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Charlton v Sheff U - Post Match Views

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    We were fucking awful, who would have thought one change would take us from the Bristol Rovers to this shower of shit? "

    Says @sam3110 who gave me dogs abuse for trying to manage expectations for the supporters who weren't at the Bristol game.

    There's a difference between good results, good performances and opponents.
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    We were fucking awful, who would have thought one change would take us from the Bristol Rovers to this shower of shit? "

    Says @sam3110 who gave me dogs abuse for trying to manage expectations for the supporters who weren't at the Bristol game.

    There's a difference between good results, good performances and opponents.

    You weren't "managing expectations" though, were you sugar?

    You claimed we scored 5 goals because they went down to 10 men, despite the fact it was already 3-0 at that point.

    You also said they should have been 3 goals up if it wasn't for Phillips, but again that's bullshit as not every shot on target is going to go in, we had shots that were saved too you know.

    We had built up a bit of momentum, we were playing well (remember all 3 teams were above us at the time of playing them) but we didn't play like we did on Tuesday, with full backs pushing up and Chicksen and Lookman providing width, pace and energy on both flanks, enabling Ulvestad and Crofts time and space to pick passes.

    The fact of the matter is bringing Jackson back in for Chicksen was a bad call, and not having that outlet meant we had far fewer options to choose from, which culminated in back passes to the keeper or hopeful punts to the strikers. Jackson spent so much time chasing the game, tucking into central midfield and exposing Fox, everyone could see it wasn't working, and as soon as Chicksen came on his energy made a difference on that side.

    Unfortunately for us, the lack of energy from the central midfield was still hampering us big time.

    Regardless of opposition, you need players to be able to keep up with the speed of play, which Jackson couldn't.

    We made the Blades look a lot better than they were, for all their possession they had less shots than Bristol and scored just the 1 goal.

    A more positive, attacking Charlton, the one we saw at Bristol, would have pushed Sheffield back a bit, stunted their game and forced them to rethink, but instead our midfield stood off (or huffed and puffed 10 yards behind) and invited pressure, playing right into their hands.

    We obviously don't agree on the Rovers match, but it was far from the weird, dumbfounding ordeal you painted it to be, where we somehow stumbled around, lucked into scoring 5 goals against all the odds
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    Firstly well played dill on Phillips any more displays like that and you ll be sold to a premier ship team as a 3rd choice but while you are here I ll enjoy seeing you play thought foley and central defence were solid. ..Fox. .I am sorry you are now an experienced footballer you shd do better...midfield over run lightweight slow and uncompetitive look man ok on the ball off the ball a real liability having said that he was fouled in the wall when they scored. ..he shd be up the field for defensive set pieces ..bI gave mac misfiring ajose not offering much but I'd blame the service from midfield. ..I love jacko but sorry skip it's time to drop down. ...must give credit to Kevin nug as the substitutions got us back in the game. ..enjoyed botakas run in the last minute he was like the kid in the playground who refuses to pass. ...Sheffield utd are a far better coached drilled team ...possibly something wilder alluded to in that interview maybe with Robinson and a couple of midfielders we could threaten promotion. ..back the team not the regime. ..very lucky to have got something from that game
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    edited November 2016
    What I saw in Utd was a well coached, drilled, physically strong, fit team but apart from Duffy they didn't have any flair at all. What they have, we can matchwith good coaching - what we have - If we play them and don't sell them they can't. There are positives there as well as a real challenge for Robinson. United put so much into the game physically, I was waiting for them to slow down. They did with about 2 or 3 minutes to go. We needed another 5 or 10 minutes.

    I love JJ to bits but his legs have gone. This is not a new happening. Facts have to be faced - he is too slow to the first couple of yards. By all means use him as a sub as he knows where teh goal is, but he can't be starting anymore!
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    Utd were far more organised than us and gave us little time on the ball - we kept losing possession and passing back to the keeper. We were outplayed yet Utd couldn't turn their pressure into goals.
    Didn't really deserve a draw but am not complaining.

    Phillips really impressed me - v confident young keeper. Felt sorry for him having to deal with constant backpasses.

