Considering the club knew there was going to huge demand for this game, is there no way they can distribute tickets depending on what people want to do?
Fans should be asked to "indicate" whether they would like to sit and the ticket office can then dish out tickets near the front for the elderly fans who want to sit and tickets near the back for those who want to stand.
It's not about what people want to do though is it ? In all seater stadia by law you must sit down.
- Standing in seated areas, is, however, contrary to ground regulations. For example, the Football League’s model set of ground regulations states: ‘Nobody may stand in any seating area whilst play is in progress. Persistent standing in seated areas whilst play is in progress is strictly forbidden and may result in ejection from the ground’.
Fair dos but it is against the rules which to all intents and purposes is the same thing ?
This happens about once in 5 years. Even at Millwall plenty sat in the upper tier much to my annoyance Usually even when we sell out, everyone usually sits. Yesterday not ideal for some people but it really is once in a blue moon. And every single club in th Country has the same issue. Think yourselves lucky you don't support other clubs who stand EVERY WEEK! And those who say it's the law.........so is doing 70mph but I bet everyone has broken that law at some point.
there was a suggestion a couple of pages ago to just politely ask those in front to sit so that you can see. Believe me we have tried that a couple of times before and got a volley of abuse in return. As said normally there is spare capacity to move elsewhere. I wonder where all those standing will be next week when my near 80 year old Mum is supporting the lads at Sheffield. Probably SITTING in their armchairs watching final score or will they be standing in their living room blocking their wife's/girlfriends view of the telly. No, thought not.
The purpose of fans being there is to support the team (enjoyably) ; the support was the best it has been in a very long time and yes standing did make for better support no question and that is what every charlton fan should want regardless of whether they are enjoying it or not. Teams play better when the support is better especially away from home. If there is some sacrifice to be made by the minority who cannot see the game then let them feel happy that the team is playing better than it otherwise would. I normally sit in the east stand but it felt right to stand for this game.
The purpose of fans being there is to support the team (enjoyably) ; the support was the best it has been in a very long time and yes standing did make for better support no question and that is what every charlton fan should want regardless of whether they are enjoying it or not. Teams play better when the support is better especially away from home. If there is some sacrifice to be made by the minority who cannot see the game then let them feel happy that the team is playing better than it otherwise would. I normally sit in the east stand but it felt right to stand for this game.
Great argument! How on Earth did we lose 4-0 yesterday then if standing helps the team?
there was a suggestion a couple of pages ago to just politely ask those in front to sit so that you can see. Believe me we have tried that a couple of times before and got a volley of abuse in return. As said normally there is spare capacity to move elsewhere. I wonder where all those standing will be next week when my near 80 year old Mum is supporting the lads at Sheffield. Probably SITTING in their armchairs watching final score or will they be standing in their living room blocking their wife's/girlfriends view of the telly. No, thought not.
Large, would be interested to know what your thoughts are on my situation yesterday. people standing in the row in front of us that wouldn't sit so we could sit down and see and allow those behind us to see. Its not just 1 row of people that you have to ask and hope they'll sit down it is every row in front of them. and considering we were in NN it just isn't possible. There was no abuse from anyone just apologies that people wouldn't sit as then they couldn't see themselves.
I wouldn't hold out much hope of away tickets being sold in any way other than as they come. Between matchday, telephone and Superstore sales the tickets are all held in different places and each host club wants them sold in a different order, plus our staff know little about how the stands are configured. We can't sell particular seats for standing and even if we did there is no way of knowing how the home club will manage the situation on the day.
You can have whatever ground regulations you like, but if the police won't enforce them, because they decide they can't, it isn't going to make any difference.
