Experienced manager at this level usually means someone who is a journeyman that isn’t good enough to operate above League 1.
ie - Adkins, Parkinson, Slade etc.
What’s the point? It doesn’t progress us anywhere.
Completely agree.
"We need an experienced manager" used to come up whenever Parky, Powell etc were struggling. The idea that this mythical experienced L1 manager is out there and available after a career full of L1 promotions.
If they're that good they don't stay at this level for long. Adkins is an example of that, he's had a career mainly in the Championship since taking Southampton up. Finally dropped back down because it was probably a choice between smaller struggling Championship clubs or a big L1 club.
A lot of successful managers at this level are on the younger side, I do wonder if it's often down to them being hungrier to do well and finding it easier to relate and understand players. The younger first team players grew up in a different time to the players Adkins managed at Scunthorpe and Southampton, passing it out from the back being much more common at all levels from academies to first teams.
Adkins seems reliant on having good technical footballers who naturally play that way, such as JFC dropping deep to collect the ball from the defence and comfortably passing it out. That Southampton team was full of players who had a lot of potential including Lallana and Lambert who went on to play for England.
When you see clubs such as Cheltenham looking so composed on the ball that's down to recruitment, coaching and management. They don't have the budget to find solid defenders who are also great on the ball, they're getting the most of what they have.
Take a chance on JJ and Euell as caretakers. We might have something special there, if not look at upcoming L1/L2 managers who play good football.
I think for me as some have mentioned previously too, the manager needs to have enough influence on the squad personnel wise to be able to play how he wants, as well as match to match tactics, so he can be responsible for success on the pitch.
If he’s denied this through interference or budget, can he be held responsible?
That’s the decision TS needs to make. Of course once the rot truly sets in he has to do something anyway regardless. Tough business football.
The problem with Jackson/Euell is that if they do come in and continue to do poorly. Some people will be so against firing them, that we'll just go on a downward spiral until it's too late this season.
Jackson and Euell will be given the whole season, the players will be blamed and they'll get another chance. Then another poor season and we're a League Two club for 2 seasons.
The problem with Jackson/Euell is that if they do come in and continue to do poorly. Some people will be so against firing them, that we'll just go on a downward spiral until it's too late this season.
Jackson and Euell will be given the whole season, the players will be blamed and they'll get another chance. Then another poor season and we're a League Two club for 2 seasons.
Woah, hang on a minute. You're already talking about sacking Adkins replacement(s)?
Have I missed something here?
Fucking hell, this is getting more and more surreal.
The problem with Jackson/Euell is that if they do come in and continue to do poorly. Some people will be so against firing them, that we'll just go on a downward spiral until it's too late this season.
Jackson and Euell will be given the whole season, the players will be blamed and they'll get another chance. Then another poor season and we're a League Two club for 2 seasons.
The same can be said about any replacement surely? Whether it’s Jackson, Euell or anybody else.
The problem with Jackson/Euell is that if they do come in and continue to do poorly. Some people will be so against firing them, that we'll just go on a downward spiral until it's too late this season.
Jackson and Euell will be given the whole season, the players will be blamed and they'll get another chance. Then another poor season and we're a League Two club for 2 seasons.
That's a massive leap from giving them a few games as caretaker to us spending two seasons in L2.
If we bring in a permanent manager and they struggle we'll have to pay off another long term contract.
If JJ and Euell do poorly a few extreme optimists won't keep them in the job. They can start as caretakers and we'll see if Adkins is the problem, we can't do that with anyone else.
The problem with Jackson/Euell is that if they do come in and continue to do poorly. Some people will be so against firing them, that we'll just go on a downward spiral until it's too late this season.
Jackson and Euell will be given the whole season, the players will be blamed and they'll get another chance. Then another poor season and we're a League Two club for 2 seasons.
That's a massive leap from giving them a few games as caretaker to us spending two seasons in L2.
If we bring in a permanent manager and they struggle we'll have to pay off another long term contract.
If JJ and Euell do poorly a few extreme optimists won't keep them in the job. They can start as caretakers and we'll see if Adkins is the problem, we can't do that with anyone else.
The problem with Jackson/Euell is that if they do come in and continue to do poorly. Some people will be so against firing them, that we'll just go on a downward spiral until it's too late this season.
Jackson and Euell will be given the whole season, the players will be blamed and they'll get another chance. Then another poor season and we're a League Two club for 2 seasons.
That's a massive leap from giving them a few games as caretaker to us spending two seasons in L2.
If we bring in a permanent manager and they struggle we'll have to pay off another long term contract.
If JJ and Euell do poorly a few extreme optimists won't keep them in the job. They can start as caretakers and we'll see if Adkins is the problem, we can't do that with anyone else.
What happens if Adkins wasnt the problem?
Don't give them the job permanently and bring in someone from outside the club.
The problem with Jackson/Euell is that if they do come in and continue to do poorly. Some people will be so against firing them, that we'll just go on a downward spiral until it's too late this season.
Jackson and Euell will be given the whole season, the players will be blamed and they'll get another chance. Then another poor season and we're a League Two club for 2 seasons.
