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MATCH THREAD (+POST p23): Charlton Athl v Cray Valley PM: FA Cup 🏆1st Rd: Sun 5 Nov 2023 | KO 17:30
Comments
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Maybe but that's not really how highlight shows tend to go. Chesterfield Pompey was the headline game on the highlight show with extended highlights and punditrykillerandflash said:Surely that's because it was the live game, which everyone would have seen already1 -
Personally think he is another stubborn, ignorant manager who can only see one way of playing. Don’t think he will last till next season at current rate, never seems to learn. If he didn’t already realise Kirk was a lousy player then God help us.Fortune 82nd Minute said:
I'm not saying I want Appleton gone but let's stop pretending he hasn't made huge mistakes recently.swordfish said:Some of the reaction on here for a cup game few were all that bothered about beforehand and that we didn't lose 🙄
I get that we were bad and wrong decisions made, I saw it on TV, but some seem to want the manager gone as a consequence. Seriously? Have we learnt nothing from chopping and changing managers every five minutes?
FWIW, I'm sure he'll stay and I don't think he'll make the same mistake again. It sounds as though one or two players might have had their last chance and might not feature again listening to his post match comments, which is a good thing if it means we focus on bringing in better replacements in January.
1) He started Aneke - which any of us could have told him wasn't a good idea - and left him on for 65 minutes. He's now out for 3 months.
2) He dropped Louie Watson after a series of really good performances for 2 games for a half fit Fraser
3) He played May up front by himself against Bolton's 3 big defenders
4)And now yesterday's cock-up.
If he carries on like this, the jury will be out on him very soon.5 -
People calling for Appleton to be sacked is quite unbelievable. He made 11 changes, he tried to give experienced pros a game to show what they could do....they failed abysmally. Not one of them came out with any credit, but the team was easily strong enough to win, they just didn't seem to care. MA has said he has now seen a few things (I would suggest a lot) about which players will be part of his squad and which won't. I suspect at least 3 or 4 will be moved on, released in January, including some of the loans!
MA now needs to get the main 11 firing for Saturday and baring any injuries that same 11 needs to play in the replay.
MA tried something that didn't work, but he has lost just 2 games in his tenure so far, it's not his squad and he has said he wants to change things in January.
Why sack a manager because he tried something different? When do we stop sacking managers every few games and start letting them build their own squad? Where has the turnover of managers got us so far? An interesting fact came up during the live game yesterday, we have had 22 managers since Curbishly left.....22, let that sink in!!
We are 5 points off a play off place with a game in hand and a transfer window coming up where MA can change personnel, despite an awful start under Holden!
We never seem to learn that knee jerk reactions don't work.
I'm gutted at yesterday's performance but we have the chance to put it right.
Sacking MA is not the answer, getting shot of some of the squad and replacing them is!
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Not really... You can still field three Over 21s in those games, four if you include a Goalkeeper.thickandthin63 said:
You are spot on,we have the under 21s but that is a competition in its own right,we have big squads now,far larger than years ago,so loads of players dont get a game one week to the next,and then when called upon,are not ready for it.We used to have the football combination which was very competetive,and also at one stage played in a mid week league,as well as having the youth leagues.So players just out of the team still could play regular football and be ready when called upon.DOUCHER said:
And this opening sentence is the problem - there used to be a reserve league ti give players a run outthickandthin63 said:I think Appleton is getting some undeserved stick.
On paper this was the ideal opportunity to give some recovering players a run out,and also give some of the fringe players a game and show us what they could do.
H e did that,and was badly let down,I wont blame the guys coming back from injury but others just did not seem up for the challenge.They should have disregarded the level Cray play at and tore into them like it was a league game,but we stood off,let them play and grow in confidence,it was us who wanted the final whistle to blow.
Now a word on Cray,I am sure some of those players have at some stage been on the books of league clubs and for some reason or another didnt make the grade,they had a point to prove,and boy did they prove it.Not afraid to be on the ball,no fear of us and in general a credit to lower league football.
As previous posters have said,2-3 last night,must now be considered to be surplus to requirements,I dont know what happened to Kirk.he came to us under very difficult circumstances,and with a good record.He now seems to have lost the will just to play football,maybe Appleton sees something in training,and is waiting for that spark to ignite and we will see a different player,so low on confidence and the booing really dosent help.Tedic and Anbankwah,well I cant see anything there at all,so they should go back.
Roll on the replay and then we can look forward to a relaxing trip to Preistfields.
