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Fraeye - How long, what next?

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  • IA said:

    I blame the fans for these bad results.

    Well, more specifically,I blame myself. I've only been able to attend two matches while Fraeye has been manager - Sheffield Wednesday home and Birmingham away.

    Sorry folks.

    Glory hunter.
  • mogodon said:

    If Roland doesn't get rid of Carol tonight, then I honestly believe his plan must be to run the club into the ground and sell off the Valley.

    You are assuming that he a) has any idea about the result or b) gives a ****. Fraeye is here until the new year. He may end up being in the post as interim longer than many full-time managers
    Well Bob and Guy were given the boot pretty suddenly. The one thing that might be saving KF is that bringing in new players in January may turn things around, depending on whose fault our duff squad was in the first place...
    Instead we will get rejects from RD's empire and some more kids. It would take a hell of a spending spree to get us out of this mess.
  • I don't even think many players would have to be signed to change things. Only about 4 and I could see results improving. That's not going to happen though, the ideological madman won't change.
  • I don't even think many players would have to be signed to change things. Only about 4 and I could see results improving. That's not going to happen though, the ideological madman won't change.

    And what player in their right mind would want to sign for us?
  • The only players we'll be able to attract will be mercenaries and youth players. Neither of which will be any use to us.

    Confidence is sapped from the players and the support has been lost. We need a lot more than a few signings to turn this mess around!
  • 1StevieG said:

    IA said:

    I blame the fans for these bad results.

    Well, more specifically,I blame myself. I've only been able to attend two matches while Fraeye has been manager - Sheffield Wednesday home and Birmingham away.

    Sorry folks.

    Glory hunter.
    I'm only there when we're winning.

    I've been away from London for a few years, in different locations. For balance, I don't remember if I saw any wins under Luzon (was at the Watford 5-0) and I probably attended all of Riga's 3-0 defeats. Fraeye is on a 100% record for me ;-)
  • mogodon said:

    If Roland doesn't get rid of Carol tonight, then I honestly believe his plan must be to run the club into the ground and sell off the Valley.

    You are assuming that he a) has any idea about the result or b) gives a ****. Fraeye is here until the new year. He may end up being in the post as interim longer than many full-time managers
    Well Bob and Guy were given the boot pretty suddenly. The one thing that might be saving KF is that bringing in new players in January may turn things around, depending on whose fault our duff squad was in the first place...
    That is my thinking as well.

    If they are going to bring players in who Fraeye/Euell want then it looks like Fraeye will be around for another six games.

    Things are desperate enough now it could almost be curtains by the end of January as there is a bottom six gap opening up already.
  • Karel First Half Fraeye

    He is the clown picking the team. Everyone on this site knows
    that the squad was never going to be big enough for a season
    in the Championship. Luzon and Fraeye are both gutless nomarks.
    We all know we need a guy with Championship or British knowledge.
    Giving warnings to the players when you should be getting some decent
    signings, not like Bergdich, Sarr, Le Pointe, Polish Peter, Thurham etc.
    Don't think Tony Watt who in my opinion is a class player would ever
    want to come back to work for these Belgian muppets.
    Racist comment now over!
  • Fraeye would have made a good captain on the Titanic.
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  • edited December 2015

    Fraeye would have made a good captain on the Titanic.

    What Iceberg? You set em up Claus, I'll knock em in :wink:
  • edited December 2015
    KF say that the club is going to make tough decisions about the players (which to flog) after yesterday's game due to their performance which he goes on to laud -Slight contradiction - Which is it, good or bad???!!!!!

    It's a mentality thing, he goes on to say.....No Karel, it's a crap Manager thing.

    Katrien ffs just give him your 100% support and backing ..................
  • Was just pondering this and we aren't almost at this stage, as GL had 13 games, KF has only had 9.

    KF 8pts from 9 games
    GL 10pts from 13 games

    However, KF will get to 13 games by Huddersfield away. Can he get 2 pts from his next 4 games? If he does that will mean he's done equally as good as GL, who we sacked because presumably results aren't good enough (and yes the results might not have been good enough because he lost the dressing room, but to me that's irrelevant).

    If he gets to this, or less then surely he has to be told he's not good enough to turn it around.

