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Comments on the Opening Presentation
Comments
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"I thought I explained this three or four times already" is an interesting (edit - condescending) way to start9
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The presentation was sadly not one you would associate with a senior executive. However I continue to respect, whatever the individuals' comfort with English, it is not her first language. I am also very happy to acknowledge the attendees were twice given the opportunity to ask questions.
The presentation itself was fairly conventional and that is was given at all is indeed a very small first step. However for those of a more challenging mind it does have to be put in context. The meeting arose from the disquiet of many at the manner in which the club is currently performing across the business including an alarming slump in the clubs' league position.
For those apparently untroubled by such performance I hope you do not mind if I maintain a somewhat higher level of expectation. Such expectation does extend to the events of Tuesday night. The presentation in the context of the meeting was counter productive. The club barely addressed any aspect of ITS FAILING PERFORMANCE.
I will comment further on the meeting itself at a later date.
In the meantime as a matter of record for later reference I note 29 points of issue.
The Vision
We have 4 vision statements (of sorts).
1 - We seek to be a competitive Championship Club - which prompts the question what does that actually mean. As we compete in the Championship by definition we are already a competitive Championship Club
2 - We have ambition to play in the Premier League - again what does that actually mean? Every club in the division wants to play in the Premier League
The issue is what is/ are the "substance", strategies and policies behind such objectives which are currently putting such objectives under threat.
Which then raises the spectre of
3 - A club able to trade on a sustainable basis
4 - A break even trading position
In the market in which we are operating the task of "squaring this circle" is exceptionally difficult - many would and do argue it is impossible which is why every season 15 clubs will chance their arm one more time to reach the (often temporary) financial haven of the Premier League. For us the collapse of the Financial Fair play disciplines and the sale of Standard Liege have distorted the challenge even further.
It is why most fans want to understand the owners commitment and the executive ability to meet this challenge. I regret I remain far from certain of either aspect.
The Fans
5. We know we need the fans to make this club bigger and better
6. We want true fan engagement
7. Fans forum – the club acknowledged it maybe not enough
Any comment on this aspect needs to be left to a full review of the video.
8. How can we get more fans into the ground?
Good question! I was rather hoping for some answers. The answers so far
Fan Strategy
9. Free lounge with match day entertainment
10. Affordable football
11. The sofa
12. Grow attendances to 20000
Performance
13. We need to increase the performance on the pitch
For a meeting driven by the performances on the pitch this one desultory mention is extraordinary
Operations
13. 25 senior player squad - only 5 out of contract
14. Academy is at the heart of all the operations
15. Most young players are signed up on long term contract
But how many are not? Why do the club no longer regularly advise fans of such contracts?
16. 5 academy debuts this season
But were they really, really ready?
17. Academy given the tools to do the job – training ground improvements
18. Want to attract the best talent and best players in London with competitive advantage of a career path to the top
Happy to endorse the training ground improvements but there are many questions to be raised concerning the "career path to the top" concept.
Operational Investment
19. Increase the player wages budget by 40%
20. Invested £9mn in incoming transfers
Again many questions arise but the most obvious has to be have we seen a commensurate "value for money" increase in performance? Our current league position suggests not. How much of either figure has been invested in players no longer contributing to the club?
21. In response to question outgoing transfers lower than £9mn
Clearly a great more detailed required here
Infrastructure Investment
22. Much needed investment in Valley and in the training ground £4.5mn
23. Pitch, seating, lounges to improve match day experience
24. New ticketing system – target fans more efficiently
25. Family zone
Fully respect the amount and nature of this investment though again greater clarity would be welcome and more than a few might rightly question aspects of their implementation.
Community
26. The community is at the heart of all the operations
27. Relationships with CACT and University of Greenwich
28. Contacts with local businesses, they understand the value Charlton can bring
29. Grow commercial revenue
All decent solid but pretty standard stuff.
From the detail above it would be churlish to argue there are not elements of value in the presentation.
I will leave further comment as I have yet to view the full video of the meeting.