Andrew Crofts went back to Brighton | Tom Huddlestone and Paul McShane went back to Man Utd in the winter of their careers
Why... Because those teams take advantage of that rule, so have a Senior Figure working alongside the youngsters
Charlton on the other hand use it exclusively for the U21s - We've had the likes of Fraser | Edun | Aneke | McGrandles all coming back from injury of late, even Kirk who isn't getting regular minutes... Why aren't we building up their game time properly at the very least, so when we have to call upon them, they're not as a rusty as what we saw last night.
Don't bother with the tiresome sarcasm people, I'm not interested... But it would be win / win for the kids... Playing alongside older players who have a lot of experience in the Senior Game, they then have a better benchmark, knowing the levels they need to reach, to dislodge them.
Would love to know why we don't take the approach that other clubs seem to take full advantage of8 -
I'm not sure anyone's pretending that he hasn't made mistakes and you've pointed out things that lead you to question his judgement, which is fine. However, I want to judge how does with squad available after changes are made to it in January, assuming he keeps us in play off contention, which might seem unlikely after seeing the squad depth failing to impress yesterday, but it was a cup game.Fortune 82nd Minute said:
I'm not saying I want Appleton gone but let's stop pretending he hasn't made huge mistakes recently.swordfish said:Some of the reaction on here for a cup game few were all that bothered about beforehand and that we didn't lose 🙄
I get that we were bad and wrong decisions made, I saw it on TV, but some seem to want the manager gone as a consequence. Seriously? Have we learnt nothing from chopping and changing managers every five minutes?
FWIW, I'm sure he'll stay and I don't think he'll make the same mistake again. It sounds as though one or two players might have had their last chance and might not feature again listening to his post match comments, which is a good thing if it means we focus on bringing in better replacements in January.
1) He started Aneke - which any of us could have told him wasn't a good idea - and left him on for 65 minutes. He's now out for 3 months.
2) He dropped Louie Watson after a series of really good performances for 2 games for a half fit Fraser
3) He played May up front by himself against Bolton's 3 big defenders
4)And now yesterday's cock-up.
If he carries on like this, the jury will be out on him very soon.
He's much to do in the meantime to win doubters over I agree, but he needs a proper go at it as it is still early in his tenure and we must also be a laughing stock for our frequent churn of managers.
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Having slept on it I feel a little sympathy for Appleton.
Our 11 starting players are full time pros. They know each other as they meet at training most week days - it's their job to be fit and ready - and use their intelligence (a bit).
Cray Valley Paper Mills are not League 2 footballers, they are not National League footballers and they are not National League North or South footballers. They are in fact from the Isthmian League 117 places below us. They are most likely butchers, bakers, candlestick makers and ... er paper millers. I doubt many punters even know the existence of Cray Valley Paper Mills FC.
It is such a humiliation. I normally search high and low for a one inch Charlton report in the Daily Mirror. No such problem today of course, the headline some sort of sick joke I assume.
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we should have won by a cricket score. We did not.No one needed a rest.Only bad weather will give us fixture congestion and potentially force players to play without the usual breaks because we don’t take any cup game seriously enough.2
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Twenty two managers (or 1st team coach) since Curbs moved on 😩.3
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I think most managers these days would have picked the same team, or similar, as Appleton did for a game against a club so low in the pyramid. This wasn't a team of unknown under 18s, these were the players people say are 'useful to have in the squad', a couple of first teamers and Andy Scott's 'clever' loan signings. Some of those clearly have no business being in a red shirt and should not be seen again.6
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Don't want him gone, but I've been saying for weeks, that I have serious doubts about him (Appleton). Most of the victories he/we have achieved were against the poorer sides in this league. Also I can't stand managers constantly playing players out of position, which he is a bloody expert in doing. There's no doubt the players let him down last night, but he opened himself up to that possibility by his ridiculous team selection. The squad needs a massive cull, but is Scott and he the men to do it? To go sooner, rather than later. In order, Kirk, Tedic, Walker (one game was enough), McGrandles, Abankwah, Thomas. Possibly Ness, if he doesn't get his act together. And also buy a decant fucking left back!swordfish said:
I'm not sure anyone's pretending that he hasn't made mistakes and you've pointed out things that lead you to question his judgement, which is fine. However, I want to judge how does with squad available after changes are made to it in January, assuming he keeps us in play off contention, which might seem unlikely after seeing the squad depth failing to impress yesterday, but it was a cup game.Fortune 82nd Minute said:
I'm not saying I want Appleton gone but let's stop pretending he hasn't made huge mistakes recently.swordfish said:Some of the reaction on here for a cup game few were all that bothered about beforehand and that we didn't lose 🙄
I get that we were bad and wrong decisions made, I saw it on TV, but some seem to want the manager gone as a consequence. Seriously? Have we learnt nothing from chopping and changing managers every five minutes?
