"It will all be ok when we sign a decent midfield"
then
"It will all be ok when we sign a left back"
then
"It will all be ok when Arter starts"
And now its
"It will all be ok when Gilbey is back"
It's just so laughable.
I'm not going to hold my breath for the inevitable.......
" it will all be ok when JFC is fit"
and the ever reliable
" it will all be ok once the winter transfer window shuts"
I won't waste my time picking this post apart but it would be nice to read some people getting behind the team.
Funny thing is I got behind the team on Saturday. My post was more about the fans on here who keeping telling me that I need to be patient as everything will be fine......especially after I pointed out months ago that we weren't.
It just seems to take some people a bit longer I suppose.....but you'll get there.
"It will all be ok when we sign a decent midfield"
then
"It will all be ok when we sign a left back"
then
"It will all be ok when Arter starts"
And now its
"It will all be ok when Gilbey is back"
It's just so laughable.
I'm not going to hold my breath for the inevitable.......
" it will all be ok when JFC is fit"
and the ever reliable
" it will all be ok once the winter transfer window shuts"
I won't waste my time picking this post apart but it would be nice to read some people getting behind the team.
There are plenty of people on here getting behind the team, what would be nice if those that do dare to criticise or raise a concern don't get constantly dug out. Golfie says it how it is not with rose tinted glasses on. He provides an opposing view on a football forum, and lets be honest he is more right than wrong at the moment.
Can anyone quote what Curbs said after the 1st half on Saturday? because there were so many fundamental errors in how a team should play and link up by Cafc.
I assume it was seen by our overseas fans live and could be watched in the UK later ?
Difficult to remember now. But he did point out that the wingers weren't tracking back and that was allowing Cheltenham 2v1 on the outside. He said he played with two wingers sometimes but they always tracked back.
He also said maybe when you're not playing well, you should have one winger and one midfielder playing wide. A bit like he used to do when he would Graham Stuart on the right sometimes. He said we looked too open.
He said Stockley had his worst half that he'd seen. Terrible touch. Etc.
Can't remember any more at the moment.
Ouch, interesting that Curbs feels able to speak out now, whereas last season he was more diplomatic when we were in our rubbish spell. Calling out Stockley too...
"It will all be ok when we sign a decent midfield"
then
"It will all be ok when we sign a left back"
then
"It will all be ok when Arter starts"
And now its
"It will all be ok when Gilbey is back"
It's just so laughable.
I'm not going to hold my breath for the inevitable.......
" it will all be ok when JFC is fit"
and the ever reliable
" it will all be ok once the winter transfer window shuts"
I won't waste my time picking this post apart but it would be nice to read some people getting behind the team.
Funny thing is I got behind the team on Saturday. My post was more about the fans on here who keeping telling me that I need to be patient as everything will be fine......especially after I pointed out months ago that we weren't.
It just seems to take some people a bit longer I suppose.....but you'll get there.
Did you though?
You said we'd lose unless Adkins did what you think is best.
I think there's a problem deeper in the club not saying it's Roddy, not saying it's the olde boys, not sure what it is, but we need those at the club to overcome it.
There's nothing us fans can do about it so rather than pointing out the obvious that we're not playing good football or winning games... We can ALL see that and it's boringly predictable and negativity is like a virus, the higher the dose of it, the worse it spreads. Why not just get behind the team together inspite of shit results... We did under Roland we can again.
"It will all be ok when we sign a decent midfield"
then
"It will all be ok when we sign a left back"
then
"It will all be ok when Arter starts"
And now its
"It will all be ok when Gilbey is back"
It's just so laughable.
I'm not going to hold my breath for the inevitable.......
" it will all be ok when JFC is fit"
and the ever reliable
" it will all be ok once the winter transfer window shuts"
I won't waste my time picking this post apart but it would be nice to read some people getting behind the team.
Funny thing is I got behind the team on Saturday. My post was more about the fans on here who keeping telling me that I need to be patient as everything will be fine......especially after I pointed out months ago that we weren't.
It just seems to take some people a bit longer I suppose.....but you'll get there.
It is not about taking longer or getting there we are all in the same position as supporters. I have criticised the formation, tactics and NA and admit we are currently in a mess. I have also said we won't get automatic promotion. What I haven't seen and neither have you is us being able to put out a team where all are up to speed and we don't have to play a RB at LB. At present we have Purrington/Pape, Arter, Gilbey to come in and Leko to start. Lee has only played one full league game, Lavelle less and God knows when we will see Schwartz if ever. In addition Kirk, who has been poor needs an overlapping LB behind him and that could be Pape. Yes we are poor at the moment but if you include Innis, Saturdays team were missing 5 players (half an outfield team) who should be in the starting 11.I never mind admitting when I am wrong but with six games into a season and half a team missing now is not the time.
