this was no longer being considered and fans should renew, or at the very least, make this clear on the same thread.
You should also have told fans that you were proposing to renew, as you have now left yourself open to claims of being a hypocritic.
I presume that the thread must have influenced some people not to renew and therefore it has possibly been damaging to the club. To what degree we can't be sure and that's not to say, that this will not be addressed by people now renewing.
Finally, if you or anyone (and I include myself), starts a thread which may materially effect the club, then I think it's only fair, that it then made clear, if they have had a change of opinion.
I said at the outset that "we" should "consider it", "it's just an idea" and asked for "people's input", which for avoidance of argument let's say was that it wasn't a good idea. Things then moved very quickly on to the group that met in the Royal Oak, which made no reference to it. Indeed, it was discounted before that group even met. I have since published two issues of the Voice which made no reference to or encouraged this idea and not returned to it on here, so I'd assumed the fact I wasn't still putting it forward was fairly obvious by now, but if not then I'm happy to make that clear. In any event, I was always going to buy season tickets, as I have every season since 1975/76, including every one of the 14 years that I worked for the club, it was just a question of when.
I'll live with being criticised for doing so, safe in the knowledge that I'd also have been criticised if I hadn't. With hindsight do I think the suggestion was a good one? No, which is why I moved away from it. But things were pretty raw that morning and I won't ever apologise for being passionate about the future of the club.
Comments
Stephans didn't want to sign a contract so would be gone in the summer anyway, or is that another fact to ignore for the theory ?
I've just altered a few words in Airman's statement to help him see an alternative point of view.
Kermogant may have played poker, but we both could have lost! I am grateful to Riga - he came in and I was concerned that he would pick the network players. Why? Because the owner was getting upset with Powell for not doing so. Riga clearly agreed that he would get free reign, so he had a freedom Powell didn't have. I think he has been an absolute hero in all of this.
Then we should be grateful to Powell. Why? Because despite having the rug pulled from under him - by both the previous and new owners, there was enough strength left in his squad to keep us up.
Another set of heroes of this season are many of the players. They had to be resillient, cope with a very challenging schedule and show professionalism. It is unfair to pick out any players, but the youngsters have played such an important part. Did we know they would? Could RD honestly calculate that Poyet and Cousins would remain injury free and make the contributions they made?
I can't understand why people can't see this. It is too simplistic to merely judge the end result. My hope is that we have learned some valuable lessons and the mistakes that have clearly been made will be learned from. I think there has clearly been an underestimation of the quality of the division and RD will know much more now.
So I am not going to condem but look critically at the evidence, and pray for positive signs which I accept can now happen. What I would like to see is Riga appointed- he clearly wants the job, so if he isn't there will be a football issue preventing it. I would like to see some of our heroes get new contracts -definitely Morro, Dervitte and Poyet. Then some new signings - a new striker with the right attributes and probably Sordell re-signed too. He seems to be settling in. A creative midfielder and general squad strengthening. If I see that, the future is rosy. But I haven't seen much of that yet so I am glad we have people like Airman ready to challenge if the scenario that is needed doesn't happen.
C'mon, let's not deal in facts.. That's not the way things are done here .
The renewal of his season ticket is disappointing - if you have principles then at least stick to them. I think the majority of us are all for multiple points of view and different ways to tackle what is perceived by some as a problem as the dialogue really helps us find a better solution, but at least follow through and/or admit your mistake/retraction. Otherwise, your position is discredited and your character undermined.
Are we forgetting the Many players we apparently tried to sign only for them to go else where ?. Loanees that refused to sign maybe due to our recent history of not playin loans ? Sordell sitting on a bench while church spends half the season running around like a nutter is a great example
I preferred airman when he used to come on here an tell us how many away tickets were sold.
The football has improved since Jose took over and a bit of optimism has returned. There was a fabulous atmosphere at the Valley on Tuesday!
Looking forward to next season and didn't think I'd say that. I'm very sad that CP has gone but in the end it was for the best given how sour things had turned - many of the reasons for this were beyond his control. Mistakes have been made but let's not keep dwelling on them.
Onwards and upwards!
It's not a right or wrong, pro or anti, black or white.