FWIW, I'm sure he'll stay and I don't think he'll make the same mistake again. It sounds as though one or two players might have had their last chance and might not feature again listening to his post match comments, which is a good thing if it means we focus on bringing in better replacements in January.
1) He started Aneke - which any of us could have told him wasn't a good idea - and left him on for 65 minutes. He's now out for 3 months.
2) He dropped Louie Watson after a series of really good performances for 2 games for a half fit Fraser
3) He played May up front by himself against Bolton's 3 big defenders
4)And now yesterday's cock-up.
If he carries on like this, the jury will be out on him very soon.
He's much to do in the meantime to win doubters over I agree, but he needs a proper go at it as it is still early in his tenure and we must also be a laughing stock for our frequent churn of managers.0 - Sponsored links:
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Pardew | Parkinson | Powell | Bowyer...RedChaser said:Twenty two managers (or 1st team coach) since Curbs moved on 😩.
The only ones in that timeframe who have completed a full season as Charlton Manager.5 -
Ps, what's happened to the scouting? Some of the rubbish we've bought in is unbeleiveble0
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If Mickey Apples didn't know it before he does now!
The players who are currently freeloading piss takers and who will never go into battle for him, started that game yesterday. Easy to say get rid of them, so I will... GET FUCKING RID OF EM!
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Hartleypete said:I can handle the piss takes from my mates, I’ve had it for years.
What I hate is when we play a weak side and give that type of performance my Grandkids don’t really like all the hassle they get at school. Then they don’t feel inclined to want to go again.
Apples needs to think about the wider picture if he wants to get the crowds back.
Totally wrong move to make 11 changes, particularly for a live TV game.
It's character building for the kids.0 -
I don't know how much of last nights result is on Appleton, players way more to blame. That x11 should beat Cray Valley comfortably 9 times out of 10.10
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Playing your best players doesn’t guarantee shit. Ask Portsmouth how their first choice XI got on yesterday.golfaddick said:
The problem isn't playing those players. The problem is playing them all together & expect them to play as a team.killerandflash said:Lets examine that starting 11
Walker - In Isted's absence, he's our No 2 keeper. If we can't play him against an 8th tier team, when can we play him?
Abankwah - Not a RB, but would Asiimwe or T Watson have been much different?
Ness - Wasn't everyone screaming for Hector to be dropped and Ness to replace him?
Thomas - Has been a regular at LB, so again perfectly reasonable to play him in his correct position
Edun - Our 1st choice LB coming back from injury. The perfect game for him to get some minutes
Anderson - Talented youngster, started the season well
McGrandles - Has done well under Appleton previously. A perfect opportunity to give him some minutes after his injury
Fraser - "The Scottish Pirlo". Was one of the 1st names on the teamsheet at the start of the season before his injury.
Kirk - The ideal opportunity to get some confidence into him
Tedic - Not been given a chance to play as a No 9, the perfect chance for him to get a goal or 2 and get some confidence
Chem - Many people have been questioning why he hasn't been in the matchday squads
It didn't work, but I can understand why Appleton picked that team. He would have learned a lot from yesterday, and not just about Kirk. Other players "failed the audition" while the lack of leadership in the first 11 is even worse in the reserve 11.
By all means give Tedic a run out. And McGrandles if needs be. But start with 4 or 5 of your regular starters. What is it we are persistently told about having a spine of a team.
Brian Clough is regarded as one of this counties best ever managers. He would never have made 11 changes to a side that had just won their first away game of the season.
Play your best players. Win the game. Then make changes.
Appleton picked a starting XI that had almost 1600 combined senior league appearances between them. It’s not as if he played a group of 18 year olds that barely had 50 senior appearances between them and they got outmuscled.Whatever combination of full time pros he picked, it should have been comfortable against 8th tier opposition.15 -
I agree, if you can't play your players who need minutes, have come back from injury or a chance to prove themselves (Chem for example), against 8th tier opposition then what's the point in having a squad.Callumcafc said:
Playing your best players doesn’t guarantee shit. Ask Portsmouth how their first choice XI got on yesterday.golfaddick said:
The problem isn't playing those players. The problem is playing them all together & expect them to play as a team.killerandflash said:Lets examine that starting 11
Walker - In Isted's absence, he's our No 2 keeper. If we can't play him against an 8th tier team, when can we play him?
Abankwah - Not a RB, but would Asiimwe or T Watson have been much different?
Ness - Wasn't everyone screaming for Hector to be dropped and Ness to replace him?
