I'd be very impressed if we got Jephcott simply because i can't believe he'd have no Championship interest.
Why, I thought there was Championship interest in Kirk and we got him.
A good piece by a Crewe analyst pointed out that while Kirk is proving to be consistent, he has a lower ceilling than Lowery/Dale so those are the two more likely to get Championship interest now. Kirk on the other hand could probably hold his own (or so they said) but isn't a standout star like the other two.
You'd have thought Crewe should have pissed this league last year the way their players are touted
True but realistically their success was down to 4-5 players, Dale, Lowery, Pickering, Kirk and Mandron. Doesn't mean the rest of the team held their weight and only finished 8 points below us.
If those players weren't young talents they probably wouldn't be getting scouted - it's more their age and potential getting them this interest.
Jephcott and Charles would be excellent signings, alas Jephcott signed a new deal in June and Charles I can't believe won't have Champ interest this late in the window. Blackburn probably with the Armstrong money
I think Jephcott is more ‘gettable’ despite the new deal as he hadn’t scored in 21 competitive games before Tuesday (Camara scored too) and I think Plymouth and the player were just protecting themselves a bit with the new deal. Think Charles will end up in the champ but also a good player who would obviously strengthen us.
I think if Jephcott is available at a similar fee to Kirk and Stockley then we'd be daft not to give it a look.
Charles and Colby Bishop would both be good options , surprised neither have left Accy.
16 goals last season and 2 years left on his contract, I doubt Plymouth would be looking for anything less than a million for Jephcott.
it all depends what sort of release clause they had to put in his contract to get him to sign it a couple of months ago. He'd have one for sure, we could just trigger it as we did for Kirk.
I'd be very impressed if we got Jephcott simply because i can't believe he'd have no Championship interest.
Why, I thought there was Championship interest in Kirk and we got him.
A good piece by a Crewe analyst pointed out that while Kirk is proving to be consistent, he has a lower ceilling than Lowery/Dale so those are the two more likely to get Championship interest now. Kirk on the other hand could probably hold his own (or so they said) but isn't a standout star like the other two.
You'd have thought Crewe should have pissed this league last year the way their players are touted
True but realistically their success was down to 4-5 players, Dale, Lowery, Pickering, Kirk and Mandron. Doesn't mean the rest of the team held their weight and only finished 8 points below us.
If those players weren't young talents they probably wouldn't be getting scouted - it's more their age and potential getting them this interest.
Perry Ng and Ryan Wintle also made big money moves to Cardiff last season.
They had a golden generation of youth players all coming through at the same time.
Jephcott and Charles would be excellent signings, alas Jephcott signed a new deal in June and Charles I can't believe won't have Champ interest this late in the window. Blackburn probably with the Armstrong money
I think Jephcott is more ‘gettable’ despite the new deal as he hadn’t scored in 21 competitive games before Tuesday (Camara scored too) and I think Plymouth and the player were just protecting themselves a bit with the new deal. Think Charles will end up in the champ but also a good player who would obviously strengthen us.
I think if Jephcott is available at a similar fee to Kirk and Stockley then we'd be daft not to give it a look.
Charles and Colby Bishop would both be good options , surprised neither have left Accy.
Andy Holt has been very quiet on that front. But he has spent a fortune on upgrading the stadium and is obviously struggling with the current financial constraints and Covid.
If he does have to sell by the end of the window and interest is limited outside League 1, then if we make an approach I hope we don't screw him over. He seems like a good guy.
Yeah I wouldn't want to get a reputation as a club that throws around derisory lowball bids for players . I think all clubs are feeling the pinch of the last 18 months or so , but I wouldn't want to take advantage of clubs.
I’m afraid to say those are the rules of the game. Football is a competition and a business. If an opportunity arises because of another clubs misfortune then you need to take advantage. I’m not suggesting anything that hasn’t happened every season since money become more important than the football. We’ve been taken advantage of and no doubt will be again. That’s a fact of life.
That's the game, it's unsavoury, but we've been the victims of low ball bids in recent years, and if we can get a good player for less than you would normally have to pay, then its just business
I'd be very impressed if we got Jephcott simply because i can't believe he'd have no Championship interest.
Why, I thought there was Championship interest in Kirk and we got him.
A good piece by a Crewe analyst pointed out that while Kirk is proving to be consistent, he has a lower ceilling than Lowery/Dale so those are the two more likely to get Championship interest now. Kirk on the other hand could probably hold his own (or so they said) but isn't a standout star like the other two.
