Every member of the SACB should fall on his/her sword after this pathetic performance, which was always on the cards. A complete overhaul of cricket in South Africa is required and it's time they took their heads out of the sand where they're currently but unsuccessfully trying to hide. Resign now if you want to retain one iota of respect... And so on, and so forth.
As you were. The SA result against the Netherlands was a blip, as against beating SL by 104 runs, Australia by 134 runs and England by 229 runs. Whereas England, losing three of our four matches, by 9 wickets against NZ, by 69 runs against Afghanistan and by 229 runs against SA are guilty of abject failure.
That is a reflection of the scant disregard that we paid to a World Cup in terms of preparation in preference to the ECB's very own mickey mouse competition. We had the opportunity to play more international 50 over games and for all the players to play in the Metro Bank but chose not to. "We don't plan to fail but fail to plan" springs to mind.
More great decision making by England. It looks like Topley has broken his finger. Archer is the named replacement and out in India for that reason but won't be considered for the rest of the tournament. So, if Archer isn't fit, what is he doing out there as it means we now have to fly a replacement in.
Mott also confirmed that they are unlikely to play with just six batsmen again meaning that either Livingstone or Moeen will return. So, who will they drop and get that balance?
Every member of the SACB should fall on his/her sword after this pathetic performance, which was always on the cards. A complete overhaul of cricket in South Africa is required and it's time they took their heads out of the sand where they're currently but unsuccessfully trying to hide. Resign now if you want to retain one iota of respect... And so on, and so forth.
As you were. The SA result against the Netherlands was a blip, as against beating SL by 104 runs, Australia by 134 runs and England by 229 runs. Whereas England, losing three of our four matches, by 9 wickets against NZ, by 69 runs against Afghanistan and by 229 runs against SA are guilty of abject failure.
That is a reflection of the scant disregard that we paid to a World Cup in terms of preparation in preference to the ECB's very own mickey mouse competition. We had the opportunity to play more international 50 over games and for all the players to play in the Metro Bank but chose not to. "We don't plan to fail but fail to plan" springs to mind.
As above but also
Poor team selection
Poor decision making from the toss onwards..that was a crazy decision
Poor captaincy ( didn't realise we d miss Morgan that much ) ,the wicket keeper can't skipper when the bowlers are under the pump..topley,Atkinson ,Willey and Wood were like startled rabbits in the last 12 overs( where the game was lost) ..the skipper should be fielding inside the circle at extra cover or midwicket..not squeaking from behind the wicket
Realistically, however bad it is to get hammered by SA and NZ, we didn't need either of those games. Realistically those 2 are going to qualify along with India and the top 3 are going to beat pretty much anyone. England are in a fight with Australia and Pakistan for the fourth slot. Beat those two and we should be favourites to qualify even if our run rate takes another hammering in the India game. Beat the other two mid-ranked teams and avoid another disaster against a smaller team and we're there.
Obviously, whether we can actually beat both Australia and Pakistan is another question.
Realistically, however bad it is to get hammered by SA and NZ, we didn't need either of those games. Realistically those 2 are going to qualify along with India and the top 3 are going to beat pretty much anyone. England are in a fight with Australia and Pakistan for the fourth slot. Beat those two and we should be favourites to qualify even if our run rate takes another hammering in the India game. Beat the other two mid-ranked teams and avoid another disaster against a smaller team and we're there.
Obviously, whether we can actually beat both Australia and Pakistan is another question.
Lol
As if we can beat both Australia and Pakistan Undercooked Injured Stokes- why? Play him or don't take him? Moeen? Archer?
Realistically, however bad it is to get hammered by SA and NZ, we didn't need either of those games. Realistically those 2 are going to qualify along with India and the top 3 are going to beat pretty much anyone. England are in a fight with Australia and Pakistan for the fourth slot. Beat those two and we should be favourites to qualify even if our run rate takes another hammering in the India game. Beat the other two mid-ranked teams and avoid another disaster against a smaller team and we're there.
Obviously, whether we can actually beat both Australia and Pakistan is another question.
If we do lose to India and beat Australia, we are almost certainly reliant on NZ beating Australia too because their other three games are against Netherlands, Afghanistan and Bangladesh. Even then, we need a better NRR than Australia which is an ask in itself given that we are only off the bottom by 0.002. To put our chances in perspective, if we take the win market as a guide, Australia are currently second favourites on Betfair at 5.50 and we are available at almost seven times that price at 38.00. In fact, even winning our final five games doesn't guarantee us a place if the other results go against us. We are also talking about a side that has lost three of their first four games and comfortably too.
Realistically, however bad it is to get hammered by SA and NZ, we didn't need either of those games. Realistically those 2 are going to qualify along with India and the top 3 are going to beat pretty much anyone. England are in a fight with Australia and Pakistan for the fourth slot. Beat those two and we should be favourites to qualify even if our run rate takes another hammering in the India game. Beat the other two mid-ranked teams and avoid another disaster against a smaller team and we're there.
