Rumours Rumours - Summer 2021 edition (Deadline Day from p814)
Comments
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I just wonder if we are going to have another season of Innis being in and out of the side if we need another senior RCB?Vfrf said:
Agree on Clayden, Elerewe for me looks like somebody who could step in now - just like how Joe Gomez looked at that age.MarcusH26 said:
Absolutely agree with this. Elewere and Clayden have looked like good prospects but probably for now should be around the squad for League Cup and Papa John's Trophy games .RedChaser said:RonnieMoore said:
Why bring Sims in just to calm fans when we have a young lad Charlie Clayden know which one I would rather have in our teamMarcusH26 said:I thought Cawley had ruled out Josh Sims? Decent enough player but not someone I remember us being linked with before.Okay I’ll bite 🙄. In the words of a famous tennis player ‘you cannot be serious’! I can’t recall Sims against us for Donny but he’s now 24, an England youth international with over 75 first team appearances for a few league clubs under his belt, over a third of those last season.
Clayden was plucked out of Orients disbanded youth team, aged 20 no league appearances, a late developer. Showed promise scoring in the first half Welling friendly who offered little competition. Not so good for the 2nd half against Dartford who offered a much sterner test. In fact I thought he should’ve mixed it up a bit rather than trying to be Roy of the Rovers. He’s got a lot to learn and a way to go if he is to get in the ‘team’ as you put it.
Sims could do a job now, Clayden is one for the future and slowly introduced to the squad IMHO.
We need players that can come in and start straight away whether that's Sims or any of the other wingers mentioned on this thread.
Of course it would be fantastic if Elewere can step in , be interesting to see him against Reading at the weekend.0 -
This is the opposite extreme of moaning that TS should be getting on with signings rather than singing.RonnieMoore said:
Why bring Sims in just to calm fans when we have a young lad Charlie Clayden know which one I would rather have in our teamMarcusH26 said:I thought Cawley had ruled out Josh Sims? Decent enough player but not someone I remember us being linked with before.
It’s a world where NA does something no other manager can, he takes decent prospects rather than proper signings and fires us to promotion.
No doubt Elewere and Roddy are defenders we need too, and Henry will become a regular in midfield alongside Morgan.0 -
Certainly having seen Elerewe a few times now and having (whisper it) Gunter as 5th choice if necessary, I don't think CB is as high a priority as wingers, CM, LB or CF, but would like another due to the injury risks. Would like to see him start the Papa Johns.MarcusH26 said:
I just wonder if we are going to have another season of Innis being in and out of the side if we need another senior RCB?Vfrf said:
Agree on Clayden, Elerewe for me looks like somebody who could step in now - just like how Joe Gomez looked at that age.MarcusH26 said:
Absolutely agree with this. Elewere and Clayden have looked like good prospects but probably for now should be around the squad for League Cup and Papa John's Trophy games .RedChaser said:RonnieMoore said:
Why bring Sims in just to calm fans when we have a young lad Charlie Clayden know which one I would rather have in our teamMarcusH26 said:I thought Cawley had ruled out Josh Sims? Decent enough player but not someone I remember us being linked with before.Okay I’ll bite 🙄. In the words of a famous tennis player ‘you cannot be serious’! I can’t recall Sims against us for Donny but he’s now 24, an England youth international with over 75 first team appearances for a few league clubs under his belt, over a third of those last season.
Clayden was plucked out of Orients disbanded youth team, aged 20 no league appearances, a late developer. Showed promise scoring in the first half Welling friendly who offered little competition. Not so good for the 2nd half against Dartford who offered a much sterner test. In fact I thought he should’ve mixed it up a bit rather than trying to be Roy of the Rovers. He’s got a lot to learn and a way to go if he is to get in the ‘team’ as you put it.
Sims could do a job now, Clayden is one for the future and slowly introduced to the squad IMHO.
We need players that can come in and start straight away whether that's Sims or any of the other wingers mentioned on this thread.