You'd have thought Crewe should have pissed this league last year the way their players are touted
True but realistically their success was down to 4-5 players, Dale, Lowery, Pickering, Kirk and Mandron. Doesn't mean the rest of the team held their weight and only finished 8 points below us.
If those players weren't young talents they probably wouldn't be getting scouted - it's more their age and potential getting them this interest.
Perry Ng and Ryan Wintle also made big money moves to Cardiff last season.
They had a golden generation of youth players all coming through at the same time.
Wintle only moved to Cardiff on a free transfer this summer
Was Ng (Cardiff) and Pickering (Blackburn) that moved in January - Wouldn't call it a golden generation either, Crewe are consistent bringing through youngsters that have moved on, e.g. Nick Powell to Man Utd, Luke Varney and Luke Murphy
Only thing was I felt last season we had too many central midfielders, and left us lacking in depth in other positions, so I hope that isn't the case this Yr. I think attacking midfielder is 5th on my priority.
yes and the worst thing about it is none of them were particularly good
None of them, even the scapegoats, were particularly bad either. The balance and combinations were awful. Certainly worse than the sum of the parts.
I'd be very impressed if we got Jephcott simply because i can't believe he'd have no Championship interest.
Why, I thought there was Championship interest in Kirk and we got him.
A good piece by a Crewe analyst pointed out that while Kirk is proving to be consistent, he has a lower ceilling than Lowery/Dale so those are the two more likely to get Championship interest now. Kirk on the other hand could probably hold his own (or so they said) but isn't a standout star like the other two.
You'd have thought Crewe should have pissed this league last year the way their players are touted
True but realistically their success was down to 4-5 players, Dale, Lowery, Pickering, Kirk and Mandron. Doesn't mean the rest of the team held their weight and only finished 8 points below us.
If those players weren't young talents they probably wouldn't be getting scouted - it's more their age and potential getting them this interest.
Yes there is that mate but honestly, I don't think we had one real out and out stand out 'Championship player' last year (probably Stockley aside and I don't think Chucks or JFC are cast iron championship quality) and an awful lot of barely league one quality in that mix and we still finished a point outside the play offs. If 50% of their side should be playing in championship or attracting championship interest I'd just have expected them to have done better.
Not meaning start an argument just a counter debate
I'd be very impressed if we got Jephcott simply because i can't believe he'd have no Championship interest.
Why, I thought there was Championship interest in Kirk and we got him.
A good piece by a Crewe analyst pointed out that while Kirk is proving to be consistent, he has a lower ceilling than Lowery/Dale so those are the two more likely to get Championship interest now. Kirk on the other hand could probably hold his own (or so they said) but isn't a standout star like the other two.
You'd have thought Crewe should have pissed this league last year the way their players are touted
True but realistically their success was down to 4-5 players, Dale, Lowery, Pickering, Kirk and Mandron. Doesn't mean the rest of the team held their weight and only finished 8 points below us.
If those players weren't young talents they probably wouldn't be getting scouted - it's more their age and potential getting them this interest.
Yes there is that mate but honestly, I don't think we had one real out and out stand out 'Championship player' last year (probably Stockley aside and I don't think Chucks or JFC are cast iron championship quality) and an awful lot of barely league one quality in that mix and we still finished a point outside the play offs. If 50% of their side should be playing in championship or attracting championship interest I'd just have expected them to have done better.
Not meaning start an argument just a counter debate
Yeah no argument here mate, love a good debate. Definately many factors to success, and it shows how missing one or two key players can really undo a team (Innis last year for us). Our points-per-game with Innis vs without is crazy. It could very well be Crewe have/had a fantastically promising team that were missing one or two key ingredients from kicking them onto the next stage. I feel Doncaster were in a similar position the year we beat them in the semi's.
I do ultimately think this is what stops many 'medium' clubs from becoming big clubs. It happens in scale like when our talent is poached to the Championship but the fact that teams such as Crewe can't stop their talent joining league rivals halts their progress as a club.
Only thing was I felt last season we had too many central midfielders, and left us lacking in depth in other positions, so I hope that isn't the case this Yr. I think attacking midfielder is 5th on my priority.
yes and the worst thing about it is none of them were particularly good
None of them, even the scapegoats, were particularly bad either. The balance and combinations were awful. Certainly worse than the sum of the parts.
i disagree - central midfield had 2 past it players, an inconsistent young player in morgan, an out of favour / form williams, gilbey who tbh i'm yet to be convinced about and jfc who became our best midfielder but was nowhere near the level of our midfield when we went up - biggest area for an overhaul this summer for me - still need that midfield general / playmaker
By a ‘Stephens type’ I mean someone who can set the tempo of the team and can pick a pass, think Dobson is a great water carrier, and both Gilbey and Clare are good box to box players, but still short of that player who can pick a pass
Jephcott and Charles would be excellent signings, alas Jephcott signed a new deal in June and Charles I can't believe won't have Champ interest this late in the window. Blackburn probably with the Armstrong money
I think Jephcott is more ‘gettable’ despite the new deal as he hadn’t scored in 21 competitive games before Tuesday (Camara scored too) and I think Plymouth and the player were just protecting themselves a bit with the new deal. Think Charles will end up in the champ but also a good player who would obviously strengthen us.