Thomas - Has been a regular at LB, so again perfectly reasonable to play him in his correct position
Edun - Our 1st choice LB coming back from injury. The perfect game for him to get some minutes
Anderson - Talented youngster, started the season well
McGrandles - Has done well under Appleton previously. A perfect opportunity to give him some minutes after his injury
Fraser - "The Scottish Pirlo". Was one of the 1st names on the teamsheet at the start of the season before his injury.
Kirk - The ideal opportunity to get some confidence into him
Tedic - Not been given a chance to play as a No 9, the perfect chance for him to get a goal or 2 and get some confidence
Chem - Many people have been questioning why he hasn't been in the matchday squads
It didn't work, but I can understand why Appleton picked that team. He would have learned a lot from yesterday, and not just about Kirk. Other players "failed the audition" while the lack of leadership in the first 11 is even worse in the reserve 11.
By all means give Tedic a run out. And McGrandles if needs be. But start with 4 or 5 of your regular starters. What is it we are persistently told about having a spine of a team.
Brian Clough is regarded as one of this counties best ever managers. He would never have made 11 changes to a side that had just won their first away game of the season.
Play your best players. Win the game. Then make changes.
Appleton picked a starting XI that had almost 1600 combined senior league appearances between them. It’s not as if he played a group of 18 year olds that barely had 50 senior appearances between them and they got outmuscled.Whatever combination of full time pros he picked, it should have been comfortable against 8th tier opposition.5 -
Well, I know it's all been said so may times before, but I don't want to see Charlie Kirk in a Charlton shirt ever again. It would be better to loan him out and pay 100% of his wages just to get him out of the place, as it must piss off the rest of the squad when they see him getting an appearance bonus for that kind of "appearance". I know the rest of them were rubbish, except for Chem Campbell, but Kirk was definitely top of that particular pile of crap.1
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Portsmouth vs Chesterfield is completely incomparable tbh.Callumcafc said:
Playing your best players doesn’t guarantee shit. Ask Portsmouth how their first choice XI got on yesterday.golfaddick said:
The problem isn't playing those players. The problem is playing them all together & expect them to play as a team.killerandflash said:Lets examine that starting 11
Walker - In Isted's absence, he's our No 2 keeper. If we can't play him against an 8th tier team, when can we play him?
Abankwah - Not a RB, but would Asiimwe or T Watson have been much different?
Ness - Wasn't everyone screaming for Hector to be dropped and Ness to replace him?
Thomas - Has been a regular at LB, so again perfectly reasonable to play him in his correct position
Edun - Our 1st choice LB coming back from injury. The perfect game for him to get some minutes
Anderson - Talented youngster, started the season well
McGrandles - Has done well under Appleton previously. A perfect opportunity to give him some minutes after his injury
Fraser - "The Scottish Pirlo". Was one of the 1st names on the teamsheet at the start of the season before his injury.
Kirk - The ideal opportunity to get some confidence into him
Tedic - Not been given a chance to play as a No 9, the perfect chance for him to get a goal or 2 and get some confidence
Chem - Many people have been questioning why he hasn't been in the matchday squads
It didn't work, but I can understand why Appleton picked that team. He would have learned a lot from yesterday, and not just about Kirk. Other players "failed the audition" while the lack of leadership in the first 11 is even worse in the reserve 11.
By all means give Tedic a run out. And McGrandles if needs be. But start with 4 or 5 of your regular starters. What is it we are persistently told about having a spine of a team.
Brian Clough is regarded as one of this counties best ever managers. He would never have made 11 changes to a side that had just won their first away game of the season.
Play your best players. Win the game. Then make changes.
Appleton picked a starting XI that had almost 1600 combined senior league appearances between them. It’s not as if he played a group of 18 year olds that barely had 50 senior appearances between them and they got outmuscled.Whatever combination of full time pros he picked, it should have been comfortable against 8th tier opposition.
Chesterfield are a national league side, that are flying, have a manager in Paul Cook and players like Will Grigg, Tom Naylor and Michael Jacobs. They were also at home.
Chesterfield would probably beat a handful of teams in league 2 and could probably even get a few results in this league. They would have smashed Cray Valley.
We severely overrate some of these players collectively
As much as you can post how many combined professional league games these players have, are we going to pretend that equates to being genuinely good at football? There's so much luck involved sometimes and we have seen some right guff play here.
It's similar to the manager merry go round, some players stay in the cycle of getting contracts as teams take a chance based on previous records, some of these players under contract here may genuinely be operating at a national league level and below.