Of course it would be fantastic if Elewere can step in , be interesting to see him against Reading at the weekend.1 -
It's a big comparison to Gomez, he was in our U18s at 14 and nearly played in an fa youth Cup tie until it was pointed out he wasn't old enough. Everybody had heard of Gomez for years before he made his first team debut, the same with Parker and Defoe (I know he never did make his debut but).Vfrf said:
Agree on Clayden, Elerewe for me looks like somebody who could step in now - just like how Joe Gomez looked at that age.MarcusH26 said:
Absolutely agree with this. Elewere and Clayden have looked like good prospects but probably for now should be around the squad for League Cup and Papa John's Trophy games .RedChaser said:RonnieMoore said:
Why bring Sims in just to calm fans when we have a young lad Charlie Clayden know which one I would rather have in our teamMarcusH26 said:I thought Cawley had ruled out Josh Sims? Decent enough player but not someone I remember us being linked with before.Okay I’ll bite 🙄. In the words of a famous tennis player ‘you cannot be serious’! I can’t recall Sims against us for Donny but he’s now 24, an England youth international with over 75 first team appearances for a few league clubs under his belt, over a third of those last season.
Clayden was plucked out of Orients disbanded youth team, aged 20 no league appearances, a late developer. Showed promise scoring in the first half Welling friendly who offered little competition. Not so good for the 2nd half against Dartford who offered a much sterner test. In fact I thought he should’ve mixed it up a bit rather than trying to be Roy of the Rovers. He’s got a lot to learn and a way to go if he is to get in the ‘team’ as you put it.
Sims could do a job now, Clayden is one for the future and slowly introduced to the squad IMHO.
We need players that can come in and start straight away whether that's Sims or any of the other wingers mentioned on this thread.
I had never even heard of Elerewe before the Wigan game.
Very few players make an impact without playing any mens football. Especially at 17/18.2 -
We need another RCB either way. Elewere has potential but he's too young to gamble on, and especially if he's going to be in/out/doing the hokey-cokey depending on Innis' fitnessMarcusH26 said:
I just wonder if we are going to have another season of Innis being in and out of the side if we need another senior RCB?Vfrf said:
Agree on Clayden, Elerewe for me looks like somebody who could step in now - just like how Joe Gomez looked at that age.MarcusH26 said:
Absolutely agree with this. Elewere and Clayden have looked like good prospects but probably for now should be around the squad for League Cup and Papa John's Trophy games .RedChaser said:RonnieMoore said:
Why bring Sims in just to calm fans when we have a young lad Charlie Clayden know which one I would rather have in our teamMarcusH26 said:I thought Cawley had ruled out Josh Sims? Decent enough player but not someone I remember us being linked with before.Okay I’ll bite 🙄. In the words of a famous tennis player ‘you cannot be serious’! I can’t recall Sims against us for Donny but he’s now 24, an England youth international with over 75 first team appearances for a few league clubs under his belt, over a third of those last season.
Clayden was plucked out of Orients disbanded youth team, aged 20 no league appearances, a late developer. Showed promise scoring in the first half Welling friendly who offered little competition. Not so good for the 2nd half against Dartford who offered a much sterner test. In fact I thought he should’ve mixed it up a bit rather than trying to be Roy of the Rovers. He’s got a lot to learn and a way to go if he is to get in the ‘team’ as you put it.
Sims could do a job now, Clayden is one for the future and slowly introduced to the squad IMHO.
We need players that can come in and start straight away whether that's Sims or any of the other wingers mentioned on this thread.
Of course it would be fantastic if Elewere can step in , be interesting to see him against Reading at the weekend.4 -
It's a fair point but not coming through our setup from a young age doesn't take away his ability as we see it today. It depends on what the scouts and Nigel think of him I suppose. Knowing Nigel's preference for allowing young players to shine, he's certainly shining the brightest in pre-season.Cafc43v3r said:
It's a big comparison to Gomez, he was in our U18s at 14 and nearly played in an fa youth Cup tie until it was pointed out he wasn't old enough. Everybody had heard of Gomez for years before he made his first team debut, the same with Parker and Defoe (I know he never did make his debut but).Vfrf said:
Agree on Clayden, Elerewe for me looks like somebody who could step in now - just like how Joe Gomez looked at that age.MarcusH26 said:
Absolutely agree with this. Elewere and Clayden have looked like good prospects but probably for now should be around the squad for League Cup and Papa John's Trophy games .RedChaser said:RonnieMoore said:
Why bring Sims in just to calm fans when we have a young lad Charlie Clayden know which one I would rather have in our teamMarcusH26 said:I thought Cawley had ruled out Josh Sims? Decent enough player but not someone I remember us being linked with before.Okay I’ll bite 🙄. In the words of a famous tennis player ‘you cannot be serious’! I can’t recall Sims against us for Donny but he’s now 24, an England youth international with over 75 first team appearances for a few league clubs under his belt, over a third of those last season.
