..... our support was woeful any other club would have tried to lift the team in a derby match but even tho a few tried we usually need goals before we get going .....
yes, noise was extremely disappointing ... I expected far more for a derby ... the covered end was totally outsung ... most of the game all I could hear was the Palaaarse crap, and I sit closer to the covered end than the Jimmy Seed
A crap performance. However, as a lot of posters have eluded to here, there have been many crap performances since January, its just that teams last season weren't able to put us away, and our defence was magnificent. We are now starting to regularly be overrun in midfield (which, to be honest, was happening last season too - Sheff U at home being a prime example, where our defence got us out of the brown stuff)- this leads to Hoofball. This is what realy worries me, after all, i dont recall any game in the 2nd half of the season last year where we played well, however, because we were still winning, the cracks were papered up by our defence.This is still the same side,bar Fuller and Wilson, and we are still playing shit - some very basic questions need to be asked of management and Directors (as i keep trying to elude to, its the same problem as we have had since January, its not just the last 5 games).
One thing i recall about Fuller from his Stoke days, is that they used to use him as the sole forward to hold up and then flood the box - not pretty, but pretty is not our priority this season based on last nights performance.
Sorry to admit this and really not looking forward to work on Monday for the abuse i will receive, but the better team won. Palace had pace and energy to burn and played the ball really well on the deck. We just lumped it up the middle all game and wondered why it was not working. We have strikers in Fuller, BWP and Kermorgant who can score goals, but apart from the goal that was disallowed we didn't get the ball in the box to them anywhere near enough to win last night. I thought it was gonna be a draw until they scored a very good goal.
We have no pace in the team. Pritchard is not a winger (unfair of Powell to play him there) and Jackson doesn't have the pace for this level. Accept this as a criticism of bad tactics not a bad manager, but after the first half of lumping it down the middle and Palace simply picking he ball up and hitting us on the counter attack constantly why did Powell wait until 15 minutes to go before bringing on a winger? Had we run at them like they ran at us i honestly believe we would have seen a different game. Their defence didn't look all that, but we didn't test them enough.
Last season we didn't play any teams with pace which was why our current team did so well. This year opposing teams will be faster and will come at us more. We need to be able to match pace with pace. Not saying Green is the saviour for us, but we need some players who will run at the oppostion and get the ball to our strikers, Green does this. Not seen enough of Kerkar and Cook to know if they can make the step up, but we must player with wingers if we hope to win these games.
Lumping the ball up for Kermy to flick on only works if there are runners to get on the end of the chance. Our midfield aren't quick enough to get beyond the ball so BWP is isolated and easily disposessed and the opposition come back at us. Fuller showed he can hold the ball up and bring others into play. This means we retain possession and can get players in support. I wouldn't be surprised if we see Fuller start in place of Kermy next game and Kerkar and possibly Green also start.
Sadly, as others had said, I believe that this division is just too high for JJ and Pritchard. The evidence was there for all to see last night.
Lumping the ball up for Kermy to flick on only works if there are runners to get on the end of the chance. Our midfield aren't quick enough to get beyond the ball so BWP is isolated and easily disposessed and the opposition come back at us. Fuller showed he can hold the ball up and bring others into play. This means we retain possession and can get players in support. I wouldn't be surprised if we see Fuller start in place of Kermy next game and Kerkar and possibly Green also start.
Sadly, as others had said, I believe that this division is just too high for JJ and Pritchard. The evidence was there for all to see last night.
Agree with this.
Possible team for me Tuesday?
Hamer Solly Morrison Cort Evina (i assume) Green Jackson Stephens Kerkar/Cook Fuller BWP
Well jackson...he's nothing at this level, we need wagstaff or cook to play on the left and jackson can go away, green has to play on the right instead of pritchard and hollands comes out for pritchard, keep stephens in there, back four is solid, I hope wiggins isn't out for long, then have cort morrison and solly, kermorgant did nothing, bwp did ok, fuller has to start the next game
Sadly, as others had said, I believe that this division is just too high for JJ and Pritchard. The evidence was there for all to see last night.
I actually think that either of them could grow and prosper at this level, but they are just not the people you need in a midfield that is being overrun. As others have said, they would both do much better in a five-man midfield where they are not being required to do a job that they are not currently capable of.
We need to either go to five in midfield and hold the ball more or three up top and commit to hoofing it and letting the strikers get on with it, with defensive midfielders to protect when the ball comes back. At this level we do not have the players to play as we are and end up doing neither.
The good news is that the defence looks genuinely strong and the strikers seem to have stepped up, so this is all fixable.