    I call this RD logic. KF will be no doubt given the rest of the season, even if he gets to 13 games on less points than GL did.
  • We have a manager with no history whose footballing knowledge was being tested in Belgium's lower tiers. And those running the club think he is the answer and his schoolboy book of football tactics will revolutionise the club and the division. They won't. They will be ripped apart for the archaic mess they are and the players, assuming they know what he's trying to do, will just carry on into freefall. Not Fraeye's fault. He had to take the chance when it came up, just in case it worked. But it hasn't and he has to go.
  • Just logged on to see if the idiot CArol has been sacked yet. Sadly it appears not,

    I give up.
  • stonemuse said:

    image

    Don't want to stick my nose in an argument (says I sticking my nose in) but if you have been told things you can't repeat why would you mention it?
    I think you are right and I should not have mentioned it.

    I do know from a family friend who was doing some work with the club at the time, that KF was at the club "assessing" our squad whilst CP was still manager, so I am inclined to believe Henry(and others) that he has at the very least had some serious involvement in our transfer dealings since then.

    Yes he probable was there assessing the players which would be a reasonable thing for RD to ask him to do - whatever we think of RD, in my opinion.

    Yep, it's perfectly reasonable, while a manager is already place, to ask a Belgian fourth division manager with no English football experience to assess the squad of a Championship team you've just bought. There's nothing insane about that whatsoever. And considering we subsequently sold Dale Stephens and Yann Kermorgant and replaced them with Polish Pete, Yohann Thuram and Loic Nego I think it's safe to say he made a right bollocks of his assessment
    Blimey KF's coach/managership has dropped from third to fourth now.... Anyway I think your deduction that his assessment, if that is what is was, resulted in all these transfer dealings is suspect to say the least and it has not been made public who made these decisions. Whoever did make these decisions is insane and needs shooting!
    I think you'll find that when Chris Powell was in charge, which is the timeframe we're talking about here, Karel had spent three years at Eendracht Zele, who are in the fourth division. His time in the Belgian third division hadn't happened yet. Granted after that he did take up a role at a Belgian third division club, rendering him only marginally less qualified to take over a second division English team.

    So what you're saying is Roland asked Karel Fraeye to assess the squad, presumably Karel gave him an answer because he was at the club, and putting his fingers in his ear and humming whenever Roland asked for a report presumably wouldn't endear him too much, and Roland...what? Ignored the assessment? Went his own way? Because you'd think if Roland was displeased enough with Karel's assessment then he wouldn't subsequently hire him as the new head coach; why would you, the bloke can't appraise a team. Roland asked Karel to appraise the squad, subsequently sold key players and signed players from all over Europe, and you think it's suspect logic to assume Fraeye had some input into this? Who else was it then?
    Appreciate the time it took to answer and the time frame perspective. However my point is that we do not know what sort of assessment was carried out by KF and what if any of his suggestions/findings were followed through. I do not know who is responsible for the comings and goings regarding Charlton; I just know it was not KF.
    Believe me or not I am past caring because if one offers up an alternative perspective on matters there is so much nitpicking and general antipathy.
    do you still rate KF after today?

    Pete, any chance of a response, no pisstake, I am really interested to see if you can still justify his appointment.
  • stonemuse said:

    stonemuse said:

    image

    Don't want to stick my nose in an argument (says I sticking my nose in) but if you have been told things you can't repeat why would you mention it?
    I think you are right and I should not have mentioned it.

    I do know from a family friend who was doing some work with the club at the time, that KF was at the club "assessing" our squad whilst CP was still manager, so I am inclined to believe Henry(and others) that he has at the very least had some serious involvement in our transfer dealings since then.

    Yes he probable was there assessing the players which would be a reasonable thing for RD to ask him to do - whatever we think of RD, in my opinion.

