The best shop window for a player who is seeking a transfer to a Premier League club is a side doing very well in the Championship, not a team struggling to keep their heads above water in League One.
Roland Duchâtelet has proved himself incapable of providing us with a side that is competitive in the Championship, and has failed by his own miserable standards.
I would love it if someone wanted to gamble their fortune on us for sure but I don't see anyone out there - if you do let's name names ? Roland is hated by many because he won't gamble his fortune on us That's a good reason to be upset but it's a bit rich to tell him to get lost if he won't gamble his cash Because of the massive relegation payouts the premiership is effectively becoming like the US football leagues i.e. No relegation - just as the American investors have always wanted Assuming the current bottom three all went down all of them will be back up within 1 or 2 years max 3 Not much room for anyone else unless they can gamble millions
Just a couple of points of information Owners of companies make intercompany loans all the time - what ever way he puts money in its mainly his cash that pays the wages etc. Players don't get paid in Monopoly money and losses have to be paid for -there's no magical credit card out there now that the banks avoid football as much as they can I was at Brentford and the post match player response was a real shock Considering it was a rare and very good win.
The bottom 3 will be back up within 2 or 3 years ? Someone forgot to tell Wigan, Portsmouth, Wolves, Fulham etc. Oh and that nice little family club from the SE7 area
This guy has got to be a wind up. Even if you don't take CARD's side of the argument you would know their argument and not be so naive with response. I can't be bothered to explain why I think he is wrong. If he can't work it out for himself after 2 years he will not understand it in an evening on the internet, he can and does though.
Anal Al is talking out of his backside. Sonogo went OTT considering we were still well adrift of the 4th from bottom but i saw other players clapping their hands at the fans us they walked pass. Considering that some drunks told the players to fuck off at Fulham. Fox, Solly and ? were given dogs abuse when they tried to clap the fans at the end. (Fulham)
Unless your under 10, everyone knows we have been a selling club, Other than Richard Murray's tenure part 1.
I am so proud of the fans for trying to make a change, not over optimistic, the change will come any time soon. but at least we has shown some spirit that we don't just want to be a club going no where other than down with this useless owner and his female side kick.
Actually, I think it was Fox and Harriott who were "given dogs abuse" because Solly dragged them over as they reached the tunnel. Dragged isn't my term, I think it was used in a recent edition of VOTV in an article about Chris Solly.
I think our differentiator should be that we develop good you players AND offer them chance of first team games, see Gomez, Poyet, Cousins, Shelvey, etc. This is especially true when you look at how many young players have come through and become first team regulars at Chelsea, Arsenal, West Ham, and Palace of late. I am also of the belief that promotion to the Premier League for a club of our size and means should be a far lower priority than ensuring Championship safety. I know there are a lot on here who feel we should be pushing for the Premier League year-on-year, but given the number of big money owners who have come in at the Championship level, we are unlikely to do that unless we are bought by one such owner with deep pockets, and joining the arms race can be a long term risk to the club (should said owners lose interest). QPR, Fulham, Forest, and Cardiff have all already massively overspent, and none of them will be promoted this year.
Where I take issue with what Katrien said in Dublin is that simply promoting young players, providing "the future stars of the Premier League," should not be the sum total of our ambition. The ability to bring in and fully develop such players is dependent on the standing of our first team, and it gets harder to attract and keep quality players in the long run if the first team performs poorly. Short of maybe Crewe Alexandria, a club cannot simply be a conveyor belt for producing young talent, especially in our catchment area.
Not trying to be a pain in the arse but who have Crewe produced in the last few years? Since say Platt, Rob Jones era. But I do take your point, just think that the Crewe example is overused.
Not unfair question at all. Since the Platt era you'd have Danny Murphy, Dean Ashton (who was sold to Norwich in the Premier League in 2005 I think), David Vaughn, Billy Jones. Then more recently the likes of Nicky Maynard (MK Dons, good at Championship level), Max Clayton (Bolton), and Nick Powell (sold to United obviously). The latter two played at U-17 level with Jordan Cousins and looked decent.
