[cite]Posted By: Curb_It[/cite]Yes a smoking outside area bit would be a great point. They do it at Derby without any problems. the stewards said to me... we want you all to be happy as when you're happy, we're all happy as nothing to worry about.
I cant see why that piece East Stand wasteland section cannot be used - you are outside and about 15 feet away from the stand if not more. It is a most RIDICULOUS rule. Its alright to see Martin Simons coming downstairs for a smoke at half time but the plebs are not allowed outside of Bartrams at half time. Its a bloody joke actually. I remember on my 40th spent a lot of money there 20 of us - 8 smokers and non charlton fans... they all sat there raging with the hump as they weren't allowed out the front door of the club to have a quick puff.
Its ABSOLUTE bollocks.
And sod you non smokers who wish to moan about me moaning about my right to smoke.
p.s. i do not smoke in the loo. thats disgusting.
Sounds like you are due a fag now, go and have 10 mins to calm down.
[quote][cite]Posted By: Stu of HU5[/cite][quote][cite]Posted By: JT[/cite]I agree with you there F&H. Should be beer only tills. Remember they had this at Derby.[/quote]
What about fat bastards like me, who want a beer and a steak slice.[/quote]
Go on a diet SIMPLES.......... like me ;-) beer on on matchdays
[quote][cite]Posted By: Stu of HU5[/cite]Well the smoke in the toilets certainly ain't coming from the steaming hot water....
That's the real question... when is the hot water getting tuned on.[/quote]
Keep up, Stu. You'll not see hot water at The Valley in your lifetime. Rumours are that the withdrawal of cold water is being considered now. And toilets may well be a thing of the past soon, so that will sort out the half-time smokers.
By 2015, food and beer are likely to be banned, and matches will only be attended by fans with evidence of 30+ years of previous support and the tickets to prove it.
All part of a much larger grand plan. And the Club would have gotten away with it if it wasn't for you meddling kids.
[cite]Posted By: Curb_It[/cite]Yes a smoking outside area bit would be a great point. They do it at Derby without any problems. the stewards said to me... we want you all to be happy as when you're happy, we're all happy as nothing to worry about.
I cant see why that piece East Stand wasteland section cannot be used - you are outside and about 15 feet away from the stand if not more. It is a most RIDICULOUS rule. Its alright to see Martin Simons coming downstairs for a smoke at half time but the plebs are not allowed outside of Bartrams at half time. Its a bloody joke actually. I remember on my 40th spent a lot of money there 20 of us - 8 smokers and non charlton fans... they all sat there raging with the hump as they weren't allowed out the front door of the club to have a quick puff.
Its ABSOLUTE bollocks.
And sod you non smokers who wish to moan about me moaning about my right to smoke.
p.s. i do not smoke in the loo. thats disgusting.
Sounds like you are due a fag now, go and have 10 mins to calm down.
No love not me. I only smoke when i drink... and doesnt everyone have to be drunk to watch Charlton these days?
Lovely to be able to take your beer to your seat on Sunday and even better that because the average age was about 12 on Sunday there were no queues for the beer at all!
Plus you were allowed to go outside for a smoke - tho some minger had had a smoke in the girls loo.
[cite]Posted By: Airman Brown[/cite]
Aren't you still falling into the trap of assuming that people not currently attending or coming to the odd game actually want to see three consecutive games, though. Much more effective, in my experience, is a sharp price promotion, such as all tickets a fiver for a particular game.
Of course the comp tickets to schools and via the community scheme does pick up existing supporters and is occasionally abused, but you're more likely to attract a new spectator (and I appreciate you were talking about getting people back) by making an offer based on one game than something that requires them to commit to more than one match at the outset.
We can target lapsed supporters quite precisely with the systems we now have and we will continue to look at this, but any initiative has to be robust in terms of its impact on revenue. It's much more about that than any marketing costs.