Obviously, whether we can actually beat both Australia and Pakistan is another question.
If we do lose to India and beat Australia, we are almost certainly reliant on NZ beating Australia too because their other three games are against Netherlands, Afghanistan and Bangladesh. Even then, we need a better NRR than Australia which is an ask in itself given that we are only off the bottom by 0.002. To put our chances in perspective, if we take the win market as a guide, Australia are currently second favourites on Betfair at 5.50 and we are available at almost seven times that price at 38.00. In fact, even winning our final five games doesn't guarantee us a place if the other results go against us. We are also talking about a side that has lost three of their first four games and comfortably too.
This is the worst thing. We're effectively out, the players look like they don't want to be there, we're clearly carrying some injuries............and we have 5 more games to endure!
Some of our players have totally lost both form and confidence. I'm not sure why this has happened as we went into this competition with high hopes. The Hundred certainly plays a part as our 50 over domestic competition now mainly consists of counties playing their reserves. Not ideal in preparing for a world Cup. But I believe our problems lie deeper than that. Buttler seems to be a poor captain and is unable to lift the players in the same way as Morgan could. The whole squad give the impression that they would rather be back home and not having to be here. And Stokes should have had his knee sorted months ago and now been recovering for the winter ahead. All in all a proper shit show.
Some of our players have totally lost both form and confidence. I'm not sure why this has happened as we went into this competition with high hopes. The Hundred certainly plays a part as our 50 over domestic competition now mainly consists of counties playing their reserves. Not ideal in preparing for a world Cup. But I believe our problems lie deeper than that. Buttler seems to be a poor captain and is unable to lift the players in the same way as Morgan could. The whole squad give the impression that they would rather be back home and not having to be here. And Stokes should have had his knee sorted months ago and now been recovering for the winter ahead. All in all a proper shit show.
I questioned at the time the appointment of Buttler (and got laughed at by the usual suspect for doing so) for a number of reasons - his lack of captaincy experience but most of all because he was having to do three jobs with that lack of experience. So, with that lack of experience and "feel", what does someone like Buttler do? He resorts to data rather than a feel for a situation. Hence electing to field yesterday because data suggests that this is what he should do. Data based on IPL stats regarding the "dew factor" where games finish that much later and that has far more influence. And not thinking for one minute what the severe heat would do to the players. The same data that suggested we could get away with having just five bowlers with no consideration for the affects of heat on those or that the likes of Topley, Wood etc are capable of breaking down at any time.
As for "losing form", I would question what that form is based on? If we accept that 50 over cricket is a different animal to Test and T20 cricket, how have we assessed that form? On what basis did we come to the conclusion that this was the best 15 when we named that provisional squad? The current Indian side averages 15 ODIs in the last year. England's team averages 5 matches. That's 10 more games, on average, for each of those players to not just assess the form but to give players the ideal preparation for the biggest international competition. A couple of people on here have quite rightly suggested that we were either going to return triumphant or discover that this was one tournament too far for this group of players. Others have commented how deep our resources are and that we could put out another ODI side. But what chance did we give ourselves to test those fringe players?
As for not looking like a team, it is difficult to argue with that. That said, the easiest team in the world to captain is one that is constantly winning. If we take, again, India, for example, all their players know their roles, who is going to be in the team, what number they will be batting, who will be bowling at any particular time etc etc. NZ and SA are much the same. We seem absolutely clueless, at times, about each of those aspects. Add to that the fact that Buttler has the knowledge that, onlooking, is one former England captain (Root) and one current one (Stokes) who might be well be thinking "what is he doing?" at times.
As much as many on here won't, naturally, be bothered about what happens from here on in, you can bet your bottom dollar that any number of our squad would rather be back home right now. Everything about their body language suggests that to be the case.
Having said all that we have said about Buttler's decision to field, Sharma has done the same and their fielding is becoming increasingly sloppy. Players also seem to be leaving the field left, right and centre
125-2 off 25 from 19-2 off 8.1 thanks to a 106 partnership between Ravindra (57) and Mitchell (46)
KL Rahul is the epitome of what someone who some pundits wax lyrically about when he takes a spectacular one handed diving catch but who consistently makes basic mistakes that they don't pick him up on. Dropped catch, byes and some very sloppy glove work today.
This really is a bat-first world cup, demonstrably so
There is another factor, allied to batting first and that is the preservation of wickets inside that first Power Play (PP). As much as the perception might be that a team, with just two fielders out, should get a big total in that first 10 overs, it is far more important not to lose any more than the one wicket.