My point wasn't that they produce world beaters year-on-year, but rather they're the only club who seem to be able to still attract, future, and then sell-on some pretty decently talent footballers despite being in League One/Two.
Full credit to @LuckyReds@Airman Brown@kentaddick@seth plum and the others who have answered question sincerely. I understand the frustration when someone's first post is questioning what is going on, but I don't think calling them stooges of the regime or other names helps. Instead I think it's important to take people at face value and address their concerns at such. I don't currently have anything to add that hasn't already been spoken, but again I applaud all of you who have taken the time to respond.
If MY soN hAd the talent of GoMEz or Lookman then there IS no way I would allow him to play at our Academy unless he had a good prospect of first team games and therefore a shop window for the bigger clubs. I Know this is a sAd reflecTion on CAFC but its RealIty. PaymENts to relegated preMiErshIp clubs next yeaR could bE as much as £100m - perhaps we all need to wake up a little.
Nice try Katrien. You can't make fools out of us.....
I was also at the Brentford game and my recollection was that all the players came to clap the support and that Riga was well made up.
Sanogo got a lot of support and went mental for it and tried to wind is up more but the rest of the team also appreciated the support a lot, even though most of what I remember chanting for the whole 90 was anti-regime.
To look to be an established championship side that, with careful management has a tilt at playoffs is a sensible goal.
I agree the loan financing is a bit of a side show. Although it may become less plausible from both a tax perspective (which is probably the main driver currently) and under League 2 regulations.
To execute properly on a strategy, employment of competent playing and support staff is key. Running a football club is not a task for the novice or the incompetent.
The main problem here is the total incompetence of the senior management and the staff used to hire. That is why there is so much pressure being applied.
The model proposed can work. But not if nearly every decision made is a bad one.
Unfortunately KM has been incontinently incompetent, TK seems if anything worse, and if Phoenix Nights were to reboot as a football club rather than a night club, the last two years at the Valley (and Bolton to be fair) would provide Peter Kaye with a whole load of material he wouldn't have to do anything with to make everyone think it was a hilarious spoof of a club.
Because of the massive relegation payouts the premiership is effectively becoming like the US football leagues i.e. No relegation - just as the American investors have always wanted Assuming the current bottom three all went down all of them will be back up within 1 or 2 years max 3 Not much room for anyone else unless they can gamble millions
So I am going to contradict what I just said about "nothing to add" and add something.
I don't entirely disagree with this, although I don't think the US leagues without relegation/promotion are a good example. There is still relegation and promotion, and it is incredibly costly.
That said, the Premier League has long been creating a "Haves and Have Nots" culture. With the increase in revenue and parachute payments, this will only get starker. It is because of this money and marketing potential for the Premier League that owners have been willing to come in or bankroll clubs, write off tens if not hundred of million in debt, and run clubs at a loss (to varying degrees, depending on the owner). This can backfire massively, as it did with Portsmouth, Bolton, Birmingham (remember Carson Yeung?), Notts County, etc. Success stories would include Bournemouth, Leicester, Boro, Hull, etc.
Roland is a part of this, albeit a smaller and less successful version. He has, and he is not alone in this, not wiped our debts but rather loaned us money from one of his companies (and continues to do so) so that the club can keep going. In my mind, this isn't entirely unreasonable, and it's where I agree with you in that there aren't a lot of millionaires/billionaires out there willing to give out tens of millions in immediate losses just to be a part of the arms race to the Premier League.
This is why I, and I think I am relatively alone in this, blame the set-up(s) within English football for this economy and ecosystem far more than I blame any one owner, including Roland. We don't have to go through all of the decisions made over the last 25 years, but at the end of the day historic, cherished institutions have been allowed to take on unmanageable debt and nearly go bankrupt despite record revenue streams seemingly without one iota of oversight. To me it's incredibly irresponsible, and I believe it is a bubble economy that will burst at some point.