    We need a better midfield and can't keep losing possession.
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    They got what they deserved after all that time wasting. Fleck in particular was the worst and even got a bit chummy with the ref towards the end. How he wasn't booked after trying to wipe out Botaka is baffling. We were awful at times and they were constantly putting us under pressure but always in it when only a goal down. If they had Magennis playing for them instead of that thick lump Clarke I think we would have been thrashed.
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    edited November 2016
    We needed an extra man up front to put them on the back foot, but then it exposes you defensively. I saw some defensive errors from them but we didn't have the pressure to benefit. The question is when to go for it. Nugent played Lookman for Crofts with 10 to go when he brought Botaka on, but I would have brought Botaka on for Fox and played Chicksen as a wing-back when Duffy went off! But Nugent's changes yeilded a goal.

    To be honest, they succesfully stifled us, but I didn't think they were that good. We are rubbish against strong limited hard working well organised teams and I'd put them firmly in that category- we need to address the reasons for this. In this league, most teams have limitations so they ought to get promotion - although a few poor results and injuries and teh doubts could flood in. They seem to have a decent manager!!!!
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    1StevieG said:

    “THIS COULD BE THE BIGGEST ROBBERY SINCE DICK TURPIN!”

    Nigel Adkins was beyond us: an intelligent man with consecutive promotions from Third to Prem. Instead, we have hired Karl Robinson, aged 36, a man who relegated MacDons below us last year and has a wife who acted in Brookside.


    Also won promotion to the Championship but don't let that fact get in the way of your cheap summary of someone who has yet to manage one game for us.
    Nigel Adkins was sacked after leading Sheffield United to 11th in L1 last season! After poor spells there and at Reading, his reputation isn't what it was anyway
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    HandG said:

    Looks like I was the only one who didn't think we were too bad! Sheff Utd looked a decent side and the better team for much of the game but, aside from the soft goal, I thought we defended really well and Phillips was only called into action a couple of times. Bringing on Novak and Botaka made a big difference and reckon another couple of minutes and we could have ncked another goal.

    We obviously have our deficiencies and hopefully our latest manager does something about that but, since Nugent took over, we are definitely a stronger unit and made sure we were in that game throughout and I personally didn't think the draw was completely undeserved.

    Also although I want Roland out and agree with everything CARD had done, I do think that the negativity about the running of the club does spill out too much to the team sometimes-they are making progress now and, whilst I appreciate we shouldn't in this league in the first place, I think the "support the team not the regime" mantra is definitely not one for all fans . Ajose has scored in his last two games yet there were still big cheers when was taken off, Fox has three assists in two games yet still came in for lots of stick for a bad cross etc etc.

    I think you will find that employees will know how badly a business is being run long before the customers.

    The jeering was from the pro-regime minority.
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    Tutt-Tutt said:

    Lookman is a young player, who developed outside of the Academy, who is still learning the game. He is naive at times, he makes the wrong decision at times and he tries to do too much at times. I hope he is getting the right coaching and information to enable him to work it out for himself.

    I also hope he gets and takes the right advice, because he isn't good enough to get into a Premier League first team yet.

    You'd like to think he will listen to and trust Robinson, seeing as Dele Alli came through at MK Dons
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    Don't agree that Lookman is petulant at all. Doesn't sulk or strop despite being kicked on and off the ball. Doesn't have a go at his pretty dire midfield colleagues despite their lack of ingenuity.
    Seems to me to be pretty levelheaded to be honest. I say enjoy his talent while we can as when he goes where will our pace, skill and threat come from?

    Agree with this. He needs a mentor but I increasingly like his attitude, he's no pushover and he was targeted cynically particularly by their number 4. Some of the best players are greedy when they're starting out. The ref offered him no protection but I wanted some of our older heads to make more fuss.
    Overall a pretty good game compared with a lot of dross we've seen at the Valley recently. We were clearly second best mostly caused by their high press and intensity of play mostly by their skilful midfield. I'd take their numbers 4, 15, 21 any day (even if 4 was a little sly git). We nicked it but apart from just after they scored we were never out of it. For once our subs were spot on in personnel and timing.
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    Rob said:

    I thought Dillon Phillips saved us. We could have been 2 or 3 down midway through the 2nd half but for him.

