Long and the short of it. Does anyone actually want him at the club or actually think he has the technical know-how to dig us out of this mess? It's not just the results that speak volumes but also his cluelessness, not to mention his woeful post-match analysis
This is a genuine question. What exactly impressed you when you talked to Fraeye? Can you be sure that you would not have been equally impressed if you had met the 4 previous managers for a similar chat?
I recall that a couple of Lifers were "impressed" with him when they met him doing his job in the stands under the last Powell months. I guess he is a personable guy who is ok talking one to one with fans. Many good managers are not.
Ithe question I'd ask KM is, what is it that Fraeye does better than the previous four, that means he should not be sacked when they were? Patently, the answer is not "winning more football matches than them"
Since KM currently does not wish to answer the question, would you like to have a go?
Prague, I understand that you are saying that because someone impresses one that that does not mean they will be good at their job. I have obviously not met the previous 4 managers but one would not have to meet Chris Powell to be impressed but then he is an exceptional man. On a personal level Karel Fraeye impressed me with his enthusiasm for the game, his obvious zeal to succeed with Charlton and his views on the squad which were much in line with mine but with most interesting and illuminating insights (which will remain confidential). On top of this he is a very friendly and has an engaging personality. I have little idea like all of us as to what goes on in KM’s mind…… The reasons the previous managers were sacked are open to question but you asked me a question and I will give you my interpretation. So I would say that whoever is really in charge of team management affairs (cannot really believe it is KM is any meaningful way) is impressed by Karel’s persona, his assessment of the squad and his ability to see the real value of the staff (hence the promotion of Jason and JJ becoming more prominent) who is good for the team and who should leave etc. He tries different options on the pitch but is of course hampered by who is available. He has brought players back from their loan periods because they are good for the squad and has brought to the first team young players like Lookman that are ready for the first team (although they have been used more than he would prefer because of the small squad). He knew many weeks before that English championship players were needed to bolster the squad and perhaps the penny has now dropped and he/she/they agree with him……..He is a very hard worker! So this is my opinion and I also think that he will get us out of the current mess with the reinforcements that he and Jason have targeted but if RD does not change tactics/visions then the problem will occur again.
For Christ's sake, even for you this is bleak. What manager doesn't want to success in his job? Should no manager ever be sacked as long as he shows a fan he chats to that he really likes football? To be perfectly honest, considering Fraeye's pathetic results since he took over and his obvious tactical mistakes nearly every game, the fact his views on the squad are in line with yours speaks to your judgment as eloquently as anyone on here ever could
In all my time supporting Charlton (going back to 1963), I've seen us turn against managers several times. As happens at every club. But I have never seen anything like this where the fans manage to so carefully target their wrath at the manager while making sure the players feel supported. And I am pretty sure the players are indeed behaving accordingly at the final whistle, as others have said.
The reason why this is happening is clear enough. While there was a lot of scepticism about his credentials, there were plenty of fair minded people prepared to give him a chance, citing Lennie and Curbs. However 9-10 games in it is quite obvious that he cannot get results. And what pisses people off is that performances under him are worse than under those who were sacked (remember Cardiff at home this timeish last year under Peeters?), yet the regime appears under no inclination to sack him as they did all the others.
Do you not recognise that?
Maybe he's only still with us because nobody else will take the job.
In all my time supporting Charlton (going back to 1963), I've seen us turn against managers several times. As happens at every club. But I have never seen anything like this where the fans manage to so carefully target their wrath at the manager while making sure the players feel supported. And I am pretty sure the players are indeed behaving accordingly at the final whistle, as others have said.
The reason why this is happening is clear enough. While there was a lot of scepticism about his credentials, there were plenty of fair minded people prepared to give him a chance, citing Lennie and Curbs. However 9-10 games in it is quite obvious that he cannot get results. And what pisses people off is that performances under him are worse than under those who were sacked (remember Cardiff at home this timeish last year under Peeters?), yet the regime appears under no inclination to sack him as they did all the others.
Do you not recognise that?
Maybe he's only still with us because nobody else will take the job.
Don't be silly.. Remember Katrien said that she had 20 applications within an hour last year when Peeters was sacked!
Jokes aside, that's actually a very interesting thought.
If Roland can't find a manager thats prepared to work with him and the existing manager is taking us down towards a level that our own CEO recognises as unsustainable... Surely the time to sell up would be moved forward with some urgency.
RD must surely be exhausting his pool of potential managers by now, and I can't see there being a queue from many non-network managers applying.
You'd also think similar issues would hit player recruitment too. I can't see any of our existing squad talking positively about the club. Then again, we seem to survive every year based on loans anyway.
In all my time supporting Charlton (going back to 1963), I've seen us turn against managers several times. As happens at every club. But I have never seen anything like this where the fans manage to so carefully target their wrath at the manager while making sure the players feel supported. And I am pretty sure the players are indeed behaving accordingly at the final whistle, as others have said.
The reason why this is happening is clear enough. While there was a lot of scepticism about his credentials, there were plenty of fair minded people prepared to give him a chance, citing Lennie and Curbs. However 9-10 games in it is quite obvious that he cannot get results. And what pisses people off is that performances under him are worse than under those who were sacked (remember Cardiff at home this timeish last year under Peeters?), yet the regime appears under no inclination to sack him as they did all the others.
Do you not recognise that?
Maybe he's only still with us because nobody else will take the job.
Don't be silly.. Remember Katrien said that she had 20 applications within an hour last year when Peeters was sacked!
Jokes aside, that's actually a very interesting thought.
If Roland can't find a manager thats prepared to work with him and the existing manager is taking us down towards a level that our own CEO recognises as unsustainable... Surely the time to sell up would be moved forward with some urgency.
