Next year I suspect we will not get the lower tier at the Toolbox and if we use the same logic the the Spanners should also have limited numbers at the Valley and held back.
If as we have been told Police intelligence told them that there was a high risk around some of their fans.Why were they sold tickets?
It was not the fans in the ground they were worried about, there were strong rumours doing the rounds that Milwall were going to come at the home fans from both ends of Floyd Road after the game, a lot of these fans were supposed to be ticketless hence why they were not in the ground.
Interesting perspective,where did you here that from?
It was mentioned on here by a few people several days before the game, it was being talked about on various internet sites plus for my sins I know a couple of well conected Millwall fans.
I am sure the police read all the public domain stuff so its not hard for them to put a picture together.
I rather suspect that the Millwall fans in the ground (in the Jimmy Seed) were never seen as particularly high risk. As I understand it they have been selling away tickets on the basis of one per season ticket holder. According to my Millwall supporting mate, their allocation was sold out very quickly (within 6 hours I think he said). So, first, it is very unlikely that any but a very small percentage of tickets got into the hands of non-season ticket holders and, second, very few of those Millwall season ticket holders were going to risk losing their season tickets and getting life bans from the toolbox by causing trouble in the ground: very much a bark worse than bite situation. I initially thought therefore that it would have been relatively safe to leave them kicking their heels and a few plastic seats while the home fans dispersed. However, it now appears from the Club's statement that there was intelligence suggesting that non-ticket holding Millwall fans were intent upon causing trouble in or around Floyd Road. So, I guess the plod just wanted to stop any potential for a pincer movement and to keep the two factions apart and that was the main reason for the initial segregation arrangements. Unfortunately it all went pear-shaped because it seems no one thought, in advance, about the safety impact at the railway crossing. And they probably should have done. I do wonder whether this threat was real or just some black propaganda put about by the spanners more undesirable elements in order to cause as much choas and costs to the police and Charlton fans as possible as well as much amusement to themselves from a nice safe distance. A sort of Millwall equivalent of knocking on someone's door and running away. Whatever, the plod probably couldn't take the risk.
“Floyd Road was then reopened once the police had confirmed that a number of away ‘risk’ supporters had left the area via Charlton station.”
So why wasn't any section 27s issued to "risk" spanners before the game?
“Unfortunately, the British Transport Police subsequently became concerned about the number of people using the level crossing and stressed that any incident close to the crossing would result in the closure of the railway line."
At what time did BTP become comcerned about the level crossing? I left at the final whistle from the North upper and walked straight to Charlton Lane to find the it was closed off by riot cops and mounted police. Why wasn't the police line further down Charlton lane allowing fans to move down the road and therefore easing the problem on the corner? Who gave the instruction to close off Coxmount as it wasn't closed when I first got to the corner?
This is why police closed off access to the rail crossing in Charlton Lane, although they did allow some supporters to filter through this way.
How many did they let through? 10 -20? when there was about 5-6000 heading that way.
Why were riot cops in Charlton Lane? Were they expecting trouble between the home fans?
No someone with "intel" had told them that big scary Millwall fans were coming down to reap havoc at either ends of the ground on us poor fans. So thats why we were herded like wimps the other way out of our own ground.
Unless our mob were gonna attack their mob in the Angerstein (which they plainly wouldnt as the world and the police knew thats where they would be), then doubt would have been disorder. There have been scuffles outside after many games and no such action taken the next season.
If the problem was non attending Millwall supporters attacking Charlton fans, then surely packing the Jimmy Seed Millwall fans off first at the station would make no difference to 'our' safety? Wouldn't they wait behind and approach the ground after the attending Millwall fans had gone?
the club and police must see that with very few problems involving fans it must have been a success,but i wonder what would have happened if we had won the game,there would not have been many happy smallwall fans but nasty angry ones and that might have been a diferent story.