    Yep, it's perfectly reasonable, while a manager is already place, to ask a Belgian fourth division manager with no English football experience to assess the squad of a Championship team you've just bought. There's nothing insane about that whatsoever. And considering we subsequently sold Dale Stephens and Yann Kermorgant and replaced them with Polish Pete, Yohann Thuram and Loic Nego I think it's safe to say he made a right bollocks of his assessment
    Blimey KF's coach/managership has dropped from third to fourth now.... Anyway I think your deduction that his assessment, if that is what is was, resulted in all these transfer dealings is suspect to say the least and it has not been made public who made these decisions. Whoever did make these decisions is insane and needs shooting!
    I think you'll find that when Chris Powell was in charge, which is the timeframe we're talking about here, Karel had spent three years at Eendracht Zele, who are in the fourth division. His time in the Belgian third division hadn't happened yet. Granted after that he did take up a role at a Belgian third division club, rendering him only marginally less qualified to take over a second division English team.

    So what you're saying is Roland asked Karel Fraeye to assess the squad, presumably Karel gave him an answer because he was at the club, and putting his fingers in his ear and humming whenever Roland asked for a report presumably wouldn't endear him too much, and Roland...what? Ignored the assessment? Went his own way? Because you'd think if Roland was displeased enough with Karel's assessment then he wouldn't subsequently hire him as the new head coach; why would you, the bloke can't appraise a team. Roland asked Karel to appraise the squad, subsequently sold key players and signed players from all over Europe, and you think it's suspect logic to assume Fraeye had some input into this? Who else was it then?
    Appreciate the time it took to answer and the time frame perspective. However my point is that we do not know what sort of assessment was carried out by KF and what if any of his suggestions/findings were followed through. I do not know who is responsible for the comings and goings regarding Charlton; I just know it was not KF.
    Believe me or not I am past caring because if one offers up an alternative perspective on matters there is so much nitpicking and general antipathy.
    do you still rate KF after today?
    Pete, any chance of a response, no pisstake, I am really interested to see if you can still justify his appointment.

    Okay, I was as unhappy about yesterday as most but I did not expect much there anyway. Actually I was as surprised and worried about his appointment as many on CL but after (by chance) talking with him about the squad and what he wants to work on I was impressed. It has not been so successful yet but he is finding out what strengths are in the small squad and trying with Jason to play the best 11(when not injured or suspended).
    He introduced Lookman and got Lennon back from his loan and made use of KAG as well as getting JJ to play a bigger role in the team/management dynamic - all good in my opinion. Of course we all agree that we are too reliant on the younger players as well as having a squad that is too small with not enough cover in important areas and we have many that are inexperienced in the Championship as well!
    He is getting a lot of stick with his post match comments but remember that he is not used to this line of questioning and has to be careful what he says to keep his job and to manage the team until the transfer window and, of course I do not expect he knows what targets will be forthcoming given Roland's meanness..... One does not get many words of wisdom from any manager post game when their team has lost! I will write about this more later but there is so much shit going down on him......... Expect a shitfull of abuse myself now from the usual candidates but WTF!

    PS How does one hide previous quotes when posting anyone?
  • Thanks for responding.
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  • In my post I meant to say that KF had made use of Holmes Denis not KAG who is not really ready yet....
  • How long? - Too long

    What next? - I dread to think
  • Duchatelet has pissed all over the supporters by
    landing us with this clown as Interim or whatever.
    Must be the final straw for the genuine supporters!
  • Karel has got some things right: Diarra in midfield, Sarr out, Lennon in (while we wait for a new central defender!) +Lookman in etc. The thing is that confidence is totally shot and a manager from the Belgian 3rd Div is going to find it an uphill battle to get it back. Had he come in after CP then maybe he could have done better. It didn't help that his first game was Boro away! His changes worked for 2 games but Mick McCarthy soon sussed that and Ipswich thrashed us. When you're in a relegation battle you want a manager who you believe can get you out, unfortunately Karel has no track record that tell us he is the man.
  • edited December 2015
    I still believe even without any additions to the squad there's enough in it to at least keep us up this season. We shouldn't even be in this position but we are because neither KF or GL has been able to get anywhere near the best out of the players.

    Many of the players have under-performed which yes you can say is down to them but put yourselves in JBG's shoes for instance. He's going to be at Euro 2016 next summer, and been a pivotal part of Iceland's qualification winning big games such as Holland away. Do you think he feels inspired by KF after he returns from his feel good factor of international duty?