I agree about the price promotion being the best option, for example I went to the Palace vs Man City Carling Cup game last season with a couple of Nigel mates and my ticket cost me half of what it had cost me to see Walsall at The Valley four days earlier. You could argue that's why Palace went bust but I admired their decision not to increase prices just to see a big team. Worked on me and I hate Palace
I thought I saw on here last season that that idea was dead in the water because of possible annoyance to ST holders though, and the risk of receiving less total revenue from a minimally increased attendance all paying less than they otherwise would have. Even if we did something simple and unoriginal like Kid for a Quid a couple times a season it'd be better than what was tried last season, which to me appeared to be nothing more than quoting ticket prices with a splash photoshop pic on the website.
I'm sure you don't need me to tell you this but I imagine if you're a casual/non fan, £20 to watch Charlton vs Hartlepool is asking alot compared to what other activities that are available, so imo there needs to be an initiative of some sort tried this year.
League Cup games are different. I have lost count of the number of times we have been referred to the authorities for trying to set low prices for cup matches against unattractive opposition and ended up with some imposed compromise because the opposition are convinced they would lose out because they think our fans would turn out in numbers at the normal price.
We do have to address the perceptions of any offer as well as the real effect. We've now built substantial margins into the season-ticket prices, but as you say we have to look at the revenue effect of any one-off price reduction and we do. We ran a couple of Kid for a Quid promotions the season before last, but because people didn't want to come to see the team they were not an overwhelming success. In any case, the regular £5 we now offer for U18s is very good value already.
The reality is that the board is unlikely to sanction any offer that poses a significant risk of lower ticket revenue for a particular game.
We're well aware that £17 will deter the uncommitted, which is why we offer a variety of taster packages, i.e. bulk comps, but we also have to maximise our revenue from those who are committed. It's a balancing act and the fact that some extra people would attend if the price was lower is just one consideration.
Can they open all the bars? There's not significantly less people buying beers in the North Upper as there were during the premiership years. Or actually there probably are: because of the bloody queues, because they shut the beer only bar down the east side. Net result is that people leave earlier and earlier to get a beer and I'm sure many don't bother at all. Commercially not good and from a customer satisfaction perspective not good. Sometimes my pint of pissy Fosters is the best part of my day. Cutting bar-staff is a false economy as some people won't wait or don't want to miss 10 minutes of football to get served.
[cite]Posted By: Airman Brown[/cite]
We do have to address the perceptions of any offer as well as the real effect. We've now built substantial margins into the season-ticket prices, but as you say we have to look at the revenue effect of any one-off price reduction and we do. We ran a couple of Kid for a Quid promotions the season before last, but because people didn't want to come to see the team they were not an overwhelming success. In any case, the regular £5 we now offer for U18s is very good value already.
The reality is that the board is unlikely to sanction any offer that poses a significant risk of lower ticket revenue for a particular game.
We're well aware that £17 will deter the uncommitted, which is why we offer a variety of taster packages, i.e. bulk comps, but we also have to maximise our revenue from those who are committed. It's a balancing act and the fact that some extra people would attend if the price was lower is just one consideration.
As you say it's all about perceptions though isn't it. I agree that £5 a kid is excellent value but everyone loves a special deal, with prices that low it wouldn't cost the club much to do kids for a quid (though I think there's gotta be a more effective, and original promotion somewhere), but might get a couple of hundred extra at least through the door. The club needs to give these wavering fans a reason to go today and not wait for another game. Atm they haven't got that, and so many don't have the incentive to come. Also gives people a reason to commit to going by buying beforehand, which I'm sure would make the commercial centre staff's lives easier!
I agree with the beer one. Maybe the club could see how many pints they pour at an average game and pre- pour a large percentage of them ten minutes before half time. Im sure most wouldnt mind having a pre poured pint if it meant they could get one and not miss any of the game.
Also went to a gig at the O2 the other night and there were blokes with mobile pint dispensers walking around the concourse serving people which sped things up.
As mclovin says it is false economy and I reckon the revenue we miss out on beacuse of ques must be a couple of grand a game at least.