My rug keeps falling on the floor if I'm standing. I support the team but some of us go primarily to watch the game and are less interested these days in the buzz from being part of a crowd like that you get on a protest march or a rock festival or gang brawling, Some clearly don't have the option of participating in physical crowd enthusiasm. Not sure how the two sides can be happily accommodated, one side will always be happy when then other side isn't. Incidentally, I was always taught to only say things about people I would say to their face so find it difficult to verbally abuse people I don't know and don't really care about. Would any one who happened to meet Danny Murphy and his wife in a pub alone be so incensed he would deliver in person the abuse he is prepared to meet out anonymously at a football ground?
The comments from 'bromleyjohn' beggar belief. You 'felt it right' to stand for this game, and 'there is some sacrifice to be made by the minority'....biggest load of b*ll*x since the Telegraph match report!! Why should supporting your team at an away match be made an endurance test, notwithstanding the football!!?
It is absolutely amazing how we can put in a brave performance like we did and give it a real go and there are coming up for 200 posts on this subject. It is like groundhog day.
It shouldn't be that amazing. This 'minority' is I believe a large minority and they can't discuss the match because they couldn't see it!
We have fans that approach games differently. It is arrogant to say you are right when what you are doing is merely right for you. I haven't got a problem with people standing if they are at the back of the stand but I can't see what is wrong with having consideration for others - elderly or with physical problems or even kids. Surely that is just basic respect and shouldn't need justifying.
Some fans like to make a lot of noise and bounce about, they are important to the club as they generate an atmosphere that helps the players as long as they are positive which they usually are. Some fans may have done that in the past but are getting a bit long in the tooth and their joints might not be so good or others have their own ways to support the team and go because they enjoy wtaching football and still love the club. I'm not saying the loud bouncy fans don't, of course they do, but some see it more as a mission - or enjoy the crack - than enjoying watching the football, I have seen some orchestrating who spend more time with their back to the game. not slagging them off, the club needs them. But it does hack me off when they judge other fans by their own preferences, the fans that don't want to bounce or be loud are also vitally important for the club. Some of these supported the team as part of 4K gates at Selhurst and cleared the Valley pitch and stands and fought to get us bacck home.
My point is we are all Charlton fans and it is wrong to tell others how they should be supporting the club. but what everybody should do is respect others - I see some people from the loud bouncy brigade livid that other people are not like them - or quiet ones looking down on the ones who create an atmosphere - that is arrogant in my book. lets respect each other and sometimes make a small sacrifice for our fellow supporters - that could mean at an away game thinking about elderly or disabled people behind you if you are standing.
I know it is too much to ask but it really shouldn't be.
yes thanks. But then again I was in ZZ and didn't have much choice. And I wasnt with my parents who were in Row G.
But my dad might have been standing immediately behind you with his gammy knee, unable to see if he sat down. That's not fair is it?
And what if he'd asked you to sit down, so then you couldn't see the game - would you have done?
Well seeing as I was in the back row on this occasion it would have been difficult. My initial post was just in response to another poster who said ask people politely and they normally comply, I pointed out this wasn't the case in my experience. I advised my parents, well my Dad actually, not to go yesterday as I knew what was going to happen. He thought that seeing as they were in Row G it would not be an issue, he was wrong.
In response to Suzi, of course yesterday was an occasion when even if you wanted to oblige and sit you couldn't because you were so many rows back and it was impossible to get thirty rows in front to all sit. I was just saying there have been numerous occasions at other away games when we have politely asked those in front to sit and have Got a volley of abuse in return. When we suggested once that there was an area where loads of others were standing so why not go join them and stand there instead we got another volley of abuse, a threat of physical violence and told they had paid for that seat and were going to stand there. This is when it becomes unacceptable, in my opinion of course, probably not in others though.