If MY soN hAd the talent of GoMEz or Lookman then there IS no way I would allow him to play at our Academy unless he had a good prospect of first team games and therefore a shop window for the bigger clubs. I Know this is a sAd reflecTion on CAFC but its RealIty. PaymENts to relegated preMiErshIp clubs next yeaR could bE as much as £100m - perhaps we all need to wake up a little.
Nice try Katrien. You can't make fools out of us.....
I was also at the Brentford game and my recollection was that all the players came to clap the support and that Riga was well made up.
Sanogo got a lot of support and went mental for it and tried to wind is up more but the rest of the team also appreciated the support a lot, even though most of what I remember chanting for the whole 90 was anti-regime.
To look to be an established championship side that, with careful management has a tilt at playoffs is a sensible goal.
I agree the loan financing is a bit of a side show. Although it may become less plausible from both a tax perspective (which is probably the main driver currently) and under League 2 regulations.
To execute properly on a strategy, employment of competent playing and support staff is key. Running a football club is not a task for the novice or the incompetent.
The main problem here is the total incompetence of the senior management and the staff used to hire. That is why there is so much pressure being applied.
The model proposed can work. But not if nearly every decision made is a bad one.
Unfortunately KM has been incontinently incompetent, TK seems if anything worse, and if Phoenix Nights were to reboot as a football club rather than a night club, the last two years at the Valley (and Bolton to be fair) would provide Peter Kaye with a whole load of material he wouldn't have to do anything with to make everyone think it was a hilarious spoof of a club.
And this is why there can be no compromise. The lights may be on at The Valley but no one's home. It's that bad.
I don't seek to tell Roland that he should spend more money on the club, I don't even really care that much if he stays or goes, I just want us to be run as a proper football club again.
We deserve better than the string of under-qualified no-marks that have filled key roles in the club from head coach to CEO. Even if we are trying to live entirely within our means we can do better than Karel Fraeye, Katrien Meire and players like Reza.
If this poster could be traced back to the club, what a PR own goal that would be for the regime.
There may be ways within Google Analytics to look at this, though I don't know if you could associate a location or IP address (or if Google even provides full IP addresses) to a username or post.
That said, I am personally not in favor of looking at where all dissenting posts originate from. If this is someone within the club posting, fine, it's their own folly and they're wasting their own time. Alan hasn't been derogatory in his comments, simply misguided or incorrect. Looking in to the origin of his post (or the one from the new poster on the other thread) sets the precedent that if you post something we don't agree with, you will come under a different scrutiny than the rest of us.
All that being said, this is obviously up to the Mods and how they run the Forum. By participating in said forum, and in the interwebs in general, we are making much of our information available to numerous sources.
I was at Brentford and the post match player response was a real shock Considering it was a rare and very good win.
I'm not saying that you are entirely wrong re Brentford, because I think the players were probably quite bruised by the reception they got at Fulham, in particular, but this has little to do with protests against the owner. It's largely because people get fed up watching rubbish week after week whatever the background. I'm also not sure it was unfair (although credit to Solly, Fox and Harriott for their actions at the end of that game, which may have had their own meaning). I do think the stick Harriott got before he went on loan was OTT.
However, I think you are exaggerating what happened at Brentford so here is some evidence.
Ah, but Anal Al was confused because he thought Charlton played in red !
