Louis Mend tweeting that Richard Cawley reporting that Bikey training with U21s.
Not sure how that works as such a small squad that you'd think they'd train together but that's the rumour
Yep that makes perfect sense. We have one senior centre back in the squad - and we leave behind another who has proven championship experience because the manager 'doesnt like him'.
I dont give a toss if you dont get on - either get 2 CB's in pronto (which will hopefully be happening), or swallow your pride and both grow up. I would rather not be starting the season with Callum Harriot in the middle of the defence thanks very much.
Louis Mend tweeting that Richard Cawley reporting that Bikey training with U21s.
Not sure how that works as such a small squad that you'd think they'd train together but that's the rumour
Yep that makes perfect sense. We have one senior centre back in the squad - and we leave behind another who has proven championship experience because the manager 'doesnt like him'.
I dont give a toss if you dont get on - either get 2 CB's in pronto (which will hopefully be happening), or swallow your pride and both grow up. I would rather not be starting the season with Callum Harriot in the middle of the defence thanks very much.
But Luzon is the manager then why would he take someone he doesn't like on pre season it's no like it's the qpr game ! ... Maybe he thinks he has a bad effect on the team ?
If Bikey can't/won't get his head together and rediscover his early season form then frankly I don't care if he DOES get stuck in the U21s. Some games he played we'd have done better to just play with 10 instead of having him charging around like a randy rhino and disrupting our own defence. All that charging around and challenging everything looks great when you actually get the ball, when you don't you look like an absolute liability and frankly for far too long he was the latter.
New CBs are the top priority for sure. Bikey being left behind does give credence to the rumours we've had that French defender join up with the squad over in Belgium though.
I know signing players is part of it, but surely coaches and managers and stuff are supposed to actually make players better. Lennie Lawrence made that point on that TV programmes that players want to know if you can make them a better player. We have imported a coach from SL, one who presumably worked closely with Tony Watt (and made him a success there :-) , so what are the coaches supposed to be doing? You're not going to make Bikey, or Wiggy, or Callum or whoever a better player by marginalising them. Coaching a player like Cousins must be a dream job, but I imagine Bikey might be more of a challenge but it still ought to be done properly and well. I mean school teachers don't teach the kids they wish they had, but the kids they actually have in front of them.
Louis Mend tweeting that Richard Cawley reporting that Bikey training with U21s.
Not sure how that works as such a small squad that you'd think they'd train together but that's the rumour
I would imagine the majority of the U21's are not on the tour and Bikey has been left behind to train with them.
That makes more sense.
Agree that the senior squad will have gone on their own. That will also keep the travel costs down - the size of our senior squad and they can probably all pile in the back of a Mondeo Estate.
Luzon is basically saying he'd rather play Diarra, Lennon, anyone other than Bikey at CB. While that sounds harsh (and can seem like a petty punishment from afar), I can see how he reaches that conclusion based on Bikey's late season form. (there was an element of dismay when I was reminded at the end of last season that we had him for another year). Maybe it's best all round if he stays back & perhaps finds another club that might take him...
But he he don't rate Andre we sure has hell need to ship in some alternatives soon...
I know signing players is part of it, but surely coaches and managers and stuff are supposed to actually make players better. Lennie Lawrence made that point on that TV programmes that players want to know if you can make them a better player. We have imported a coach from SL, one who presumably worked closely with Tony Watt (and made him a success there :-) , so what are the coaches supposed to be doing? You're not going to make Bikey, or Wiggy, or Callum or whoever a better player by marginalising them. Coaching a player like Cousins must be a dream job, but I imagine Bikey might be more of a challenge but it still ought to be done properly and well. I mean school teachers don't teach the kids they wish they had, but the kids they actually have in front of them.
Wasn't it said, when all the Bob Peeters stuff came out, that Bikey had clashed with various players in the dressing room during the middle of last season? Luzon comes in and then he's never seen again.
Curbs was pretty well known for freezing players out that he didn't get along with, maybe Luzon is the same.
I agree to a certain extent Seth, but the players have to be willing to learn and, if necessary, adapt. We don't have world class players in our squad who can see themselves as exceptions to this. If they do, then they are, frankly, deluded.
To continue the analogy. If a pupil continues to be a disruptive force in the classroom, they will find themselves removed. Either to a remedial class, or a special needs school down the (Old Kent) Road!!
Have heard from Colin's mate Ketts that Bikey and Luzon do not see eye to eye and he will never play for Charlton again. Have also heard that Blackburn are preparing a bid for Cousins to replace Tom Cairney.
To clarify a little. I'm not Colin's mate, he tends to recycle stuff I do on other sites. I don't know the guy & to the best of my knowledge, we've never met.
Re Bikey. Certainly he & Luzon don't get on, as demonstrated by Bikey's non-inclusion in the 24 who were on duty at Welling, so it's difficult to see how he can play under Luzon again, but who knows what the future holds. The likelihood is that Bikey will move on, but recent managers haven't had much longevity have they? If Bikey outlasts Luzon, the next incumbent may rate him as highly as Peeters did.
Wasn't it said, when all the Bob Peeters stuff came out, that Bikey had clashed with various players in the dressing room during the middle of last season? Luzon comes in and then he's never seen again.
Curbs was pretty well known for freezing players out that he didn't get along with, maybe Luzon is the same.
Exactly, Coaches fall out with players at clubs all over the country all the time. But because it's Guy Luzon that has now fallen out with a player it's a disgrace and the owner should be flogged in the streets of Liege.
