I think its more the point that they are unlikely to have a prepared and analytical approach to take the club to task on certain questions, and so may dilute the group, nor would they be accountable to any other group of fans, thats not demeaning to the average fan, and if they are so open to the average fan why not just call a public meeting? Perhaps this is controlled way of effectively doing that.
A bit glib I accept, but I would say a fair chunk of the fans don't really care about the governance of the club, they care about the football I'll give them that, but they won't be as well versed in the issues as say a trust member or a supporters club rep.
I kind of read that comment as fans which won't *necessarily* have a clue. Like it or not, a lot of football fans look no further than the manager, 3 points and a piss-up. And won't know anything about Meire for instance. All you need are a few of these taken in by her 'sweet looks' and false sincerity, regurgitating the same old unfounded crap/untruths. Add Murray peddling his usual spin/changing subject when it doesn't suit him, and referring to what the club was like when run properly (i.e. years ago), this will make it much harder for the vocal dissenters. It's all complete propaganda and a total waste of time.
that's the database that says my email address isn't registered until I try to register it then tells me it already is so I should do one, the database that texts me garbage I've never asked for and posts me other peoples stuff every now and again....brilliant
I kind of read that comment as fans which won't *necessarily* have a clue. Like it or not, a lot of football fans look no further than the manager, 3 points and a piss-up. And won't know anything about Meire for instance. All you need are a few of these taken in by her 'sweet looks' and false sincerity, regurgitating the same old unfounded crap/untruths. Add Murray peddling his usual spin/changing subject when it doesn't suit him, and referring to what the club was like when run properly (i.e. years ago), this will make it much harder for the vocal dissenters. It's all complete propaganda and a total waste of time.
But their point of view is just as valid as that of the hardcore Roland out brigade. What we need is a representative cross selection of Charlton supporters. Hardcore anti Roland, worried middle ground and prepared to give them the benefit of the doubt, types.
What we also need is constructive dialogue from both sides, if the first few fans just stand up and shout abuse, then that won't get anyone anywhere.
I can't help thinking that there is an enormous showing of arrogance being posted on this thread.
Quite silly to imply that people who spend time and effort representing other fans won't on average know more and be better placed to make arguments than people chosen at random who have not shown any such motivation.
The "randomn selection" could be really interesting. My group of CAFC mates come from all walks of life. Including:
some who would be comfortable putting a really intelligent and eloquent argument to a CE others who would hide at the back, and one or two who would potentially be irrational and use the opportunaty to foam and vent.
But hey thats democracy, but could be interesting to see who gets "drawn".
I can't help thinking that there is an enormous showing of arrogance being posted on this thread.
Quite silly to imply that people who spend time and effort representing other fans won't on average know more and be better placed to make arguments than people chosen at random who have not shown any such motivation.
If you want any idea (in my opinion) what the meeting will be like (whenever it is) have a look at the VIP Meeting video back in February. Page 11 of the thread below.
And its not that offensive. Loads of people I know who are season ticket holders, don't care about who runs the club, and even couldn't name half the team. They engage in the club for a few hours, don't spend hours on message boards, aren't invested in the politics, don't look at social media.
We're in a bit of an echo chamber here, we know the ins and outs, but most people aren't engaged, and those who are randomly selected may well be the least interested.
If you want any idea (in my opinion) what the meeting will be like (whenever it is) have a look at the VIP Meeting video back in February. Page 11 of the thread below.
The meeting is better than nothing I guess. However, unless they agree that their current strategy isn't working and they are now going to start resourcing the playing and managerial side of things properly from now on, then for me, the war is still on. This obviously includes bringing in a proper manager, not a master chocolatier from the Belgium selection box.
I can't help thinking that there is an enormous showing of arrogance being posted on this thread.
Quite silly to imply that people who spend time and effort representing other fans won't on average know more and be better placed to make arguments than people chosen at random who have not shown any such motivation.
But that's divide and rule for you.
They may not know more or be better placed - but 'not have a clue' - really?
And its not that offensive. Loads of people I know who are season ticket holders, don't care about who runs the club, and even couldn't name half the team. They engage in the club for a few hours, don't spend hours on message boards, aren't invested in the politics, don't look at social media.