Thanks for the more considered responses I quite agree that there is a lot wrong with the way Roland's plan has been executed , and supporters don't start mass campaigns without good reason - they are rightly angry with poor communication and far too many managers But let's be very honest 1. Varney hasn't got the money if he did you would have heard a lot more by now 2. Relegated premiership clubs massive payouts change everything and we need to acknowledge that from now on very few promoted clubs won't be the recently relegated ones because of the huge parachute payments 3. Some of the players brought in from abroad have been excellent so someone somewhere can recruit a player-Igor was the best up front I've seen since Bent as I'm sure most would agree. 4. The very best youngsters will only come to us if we play them in the first team when ready and show them a route map to the premiership 5. If someone owns a loss making company and then makes a loan to the same company to fund the losses it doesn't make him a financial criminal - If you don't understand that then you are unfortunately financially illiterate
Ps at Brentford the players stood around the halfway line for a very long time before coming towards us -as those who were there would surely agree it was very strange. I wasn't at Fulham so didn't know about the abuse so that probably explains it
Thanks for the more considered responses I quite agree that there is a lot wrong with the way Roland's plan has been executed , and supporters don't start mass campaigns without good reason - they are rightly angry with poor communication and far too many managers But let's be very honest 1. Varney hasn't got the money if he did you would have heard a lot more by now 2. Relegated premiership clubs massive payouts change everything and we need to acknowledge that from now on very few promoted clubs won't be the recently relegated ones because of the huge parachute payments 3. Some of the players brought in from abroad have been excellent so someone somewhere can recruit a player-Igor was the best up front I've seen since Bent as I'm sure most would agree. 4. The very best youngsters will only come to us if we play them in the first team when ready and show them a route map to the premiership 5. If someone owns a loss making company and then makes a loan to the same company to fund the losses it doesn't make him a financial criminal - If you don't understand that then you are unfortunately financially illiterate
Ps at Brentford the players stood around the halfway line for a very long time before coming towards us -as those who were there would surely agree it was very strange. I wasn't at Fulham so didn't know about the abuse so that probably explains it
How shall I recognise you at Bolton 2 weeks tomorrow, AA ?
Thanks for the more considered responses I quite agree that there is a lot wrong with the way Roland's plan has been executed , and supporters don't start mass campaigns without good reason - they are rightly angry with poor communication and far too many managers But let's be very honest 1. Varney hasn't got the money if he did you would have heard a lot more by now 2. Relegated premiership clubs massive payouts change everything and we need to acknowledge that from now on very few promoted clubs won't be the recently relegated ones because of the huge parachute payments 3. Some of the players brought in from abroad have been excellent so someone somewhere can recruit a player-Igor was the best up front I've seen since Bent as I'm sure most would agree. 4. The very best youngsters will only come to us if we play them in the first team when ready and show them a route map to the premiership 5. If someone owns a loss making company and then makes a loan to the same company to fund the losses it doesn't make him a financial criminal - If you don't understand that then you are unfortunately financially illiterate
Ps at Brentford the players stood around the halfway line for a very long time before coming towards us -as those who were there would surely agree it was very strange. I wasn't at Fulham so didn't know about the abuse so that probably explains it
How shall I recognise you at Bolton 2 weeks tomorrow, AA ?
Igor best up front since Bent? I think you will find many of us would say a certain Frenchman who your boss sold for peanuts was much better.
Two Shats is very quickly going to find his source of Premiership quality talent drying up. No sensible parent is going to let their kid play for Charlton if there are other options on the table, because quite frankly:
The only youngsters that will be signing for us are those that aren't good enough to go to other teams.
