The fact is on today's performance we wouldn't even compete in league 4.WE have a non league squad.
The point is, its not a non-league squad, far from it. Rudd, Fox, Bauer, Pearce, Holmes, Lookman, Ulvestad, Novak and Magennis would get into most if not all league one starting XIs.
That says all you need to know about Slade.
He has had a pre-season and 12 league games and he still has no pattern of play, alternative game plan neither does he know his best team. Its bollocks to be honest.
We've got a decent squad. Rudd, Bauer, Teixeira, Kashi, Foley, Crofts, Ulvestad, Jackson, Magennis have all played at the highest level. Solly, Fox, Lennon, Pearce, Holmes, Novak, Lookman, Ajose have all looked good at Championship level.
The one heartening thing about this thread, and others, is that people have identified Slade as the main problem.
My first game for 2 years due to knee ops. Supporter of 40 yrs But still great to be at the valley. Its sad to see our supporters booing the team before half time. The players are doing their best the regime is the problem! In my view Holmes was the only positive and I couldn't understand why he was substituted Can't see us being top 6 on this performance
2) our international break means that at least it wont be Millwall sending into the bottom 4 come 5pm next Saturday
3) millwall below us for at least 2 weeks
Didn't realise until reading on here that the only home league game I've missed this season (Shrewsbury) we won & so I've yet to see a win this season.
I will still keep going to games......morbid fascination I suppose. Want to see how bad it can get. Slade is clueless & inept. Too many things wrong with team selection & set up to mention
How would he do that without having full control of incoming players?
Like Slade hasn't chosen these players??
He doesn't have full control no. In the press conference after his appointment, The question was asked whether RS had control over signings. KM replied that the network scouts identified players who they then took to RS who had final say on whether the club went after them. That's completely different to the manager having full control and actually choosing players. I'm sure at times RS may have said he wanted this player or that , but the clubs official and public policy is that the scouting network identify players, not RS.
You may know something I don't, but surely he identified Crofts and Foley (about whom he got pushback), as well as Louis Thompson who we spent six weeks begging Norwich for.
I'm sorry but if you're the manager and you have final say over transfers you're to blame for a failed transfer policy. Heavy is the head that wears the crown. And besides, what has indicated from any of our performance this season that Slade would do better with better players? It's not his transfer signings that are the biggest problem, it's his coaching.
For all the talk at East Kent Addicks this week, explaining analytics, consolidated scouting reports on the opposition, with a PowerPoint presentation, Brussell managed to pick the wrong system, with the wrong tactics, as well as the wrong team selection. Then made the wrong substitution late on. A lower league manager making lower league mistakes.
Don't let Slade tell you it was 4-3-3. We had two central midfielders in Crofts & Ulvestad, with Holmes on the right, Lookman on the left, Jacko in the no.10 role, behind the lone CF Maginnis. 4-4-1-1 to 4-2-3-1. Rochdale were in a straightforward 4-4-2. Why not match up with them and allow our superior individuals beat their individuals in one-against-one contests across the pitch? If Rochdale caught him out by playing 4-4-2, then why not change it after twenty minutes, when it was clear to everyone in the ground that the system wasn't working? I got the impression that Nugent was agitated by the way it was going midway through the first half. However, Brussell's in-decision was final.
Jacko hasn't got the legs to play the no.10 role. What a strange selection? Was it to play him in a role that allowed him the luxury of not having to run back? There was nothing positive from that selection, Jacko wasn't involved in the game, he failed to get forward in support of the lone CF and was too slow in closing down the opposition Back Four, who continuously got out of the defensive third into midfield. He spent the first half chasing shadows. When he was finally switched with Lookman, we caused them problems. Prior to that, we were awful. We then had the Holmes substitution, which was unbelievable.
Thank Christ for Lookman. He is a joy to watch and improving with every game. He would suit a Championship promotion chasing club, rather than stepping up to the Premier League. Gradual progression would be of more benefit to him than a big jump. Norwich would be a good fit. He also needs to be on the edge of the box at corners, not taking them. He has the quick feet and the shot to be able to score from those positions if a corner is half-cleared.
It absolutely blows my mind that we can start with 3-5 players in midfield and still not dominate a match. I imagine that yes, a no.10 role for Jacko was to alleviate running, but it's not something he's suited to, especially when he's having to work when not in possession or try to read flick-ons/knock-downs. In a more controlled game where he can ghost into the box, maybe.