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If that's what you can pull from 9 minutes then I'll have to set Saturday aside to read your musings on the subsequent 90 minutes of meeting !0
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The sofa came from a DFS sale!PL54 said:
Do you know otherwise?Weegie Addick said:How have they spent £4.5M on The Valley? OK, £1M or so on the pitch but were the new seats, big screen, sofa that expensive?!
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And further confirmation that as a CEO she is totally out of her depth. Her people skills are atrocious.Chunes said:"I thought I explained this three or four times already" is an interesting (edit - condescending) way to start
If anybody needs removing from the board I would suggest it's her , and any chants from fans should be directed at her first, before Roland.
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Maybe he is the next head of the communications team.carly burn said:The club shop fella though!
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I watched the full video last night and from the notes I made have a few comments:
1. I liked the fans approach, I thought it was both respectful and professional. IMO I suspect KM was expecting ranting and rudeness. Perhaps she assumes all fans are Ultras and behave like the Standard Liege rioters. However, I think we are not going to get anywhere in trying have 'meaningful dialogue'. For me the meeting could be summarised as 'we here what you're saying'......(but aren't in the slightest bit concerned)
2. Murray bothers me in some way that I can't explain. When talking about managers he stated that the club 'needed' someone new (ie Karel) and then he changed it to 'needs' (ie we haven't decided to make him the manager - honest). His bit about fans being 'like a church with followers' followed by 'we owe them something'. Oh good. I didn't notice he was on his phone though.
3. I was surprised to hear KM say that RD had bought the club due to it's great history and fans, as they seem to be ignoring both.
4. I felt sorry for JJ. I have rarely seen anyone keep the same sullen, depressed looking expression for so long. He reminded me of someone who was being sentenced to a long time in jail for doing something they regretted enormously. One of the few times he smiled was when KM said about us all being equal - we are all RD's children.
So where to go from here? I have never been any good at keeping calm in professional situations when talking to people who are clearly just bringing out the same old same old. I admire the fans who are able to do that as it didn't give KM etc the pleasure of using the victim, you're all shouting at me, card last night. I guess there will be a proportion of fans who are still able to be respectful and professional with her in the hope of having meaningful dialogue. For me I don't think that will happen and believe we need to ramp up the lawful demonstrations to try for change.
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Very true and poor for a CEO - especially at the beginning when she couldn't get the slides to go backward or forward properly. Key for me was that the 3 main objectives are simply, high-level, aspirational goals - bit like a corporate vision statement. Speaking as an ex-management consultant, you have to take the vision statement or high-level goals and translate those into actions. Strategy is fine but you need the right people to execute it. What are the plans in place to ensure that we stay a competitive championship club and who takes responsibility? What are the timelines for Premiership aspirations? I'm sure they can't/won't provide the details - fine - but a didn't get any confidence that they have been thought through. Just words. Moving to 20,000? Its not just about new fans or increasing attendance - how do you stop the apparent attrition? Where are the target timelines, what are the ideas to drive forward. To me was all a bit hollow and lacking in substance. Having done it a few times myself - it definitely had a feel of being 'thrown together' at the last moment.last_line said:The presentation was pretty poor and clearly unrehearsed which seems strange
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Not sure she did her CV much good last night. All on YouTube for anyone to dissect in the future.1
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Not seen it all but trying to summarise a few key things
Manager situation
It is clear there is no search, interview process going on at all. It is Fraeye's until he screws up. So the stuff on appointment about searching for a long term coach seems a fabrication. Saying it was decided on the Sunday also seems to be an outright fib as I was told by two people on the Saturday that the job was his.
We also learned from Murray the importance of trust between Owner and Manager, so from that I can assume that unless Roland has a completely different approach, we will continue getting Luzon, Fraeye type appointments.
Player recruitment
If it wasn't spelt out before it is very clear now. Data analysis forms a huge part, our scouting network is effectively attached to what is at network clubs (Spain, Belgium, Hungary) and EVERYTHING is ultimately decided by a team of data analysts in Belgium. U.K. Recruitment is effectively Mark Stow stepping into Chapple's shoes. Given Chapple left because of the set up and lack of real follow through, no change is likely to happen here
Fan engagement
Seemed to me like a very non committal piecemeal offering. Will arrange certain focus groups for certain issues when / if they arise. Reactive not proactive stuff. No real defined positive intent to change over than the mention of a target 20k thing.