Thanks for the more considered responses I quite agree that there is a lot wrong with the way Roland's plan has been executed , and supporters don't start mass campaigns without good reason - they are rightly angry with poor communication and far too many managers - There is everything wrong with the plan, because the plan suffers from that most basic of flaws: It is not grounded in reality. Football is a crazy industry, and to make a success of that industry you need to understand it. The Shareholder understands it in his other financial endeavours, why not with football. But let's be very honest 1. Varney hasn't got the money if he did you would have heard a lot more by now - He never claimed to have the money, rather he was prepared to put those with money in contact with the club. Prospective purchasers of clubs don't generally broadcast their plans or funds - unless they're Michael Knighton. 2. Relegated premiership clubs massive payouts change everything and we need to acknowledge that from now on very few promoted clubs won't be the recently relegated ones because of the huge parachute payments - All that's happening is that the current situation, already bad, gets worse. But it's not that much different from the idea that only the biggest teams win the Premier League. I am far too much of a believer in the cock up theory of life to assume that the parachute payments will automatically mean return to the Prem. What needs to happen, is that other clubs need to be smarter, which we won't be with the regime in charge, given the evidence of their tenure to date. 3. Some of the players brought in from abroad have been excellent so someone somewhere can recruit a player-Igor was the best up front I've seen since Bent as I'm sure most would agree. - When fully fit, he's good. Has he given more to the team than a certain Monsieur Kermogant. But fully fit has been a foreign country for many of the imports. I really do not think we have had enough minutes from almost all of the players brought in since Duchatelet took over to say that they are excellent. Of course, you may have meant Marcus. 4. The very best youngsters will only come to us if we play them in the first team when ready and show them a route map to the premiership - Well given the way the regime throws youngsters in without, seemingly, the faintest regard for their welfare, you can rest assured that we won't be overburdened with the best youngsters under Duchatelet. 5. If someone owns a loss making company and then makes a loan to the same company to fund the losses it doesn't make him a financial criminal - If you don't understand that then you are unfortunately financially illiterate - Apart from some, tongue in cheek, suggestions that the only way that the regime approach makes sense is if it is for money laundering, I don't recall anyone suggesting RD is a criminal. But there are oh so many ways in which he fails to make the grade of even the most basic competence as a football club owner. If anything, his cack handed approach to running our club, suggests that, with the exception of the business that he understands, it's Roland who is (football) financially illiterate.
Ps at Brentford the players stood around the halfway line for a very long time before coming towards us -as those who were there would surely agree it was very strange. I wasn't at Fulham so didn't know about the abuse so that probably explains it
Thanks for the more considered responses I quite agree that there is a lot wrong with the way Roland's plan has been executed , and supporters don't start mass campaigns without good reason - they are rightly angry with poor communication and far too many managers But let's be very honest 1. Varney hasn't got the money if he did you would have heard a lot more by now 2. Relegated premiership clubs massive payouts change everything and we need to acknowledge that from now on very few promoted clubs won't be the recently relegated ones because of the huge parachute payments 3. Some of the players brought in from abroad have been excellent so someone somewhere can recruit a player-Igor was the best up front I've seen since Bent as I'm sure most would agree. 4. The very best youngsters will only come to us if we play them in the first team when ready and show them a route map to the premiership 5. If someone owns a loss making company and then makes a loan to the same company to fund the losses it doesn't make him a financial criminal - If you don't understand that then you are unfortunately financially illiterate
Ps at Brentford the players stood around the halfway line for a very long time before coming towards us -as those who were there would surely agree it was very strange. I wasn't at Fulham so didn't know about the abuse so that probably explains it
1. Varney may or may not have money or access to money but as Roland and Katrien won't talk, then up to now we have heard the appropriate amount...that Roland is not necessarily the only game in town. 2. So everybody gives up do they, and says from 2016 the football firmament is fixed forever more? Bournemouth are there, Leicester about to win the league, and Burnley posting profits. the scenario is not pinned forever, unless you are a defeatist 3. Kermogant is much better than Igor. Of the players brought in, I struggle to think of the 'excellent' ones. They have mainly been a few OKish or a lot who are total toilet. 4. The route map to Charlton's first team ought to be the same as the route map to the Premiership. Everybody frowns on 'nursery clubs', yet we are supposed to become one voluntarily? No chance. If Roland wants to make us a glorified nursery club in the medium to long-term, he will have medium to long-term expensive protests continuing. 5. If somebody owns a loss making company and then heaps more loss on that same company they are financially illiterate.
The experiment might work somewhere, but not here at Charlton, and if the experiment continues the protests may get nastier and more targeted at individuals working for the club, and by that I mean the players. It won't just be sponsors who are discouraged to sign on at Sparrows Lane and the Valley, but players too, especially the young players pitching up at weekends and evenings, they will find it makes for a less stressful life to sign for Crystal Palace, Millwall, West ham or whoever. If the poor diddums players don't like it, then they have the option to take it up with their paymasters.