The problem with matching them with 4-4-2 is we've shown that we get overrun in that system, particularly with Slade's one winger one Jackson on the left policy. All our attacks go down the right and by the sounds of things we're utterly predictable.
I think sometimes (and I'm as guilty as anyone of this) we get bogged down in formations instead of styles and patterns of play. As Jonathan Wilson says, formations are just numbers, it's what you do with them. For me a 4-3-3 should suit the strengths and cover the weaknesses of a lot of our players. But if the opposition press us and we have no other ideas but to hoof it long, and if we end up reverting to a 4-1-4-1 at home against Rochdale because we don't know how to keep the ball, that's not so much the formation as the lack of a way of playing. We can talk about playing one forward but if executed well we should have had three forwards and/or a forward with a line of attacking three just behind him. Clearly that didn't happen...again. That's not formations, that's coaching.
2nd game of season for me and 1st for my 4 boys Highlights of the day were driving down the A12 singing "who are ya " at the taxpayers stadium and then as we left Frankie & Benny's in Charlton my 4 year old was pointing at two young boys and a father ,waiting to be seated , in West Ham tops and booooooing at them
Good to see the posh little Essex boy has some Sarf London herbert genes in him
It wasn't until the first "We want Roland out " chant in the 42nd minute did I then realise that we were gonna lose because of those damn protesting fans putting the players off . It seems Lincs, Purdis and co were right after all
0 % Top two ......... 12% 3rd-6th ......... 48% 7th-12th ......... 37.5% 13th-20th ........ 2.5% relegation
For all the talk at East Kent Addicks this week, explaining analytics, consolidated scouting reports on the opposition, with a PowerPoint presentation, Brussell managed to pick the wrong system, with the wrong tactics, as well as the wrong team selection. Then made the wrong substitution late on. A lower league manager making lower league mistakes.
Don't let Slade tell you it was 4-3-3. We had two central midfielders in Crofts & Ulvestad, with Holmes on the right, Lookman on the left, Jacko in the no.10 role, behind the lone CF Maginnis. 4-4-1-1 to 4-2-3-1. Rochdale were in a straightforward 4-4-2. Why not match up with them and allow our superior individuals beat their individuals in one-against-one contests across the pitch? If Rochdale caught him out by playing 4-4-2, then why not change it after twenty minutes, when it was clear to everyone in the ground that the system wasn't working? I got the impression that Nugent was agitated by the way it was going midway through the first half. However, Brussell's in-decision was final.
Jacko hasn't got the legs to play the no.10 role. What a strange selection? Was it to play him in a role that allowed him the luxury of not having to run back? There was nothing positive from that selection, Jacko wasn't involved in the game, he failed to get forward in support of the lone CF and was too slow in closing down the opposition Back Four, who continuously got out of the defensive third into midfield. He spent the first half chasing shadows. When he was finally switched with Lookman, we caused them problems. Prior to that, we were awful. We then had the Holmes substitution, which was unbelievable.
Thank Christ for Lookman. He is a joy to watch and improving with every game. He would suit a Championship promotion chasing club, rather than stepping up to the Premier League. Gradual progression would be of more benefit to him than a big jump. Norwich would be a good fit. He also needs to be on the edge of the box at corners, not taking them. He has the quick feet and the shot to be able to score from those positions if a corner is half-cleared.
It absolutely blows my mind that we can start with 3-5 players in midfield and still not dominate a match. I imagine that yes, a no.10 role for Jacko was to alleviate running, but it's not something he's suited to, especially when he's having to work when not in possession or try to read flick-ons/knock-downs. In a more controlled game where he can ghost into the box, maybe.
The problem with matching them with 4-4-2 is we've shown that we get overrun in that system, particularly with Slade's one winger one Jackson on the left policy. All our attacks go down the right and by the sounds of things we're utterly predictable.
I think sometimes (and I'm as guilty as anyone of this) we get bogged down in formations instead of styles and patterns of play. As Jonathan Wilson says, formations are just numbers, it's what you do with them. For me a 4-3-3 should suit the strengths and cover the weaknesses of a lot of our players. But if the opposition press us and we have no other ideas but to hoof it long, and if we end up reverting to a 4-1-4-1 at home against Rochdale because we don't know how to keep the ball, that's not so much the formation as the lack of a way of playing. We can talk about playing one forward but if executed well we should have had three forwards and/or a forward with a line of attacking three just behind him. Clearly that didn't happen...again. That's not formations, that's coaching.
Agree about formations and their over inflated relevance.
