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Rumours Rumours - Summer 2021 edition (Deadline Day from p814)

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  • More crap & lies then. Adkins quote on Tuesday was ..." he's player that I'm aware of...."

    I would bloody hope so if he's been training with us. Or is Adkins blind or just hasn't encountered him on his daily walk around the training pitches.

    See, this is what pisses me off. Just say it as it is.

    "Yes, the kid has been training with us..."

    If you can lie about something so obvious & that can easily be found out, what else are you lying about that can't be.
    He didn't lie. He said he was aware of him.
    thenewbie said:
    More crap & lies then. Adkins quote on Tuesday was ..." he's player that I'm aware of...."

    I would bloody hope so if he's been training with us. Or is Adkins blind or just hasn't encountered him on his daily walk around the training pitches.

    See, this is what pisses me off. Just say it as it is.

    "Yes, the kid has been training with us..."

    If you can lie about something so obvious & that can easily be found out, what else are you lying about that can't be.
    I know being contrary is your shtick but this is a really hyperbolic reading. "Crap and lies" is just putting as overly a negative spin on things as you accuse Adkins of putting a positive one.

    Yes, they are aware of him, they've bought him in and that's as far as it's gone. Gomes was here for a while but they avoided signing him, this could well be the same again.
    My point is Adkins didnt tell the truth. When asked the question about a player he could & should have said..." yes, he is training with us so that we can take a look".

    We knew about Gomes because he played in a couple of pre-season games. They couldn't hide that one.

    I'm assuming Adkins is "aware" of Harry Kane. Is he training with us too  ?


    Why though? What difference would it possibly make to know whether he's training or not given they quite clearly haven't made a decision yet? Robbie Elliot was training with us last year but was never going to actually sign.

    Grow up.
  • J BLOCK said:
    If its a budget issue then that lies with TS. 
    Which it is. We aren't pay the necessary wages to build the team needed. 
    It appears so now.

    I think the statement TS put out when he took over using words like “sustainable” and “long term” are accurate and very much part of the plan.  The bit we may of been sold under false pretences is the 5 year plan.  Because clearly premier league football is way off under this wage structure.

    I think we could build a good team on low wages with the right management team around and of course good youth academy, but it’s not gonna be done in one season, we could be in this league for a while, albeit run like a proper football club again, a painful prospect short term, but it could be argued a necessary one.
    I don't really think sustainable and long term exist with any club outside the Premiership. Its just a case of how much TS is prepared to lose every year, maybe its £5m or £10m but none of that is really '' sustainable''. The other thing is that with due respect to TS, he's really not that rich. and Zynex isn't that big a business and it is arguably a little over hyped in Nasdaq as a medical tech business. 
    Also, TS is 62 years old, the same as me and he must realize that he needs to get on with it and doesn't want to be watching crappy 3rd division football for the next 5 years. 
    So all in all, I think he needs to get on with it now and try very hard this season and not look to be building some kind of long term project.

    Finally, in a way, he doesn't really own anything other than the right to play football manager for a while , does he ? It came home to me when I walked in to the East Stand last Saturday when there are weeds growing in and out of the portakabin that stands next to the gate that maintenance will inevitably be very limited whilst Roland owns the ground. 
    Heresy I know but for a long term plan maybe someone ought to be reaching out to Roland's son behind the scenes and hope that Roland drops off his perch soon and that his then incredibly rich ( much richer than TS) Valley owning son fancies bankrolling a football club and running it sensibly unlike his Dad.
    As I said - I know its heresy !!! 
  • No real rhyme or reason behind this comment - but I have to ask why we can’t ever get taken over by mega rich owners who have the budget to build the squad we need. What do Wigan have that Charlton don’t? Smaller fan base, smaller income on match day, smaller growth potential.

    As I say a bit of a throwaway comment - but Christ Sake why not us for once
  • Rothko said:
    I just don't think people have ever listened to Sandgaard properly or beyond a few flashy soundbites which people cling to like there is nothing else in the world.

    If you go back to the CAST Zoom call earlier this year, there were no indications we would spend big, but we would spend well, develop the players we got, and hopefully buy the right way, he's always talked about putting the building blocks in place so when we do go up, it's a sustainable promotion. 
    People make up their own narrative. An example, TS is a showman so in his stay over here wants to unveil the players himself.
  • Cafc43v3r said:
    J BLOCK said:
    If its a budget issue then that lies with TS. 
    Which it is. We aren't pay the necessary wages to build the team needed. 
    It appears so now.