Some great posts on here, esp the last couple by Suzi.
the one overiding factor that seems to be missed by many on here, esp by the "I want to stand, so I'm standing " brigade is that the vast majority of football grounds are, in fact, ALL SEATER stadiums and UNLESS they have a terrace/standing area (League 1 and below) then YOU ARE REQUIRED TO SIT. it is not a request that you sit down at football matches, BUT A REQUIREMENT.(I'm not sure if it actual law, - i expect it is but I'm not a lawyer)
Compare it to the cinema, theatre, opera etc - all these entertainment venuea have seats which the patrons are expected to sit to watch the performances. Imagine going to watch the latest James Bond film at the cinema to find the front 6 rows all standing up.It doesn't happen because everyone knows that you have to sit to watch the film. At this point I expect to hear the protagenists whine." but I always stand, I have always stood at football and I'm not going to change my ways " Well, I have news for you.....THINGS CHANGE. 100 years ago doctors perscribed cocaine - now it is a banned substance. 30 years ago you could drive a car without wearing a seatbelt - now you will get fined if you are found driving without one. Childrem under 12 are required (by law) to sit in a specialised car seat.
Unfortunately (for some) we live in a democracy and we can not pick and choose what laws we are going to obey and which ones we are going to ignore. For the greater good we have to obey the rule of law, and if you want to watch a game of football in the UK then you will have to "suffer" sitting down to watch it. We all understand that during certain periods of play it becomes almost universal to rise off your seat (during an attack, or at a corner) but this only usually lasts for 10/15 seconds before you sit down again.
So, reversing a point made by an previous post.................if YOU don't want to SIT DOWN at a football match, I advise you not to go !!!!!!
Considering the club knew there was going to huge demand for this game, is there no way they can distribute tickets depending on what people want to do?
Fans should be asked to "indicate" whether they would like to sit and the ticket office can then dish out tickets near the front for the elderly fans who want to sit and tickets near the back for those who want to stand.
It's not about what people want to do though is it ? In all seater stadia by law you must sit down.
In practice it is almost impossible to phrase a law which bans standing in seated areas for the reasons that people will need to get up from time to time during play.
The ground regulations though are phrased reasonably and should enable stewards to "police" the rules.
I've been an Addick for _ _ _ yrs with the likes of Brian Kinsey..Lenny Glover..Alan Camble...and I can't bring myself to go and watch a live match sitting, I just felt more at one with the team standing on the old terraces,pitty its not half & half then suporters who do have health problems could have the seated areas with out no worries of interuptions, but that would never happen.
Peoples lack of consideration apparently deprived a small minority of fellow fans the chance to enjoy a match they had paid to see. On what possible basis can that be right? No matter peoples personal preference they bought a ticket to watch a football in an all seater stadium the terms & conditions of which are very clear.
Were I deprived of my ability to watch the game I would demand my money back from the club, (acting as agent for Fulham) as Fulham failed to provide the goods & services they contracted to provide upon the sale of the ticket. It is a fundamental breach of contract. The vendor has an implicit duty of care to provide services he contracted to provide under the terms and conditions of the sale, i.e. a seat from which to watch the game.
I would also report the issue to the Football Association, the local authority and the local police authority under whose jurisdiction the stadium license will have been granted. From the accounts described I suggest somebody is in breach of the duty of care to the public under which the stadium license was granted and the applicable health and safety certificate.
Many of you will be travelling next week to the scene of the worst footballing disaster in living memory. All seater stadiums were introduced at enormous cost to the game for a purpose. Based on some of the comments on this thread it is not hard to see why. Perhaps some of you should take a little time to visit the memorial to the Liverpool 96 who simply went to watch a football match in 1989 and lost their lives.
Such scenes should never be seen at a football ground again. So excuse me if I have little time for the selfish self righteous justification of those who chose to enhance their personal gratification of Saturdays' game by standing at the expense of others.
As if one persons experience were not bad enough some rather than apologizing to the individual who has a) endured considerable discomfort b) been deprived of watching a game he has paid to see, attack him for complaining about the experience and then glory in their heightened experience.
I wouldn't hold out much hope of away tickets being sold in any way other than as they come. Between matchday, telephone and Superstore sales the tickets are all held in different places and each host club wants them sold in a different order, plus our staff know little about how the stands are configured. We can't sell particular seats for standing and even if we did there is no way of knowing how the home club will manage the situation on the day.