Thanks for the more considered responses I quite agree that there is a lot wrong with the way Roland's plan has been executed , and supporters don't start mass campaigns without good reason - they are rightly angry with poor communication and far too many managers But let's be very honest 1. Varney hasn't got the money if he did you would have heard a lot more by now
Heard a lot more, like when he gave CARD a follow up statement saying he hadn't gone anywhere? What more could we have heard when the club were flat out ignoring him?
I will be sincerely surprised if you can name one thing he could do that he hasn't - short of sharing his backers bank statements. (That said, I sincerely doubt you'll reply anyway.) It's quite clear the kind of associates Varney has by KEH and the backing he has at Ebbsfleet.
2. Relegated premiership clubs massive payouts change everything and we need to acknowledge that from now on very few promoted clubs won't be the recently relegated ones because of the huge parachute payments
Awesome... who said anything about promotion though?
I've already responded to just how little promotion has to do with CARD's aspirations, unfortunately you seem - like the other newer posters - unable to tackle a discussion by responding to other posters directly.
3. Some of the players brought in from abroad have been excellent so someone somewhere can recruit a player-Igor was the best up front I've seen since Bent as I'm sure most would agree.
Gudmundsson, Igor, Texiera and Bauer have all been brilliant. I'm not sure whether Tex is better than Morrison, or Igor better than Kermogant either - but very good none the less.
However, this has got very little to do with the protests. As you seem very keen to bring our transfer policy in to the discussion though, I will highlight one key fact - had we not bought players which were woefully out of their depth (Piotr, Tucudean, Sarr, Koc.. and so on) - Roland would've spent less money and we'd be in a healthier position. However, this wasn't possible due to his reluctance to bring in the correct calibre of staff in the form of scouts.
4. The very best youngsters will only come to us if we play them in the first team when ready and show them a route map to the premiership
No they wont.
The very best youngsters are already offered more money (despite their ages) by bigger academies, and being in League One will be seen as a negative. Furthermore, the current player recruitment strategy would suggest that we will stay at that level or below.
Roland has been very good by offering investment in to the academy, but this is a shortsighted plan - for the academy to flourish the club needs to be run correctly, and this means a new CEO and qualified staff at all levels. He will not do this, nor will he engage with fans to understand why this is important.
5. If someone owns a loss making company and then makes a loan to the same company to fund the losses it doesn't make him a financial criminal - If you don't understand that then you are unfortunately financially illiterate
It doesn't make them a financial criminal - it makes them a shrewd businessman. I spend nearly all day looking at company financials and work as an engineer responsible for ensuring a very well known financial service can process group finances correctly - I am fully aware of how common this practice is.
However, as has been addressed elsewhere, when you do this with a football club it will have long term repercussions - have you looked up the cashflow issues Standard Liege had when Roland left yet? It also underlines how, for Roland, this is far from a risky endeavour and could be viewed as an investment scheme - he is in essence writing off every penny he spends. This means you and I, the fans, are responsible for the poor acquisitions of late.
Ps at Brentford the players stood around the halfway line for a very long time before coming towards us -as those who were there would surely agree it was very strange. I wasn't at Fulham so didn't know about the abuse so that probably explains it
The photos above speak a thousand words. I was at both matches and would like to point out Harriotts joy at celebrating in front of the away faithful.
Comments
Roland Duchâtelet has proved himself incapable of providing us with a side that is competitive in the Championship, and has failed by his own miserable standards.
RD kicked Vetokele ?
Sink the timewaster.
Someone forgot to tell Wigan, Portsmouth, Wolves, Fulham etc. Oh and that nice little family club from the SE7 area
I can't be bothered to explain why I think he is wrong. If he can't work it out for himself after 2 years he will not understand it in an evening on the internet, he can and does though.
Dragged isn't my term, I think it was used in a recent edition of VOTV in an article about Chris Solly.
My point wasn't that they produce world beaters year-on-year, but rather they're the only club who seem to be able to still attract, future, and then sell-on some pretty decently talent footballers despite being in League One/Two.