Clayden was plucked out of Orients disbanded youth team, aged 20 no league appearances, a late developer. Showed promise scoring in the first half Welling friendly who offered little competition. Not so good for the 2nd half against Dartford who offered a much sterner test. In fact I thought he should’ve mixed it up a bit rather than trying to be Roy of the Rovers. He’s got a lot to learn and a way to go if he is to get in the ‘team’ as you put it.
Sims could do a job now, Clayden is one for the future and slowly introduced to the squad IMHO.
We need players that can come in and start straight away whether that's Sims or any of the other wingers mentioned on this thread.
I had never even heard of Elerewe before the Wigan game.
Very few players make an impact without playing any mens football. Especially at 17/18.
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Yeah this where I'm at. Not a fan of us getting to a position where you're playing Gunter there because of injuries. Would rather we have 4 senior CBs and Barker/Elewere learning in the Papa John's/LC .thenewbie said:
We need another RCB either way. Elewere has potential but he's too young to gamble on, and especially if he's going to be in/out/doing the hokey-cokey depending on Innis' fitnessMarcusH26 said:
I just wonder if we are going to have another season of Innis being in and out of the side if we need another senior RCB?Vfrf said:
Agree on Clayden, Elerewe for me looks like somebody who could step in now - just like how Joe Gomez looked at that age.MarcusH26 said:
Absolutely agree with this. Elewere and Clayden have looked like good prospects but probably for now should be around the squad for League Cup and Papa John's Trophy games .RedChaser said:RonnieMoore said:
Why bring Sims in just to calm fans when we have a young lad Charlie Clayden know which one I would rather have in our teamMarcusH26 said:I thought Cawley had ruled out Josh Sims? Decent enough player but not someone I remember us being linked with before.Okay I’ll bite 🙄. In the words of a famous tennis player ‘you cannot be serious’! I can’t recall Sims against us for Donny but he’s now 24, an England youth international with over 75 first team appearances for a few league clubs under his belt, over a third of those last season.
Clayden was plucked out of Orients disbanded youth team, aged 20 no league appearances, a late developer. Showed promise scoring in the first half Welling friendly who offered little competition. Not so good for the 2nd half against Dartford who offered a much sterner test. In fact I thought he should’ve mixed it up a bit rather than trying to be Roy of the Rovers. He’s got a lot to learn and a way to go if he is to get in the ‘team’ as you put it.
Sims could do a job now, Clayden is one for the future and slowly introduced to the squad IMHO.
We need players that can come in and start straight away whether that's Sims or any of the other wingers mentioned on this thread.
Of course it would be fantastic if Elewere can step in , be interesting to see him against Reading at the weekend.
Winger and CM hopefully get sorted soon. Not quite sure what we do with Left Back , could be one we use a loan on.1 -
Balancing act with Elerewe. Deciding if we need to nail him down to a long contract (gamble) v allowing him to get out of contract and be advised by his agent not to sign another one with us. The latter seems to be the way of the world now. How can you tell if a player is a diamond or a shiny piece of glass at age 17.7
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Any rumours today? I see CAFC media team have started early talking about JFCs recovery so hopefully loads of content to share!