You can have whatever ground regulations you like, but if the police won't enforce them, because they decide they can't, it isn't going to make any difference.
What about if the authorities demand that clubs make fans sit or they take away their safety certificate and force them to play behind closed doors for a few games?
If we are all going to condone standing in areas that were not designed (and are not safe) for it then we are effectively saying that if you want to sit, stay away.
As I've said before my Dad can't stand for 90 minutes, so we don't go to many away games, but that shouldn't be our limit of options.
As for this only happening at big games, it doesn't. It happens at most away games that we go to. Sure Sheff Wed (hundereds of miles away and a large away allocation) will have spare seats but im guessing this is uncommon, especially in this league.
Even if one chooses to ask the young lads infront (who have had a few beers) to sit down the request is at best refused and on more than one occasion we've been told to f off.
Peoples lack of consideration apparently deprived a small minority of fellow fans the chance to enjoy a match they had paid to see. On what possible basis can that be right? No matter peoples personal preference they bought a ticket to watch a football in an all seater stadium the terms & conditions of which are very clear.
Were I deprived of my ability to watch the game I would demand my money back from the club, (acting as agent for Fulham) as Fulham failed to provide the goods & services they contracted to provide upon the sale of the ticket. It is a fundamental breach of contract. The vendor has an implicit duty of care to provide services he contracted to provide under the terms and conditions of the sale, i.e. a seat from which to watch the game.
I would also report the issue to the Football Association, the local authority and the local police authority under whose jurisdiction the stadium license will have been granted. From the accounts described I suggest somebody is in breach of the duty of care to the public under which the stadium license was granted and the applicable health and safety certificate.
Many of you will be travelling next week to the scene of the worst footballing disaster in living memory. All seater stadiums were introduced at enormous cost to the game for a purpose. Based on some of the comments on this thread it is not hard to see why. Perhaps some of you should take a little time to visit the memorial to the Liverpool 96 who simply went to watch a football match in 1989 and lost their lives.
Such scenes should never be seen at a football ground again. So excuse me if I have little time for the selfish self righteous justification of those who chose to enhance their personal gratification of Saturdays' game by standing at the expense of others.
As if one persons experience were not bad enough some rather than apologizing to the individual who has a) endured considerable discomfort b) been deprived of watching a game he has paid to see, attack him for complaining about the experience and then glory in their heightened experience.
Extraordinary
Grapevine49
Are you for real ????
Please complain to all the above people and then come back with their replys, Should be funny!
And to compare 7k Charlton fans standing up behind seats in a stand that holds 7k to the Hillsborough tragedy is just plain stupid and ignorant!
The fundamental problem here, as other's have mentioned, is the authorities rigid refusal to allow safe standing areas. The biggest problem at Hillsborough was the fencing that penned everyone in, not that people were initially stood up.
We must hope the experiments being proposed in Scotland go well and allow for a sensible re-think of the policy towards stadium design in England. Until that day, I don't see that there is a lot the club can do, especially given their already streched resources. Maybe when we're topflight again the ticket office will have the man-power to fanny around picking out certain seats for certain people. I know in the past we have asked for away tickets 'somewhere towards the back' and the club have provided us with them easily enough.