To me it's about shape, about the ability to press in numbers and recovery of the ball when losing possession.
If we move the ball quickly then a 4-5-1 can work because two wide players push up naturally into a 4-3-3.
The problem with playing a straight three up front is when you play too much long ball and it comes straight back, like the last 10 minutes yesterday which was like a training drill for the Rochdale defence to practice defending long ball, you effectively lose the defensive role of two players as they are too high up to recover and defend which they would be able to do in a 4-3-3.
Regarding Jacko. I think Slade must read this forum because a number of fairly knowledgable individuals have suggested on here that is the only role for him these days - as a number ten/playing behind a from two and I could see that but even that didn't work for reasons already highlighted on here. At least Ajose tried to run the channels a bit.
Yesterday's 4-2-3-1 formation fell apart because the Crofts and Ulvestad spent much of their time standing between our centre-backs, forming what, at times looked like a back 6. With Jackson trying (failing) to pick up Magennis' knock-downs, it left a great big grassy space where our midfield should have been.
@ElfsborgAddick, I agree that fans generally are far too quick to call for change (except in the case of RD/KM), and I'm not shouting for Slades head yet. But he is one who seems to be unable to learn from his mistakes, which is my point. All very well chucking him out, but as others have said, who the bloody hell would contemplate working with this owner and his circus of incompetents?
I'd give him the season unless there's regime change in the meantime. But he needs to sort out the failings that are clear to many on this board, and quickly. Agreed, we need to give him a season, hopefully the January transfer window will help turn things around.
Unfortunately I think he could be gone before that if we stay bottom six. If that is the case, I reckon they'll get desperate and give it to Jackson(no disrespect to him with this comment)
Impossible to second guess anything the regime might do - they are not constrained by logic or common sense. Perhaps they'll have another meeting to ask key players if Russ is the right man...
Slades game setup is terrible and it has been the same every game. Can't he see that it just isn't working? Time to wake up Slade, own up to your own abject failure so far and start making proper use of the players at your disposal
And stop publicly blaming players cos that's counter productive and cuntish
All good enough at this level ---- where are the midfield players ? We have no one who can hold the ball, break up play, pass the ball forward, create play.
One up front and NO ONE to knock the ball down to. Huge huge hole down the middle that the oppo can just walk straight through.
If the guy from Burnely is a box to box player the it's the 6 yard box to the 18 yard box !!
5 mins after Ajose came on he is back on the half way line trying to get the ball FFS !!!
Jacksons legs have gone but so has his confidence, he can't even pass the ball at the moment.
Unless we can compete in the midfield we will go down ----- 4th level for the first time
seriously, whoever amongst you lot was calling for Curbishley's head back in 2006 because he "couldn't take you to the next level" should be taking a long, hard look at yourselves. Because I remember loads of you calling in to 606 and shaking my head at the folly of it all. And then taking Dowie
Are you on a wind-up? Half a dozen gobby wankers calling in to radio phone-in does not equate with a whole fan base. It saddens me that this myth is widely believed in the media and has become received wisdom. The vast silent majority at the Valley were fully aware of the scale of Curbs achievement in punching substantially above our weight
This is is unlikely to be our worst ever performance, probably not even in the top 10 (I saw 6-0 at Hull last season which has to be worse), but one thing is clear, there is no let up in the decline. Even a point now seems like a continuation of the painful demise. There is no treading water any longer it is just crap, week after week. It is getting to the point where people are not staying away in protest, they just don't want to come anymore. It saddens me that a team I love is being allowed to enter freefall by one person. Ultimately it is not a team of inept players, or an incompetent manager, or even poor quality CEO that is causing this situation, it is Roland. The buck can only be passed to him because he owns Charlton from top to bottom. If anyone can change things it is him and him only. He has the power to appoint quality personnel but is choosing otherwise which is not acceptable.
If this was a marriage, it would be considered neglect or emotional abuse. Sadly in a marriage the abused party can eventually choose to leave, but with Charlton, no matter how shitty he/she appears to behave, we can't leave. Maybe we can withold 'benefits' for a period but we'll be back. Saddened in Sheffield.
For all the talk at East Kent Addicks this week, explaining analytics, consolidated scouting reports on the opposition, with a PowerPoint presentation, Brussell managed to pick the wrong system, with the wrong tactics, as well as the wrong team selection. Then made the wrong substitution late on. A lower league manager making lower league mistakes.