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Thing is, contracts mean naff all anyway. I don't think the cost would be particularly high for a 3 year pro deal. If you did that for 5 players every summer it would only take one to progress in the way you hope for it to be cost effective.ShootersHillGuru said:Balancing act with Elerewe. Deciding if we need to nail him down to a long contract (gamble) v allowing him to get out of contract and be advised by his agent not to sign another one with us. The latter seems to be the way of the world now. How can you tell if a player is a diamond or a shiny piece of glass at age 17.2 -
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Vfrf said:
It's a fair point but not coming through our setup from a young age doesn't take away his ability as we see it today. It depends on what the scouts and Nigel think of him I suppose. Knowing Nigel's preference for allowing young players to shine, he's certainly shining the brightest in pre-season.Cafc43v3r said:
It's a big comparison to Gomez, he was in our U18s at 14 and nearly played in an fa youth Cup tie until it was pointed out he wasn't old enough. Everybody had heard of Gomez for years before he made his first team debut, the same with Parker and Defoe (I know he never did make his debut but).Vfrf said:
Agree on Clayden, Elerewe for me looks like somebody who could step in now - just like how Joe Gomez looked at that age.MarcusH26 said:
Absolutely agree with this. Elewere and Clayden have looked like good prospects but probably for now should be around the squad for League Cup and Papa John's Trophy games .RedChaser said:RonnieMoore said:
Why bring Sims in just to calm fans when we have a young lad Charlie Clayden know which one I would rather have in our teamMarcusH26 said:I thought Cawley had ruled out Josh Sims? Decent enough player but not someone I remember us being linked with before.Okay I’ll bite 🙄. In the words of a famous tennis player ‘you cannot be serious’! I can’t recall Sims against us for Donny but he’s now 24, an England youth international with over 75 first team appearances for a few league clubs under his belt, over a third of those last season.
Clayden was plucked out of Orients disbanded youth team, aged 20 no league appearances, a late developer. Showed promise scoring in the first half Welling friendly who offered little competition. Not so good for the 2nd half against Dartford who offered a much sterner test. In fact I thought he should’ve mixed it up a bit rather than trying to be Roy of the Rovers. He’s got a lot to learn and a way to go if he is to get in the ‘team’ as you put it.
Sims could do a job now, Clayden is one for the future and slowly introduced to the squad IMHO.
We need players that can come in and start straight away whether that's Sims or any of the other wingers mentioned on this thread.
I had never even heard of Elerewe before the Wigan game.
Very few players make an impact without playing any mens football. Especially at 17/18.Agreed, he looks very comfortable on the ball .
However I’d like to see him up against an old war horse type centre forward to assess how he copes with the physicality of men’s league football. Hopefully he’ll be given that opportunity v Reading and or Palarse to continue his development.
One thing is for sure he couldn’t have a better mentor than Jason Pearce able to teach him the tricks of the trade.
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Agree with that mate, in my eyes he's still un-tested but looking at how he held off that Welling ST showed some good strength. It'd be a different challenge against Wyke/Piggott of course, under no illusions about that - I expect he'll get plenty of minutes against the Premier/Championship sides.RedChaser said:Vfrf said:
It's a fair point but not coming through our setup from a young age doesn't take away his ability as we see it today. It depends on what the scouts and Nigel think of him I suppose. Knowing Nigel's preference for allowing young players to shine, he's certainly shining the brightest in pre-season.Cafc43v3r said:
It's a big comparison to Gomez, he was in our U18s at 14 and nearly played in an fa youth Cup tie until it was pointed out he wasn't old enough. Everybody had heard of Gomez for years before he made his first team debut, the same with Parker and Defoe (I know he never did make his debut but).Vfrf said:
Agree on Clayden, Elerewe for me looks like somebody who could step in now - just like how Joe Gomez looked at that age.MarcusH26 said:
Absolutely agree with this. Elewere and Clayden have looked like good prospects but probably for now should be around the squad for League Cup and Papa John's Trophy games .RedChaser said:RonnieMoore said:
Why bring Sims in just to calm fans when we have a young lad Charlie Clayden know which one I would rather have in our teamMarcusH26 said:I thought Cawley had ruled out Josh Sims? Decent enough player but not someone I remember us being linked with before.Okay I’ll bite 🙄. In the words of a famous tennis player ‘you cannot be serious’! I can’t recall Sims against us for Donny but he’s now 24, an England youth international with over 75 first team appearances for a few league clubs under his belt, over a third of those last season.
Clayden was plucked out of Orients disbanded youth team, aged 20 no league appearances, a late developer. Showed promise scoring in the first half Welling friendly who offered little competition. Not so good for the 2nd half against Dartford who offered a much sterner test. In fact I thought he should’ve mixed it up a bit rather than trying to be Roy of the Rovers. He’s got a lot to learn and a way to go if he is to get in the ‘team’ as you put it.
Sims could do a job now, Clayden is one for the future and slowly introduced to the squad IMHO.
We need players that can come in and start straight away whether that's Sims or any of the other wingers mentioned on this thread.
I had never even heard of Elerewe before the Wigan game.
Very few players make an impact without playing any mens football. Especially at 17/18.Agreed, he looks very comfortable on the ball .
