I feel sorry for the Police as they're going to be criticised whatever they do.
I have read some comments on here to the effect that 'where the Police when our fans were attacked by CP supporters a few years ago?'. If, on Saturday there had there been few Police about and Charlton fans were attacked, people would be moaning that there weren't enough Police. They are in a 'no win' situation. It seems that due to the acts of a few, Charlton fans will now have to be carefully watched by the Police at away matches in future.
Yes, let there be Police on duty but does it really need the whole of the Met's riot squad in attendance?
I feel sorry for the Police as they're going to be criticised whatever they do.
I have read some comments on here to the effect that 'where the Police when our fans were attacked by CP supporters a few years ago?'. If, on Saturday there had there been few Police about and Charlton fans were attacked, people would be moaning that there weren't enough Police. They are in a 'no win' situation. It seems that due to the acts of a few, Charlton fans will now have to be carefully watched by the Police at away matches in future.
You feel sorry for the police ? What about the supporters of your own club who were falsely arrested or took a clump ? What about the people's who's property was damaged by the actions of a tiny minority given the oppertunity to behave terribly by the polices ridiculous decisions ?
I'm assuming you weren't there.
On the list of people I feel sorry for after Saturday the Police are pretty far down believe me.
Just spoken to a mate who was on duty there Saturday. He said the initial plan was for us to exit and be lead down that side street. For some reason, of which he has no idea, the plan changed to keeping us kettled. Even he was surprised. A lot of PC's are constantly bemused by their superior's decisions at various public order events apparently.
I feel sorry for the Police as they're going to be criticised whatever they do.
I have read some comments on here to the effect that 'where the Police when our fans were attacked by CP supporters a few years ago?'. If, on Saturday there had there been few Police about and Charlton fans were attacked, people would be moaning that there weren't enough Police. They are in a 'no win' situation. It seems that due to the acts of a few, Charlton fans will now have to be carefully watched by the Police at away matches in future.
You feel sorry for the police ? What about the supporters of your own club who were falsely arrested or took a clump ? What about the people's who's property was damaged by the actions of a tiny minority given the oppertunity to behave terribly by the polices ridiculous decisions ? I'm assuming you weren't there.
On the list of people I feel sorry for after Saturday the Police are pretty far down believe me.
Where are all these people that were wrongfully arrested? Where are all these people that got such savage police beatings? I was there and I didn't see any of it.
But of course all of our fans were little angles that would not have dreamed of being out of order (smashing up seats, toilets, cars) had the Police "not given them the oppertunity!
"Given them the opertunity" are you having a laugh!!
I feel sorry for the Police as they're going to be criticised whatever they do.
I have read some comments on here to the effect that 'where the Police when our fans were attacked by CP supporters a few years ago?'. If, on Saturday there had there been few Police about and Charlton fans were attacked, people would be moaning that there weren't enough Police. They are in a 'no win' situation. It seems that due to the acts of a few, Charlton fans will now have to be carefully watched by the Police at away matches in future.
You feel sorry for the police ? What about the supporters of your own club who were falsely arrested or took a clump ? What about the people's who's property was damaged by the actions of a tiny minority given the oppertunity to behave terribly by the polices ridiculous decisions ? I'm assuming you weren't there.
On the list of people I feel sorry for after Saturday the Police are pretty far down believe me.
Where are all these people that were wrongfully arrested? Where are all these people that got such savage police beatings? I was there and I didn't see any of it.
But of course all of our fans were little angles that would not have dreamed of being out of order (smashing up seats, toilets, cars) had the Police "not given them the oppertunity!
"Given them the opertunity" are you having a laugh!!
Well for a start there's a thread on this very site from someone who was wrongly arrested detailing their experience and injuries.
If you really were there then surely you must agree that the polices kettling of 3,000 people after a football match alongside local residents cars provided the oppertunity for idiots to cause more damage than otherwise would have occurred ?
