[quote][cite]Posted By: BDL[/cite]So what is the difference between Arsenal and MK Dons? The Gooners were the original "Franchise" team.[/quote]
The difference is 90 years - professional football was still relatively young when Arsenal upped sticks (and, of course, the Football League had refused them permission to merge with Fulham). If Arsenal had stayed in Plumstead, I imagine Charlton would not have gone professional.
It's sad to see how many people write Wimbledon FC off in the same way that Michael Herd of the Standard wrote Charlton off in the 1980s. We should remember our own history.
[cite]Posted By: Friend Or Defoe[/cite]Wow it seems most of the forum is going! Perhaps the club should apply for an increased allocation?
There was no reason why a club based in Wimbledon couldn't succeed.
But that was PRECISELY the reason why the team (was) moved. Their gates at Plough Lane were below 4000, and even less attended their games at Selhurst, to the extent that their accounts for their last 2 years in South London budgeted for an attendance of...zero.
Now MK Dons have a s/t fan-base approaching 10K.
Exactly - the old club was moribund, and might not have survived to complete another season. I am sure most of us have got a non league team that probably plays closer to where we live than the Valley. Are we 'SCUM' for not supporting them, like the fans that didnt support Milton Keynes City ?
[cite]Posted By: NathanPrior[/cite]The only way teams are gonna compete with others are by franchising, and this is the way more and more clubs are going, shouldnt really knock it, as one day it could be us in that position.
lost for words. What utter complete crap.
Can someone explain why this is so stupid. You may disagree with it but it aint stupid. There are approxiamately 45 teams currently up for sale, there are some 20 teams near administration or have just gone in. If you think change isnt necessary and on its way then keep burying your heads in the sand.
Solar - Wimbledon only had 4000 at Plough lane and even less at Selhurst. What are you talking about? They didn't have the best suppost but it was well above four thousand.
The reason that the club was moved is because of 2 men.
[cite]Posted By: Friend Or Defoe[/cite]Wow it seems most of the forum is going! Perhaps the club should apply for an increased allocation?
It will be on a tuesday night in January and we will take 326 fans!
[cite]Posted By: charlton_carl[/cite]Some utter crap on this thread.
Solar - Wimbledon only had 4000 at Plough lane and even less at Selhurst. What are you talking about? They didn't have the best suppost but it was well above four thousand.
Plough lane only held about 10k didn't it so their support can't have been that great. And their attendances at Selhurst were only boosted because they gave away fans about 15k tickets.
So what if Wimbledon only had 4,000 supporters, doesn't make the theft of a club from it's community right.
If Milton Keynes is the footballing city some claim it is, why couldn't a non league club have been developed over the past 15 years to the current level, rather then stealing another club by lying to a FA commission
[cite]Posted By: Friend Or Defoe[/cite]Wow it seems most of the forum is going! Perhaps the club should apply for an increased allocation?
There was no reason why a club based in Wimbledon couldn't succeed.
But that was PRECISELY the reason why the team (was) moved. Their gates at Plough Lane were below 4000, and even less attended their games at Selhurst, to the extent that their accounts for their last 2 years in South London budgeted for an attendance of...zero.
Now MK Dons have a s/t fan-base approaching 10K.
Exactly - the old club was moribund, and might not have survived to complete another season. I am sure most of us have got a non league team that probably plays closer to where we live than the Valley. Are we 'SCUM' for not supporting them, like the fans that didnt support Milton Keynes City ?
Surely if they couldn't survive they could of restarted as Wimbledon AFC in the Southern/Isthmain league instead of moving to Milton Keynes?
As for the scum comment, no idea where that came from. The difference between us and the people of Milton Keynes is they had a local team, but they ignore it because they weren't in the league, there were also league teams nearby in other towns. I'm not criticising that at all, support who you want, but it's a bit strange for them to suddenly start supporting a local team when one appears in the league. Have they switched teams or suddenly become football fans? I wished they hadn't, as all they've done is proved that franchising can work.
I think the problem was that people who ran Wimbledon did not want to survive as Wimbledon.
This plan to relocate Wimbledon had been going on for years and when Hamman finally sold to Charles Koppel that was the final nail in the coffin.
The supporters wanted to club to go back to Merton and both Koppel and Hamman said they had tried to buy the old plough lane and the god track, the truth was that they hadn't.
AFC Wimbledon have shown that it was possible for the club to survive in the lower leagues.
What is the difference between the set up with MK DONS and ARSENAL. When Arsenal left Woolwich for north London in 19(something) for econmic reasons, it must have been devistating for the local populace and would have seemd as far away as Milton Keynes giving what transport links were like back then.