    I think the statement TS put out when he took over using words like “sustainable” and “long term” are accurate and very much part of the plan.  The bit we may of been sold under false pretences is the 5 year plan.  Because clearly premier league football is way off under this wage structure.

    I think we could build a good team on low wages with the right management team around and of course good youth academy, but it’s not gonna be done in one season, we could be in this league for a while, albeit run like a proper football club again, a painful prospect short term, but it could be argued a necessary one.
    That's not a viable plan either though.  Even if we ran a squad of 18 in 2 or 3 grand a week we would lose about 3 or 4 million a year, every year and would be lucky to not get relegated.

    You can't run an academy the size of ours, a professional u23 team, pay all the staff, pay the utility bills, policing, stewards etc etc on the TV money the commercial income and season ticket sales. Let alone fund the first team's wages.

    If we had lost the penalty shoot out to Doncaster, we would have been looking at a relegation battle the following season.  If we don't fund the first team properly this season that's what we will be looking at next season as well.

    Spending little is not a zero cost game. 
    Disagree.

    We are paying fees for young players, young players (not all) have sell on value, as does the academy players (not all).  You only need one to shine and you can flog him for 5 million these days. 

    In other words, Brentford.
  • edited August 2021
    Cafc43v3r said:
    J BLOCK said:
    If its a budget issue then that lies with TS. 
    Which it is. We aren't pay the necessary wages to build the team needed. 
    It appears so now.

    I think the statement TS put out when he took over using words like “sustainable” and “long term” are accurate and very much part of the plan.  The bit we may of been sold under false pretences is the 5 year plan.  Because clearly premier league football is way off under this wage structure.

    I think we could build a good team on low wages with the right management team around and of course good youth academy, but it’s not gonna be done in one season, we could be in this league for a while, albeit run like a proper football club again, a painful prospect short term, but it could be argued a necessary one.
    That's not a viable plan either though.  Even if we ran a squad of 18 in 2 or 3 grand a week we would lose about 3 or 4 million a year, every year and would be lucky to not get relegated.

    You can't run an academy the size of ours, a professional u23 team, pay all the staff, pay the utility bills, policing, stewards etc etc on the TV money the commercial income and season ticket sales. Let alone fund the first team's wages.

    If we had lost the penalty shoot out to Doncaster, we would have been looking at a relegation battle the following season.  If we don't fund the first team properly this season that's what we will be looking at next season as well.

    Spending little is not a zero cost game. 
    Disagree.

    We are paying fees for young players, young players (not all) have sell on value, as does the academy players (not all).  You only need one to shine and you can flog him for 5 million these days. 

    In other words, Brentford.
    But that only works if you buy the players and they work.  If we buy enough good young players that one is likley to be worth 5 million we would probably get promoted.  You can't start at the base we are and expect to flog a player next summer for any significant fee.

    Also Brentford did it before Brexit, a lot, not all, of their big sales were on players that now wouldn't get a work permit. Some of their other early signings in league 1 would now go to the championship.

    It sounds so simple because Brentford, Leicester and Peterborough have all been relatively successful recently, if it was why isn't everyone else doing it?

    If you use Peterborough as the comparison they don't have anywhere near the overheads we do and it took them 8 years to get promoted.  If we take 8 years there won't be much of a club left and the losses would spiral. 
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  • Cafc43v3r said:
    Cafc43v3r said:
    J BLOCK said:
    If its a budget issue then that lies with TS. 
    Which it is. We aren't pay the necessary wages to build the team needed. 
    It appears so now.

    I think the statement TS put out when he took over using words like “sustainable” and “long term” are accurate and very much part of the plan.  The bit we may of been sold under false pretences is the 5 year plan.  Because clearly premier league football is way off under this wage structure.

    I think we could build a good team on low wages with the right management team around and of course good youth academy, but it’s not gonna be done in one season, we could be in this league for a while, albeit run like a proper football club again, a painful prospect short term, but it could be argued a necessary one.
    That's not a viable plan either though.  Even if we ran a squad of 18 in 2 or 3 grand a week we would lose about 3 or 4 million a year, every year and would be lucky to not get relegated.

    You can't run an academy the size of ours, a professional u23 team, pay all the staff, pay the utility bills, policing, stewards etc etc on the TV money the commercial income and season ticket sales. Let alone fund the first team's wages.

    If we had lost the penalty shoot out to Doncaster, we would have been looking at a relegation battle the following season.  If we don't fund the first team properly this season that's what we will be looking at next season as well.

    Spending little is not a zero cost game. 
    Disagree.

    We are paying fees for young players, young players (not all) have sell on value, as does the academy players (not all).  You only need one to shine and you can flog him for 5 million these days. 