League appareances are as relevant as xG stats to me personally, doesn't win anything when it's all said and done, just excuses and distractions from the actual results.6 -
That starting 11 should have walked through CV with ease.
12 - Sponsored links:
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Come on mate, these players still are full time professionals against 8th tier part timers.Braziliance said:
Portsmouth vs Chesterfield is completely incomparable tbh.Callumcafc said:
Playing your best players doesn’t guarantee shit. Ask Portsmouth how their first choice XI got on yesterday.golfaddick said:
The problem isn't playing those players. The problem is playing them all together & expect them to play as a team.killerandflash said:Lets examine that starting 11
Walker - In Isted's absence, he's our No 2 keeper. If we can't play him against an 8th tier team, when can we play him?
Abankwah - Not a RB, but would Asiimwe or T Watson have been much different?
Ness - Wasn't everyone screaming for Hector to be dropped and Ness to replace him?
Thomas - Has been a regular at LB, so again perfectly reasonable to play him in his correct position
Edun - Our 1st choice LB coming back from injury. The perfect game for him to get some minutes
Anderson - Talented youngster, started the season well
McGrandles - Has done well under Appleton previously. A perfect opportunity to give him some minutes after his injury
Fraser - "The Scottish Pirlo". Was one of the 1st names on the teamsheet at the start of the season before his injury.
Kirk - The ideal opportunity to get some confidence into him
Tedic - Not been given a chance to play as a No 9, the perfect chance for him to get a goal or 2 and get some confidence
Chem - Many people have been questioning why he hasn't been in the matchday squads
It didn't work, but I can understand why Appleton picked that team. He would have learned a lot from yesterday, and not just about Kirk. Other players "failed the audition" while the lack of leadership in the first 11 is even worse in the reserve 11.
By all means give Tedic a run out. And McGrandles if needs be. But start with 4 or 5 of your regular starters. What is it we are persistently told about having a spine of a team.
Brian Clough is regarded as one of this counties best ever managers. He would never have made 11 changes to a side that had just won their first away game of the season.
Play your best players. Win the game. Then make changes.
Appleton picked a starting XI that had almost 1600 combined senior league appearances between them. It’s not as if he played a group of 18 year olds that barely had 50 senior appearances between them and they got outmuscled.Whatever combination of full time pros he picked, it should have been comfortable against 8th tier opposition.
Chesterfield are a national league side, that are flying, have a manager in Paul Cook and players like Will Grigg, Tom Naylor and Michael Jacobs. They were also at home.
Chesterfield would probably beat a handful of teams in league 2 and could probably even get a few results in this league. They would have smashed Cray Valley.
We severely overrate some of these players collectivelyThat’s not overrating them, that’s a fact. I’d be very concerned if all of a sudden half of our squad’s true level was the 8th tier. It’s not, they just put in one of the most rank performances of all time.These players have hundreds of EFL appearances at League One and League Two level, if not higher. Nothing to do with us as fans under or overrating anyone.5 -
I saw a fairly reasonable vlogger yesterday say that this result was a sackable offence.
As much as I am not sure about that, I have never been sold on Appleton. I don't see any tactics when we play, I think a lot of our good results are down to having a few, genuinely decent players and them having stellar performances, not tactical management. If he was a manager who had a playstyle it would have shown against a part-time team, he couldn't even manage that. According to a fair few people these professionals should have got a result so Appleton must be tactically inept? It's either that or they aren't professional standard.
I have him in the same boat as Garner, Adkins, Holden, Slade etc. Just a very ordinary bloke who's been fortunate enough to get himself in the footballing managerial scheme and clubs take chances on relative past success.
I think of every fan group who tried to sell him to us and it was largely Oxford and Lincoln fans. No disrespect to them but our ambition is simply higher than theirs. They were accustomed to watching league 2 footie (or recently) while he was there. Most of us would be ashamed to operate at that level, we are all fed up of league 1 as is.
I just think it's inevitable we go nowhere again this season and he will just be another manager we will be reeling off in the future that didn't get it right.
Might sound harsh but take away the likes of Dobbo, May, CBT, Leaburn and some of the newer lads like Jones and of course our youth and then I truly couldn't give a b*llocks about most of these players. They take the p*ss and can't even be bothered to bust a gut.3 -
What else could it possibly mean? EFL standard players will still run rings around the average park team, which Cray Valley are closer to than the EFLBraziliance said:Callumcafc said:
Playing your best players doesn’t guarantee shit. Ask Portsmouth how their first choice XI got on yesterday.golfaddick said:
The problem isn't playing those players. The problem is playing them all together & expect them to play as a team.killerandflash said:Lets examine that starting 11
Walker - In Isted's absence, he's our No 2 keeper. If we can't play him against an 8th tier team, when can we play him?