I've just listened to NA post match interview on the OS. He quite clearly was not happy about the 1st half, and only a bit happier about the first 20 mins of the 2nd half, and was including himself in the under performance. The bit that struck me was when he was talking about the size of the squad he has now and the competition for places. I think he will make quite a few changes on Saturday, and may we'll go 442. I'd expect to see Washington, Leko and Souare in, Gunter, Watson, DJ and hopefully Morgan out, with Dobson or Clare replacing him.
I think it can be turned round and there is certainly time to do so. We basically need to go on a run as the first priority. What you have in football is the annoying behaviour of opponents doing their research and implementing a plan to stop you. You don't need to see the report on us to work out that it will go along the lines of stop Stockley and you stop them.
Given that you don't have to be a rocket scientist to work that out, surely you need another way of playing that you can quickly slip into when that happens. Not wait until half time, but act on it when it is clear what is happening. And given the tactics employed are not that complex, it should be easier to counter and if a team has to put more emphasis on stopping Stockley, it should open up for other players.
I do know I have zero interest in what Adkins has to say before and after a game as I have worked out it is bullshit. That isn't to say he is a bad manager, or indeed that is a bad thing, but my clue to how well we are being managed is what I see on the pitch. And that is what he needs to sort out presto. No excuses, no blaming, just do what he is paid to do and we will all be happy.
"It will all be ok when we sign a decent midfield"
then
"It will all be ok when we sign a left back"
then
"It will all be ok when Arter starts"
And now its
"It will all be ok when Gilbey is back"
It's just so laughable.
I'm not going to hold my breath for the inevitable.......
" it will all be ok when JFC is fit"
and the ever reliable
" it will all be ok once the winter transfer window shuts"
I won't waste my time picking this post apart but it would be nice to read some people getting behind the team.
Funny thing is I got behind the team on Saturday. My post was more about the fans on here who keeping telling me that I need to be patient as everything will be fine......especially after I pointed out months ago that we weren't.
It just seems to take some people a bit longer I suppose.....but you'll get there.
It is not about taking longer or getting there we are all in the same position as supporters. I have criticised the formation, tactics and NA and admit we are currently in a mess. I have also said we won't get automatic promotion. What I haven't seen and neither have you is us being able to put out a team where all are up to speed and we don't have to play a RB at LB. At present we have Purrington/Pape, Arter, Gilbey to come in and Leko to start. Lee has only played one full league game, Lavelle less and God knows when we will see Schwartz if ever. In addition Kirk, who has been poor needs an overlapping LB behind him and that could be Pape. Yes we are poor at the moment but if you include Innis, Saturdays team were missing 5 players (half an outfield team) who should be in the starting 11.I never mind admitting when I am wrong but with six games into a season and half a team missing now is not the time.
We would all like to see the positives, but remember that Purrington, Schwarz and Gilbey were not considered good enough last season to be automatic starters, now you see them as saviours. Inniss has been injury prone for years. I don't see any cavalry coming over the hill personally. Add to this Adkins fixation with one up front and there is not much light at the end of the tunnel.
Some of the excuses on here for our performance on Saturday are laughable. We're in L1 and are one of the better resourced clubs so sitting in 20th with one win in six games is crap however you dress it up.
There wasn't much to cheer on Saturdsy and Adkins needs to sort his tactics out and drop players who won't follow them. If we don't have a functioning midfield we won't get anywhere.
"It will all be ok when we sign a decent midfield"
then
"It will all be ok when we sign a left back"
then
"It will all be ok when Arter starts"
And now its
"It will all be ok when Gilbey is back"
It's just so laughable.
I'm not going to hold my breath for the inevitable.......
" it will all be ok when JFC is fit"
and the ever reliable
" it will all be ok once the winter transfer window shuts"
I won't waste my time picking this post apart but it would be nice to read some people getting behind the team.
Funny thing is I got behind the team on Saturday. My post was more about the fans on here who keeping telling me that I need to be patient as everything will be fine......especially after I pointed out months ago that we weren't.
It just seems to take some people a bit longer I suppose.....but you'll get there.
It is not about taking longer or getting there we are all in the same position as supporters. I have criticised the formation, tactics and NA and admit we are currently in a mess. I have also said we won't get automatic promotion. What I haven't seen and neither have you is us being able to put out a team where all are up to speed and we don't have to play a RB at LB. At present we have Purrington/Pape, Arter, Gilbey to come in and Leko to start. Lee has only played one full league game, Lavelle less and God knows when we will see Schwartz if ever. In addition Kirk, who has been poor needs an overlapping LB behind him and that could be Pape. Yes we are poor at the moment but if you include Innis, Saturdays team were missing 5 players (half an outfield team) who should be in the starting 11.I never mind admitting when I am wrong but with six games into a season and half a team missing now is not the time.