It seems to me, however, we as fans can easily self police this. 98% of the time this isn't even an issue as the away end is two thirds empty but on the odd occassion we sell out, it seems simple enough that on entering the ground you think to yourself 'do I want to stand today'? If the answer is yes, head towards the back and centre of the away block and fan outward sideways and forwards from there. If you want to sit, sit somehwere towards the front. No-one checks you're sat in the seat allocated on your ticket so nothing is stopping us from organising ourselves into broad areas. I like to sing and don't mind standing so I usually head towards the noisier supporters who naturally tend to congregate in the area I've mentioned as a standing zone above. However, I don't like to be right in the middle of fans who've been drinking and can sometimes be a bit aggressive but they have as much right to be at the game as me, and I know where they'll likely be so I sit/stand at the back but off to one side. However, from time to time we end up having to move as someone will wander up staring at their tickets and say to us 'I think you're in our seats' even though there are about 2000 empty ones to choose from. When we sell out there are only as many tickets as there are seats so as long as people choose there seats with a little bit of thought (i.e. don't leave loads of single seats empty) there's no danger that anyone won't get a seat, even if it's not the same number as stamped on their ticket. If you turn up late and all the best seats have gone, that's just tough luck.
To me it seems a perfectly reasonable thing to ask of supporters to just position themselves according to a general etiquette so everyone has a fair chance of enjoying the game in the way that best suits them - there are plenty of other unwritten rules in daily life that we all generally adhere to easily enough. It's no good swapping seats after kick-off - can you imagine trying to rearrange 7000 fans in a totally unmanaged manner while the game is going on? It'd be bloody chaos.
I think that would be the solution and rather than deride other fans and say tough, maybe we could try to organise ourselves a bit. And I should clarify, I'm not being critical of all who stood- if those in front of you stand- you have little choice. The support on Saturday was brilliant, it's just it still would have been brilliant with a little consideration for our own.
At the risk of sounding obstinate some people that want to sit don'twant to be forced down the front and/or off to the side. The back in the middle is probably where everyone wants to be.
We were in the second row at Fulham and our heads were below that of the players - the view of the other goal was very poor.
I accept that there is no solution, but i just can't bring myself to accept that because so many people break the rules those that dont have to just accept it.
I can see both sides of this debate and clearly it needed to be had as there are so many lifers on either side regarding this.
I am a little uncomfortable with playing the Hillsborough card here though, its quite irrelevent to what is being discussed here and I feel, a little distastfull to use so out of context, no-one here is endorsing overcrowded terracing from a bygone age whilst fenced in and I am sure most would visit the memorial where so many people people tragically lost thier lives out of respect not for some sort of reality check to the seating/standing debate.
In the end its about a bit of respect for each other, we are not Leeds or Man Utd. No law was passed last Saturday that from this day forth no one shall sit, it was a spontanious event and unlikely to happen for a while again.
I also have a forces pension for a knee injury that did make it a little uncomfortable so can identify with some of issues on here but I sat for 5 minutes from time to time then stood again
Lets try to provide some rational thinking, rather than treat it as an argument between young and old. To state my positon, I am 74 decently fit to stand, but I did not enjoy doing so because my view of the game from just behind the disabled area was obstructed. Incidentally those who found it painful to stand would have been wise to declare this and sit in that area which afforded a decent view. We basically have two groups here, those who love to stand and those who wish to sit. My seat at the Valley is in the Upper North, primarily because I enjoy the atmosphere made by probably those who like to stand. We have two things to consider, first of all games at home and secondly away games. At the Valley if there was a big demand, we could consider making the North Lower a standing area where no-one would have their view obstructed, but the singing etc would possibly be more effective. With away games where we fill the Stand, we are stuck with standing and I for one will not be attending. We saw at the last home game that when the Police tried to empty the Upper North they were defied by the lads at the top. All of us are entitled to be comfortable in our enjoyment of the game that we have paid to see. On saturday would it not have been possible for the Club to allocate standing at the back and enforced seating at the front ? They hold information about supporters like age etc, surely in this technological age they could do better.
Comments
Fair dos but it is against the rules which to all intents and purposes is the same thing ?
Usually even when we sell out, everyone usually sits.
Yesterday not ideal for some people but it really is once in a blue moon.
And every single club in th Country has the same issue.
Think yourselves lucky you don't support other clubs who stand EVERY WEEK!
And those who say it's the law.........so is doing 70mph but I bet everyone has broken that law at some point.