Abankwah - Not a RB, but would Asiimwe or T Watson have been much different?
Ness - Wasn't everyone screaming for Hector to be dropped and Ness to replace him?
Thomas - Has been a regular at LB, so again perfectly reasonable to play him in his correct position
Edun - Our 1st choice LB coming back from injury. The perfect game for him to get some minutes
Anderson - Talented youngster, started the season well
McGrandles - Has done well under Appleton previously. A perfect opportunity to give him some minutes after his injury
Fraser - "The Scottish Pirlo". Was one of the 1st names on the teamsheet at the start of the season before his injury.
Kirk - The ideal opportunity to get some confidence into him
Tedic - Not been given a chance to play as a No 9, the perfect chance for him to get a goal or 2 and get some confidence
Chem - Many people have been questioning why he hasn't been in the matchday squads
It didn't work, but I can understand why Appleton picked that team. He would have learned a lot from yesterday, and not just about Kirk. Other players "failed the audition" while the lack of leadership in the first 11 is even worse in the reserve 11.
By all means give Tedic a run out. And McGrandles if needs be. But start with 4 or 5 of your regular starters. What is it we are persistently told about having a spine of a team.
Brian Clough is regarded as one of this counties best ever managers. He would never have made 11 changes to a side that had just won their first away game of the season.
Play your best players. Win the game. Then make changes.
Appleton picked a starting XI that had almost 1600 combined senior league appearances between them. It’s not as if he played a group of 18 year olds that barely had 50 senior appearances between them and they got outmuscled.Whatever combination of full time pros he picked, it should have been comfortable against 8th tier opposition.
As much as you can post how many combined professional league games these players have, are we going to pretend that equates to being genuinely good at football? There's so much luck involved sometimes and we have seen some right guff play here.
It's similar to the manager merry go round, some players stay in the cycle of getting contracts as teams take a chance based on previous records, some of these players under contract here may genuinely be operating at a national league level and below.
League appareances are as relevant as xG stats to me personally, doesn't win anything when it's all said and done, just excuses and distractions from the actual results.
Have the players we played yesterday collectively fooled EFL calibre managers almost 1600 times? A few times with a few dodgy managers is possible. 1600 times is not.
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Separate question that I’d love to hear answers to: take yesterday’s team selection, and the U21s only as options off the bench, what do you think that squad’s natural level would be?
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I am not disputing they have appearances, I am saying that isn't always evidence to how a player should perform. Some players can decline rapidly between years or have a complete change mentally while under contract.Callumcafc said:
Come on mate, these players still are full time professionals against 8th tier part timers.Braziliance said:
Portsmouth vs Chesterfield is completely incomparable tbh.Callumcafc said:
Playing your best players doesn’t guarantee shit. Ask Portsmouth how their first choice XI got on yesterday.golfaddick said:
The problem isn't playing those players. The problem is playing them all together & expect them to play as a team.killerandflash said:Lets examine that starting 11
Walker - In Isted's absence, he's our No 2 keeper. If we can't play him against an 8th tier team, when can we play him?
Abankwah - Not a RB, but would Asiimwe or T Watson have been much different?
Ness - Wasn't everyone screaming for Hector to be dropped and Ness to replace him?
Thomas - Has been a regular at LB, so again perfectly reasonable to play him in his correct position
Edun - Our 1st choice LB coming back from injury. The perfect game for him to get some minutes
Anderson - Talented youngster, started the season well
McGrandles - Has done well under Appleton previously. A perfect opportunity to give him some minutes after his injury
Fraser - "The Scottish Pirlo". Was one of the 1st names on the teamsheet at the start of the season before his injury.
Kirk - The ideal opportunity to get some confidence into him
Tedic - Not been given a chance to play as a No 9, the perfect chance for him to get a goal or 2 and get some confidence
Chem - Many people have been questioning why he hasn't been in the matchday squads
It didn't work, but I can understand why Appleton picked that team. He would have learned a lot from yesterday, and not just about Kirk. Other players "failed the audition" while the lack of leadership in the first 11 is even worse in the reserve 11.
By all means give Tedic a run out. And McGrandles if needs be. But start with 4 or 5 of your regular starters. What is it we are persistently told about having a spine of a team.
Brian Clough is regarded as one of this counties best ever managers. He would never have made 11 changes to a side that had just won their first away game of the season.
Play your best players. Win the game. Then make changes.