We would all like to see the positives, but remember that Purrington, Schwarz and Gilbey were not considered good enough last season to be automatic starters, now you see them as saviours. Inniss has been injury prone for years. I don't see any cavalry coming over the hill personally. Add to this Adkins fixation with one up front and there is not much light at the end of the tunnel.
Did I say they were saviours? I did say I didn't know when we would see Schwartz again. And Purrington is better than Gunter at LB. Pape could turn out better than Purrington. Gilbey was a good player before we signed him and under NA showed he had something to offer. He would also be a better option than Morgan. An off form Arter will be better than Watson. Leko has to start in my opinion and whilst I accept Innis and his injuries he is a very good player when he can start. I do agree with the fixation with Stockley and have already said the formation is wrong and we looked better with Washington in a 442
I've just listened to NA post match interview on the OS. He quite clearly was not happy about the 1st half, and only a bit happier about the first 20 mins of the 2nd half, and was including himself in the under performance. The bit that struck me was when he was talking about the size of the squad he has now and the competition for places. I think he will make quite a few changes on Saturday, and may we'll go 442. I'd expect to see Washington, Leko and Souare in, Gunter, Watson, DJ and hopefully Morgan out, with Dobson or Clare replacing him.
Agree. All of them can have no complaints if they’re dropped
I was pretty pissed off on saturday(like the rest of you).But the worst thing to me was,the total lack of effort from Kirk and DJ in helping out our full backs,time after time on both sides,they were esposed to a wave of attackers.Neither full back had the best of games but surely a helping hand would not have gone amiss.In contrast,Leeds v Liverpool,Game won,Leeds 10 men,Mo Salah,back in his own half helping out his colleagues,if the top players are not afraid to get their hands dirty,why not ours.
DJ is a dud. 3 good runs against MK Dons, but has offered very little else since he's been here.
It has p***ed me off how much stick our full backs got given how little cover DJ and Kirk gave. It was pretty obvious early on this was happening and Cheltenham were free to get crosses in with little pressure.
I do wonder what our tactics are?
The lack of cover the full backs got on Saturday is not in question and the averaged low marks they received from 78 lifers was no doubt heavily influenced by their poor defending. This is their bread and butter, it left us with a mountain to climb after going 2 goals behind on the half hour and the dye was cast.
Have a look at the highlights again both goals came from the oppos’ right. Gunter gave the wide man far too much room for both goals to get a cross in unchallenged. In fact he comes inside next to Famewo for their second instead of picking up the wide man! How a player with so much international experience can defend like that is beyond comprehension.
Matthews who was marginally better of the two, was totally unaware of the of their player who ran across him to shoot at Macgilivry who pushed it out for them to score their first. At least he made some forays forward to try and make amends whereas Gunter just kept passing sideways and backwards to Famewo and then directed him to give it to the keeper. His confidence seemed shot and didn’t want the ball copping out and letting someone else take responsibility IMO.
That’s just rank bad full back play and Curbs actually said as much at half time.
"It will all be ok when we sign a decent midfield"
then
"It will all be ok when we sign a left back"
then
"It will all be ok when Arter starts"
And now its
"It will all be ok when Gilbey is back"
It's just so laughable.
I'm not going to hold my breath for the inevitable.......
" it will all be ok when JFC is fit"
and the ever reliable
" it will all be ok once the winter transfer window shuts"
I won't waste my time picking this post apart but it would be nice to read some people getting behind the team.
Funny thing is I got behind the team on Saturday. My post was more about the fans on here who keeping telling me that I need to be patient as everything will be fine......especially after I pointed out months ago that we weren't.
It just seems to take some people a bit longer I suppose.....but you'll get there.
It is not about taking longer or getting there we are all in the same position as supporters. I have criticised the formation, tactics and NA and admit we are currently in a mess. I have also said we won't get automatic promotion. What I haven't seen and neither have you is us being able to put out a team where all are up to speed and we don't have to play a RB at LB. At present we have Purrington/Pape, Arter, Gilbey to come in and Leko to start. Lee has only played one full league game, Lavelle less and God knows when we will see Schwartz if ever. In addition Kirk, who has been poor needs an overlapping LB behind him and that could be Pape. Yes we are poor at the moment but if you include Innis, Saturdays team were missing 5 players (half an outfield team) who should be in the starting 11.I never mind admitting when I am wrong but with six games into a season and half a team missing now is not the time.