And what if he'd asked you to sit down, so then you couldn't see the game - would you have done?
You can have whatever ground regulations you like, but if the police won't enforce them, because they decide they can't, it isn't going to make any difference.
Why should supporting your team at an away match be made an endurance test, notwithstanding the football!!?
Some fans like to make a lot of noise and bounce about, they are important to the club as they generate an atmosphere that helps the players as long as they are positive which they usually are. Some fans may have done that in the past but are getting a bit long in the tooth and their joints might not be so good or others have their own ways to support the team and go because they enjoy wtaching football and still love the club. I'm not saying the loud bouncy fans don't, of course they do, but some see it more as a mission - or enjoy the crack - than enjoying watching the football, I have seen some orchestrating who spend more time with their back to the game. not slagging them off, the club needs them. But it does hack me off when they judge other fans by their own preferences, the fans that don't want to bounce or be loud are also vitally important for the club. Some of these supported the team as part of 4K gates at Selhurst and cleared the Valley pitch and stands and fought to get us bacck home.
My point is we are all Charlton fans and it is wrong to tell others how they should be supporting the club. but what everybody should do is respect others - I see some people from the loud bouncy brigade livid that other people are not like them - or quiet ones looking down on the ones who create an atmosphere - that is arrogant in my book. lets respect each other and sometimes make a small sacrifice for our fellow supporters - that could mean at an away game thinking about elderly or disabled people behind you if you are standing.
I know it is too much to ask but it really shouldn't be.
In response to Suzi, of course yesterday was an occasion when even if you wanted to oblige and sit you couldn't because you were so many rows back and it was impossible to get thirty rows in front to all sit. I was just saying there have been numerous occasions at other away games when we have politely asked those in front to sit and have Got a volley of abuse in return. When we suggested once that there was an area where loads of others were standing so why not go join them and stand there instead we got another volley of abuse, a threat of physical violence and told they had paid for that seat and were going to stand there. This is when it becomes unacceptable, in my opinion of course, probably not in others though.
The ground regulations though are phrased reasonably and should enable stewards to "police" the rules.
Were I deprived of my ability to watch the game I would demand my money back from the club, (acting as agent for Fulham) as Fulham failed to provide the goods & services they contracted to provide upon the sale of the ticket. It is a fundamental breach of contract. The vendor has an implicit duty of care to provide services he contracted to provide under the terms and conditions of the sale, i.e. a seat from which to watch the game.
I would also report the issue to the Football Association, the local authority and the local police authority under whose jurisdiction the stadium license will have been granted. From the accounts described I suggest somebody is in breach of the duty of care to the public under which the stadium license was granted and the applicable health and safety certificate.
Many of you will be travelling next week to the scene of the worst footballing disaster in living memory. All seater stadiums were introduced at enormous cost to the game for a purpose. Based on some of the comments on this thread it is not hard to see why. Perhaps some of you should take a little time to visit the memorial to the Liverpool 96 who simply went to watch a football match in 1989 and lost their lives.
Such scenes should never be seen at a football ground again. So excuse me if I have little time for the selfish self righteous justification of those who chose to enhance their personal gratification of Saturdays' game by standing at the expense of others.
As if one persons experience were not bad enough some rather than apologizing to the individual who has a) endured considerable discomfort b) been deprived of watching a game he has paid to see, attack him for complaining about the experience and then glory in their heightened experience.
Extraordinary
Grapevine49
If we are all going to condone standing in areas that were not designed (and are not safe) for it then we are effectively saying that if you want to sit, stay away.
As I've said before my Dad can't stand for 90 minutes, so we don't go to many away games, but that shouldn't be our limit of options.
As for this only happening at big games, it doesn't. It happens at most away games that we go to. Sure Sheff Wed (hundereds of miles away and a large away allocation) will have spare seats but im guessing this is uncommon, especially in this league.
Even if one chooses to ask the young lads infront (who have had a few beers) to sit down the request is at best refused and on more than one occasion we've been told to f off.