Pritchard looked like a very small boy in a big mans game last night, Solly should never play left back in a derby, taking off JJ instead of Hollands or Pritchard was wrong, at least he was getting around the pitch, and we needed his crossing ability for Fuller and Kermorgant. Wilson was average, but he definitely prefers going forward. Stephens showed why we missed him against Forest, he may tire and float in and out of the game, but he holds onto the ball better than anyone else (when we weren't hoofing it) and moves the ball well. Kermorgant was bested in the air, and we should have played to his feet more. BWP was probably our most energetic player. Cort and Morro were good but nothing to write home about, and Hamers a complete legend in my eyes right now. Green needs to start, we missed his dead balls and crosses, fuller should have scored, and makes things happen. Overall though we played crap hoofball, couldn't contain Bolasie and Zaha very well, and just didnt seem able to.adapt
Until CP realises that with this mid field we will be lucky to survive in this league things will not get any better. I dont know the answer but thats what CP and his staff get paid for. It will also let the owners know that in football these days you do not progress without spending, many have tried and failed before.I do not expect to get promoted this season or even next season but we must establish ourselves first in theChampionship. We were outplayed last night and were physicly wanting against a very ordinary team. Did anyone think it was "The war of the Worlds" when walking out last night, how much did the police cost the club last night.
Until CP realises that with this mid field we will be lucky to survive in this league things will not get any better. I dont know the answer but thats what CP and his staff get paid for. It will also let the owners know that in football these days you do not progress without spending, many have tried and failed before.I do not expect to get promoted this season or even next season but we must establish ourselves first in theChampionship. We were outplayed last night and were physicly wanting against a very ordinary team. Did anyone think it was "The war of the Worlds" when walking out last night, how much did the police cost the club last night.
Do you genuinely believe that Powell is not aware of our midfield frailties?. He can't do anything about it.
Before we start writing Pritchard off, it might be a good idea to see him playing to his strengths and in his best position ie central midfield. As said above, nothing wrong with the defence and up front BWP looks well up to this level. One of Kermy or Fuller should also be good enough. The problem is midfield and without a decent midfield the whole team can look poor. We have to play with conventional wingers at home to spread the play and provide chances for the forwards. We have the players, it's about getting the blend right in midfield.
We're being overrun in midfield and some want to see 2 wingers start in a 4-4-2?
What do you suggest? Its obviously not working with jackson and pritchard?
Both of them are the cause for us getting overrun, neither of them can take their fullbacks on, that eventually invites pressure onto our midfield and defence.
Both of them can't put the pressure back on their fullbacks due to not being able to get the ball down and run at them.
I am a fan of Pritchard but he is physically lightweight in this league whether on the wing or in the centre muscle is nuffing out his skilss. I believe it's time to give Green and Kerker a start; Pritchard is likely to be more effective coming on as a sub. CP's choice is then to move JJ to midfield dropping either Hollands or Stephens (the latter is my preference) or biting the bullet and dropping the skipper - JJ has still got goals in him but no longer effective playing out wide in my view; Powells loyalty to league winning players could cost us dearly but then I'm sure he knows that!
It was very noticeable last night, as it was against Nottingham Forest, just how much bigger & physically stronger our opponents were. We were basically out-muscled all over the pitch. This is a major adjustment from last season that we are going to have to come to terms with quickly.
What worried me more than anything else last night was Powell's tactics after we went 1 down. Ok we were losing the game but shifting to 4-3-3 when Zaha and Bolasie were causing us all sorts of problems didnt make any sense to me!As soon as Green came on, you could see a more positive balance in the side!He should have brought on Fuller for either BWP or Kermorgant who I thought both had very poor games!Cant get any worse than last night though!
When you have possession in midfield you need to spread it wide quickly or burst through the middle, both with pace. We do neither because we have no width and no pace in either position. Until both these issues are addressed we will continue to struggle to create and our strikers who I believe are of Championship standard will be Isolated. It's fortunate we have a very decent defence. I am confident thar Sir Chris knows this. I am not confident that there is money to make the required changes.
What worried me more than anything else last night was Powell's tactics after we went 1 down. Ok we were losing the game but shifting to 4-3-3 when Zaha and Bolasie were causing us all sorts of problems didnt make any sense to me!As soon as Green came on, you could see a more positive balance in the side!He should have brought on Fuller for either BWP or Kermorgant who I thought both had very poor games!Cant get any worse than last night though!
but green still came on as part of a 4-3-3 instead of pritchard? so it was the same openess to zaha and bolasie
It's amazing how people see things differently! I thought Wilson was absolutely shocking! I mean really bad. He was ok going forward and got better but defensively he is terrible.
Same issues as at Forest, midfield overrun and non-existent in attack so it just got hoofed over at every opportunity, only Stephens looks anywhere near comfortable and thought he was our best player last night in the "front 6" by some distance. Derby away very much on the horizon already, assuming Wiggins won't be fit I would have to try and inject something into the team, drop Pritchard Jackson and Kermorgant in favour of Green Kerkar and Fuller. Hopefully Evina is a million miles away from the squad and we'll have to just continue with Solly on the wrong side and Wilson at RB.
I was surprised with the way Palace started the game, it was nice as a Palace fan to see them take the game to the opposition for once, usually we sit back and try to counter attack.