And what have I been banging on about since late June........
That we were behind the 8 ball with our lack of signings. Its doesnt take a genius to work out that if you start a season with your only left back injured & a midfield consisting of just Morgan, Watson, Clare & Dobson then you'll be in trouble.
I take no pleasure out of saying I told you so. A lot on here didnt want to listen & said I should be patient. Well being patient meant that in the end 2 of the players we brought in aren't "match fit" and we are still playing a right back at left back 6 games in.
As I've said many times, if this is what you get after having 3 months to prepare for a season good knows what happens when you are really up against it.
The only person I will single out is Nigel Adkins because he decides the formations and had opportunities to change things up before the 2nd goal. The manager has to think on his feet. Pro active or reactive or at least some type of active to change the course of the first half.
This. The definition of stupidity is doing the same thing again and again and expecting a different result…….so he needs to change something.
If his view is that the players aren’t carrying out his instructions, then he should review the transcript of his post match comments on the CAFC web site - that is a strangled, word salad chucked at a wall. Perhaps, along with formation and line up changes, communication could be improved?
We don't know what sort of job JJ or Euell for that So going back to what I would do if I owned the club. Well my priority would be to find a Curbs or a Powell. These were managers who understood the club and knew when money had to be spent but also realised they had to be careful how they spent it. You find these managers by giving them a chance and they either take that chance or they don't. Both understood the club very well on their first day. Complicated structures may work for very big clubs but I can't see how they work for us. We have seen what works for us and Bowyer even demonstrated it when he first got the job. The trick is of course is to get that one appointment right and who is to say JJ or Euell would not be right. But if not, maybe Pearce is..........
Eh? I enjoyed the post until that bit.
But the point is, we don't know. I could have said Watson. Curbs was definitely not as popular as Gritty when he got the job. I am saying that person may be within our ranks whoever he is.
"It will all be ok when we sign a decent midfield"
then
"It will all be ok when we sign a left back"
then
"It will all be ok when Arter starts"
And now its
"It will all be ok when Gilbey is back"
It's just so laughable.
I'm not going to hold my breath for the inevitable.......
" it will all be ok when JFC is fit"
and the ever reliable
" it will all be ok once the winter transfer window shuts"
I won't waste my time picking this post apart but it would be nice to read some people getting behind the team.
Funny thing is I got behind the team on Saturday. My post was more about the fans on here who keeping telling me that I need to be patient as everything will be fine......especially after I pointed out months ago that we weren't.
It just seems to take some people a bit longer I suppose.....but you'll get there.
It is not about taking longer or getting there we are all in the same position as supporters. I have criticised the formation, tactics and NA and admit we are currently in a mess. I have also said we won't get automatic promotion. What I haven't seen and neither have you is us being able to put out a team where all are up to speed and we don't have to play a RB at LB. At present we have Purrington/Pape, Arter, Gilbey to come in and Leko to start. Lee has only played one full league game, Lavelle less and God knows when we will see Schwartz if ever. In addition Kirk, who has been poor needs an overlapping LB behind him and that could be Pape. Yes we are poor at the moment but if you include Innis, Saturdays team were missing 5 players (half an outfield team) who should be in the starting 11.I never mind admitting when I am wrong but with six games into a season and half a team missing now is not the time.
And what have I been banging on about since late June........
That we were behind the 8 ball with our lack of signings. Its doesnt take a genius to work out that if you start a season with your only left back injured & a midfield consisting of just Morgan, Watson, Clare & Dobson then you'll be in trouble.
I take no pleasure out of saying I told you so. A lot on here didnt want to listen & said I should be patient. Well being patient meant that in the end 2 of the players we brought in aren't "match fit" and we are still playing a right back at left back 6 games in.
As I've said many times, if this is what you get after having 3 months to prepare for a season good knows what happens when you are really up against it.
I am not writing off Dobson and Clare, they are both young and likely to improve what is disappointing is that they can't play or are good enough to play in the same team together a bit like Watson and Pratley. In saying that both should be back ups and not starters, which is now happening. What you, I or the management couldn't predict is Gilbey getting Covid which after 2 months he is still only just started training. I am sure he was part of the first 11 plan. Getting players late in was always a gamble but I don't think many would have predicated such a poor start and just about all of us said a LB was a priority as soon as Purrington got injured if not before. There is still time to turn things around, in fact 40 games, but after Saturday my biggest concern is NA and his one dimensional outlook.