However I’d like to see him up against an old war horse type centre forward to assess how he copes with the physicality of men’s league football. Hopefully he’ll be given that opportunity v Reading and or Palarse to continue his development.
One thing is for sure he couldn’t have a better mentor than Jason Pearce able to teach him the tricks of the trade.
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One of the big things, for me, this season is how we use our u23 squad and the games. For a while now our u23 teams have been made up of average players in their late teens early 20s with the occasional diamond. We now have a massive array of 17 and 18 year olds, which we haven't had for a while. Probably since the Cousins/Poyet/Phillips group?Vfrf said:
Agree with that mate, in my eyes he's still un-tested but looking at how he held off that Welling ST showed some good strength. It'd be a difference challenge against Wyke/Piggott of course, under no illusions about that - I expect he'll get plenty of minutes against the Premier/Championship sides.RedChaser said:Vfrf said:
It's a fair point but not coming through our setup from a young age doesn't take away his ability as we see it today. It depends on what the scouts and Nigel think of him I suppose. Knowing Nigel's preference for allowing young players to shine, he's certainly shining the brightest in pre-season.Cafc43v3r said:
It's a big comparison to Gomez, he was in our U18s at 14 and nearly played in an fa youth Cup tie until it was pointed out he wasn't old enough. Everybody had heard of Gomez for years before he made his first team debut, the same with Parker and Defoe (I know he never did make his debut but).Vfrf said:
Agree on Clayden, Elerewe for me looks like somebody who could step in now - just like how Joe Gomez looked at that age.MarcusH26 said:
Absolutely agree with this. Elewere and Clayden have looked like good prospects but probably for now should be around the squad for League Cup and Papa John's Trophy games .RedChaser said:RonnieMoore said:
Why bring Sims in just to calm fans when we have a young lad Charlie Clayden know which one I would rather have in our teamMarcusH26 said:I thought Cawley had ruled out Josh Sims? Decent enough player but not someone I remember us being linked with before.Okay I’ll bite 🙄. In the words of a famous tennis player ‘you cannot be serious’! I can’t recall Sims against us for Donny but he’s now 24, an England youth international with over 75 first team appearances for a few league clubs under his belt, over a third of those last season.
Clayden was plucked out of Orients disbanded youth team, aged 20 no league appearances, a late developer. Showed promise scoring in the first half Welling friendly who offered little competition. Not so good for the 2nd half against Dartford who offered a much sterner test. In fact I thought he should’ve mixed it up a bit rather than trying to be Roy of the Rovers. He’s got a lot to learn and a way to go if he is to get in the ‘team’ as you put it.
Sims could do a job now, Clayden is one for the future and slowly introduced to the squad IMHO.
We need players that can come in and start straight away whether that's Sims or any of the other wingers mentioned on this thread.
I had never even heard of Elerewe before the Wigan game.
Very few players make an impact without playing any mens football. Especially at 17/18.Agreed, he looks very comfortable on the ball .
However I’d like to see him up against an old war horse type centre forward to assess how he copes with the physicality of men’s league football. Hopefully he’ll be given that opportunity v Reading and or Palarse to continue his development.
One thing is for sure he couldn’t have a better mentor than Jason Pearce able to teach him the tricks of the trade.
I would much rather see player like Deji and Henry play with players like Pearce and Watson and really focus on developing first team players than older ones who are unlikely to ever make it.
Is it only me that thinks Elerewe sounds like what Jonathan Ross would call him
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I think the next step for Deji will be a loan, even if an old fashioned 1-3 month period.4
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My apologies , I sometimes completely miss sarcasm in text form.addick1956 said:
I was being a tad sarcastic.MarcusH26 said:
The usual agent chaos! Sounds like there's quite a bit of that going around.addick1956 said:
Perhaps he has an agent !MarcusH26 said:I thought Cawley had ruled out Josh Sims? Decent enough player but not someone I remember us being linked with before.0 -
Agreed, he looks good and definitely COULD have first team potential yet but he's no Gomez. He's not there yet. Bring him on gradually has to be the safer, fairer option.Cafc43v3r said:
Has he even played for our u23s yet? That must be the next step, when it comes.mendonca said:I think the next step for Deji will be a loan, even if an old fashioned 1-3 month period.