Full credit to @LuckyReds @Airman Brown @kentaddick @seth plum and the others who have answered question sincerely. I understand the frustration when someone's first post is questioning what is going on, but I don't think calling them stooges of the regime or other names helps. Instead I think it's important to take people at face value and address their concerns at such. I don't currently have anything to add that hasn't already been spoken, but again I applaud all of you who have taken the time to respond.
Sanogo got a lot of support and went mental for it and tried to wind is up more but the rest of the team also appreciated the support a lot, even though most of what I remember chanting for the whole 90 was anti-regime.
To look to be an established championship side that, with careful management has a tilt at playoffs is a sensible goal.
I agree the loan financing is a bit of a side show. Although it may become less plausible from both a tax perspective (which is probably the main driver currently) and under League 2 regulations.
To execute properly on a strategy, employment of competent playing and support staff is key. Running a football club is not a task for the novice or the incompetent.
The main problem here is the total incompetence of the senior management and the staff used to hire. That is why there is so much pressure being applied.
The model proposed can work. But not if nearly every decision made is a bad one.
Unfortunately KM has been incontinently incompetent, TK seems if anything worse, and if Phoenix Nights were to reboot as a football club rather than a night club, the last two years at the Valley (and Bolton to be fair) would provide Peter Kaye with a whole load of material he wouldn't have to do anything with to make everyone think it was a hilarious spoof of a club.
I don't entirely disagree with this, although I don't think the US leagues without relegation/promotion are a good example. There is still relegation and promotion, and it is incredibly costly.
That said, the Premier League has long been creating a "Haves and Have Nots" culture. With the increase in revenue and parachute payments, this will only get starker. It is because of this money and marketing potential for the Premier League that owners have been willing to come in or bankroll clubs, write off tens if not hundred of million in debt, and run clubs at a loss (to varying degrees, depending on the owner). This can backfire massively, as it did with Portsmouth, Bolton, Birmingham (remember Carson Yeung?), Notts County, etc. Success stories would include Bournemouth, Leicester, Boro, Hull, etc.
Roland is a part of this, albeit a smaller and less successful version. He has, and he is not alone in this, not wiped our debts but rather loaned us money from one of his companies (and continues to do so) so that the club can keep going. In my mind, this isn't entirely unreasonable, and it's where I agree with you in that there aren't a lot of millionaires/billionaires out there willing to give out tens of millions in immediate losses just to be a part of the arms race to the Premier League.
This is why I, and I think I am relatively alone in this, blame the set-up(s) within English football for this economy and ecosystem far more than I blame any one owner, including Roland. We don't have to go through all of the decisions made over the last 25 years, but at the end of the day historic, cherished institutions have been allowed to take on unmanageable debt and nearly go bankrupt despite record revenue streams seemingly without one iota of oversight. To me it's incredibly irresponsible, and I believe it is a bubble economy that will burst at some point.
We deserve better than the string of under-qualified no-marks that have filled key roles in the club from head coach to CEO. Even if we are trying to live entirely within our means we can do better than Karel Fraeye, Katrien Meire and players like Reza.
That said, I am personally not in favor of looking at where all dissenting posts originate from. If this is someone within the club posting, fine, it's their own folly and they're wasting their own time. Alan hasn't been derogatory in his comments, simply misguided or incorrect. Looking in to the origin of his post (or the one from the new poster on the other thread) sets the precedent that if you post something we don't agree with, you will come under a different scrutiny than the rest of us.
All that being said, this is obviously up to the Mods and how they run the Forum. By participating in said forum, and in the interwebs in general, we are making much of our information available to numerous sources.
I quite agree that there is a lot wrong with the way Roland's plan has been executed , and supporters don't start mass campaigns without good reason - they are rightly angry with poor communication and far too many managers
But let's be very honest
1. Varney hasn't got the money if he did you would have heard a lot more by now
2. Relegated premiership clubs massive payouts change everything and we need to acknowledge that from now on very few promoted clubs won't be the recently relegated ones because of the huge parachute payments
3. Some of the players brought in from abroad have been excellent so someone somewhere can recruit a player-Igor was the best up front I've seen since Bent as I'm sure most would agree.