RD must surely be exhausting his pool of potential managers by now, and I can't see there being a queue from many non-network managers applying.
You'd also think similar issues would hit player recruitment too. I can't see any of our existing squad talking positively about the club. Then again, we seem to survive every year based on loans anyway.
I saw the players on the pitch after the final whistle yesterday and the reaction of Solly when he was moved into central midfield.
From what I saw it didn't look like the booing of Fraeye would harm them, quite the opposite in fact.
In my opinion the guy has no idea what he's doing. We had no idea of how to score a goal in the first half yesterday - there was no route to goal whatsoever.
Bringing on a left footed left back to play right back when he only has Vaz Te in front of him was a recipe for disaster and therefore he must take some responsibility for THD's sending off.
Taking Ba off at half time when Jackson was clearly already injured was a dumb move and the decision to move Solly into midfield was clearly just a case of moving our best player into a gap that needed filling.
I know you've spoken to him and heard what he's got to say @Desperate_Pete and you were obviously impressed. Well actions speak louder than words and I've seen the way he sets his team up and his reactions to the play and I'm distinctly unimpressed.
Combine that with the fact that he's nowhere near qualified to be anywhere near the club in any capacity apart from his aptitude to towing the party line and you can see why he's not particularly popular surely?
I think the way we were when the Full-Time whistle went, sent a strong message to the players... i.e. we clapped them so they knew we support them yet the moment Fraeye went near the North Stand the abuse turned to him until he disappeared and then the fans turned back to supporting the players.
The performance when Solly moved to Midfield almost sent a silent message to us the fans saying... Look we know Fraeye is bloody clueless, we're taking matters into our own hands on the pitch to show we're united with you
Not to play devil's advocate here, because I'd rather have an aubergine managing/coaching our team then KF, but he is not the first person to play Solly in the middle of the park or out of position, and it's not the first time Solly has played bad when it has happened.
Anyway, it should be illegal to post on this thread until he has been moved on (because surely you cannot sack an interim?)
Not to play devil's advocate here, because I'd rather have an aubergine managing/coaching our team then KF, but he is not the first person to play Solly in the middle of the park or out of position, and it's not the first time Solly has played bad when it has happened.
Anyway, it should be illegal to post on this thread until he has been moved on (because surely you cannot sack an interim?)
I don't think Solly played badly in Midfield and think when he gets older he could do a Jackson where he moves from Full-Back into the middle of the pitch, what I don't understand though is why both Solly and THD were played out of position, Holmes-Dennis could easily have been put into Midfield as he hasn't done badly there himself when called upon
Not to play devil's advocate here, because I'd rather have an aubergine managing/coaching our team then KF, but he is not the first person to play Solly in the middle of the park or out of position, and it's not the first time Solly has played bad when it has happened.
Anyway, it should be illegal to post on this thread until he has been moved on (because surely you cannot sack an interim?)
I don't think Solly played badly in Midfield and think when he gets older he could do a Jackson where he moves from Full-Back into the middle of the pitch, what I don't understand though is why both Solly and THD were played out of position, Holmes-Dennis could easily have been put into Midfield as he hasn't done badly there himself when called upon
Agree with that. THD certainly seems like a more dynamic player and someone who I have quietly been impressed with.
Get Riga and Mr Kemorgant in and it's like RD has decided to press the reset button in the hope of appeasing us fans.
Thing is it's not gonna work.
These muppets running the club need to go NOW!
The worrying thing is, what with all the doom and gloom of late - I think if RD got rid of KF, and brought in Riga and Kermorgant he'd probably placate a lot of fans. If he then got Katrien to resign I think people would be quite prepared to sing his praises... at least for a while.
This was actually one of my worries about Poyet coming back for the rest of the season to be honest, we're making good progress as fans uniting against what's going on - and these little gestures could be enough to get some of us out of our misery and give them (yet another) chance. This would be a very bad thing, and also quite embarrassing considering the media attention we've got.
Then it makes you wonder what kind of a shitty fan you are for thinking like that! Thank God Roland is never going to do anything like that to win us over, eh?
He is showing us how many points he's delivered to us in the last 8 games...& he's very proud of this as we should not expect Charlton to be a team that goes into every match expected to win.
Comments
Jokes aside, that's actually a very interesting thought.
If Roland can't find a manager thats prepared to work with him and the existing manager is taking us down towards a level that our own CEO recognises as unsustainable... Surely the time to sell up would be moved forward with some urgency.
RD must surely be exhausting his pool of potential managers by now, and I can't see there being a queue from many non-network managers applying.
You'd also think similar issues would hit player recruitment too. I can't see any of our existing squad talking positively about the club. Then again, we seem to survive every year based on loans anyway.
The performance when Solly moved to Midfield almost sent a silent message to us the fans saying... Look we know Fraeye is bloody clueless, we're taking matters into our own hands on the pitch to show we're united with you
Anyway, it should be illegal to post on this thread until he has been moved on (because surely you cannot sack an interim?)
Maybe that's why Poyet coming back...
Thing is it's not gonna work.
These muppets running the club need to go NOW!
This was actually one of my worries about Poyet coming back for the rest of the season to be honest, we're making good progress as fans uniting against what's going on - and these little gestures could be enough to get some of us out of our misery and give them (yet another) chance. This would be a very bad thing, and also quite embarrassing considering the media attention we've got.
Then it makes you wonder what kind of a shitty fan you are for thinking like that! Thank God Roland is never going to do anything like that to win us over, eh?
It'll all end in tears. I'm not looking forward to the next three games, all away and difficult.