    Yes, he looked good and pulled off some great saves. But that's the job of the keeper. Only a poor one would have let those in.
    Actually, Bristol Rovers' keeper would probably have let all of them in!


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    sam3110 said:

    We were fucking awful, who would have thought one change would take us from the Bristol Rovers to this shower of shit? "

    Says @sam3110 who gave me dogs abuse for trying to manage expectations for the supporters who weren't at the Bristol game.

    There's a difference between good results, good performances and opponents.

    You weren't "managing expectations" though, were you sugar?

    You claimed we scored 5 goals because they went down to 10 men, despite the fact it was already 3-0 at that point.

    You also said they should have been 3 goals up if it wasn't for Phillips, but again that's bullshit as not every shot on target is going to go in, we had shots that were saved too you know.

    We had built up a bit of momentum, we were playing well (remember all 3 teams were above us at the time of playing them) but we didn't play like we did on Tuesday, with full backs pushing up and Chicksen and Lookman providing width, pace and energy on both flanks, enabling Ulvestad and Crofts time and space to pick passes.

    The fact of the matter is bringing Jackson back in for Chicksen was a bad call, and not having that outlet meant we had far fewer options to choose from, which culminated in back passes to the keeper or hopeful punts to the strikers. Jackson spent so much time chasing the game, tucking into central midfield and exposing Fox, everyone could see it wasn't working, and as soon as Chicksen came on his energy made a difference on that side.

    Unfortunately for us, the lack of energy from the central midfield was still hampering us big time.

    Regardless of opposition, you need players to be able to keep up with the speed of play, which Jackson couldn't.

    We made the Blades look a lot better than they were, for all their possession they had less shots than Bristol and scored just the 1 goal.

    A more positive, attacking Charlton, the one we saw at Bristol, would have pushed Sheffield back a bit, stunted their game and forced them to rethink, but instead our midfield stood off (or huffed and puffed 10 yards behind) and invited pressure, playing right into their hands.

    We obviously don't agree on the Rovers match, but it was far from the weird, dumbfounding ordeal you painted it to be, where we somehow stumbled around, lucked into scoring 5 goals against all the odds

    But I didn't call it an ordeal and I didn't say I didn't enjoy it did I treacle. Goals were individual pieces of skill, not luck. It was just luck the opportunities fell to them.

    Only an eeyore would have rubbished the idea of raising the contradictions in a game where our goalie and central defenders, exposed by a pedestrian midfield, were the stand out performances in a decisive win.
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    Phillips: point entirely thanks to his shot stopping 4 terrific saves 2 of which worldies - 7 or 8 of his teammates owe him big time for saving their bacon. Good job Dillon, really well done.
    Foley: probably his best game yet made good use of the tools he has, he's just not well equipped at this level
    Fox: alright going forward first half, defensively inadequate at all times
    Bauer: ok defensively, pathetic distribution
    Pearce: inadequate
    Lookman: talent not in doubt, doesn't appear to have learned much yet, half an eye on the exit door perhaps?
    Crofts: woefully inadequate, no redeeming aspects at all
    Ulvestad: never on the pace today, overrun, maybe because he was dreadfully short of competent colleagues in midfield
    Jackson: inexplicable selection, willing but not nearly physically able, time to be honest with yourself John
    Magennis: gives everything at all times, lacking much service or any support, the best outfield player bar none
    Ajose: appallingly lazy shameful display, owed a firm kick in the balls from all his colleagues
    Chicksen: hopelessly one-footed, willing, not blessed with talent but obviously the better selection than JJ
    Novak: fat, slow, dim, weak but better attitude than Ajose

    Botaka: an enigma, talented with the ball at his feet, but is he selfish and lazy or just really really dim? output always so much less than his apparent parts suggest - what is the opposite of synergy? entropy?
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    Botaka: an enigma, talented with the ball at his feet, but is he selfish and lazy or just really really dim? output always so much less than his apparent parts suggest - what is the opposite of synergy? entropy?

    I have called him a luxury player for League 1 in the past,
    but strange words on a day when after Duffy went off for United and Botaka came on for CAFC, at last we had someone who could run at their defense and show some silky skills. We have enough water carriers already. Without Holmes and Lookman double marked, Botaka did well in his cameo role.