Don't let Slade tell you it was 4-3-3. We had two central midfielders in Crofts & Ulvestad, with Holmes on the right, Lookman on the left, Jacko in the no.10 role, behind the lone CF Maginnis. 4-4-1-1 to 4-2-3-1. Rochdale were in a straightforward 4-4-2. Why not match up with them and allow our superior individuals beat their individuals in one-against-one contests across the pitch? If Rochdale caught him out by playing 4-4-2, then why not change it after twenty minutes, when it was clear to everyone in the ground that the system wasn't working? I got the impression that Nugent was agitated by the way it was going midway through the first half. However, Brussell's in-decision was final.
Jacko hasn't got the legs to play the no.10 role. What a strange selection? Was it to play him in a role that allowed him the luxury of not having to run back? There was nothing positive from that selection, Jacko wasn't involved in the game, he failed to get forward in support of the lone CF and was too slow in closing down the opposition Back Four, who continuously got out of the defensive third into midfield. He spent the first half chasing shadows. When he was finally switched with Lookman, we caused them problems. Prior to that, we were awful. We then had the Holmes substitution, which was unbelievable.
Thank Christ for Lookman. He is a joy to watch and improving with every game. He would suit a Championship promotion chasing club, rather than stepping up to the Premier League. Gradual progression would be of more benefit to him than a big jump. Norwich would be a good fit. He also needs to be on the edge of the box at corners, not taking them. He has the quick feet and the shot to be able to score from those positions if a corner is half-cleared.
I think sometimes (and I'm as guilty as anyone of this) we get bogged down in formations instead of styles and patterns of play. As Jonathan Wilson says, formations are just numbers, it's what you do with them. For me a 4-3-3 should suit the strengths and cover the weaknesses of a lot of our players. But if the opposition press us and we have no other ideas but to hoof it long, and if we end up reverting to a 4-1-4-1 at home against Rochdale because we don't know how to keep the ball, that's not so much the formation as the lack of a way of playing. We can talk about playing one forward but if executed well we should have had three forwards and/or a forward with a line of attacking three just behind him. Clearly that didn't happen...again. That's not formations, that's coaching.
Winning football matches is about have good players, then it is about what formation,you use. You scout the opposition and use that information to make sure you pick the right team and put the individuals in the right positions that suit your strengths.
The only teams capable of playing 4-3-3 properly are the likes of Barcelona & Real Madrid, with Neymar-Suarez-Messi backed up by Rakitic-Busquets-Iniesta, or Ronaldo-Benezema- Bale backed up by Modric-Kroos-Isco. powerful forwards backed up by a strong midfield. Man City were 4-1-4-1 at Celtic, Celtic 4-2-3-1, AC Milan 4-1-4-1 to 4-1-2-3, Fiorentina 4-2-3-1, West Ham 4-2-3-1, Southampton 4-4-2 Diamond, Arsenal 4-2-3-1, Chelsea 4-2-3-1, Man Utd 4-2-3-1, Leicester 4-1-4-1, Benfica 4-4-2 to 4-2-4, AS Roma 4-2-3-1, Tottenham 4-2-3-1, C.Palace 4-2-3-1, Stoke 4-2-3-1, Watford 5-3-2 to 3-5-2, Feyenoord 4-2-3-1, AS Monaco 4-4-2 to 4-2-4, Paris SG 4-2-3-1, Everton 4-2-3-1, to list a few from matches in September. The only instances of teams playing close to 4-3-3,apart from the big two, are Napoli 4-1-2-3 and Holland 4-1-4-1 to 4-1-2-3. You will notice that some top coaches at these clubs haven't decided they are good enough to play 4-3-3.
4-3-3 means you have three up front, who stay there and don't work back, which is a big luxury. Don't forget we are talking about League One players here, who have weaknesses in their games. Lookman apart who is obviously on the move upwards, the others have flaws in their games. If they didn't have flaws, they'd be earning more money at a higher level. You can't just throw a system at League One players and expect them to adapt, they don't have the tools to do so. Keep it simple, if the opposition are 4-4-2, why try something complicated?
If it wasn't about formations and setting up your team in the best way to win a game, we'd all still be playing 2-3-5. England won the World Cup in 66 with a change of system, the wingless wonders, Hungary came to Wembley in 1953 with 4-2-4 against England's 2-3-5, and battered us 6-3, in a game that changed football. Saying it isn't about the system is a good excuse to deflect the blame away from the manager to the players, particularly after a poor performance like yesterday. Jacko was so ineffective in the no.10 role yesterday, we were effectively 10 v 11. You can't just change a system without working on it and making sure there is a pattern of play that goes with it. There was three days between the last fixture and this one, no chance.