There's a middle ground that is often the quietist as they are not looking to get one over someone and not let it go.
At the moment there are too many people on both sides of this fence and I think if they both put personal differences and deep seated pre-conceptions to one side for a moment they'd realise they are both fighting and arguing for the same thing - just in different (and often aggressive) ways.
The long term prosperity of Charlton Athletic Football Club.
That's why this is so ridiculous.
Katrine is far more engaging and willing to muck it in as opposed to TJ/MS who were nowhere to be seen...
So lay off the club as it's moving in the right direction and also Airman Brown who made a sensible decision to renew and hopefully will see the light soon... ;-)
Yup, my cup's half full and I'm not making any excuses for that!
People dont like enforced change, especially when it comes with the deep tribal emotions that accompany football fanatics. People follow football for a variety of reasons, but nearly all do partly out of a sense of belonging to their chosen "tribe". These feelings are particularly prevalent at Charlton considering the history.
Its far more invigorating to take a polar viewpoint than a middle of the road one.
I like this forum for the witty banter and the touching human stories it often details. It is a taste of London for me whilst I am exiled from SE7. Seems many others are of similar ilk
I would echo the sentiments of @WSS and repeat that we are the same tribe and look back to the last few seasons and "one aim".
One point we should all be able to agree on is that under the onwership of TJ and MS we were going to the dogs.
RD provides a real shake up of what we expect from a football club. I dont know if he will be a king or a thief, probably something inbetween actually.
One thing that does provide a comfort is his history in terms of his views and ideologies. The man is clearly fixated with socialism and community. So I trust his motives but he might get it all wrong anyway as he tries to shake up the game.
he wasnt the first and he wont be the last Multi club owner.
Multi club ownership is directly contradictory to most fans' view that their club is "the greatest of them all".
Have a great day out at Blackpool...I am sure come July even those that are contemplating giving up their support will be eagerly anticipating the new season.
In the end, we all talk shite because we would support any owner who buys us a sparkling new Number 9. Football support is crazy because its tradition of history mixed with an incredibly short term view of the future.
Never fight your teammates unless your're Lee Bowyer
An employer seeking to get rid of an employee can pretend black is white until they get before an employment tribunal, because up to that point they are both judge and jury. In this case, the club's process was so robust that it ended up with its own personnel manager who had overseen the process giving evidence on oath that it had not run a fair process, a (then) current member of its board having to lie on oath or explain on oath why he had lied in the internal process and its two most senior officers at the time of the so-called offence - one of whom was my line manager - providing detailed evidence which directly and explicitly contradicted its claims.
As you point out, logically and actually this has nothing to do with the current owner or any current discussion, but because people hold a different view to me they continually return to it in an attempt to undermine me personally rather than address the facts of a particular issue. The fact is that the club could not defend its case before a judge because it was always nonsense. Its process was nonsense and it made a further series of mistakes in taking it forward through a combination of carelessness and because it did not even know its own business. Robust is the last thing its process was. But that has nothing to do with this matter and it is not me returning to it. It's you.
When I started this thread, straight after Chris Powell was sacked, I posed the idea of a season-ticket strike as a question. Leaving that aside, a strike is when you stop doing something for a certain period of time and then resume. It was only ever about timing. In any event, I did not organise and I did not seek to organise a season-ticket strike, which clearly would have needed more than a single thread on here if it was to be taken forward.
I raised the question of whether it was a suitable response to what was happening at the club. I was then contacted by other people who wanted to organise more immediate action. This led to a much larger meeting in the Royal Oak and further conversations between some of those people and the Trust, which continue and have been and remain completely amicable. The immediate issue - RD trying to pick the team - went away, so all parties agreed it was sensible to wait and see what happened over time.
Nobody is or ever has been arguing for the reinstatement of Chris Powell or the return of Yann Kermorgant, just an understanding of what it means for the future of the club they continue to support. The idea that the people in that group cannot have a view and articulate it without claiming to speak for or represent other people is nonsense. They speak for themselves and they will meet and discuss issues as and when they like, just as other people will, including on here.
I find it quite amusing that I am apparently required to answer questions from people who consistently abuse me on here. Why would I take those people, hiding behind their pseudonyms, or their questions seriously? They have a fixed view about me and they are welcome to it. I've no intention of wasting any time on them.