The idea of not selling food is ridiculous. There are some of us who don't drink during a game who would say, why can you lot go 90 minutes which out stuffing your beer guts with more drink? And children like packets of crisps to keep them quiet, would you rather they weren't kept quiet? Selfish opinions can't be helpful to the forum.
My questions: Given the huge operating costs of the big screen, is the board considering scrapping it and just going back to having a clock.
Would the board consider setting up a charity arm of the club where people can donate money to be used on the the running of the club rather than just the youth team. This way anyone who does want to give money to the club can, without us coming up with Del-boy style money raising schemes / trying to get a supporters trust off the ground?
Can the shop manage stock more effectively. For two season running the shop has been over-run with size xxxxxxxxxxxxxl in the closing days of the season when it ran out of medium and large in February.
[cite]Posted By: Harveys Trainer[/cite]
Would the board consider setting up a charity arm of the club where people can donate money to be used on the the running of the club rather than just the youth team. This way anyone who does want to give money to the club can, without us coming up with Del-boy style money raising schemes / trying to get a supporters trust off the ground?
There is Valley Gold whic is only for the youth set up, as you say, but the more that goes to that from fans means the less that needs to come out of other budgets.
As for the Trust it would be a Industrial and Provident Society so a not for profit organisation which could donate money or better IMHO buy things and lease them to the Club. With a trust money raised could be targeted to specific areas of the club and give fans a say in how it is used.
If anyone wants to give money to the Club I'm pretty sure you can just send a cheque to Steve Kavanagh : - )
[cite]Posted By: Harvey's trainer[/cite]My questions:
Given the huge operating costs of the big screen, is the board considering scrapping it and just going back to having a clock.
Or we could back to the days of the old letter board and make it completely manual. Save on the costs of the screen, the leccy bill, and claim we're cutting our carbon footprint in the process. The club could even run competitions to see who gets to be the lucky soul to climb up the step ladder to change the score after a goal goes in.
[cite]Posted By: Harvey's trainer[/cite]My questions:
Given the huge operating costs of the big screen, is the board considering scrapping it and just going back to having a clock.
Or we could back to the days of the old letter board and make it completely manual. Save on the costs of the screen, the leccy bill, and claim we're cutting our carbon footprint in the process. The club could even run competitions to see who gets to be the lucky soul to climb up the step ladder to change the score after a goal goes in.
It still works in cricket!
You almost make my exact point but in a different way Henry. We spend a lot of time on this board discussing ways in which we could raise money for the club to help out. But the fact is, if anyone really wanted to give money to the club they can, they doesn't need to be anything fancy about it.
The cold truth is, people don't just send money to the club and following that line of thought I am highly sceptical that anyone would give money in the amounts needed to make a supporter trust work. All talk, no action.
You almost make my exact point but in a different way Henry. We spend a lot of time on this board discussing ways in which we could raise money for the club to help out. But the fact is, if anyone really wanted to give money to the club they can, they doesn't need to be anything fancy about it.
The cold truth is, people don't just send money to the club and following that line of thought I am highly sceptical that anyone would give money in the amounts needed to make a supporter trust work. All talk, no action.
You are probably right HT human nature being what it is.
However fans might be disposed to give to a fans' organisation (such as a Supporters' Trust) if they perceived that the money was going to be used for what they regard as worthwhile rather than absorbed into paying real or imagined inflated salaries if donated directly to the Club as you suggest.
I think there are many of us whom do not have the intelligence or ability to form a Supporters' Trust or alternatively do not feel sufficiently thickskinned to endure the inevitable brickbats which would come their way.
[cite]Posted By: Harvey's trainer[/cite]My questions:
Given the huge operating costs of the big screen, is the board considering scrapping it and just going back to having a clock.
Or we could back to the days of the old letter board and make it completely manual. Save on the costs of the screen, the leccy bill, and claim we're cutting our carbon footprint in the process. The club could even run competitions to see who gets to be the lucky soul to climb up the step ladder to change the score after a goal goes in.
It still works in cricket!