    What did you think he did wrong yesterday ?

    Or like others, did you head for home early ?


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    cabbles said:

    Interesting comments by Wilder

    United scraped narrow wins against 9 men in their previous 2 matches, their midweek winner was in the 3rd minute of extra time. Coincidentally the same time as our equaliser today!
    Sour grapes. They didn't do enough to win. Plain and simple
    When you are playing away and the home team after scoring 5 goals in their last game only have 1 shot on target in 90 minutes (Josh's left foot shot from an acute angle in 2nd half) and the home keeper does 2 great saves to stop you being 3 nil up, i would say you can count yourself unlucky ?

    I think we mugged them !

    Our best 1-1 of the season.
    Plus an earlier Lookman shot which he directed at the keeper rather than smashing.
    And Magennis almost got on the end of a cross. Would have been a point blank header. But wasn't.
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    PeterGage said:

    sam3110 said:

    PeterGage said:

    Left after 85 mins (long drive home) and assumed we had lost. Didn't hear any roar whilst walking away from the ground to suggest we had equalised.


    Botaka 3

    Oh that explains it. How anyone can leave before the final whistle and marks players for the full game is beyond me
    Me thinks that seeing 85 mins of a 90 minute game is enough to give an opinion and mark players!
    If Botaka had played long enough to be marked, missing the last ten minutes would be a disaster for his score!
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    I thought we did ok yesterday. I think the 3-5-2 was always going to make our midfield look weak. Jackson takes a lot of stick but the problem is that with us being so weak in the middle and then haveing three in the centre Jackson was always going to come inside. 4-4-2.

    Very few teams get the 3-5-2 to work. United's three centre backs stayed deep and the other seven moved up and down the pitch together we we were overrun the whole game.

    Despite having few shots on goal I thought we looked quite dangerous on the ball in the first half. Their only goal came from a very clever free kick and we kept them out for the rest of the game.

    Sure, the equaliser came late but let's not kid ourselves, United didn't sit deep they attached for the whole game and only scored one goal from a neat trick.

    Following on from two comfortable wins I think this was a solid performance and a good result against a team that is most likely to finish top two and much higher than we are.

    I didn't see the Port Vale or Bristol Rovers game but I came away from this one feeling more positive than I have this season. Promotion looks a real possibility to me now.

    Easy to make 3-5-2 work against a team with no pace out wide. Playing Jackson on the left (who did manage one really good 1st half cross) against them, played nicely into their hands.
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    edited November 2016
    Dillon Phillips .. yesterday he slammed a clearance straight into a Blades player and luckily the ball rebounded well wide of his goal ..
    I recall Sasa Ilic doing something similar early in his Charlton career ..
    IF we are as successful with Dillon as we were with Sasa, that'll do for me ..
    BUT .. who nowadays believes in history repeating itself or in good omens ?
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    “THIS COULD BE THE BIGGEST ROBBERY SINCE DICK TURPIN!”

    Nigel Adkins was beyond us: an intelligent man with consecutive promotions from Third to Prem. Instead, we have hired Karl Robinson, aged 36, a man who relegated MacDons below us last year and has a wife who acted in Brookside.

    Not that someone's spouse should even come into the discussions, but I really couldn't care less if she had acted in world-record number of porn films and was a fan of Donald Trump if her husband was a good football manager who could turn this mess around.
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    Who are these players that we paid big money that Wilder is talking about?

    Have it on reliable authority that Charlton paid far more than necessary (compared to offers from other L1 clubs chasing him) in wages to get Novak.
    I wonder who was in charge of the negotiations with that transfer........
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    Simonsen said:

    I thought we did ok yesterday. I think the 3-5-2 was always going to make our midfield look weak. Jackson takes a lot of stick but the problem is that with us being so weak in the middle and then haveing three in the centre Jackson was always going to come inside. 4-4-2.

    Very few teams get the 3-5-2 to work. United's three centre backs stayed deep and the other seven moved up and down the pitch together we we were overrun the whole game.

    Despite having few shots on goal I thought we looked quite dangerous on the ball in the first half. Their only goal came from a very clever free kick and we kept them out for the rest of the game.