Jonathon Wilson has no experience of playing, managing, coaching or scouting in the professional game. He wrote a good book, all based on what has gone before. It was all out there, he just pulled it together. The job of the professional manager/coach is to get it right before the game and during the game. Sean Dyche killed him on 5Live recently when he was putting forward a few theories with "what experience do you have in the game". In other words, if you haven't been in a dressing room, you are guessing.
In the last two seasons the wheels seemed to come off about the time of the second international break, this year it's started early. We seem to have got into that spiral of decline where you see the confidence draining out week by week. Also, you suspect the word is out that if you keep Holmes quiet, unless Lookman is on you can pretty well stop Charlton their tracks. Witness the kicking Holmes got off of Bolton.
Most of the criticism is being aimed at Slade and the midfield, but I worry that we are limited upfront as well. McGennis looks OK but Novak and Ajose don't look like much of a threat. For all the talk about service, the front men have to make the runs and make themselves available. The team overall seems static, shapeless and slow to me. Botaka is a bit of an unknown quality, he does seem to have a bit of pace but Slade seems terrified of taking a chance on him. I don't think the squad is as good as a lot of people think, but Slade isn't helping with his approach. Things need to improve and pronto.
That was painful and embarrassing to say the very least. What really gets me is that we have some decent players, I can't believe that there is many better and more gifted players than Lookman in this league, Ricky Holmes is a livewire and best of all he doesn't hide so why are we so crap?
To me it's the system Slade is playing that is causing the problem. Clearly Jackson should not be starting he hardly made one tackle yesterday and was anonymous all through the game I would play Botaka to add some pace and support the forwards, play Lookman as the number 10 type player and have Croft and Ulvestad in the middle with Holmes the other wide player. Get the ball to feet as Maggennis can hold up or run with the ball hopefully that creates more chances. With Magennis up front on his own there is only a hoof from the back to set an attack going and in League 1 that doesn't work.
At the back we look shaky, Fox had another one of his days, missing the tackle that let to the goal and Foley just isn't Solly. Bauer had a decent game I would like to see him paired with Tex. As for Ajose? the new Reza, runs around a lot nobody knows what he is going to do and complains, waste of money.
If Russell Slade really believes we are top 6 material on this showing he is seriously deluded and needs to stop taking whatever it is he's on.
Not sure if anybody else noticed, but the number 18 for them at centre half was blowing out of his arse for most of the 2nd half, not once did we try and capitalise on that. Lookman should have had him on toast, even Slade could have outpaced him, yet we chose to avoid exploiting that weakness.
Slade is totally oblivious to obvious things. It's embarrassing.
Ha ha ha @ricky_otto . And you expect Slade to pick up on something as subtle as that? He still hasn't twigged that playing Magennis so isolated up front is serving no purpose other than to knacker one of our better players. The midfield are too slow. By sitting back we invite the opposition onto us, but don't have the creativity and spark to capitalise on this. I'll be honest, I don't want another manager change. But I don't want a manager who lacks the wit to see how the game changes, or even where it's going wrong, and wait an hour to change things.
Doesn’t the manager get it. The booing at the Holmes substitution was aim at him not the player coming on. Think Slade is far too negative and they don’t play like a team. Think every team we have played this season maybe except Shrewsbury have played like a team and worked together. We seem so far off that I think middle of table is best we can achieve Hope I’m proved wrong
I feel that I must confess that I broke my boycott to go yesterday, mainly out of curiosity in all these new English league players that we have now and frankly just to be in the Valley one more time. It felt quite wrong giving RD any money at all but the £5 I think he would not notice and anyway I cannot get hold of all these free tickets that some posters seem to regularly get.
To be honest it was a mistake for several reasons which are in no particular order:
• I have lost all sense of excitement or attachment being there. • Not being able to book my old season ticket seat and having to sit next to a bunch of miserable and foul mouthed moaners that I though I had seen the last of! • No Chris Solly. • Being reminded of the poor quality of this league and the amount of foul play that goes unpunished. • No Chris Solly. • The apparent limited ability of the new players although Holmes was impressive if flawed like many wingers. I liked him though! • The negative play and lack of improvisation of the midfield and blimey is Foley capable of looking forward or what? • Boos at half time – best saved for full time if one feels the need IMO. • The present manager’s team set up (although reliant on the quality and availability of players – not enough and not of the necessary quality, as has been the case since RD arrived) and substitutions (same ‘although’ but also dependent on the fitness/injury carrying of the players involved – e.g. Holmes was taken off but it was reported that he was a likely to play…). • It was a poor game generally and the East stand was quieter than I remembered. • Other (probably several) reasons that I have forgotten…. • No Chris Solly.