I think if Jephcott is available at a similar fee to Kirk and Stockley then we'd be daft not to give it a look.
Charles and Colby Bishop would both be good options , surprised neither have left Accy.
Andy Holt has been very quiet on that front. But he has spent a fortune on upgrading the stadium and is obviously struggling with the current financial constraints and Covid.
If he does have to sell by the end of the window and interest is limited outside League 1, then if we make an approach I hope we don't screw him over. He seems like a good guy.
Yeah I wouldn't want to get a reputation as a club that throws around derisory lowball bids for players . I think all clubs are feeling the pinch of the last 18 months or so , but I wouldn't want to take advantage of clubs.
Can't be many clubs that have been taken advantage of more than us. We lost Gomez, Konsa, Pope, Doughty, Gudmundsson and Grant for less than 15m for the lot. Throw in Aribo, Lockyer and Bauer going on frees and we've probably lost over 100m worth of players for a small fraction of their value.
By a ‘Stephens type’ I mean someone who can set the tempo of the team and can pick a pass, think Dobson is a great water carrier, and both Gilbey and Clare are good box to box players, but still short of that player who can pick a pass
At present it’s Gilbey & Morgan, the question is whether they are good enough.
Someone like Alex Pritchard that Sunderland got who can pick a pass but also drive forward centrally with the ball at feet would have been perfect I think.
By a ‘Stephens type’ I mean someone who can set the tempo of the team and can pick a pass, think Dobson is a great water carrier, and both Gilbey and Clare are good box to box players, but still short of that player who can pick a pass
At present it’s Gilbey & Morgan, the question is whether they are good enough.
Someone like Alex Pritchard that Sunderland got who can pick a pass but also drive forward centrally with the ball at feet would have been perfect I think.
The fact that no one is certain probably gives us the answer.
By a ‘Stephens type’ I mean someone who can set the tempo of the team and can pick a pass, think Dobson is a great water carrier, and both Gilbey and Clare are good box to box players, but still short of that player who can pick a pass
At present it’s Gilbey & Morgan, the question is whether they are good enough.
Someone like Alex Pritchard that Sunderland got who can pick a pass but also drive forward centrally with the ball at feet would have been perfect I think.
I don't think they are, Gilbey smacks me as someone who is box to box, puts in a shift and will score goals, and Morgan I'm just not convinced he can do that.
Jephcott and Charles would be excellent signings, alas Jephcott signed a new deal in June and Charles I can't believe won't have Champ interest this late in the window. Blackburn probably with the Armstrong money
I think Jephcott is more ‘gettable’ despite the new deal as he hadn’t scored in 21 competitive games before Tuesday (Camara scored too) and I think Plymouth and the player were just protecting themselves a bit with the new deal. Think Charles will end up in the champ but also a good player who would obviously strengthen us.
I think if Jephcott is available at a similar fee to Kirk and Stockley then we'd be daft not to give it a look.
Charles and Colby Bishop would both be good options , surprised neither have left Accy.
Andy Holt has been very quiet on that front. But he has spent a fortune on upgrading the stadium and is obviously struggling with the current financial constraints and Covid.
If he does have to sell by the end of the window and interest is limited outside League 1, then if we make an approach I hope we don't screw him over. He seems like a good guy.
Yeah I wouldn't want to get a reputation as a club that throws around derisory lowball bids for players . I think all clubs are feeling the pinch of the last 18 months or so , but I wouldn't want to take advantage of clubs.
Can't be many clubs that have been taken advantage of more than us. We lost Gomez, Konsa, Pope, Doughty, Gudmundsson and Grant for less than 15m for the lot. Throw in Aribo, Lockyer and Bauer going on frees and we've probably lost over 100m worth of players for a small fraction of their value.