If the problem was non attending Millwall supporters attacking Charlton fans, then surely packing the Jimmy Seed Millwall fans off first at the station would make no difference to 'our' safety? Wouldn't they wait behind and approach the ground after the attending Millwall fans had gone?
the club and police must see that with very few problems involving fans it must have been a success,but i wonder what would have happened if we had won the game,there would not have been many happy smallwall fans but nasty angry ones and that might have been a diferent story.
Some did wait around, and start offering people out on Woolwich Road.
I suggest IF we'd won, it would been even more of a farce.
The police won't really give two figs for the inconvenience caused to a couple of thousand football fans when the bigger picture they will see will be that a potential public order problem went off without incident. The club will care more or at least some staff members will care more but again will look at the overall result of no trouble as being a success. With hindsight the club will think they could have done things differently and so they should. Thankfully Charlton are not a club that attracts too much in the way of crowd trouble and compared to many other clubs are novices in arrangement that were implemented on Saturday. Explanations certainly. Appologies certainly. Learned lessons hopefully.
Next year I suspect we will not get the lower tier at the Toolbox and if we use the same logic the the Spanners should also have limited numbers at the Valley and held back.
If as we have been told Police intelligence told them that there was a high risk around some of their fans.Why were they sold tickets?
It was not the fans in the ground they were worried about, there were strong rumours doing the rounds that Milwall were going to come at the home fans from both ends of Floyd Road after the game, a lot of these fans were supposed to be ticketless hence why they were not in the ground.
Interesting perspective,where did you here that from?
I remember Police actions at Wapping, I don't want my grandchildren involved in any way. I know how easy these things get out of hand. The Police were out of order to block Charlton Lane. Am I an old worry guts? O.K. so why did the Police on horseback wear helmets with face guards?
I remember Police actions at Wapping, I don't want my grandchildren involved in any way. I know how easy these things get out of hand. The Police were out of order to block Charlton Lane. Am I an old worry guts? O.K. so why did the Police on horseback wear helmets with face guards?
Having read the article on the club site I found the mention of an adapted flare quite sinister. Was is found on a Charlton fan or a spanner? More worrying in what way was it adapted?
Comments
I am sure the police read all the public domain stuff so its not hard for them to put a picture together.
So, first, it is very unlikely that any but a very small percentage of tickets got into the hands of non-season ticket holders and, second, very few of those Millwall season ticket holders were going to risk losing their season tickets and getting life bans from the toolbox by causing trouble in the ground: very much a bark worse than bite situation.
I initially thought therefore that it would have been relatively safe to leave them kicking their heels and a few plastic seats while the home fans dispersed.
However, it now appears from the Club's statement that there was intelligence suggesting that non-ticket holding Millwall fans were intent upon causing trouble in or around Floyd Road.
So, I guess the plod just wanted to stop any potential for a pincer movement and to keep the two factions apart and that was the main reason for the initial segregation arrangements. Unfortunately it all went pear-shaped because it seems no one thought, in advance, about the safety impact at the railway crossing. And they probably should have done.
I do wonder whether this threat was real or just some black propaganda put about by the spanners more undesirable elements in order to cause as much choas and costs to the police and Charlton fans as possible as well as much amusement to themselves from a nice safe distance. A sort of Millwall equivalent of knocking on someone's door and running away.
Whatever, the plod probably couldn't take the risk.
So why wasn't any section 27s issued to "risk" spanners before the game?
“Unfortunately, the British Transport Police subsequently became concerned about the number of people using the level crossing and stressed that any incident close to the crossing would result in the closure of the railway line."
At what time did BTP become comcerned about the level crossing? I left at the final whistle from the North upper and walked straight to Charlton Lane to find the it was closed off by riot cops and mounted police. Why wasn't the police line further down Charlton lane allowing fans to move down the road and therefore easing the problem on the corner? Who gave the instruction to close off Coxmount as it wasn't closed when I first got to the corner?
This is why police closed off access to the rail crossing in Charlton Lane, although they did allow some supporters to filter through this way.
How many did they let through? 10 -20? when there was about 5-6000 heading that way.
I suggest IF we'd won, it would been even more of a farce.
86 posts until this thread hits 1000
Come on Alan spill.