Understanding the detachment / discontent
This is one where I think they fell down the most. KM delivered a number of things in her presentation sarcastically imo, eg on strategy 'i thought I'd explained this 3 or 4 times', sarcastic use of black and white, her approach is extremely defensive. On the season ticket shambles it was given as an excuse that the supporters had to be patient. There is simply no understanding of why people's discontent has evolved and escalated, and the fact that there approach is to put the responsibility on true Charlton fans to drown out these 'negative people' is just so disappointing.
Strategy
As covered above, an undefined attempt to grow home attendance by 50%+ and sell our better players. The one thing that loses supporters the most is lack of ambition, and the biggest indicator of lack of ambition is selling players
Gimmicks
Very clear these are going to continue in an attempt to 'attract new fans'. What they don't seem to grasp is that new fans are attracted by a strategy of results, ticketing offers, good marketing, and getting into schools and junior clubs, delivering a product worth revisiting that is value for money. Gimmicks are to entertain your audience once you have them. Choosing gimmicks that are largely at odds with what your audience want and not understanding your captive customer base are just so obvious mistakes, yet they keep getting repeated. At least we learned the house DJ was put into crossbars because Katrien likes house music. Let's all hope she doesn't like Jedward30 -
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It is a very nice sofa so it might have cost that muchWeegie Addick said:How have they spent £4.5M on The Valley? OK, £1M or so on the pitch but were the new seats, big screen, sofa that expensive?!
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KF told me after the Boro game that he got a call straight after the defeat to Brentford from KM1
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"There is simply no understanding of why people's discontent has evolved and escalated, and the fact that there approach is to put the responsibility on true Charlton fans to drown out these 'negative people' is just so disappointing". AFKA
After watching the video in full I agree with this statement entirely. She just does not "get it" in my opinion. I cannot see any progress being made with KM in charge as she just seems to be living in a cocoon. Her overall responses to the fans concerns left me feeling there will be little change in emphasis with the way our club will be run under this current ownership. We need owners who know how to run a football club but I realise there is not a queue banging on Charlton's door. It seems we will we have to get used to an apparent fall-back strategy of hurriedly finding sticking plasters for the team every January Window to keep us in the Championship. Are all the future seasons going to be the same under this leadership and if so where will be the attraction for another 10K new fans?4 -
"Operations
13. 25 senior player squad - only 5 out of contract
14. Academy is at the heart of all the operations
15. Most young players are signed up on long term contract"
Are THD, RCC and Lookman included in the 25? What are their contract situations? If any of them are successful, they won't be with us for long.
Not seen either video yet but did see comment on Tuesday on the number of Over-50s in the fan base. As someone approaching 50, does she not want us anymore?0 -
KM's assertion that only 2% of the crowd were protesting and that those not in favour of a protest should stand up against this 'minority' shows that she ...still ...has no concept of the dissatisfaction in the fan base.
Police estimates were 700 protesting; add to that the many hundreds that did not even bother to turn up to the game (their own silent protest), many more who are unhappy but would not want to join, or could not join, a protest, plus those who are stating that they will not renew their season ticket and the figure is much higher.
I believe the meeting was a start, but only a start. Despite claims to the contrary, we did not see a strategy, merely aims and objectives. The three action points that the club have committed to are positive ...if a year or so late.
They now need to step up to the plate and take on responsibility for those action points and ...far more importantly ...be accountable for delivery and success of those aims.
Regular dialogue can only be good and is an important building block in any successful institution.