I imagine he'll be one of the ones who gets to train with the senior squad and that will do him a lot of good to have the likes of Pearce showing him the ropes.1 -
Think people are getting carried away saying play Elerewer he’s far too young at the moment, look at Barker last year people called for him to be played regularly (after we were forced to play him) and I think the early exposure set him back a bit.5
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Definitely. U23's with the view to a 'work experience' loan in January.Cafc43v3r said:
Has he even played for our u23s yet? That must be the next step, when it comes.mendonca said:I think the next step for Deji will be a loan, even if an old fashioned 1-3 month period.
I think we need to utilise our relationship with Welling and Dartford a bit more. With Covid hitting these clubs are going to struggle to build competitive squads. Correct me if I'm wrong, but can't we just send them the odd player for a game or two. If they've got small squads it's got to be worth chucking them a player for a month if they have an injury or two.5 -
Bournesnr said:Think people are getting carried away saying play Elerewer he’s far too young at the moment, look at Barker last year people called for him to be played regularly (after we were forced to play him) and I think the early exposure set him back a bit.I wouldn't say carried away is the correct term, I've been watching football for 20+ years. I simply think he has the right toolkit and mentality to make the step up. Maybe he will and maybe he won't but he is a completely different kettle of fish to Barker. Barker looked ok, Elerewe looks fantastic.I'd only start giving him game time on a 3 year contract mind.4
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Dartford especially, was impressed with how they're playing these days.cafcfan1990 said:
Definitely. U23's with the view to a 'work experience' loan in January.Cafc43v3r said:
Has he even played for our u23s yet? That must be the next step, when it comes.mendonca said:I think the next step for Deji will be a loan, even if an old fashioned 1-3 month period.
I think we need to utilise our relationship with Welling and Dartford a bit more. With Covid hitting these clubs are going to struggle to build competitive squads. Correct me if I'm wrong, but can't we just send them the odd player for a game or two. If they've got small squads it's got to be worth chucking them a player for a month if they have an injury or two.
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“Work Experience Player” means a Player whose registration is held by a competition other than the Competition and is registered under a Scholarship. The Club taking the Player on work experience will register the Player Non Contract with a league in which they take part to fulfil the football element of the Scholarship, not the educational part."cafcfan1990 said:
Definitely. U23's with the view to a 'work experience' loan in January.Cafc43v3r said:
Has he even played for our u23s yet? That must be the next step, when it comes.mendonca said:I think the next step for Deji will be a loan, even if an old fashioned 1-3 month period.
I think we need to utilise our relationship with Welling and Dartford a bit more. With Covid hitting these clubs are going to struggle to build competitive squads. Correct me if I'm wrong, but can't we just send them the odd player for a game or two. If they've got small squads it's got to be worth chucking them a player for a month if they have an injury or two.
“Youth Loan” means a loan transfer for a period of no fewer than 28 days of a Player who is a qualifying Player within the terms of the Rules."
I believe if you use the work experience loan, which would apply to Deli, due to his age, he could still train with us and play in age related games but could play for a" mens team" on a Saturday.1 -
It is interesting how NA's desire to promote kids from within the Club will sit given LB's complete reluctance to do so. The former seems to be looking to the long term which may or may not stifle our automatic promotion chances whereas the latter was very reluctant to drop members of the older brigade - under LB our homegrown products started in total just 24 games last season whereas the likes of Gunter and Pratley started 58 games between them0
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I would just point out that apart from the last 3 and Konch, all the names mentioned played in an era when clubs did not operate with a large squad with 2 players for every position.addick1956 said:
Concerning players being too young.
These players were put in the first team as 16, 17 or 18 year old. One of them managed the team recently. Another made his debut for another team at 15 and was sold to Charlton for a then reputed record for a teenager for £17,500.
Eddie Firmani 18 1951
Stuart Leary 18 1951
Brian Kinsey 19 1957 I think
Keith Peacock 18 1964
Lenny Glover 19 1962
Alan Campbell 17 1965
Paul Elliot 18 1980 (his debut was a nightmare, but after that
Paul Walsh 18 1981
Paul Konchesky 17 1996
Graham Tutt 17 1974
Joe Gomez 17 2015
Ezrri Konsa 17 2016
Anfernee Djiksteel 18 2016
There are many others . The point is all these had good careers from an early age and didn't go I the team as a stop gap. Many were defenders. None were loaned out either before the debut and few were at all and many were sold for a handsome profit or stayed years at Charlton
The maxim was, ' If you are good enough, yo are old enough '.