Clarky 100% correct regarding injuries to Purrs and Inniss but I'm from the never be out thought by your opposite number and Nigel was for 45 minutes until Leko and then Washington came on. Stockley having a poor game was our night mare scenario as Super sub Chuks has gone. I would have been bold and gone Leko before the 2nd goal Davison and Washington from the 60's minute. This would have given the team some energy and may have seen a draw or even a win. Adkins choice to leave Davison out the 18.
May only be the Papa John but when a striker scores a couple of goals for Cafc surely put him in the 18. Davidson has pace to burn and has had more shots on target than anyone else.
I remember Alan Curbishley playing five across the middle after a string of poor results. He was criticised initially, but I remember him retorting in his usual dulcet tones 'Well we're being mugged off aren't we'.
Here he is talking in a Guardian report in 2005.
At Charlton, we had a poor run early this season playing 4-4-2, including 4-0 defeats at Arsenal and Manchester City. Losing 2-1 at home to Middlesbrough playing 4-4-2 was the final straw, so for our visit to Tottenham in November we gave 4-5-1 a try, won 3-2 and have stuck with it. Our record before that game was won three, drawn three, lost five; since then it has been won nine, drawn four, lost five.
With 4-5-1 you have an extra man in midfield, your back four have greater protection than with 4-4-2 and opposing centre-halves have the problem of what to do about the man 'in the hole'. It's a big problem for a team playing 4-4-2 coming up against someone like Bergkamp, but 4-5-1 helps you to deal with that because you have an extra man in midfield.
At Charlton, our two full-backs attack as much as they can, while the centre-backs sit back. Danny Murphy has the freedom to act as our Bergkamp, Matt Holland and Paul Konchesky are alongside him in the middle, Shaun Bartlett is the lone striker, with Jerome Thomas and Dennis Rommedahl or Jonatan Johansson. It means that we have five or six attacking players in the same team.
I agree with the people on here saying it isnt too late to sort this out and have a successful season but Adkins needs to act swiftly. We are far too predictable in our play and just lack movement added to the fact that our defence doesnt seem to trust our midfield to hold or distribute the ball hence Famwoe trying to play raking passes upto our attack. We may as well not bother having a midfield at the moment. I know they have been getting stick but atleast Clare has the desire to run forwards to get us going. Dobson likewise. Until Arter and Gilby etc are ready I would rather play any combination of midfielders we have available than watson/morgan. I know it would be a tough call but I also think we should drop Stockly to start washington next game to see if that changes our movement and approach
"It will all be ok when we sign a decent midfield"
then
"It will all be ok when we sign a left back"
then
"It will all be ok when Arter starts"
And now its
"It will all be ok when Gilbey is back"
It's just so laughable.
I'm not going to hold my breath for the inevitable.......
" it will all be ok when JFC is fit"
and the ever reliable
" it will all be ok once the winter transfer window shuts"
I won't waste my time picking this post apart but it would be nice to read some people getting behind the team.
Funny thing is I got behind the team on Saturday. My post was more about the fans on here who keeping telling me that I need to be patient as everything will be fine......especially after I pointed out months ago that we weren't.
It just seems to take some people a bit longer I suppose.....but you'll get there.
Did you though?
You said we'd lose unless Adkins did what you think is best.
I think there's a problem deeper in the club not saying it's Roddy, not saying it's the olde boys, not sure what it is, but we need those at the club to overcome it.
There's nothing us fans can do about it so rather than pointing out the obvious that we're not playing good football or winning games... We can ALL see that and it's boringly predictable and negativity is like a virus, the higher the dose of it, the worse it spreads. Why not just get behind the team together inspite of shit results... We did under Roland we can again.
You're speaking like the crowd wasn't behind the team on Saturday. The atmosphere, for the most part, was great. People will always be more negative on here, because it's where they come to vent.
I remember Alan Curbishley playing five across the middle after a string of poor results. He was criticised initially, but I remember him retorting in his usual dulcet tones 'Well we're being mugged off aren't we'.
Here he is talking in a Guardian report in 2005.
At Charlton, we had a poor run early this season playing 4-4-2, including 4-0 defeats at Arsenal and Manchester City. Losing 2-1 at home to Middlesbrough playing 4-4-2 was the final straw, so for our visit to Tottenham in November we gave 4-5-1 a try, won 3-2 and have stuck with it. Our record before that game was won three, drawn three, lost five; since then it has been won nine, drawn four, lost five.
With 4-5-1 you have an extra man in midfield, your back four have greater protection than with 4-4-2 and opposing centre-halves have the problem of what to do about the man 'in the hole'. It's a big problem for a team playing 4-4-2 coming up against someone like Bergkamp, but 4-5-1 helps you to deal with that because you have an extra man in midfield.