I feel like people are sleeping on our midfield a little bit. I think that they will obviously improve once they get a few games under their belt and that 3 from Dobson, Clare, Morgan and Gilbey have enough mobility, pace and technique to be a good unit. They at least matched Wednesday's midfield who were all playing in the Champ last year and included Barry '27k' Bannan. I think our current midfielders have enough to come out on top against most midfields in the league. I would add in a more 'creative' CM/AM for sure, but I don't think they need to be a standout first-name-on-the-teamsheet kind of signing (though obviously I wouldn't turn it down.)
I feel like people are sleeping on our midfield a little bit. I think that they will obviously improve once they get a few games under their belt and that 3 from Dobson, Clare, Morgan and Gilbey have enough mobility, pace and technique to be a good unit. They at least matched Wednesday's midfield who were all playing in the Champ last year and included Barry '27k' Bannan. I think our current midfielders have enough to come out on top against most midfields in the league. I would add in a more 'creative' CM/AM for sure, but I don't think they need to be a standout first-name-on-the-teamsheet kind of signing (though obviously I wouldn't turn it down.)
They're fine defensively but I don't think they scare any opponents going forward.
I feel like people are sleeping on our midfield a little bit. I think that they will obviously improve once they get a few games under their belt and that 3 from Dobson, Clare, Morgan and Gilbey have enough mobility, pace and technique to be a good unit. They at least matched Wednesday's midfield who were all playing in the Champ last year and included Barry '27k' Bannan. I think our current midfielders have enough to come out on top against most midfields in the league. I would add in a more 'creative' CM/AM for sure, but I don't think they need to be a standout first-name-on-the-teamsheet kind of signing (though obviously I wouldn't turn it down.)
They're fine defensively but I don't think they scare any opponents going forward.
Well it's a good thing we're signing forwards then
I feel like people are sleeping on our midfield a little bit. I think that they will obviously improve once they get a few games under their belt and that 3 from Dobson, Clare, Morgan and Gilbey have enough mobility, pace and technique to be a good unit. They at least matched Wednesday's midfield who were all playing in the Champ last year and included Barry '27k' Bannan. I think our current midfielders have enough to come out on top against most midfields in the league. I would add in a more 'creative' CM/AM for sure, but I don't think they need to be a standout first-name-on-the-teamsheet kind of signing (though obviously I wouldn't turn it down.)
I tend to agree with this view. People are going to be down on Albie when he blazes 2 chances over the bar (and he has previous for it) - but will overlook one of the reasons we were clearly the better side in the second half against Wednesday was because our midfield started to dominate more.
To be honest I'm very excited about the next 10 games or so*. We've got a young, dynamic and attacking side so truly believe we will see some exciting games when things start to click.
*until we lose a few games in a row and I'm calling for Adkins head .
I feel like people are sleeping on our midfield a little bit. I think that they will obviously improve once they get a few games under their belt and that 3 from Dobson, Clare, Morgan and Gilbey have enough mobility, pace and technique to be a good unit. They at least matched Wednesday's midfield who were all playing in the Champ last year and included Barry '27k' Bannan. I think our current midfielders have enough to come out on top against most midfields in the league. I would add in a more 'creative' CM/AM for sure, but I don't think they need to be a standout first-name-on-the-teamsheet kind of signing (though obviously I wouldn't turn it down.)
They're fine defensively but I don't think they scare any opponents going forward.
Well it's a good thing we're signing forwards then
Need one of those midfield 3 to be someone capable of getting into the box and scoring. At the moment Morgan isn't the guy.
I feel like people are sleeping on our midfield a little bit. I think that they will obviously improve once they get a few games under their belt and that 3 from Dobson, Clare, Morgan and Gilbey have enough mobility, pace and technique to be a good unit. They at least matched Wednesday's midfield who were all playing in the Champ last year and included Barry '27k' Bannan. I think our current midfielders have enough to come out on top against most midfields in the league. I would add in a more 'creative' CM/AM for sure, but I don't think they need to be a standout first-name-on-the-teamsheet kind of signing (though obviously I wouldn't turn it down.)
They're fine defensively but I don't think they scare any opponents going forward.
If you play a 4-3-3 though I'm not sure you need any of the 3 to scare anyone offensively. Yes you need forward passing range and runs into the box but the key attacking players are the two wingers. I think we are missing a trick in the CAM position currently occupied by Morgan but the last thing we want there is a real out and out playmaker because then you've got 4 attacking players and you're asking Kirk or DJ to increase their defensive workload which is not what we want from them.