If Nigel goes that way at Charlton he won't be the first at this club. Perhaps it is sensible .
Barker may have gone backwards because he thinks he should be a 1st team player now 🤔
In the case of Charlton, as the owner was reluctant to ever spend any money on players, it was often a case of needs must when chucking in a promising kid.0 -
To be fair to Bowyer once Doughty got injured he didn't really have much choice did he? Adkins didn't play Morgan either, until he was really left with no choice.Addick Addict said:It is interesting how NA's desire to promote kids from within the Club will sit given LB's complete reluctance to do so. The former seems to be looking to the long term which may or may not stifle our automatic promotion chances whereas the latter was very reluctant to drop members of the older brigade - under LB our homegrown products started in total just 24 games last season whereas the likes of Gunter and Pratley started 58 games between them
Bowyer had previously picked Konsa, Dijksteel, Aribo, Doughty etc when he had other options. He also started Morgan in both legs of the play off semis as a teenager.
You can't just play kids for the sake of it, especially when every season you either desperate for promotion or in a relegation scrap. As we have been every season for a long time now. The kids have got to be good enough and ready. Very few players, at any level, hold down a 1st team spot as a 17/18 year old. Parker didn't, Konch didn't, Aribo didn't, Konsa didn't.4 -
Good job we did not have the save attitude with players like Paul Walsh a d Robert Lee …RedChaser said:RonnieMoore said:
Why bring Sims in just to calm fans when we have a young lad Charlie Clayden know which one I would rather have in our teamMarcusH26 said:I thought Cawley had ruled out Josh Sims? Decent enough player but not someone I remember us being linked with before.Okay I’ll bite 🙄. In the words of a famous tennis player ‘you cannot be serious’! I can’t recall Sims against us for Donny but he’s now 24, an England youth international with over 75 first team appearances for a few league clubs under his belt, over a third of those last season.
Clayden was plucked out of Orients disbanded youth team, aged 20 no league appearances, a late developer. Showed promise scoring in the first half Welling friendly who offered little competition. Not so good for the 2nd half against Dartford who offered a much sterner test. In fact I thought he should’ve mixed it up a bit rather than trying to be Roy of the Rovers. He’s got a lot to learn and a way to go if he is to get in the ‘team’ as you put it.
Sims could do a job now, Clayden is one for the future and slowly introduced to the squad IMHO.
If we can’t blood young players in league one then we might as well close the academy and save millions of pounds each year7 -
It does seem incredulous that Tutt made his debut at 17 for us - Pope made one appearance for us before the age off 22 and Maynard-Brewer is the same age but yet to start a League game in a Charlton shirt.addick1956 said:
Concerning players being too young.
These players were put in the first team as 16, 17 or 18 year old. One of them managed the team recently. Another made his debut for another team at 15 and was sold to Charlton for a then reputed record for a teenager for £17,500.
Eddie Firmani 18 1951
Stuart Leary 18 1951
Brian Kinsey 19 1957 I think
Keith Peacock 18 1964
Lenny Glover 19 1962
Alan Campbell 17 1965
Paul Elliot 18 1980 (his debut was a nightmare, but after that
Paul Walsh 18 1981
Paul Konchesky 17 1996
Graham Tutt 17 1974
Joe Gomez 17 2015
Ezrri Konsa 17 2016
Anfernee Djiksteel 18 2016
There are many others . The point is all these had good careers from an early age and didn't go I the team as a stop gap. Many were defenders. None were loaned out either before the debut and few were at all and many were sold for a handsome profit or stayed years at Charlton
The maxim was, ' If you are good enough, yo are old enough '.
If Nigel goes that way at Charlton he won't be the first at this club. Perhaps it is sensible .