Having said that, I am fully aware that the majority of the fans could not care less about dialogue if the results are going in the right direction.2 -
and what did it achieve? her putting down in black and white on a powerpoint presentation what she has already stated previously - there again, we all have different agendas - as I state - 99% just want some action rather than words - playersa nd a manager - others hate being cut off from the communication and can't get over it - you need to get over yourselvesHenry Irving said:
So pointless that she noticed it, is aware of it and tried, and failed, to address it.DOUCHER said:Do we not think the whole PowerPoint thing is in response to the black and white thing? Told u its a pointless campaign -all we want is a decent manager and team
I'm fine if people don't agree with the aims or think it doesn't go far enough but to claim that it is pointless when it is clearly hitting home is ludicrous.
It's been going for about two weeks and it has already been responded to.
Sure, she trying to laugh it off but that because she doesn't have an adult response.
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Just to elaborate if I may - the purpose of our protest should be to try and change the way they are going about things - its not that we don't know what there aims / objectives are - we do and its tedious keep asking what they are. We need them to accept that they may need to adjust by bringing in a 'proper' manager and some proven championship quality players to help in the short to mid term - that is what this protest should be about. I also think that a lot of you will look back and be embarrassed with the way you have treated / referred to a woman who (however inexperienced in her position she may be) is just a human being doing her best - You really all need to take a step back before you lose all credibility.2
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Arrogant, dismissive, amateur and inaccurate... from our CEO...
On with the protest4 -
They said in the video that if KF does Ok he will stay. Wise up we are stuck with KF, there is no ongoing search, if KF loses the best 5-6 matches then they will install another Roland puppet, its what they do.DOUCHER said:Just to elaborate if I may - the purpose of our protest should be to try and change the way they are going about things - its not that we don't know what there aims / objectives are - we do and its tedious keep asking what they are. We need them to accept that they may need to adjust by bringing in a 'proper' manager and some proven championship quality players to help in the short to mid term - that is what this protest should be about. I also think that a lot of you will look back and be embarrassed with the way you have treated / referred to a woman who (however inexperienced in her position she may be) is just a human being doing her best - You really all need to take a step back before you lose all credibility.
It was said in the video that Charlton are not known as having an aggressive fanbase. So for grown men and women (yes there were women there too, KM failed to mention that) to stage a protest, the club have monumentally f**ked up.
So she got called a few names etc, tough f**king shit, football is about passion, its tribal, KM with her 'little girl lost' face trying to garner sympathy was pathetic, if she was a 60 year old bloke the same things would have been said, so she appears to not have a bloody clue what she has done and does not understand football and our club, and judging by your constant snipes at the protests then you understand as much about our club as KM does.4 -
FRank Sinatra said the only thing he owed the public was a good performance. He didn't say if he sang out of tune he'd come and have a dialogue with his fans.0
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If Frank Sinatra sang like Charlton play then he wouldn't have any fans.andynelson said:FRank Sinatra said the only thing he owed the public was a good performance. He didn't say if he sang out of tune he'd come and have a dialogue with his fans.
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One of the things that concerned me most from the meeting was that they seem perfectly happy to go from manager to manager as long as we are getting the bounce each time to secure some points. She didn't seem to get that we also lose a lot of points when an inexperienced manager finally gets found out. I would like to have seen her taken to task on this a bit more.5
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Yes this is perfectly true, but it's so obvious when you look at the league tables that if she really can't see it then there is no point in trying to explain it to her, so I don't blame anyone for not pressing her on it.WestCountryAddick said:One of the things that concerned me most from the meeting was that they seem perfectly happy to go from manager to manager as long as we are getting the bounce each time to secure some points. She didn't seem to get that we also lose a lot of points when an inexperienced manager finally gets found out. I would like to have seen her taken to task on this a bit more.
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I don't think KM can win to be honest - which I suppose is largely her fault for backing herself into a corner with poor communication early on, as well as just taking the job in the first place. I think that owning up to getting things wrong would be a good start, which she kind of does sometimes without actually saying it explicitly or apologising, which is frustrating.