For the record I don't include you in that group, Addickted, hence I respond. But you might answer my question in return?
Interesting take on history.
My optimism throughout this relegation fight has not been blind but based on observing the football improving and us starting to get lucky. Unlucky teams and managers get relegated! From the sponsors night thread it appears that much of what I have been predicting is in the pipeline or at least the management are looking to execute.
The very eloquent writings of Grapevine49, Mundell Fleming and New York Addick are all based on a rational appraisal of events and future possibilities. As it happens my musings are far more positive than these others but not because the club tell me what to say... it is simply because I don't see why Duchatelet would want to hang around competing with Huddersfield, Millwall and Sheffield Wednesday when we could be challenging Ipswich, Bournemouth and Watford for sixth place some day soon. We are showing 65 point a season form. To achieve 75 points we would have to take 4 or 6 points off of every single club in the bottom half of the table. Contrast that to this season where we lost at home to Millwall, Barnsley and Birmingham. How many additional players do we really need to be able to deliver that? And will Duchatelet and the new management team make it happen?
In summary I have supported CAFC thoughout in my analysis and opinions because I support CAFC.
The truth about kermy will never really come out in its entirety but I think those who have delved to seek from their own sources will agree that what I posted was closest to the truth
The truth about RD will never come out as he is a successful and well established owner of football clubs
The only way we will form opinion is by watching for ourselves
Very few I speak to give two hoots about his other clubs or other interests but solely about cafc and what he does with us
All the over examining and watching will lead to misguided guesses even if they are made with the best intentions
It will lead you to paranoia and insanity
KM has said and this is a fact
That they miss calculated the quality required
They made some mistakes they tried to get deals over the line
But more importantly that they intend to get our work done early this window by the end of June
The pitch will be fixed
The training ground and academy will be superb
There is season tickets at 150 quid FFs
For an adult
So what if it's next to the away end in the east for people struggling to get by or a family of 4 for example that is the best value ticket I have ever heard of
RD so far has not shown 1 iota to any of you that he is a danger to our club that warrants a view of caution or mistrust
Just sit back and enjoy what unfolds and if and it's a big If in 18months to 2 yrs time he has made some horrific errors and we are looking at football in the lower tiers I will be the first to say I trusted this man and I was wrong
But right now I wouldn't mind RD being my dad I think he has done a great job
I am generally in support of you & believe that if it wasn't for your past efforts, along with others, the club may well not exist today.I will always be grateful to you for that.
However, I don't always agree with you.
You know what weight your opinion carries on here & elsewhere & it would be disingenuous to say otherwise (not that you have).
The point is, if you start a thread entitled " Season-ticket strike to bring the owner to the table", you know full well that this will carry more weight than most other posters.
Therefore, if you have decided that this was not an action that fans should take in your opinion, then the fairest thing to have done, would have been to start another thread, explaining that this was no longer being considered and fans should renew, or at the very least, make this clear on the same thread.
You should also have told fans that you were proposing to renew, as you have now left yourself open to claims of being a hypocritic.
I presume that the thread must have influenced some people not to renew and therefore it has possibly been damaging to the club. To what degree we can't be sure and that's not to say, that this will not be addressed by people now renewing.
Finally, if you or anyone (and I include myself), starts a thread which may materially effect the club, then I think it's only fair, that it then made clear, if they have had a change of opinion.
Leon Best was likely to want to stay up North due to his missus being pregnant, Connor Wickham is doing brilliantly at Sunderland, and a lot of waste of hot air and raising of hopes. (After talking to the parent club) Find out if the move suits. If it doesn't then for whatever reason, it doesn't. The last big squad rebuild was done quickly and without fuss. I am sure there were a few players that were wanted but didn't sign up as well. Avoid contracts being played out in public as well as much as possible (player agents may make this more difficult). As a supporter, I hope that the publicity does not come from the club.
I'll live with being criticised for doing so, safe in the knowledge that I'd also have been criticised if I hadn't. With hindsight do I think the suggestion was a good one? No, which is why I moved away from it. But things were pretty raw that morning and I won't ever apologise for being passionate about the future of the club.