Barker may have gone backwards because he thinks he should be a 1st team player now 🤔
We're by no means unique in this respect because Managers are reluctant for keepers to learn from their mistakes in the first team - they would rather they did that on loan elsewhere. Ramsdale made his debut for Bournemouth in the PL a week before his 19th birthday but he'd already made 41 appearances at three other clubs by then. He is about the only top flight keeper to do so as a teenager that I can think of in recent times.2 -
I’m haven’t said we shouldn’t blood players have I? I called you out on a Sims v Clayden at this point in time and I seem to have got a fair bit of support for that opinion. A bit of friendly advice, when you are in a hole throw the shovel away 😉.RonnieMoore said:
Good job we did not have the save attitude with players like Paul Walsh a d Robert Lee …RedChaser said:RonnieMoore said:
Why bring Sims in just to calm fans when we have a young lad Charlie Clayden know which one I would rather have in our teamMarcusH26 said:I thought Cawley had ruled out Josh Sims? Decent enough player but not someone I remember us being linked with before.Okay I’ll bite 🙄. In the words of a famous tennis player ‘you cannot be serious’! I can’t recall Sims against us for Donny but he’s now 24, an England youth international with over 75 first team appearances for a few league clubs under his belt, over a third of those last season.
Clayden was plucked out of Orients disbanded youth team, aged 20 no league appearances, a late developer. Showed promise scoring in the first half Welling friendly who offered little competition. Not so good for the 2nd half against Dartford who offered a much sterner test. In fact I thought he should’ve mixed it up a bit rather than trying to be Roy of the Rovers. He’s got a lot to learn and a way to go if he is to get in the ‘team’ as you put it.
Sims could do a job now, Clayden is one for the future and slowly introduced to the squad IMHO.
If we can’t blood young players in league one then we might as well close the academy and save millions of pounds each year3 -
There is a difference between blooding youngsters and relying on them to perform conistently in professional football.RonnieMoore said:
Good job we did not have the save attitude with players like Paul Walsh a d Robert Lee …RedChaser said:RonnieMoore said:
Why bring Sims in just to calm fans when we have a young lad Charlie Clayden know which one I would rather have in our teamMarcusH26 said:I thought Cawley had ruled out Josh Sims? Decent enough player but not someone I remember us being linked with before.Okay I’ll bite 🙄. In the words of a famous tennis player ‘you cannot be serious’! I can’t recall Sims against us for Donny but he’s now 24, an England youth international with over 75 first team appearances for a few league clubs under his belt, over a third of those last season.
Clayden was plucked out of Orients disbanded youth team, aged 20 no league appearances, a late developer. Showed promise scoring in the first half Welling friendly who offered little competition. Not so good for the 2nd half against Dartford who offered a much sterner test. In fact I thought he should’ve mixed it up a bit rather than trying to be Roy of the Rovers. He’s got a lot to learn and a way to go if he is to get in the ‘team’ as you put it.
Sims could do a job now, Clayden is one for the future and slowly introduced to the squad IMHO.
If we can’t blood young players in league one then we might as well close the academy and save millions of pounds each year
We normally get it spot on, the odd appearance in the cups and during extreme injury/suspension period is fine. Having a 17 year old who has only ever played at u18's level being one of your 4 senior CBs when a couple of the others are injury prone is just incredibly naive.18 -
Your comparing someone who is already 20 and never played a league game, for anyone, with two England Internationals?RonnieMoore said:
Good job we did not have the save attitude with players like Paul Walsh a d Robert Lee …RedChaser said:RonnieMoore said:
Why bring Sims in just to calm fans when we have a young lad Charlie Clayden know which one I would rather have in our teamMarcusH26 said:I thought Cawley had ruled out Josh Sims? Decent enough player but not someone I remember us being linked with before.Okay I’ll bite 🙄. In the words of a famous tennis player ‘you cannot be serious’! I can’t recall Sims against us for Donny but he’s now 24, an England youth international with over 75 first team appearances for a few league clubs under his belt, over a third of those last season.
Clayden was plucked out of Orients disbanded youth team, aged 20 no league appearances, a late developer. Showed promise scoring in the first half Welling friendly who offered little competition. Not so good for the 2nd half against Dartford who offered a much sterner test. In fact I thought he should’ve mixed it up a bit rather than trying to be Roy of the Rovers. He’s got a lot to learn and a way to go if he is to get in the ‘team’ as you put it.
Sims could do a job now, Clayden is one for the future and slowly introduced to the squad IMHO.
If we can’t blood young players in league one then we might as well close the academy and save millions of pounds each year
We have now reached peek paradox where half the supporters want 10 signings and the other half don't want any and to give the 17 year olds a chance. In fact I think there have been some people arguing both points simultaneously.2