Yeah, the presentation was high-level and doesn't answer much, but if she'd stood there for 30+ minutes (still quite short to cover essentially everything about the club) we'd say that she was eating into 'discussion time' and not listening to supporters or something. My opinion is that overall it was a bit 'meh' - doesn't answer much, but it did make me feel like (despite all of the hysteria) that there's nothing sinister going on in the background and we are getting some serious money pumped into club's infrastructure. There's just been so many mistakes across the board to be owned up to - from managerial appointments and player recruitment to simple logistics of coaches/season tickets/databases/sofas all in this painfully poorly executed attempt at improving the club. I think the character assassinations of KM are very harsh, but the criticisms of how well she's doing her job are much less harsh.4 -
The more I see of KM & Co. the more I get the impression that they are just winging it and hoping it pans out. Yes they seem to have some goals, but judging by their actions and their lack of communication on the matter, I'm not sure they really know how they are going to get there. Even when questioned last night about how they intend to get there, they just gave a few generic and very obvious answers that didn't really give any insight on how that fitted their particular strategy.6
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I didn't say the protest was pointless - I said the black and white, write it down thing was - I also said the protest should be about changing things but I stand by my statement - grown men f'ing and blinding, getting personal and all the rest of it - sort yourself out. Season ticket holder continuous since 1 was 12 - now 44. selhurst, west ham , valley before and after, helped club re build ground when came back, helped with leaflets for campaign etc etc - understand fully what its all about but I wouldn't expect you to take a step back and realise how ridiculous you sound so you crack on.Greenie said:
They said in the video that if KF does Ok he will stay. Wise up we are stuck with KF, there is no ongoing search, if KF loses the best 5-6 matches then they will install another Roland puppet, its what they do.DOUCHER said:Just to elaborate if I may - the purpose of our protest should be to try and change the way they are going about things - its not that we don't know what there aims / objectives are - we do and its tedious keep asking what they are. We need them to accept that they may need to adjust by bringing in a 'proper' manager and some proven championship quality players to help in the short to mid term - that is what this protest should be about. I also think that a lot of you will look back and be embarrassed with the way you have treated / referred to a woman who (however inexperienced in her position she may be) is just a human being doing her best - You really all need to take a step back before you lose all credibility.
It was said in the video that Charlton are not known as having an aggressive fanbase. So for grown men and women (yes there were women there too, KM failed to mention that) to stage a protest, the club have monumentally f**ked up.
So she got called a few names etc, tough f**king shit, football is about passion, its tribal, KM with her 'little girl lost' face trying to garner sympathy was pathetic, if she was a 60 year old bloke the same things would have been said, so she appears to not have a bloody clue what she has done and does not understand football and our club, and judging by your constant snipes at the protests then you understand as much about our club as KM does.
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The presentation was the sort of low standard id expect from some arrogant idiot on the Apprentice.
In fairness to KM I will not look upon her as a CEO, but as some dirty old businessman's bit of London skirt.1 -
What pisses me off is that she has thrown around this 2% figure (which equates to about 200 based on current actual turnouts) and somehow in her corporate-trained mind has taken that to mean 98% think she's the next best thing since sliced bread. Suggest she get some of her spies to sit away from the rarified atmosphere of the directors' box and report back to her at the unhappiness in the standsstonemuse said:KM's assertion that only 2% of the crowd were protesting and that those not in favour of a protest should stand up against this 'minority' shows that she ...still ...has no concept of the dissatisfaction in the fan base.
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I think you are being grossly unfair to the arrogant idiots on The Apprentice.smudge7946 said:The presentation was the sort of low standard id expect from some arrogant idiot on the Apprentice.
In fairness to KM I will not look upon her as a CEO, but as some dirty old businessman's bit of London skirt.5 -
Yes but RD & KM's aims are different from ours.Greenie said:b>From my comment on the other thread
Please! she must really take us for 24 carat idiots.
On the academy........
(Not verbatim)
'5 academy players made their debuts, this means that will be our advantage over the other prem league teams'
No it doesn't (with no disrespect to those players) it means we dont have enough senior experienced players at the club, and when we have injuries we have to rely on a bunch of kids.
What bloody world does she live in........?
We see it as a disadvantage, because a team half full of kids will be weak & lose.
They see it as an advantage over Premier clubs, because they hope it will attract more kids to CAFC than Premier clubs.
The results of the 1st team are secondary.5