Positives – well only one and that is obviously watching young Lookman again and for a whole match! He has come on a great deal since last season but now looks out of place with the lesser abilities of his team mates. I regret that I will never see him play again – for Charlton anyway!
Took my mum along to this game for her first in over 35 years. She easily saw what I've (and we all have) been saying about this regime.
It is rotten to the core. She couldn't believe the booing (but completely understands why it was done and who it's aimed it) and how far we have fallen.
It is a tremendously sad situation that we find ourselves in. The regime need to go. We need to ramp up the protests again (glad to hear the plans for Coventry game) and put the pressure on.
My mum also believes there is an ulterior motive for Roland running us into the ground. How the apologists can't see it is beyond me. We are in critical danger. Time for us fans to once again provide life support and rid our club of this riddling disease.
Comments
The one heartening thing about this thread, and others, is that people have identified Slade as the main problem.
Its sad to see our supporters booing the team before half time. The players are doing their best the regime is the problem!
In my view Holmes was the only positive and I couldn't understand why he was substituted
Can't see us being top 6 on this performance
1) not quite as bad as last Tuesday.
2) our international break means that at least it wont be Millwall sending into the bottom 4 come 5pm next Saturday
3) millwall below us for at least 2 weeks
Didn't realise until reading on here that the only home league game I've missed this season (Shrewsbury) we won & so I've yet to see a win this season.
I will still keep going to games......morbid fascination I suppose. Want to see how bad it can get. Slade is clueless & inept. Too many things wrong with team selection & set up to mention
I'm sorry but if you're the manager and you have final say over transfers you're to blame for a failed transfer policy. Heavy is the head that wears the crown. And besides, what has indicated from any of our performance this season that Slade would do better with better players? It's not his transfer signings that are the biggest problem, it's his coaching.
The problem with matching them with 4-4-2 is we've shown that we get overrun in that system, particularly with Slade's one winger one Jackson on the left policy. All our attacks go down the right and by the sounds of things we're utterly predictable.
I think sometimes (and I'm as guilty as anyone of this) we get bogged down in formations instead of styles and patterns of play. As Jonathan Wilson says, formations are just numbers, it's what you do with them. For me a 4-3-3 should suit the strengths and cover the weaknesses of a lot of our players. But if the opposition press us and we have no other ideas but to hoof it long, and if we end up reverting to a 4-1-4-1 at home against Rochdale because we don't know how to keep the ball, that's not so much the formation as the lack of a way of playing. We can talk about playing one forward but if executed well we should have had three forwards and/or a forward with a line of attacking three just behind him. Clearly that didn't happen...again. That's not formations, that's coaching.
2nd game of season for me and 1st for my 4 boys
Highlights of the day were driving down the A12 singing "who are ya " at the taxpayers stadium and then as we left Frankie & Benny's in Charlton my 4 year old was pointing at two young boys and a father ,waiting to be seated , in West Ham tops and booooooing at them
Anyway the rest of it was
Good to see the posh little Essex boy has some Sarf London herbert genes in him
It wasn't until the first "We want Roland out " chant in the 42nd minute did I then realise that we were gonna lose because of those damn protesting fans putting the players off . It seems Lincs, Purdis and co were right after all
0 % Top two ......... 12% 3rd-6th ......... 48% 7th-12th ......... 37.5% 13th-20th ........ 2.5% relegation
To me it's about shape, about the ability to press in numbers and recovery of the ball when losing possession.
If we move the ball quickly then a 4-5-1 can work because two wide players push up naturally into a 4-3-3.
The problem with playing a straight three up front is when you play too much long ball and it comes straight back, like the last 10 minutes yesterday which was like a training drill for the Rochdale defence to practice defending long ball, you effectively lose the defensive role of two players as they are too high up to recover and defend which they would be able to do in a 4-3-3.
Regarding Jacko. I think Slade must read this forum because a number of fairly knowledgable individuals have suggested on here that is the only role for him these days - as a number ten/playing behind a from two and I could see that but even that didn't work for reasons already highlighted on here.
At least Ajose tried to run the channels a bit.
With Jackson trying (failing) to pick up Magennis' knock-downs, it left a great big grassy space where our midfield should have been.