Below are the top 12 scores to date, whether they batted first (F) or second (S) and won (W) or lost (L). The average score of the 8 teams batting first below after the PP, is 61 after 10 overs - but, more to the point, those 8 sides only lost 3 wickets between them in total. In fact, one of the lowest opening PP (48-1) resulted in the highest tournament score (428-5) :
Afghanistan v England 79-0 284-10 (F) (W) NZ v Afghanistan 43-1 288-6 (F) (W) Pakistan v Australia 61-0 305-10 (S) (L) SA v Australia 53-0 311-7 (F) (W) NZ v Netherlands 63-0 322-7 (F) (W) SL v SA 94-2 326-10 (S) (L) SL v Pakistan 58-1 344-9 (S) (L) Pakistan v SL 48-2 345-4 (S) (W) England v Bangladesh 61-0 364-9 (F) (W) Australia v Pakistan 82-0 367-9 (F) (W) SA v England 59-1 399-7 (F) (W) SA v SL 48-1 428-5 (F) (W)
Comments
170 all out. South Africa win by 229 runs
Bloody cheats.
I demand a re-match.
100 combined between the rest of them..!
From front on you can see that once it's thrown up in the air it lands & touches the boundary.
Joint bottom.
So so poor.
That is a reflection of the scant disregard that we paid to a World Cup in terms of preparation in preference to the ECB's very own mickey mouse competition. We had the opportunity to play more international 50 over games and for all the players to play in the Metro Bank but chose not to. "We don't plan to fail but fail to plan" springs to mind.
Mott also confirmed that they are unlikely to play with just six batsmen again meaning that either Livingstone or Moeen will return. So, who will they drop and get that balance?
Poor team selection
Poor decision making from the toss onwards..that was a crazy decision
Poor captaincy ( didn't realise we d miss Morgan that much ) ,the wicket keeper can't skipper when the bowlers are under the pump..topley,Atkinson ,Willey and Wood were like startled rabbits in the last 12 overs( where the game was lost) ..the skipper should be fielding inside the circle at extra cover or midwicket..not squeaking from behind the wicket
Obviously, whether we can actually beat both Australia and Pakistan is another question.
As if we can beat both Australia and Pakistan
Undercooked
Injured
Stokes- why? Play him or don't take him?
Moeen?
Archer?
Hopeless
I'm not sure why this has happened as we went into this competition with high hopes.
The Hundred certainly plays a part as our 50 over domestic competition now mainly consists of counties playing their reserves.
Not ideal in preparing for a world Cup.
But I believe our problems lie deeper than that.
Buttler seems to be a poor captain and is unable to lift the players in the same way as Morgan could.
The whole squad give the impression that they would rather be back home and not having to be here.
And Stokes should have had his knee sorted months ago and now been recovering for the winter ahead.
All in all a proper shit show.
As for "losing form", I would question what that form is based on? If we accept that 50 over cricket is a different animal to Test and T20 cricket, how have we assessed that form? On what basis did we come to the conclusion that this was the best 15 when we named that provisional squad? The current Indian side averages 15 ODIs in the last year. England's team averages 5 matches. That's 10 more games, on average, for each of those players to not just assess the form but to give players the ideal preparation for the biggest international competition. A couple of people on here have quite rightly suggested that we were either going to return triumphant or discover that this was one tournament too far for this group of players. Others have commented how deep our resources are and that we could put out another ODI side. But what chance did we give ourselves to test those fringe players?
As for not looking like a team, it is difficult to argue with that. That said, the easiest team in the world to captain is one that is constantly winning. If we take, again, India, for example, all their players know their roles, who is going to be in the team, what number they will be batting, who will be bowling at any particular time etc etc. NZ and SA are much the same. We seem absolutely clueless, at times, about each of those aspects. Add to that the fact that Buttler has the knowledge that, onlooking, is one former England captain (Root) and one current one (Stokes) who might be well be thinking "what is he doing?" at times.
As much as many on here won't, naturally, be bothered about what happens from here on in, you can bet your bottom dollar that any number of our squad would rather be back home right now. Everything about their body language suggests that to be the case.
125-2 off 25 from 19-2 off 8.1 thanks to a 106 partnership between Ravindra (57) and Mitchell (46)
Mitchell 99* (98)
273 all out off 50
Below are the top 12 scores to date, whether they batted first (F) or second (S) and won (W) or lost (L). The average score of the 8 teams batting first below after the PP, is 61 after 10 overs - but, more to the point, those 8 sides only lost 3 wickets between them in total. In fact, one of the lowest opening PP (48-1) resulted in the highest tournament score (428-5) :
Afghanistan v England 79-0 284-10 (F) (W)
NZ v Afghanistan 43-1 288-6 (F) (W)
Pakistan v Australia 61-0 305-10 (S) (L)
SA v Australia 53-0 311-7 (F) (W)
NZ v Netherlands 63-0 322-7 (F) (W)
SL v SA 94-2 326-10 (S) (L)
SL v Pakistan 58-1 344-9 (S) (L)
Pakistan v SL 48-2 345-4 (S) (W)
England v Bangladesh 61-0 364-9 (F) (W)
Australia v Pakistan 82-0 367-9 (F) (W)
SA v England 59-1 399-7 (F) (W)
SA v SL 48-1 428-5 (F) (W)