Obill takingthe piss for generations out of football fans.
Ifthey can get it wrong they do.
The only surprise is they havnt used tassers on fans. They used "terrorist" movement restictions on football fans and still do.Kettling at footie should be no surprise
I think they are shit.
As for knobheads smashing cars up etc ----no idea what thats all about-----but smashing cars ,trains,shops etc is nothing new at footie and has been going on since the 60z. Not only footie was going on with the Teddy boys,mods,rockers,skins,yooots etc.
People who vandalise property need no excuse - they would probably have done it no matter what the Police did. To blame the Police for that is just plain stupid.
There are two separate problems here which some people are binding up together.
One is that some people committed acts of vandalism. Nearly everyone has said that is wrong and should not have happened. Most people have said that there is no excuse or credit for the destruction in the ground or in the streets. Even those on here with a hooligan past have condemned it.
The other, separate, issue is the Police mismanagement of the crowd after the game. This happened, was real and was poor in conception and execution.
I was there, I saw it with my own eyes and had to deal with it.
One does not excuse the other, on either side.
As I said early the Police are the guardians of law and order and so are expected, by me at least, to reach a higher standard of behaviour, planning and control. On Saturday they failed on all three counts.
This is NOT police bashing or "damned if they do, damned if they don't". I am not drawing wider conclusions on the overall conduct of the Met from this one example as others are doing. They simply F***** up.
Worse they have done the same thing, with the same results, before yet they seem to have not learnt one thing from the events.
People who vandalise property need no excuse - they would probably have done it no matter what the Police did. To blame the Police for that is just plain stupid.
Really ? I would say that the majority of the damage was opportunistic. I highly doubt that many of the perpetrators awoke that morning thinking "I'm going to break the wing mirror off of a car after the match today". They probably went to the game with a general intention of causing some, unspecified trouble because they're idiots. Then, when they were held in close proximity with thousands of others on a street lined with cars they were presented with an opportunity to cause damage in what they assumed was relative safety.
People who vandalise property need no excuse - they would probably have done it no matter what the Police did. To blame the Police for that is just plain stupid.
What happened Saturday is exactly what occurred when Brighton were there in December, so why did the police let the same situation occur once again when property and cars were damaged then.
Whoever was in charge on Saturday, has not learned from the events back in December and for the residents in Sangley Road, it was like Groundhog day!
ME14 - the police should have done a lessons learnt and risk assessment on the crowd control and fully briefed there officers on the outcome from the results. This quite clearly was not done. Poor policing in my view
I was there and one of the last out of the ground and although all the action must have been at the front it was quite leisurely at the back if not very frustrating when we got held up outside the station . All in all it was a 45minute journey from stadium to train (a train I ,by the way did not want to be on) but I would prefer that than a load of violence and stupidity and I now realise that the ticket price was raised to pay for the police (or at least help towards it for it really was top heavy but perhaps necessary; who knows?) and that if events like those at Millwall occur then this is what you can expect. The same in the cup game at The Valley , taunt the opposition in such a flagrant way is the same as taunting the police. Why cant we simply support the team and not pretend we are bigger boys than the opposing fans....it is understandable but disrespectful and we get what we deserve from the police when we do this.
If people actually acted more sensibly and didn't hate people they don't know, just because they support another football team, everything would be far more pleasant. It is totally irrational, all this tribal rivalry. Shouting abuse at people you don't know is pretty pathetic in my opinion. You don't get this in other sports.
Yes but we owe respect to people whilst supporting our team. That may sound old fashioned but its a braver thing. Just because that is the way it is need not be the way it ought to be
Fair enough, everyone has their views ...mine is that without the tribalism,football loses it's soul ...and I'd lose a lot of my love for it.
Don't expect many will agree but it's a personal perspective ...and before someone jumps on me, that does not mean I condone vandalism ...pity I have to make that point but reading through CL today, there has been a lot of knee-jerk reactions.