For what my opinion is worth I think Bikey lost the plot long before Luzon came in. Its a shame as he had looked top class in the first 3rd of the season. For him to fall apart that much says a lot about his mental character.
Very few outside of the training ground will know exactly what has gone on. But this is hardly a case where there is no discernible reason for the fallout. Bikey has a history of being a hot head.
Well yes if kids are a disruptive influence on all the other kids they get removed, but eventually they get some kind of attention somewhere. However if a kid or player is not actually disruptive, what then? The easy option is to abandon them, the difficult bit is to work the hard yards with them. If I may reference back to the Lawrence era again, there were a number of instances where he took on players supposed to be finished like Andy Peake or Steve Mackenzie. Notwithstanding the pay a decent coach should try to find solutions to problems rather than appear to wash their hands of them. My final example is to contemplate the effect Riga had on Harriott.
Bit of the Bobs about this Bikey stuff. If the stuff about Wiggins is true as well it's slightly concerning that Luzon seems to be a one-track sort of manager. Players are going to act out and cause trouble every so often and it's up to the manager to deal with them. Given the size of our squad I'd rather he was trying to improve the players' attitude or ability rather than telling them to do one.
Bit of the Bobs about this Bikey stuff. If the stuff about Wiggins is true as well it's slightly concerning that Luzon seems to be a one-track sort of manager. Players are going to act out and cause trouble every so often and it's up to the manager to deal with them. Given the size of our squad I'd rather he was trying to improve the players' attitude or ability rather than telling them to do one.
Yes but this assumes that the problem was with the manager's attitude to the player and not necessarily the other way around - we're not the first club that Bikey's had this kind of hassle with. Lots of people are assuming that Luzon simply froze Bikey out for the sake of spite and is just 'washing his hands' when for all we know he's tried (perhaps several times) to get Bikey to grow up and get it together and Bikey's the one being childish. In that case, what can you do but get rid?
With Bikey's rep, I am guessing it's not Luzon hasn't 'just' said to do one after one isolated incident. It will have been going on for a while and Luzon figures 'pre-season, fresh start' and Bikey's not part of the new future intent.
He will not be the first manager to dw a disruptive player (IF this is the case) in this way.
It is up to the player to now decide if he wants to build bridges, leave, or spend the rest of his time in the under 21 squad not playing. Not many managers keep their doors shut as it is not in their or the clubs interest.
Comments
I dont give a toss if you dont get on - either get 2 CB's in pronto (which will hopefully be happening), or swallow your pride and both grow up. I would rather not be starting the season with Callum Harriot in the middle of the defence thanks very much.
New CBs are the top priority for sure. Bikey being left behind does give credence to the rumours we've had that French defender join up with the squad over in Belgium though.
We have imported a coach from SL, one who presumably worked closely with Tony Watt (and made him a success there :-) , so what are the coaches supposed to be doing? You're not going to make Bikey, or Wiggy, or Callum or whoever a better player by marginalising them. Coaching a player like Cousins must be a dream job, but I imagine Bikey might be more of a challenge but it still ought to be done properly and well. I mean school teachers don't teach the kids they wish they had, but the kids they actually have in front of them.
But he he don't rate Andre we sure has hell need to ship in some alternatives soon...
Curbs was pretty well known for freezing players out that he didn't get along with, maybe Luzon is the same.
To continue the analogy. If a pupil continues to be a disruptive force in the classroom, they will find themselves removed. Either to a remedial class, or a special needs school down the (Old Kent) Road!!
Re Bikey. Certainly he & Luzon don't get on, as demonstrated by Bikey's non-inclusion in the 24 who were on duty at Welling, so it's difficult to see how he can play under Luzon again, but who knows what the future holds. The likelihood is that Bikey will move on, but recent managers haven't had much longevity have they? If Bikey outlasts Luzon, the next incumbent may rate him as highly as Peeters did.
For what my opinion is worth I think Bikey lost the plot long before Luzon came in. Its a shame as he had looked top class in the first 3rd of the season. For him to fall apart that much says a lot about his mental character.
Very few outside of the training ground will know exactly what has gone on. But this is hardly a case where there is no discernible reason for the fallout. Bikey has a history of being a hot head.
If I may reference back to the Lawrence era again, there were a number of instances where he took on players supposed to be finished like Andy Peake or Steve Mackenzie. Notwithstanding the pay a decent coach should try to find solutions to problems rather than appear to wash their hands of them. My final example is to contemplate the effect Riga had on Harriott.
With Bikey's rep, I am guessing it's not Luzon hasn't 'just' said to do one after one isolated incident. It will have been going on for a while and Luzon figures 'pre-season, fresh start' and Bikey's not part of the new future intent.
It is up to the player to now decide if he wants to build bridges, leave, or spend the rest of his time in the under 21 squad not playing. Not many managers keep their doors shut as it is not in their or the clubs interest.
We don't know the ins and outs. At this point I am inclined to let him manage.
We don't know the ins and outs. At this point I am inclined to let him manage.
Could not agree more!
(Pleasedon'tflagmepleasedon'tflagmepleasedon'tflagme)
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fabián_Assmann
As for Bikey, he has followed the exact same pattern as at Boro and other clubs.
Starts off looking great & within a short period of time, he goes wibble.
We knew he was unstable, when we signed him, so there can be no blame attached to Luzon.
Get rid.
(PS if Bikey reads this, I'm only joking mate.)