    Sure, the equaliser came late but let's not kid ourselves, United didn't sit deep they attached for the whole game and only scored one goal from a neat trick.

    Following on from two comfortable wins I think this was a solid performance and a good result against a team that is most likely to finish top two and much higher than we are.

    I didn't see the Port Vale or Bristol Rovers game but I came away from this one feeling more positive than I have this season. Promotion looks a real possibility to me now.

    Easy to make 3-5-2 work against a team with no pace out wide. Playing Jackson on the left (who did manage one really good 1st half cross) against them, played nicely into their hands.
    I sit looking down that side. They overloaded on Fox throughout the first half and with Duffy pulling wide from his free role in the 3-4-1-2, they opened us up on 4 or 5 occasions in that corner, but failed to capitalise, which Wilder was alluding to in his post match interval.
    I was also amazed how many thought Foley had a good game last week. Jerome Thomas turned him inside out in the opening 15 minutes, before fading. Foley's lack of pace was exposed yesterday as well.
    The first time I've seen Chicksen. He's quick and got about the pitch with plenty of energy. Unfortunately he butchered a good crossing opportunity on a counter-attack down the right, when he dithered trying to switch the ball onto his left foot. But he looks promising.

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    edited November 2016
    Simonsen said:

    I thought we did ok yesterday. I think the 3-5-2 was always going to make our midfield look weak. Jackson takes a lot of stick but the problem is that with us being so weak in the middle and then haveing three in the centre Jackson was always going to come inside. 4-4-2.

    Very few teams get the 3-5-2 to work. United's three centre backs stayed deep and the other seven moved up and down the pitch together we we were overrun the whole game.

    Despite having few shots on goal I thought we looked quite dangerous on the ball in the first half. Their only goal came from a very clever free kick and we kept them out for the rest of the game.

    Sure, the equaliser came late but let's not kid ourselves, United didn't sit deep they attached for the whole game and only scored one goal from a neat trick.

    Following on from two comfortable wins I think this was a solid performance and a good result against a team that is most likely to finish top two and much higher than we are.

    I didn't see the Port Vale or Bristol Rovers game but I came away from this one feeling more positive than I have this season. Promotion looks a real possibility to me now.

    Easy to make 3-5-2 work against a team with no pace out wide. Playing Jackson on the left (who did manage one really good 1st half cross) against them, played nicely into their hands.
    Exactly. Negate 3-5-2 by FBs advancing into midfield but Fox and Foley don't have that in their DNA. Three questions.
    Is wing backs the Blades normal line up?
    If yes did we scout them?
    Do we actually scout opponents? Because I am sure in recent history we didn't (at a competent level) do this because we simply didn't have anyone on our payroll, not involved with day to day, that had the c.v. to do it. Who has that role currently?
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    Nigel Adkins was beyond us: an intelligent man with consecutive promotions from Third to Prem. Instead, we have hired Karl Robinson, aged 36, a man who relegated MacDons below us last year and has a wife who acted in Brookside.

    Wtf has his wife got to do with anything?
    Well she's no Mrs Guy Luzon.

    We weren't great yesterday but Sheffield United are probably the best team we've played this season and most teams will struggle to get a point from them so we can be happy with that. I was at Bristol Rovers and (silly as this sounds) we were good but not amazing. Duffy was excellent for them, if he plays like that every week then he'll be playing at a higher level next year one way or another.

    Would really like to see Botaka start a match, I'm sure Robinson will have been impressed with his cameo. The cup game would be a great chance for that providing he's allowed to feature in FA Cup matches.
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    edited November 2016
    I think the fact we got something out of the game, will give us some confidence. Robinson will probably be trying to find out why Botaka didn't start or hasn't featured much for us as he looked unplayable when he came on. Similar to Fleetwood. The problem for me is that it is unreasonable to expect him to be unplayable every game, especially in 20 minutes at most slots, but surely he has earned more time on the pitch than he has been given. If Robinson gives him a chance, that would be a big tick in my book.
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    I think the next two games will show us the mettle of Robbo. Playing JJ, Crofts and multiple CBs on the bench or Botaka, Chicksen, Tex and Ba. His own man (where he asesses loanee recalls in January) or a regime apologist.
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