We're in a bit of an echo chamber here, we know the ins and outs, but most people aren't engaged, and those who are randomly selected may well be the least interested.
But suppose 60% of supporters aren't bothered, 20% are concerned and 20% are really angry, then just listening to the 40% will give a distorted view of what the supporters think
If you want any idea (in my opinion) what the meeting will be like (whenever it is) have a look at the VIP Meeting video back in February. Page 11 of the thread below.
If you want any idea (in my opinion) what the meeting will be like (whenever it is) have a look at the VIP Meeting video back in February. Page 11 of the thread below.
And its not that offensive. Loads of people I know who are season ticket holders, don't care about who runs the club, and even couldn't name half the team. They engage in the club for a few hours, don't spend hours on message boards, aren't invested in the politics, don't look at social media.
We're in a bit of an echo chamber here, we know the ins and outs, but most people aren't engaged, and those who are randomly selected may well be the least interested.
But suppose 60% of supporters aren't bothered, 20% are concerned and 20% are really angry, then just listening to the 40% will give a distorted view of what the supporters think
What if the new regime had immediately engaged with the Trust as the last regime had been, there had been a joint declaration, publicity and regular meetings, it pretty much launched the Trust to the size it is today. We were about to set up a new Fill the Valley Target 20k group.
Would things have been different? This is exactly what happened at Watford with the Pozzos and thats gone pretty well. No-one was complaining about this situation, many of the FF members who represent supporters groups primarily on social and travel, were members of the Trust.
I think things could have been very different, and it would have sent out a big message, instead the opposite approach is has brought about suspicion, complaints of PR, control and divide and rule. It has created a problem where non-existed.
I think the point about all of this and possibly the forthcoming meeting, is its not so much about what is said but how the meeting is conducted. If it appears to be PR or overly controlled it will be dismissed as more of the same.
Arguing amongst ourselves before its even happened is a bit silly. Let's see what comes of it. If,as I'm sure,we get the 'same old sh** different day' answers then its another stick to hit them with. I just hope the questions fired at her are forthright and pretty simple, like those listed in the 'spell it out' mantra. Let's leave the sofa and Alan Curbishley out of this for now. If she starts beating around bushes and doesn't give clear answers then I would seriously consider getting up and walking out.
Comments
I was immensely proud to see Joe speaking in front of banner that said "Giving Fans a Voice"
What we also need is constructive dialogue from both sides, if the first few fans just stand up and shout abuse, then that won't get anyone anywhere.
But that's divide and rule for you.
some who would be comfortable putting a really intelligent and eloquent argument to a CE
others who would hide at the back, and
one or two who would potentially be irrational and use the opportunaty to foam and vent.
But hey thats democracy, but could be interesting to see who gets "drawn".
http://forum.charltonlife.com/discussion/59459/vip-meetings/p8
We're in a bit of an echo chamber here, we know the ins and outs, but most people aren't engaged, and those who are randomly selected may well be the least interested.
People in the main will only be interested in firing questions at her.
Richard Murray is only there to act as her minder.
What if the new regime had immediately engaged with the Trust as the last regime had been, there had been a joint declaration, publicity and regular meetings, it pretty much launched the Trust to the size it is today. We were about to set up a new Fill the Valley Target 20k group.
Would things have been different? This is exactly what happened at Watford with the Pozzos and thats gone pretty well. No-one was complaining about this situation, many of the FF members who represent supporters groups primarily on social and travel, were members of the Trust.
I think things could have been very different, and it would have sent out a big message, instead the opposite approach is has brought about suspicion, complaints of PR, control and divide and rule. It has created a problem where non-existed.
I think the point about all of this and possibly the forthcoming meeting, is its not so much about what is said but how the meeting is conducted. If it appears to be PR or overly controlled it will be dismissed as more of the same.
If,as I'm sure,we get the 'same old sh** different day' answers then its another stick to hit them with. I just hope the questions fired at her are forthright and pretty simple, like those listed in the 'spell it out' mantra.
Let's leave the sofa and Alan Curbishley out of this for now.
If she starts beating around bushes and doesn't give clear answers then I would seriously consider getting up and walking out.