You almost make my exact point but in a different way Henry. We spend a lot of time on this board discussing ways in which we could raise money for the club to help out. But the fact is, if anyone really wanted to give money to the club they can, they doesn't need to be anything fancy about it.
The cold truth is, people don't just send money to the club and following that line of thought I am highly sceptical that anyone would give money in the amounts needed to make a supporter trust work. All talk, no action.
I agree lots of talk and no action - from Charlton Supporters. It was you who suggested a charity to enable donations so you must have felt that some people would contribute otherwise why suggest it.
Fact, and it is fact, that Trusts at other clubs have worked, have raised large amounts of money and in some cases even taken over the ownership and running of their clubs.
So the problem as I see it isn't the concept of a Supporters' Trust which is tried and tested but, and I hate to say this, with us, the Charlton fans. As you said, all talk, no action.
Following the debate on CL, are the board happy with the structure and roles of the senior management? Can the board reassure the fans that resources are being effectively used off the field both financialand personnel.
Can you ask what is the latest regarding any offers from potential investors? It seems since Gold and Sullivan we have not heard anything. Also can you ask if there was any truth about Chris Dagnall and is a prolific goal scorer is a main target for next season?
[cite]Posted By: Harvey's trainer[/cite]My questions:
Given the huge operating costs of the big screen, is the board considering scrapping it and just going back to having a clock.
The cold truth is, people don't just send money to the club and following that line of thought I am highly sceptical that anyone would give money in the amounts needed to make a supporter trust work. All talk, no action.
Thing is mate maybe ten percent of our regular support use forums and are perhaps aware of the extent of the financial situation and even those of who (who aren't in the know) probably don't know it's true extent and why would we until we see the accounts as organisations publish true detailed facts of their finances for any Tom, Dick and Harry.
Money wise I would say that a vast majority of supporters have contributed a lot of money to the club through season tickets and merchandise and spend a lot of money over the course of the season as it is. With the current economic climate I would imagine that most of us dont have surplus cash to donate to the club as much as we would like to and the amounts we could donate probably wouldnt touch the sides.
As for all talk and no action people do have full time jobs, families etc and sometimes it just isnt realistic to commit to something that would need a lot of time and effort for it to be worthwhile. On that note (whether he came across as an ars3 or not) that Mr Windscreen fella who got banned did act in trying to organise something (whether it was for egotistical reasons or not) and he seemed to get derided and shot down for it.
I think if we all had the time and the money we would be able to give a lot more action rather than talk but most of us dont have that luxury.
Cant quote from previous page, but i do like PBS idea of the extra sponsorship on the back of the players kits. Good idea for a small piece of extra revenue. If KRBS will allow it, why not go for it?....if other clubs in this league can attract two sponsors, then surely a club like ourselves can.
[cite]Posted By: ValleyGary[/cite]Cant quote from previous page, but i do like PBS idea of the extra sponsorship on the back of the players kits. Good idea for a small piece of extra revenue. If KRBS will allow it, why not go for it?....if other clubs in this league can attract two sponsors, then surely a club like ourselves can.
It may be that KRBS have paid to be the only shirt sponsor and that the deal we have for the one sponsor is more than other clubs are getting for two.
But it is a very valid question and one that it would be good to get an answer to.
Comments
Would need a venn diagram
Fat and eating food, fat and not eating, eating and drinking area, only drinking area, swap panini cards area etc, Charlton lifers area.
Paint lines on the ground/floor and use the extra steward to violently enforce.
Sounds like you are due a fag now, go and have 10 mins to calm down.
What about fat bastards like me, who want a beer and a steak slice.[/quote]
Go on a diet SIMPLES.......... like me ;-) beer on on matchdays
That's the real question... when is the hot water getting tuned on.[/quote]
Keep up, Stu. You'll not see hot water at The Valley in your lifetime. Rumours are that the withdrawal of cold water is being considered now. And toilets may well be a thing of the past soon, so that will sort out the half-time smokers.
By 2015, food and beer are likely to be banned, and matches will only be attended by fans with evidence of 30+ years of previous support and the tickets to prove it.