@ElfsborgAddick, I agree that fans generally are far too quick to call for change (except in the case of RD/KM), and I'm not shouting for Slades head yet. But he is one who seems to be unable to learn from his mistakes, which is my point.
All very well chucking him out, but as others have said, who the bloody hell would contemplate working with this owner and his circus of incompetents?
I'd give him the season unless there's regime change in the meantime. But he needs to sort out the failings that are clear to many on this board, and quickly.
Agreed, we need to give him a season, hopefully the January transfer window will help turn things around.
Unfortunately I think he could be gone before that if we stay bottom six. If that is the case, I reckon they'll get desperate and give it to Jackson(no disrespect to him with this comment)
Perhaps they'll have another meeting to ask key players if Russ is the right man...
Holmes,Lookman,Mcguniess, Ajose,
All good enough at this level ---- where are the midfield players ? We have no one who can hold the ball, break up play, pass the ball forward, create play.
One up front and NO ONE to knock the ball down to.
Huge huge hole down the middle that the oppo can just walk straight through.
If the guy from Burnely is a box to box player the it's the 6 yard box to the 18 yard box !!
5 mins after Ajose came on he is back on the half way line trying to get the ball FFS !!!
Jacksons legs have gone but so has his confidence, he can't even pass the ball at the moment.
Unless we can compete in the midfield we will go down ----- 4th level for the first time
Half a dozen gobby wankers calling in to radio phone-in does not equate with a whole fan base.
It saddens me that this myth is widely believed in the media and has become received wisdom.
The vast silent majority at the Valley were fully aware of the scale of Curbs achievement in punching substantially above our weight
If this was a marriage, it would be considered neglect or emotional abuse. Sadly in a marriage the abused party can eventually choose to leave, but with Charlton, no matter how shitty he/she appears to behave, we can't leave. Maybe we can withold 'benefits' for a period but we'll be back. Saddened in Sheffield.
The only teams capable of playing 4-3-3 properly are the likes of Barcelona & Real Madrid, with Neymar-Suarez-Messi backed up by Rakitic-Busquets-Iniesta, or Ronaldo-Benezema- Bale backed up by Modric-Kroos-Isco. powerful forwards backed up by a strong midfield. Man City were 4-1-4-1 at Celtic, Celtic 4-2-3-1, AC Milan 4-1-4-1 to 4-1-2-3, Fiorentina 4-2-3-1, West Ham 4-2-3-1, Southampton 4-4-2 Diamond, Arsenal 4-2-3-1, Chelsea 4-2-3-1, Man Utd 4-2-3-1, Leicester 4-1-4-1, Benfica 4-4-2 to 4-2-4, AS Roma 4-2-3-1, Tottenham 4-2-3-1, C.Palace 4-2-3-1, Stoke 4-2-3-1, Watford 5-3-2 to 3-5-2, Feyenoord 4-2-3-1, AS Monaco 4-4-2 to 4-2-4, Paris SG 4-2-3-1, Everton 4-2-3-1, to list a few from matches in September. The only instances of teams playing close to 4-3-3,apart from the big two, are Napoli 4-1-2-3 and Holland 4-1-4-1 to 4-1-2-3. You will notice that some top coaches at these clubs haven't decided they are good enough to play 4-3-3.
4-3-3 means you have three up front, who stay there and don't work back, which is a big luxury. Don't forget we are talking about League One players here, who have weaknesses in their games. Lookman apart who is obviously on the move upwards, the others have flaws in their games. If they didn't have flaws, they'd be earning more money at a higher level. You can't just throw a system at League One players and expect them to adapt, they don't have the tools to do so. Keep it simple, if the opposition are 4-4-2, why try something complicated?
If it wasn't about formations and setting up your team in the best way to win a game, we'd all still be playing 2-3-5. England won the World Cup in 66 with a change of system, the wingless wonders, Hungary came to Wembley in 1953 with 4-2-4 against England's 2-3-5, and battered us 6-3, in a game that changed football. Saying it isn't about the system is a good excuse to deflect the blame away from the manager to the players, particularly after a poor performance like yesterday. Jacko was so ineffective in the no.10 role yesterday, we were effectively 10 v 11. You can't just change a system without working on it and making sure there is a pattern of play that goes with it. There was three days between the last fixture and this one, no chance.