Appleton picked a starting XI that had almost 1600 combined senior league appearances between them. It’s not as if he played a group of 18 year olds that barely had 50 senior appearances between them and they got outmuscled.Whatever combination of full time pros he picked, it should have been comfortable against 8th tier opposition.
Chesterfield are a national league side, that are flying, have a manager in Paul Cook and players like Will Grigg, Tom Naylor and Michael Jacobs. They were also at home.
Chesterfield would probably beat a handful of teams in league 2 and could probably even get a few results in this league. They would have smashed Cray Valley.
We severely overrate some of these players collectivelyThat’s not overrating them, that’s a fact. I’d be very concerned if all of a sudden half of our squad’s true level was the 8th tier. It’s not, they just put in one of the most rank performances of all time.These players have hundreds of EFL appearances at League One and League Two level, if not higher. Nothing to do with us as fans under or overrating anyone.
That's the nature of competition and a footballing pyramid. Right now there will be players in league 2 who are operating well below their level and will be noticed sooner or later, just like there will be players on the books of Premier league clubs who are operating way above their station, Tedic is an example of this. I doubt however, that players in division 7 or whatever it is are operating at a division 3 level as the gap is usually too drastic.
Last night you have to make a decision imo, you believe either those players aren't fit for purpose or the manager isn't. Cray Valley operate in the Isthmian South East, which I was genuinely shocked to find out is the same league as Ashford United where I know the level of those players.
I genuinely find it inconceivable to accept that a team, that as we keep getting reminded, separate us by over 100 league places, could get a result against us.
I think the mood is actually quite tame all things considered, as it has to be one of the most disgraceful results in my lifetime of supporting this team0 -
But playing your reserves seems toCallumcafc said:
Playing your best players doesn’t guarantee shit. Ask Portsmouth how their first choice XI got on yesterday.golfaddick said:
The problem isn't playing those players. The problem is playing them all together & expect them to play as a team.killerandflash said:Lets examine that starting 11
Walker - In Isted's absence, he's our No 2 keeper. If we can't play him against an 8th tier team, when can we play him?
Abankwah - Not a RB, but would Asiimwe or T Watson have been much different?
Ness - Wasn't everyone screaming for Hector to be dropped and Ness to replace him?
Thomas - Has been a regular at LB, so again perfectly reasonable to play him in his correct position
Edun - Our 1st choice LB coming back from injury. The perfect game for him to get some minutes
Anderson - Talented youngster, started the season well
McGrandles - Has done well under Appleton previously. A perfect opportunity to give him some minutes after his injury
Fraser - "The Scottish Pirlo". Was one of the 1st names on the teamsheet at the start of the season before his injury.
Kirk - The ideal opportunity to get some confidence into him
Tedic - Not been given a chance to play as a No 9, the perfect chance for him to get a goal or 2 and get some confidence
Chem - Many people have been questioning why he hasn't been in the matchday squads
It didn't work, but I can understand why Appleton picked that team. He would have learned a lot from yesterday, and not just about Kirk. Other players "failed the audition" while the lack of leadership in the first 11 is even worse in the reserve 11.
By all means give Tedic a run out. And McGrandles if needs be. But start with 4 or 5 of your regular starters. What is it we are persistently told about having a spine of a team.
Brian Clough is regarded as one of this counties best ever managers. He would never have made 11 changes to a side that had just won their first away game of the season.
Play your best players. Win the game. Then make changes.
Appleton picked a starting XI that had almost 1600 combined senior league appearances between them. It’s not as if he played a group of 18 year olds that barely had 50 senior appearances between them and they got outmuscled.Whatever combination of full time pros he picked, it should have been comfortable against 8th tier opposition.1 -
Promotion is a Want, Playoffs is a must and top 10 is the very least we should expect. #PeanutsMolloy said:No criticism of Appleton from me.
It's League outcome that's the ONLY test as far as I'm concerned. I couldn't even give a **** about potentially going out to CV if we're we're top 6 come May.
It was a good idea IMHO to test the fringe players - a valuable lesson that, bar Chem Campbell and Fraser, they're not contenders for a 1st team start.
Despite the poor performance, we had enough chances to win it second half. Any other player (bar maybe the keeper) would have finished at least 1 of the 2 fluffed by Kirk, who is surely now finished at CAFC.
Last night was shit, but Cray Valley came to do a job and our lot came to collect a paycheck. They made us look non-league as we were both so shite. All of the starting 11 should hang their heads in shame. Ness was unlucky to score an own goal, but the whole defence was poor even without that. The keeper must be an emergencies only option or we're in trouble.
The midfield was woeful. Side pass, side pass, back to defence.