Fair enough, everyone has their views ...mine is that without the tribalism,football loses it's soul ...and I'd lose a lot of my love for it.
Don't expect many will agree but it's a personal perspective ...and before someone jumps on me, that does not mean I condone vandalism ...pity I have to make that point but reading through CL today, there has been a lot of knee-jerk reactions.
Mate i expect your view would be the same as the majority
If people actually acted more sensibly and didn't hate people they don't know, just because they support another football team, everything would be far more pleasant. It is totally irrational, all this tribal rivalry. Shouting abuse at people you don't know is pretty pathetic in my opinion. You don't get this in other sports.
I just wonder what it will be like versus Millwall?! Will they use same tactics with Millwall? Hope the boozers are still open, so normal abiding fans can have a drink before the game...
Violence and aggro is never ever the view of the majority. We are all tribal ; it is a very primaeval thing to be . There is no human being who isn't tribal but why is it that other sports can be tribal but football has to introduce an uglier side of that with violence and abuse and why is it more importantly that Rugby can have tribalism and not the violence. It is sad that so many accept an ugliness in going to a game. This isn't knee- jerk ; it's a challenge to be more courageous than those who think they are standing their ground when all they should do is shake someone's hand.
Comments
Righto.
I'm assuming you weren't there.
On the list of people I feel sorry for after Saturday the Police are pretty far down believe me.
The Police didn't vandalise resident's property. The morons who did it had a choice, no-one made them do it but themselves.
For some reason, of which he has no idea, the plan changed to keeping us kettled. Even he was surprised.
A lot of PC's are constantly bemused by their superior's decisions at various public order events apparently.
well according to his officers who attended the pub and carried out numerous section 60s
But of course all of our fans were little angles that would not have dreamed of being out of order (smashing up seats, toilets, cars) had the Police "not given them the oppertunity!
"Given them the opertunity" are you having a laugh!!
If you really were there then surely you must agree that the polices kettling of 3,000 people after a football match alongside local residents cars provided the oppertunity for idiots to cause more damage than otherwise would have occurred ?
Ifthey can get it wrong they do.
The only surprise is they havnt used tassers on fans. They used "terrorist" movement restictions on football fans and still do.Kettling at footie should be no surprise
I think they are shit.
As for knobheads smashing cars up etc ----no idea what thats all about-----but smashing cars ,trains,shops etc is nothing new at footie and has been going on since the 60z. Not only footie was going on with the Teddy boys,mods,rockers,skins,yooots etc.
One is that some people committed acts of vandalism. Nearly everyone has said that is wrong and should not have happened. Most people have said that there is no excuse or credit for the destruction in the ground or in the streets. Even those on here with a hooligan past have condemned it.
The other, separate, issue is the Police mismanagement of the crowd after the game. This happened, was real and was poor in conception and execution.
I was there, I saw it with my own eyes and had to deal with it.
One does not excuse the other, on either side.
As I said early the Police are the guardians of law and order and so are expected, by me at least, to reach a higher standard of behaviour, planning and control. On Saturday they failed on all three counts.
This is NOT police bashing or "damned if they do, damned if they don't". I am not drawing wider conclusions on the overall conduct of the Met from this one example as others are doing. They simply F***** up.
Worse they have done the same thing, with the same results, before yet they seem to have not learnt one thing from the events.
Whoever was in charge on Saturday, has not learned from the events back in December and for the residents in Sangley Road, it was like Groundhog day!
I find it more outrageous that you can be section 27 d on way to football for nothing
The tv should tell you that the OB can not do not and will not change their stance towards groups of people
Don't expect many will agree but it's a personal perspective ...and before someone jumps on me, that does not mean I condone vandalism ...pity I have to make that point but reading through CL today, there has been a lot of knee-jerk reactions.
Tell that to the coppers with the batons hitting people with their hands up getting pushed from behind.
Unbelievable.