However it worked out alright, because of Woolwich Arsenals move to north London, Chartlon Athletic was born ! Yet you dont find many addicts bitter and twisted about Arsenal and claiming them not to be a real team or reusing to play pre season friendly matches against them.
Charlton did not turn professional until the summer of 1913 - the same summer as Arsenal moved out of the Manor Ground and up to Highbury. Whether one event led to the other isn't clear.
[cite]Posted By: Rothko[/cite]So what if Wimbledon only had 4,000 supporters, doesn't make the theft of a club from it's community right.
If Milton Keynes is the footballing city some claim it is, why couldn't a non league club have been developed over the past 15 years to the current level, rather then stealing another club by lying to a FA commission
it doesnt make it right for those not opposed to the moving of the team to lose out either.
Who was not opposed? ASDA who needed the stadium to allow a mega store? Milton Keynes Council? The people of Milton Keynes who were too lazy to support exsiting non league clubs in the area?
So every single wimbledon fc fan now supports afc wimbledon? There are no fans that went with MK dons to the stadium, if so then the attendances for AFC wimbledon are what? and is that enough to sustain league status.
i dont really give 2 hoots about them i think it is laughable that charlton fans would put the support of their own team behind their morales for mk dons who should mean eff all to them.
charlton need to win at mk dons to win the league, and we will see how many of you swallow your morals
let's hope if we ever get in trouble again that the fans of "other" clubs don't have the same attitude to us as you seem to have towards them
mk dons are nothing to do with wimbledon , wimbledon should've started again as they did and a team that had earned a place in the league been given their place .
Lining the pockets of that wiesel winkleman is just another way of agreeing with what happened
So if our gates ever drop down to 4,000 no one will mind if we get moved to a new town somewhere along the M11 then?
I've got no time for a club which didn't earn it's right to be a league club, or a city which had no desire to build a club, and instead lied to the FA and the League to move the club.
Agree with your sentiments Sash but...... It's happened and there is no going back now.
I made the example of Arsenal and MK just to see what reaction I got. From my own point of view, they are welcome to their ex-council tip in the great expanse of concrete north of the Thames. Without them moving, I and you would never have had our Charlton!
Yes MK "stole" a league place. Yes they have no history and yes for the grace of god it could have been us or 80 odd other clubs. But without MK, AFC would never have happened and the AFC fans that I work with (3 of them) would never ever swap the rollercoaster they have enjoyed over the past few seasons, their words not mine.
Anyway, wonder what Kingstonian fans have to say about this? ;-)
No one is forcing anyone to go to Stadium MK, but face facts - We will be playing them next season. You have a choice.
[cite]Posted By: Rothko[/cite]So if our gates ever drop down to 4,000 no one will mind if we get moved to a new town somewhere along the M11 then?
I've got no time for a club which didn't earn it's right to be a league club, quote]
I would mind but i wouldnt expect other fans too it has eff all to do with them, Noone is asking you to have any time for them you are there to see your team beat them not support MK
[cite]Posted By: buckshee[/cite]me me me me me
let's hope if we ever get in trouble again that the fans of "other" clubs don't have the same attitude to us as you seem to have towards them.
What attitude i have said i would go there to support Charlton no one else, i dont care that they moved i feel for those that follow AFC but they are doing it the right way and going back to their beginings,i dont support them though i wouldnt want them to win a game i only care for the results of CAFC not anyone else,
.
Lining the pockets of that wiesel winkleman is just another way of agreeing with what happened
No it is a way of going to support CAFC i couldnt give a toss whos pockets it goes in, i would love to see Palarse go belly up but by not going to Shithurst pk wont make that happen what it will do will be one less voice thrying to help his or hers team now that i cant understand
[cite]Posted By: BDL[/cite]Agree with your sentiments Sash but...... It's happened and there is no going back now.
I made the example of Arsenal and MK just to see what reaction I got. From my own point of view, they are welcome to their ex-council tip in the great expanse of concrete north of the Thames. Without them moving, I and you would never have had our Charlton!
Yes MK "stole" a league place. Yes they have no history and yes for the grace of god it could have been us or 80 odd other clubs. But without MK, AFC would never have happened and the AFC fans that I work with (3 of them) would never ever swap the rollercoaster they have enjoyed over the past few seasons, their words not mine.
.
great post BDL
Shit Happens you cant do nothing about it once it has sure you can get arsey and moan and groan, you could even go there with banners and songs to let them know how you feel about it sitting on your backside at home on your morale high ground proves what exactly
Comments
The difference is 90 years - professional football was still relatively young when Arsenal upped sticks (and, of course, the Football League had refused them permission to merge with Fulham). If Arsenal had stayed in Plumstead, I imagine Charlton would not have gone professional.