That's a massive leap from giving them a few games as caretaker to us spending two seasons in L2.
If we bring in a permanent manager and they struggle we'll have to pay off another long term contract.
If JJ and Euell do poorly a few extreme optimists won't keep them in the job. They can start as caretakers and we'll see if Adkins is the problem, we can't do that with anyone else.
What happens if Adkins wasnt the problem?
Don't give them the job permanently and bring in someone from outside the club.
The problem with Jackson/Euell is that if they do come in and continue to do poorly. Some people will be so against firing them, that we'll just go on a downward spiral until it's too late this season.
Jackson and Euell will be given the whole season, the players will be blamed and they'll get another chance. Then another poor season and we're a League Two club for 2 seasons.
That's a massive leap from giving them a few games as caretaker to us spending two seasons in L2.
If we bring in a permanent manager and they struggle we'll have to pay off another long term contract.
If JJ and Euell do poorly a few extreme optimists won't keep them in the job. They can start as caretakers and we'll see if Adkins is the problem, we can't do that with anyone else.
What happens if Adkins wasnt the problem?
Don't give them the job permanently and bring in someone from outside the club.
What then happens to that someone outside if we are not getting the results after 15 games?
The problem with Jackson/Euell is that if they do come in and continue to do poorly. Some people will be so against firing them, that we'll just go on a downward spiral until it's too late this season.
Jackson and Euell will be given the whole season, the players will be blamed and they'll get another chance. Then another poor season and we're a League Two club for 2 seasons.
That's a massive leap from giving them a few games as caretaker to us spending two seasons in L2.
If we bring in a permanent manager and they struggle we'll have to pay off another long term contract.
If JJ and Euell do poorly a few extreme optimists won't keep them in the job. They can start as caretakers and we'll see if Adkins is the problem, we can't do that with anyone else.
What happens if Adkins wasnt the problem?
Don't give them the job permanently and bring in someone from outside the club.
And keep JJ and Euall in their current jobs?
Could go either way depending how they do and what the new manager wants. I'd rather a new manager had their own staff.
The problem with Jackson/Euell is that if they do come in and continue to do poorly. Some people will be so against firing them, that we'll just go on a downward spiral until it's too late this season.
Jackson and Euell will be given the whole season, the players will be blamed and they'll get another chance. Then another poor season and we're a League Two club for 2 seasons.
That's a massive leap from giving them a few games as caretaker to us spending two seasons in L2.
If we bring in a permanent manager and they struggle we'll have to pay off another long term contract.
If JJ and Euell do poorly a few extreme optimists won't keep them in the job. They can start as caretakers and we'll see if Adkins is the problem, we can't do that with anyone else.
What happens if Adkins wasnt the problem?
Don't give them the job permanently and bring in someone from outside the club.
What then happens to that someone outside if we are not getting the results after 15 games?
Going off this logic, no manager would be sacked, ever.
The problem with Jackson/Euell is that if they do come in and continue to do poorly. Some people will be so against firing them, that we'll just go on a downward spiral until it's too late this season.
Jackson and Euell will be given the whole season, the players will be blamed and they'll get another chance. Then another poor season and we're a League Two club for 2 seasons.
That's a massive leap from giving them a few games as caretaker to us spending two seasons in L2.
If we bring in a permanent manager and they struggle we'll have to pay off another long term contract.
If JJ and Euell do poorly a few extreme optimists won't keep them in the job. They can start as caretakers and we'll see if Adkins is the problem, we can't do that with anyone else.
What happens if Adkins wasnt the problem?
Don't give them the job permanently and bring in someone from outside the club.
What then happens to that someone outside if we are not getting the results after 15 games?
That's not a reason to stick with NA if it's not working. Whatever your opinion on the squad I'm sure the majority agree it's not the 23rd best squad in the division. I expect he'll get a couple more games at the very least so we need to at least see signs we're improving, even if we don't immediately get results. So far we've not shown anything like that, every area of our game is lacking, defending, passing, pressing and attacking. Even the effort doesn't seem to be there.
The problem with Jackson/Euell is that if they do come in and continue to do poorly. Some people will be so against firing them, that we'll just go on a downward spiral until it's too late this season.
Jackson and Euell will be given the whole season, the players will be blamed and they'll get another chance. Then another poor season and we're a League Two club for 2 seasons.
That's a massive leap from giving them a few games as caretaker to us spending two seasons in L2.
If we bring in a permanent manager and they struggle we'll have to pay off another long term contract.
If JJ and Euell do poorly a few extreme optimists won't keep them in the job. They can start as caretakers and we'll see if Adkins is the problem, we can't do that with anyone else.
What happens if Adkins wasnt the problem?
Don't give them the job permanently and bring in someone from outside the club.
What then happens to that someone outside if we are not getting the results after 15 games?
Again, the idea is they do get the results cos the current one is the problem. That’s the entire reason why fans want him gone, we believe things will get better. I don’t get the point you’re trying to make.