    In other words, Brentford.
    But that only works if you buy the players and they work.  If we buy enough good young players that one is likley to be worth 5 million we would probably get promoted.  You can't start at the base we are and expect to flog a player next summer for any significant fee.

    Also Brentford did it before Brexit, a lot, not all, of their big sales were on players that now wouldn't get a work permit. Some of their other early signings in league 1 would now go to the championship.

    It sounds so simple because Brentford, Leicester and Peterborough have all been relatively successful recently, if it was why isn't everyone else doing it? 
    Well we don’t know if it works do we it’s been what 9 months.  It’s a long term plan.

    I’m not saying it’s simple, effective or even the actual plan.  But what else could it be?  They are looking at young players from other clubs and young players at home.  That much is obvious, my opinion is that he is in it for the long haul and we could be in for a few years of league one, unfortunately.
  • Pretty underwhelming record since leaving Villa really, and 23 now (nearly 24) so not even a kid

    I'm baffled by our lack of activity at the start of the window, concerning free agents. Why didn't we pick up more players then - our only out of contract signing was McG, who was a direct replacement for losing Amos the same way. That's when the best free agents are snapped up.

    Yes they might demand more wages and a higher signing on fee, but then you're not paying the transfer fees that players like Kirk will demand. And not every decent free agent went to Ipswich or Wigan.
  • Croydon said:
    Rothko said:
    I just don't think people have ever listened to Sandgaard properly or beyond a few flashy soundbites which people cling to like there is nothing else in the world.

    If you go back to the CAST Zoom call earlier this year, there were no indications we would spend big, but we would spend well, develop the players we got, and hopefully buy the right way, he's always talked about putting the building blocks in place so when we do go up, it's a sustainable promotion. 
    I've never taken much notice of his comments, but now I just don't get why he said all of it if we're clearly running under a tight budget. He could have said he was going to bring some stability etc after the past few years, and I think that would have got just as many fans onside from the outset.
    He’s an excitable guy and incredibly positive, it’s no wonder he makes big off the cuff statement, after taking us over or just having missed out on the play offs. The first time we ever heard of the bloke, he was described as a rockstar businessman, so it was never going to be subtle statements from him. His last few statements show he’s already learnt a lot and is understanding he needs to lay off the grand gestures. 
  • Pretty underwhelming record since leaving Villa really, and 23 now (nearly 24) so not even a kid

    I'm baffled by our lack of activity at the start of the window, concerning free agents. Why didn't we pick up more players then - our only out of contract signing was McG, who was a direct replacement for losing Amos the same way. That's when the best free agents are snapped up.

    Yes they might demand more wages and a higher signing on fee, but then you're not paying the transfer fees that players like Kirk will demand. And not every decent free agent went to Ipswich or Wigan.
    I suspect we very very much underestimated the windows difficulties 
  • It's a dubious comparison as well for Adkins to compare us with his Scunthorpe sides that he got promoted.

    Scunthorpe were a small club at this level, with a small stadium, therefore it's far easier to generate the "we're up against the big boys, lets show 'em" team spirit than it is at Charlton. Every other club will see us as one of the big boys in this division, because that's what we are.

    It would be like an Arsenal or Spurs trying to reach the Top 6 this season based on underdog team spirit, nobody would buy it.
  • I believe we have the most expensive season tickets in league 1 so it's no surprise fans would expect us to have one of (if not the) biggest budget
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  • Ahhh another day of absolutely nothing! Interested to know what the tweet was about yesterday, 
  • Charlton fans reading over the latest TS or Adkins comments so we can hang them with them later 



    This, wish I could both like and LOL this, the way some people keep on quoting TS and NA comments as though they both stood in the centre circle of the pitch in front of a full Valley when they made them.
  • It's a dubious comparison as well for Adkins to compare us with his Scunthorpe sides that he got promoted.

    Scunthorpe were a small club at this level, with a small stadium, therefore it's far easier to generate the "we're up against the big boys, lets show 'em" team spirit than it is at Charlton. Every other club will see us as one of the big boys in this division, because that's what we are.

    It would be like an Arsenal or Spurs trying to reach the Top 6 this season based on underdog team spirit, nobody would buy it.
    The positive I take from that post is that Charlton are doing everything in their power to dispel the “big boy” image. Before we know it, we will be competing on level terms. 
  • I believe we have the most expensive season tickets in league 1 so it's no surprise fans would expect us to have one of (if not the) biggest budget
    Depends how many of the most expensive of our season tickets have been sold. The majority of our tickets sold are in the covered  end, and they’re not the most expensive option.