Please complain to all the above people and then come back with their replys, Should be funny!
And to compare 7k Charlton fans standing up behind seats in a stand that holds 7k to the Hillsborough tragedy is just plain stupid and ignorant!
We must hope the experiments being proposed in Scotland go well and allow for a sensible re-think of the policy towards stadium design in England. Until that day, I don't see that there is a lot the club can do, especially given their already streched resources. Maybe when we're topflight again the ticket office will have the man-power to fanny around picking out certain seats for certain people. I know in the past we have asked for away tickets 'somewhere towards the back' and the club have provided us with them easily enough.
It seems to me, however, we as fans can easily self police this. 98% of the time this isn't even an issue as the away end is two thirds empty but on the odd occassion we sell out, it seems simple enough that on entering the ground you think to yourself 'do I want to stand today'? If the answer is yes, head towards the back and centre of the away block and fan outward sideways and forwards from there. If you want to sit, sit somehwere towards the front. No-one checks you're sat in the seat allocated on your ticket so nothing is stopping us from organising ourselves into broad areas. I like to sing and don't mind standing so I usually head towards the noisier supporters who naturally tend to congregate in the area I've mentioned as a standing zone above. However, I don't like to be right in the middle of fans who've been drinking and can sometimes be a bit aggressive but they have as much right to be at the game as me, and I know where they'll likely be so I sit/stand at the back but off to one side. However, from time to time we end up having to move as someone will wander up staring at their tickets and say to us 'I think you're in our seats' even though there are about 2000 empty ones to choose from. When we sell out there are only as many tickets as there are seats so as long as people choose there seats with a little bit of thought (i.e. don't leave loads of single seats empty) there's no danger that anyone won't get a seat, even if it's not the same number as stamped on their ticket. If you turn up late and all the best seats have gone, that's just tough luck.
To me it seems a perfectly reasonable thing to ask of supporters to just position themselves according to a general etiquette so everyone has a fair chance of enjoying the game in the way that best suits them - there are plenty of other unwritten rules in daily life that we all generally adhere to easily enough. It's no good swapping seats after kick-off - can you imagine trying to rearrange 7000 fans in a totally unmanaged manner while the game is going on? It'd be bloody chaos.
We were in the second row at Fulham and our heads were below that of the players - the view of the other goal was very poor.
I accept that there is no solution, but i just can't bring myself to accept that because so many people break the rules those that dont have to just accept it.
I am a little uncomfortable with playing the Hillsborough card here though, its quite irrelevent to what is being discussed here and I feel, a little distastfull to use so out of context, no-one here is endorsing overcrowded terracing from a bygone age whilst fenced in and I am sure most would visit the memorial where so many people people tragically lost thier lives out of respect not for some sort of reality check to the seating/standing debate.
In the end its about a bit of respect for each other, we are not Leeds or Man Utd. No law was passed last Saturday that from this day forth no one shall sit, it was a spontanious event and unlikely to happen for a while again.
I also have a forces pension for a knee injury that did make it a little uncomfortable so can identify with some of issues on here but I sat for 5 minutes from time to time then stood again
We basically have two groups here, those who love to stand and those who wish to sit. My seat at the Valley is in the Upper North, primarily because I enjoy the atmosphere made by probably those who like to stand. We have two things to consider, first of all games at home and secondly away games. At the Valley if there was a big demand, we could consider making the North Lower a standing area where no-one would have their view obstructed, but the singing etc would possibly be more effective. With away games where we fill the Stand, we are stuck with standing and I for one will not be attending. We saw at the last home game that when the Police tried to empty the Upper North they were defied by the lads at the top.
All of us are entitled to be comfortable in our enjoyment of the game that we have paid to see. On saturday would it not have been possible for the Club to allocate standing at the back and enforced seating at the front ? They hold information about supporters like age etc, surely in this technological age they could do better.