Get the wet fish out and get a decent manager in. Should have kept Pratley for another year He had fight and leadership. Before anyone replies...check the league table....pathetic
If something is going to change then surely it's best be decisive and do it sooner rather than later, but reckon it needs be with someone ready to come in straight away and with the intention of sticking with them.
Can't be doing with a caretaker set up until the end of the season or whatever, better keeping it as it is now
My worry is no matter who we get in as manager, are we the fans going to give that manager the time to work with thier squad?
We’re a demanding fan base but only because we are at the lowest we’ve been for donkeys years. The expectation for this season has already plummeted, so someone coming in now, early doors, is ideal before we find ourselves in a relegation battle.
But whether or not Adkins is sacked - if the set-up & staffing doesn't change, both in recruitment and off the pitch, I think we'll still be in the brown stuff.
Thing is we don't know what is wrong, is it the manager or is it the setup, nobody knows. But we can see results are terrible and something has to change, if it is the setup that has not made Adkins job easy, it might be because he doesn't suit the setup, then the next manager might work well in it.
Chris Wilder is old school and he would want full control, if Roddy etc pick the players we aren't the club for him.
Recruitment was lethargic. Way too late making those signings. But now we have a full squad we need to give the fella a few more games to see if he can make it work.
Unpopular opinion because the witch hunt appears to be in full effect but I wouldn’t sack him, yet. My thinking is this:
- the transfer window was pretty decent in the end - I believe the squad we have should be able to challenge for the playoffs, any less would be a failure of management, recruitment or both - all that said, the recruitment was only completed 14 days ago (including Souare, who I think is going to be key to unlocking Kirk) - given the international break we’re effectively judging a manager who has had his full squad for a couple of training sessions and one match, I’m willing to give it a bit longer (but my patience is finite)
Another reason I don’t agree with sacking him just yet is that many of the voices calling for it are at the same time advocating some combination of Jackson or Euell and or Curbishley. I would hate to be associated with minds so unimaginative.
Comments
"We need an experienced manager" used to come up whenever Parky, Powell etc were struggling. The idea that this mythical experienced L1 manager is out there and available after a career full of L1 promotions.
If they're that good they don't stay at this level for long. Adkins is an example of that, he's had a career mainly in the Championship since taking Southampton up. Finally dropped back down because it was probably a choice between smaller struggling Championship clubs or a big L1 club.
A lot of successful managers at this level are on the younger side, I do wonder if it's often down to them being hungrier to do well and finding it easier to relate and understand players. The younger first team players grew up in a different time to the players Adkins managed at Scunthorpe and Southampton, passing it out from the back being much more common at all levels from academies to first teams.
Adkins seems reliant on having good technical footballers who naturally play that way, such as JFC dropping deep to collect the ball from the defence and comfortably passing it out. That Southampton team was full of players who had a lot of potential including Lallana and Lambert who went on to play for England.
When you see clubs such as Cheltenham looking so composed on the ball that's down to recruitment, coaching and management. They don't have the budget to find solid defenders who are also great on the ball, they're getting the most of what they have.
Take a chance on JJ and Euell as caretakers. We might have something special there, if not look at upcoming L1/L2 managers who play good football.
That’s the decision TS needs to make. Of course once the rot truly sets in he has to do something anyway regardless. Tough business football.
Jackson and Euell will be given the whole season, the players will be blamed and they'll get another chance. Then another poor season and we're a League Two club for 2 seasons.
Have I missed something here?
Fucking hell, this is getting more and more surreal.
If we bring in a permanent manager and they struggle we'll have to pay off another long term contract.
If JJ and Euell do poorly a few extreme optimists won't keep them in the job. They can start as caretakers and we'll see if Adkins is the problem, we can't do that with anyone else.
He had fight and leadership. Before anyone replies...check the league table....pathetic
Can't be doing with a caretaker set up until the end of the season or whatever, better keeping it as it is now
But whether or not Adkins is sacked - if the set-up & staffing doesn't change, both in recruitment and off the pitch, I think we'll still be in the brown stuff.
Chris Wilder is old school and he would want full control, if Roddy etc pick the players we aren't the club for him.
- the transfer window was pretty decent in the end
- I believe the squad we have should be able to challenge for the playoffs, any less would be a failure of management, recruitment or both
- all that said, the recruitment was only completed 14 days ago (including Souare, who I think is going to be key to unlocking Kirk)
- given the international break we’re effectively judging a manager who has had his full squad for a couple of training sessions and one match, I’m willing to give it a bit longer (but my patience is finite)
Another reason I don’t agree with sacking him just yet is that many of the voices calling for it are at the same time advocating some combination of Jackson or Euell and or Curbishley. I would hate to be associated with minds so unimaginative.
when goggling Wilders salary I found this from the owners on his leaving the Sheff Utd
We said, ‘no way are we going to pay you £4m, you are resigning. We are not firing you. Why would we have to pay almost one year’s salary?’”
So I think it pretty clear we can’t afford him in a million years. Move on!
Ryan Lowefor me, maybe Matt Taylor 👍🏼