    I make it we have a cheaper season ticket option than 13 other sides in this league. 

    2021/22 League 1 season ticket prices

    AFC Wimbledon – £380-£525

    Accrington Stanley - £229

    Bolton Wanderers – £248-£366

    Burton Albion - £301-£423

    Cambridge United - £319-£425

    Charlton Athletic - £260-£575

    Cheltenham Town - £255-£481

    Crewe Alexandra - £395

    Doncaster Rovers - £299-£395

    Fleetwood Town - £170

    Gillingham - £321-£435

    Ipswich Town - £352-£470

    Lincoln City - £359-£429

    MK Dons - £230

    Morecambe - £150-£300

    Oxford United - £329-£500

    Plymouth Argyle - £288-£395

    Portsmouth - £313

    Rotherham United - £355-£395

    Sheffield Wednesday - £365-£495

    Shrewsbury Town - £305-£465

    Sunderland - £340-£465

    Wigan Athletic - £299-£369

    Wycombe Wanderers - £380-£494

    The Upper Covered End is £400 though, that's more expensive than the most expensive seats in many of the northern grounds. 
  • I believe we have the most expensive season tickets in league 1 so it's no surprise fans would expect us to have one of (if not the) biggest budget
    It's a false expectation.  If you look at the 18/19 accounts, the last league 1 accounts with a crowd. 

    Our "Administrative costs" were just short of £20 million.   Of that about 10 was wages, from everyone from the tea lady to Igor.

    Of the other 10 about 4 was "paper money" deprecation, amortisation and interest that was never going to be paid.

    The ticket sales and TV money just about cover the other 6 million.

    In league 1 the first team is paid by the owner, one way or another.  Season tickets only account for how much else he has to spend or not. 
  • “The points that we got per budget was unbelievable. So it can be done. It can be done with spirit, goalscorers, keeping clean sheets…you don’t have to have the best players; it’s about the whole squad coming together.

    “Sometimes you can spend money and have a big squad of players – you can’t keep people happy some of the times.

    “We’ve got our budget and we’ve got to work within the restraints of that, like every football club has to go and do. You get the best that you can out of everybody – with a harmony and spirit and desire to keep improving and doing well."

    Adkins said this the other day. I have highlighted the most glaring thing we are missing in that. Adkins at least is showing he knows what is needed. He must equally know we haven't got it. Yet!

  • edited August 2021
    So Adkins is saying that the league generally reflects the outlay in wages etc. That we are below where others are in our outlay but that occasionally you can buck the trend.

    Not blowing through the league is it. More hope than expectation.
  • Cafc43v3r said:
    J BLOCK said:
    If its a budget issue then that lies with TS. 
    Which it is. We aren't pay the necessary wages to build the team needed. 
    It appears so now.

    I think the statement TS put out when he took over using words like “sustainable” and “long term” are accurate and very much part of the plan.  The bit we may of been sold under false pretences is the 5 year plan.  Because clearly premier league football is way off under this wage structure.

    I think we could build a good team on low wages with the right management team around and of course good youth academy, but it’s not gonna be done in one season, we could be in this league for a while, albeit run like a proper football club again, a painful prospect short term, but it could be argued a necessary one.
    That's not a viable plan either though.  Even if we ran a squad of 18 in 2 or 3 grand a week we would lose about 3 or 4 million a year, every year and would be lucky to not get relegated.

    You can't run an academy the size of ours, a professional u23 team, pay all the staff, pay the utility bills, policing, stewards etc etc on the TV money the commercial income and season ticket sales. Let alone fund the first team's wages.

    If we had lost the penalty shoot out to Doncaster, we would have been looking at a relegation battle the following season.  If we don't fund the first team properly this season that's what we will be looking at next season as well.

    Spending little is not a zero cost game. 
    Disagree.

    We are paying fees for young players, young players (not all) have sell on value, as does the academy players (not all).  You only need one to shine and you can flog him for 5 million these days. 

    In other words, Brentford.
    How do you expect us to to a Brentford? when all these talented young players are asked to do is smash the ball up towards the big blonde lads head.

    To me the biggest problem in this whole mess of a pre-season isn't the signings, you don't have to be Phil Foden in L1. It's the absolutely awful style of play and the tactics from 1988 that we are employing - play the right way and you can cut through this league, like Lincoln last year and we did under Bows.

    Adkins is getting away with murder right now as we're all fixated on signings... yesterday he said there were things we are doing very, very well... like what, I've not seen anything
This discussion has been closed.

Roland Out Forever!