As has been pointed out many times, Charlton just couldn't contain Zaha, and it was also nice to see Bolasie causing defenders problems too, if his shooting hadn't been more composed, it may have been more. I think the better side clearly won, although if your goal had stood, which obviously it should have, it may have been a different game, but I think a result other than a Palace win would have been wrong. I did say pre game that I would be delighted with a point.
Palace hopefully now have a reasonable squad, which should be good enough to get to at least mid-table comfortably, but for Charlton to survive this year, I think you'll need to bring in some quality, however I do like the look of Stevens and Solly, otherwise very ordinary.
I was surprised with the way Palace started the game, it was nice as a Palace fan to see them take the game to the opposition for once, usually we sit back and try to counter attack.
As has been pointed out many times, Charlton just couldn't contain Zaha, and it was also nice to see Bolasie causing defenders problems too, if his shooting hadn't been more composed, it may have been more. I think the better side clearly won, although if your goal had stood, which obviously it should have, it may have been a different game, but I think a result other than a Palace win would have been wrong. I did say pre game that I would be delighted with a point.
Palace hopefully now have a reasonable squad, which should be good enough to get to at least mid-table comfortably, but for Charlton to survive this year, I think you'll need to bring in some quality, however I do like the look of Stevens and Solly, otherwise very ordinary.
You must have been watching a completely different game to all the rest then fella, Palaces 2 wingers killed us, just lucky the end product wasnt there!
A fair assessment budgie. After last night I reckon we'll be safe if we finish one place above you or one place below. Don't see you fighting relegation.
You must have been watching a completely different game to all the rest then fella, Palaces 2 wingers killed us, just lucky the end product wasnt there!
Bolasie looked good, but to be fair he was up against Wilson , Solly did t let Zaha do much, however when Zaha was against Morrison Zaha looked quality
Solly stood up to him pretty well, especially as he was out of his favoured position!I was just thought Zaha in general was the best player on the pitch by a country mile!
Comments
This is what realy worries me, after all, i dont recall any game in the 2nd half of the season last year where we played well, however, because we were still winning, the cracks were papered up by our defence.This is still the same side,bar Fuller and Wilson, and we are still playing shit - some very basic questions need to be asked of management and Directors (as i keep trying to elude to, its the same problem as we have had since January, its not just the last 5 games).
One thing i recall about Fuller from his Stoke days, is that they used to use him as the sole forward to hold up and then flood the box - not pretty, but pretty is not our priority this season based on last nights performance.
We have no pace in the team. Pritchard is not a winger (unfair of Powell to play him there) and Jackson doesn't have the pace for this level. Accept this as a criticism of bad tactics not a bad manager, but after the first half of lumping it down the middle and Palace simply picking he ball up and hitting us on the counter attack constantly why did Powell wait until 15 minutes to go before bringing on a winger? Had we run at them like they ran at us i honestly believe we would have seen a different game. Their defence didn't look all that, but we didn't test them enough.
Last season we didn't play any teams with pace which was why our current team did so well. This year opposing teams will be faster and will come at us more. We need to be able to match pace with pace. Not saying Green is the saviour for us, but we need some players who will run at the oppostion and get the ball to our strikers, Green does this. Not seen enough of Kerkar and Cook to know if they can make the step up, but we must player with wingers if we hope to win these games.
Sadly, as others had said, I believe that this division is just too high for JJ and Pritchard. The evidence was there for all to see last night.
Possible team for me Tuesday?
Hamer
Solly
Morrison
Cort
Evina (i assume)
Green
Jackson
Stephens
Kerkar/Cook
Fuller
BWP
Subs - Button, Dervite, Wilson, Hollands, Kermorgant, Cook/Kerkar, Pritchard
We need to either go to five in midfield and hold the ball more or three up top and commit to hoofing it and letting the strikers get on with it, with defensive midfielders to protect when the ball comes back. At this level we do not have the players to play as we are and end up doing neither.
The good news is that the defence looks genuinely strong and the strikers seem to have stepped up, so this is all fixable.
Did anyone think it was "The war of the Worlds" when walking out last night, how much did the police cost the club last night.
Both of them are the cause for us getting overrun, neither of them can take their fullbacks on, that eventually invites pressure onto our midfield and defence.
Both of them can't put the pressure back on their fullbacks due to not being able to get the ball down and run at them.
As has been pointed out many times, Charlton just couldn't contain Zaha, and it was also nice to see Bolasie causing defenders problems too, if his shooting hadn't been more composed, it may have been more. I think the better side clearly won, although if your goal had stood, which obviously it should have, it may have been a different game, but I think a result other than a Palace win would have been wrong. I did say pre game that I would be delighted with a point.
Palace hopefully now have a reasonable squad, which should be good enough to get to at least mid-table comfortably, but for Charlton to survive this year, I think you'll need to bring in some quality, however I do like the look of Stevens and Solly, otherwise very ordinary.
Looking forward to the Selhurst game.