All part of a much larger grand plan. And the Club would have gotten away with it if it wasn't for you meddling kids.
No love not me. I only smoke when i drink... and doesnt everyone have to be drunk to watch Charlton these days?
Plus you were allowed to go outside for a smoke - tho some minger had had a smoke in the girls loo.
No deal or no deal ;-)
But only pints of wine
; - )
League Cup games are different. I have lost count of the number of times we have been referred to the authorities for trying to set low prices for cup matches against unattractive opposition and ended up with some imposed compromise because the opposition are convinced they would lose out because they think our fans would turn out in numbers at the normal price.
We do have to address the perceptions of any offer as well as the real effect. We've now built substantial margins into the season-ticket prices, but as you say we have to look at the revenue effect of any one-off price reduction and we do. We ran a couple of Kid for a Quid promotions the season before last, but because people didn't want to come to see the team they were not an overwhelming success. In any case, the regular £5 we now offer for U18s is very good value already.
The reality is that the board is unlikely to sanction any offer that poses a significant risk of lower ticket revenue for a particular game.
We're well aware that £17 will deter the uncommitted, which is why we offer a variety of taster packages, i.e. bulk comps, but we also have to maximise our revenue from those who are committed. It's a balancing act and the fact that some extra people would attend if the price was lower is just one consideration.
As you say it's all about perceptions though isn't it. I agree that £5 a kid is excellent value but everyone loves a special deal, with prices that low it wouldn't cost the club much to do kids for a quid (though I think there's gotta be a more effective, and original promotion somewhere), but might get a couple of hundred extra at least through the door. The club needs to give these wavering fans a reason to go today and not wait for another game. Atm they haven't got that, and so many don't have the incentive to come. Also gives people a reason to commit to going by buying beforehand, which I'm sure would make the commercial centre staff's lives easier!
Also went to a gig at the O2 the other night and there were blokes with mobile pint dispensers walking around the concourse serving people which sped things up.
As mclovin says it is false economy and I reckon the revenue we miss out on beacuse of ques must be a couple of grand a game at least.
My questions:
Given the huge operating costs of the big screen, is the board considering scrapping it and just going back to having a clock.
Would the board consider setting up a charity arm of the club where people can donate money to be used on the the running of the club rather than just the youth team. This way anyone who does want to give money to the club can, without us coming up with Del-boy style money raising schemes / trying to get a supporters trust off the ground?
Can the shop manage stock more effectively. For two season running the shop has been over-run with size xxxxxxxxxxxxxl in the closing days of the season when it ran out of medium and large in February.
There is Valley Gold whic is only for the youth set up, as you say, but the more that goes to that from fans means the less that needs to come out of other budgets.
As for the Trust it would be a Industrial and Provident Society so a not for profit organisation which could donate money or better IMHO buy things and lease them to the Club. With a trust money raised could be targeted to specific areas of the club and give fans a say in how it is used.
If anyone wants to give money to the Club I'm pretty sure you can just send a cheque to Steve Kavanagh : - )
It still works in cricket!
You almost make my exact point but in a different way Henry. We spend a lot of time on this board discussing ways in which we could raise money for the club to help out. But the fact is, if anyone really wanted to give money to the club they can, they doesn't need to be anything fancy about it.
The cold truth is, people don't just send money to the club and following that line of thought I am highly sceptical that anyone would give money in the amounts needed to make a supporter trust work. All talk, no action.
I agree lots of talk and no action - from Charlton Supporters. It was you who suggested a charity to enable donations so you must have felt that some people would contribute otherwise why suggest it.
Fact, and it is fact, that Trusts at other clubs have worked, have raised large amounts of money and in some cases even taken over the ownership and running of their clubs.
So the problem as I see it isn't the concept of a Supporters' Trust which is tried and tested but, and I hate to say this, with us, the Charlton fans. As you said, all talk, no action.
It may be that KRBS have paid to be the only shirt sponsor and that the deal we have for the one sponsor is more than other clubs are getting for two.
But it is a very valid question and one that it would be good to get an answer to.