Jonathon Wilson has no experience of playing, managing, coaching or scouting in the professional game. He wrote a good book, all based on what has gone before. It was all out there, he just pulled it together. The job of the professional manager/coach is to get it right before the game and during the game. Sean Dyche killed him on 5Live recently when he was putting forward a few theories with "what experience do you have in the game". In other words, if you haven't been in a dressing room, you are guessing.
Looking forward to your counter arguments.
In the last two seasons the wheels seemed to come off about the time of the second international break, this year it's started early. We seem to have got into that spiral of decline where you see the confidence draining out week by week.
Also, you suspect the word is out that if you keep Holmes quiet, unless Lookman is on you can pretty well stop Charlton their tracks. Witness the kicking Holmes got off of Bolton.
Most of the criticism is being aimed at Slade and the midfield, but I worry that we are limited upfront as well. McGennis looks OK but Novak and Ajose don't look like much of a threat. For all the talk about service, the front men have to make the runs and make themselves available. The team overall seems static, shapeless and slow to me. Botaka is a bit of an unknown quality, he does seem to have a bit of pace but Slade seems terrified of taking a chance on him.
I don't think the squad is as good as a lot of people think, but Slade isn't helping with his approach. Things need to improve and pronto.
To me it's the system Slade is playing that is causing the problem. Clearly Jackson should not be starting he hardly made one tackle yesterday and was anonymous all through the game I would play Botaka to add some pace and support the forwards, play Lookman as the number 10 type player and have Croft and Ulvestad in the middle with Holmes the other wide player. Get the ball to feet as Maggennis can hold up or run with the ball hopefully that creates more chances. With Magennis up front on his own there is only a hoof from the back to set an attack going and in League 1 that doesn't work.
At the back we look shaky, Fox had another one of his days, missing the tackle that let to the goal and Foley just isn't Solly. Bauer had a decent game I would like to see him paired with Tex. As for Ajose? the new Reza, runs around a lot nobody knows what he is going to do and complains, waste of money.
If Russell Slade really believes we are top 6 material on this showing he is seriously deluded and needs to stop taking whatever it is he's on.
(I'm sure he was talking about promotion earlier in the season and not just getting up the table, but never mind)
So there you have it, the guru has spoken, chill out, relax and don't worry about a thing. Colin says it will all be fine.
Slade is totally oblivious to obvious things. It's embarrassing.
I'll be honest, I don't want another manager change. But I don't want a manager who lacks the wit to see how the game changes, or even where it's going wrong, and wait an hour to change things.
Think Slade is far too negative and they don’t play like a team. Think every team we have played this season maybe except Shrewsbury have played like a team and worked together. We seem so far off that I think middle of table is best we can achieve
Hope I’m proved wrong
It felt quite wrong giving RD any money at all but the £5 I think he would not notice and anyway I cannot get hold of all these free tickets that some posters seem to regularly get.
To be honest it was a mistake for several reasons which are in no particular order:
• I have lost all sense of excitement or attachment being there.
• Not being able to book my old season ticket seat and having to sit next to a bunch of miserable and foul mouthed moaners that I though I had seen the last of!
• No Chris Solly.
• Being reminded of the poor quality of this league and the amount of foul play that goes unpunished.
• No Chris Solly.
• The apparent limited ability of the new players although Holmes was impressive if flawed like many wingers. I liked him though!
• The negative play and lack of improvisation of the midfield and blimey is Foley capable of looking forward or what?
• Boos at half time – best saved for full time if one feels the need IMO.
• The present manager’s team set up (although reliant on the quality and availability of players – not enough and not of the necessary quality, as has been the case since RD arrived) and substitutions (same ‘although’ but also dependent on the fitness/injury carrying of the players involved – e.g. Holmes was taken off but it was reported that he was a likely to play…).
• It was a poor game generally and the East stand was quieter than I remembered.
• Other (probably several) reasons that I have forgotten….
• No Chris Solly.
Positives – well only one and that is obviously watching young Lookman again and for a whole match! He has come on a great deal since last season but now looks out of place with the lesser abilities of his team mates. I regret that I will never see him play again – for Charlton anyway!
Back to the boycott!
It is rotten to the core. She couldn't believe the booing (but completely understands why it was done and who it's aimed it) and how far we have fallen.
It is a tremendously sad situation that we find ourselves in. The regime need to go. We need to ramp up the protests again (glad to hear the plans for Coventry game) and put the pressure on.
My mum also believes there is an ulterior motive for Roland running us into the ground. How the apologists can't see it is beyond me. We are in critical danger. Time for us fans to once again provide life support and rid our club of this riddling disease.