Dobson & Clare look fine, Morgan is improving all the time and (when healthy) Gilbey showed he's plenty good enough for this division after Adkins arrived We don't need anything in midfield as much as we need cover for LB, CB and GK If/when better quality players come available at costs that fit the overall budget, I'm sure CAFC's hat will be in the ring. Ideally these will be acquisitions but with 4 loan slots available permanent deals aren't imperative - they can sometimes evolve to permanent as we've seen with Famewo and Shinnie I'm confident the days of signing the dregs just as the window closes are behind us
Following this thread from the start has set me wondering where we would be with this summer's team rebuild if we had made it into the Championship at the close of last season.
If we do go up at the end of this season, will the finance be available for the bigger rebuild required for sustainable Championship football?
Would it be possible that being that bit closer to the promised land of the PL may lead to TS finding outside investors who may be more willing to take a punt on CAFC? Seems more likely to me.
Possibly, but as others have pointed out, TS does not yet own the two principal assets, The Valley and Sparrows Lane and as we have seen with previous attempts to secure these, acquiring either or both at a reasonable price may not be straightforward. The curse of Roland continues! I see any party willing to invest under this condition driving a hard bargain which might require TS to hand over a larger percentage of ownership than he would otherwise be happy with. Will be interesting to see how this pans out...
Dobson & Clare look fine, Morgan is improving all the time and (when healthy) Gilbey showed he's plenty good enough for this division after Adkins arrived We don't need anything in midfield as much as we need cover for LB, CB and GK If/when better quality players come available at costs that fit the overall budget, I'm sure CAFC's hat will be in the ring. Ideally these will be acquisitions but with 4 loan slots available permanent deals aren't imperative - they can sometimes evolve to permanent as we've seen with Famewo and Shinnie I'm confident the days of signing the dregs just as the window closes are behind us
I noticed there were no 2s or 3s in your player marks last weekend. Still selecting a target eh
I feel like people are sleeping on our midfield a little bit. I think that they will obviously improve once they get a few games under their belt and that 3 from Dobson, Clare, Morgan and Gilbey have enough mobility, pace and technique to be a good unit. They at least matched Wednesday's midfield who were all playing in the Champ last year and included Barry '27k' Bannan. I think our current midfielders have enough to come out on top against most midfields in the league. I would add in a more 'creative' CM/AM for sure, but I don't think they need to be a standout first-name-on-the-teamsheet kind of signing (though obviously I wouldn't turn it down.)
They're fine defensively but I don't think they scare any opponents going forward.
If you play a 4-3-3 though I'm not sure you need any of the 3 to scare anyone offensively. Yes you need forward passing range and runs into the box but the key attacking players are the two wingers. I think we are missing a trick in the CAM position currently occupied by Morgan but the last thing we want there is a real out and out playmaker because then you've got 4 attacking players and you're asking Kirk or DJ to increase their defensive workload which is not what we want from them.
So when we're attacking you've got the ball down the wing. Two players in the box marked by 3/4/5 people. Then the midfielders are going to be 25 yards from goal are they?
You need someone to be able to run in late unmarked, or hover around the edge of the box for any second balls.
If we're going to play 3 attacking players and 8 defensive ones, we're not going to create any chances.
Morgan and Clare are good at recycling the ball and finding the wingers, but beyond that they haven't offered anything going forward.
Comments
Was Ng (Cardiff) and Pickering (Blackburn) that moved in January - Wouldn't call it a golden generation either, Crewe are consistent bringing through youngsters that have moved on, e.g. Nick Powell to Man Utd, Luke Varney and Luke Murphy
If 50% of their side should be playing in championship or attracting championship interest I'd just have expected them to have done better.
Not meaning start an argument just a counter debate
The last time I posted about us asking about loans Clare signed within 48 hours...
If I know, or heard it, so do a lot of other people.
To be honest I'm very excited about the next 10 games or so*. We've got a young, dynamic and attacking side so truly believe we will see some exciting games when things start to click.
*until we lose a few games in a row and I'm calling for Adkins head
We don't need anything in midfield as much as we need cover for LB, CB and GK
If/when better quality players come available at costs that fit the overall budget, I'm sure CAFC's hat will be in the ring. Ideally these will be acquisitions but with 4 loan slots available permanent deals aren't imperative - they can sometimes evolve to permanent as we've seen with Famewo and Shinnie
I'm confident the days of signing the dregs just as the window closes are behind us
I see any party willing to invest under this condition driving a hard bargain which might require TS to hand over a larger percentage of ownership than he would otherwise be happy with.
Will be interesting to see how this pans out...
You need someone to be able to run in late unmarked, or hover around the edge of the box for any second balls.
If we're going to play 3 attacking players and 8 defensive ones, we're not going to create any chances.
Morgan and Clare are good at recycling the ball and finding the wingers, but beyond that they haven't offered anything going forward.