At Charlton, our two full-backs attack as much as they can, while the centre-backs sit back. Danny Murphy has the freedom to act as our Bergkamp, Matt Holland and Paul Konchesky are alongside him in the middle, Shaun Bartlett is the lone striker, with Jerome Thomas and Dennis Rommedahl or Jonatan Johansson. It means that we have five or six attacking players in the same team.
"It will all be ok when we sign a decent midfield"
then
"It will all be ok when we sign a left back"
then
"It will all be ok when Arter starts"
And now its
"It will all be ok when Gilbey is back"
It's just so laughable.
I'm not going to hold my breath for the inevitable.......
" it will all be ok when JFC is fit"
and the ever reliable
" it will all be ok once the winter transfer window shuts"
I won't waste my time picking this post apart but it would be nice to read some people getting behind the team.
Funny thing is I got behind the team on Saturday. My post was more about the fans on here who keeping telling me that I need to be patient as everything will be fine......especially after I pointed out months ago that we weren't.
It just seems to take some people a bit longer I suppose.....but you'll get there.
It is not about taking longer or getting there we are all in the same position as supporters. I have criticised the formation, tactics and NA and admit we are currently in a mess. I have also said we won't get automatic promotion. What I haven't seen and neither have you is us being able to put out a team where all are up to speed and we don't have to play a RB at LB. At present we have Purrington/Pape, Arter, Gilbey to come in and Leko to start. Lee has only played one full league game, Lavelle less and God knows when we will see Schwartz if ever. In addition Kirk, who has been poor needs an overlapping LB behind him and that could be Pape. Yes we are poor at the moment but if you include Innis, Saturdays team were missing 5 players (half an outfield team) who should be in the starting 11.I never mind admitting when I am wrong but with six games into a season and half a team missing now is not the time.
Hang on a moment. You've just pointed out that we've been signing unfit, unready players, and very late too.
The owner said that we would be in the Premier League within 5 years.
The manager said that we would be like Hull (Champions).
If they weren't so deluded and / or arrogant then people wouldn't be moaning so much. At some other clubs the fans would be asking the club for money back on season tickets arguing angrily that they were purchased under false pretences.
TS comes across as very kind, enthusiastic, fun, likeable and loves football. It sounds like a description of my 11 year old boy. I certainly wouldn't expect good results with him as owner though.
I remember Alan Curbishley playing five across the middle after a string of poor results. He was criticised initially, but I remember him retorting in his usual dulcet tones 'Well we're being mugged off aren't we'.
Here he is talking in a Guardian report in 2005.
At Charlton, we had a poor run early this season playing 4-4-2, including 4-0 defeats at Arsenal and Manchester City. Losing 2-1 at home to Middlesbrough playing 4-4-2 was the final straw, so for our visit to Tottenham in November we gave 4-5-1 a try, won 3-2 and have stuck with it. Our record before that game was won three, drawn three, lost five; since then it has been won nine, drawn four, lost five.
With 4-5-1 you have an extra man in midfield, your back four have greater protection than with 4-4-2 and opposing centre-halves have the problem of what to do about the man 'in the hole'. It's a big problem for a team playing 4-4-2 coming up against someone like Bergkamp, but 4-5-1 helps you to deal with that because you have an extra man in midfield.
At Charlton, our two full-backs attack as much as they can, while the centre-backs sit back. Danny Murphy has the freedom to act as our Bergkamp, Matt Holland and Paul Konchesky are alongside him in the middle, Shaun Bartlett is the lone striker, with Jerome Thomas and Dennis Rommedahl or Jonatan Johansson. It means that we have five or six attacking players in the same team.
That's exactly the formation we are attempting to play now. Yet a lot of people's solution is to sick another striker in.
The major problem is we don't have two players that can do the job "captain clean shorts" and Konch (a left back playing out of position) did. We need 3 in there.
We've filled our squad with wingers, but I'm starting to wonder if we can afford to have 2 lightweight wingers in our 4231/433 formation, and whether we'd be better playing a Powell style 442, but with one just one winger and a more defensive wide midfielder on the other side.
Said this yesterday, you simply can't play with 2 wingers who don't track back. I would drop DJ & put Washington wide. Ok he's not a defensive player but he will work his bollocks off & chase back, do we have anyone else ?
Whilst Thomas and Nigel may be regretting the timescales they predicted for gaining Premiership and Championship footy, if instead 10, 20 and 40 years had been applied to the Championship, Premiership and winning the Champions League respectively, would fans have been more impressed? Whilst both predictions might now appear unrealistic, based on performances so far this season, at least there was/is some ambition to attempt get there. Roland couldn't be bothered to finance a squad to keep us in the Championship...