    The Bolton game for me was clearer more than ever that the team has the ability within it. At 2-0 I was seriously considering whether we would really go on and seriously thump them but at 2-2 we were probably lucky to hang on for a point in the end and a lot of it came down to poor passing and movement essentially the poor execution of whatever plan there was to win the game. You look around the pitch and you certainly felt so many players could have given so much more that night and that for me comes down to the head coach to get the best out of his players.

    The players badly need a lift and somebody in charge they can respect. They know we don't respect KF as a head coach, he probably is a nice enough guy and trying his best but at this stage it's not good enough. There's still time to turn this whole mess around but we need to act ASAP. Bristol City away on Boxing Day is a six pointer but I fear we will go through the usual motions of an away game, possibly go 1-0 up and then end up losing 2-1 or 3-1 with a quickfire burst of goals in the 2nd half. I'd even take a point but we simply must not lose and I don't think we are capable of this mentality with the current setup.
  • How long has he got?
    Too f***ing long.
    4-0 at Burnley is way, way, way beyond a joke.
    Feels like RIP Charlton.

    RIP Charlton. I like that.. I'm sure there is a way to build a campaign on that.

    I think we are past the time for spelling it out... maybe SIO can develop into a campaign mourning the death of this once great football club with RIP Charlton as it's catch phrase.. can continue with the black and white scarfs etc.
  • The only thing that can save this club now is bringing in a manager (and yes I mean manager) who can unite the club at every level.

    Unite the players to fight for the cause for the shirt for the fans and for each other. Organise the team so we are well drilled and hard to beat.

    Get all the back room staff working for the same cause.

    And get the fans back on side. Backing the players and getting behind the team.


    Usually I would a at never go back. But this isn't normal circumstances. So it has to be one man. Curbs.

    Powell might work but not sure he would quite have the same unifying impact.
  • I still believe even without any additions to the squad there's enough in it to at least keep us up this season. We shouldn't even be in this position but we are because neither KF or GL has been able to get anywhere near the best out of the players.

    Many of the players have under-performed which yes you can say is down to them but put yourselves in JBG's shoes for instance. He's going to be at Euro 2016 next summer, and been a pivotal part of Iceland's qualification winning big games such as Holland away. Do you think he feels inspired by KF after he returns from his feel good factor of international duty?

    The Bolton game for me was clearer more than ever that the team has the ability within it. At 2-0 I was seriously considering whether we would really go on and seriously thump them but at 2-2 we were probably lucky to hang on for a point in the end and a lot of it came down to poor passing and movement essentially the poor execution of whatever plan there was to win the game. You look around the pitch and you certainly felt so many players could have given so much more that night and that for me comes down to the head coach to get the best out of his players.

    The players badly need a lift and somebody in charge they can respect. They know we don't respect KF as a head coach, he probably is a nice enough guy and trying his best but at this stage it's not good enough. There's still time to turn this whole mess around but we need to act ASAP. Bristol City away on Boxing Day is a six pointer but I fear we will go through the usual motions of an away game, possibly go 1-0 up and then end up losing 2-1 or 3-1 with a quickfire burst of goals in the 2nd half. I'd even take a point but we simply must not lose and I don't think we are capable of this mentality with the current setup.

    I think you make some good points. Our first XI isn't a bad side, what we need is a GOOD manager or Head Coach that can work their magic and squeeze every drop of ability from the players. The defence needs some serious work however. It's hard to judge whether they are good enough individually, but they don't work as a unit, that's for sure. The rest of the team also have to take their defensive responsibilities seriously. Too often there have been huge gaps in the midfield and the opposition can virtually walk the ball right up to our penalty area. An experienced coach could fix some of these problems relatively quickly though.

    The other issue of course, is that outside of our first XI, we are desperately short of cover. In the Curbs years we often had a few half decent utility players that could assume a couple of different positions when required. All we have now are a few youngsters, many of which are lacking in confidence because their transition into the first team has not been managed properly. They have been thrown in to high pressure situations out of necessity, it's no way to treat what should be our stars of the future.

    As I'm typing this, I'm wondering why I bother. The vast majority of these issues have been glaringly obvious for two seasons, yet the club consistently fail to address them.
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Roland Out Forever!