Fraser's run and finish were the only good things he did all game. I thought he'd come alive after scoring instead he just took his foot off the gas in a 'Job done' kind of way.
The attack well Tedic looked better up front than he does out wide, but that wasn't hard.2 -
That 11 Should have beat Cray Valley - But didn't.
It obvious some of the players shouldn't and hopefully wont, be used again.
Some players were 'rested' but we now have another fixture - meaning some players will play 3 games in 7 days.
All the above means Appleton fucked up.1 -
There are a whole host of teams playing at Level 7 or 8 which makes our result even worse. The first 6 levels have one division per level.Braziliance said:
I am not disputing they have appearances, I am saying that isn't always evidence to how a player should perform. Some players can decline rapidly between years or have a complete change mentally while under contract.Callumcafc said:
Come on mate, these players still are full time professionals against 8th tier part timers.Braziliance said:
Portsmouth vs Chesterfield is completely incomparable tbh.Callumcafc said:
Playing your best players doesn’t guarantee shit. Ask Portsmouth how their first choice XI got on yesterday.golfaddick said:
The problem isn't playing those players. The problem is playing them all together & expect them to play as a team.killerandflash said:Lets examine that starting 11
Walker - In Isted's absence, he's our No 2 keeper. If we can't play him against an 8th tier team, when can we play him?
Abankwah - Not a RB, but would Asiimwe or T Watson have been much different?
Ness - Wasn't everyone screaming for Hector to be dropped and Ness to replace him?
Thomas - Has been a regular at LB, so again perfectly reasonable to play him in his correct position
Edun - Our 1st choice LB coming back from injury. The perfect game for him to get some minutes
Anderson - Talented youngster, started the season well
McGrandles - Has done well under Appleton previously. A perfect opportunity to give him some minutes after his injury
Fraser - "The Scottish Pirlo". Was one of the 1st names on the teamsheet at the start of the season before his injury.
Kirk - The ideal opportunity to get some confidence into him
Tedic - Not been given a chance to play as a No 9, the perfect chance for him to get a goal or 2 and get some confidence
Chem - Many people have been questioning why he hasn't been in the matchday squads
It didn't work, but I can understand why Appleton picked that team. He would have learned a lot from yesterday, and not just about Kirk. Other players "failed the audition" while the lack of leadership in the first 11 is even worse in the reserve 11.
By all means give Tedic a run out. And McGrandles if needs be. But start with 4 or 5 of your regular starters. What is it we are persistently told about having a spine of a team.
Brian Clough is regarded as one of this counties best ever managers. He would never have made 11 changes to a side that had just won their first away game of the season.
Play your best players. Win the game. Then make changes.
Appleton picked a starting XI that had almost 1600 combined senior league appearances between them. It’s not as if he played a group of 18 year olds that barely had 50 senior appearances between them and they got outmuscled.Whatever combination of full time pros he picked, it should have been comfortable against 8th tier opposition.
Chesterfield are a national league side, that are flying, have a manager in Paul Cook and players like Will Grigg, Tom Naylor and Michael Jacobs. They were also at home.
Chesterfield would probably beat a handful of teams in league 2 and could probably even get a few results in this league. They would have smashed Cray Valley.
We severely overrate some of these players collectivelyThat’s not overrating them, that’s a fact. I’d be very concerned if all of a sudden half of our squad’s true level was the 8th tier. It’s not, they just put in one of the most rank performances of all time.These players have hundreds of EFL appearances at League One and League Two level, if not higher. Nothing to do with us as fans under or overrating anyone.
That's the nature of competition and a footballing pyramid. Right now there will be players in league 2 who are operating well below their level and will be noticed sooner or later, just like there will be players on the books of Premier league clubs who are operating way above their station, Tedic is an example of this. I doubt however, that players in division 7 or whatever it is are operating at a division 3 level as the gap is usually too drastic.
Last night you have to make a decision imo, you believe either those players aren't fit for purpose or the manager isn't. Cray Valley operate in the Isthmian South East, which I was genuinely shocked to find out is the same league as Ashford United where I know the level of those players.
I genuinely find it inconceivable to accept that a team, that as we keep getting reminded, separate us by over 100 league places, could get a result against us.
I think the mood is actually quite tame all things considered, as it has to be one of the most disgraceful results in my lifetime of supporting this team
Not in my wildest dreams did I imagine such a poor performance.0 -
PWR.
' Er' Indoors' said they were bloody lucky not to lose that and refused to use the Charlton glass she normally takes to bed with water in it.
The above eloquently expresses my feelings about Charlton's performance (or rather lack of) against Cray Valley. I could write reams more and add nothing.4