"It will all be ok when we sign a decent midfield"
then
"It will all be ok when we sign a left back"
then
"It will all be ok when Arter starts"
And now its
"It will all be ok when Gilbey is back"
It's just so laughable.
I'm not going to hold my breath for the inevitable.......
" it will all be ok when JFC is fit"
and the ever reliable
" it will all be ok once the winter transfer window shuts"
I won't waste my time picking this post apart but it would be nice to read some people getting behind the team.
Funny thing is I got behind the team on Saturday. My post was more about the fans on here who keeping telling me that I need to be patient as everything will be fine......especially after I pointed out months ago that we weren't.
It just seems to take some people a bit longer I suppose.....but you'll get there.
It is not about taking longer or getting there we are all in the same position as supporters. I have criticised the formation, tactics and NA and admit we are currently in a mess. I have also said we won't get automatic promotion. What I haven't seen and neither have you is us being able to put out a team where all are up to speed and we don't have to play a RB at LB. At present we have Purrington/Pape, Arter, Gilbey to come in and Leko to start. Lee has only played one full league game, Lavelle less and God knows when we will see Schwartz if ever. In addition Kirk, who has been poor needs an overlapping LB behind him and that could be Pape. Yes we are poor at the moment but if you include Innis, Saturdays team were missing 5 players (half an outfield team) who should be in the starting 11.I never mind admitting when I am wrong but with six games into a season and half a team missing now is not the time.
And what have I been banging on about since late June........
That we were behind the 8 ball with our lack of signings. Its doesnt take a genius to work out that if you start a season with your only left back injured & a midfield consisting of just Morgan, Watson, Clare & Dobson then you'll be in trouble.
I take no pleasure out of saying I told you so. A lot on here didnt want to listen & said I should be patient. Well being patient meant that in the end 2 of the players we brought in aren't "match fit" and we are still playing a right back at left back 6 games in.
As I've said many times, if this is what you get after having 3 months to prepare for a season good knows what happens when you are really up against it.
You’ve been right all along and I’ve liked and agreed with a lot of your posts over the summer because to the realists it’s all been too obvious.
I guess the eternal optimists have just needed an extra 3 months to catch up.I think we are all there now.
Its likely to be a long old Autumn while we wait for players to get fit and for Adkins to fall on his sword.
I would most certainly consider playing Davison instead of Stockley next game,not quite as effective in the air,but can hold the ball up,is very quick and mobile,and can shoot straight,also he will chase down defenders,forcing errors.Up front with Washington,Lee just behind,and find a place for Blackett Taylor who needs the opportunity to prove himself.
I would most certainly consider playing Davison instead of Stockley next game,not quite as effective in the air,but can hold the ball up,is very quick and mobile,and can shoot straight,also he will chase down defenders,forcing errors.Up front with Washington,Lee just behind,and find a place for Blackett Taylor who needs the opportunity to prove himself.
You’d drop our top scorer and captain because he can’t ‘shoot straight’? Righto.
Comments
It just seems to take some people a bit longer I suppose.....but you'll get there.
You said we'd lose unless Adkins did what you think is best.
I think there's a problem deeper in the club not saying it's Roddy, not saying it's the olde boys, not sure what it is, but we need those at the club to overcome it.
There's nothing us fans can do about it so rather than pointing out the obvious that we're not playing good football or winning games... We can ALL see that and it's boringly predictable and negativity is like a virus, the higher the dose of it, the worse it spreads. Why not just get behind the team together inspite of shit results... We did under Roland we can again.
The bit that struck me was when he was talking about the size of the squad he has now and the competition for places.
I think he will make quite a few changes on Saturday, and may we'll go 442.
I'd expect to see Washington, Leko and Souare in, Gunter, Watson, DJ and hopefully Morgan out, with Dobson or Clare replacing him.
Given that you don't have to be a rocket scientist to work that out, surely you need another way of playing that you can quickly slip into when that happens. Not wait until half time, but act on it when it is clear what is happening. And given the tactics employed are not that complex, it should be easier to counter and if a team has to put more emphasis on stopping Stockley, it should open up for other players.
I do know I have zero interest in what Adkins has to say before and after a game as I have worked out it is bullshit. That isn't to say he is a bad manager, or indeed that is a bad thing, but my clue to how well we are being managed is what I see on the pitch. And that is what he needs to sort out presto. No excuses, no blaming, just do what he is paid to do and we will all be happy.
Add to this Adkins fixation with one up front and there is not much light at the end of the tunnel.
There wasn't much to cheer on Saturdsy and Adkins needs to sort his tactics out and drop players who won't follow them. If we don't have a functioning midfield we won't get anywhere.