It's sad to see how many people write Wimbledon FC off in the same way that Michael Herd of the Standard wrote Charlton off in the 1980s. We should remember our own history.
Exactly - the old club was moribund, and might not have survived to complete another season. I am sure most of us have got a non league team that probably plays closer to where we live than the Valley. Are we 'SCUM' for not supporting them, like the fans that didnt support Milton Keynes City ?
Can someone explain why this is so stupid. You may disagree with it but it aint stupid. There are approxiamately 45 teams currently up for sale, there are some 20 teams near administration or have just gone in. If you think change isnt necessary and on its way then keep burying your heads in the sand.
Solar - Wimbledon only had 4000 at Plough lane and even less at Selhurst. What are you talking about? They didn't have the best suppost but it was well above four thousand.
The reason that the club was moved is because of 2 men.
Charles Koppel and Sam hamman
It will be on a tuesday night in January and we will take 326 fans!
Plough lane only held about 10k didn't it so their support can't have been that great. And their attendances at Selhurst were only boosted because they gave away fans about 15k tickets.
What was our attendances when we were at Selhurst?
Point is both were well above 4000
If Milton Keynes is the footballing city some claim it is, why couldn't a non league club have been developed over the past 15 years to the current level, rather then stealing another club by lying to a FA commission
As for the scum comment, no idea where that came from. The difference between us and the people of Milton Keynes is they had a local team, but they ignore it because they weren't in the league, there were also league teams nearby in other towns. I'm not criticising that at all, support who you want, but it's a bit strange for them to suddenly start supporting a local team when one appears in the league. Have they switched teams or suddenly become football fans? I wished they hadn't, as all they've done is proved that franchising can work.
This plan to relocate Wimbledon had been going on for years and when Hamman finally sold to Charles Koppel that was the final nail in the coffin.
The supporters wanted to club to go back to Merton and both Koppel and Hamman said they had tried to buy the old plough lane and the god track, the truth was that they hadn't.
AFC Wimbledon have shown that it was possible for the club to survive in the lower leagues.
When Arsenal left Woolwich for north London in 19(something) for econmic reasons, it must have been devistating for the local populace and would have seemd as far away as Milton Keynes giving what transport links were like back then.
However it worked out alright, because of Woolwich Arsenals move to north London, Chartlon Athletic was born !
Yet you dont find many addicts bitter and twisted about Arsenal and claiming them not to be a real team or reusing to play pre season friendly matches against them.
I won't buy a ticket to watch Charlton play there, but I will bring my AFC supporting pal along to our home game against them to cheer Charlton on.
it doesnt make it right for those not opposed to the moving of the team to lose out either.
i dont really give 2 hoots about them i think it is laughable that charlton fans would put the support of their own team behind their morales for mk dons who should mean eff all to them.
charlton need to win at mk dons to win the league, and we will see how many of you swallow your morals
AFC Wimbledon are averaging over 3,000, and that will grow in Conference National, and should be enough to sustain League football.
As I said, I'll be at home, thinking of those who would have brought the Fryer/Noades dream in 1985
the fa/league should be ashamed of what they allowed to happen
your principles are yours mine are mine and i have a great memory and i am not selfish so there
your right there are those that should be ashamed
fans of other teams and the children of MK are not amongst them
let's hope if we ever get in trouble again that the fans of "other" clubs don't have the same attitude to us as you seem to have towards them
mk dons are nothing to do with wimbledon , wimbledon should've started again as they did and a team that had earned a place in the league been given their place .
Lining the pockets of that wiesel winkleman is just another way of agreeing with what happened
I've got no time for a club which didn't earn it's right to be a league club, or a city which had no desire to build a club, and instead lied to the FA and the League to move the club.
They stole a league place, end of.
I made the example of Arsenal and MK just to see what reaction I got. From my own point of view, they are welcome to their ex-council tip in the great expanse of concrete north of the Thames. Without them moving, I and you would never have had our Charlton!
Yes MK "stole" a league place. Yes they have no history and yes for the grace of god it could have been us or 80 odd other clubs. But without MK, AFC would never have happened and the AFC fans that I work with (3 of them) would never ever swap the rollercoaster they have enjoyed over the past few seasons, their words not mine.
Anyway, wonder what Kingstonian fans have to say about this? ;-)
No one is forcing anyone to go to Stadium MK, but face facts - We will be playing them next season. You have a choice.