I do agree with the fixation with Stockley and have already said the formation is wrong and we looked better with Washington in a 442
The lack of cover the full backs got on Saturday is not in question and the averaged low marks they received from 78 lifers was no doubt heavily influenced by their poor defending. This is their bread and butter, it left us with a mountain to climb after going 2 goals behind on the half hour and the dye was cast.
Have a look at the highlights again both goals came from the oppos’ right. Gunter gave the wide man far too much room for both goals to get a cross in unchallenged. In fact he comes inside next to Famewo for their second instead of picking up the wide man! How a player with so much international experience can defend like that is beyond comprehension.
Matthews who was marginally better of the two, was totally unaware of the of their player who ran across him to shoot at Macgilivry who pushed it out for them to score their first. At least he made some forays forward to try and make amends whereas Gunter just kept passing sideways and backwards to Famewo and then directed him to give it to the keeper. His confidence seemed shot and didn’t want the ball copping out and letting someone else take responsibility IMO.
That’s just rank bad full back play and Curbs actually said as much at half time.
That we were behind the 8 ball with our lack of signings. Its doesnt take a genius to work out that if you start a season with your only left back injured & a midfield consisting of just Morgan, Watson, Clare & Dobson then you'll be in trouble.
I take no pleasure out of saying I told you so. A lot on here didnt want to listen & said I should be patient. Well being patient meant that in the end 2 of the players we brought in aren't "match fit" and we are still playing a right back at left back 6 games in.
As I've said many times, if this is what you get after having 3 months to prepare for a season good knows what happens when you are really up against it.
If his view is that the players aren’t carrying out his instructions, then he should review the transcript of his post match comments on the CAFC web site - that is a strangled, word salad chucked at a wall. Perhaps, along with formation and line up changes, communication could be improved?
What you, I or the management couldn't predict is Gilbey getting Covid which after 2 months he is still only just started training. I am sure he was part of the first 11 plan.
Getting players late in was always a gamble but I don't think many would have predicated such a poor start and just about all of us said a LB was a priority as soon as Purrington got injured if not before. There is still time to turn things around, in fact 40 games, but after Saturday my biggest concern is NA and his one dimensional outlook.
May only be the Papa John but when a striker scores a couple of goals for Cafc surely put him in the 18. Davidson has pace to burn and has had more shots on target than anyone else.
Here he is talking in a Guardian report in 2005.
At Charlton, we had a poor run early this season playing 4-4-2, including 4-0 defeats at Arsenal and Manchester City. Losing 2-1 at home to Middlesbrough playing 4-4-2 was the final straw, so for our visit to Tottenham in November we gave 4-5-1 a try, won 3-2 and have stuck with it. Our record before that game was won three, drawn three, lost five; since then it has been won nine, drawn four, lost five.
With 4-5-1 you have an extra man in midfield, your back four have greater protection than with 4-4-2 and opposing centre-halves have the problem of what to do about the man 'in the hole'. It's a big problem for a team playing 4-4-2 coming up against someone like Bergkamp, but 4-5-1 helps you to deal with that because you have an extra man in midfield.
At Charlton, our two full-backs attack as much as they can, while the centre-backs sit back. Danny Murphy has the freedom to act as our Bergkamp, Matt Holland and Paul Konchesky are alongside him in the middle, Shaun Bartlett is the lone striker, with Jerome Thomas and Dennis Rommedahl or Jonatan Johansson. It means that we have five or six attacking players in the same team.
The whole article can be seen here.
https://www.theguardian.com/football/2005/mar/20/newsstory.sport
I know it would be a tough call but I also think we should drop Stockly to start washington next game to see if that changes our movement and approach
Adjust the middle three slightly and it's what we now call 4-3-3.
The owner said that we would be in the Premier League within 5 years.
The manager said that we would be like Hull (Champions).
If they weren't so deluded and / or arrogant then people wouldn't be moaning so much. At some other clubs the fans would be asking the club for money back on season tickets arguing angrily that they were purchased under false pretences.
TS comes across as very kind, enthusiastic, fun, likeable and loves football. It sounds like a description of my 11 year old boy. I certainly wouldn't expect good results with him as owner though.
The major problem is we don't have two players that can do the job "captain clean shorts" and Konch (a left back playing out of position) did. We need 3 in there.
Whilst both predictions might now appear unrealistic, based on performances so far this season, at least there was/is some ambition to attempt get there.
Roland couldn't be bothered to finance a squad to keep us in the Championship...
I guess the eternal optimists have just needed an extra 3 months to catch up.I think we are all there now.
Its likely to be a long old Autumn while we wait for players to get fit and for Adkins to fall on his sword.