4. The very best youngsters will only come to us if we play them in the first team when ready and show them a route map to the premiership
5. If someone owns a loss making company and then makes a loan to the same company to fund the losses it doesn't make him a financial criminal - If you don't understand that then you are unfortunately financially illiterate
Ps at Brentford the players stood around the halfway line for a very long time before coming towards us -as those who were there would surely agree it was very strange. I wasn't at Fulham so didn't know about the abuse so that probably explains it
Or should I say, Richard ?
The only youngsters that will be signing for us are those that aren't good enough to go to other teams.
2. So everybody gives up do they, and says from 2016 the football firmament is fixed forever more? Bournemouth are there, Leicester about to win the league, and Burnley posting profits. the scenario is not pinned forever, unless you are a defeatist
3. Kermogant is much better than Igor. Of the players brought in, I struggle to think of the 'excellent' ones. They have mainly been a few OKish or a lot who are total toilet.
4. The route map to Charlton's first team ought to be the same as the route map to the Premiership. Everybody frowns on 'nursery clubs', yet we are supposed to become one voluntarily? No chance. If Roland wants to make us a glorified nursery club in the medium to long-term, he will have medium to long-term expensive protests continuing.
5. If somebody owns a loss making company and then heaps more loss on that same company they are financially illiterate.
The experiment might work somewhere, but not here at Charlton, and if the experiment continues the protests may get nastier and more targeted at individuals working for the club, and by that I mean the players. It won't just be sponsors who are discouraged to sign on at Sparrows Lane and the Valley, but players too, especially the young players pitching up at weekends and evenings, they will find it makes for a less stressful life to sign for Crystal Palace, Millwall, West ham or whoever. If the poor diddums players don't like it, then they have the option to take it up with their paymasters.
I've read it all now.
I will be sincerely surprised if you can name one thing he could do that he hasn't - short of sharing his backers bank statements. (That said, I sincerely doubt you'll reply anyway.) It's quite clear the kind of associates Varney has by KEH and the backing he has at Ebbsfleet. Awesome... who said anything about promotion though?
I've already responded to just how little promotion has to do with CARD's aspirations, unfortunately you seem - like the other newer posters - unable to tackle a discussion by responding to other posters directly. Gudmundsson, Igor, Texiera and Bauer have all been brilliant. I'm not sure whether Tex is better than Morrison, or Igor better than Kermogant either - but very good none the less.
However, this has got very little to do with the protests. As you seem very keen to bring our transfer policy in to the discussion though, I will highlight one key fact - had we not bought players which were woefully out of their depth (Piotr, Tucudean, Sarr, Koc.. and so on) - Roland would've spent less money and we'd be in a healthier position. However, this wasn't possible due to his reluctance to bring in the correct calibre of staff in the form of scouts. No they wont.
The very best youngsters are already offered more money (despite their ages) by bigger academies, and being in League One will be seen as a negative. Furthermore, the current player recruitment strategy would suggest that we will stay at that level or below.
Roland has been very good by offering investment in to the academy, but this is a shortsighted plan - for the academy to flourish the club needs to be run correctly, and this means a new CEO and qualified staff at all levels. He will not do this, nor will he engage with fans to understand why this is important. It doesn't make them a financial criminal - it makes them a shrewd businessman. I spend nearly all day looking at company financials and work as an engineer responsible for ensuring a very well known financial service can process group finances correctly - I am fully aware of how common this practice is.
However, as has been addressed elsewhere, when you do this with a football club it will have long term repercussions - have you looked up the cashflow issues Standard Liege had when Roland left yet? It also underlines how, for Roland, this is far from a risky endeavour and could be viewed as an investment scheme - he is in essence writing off every penny he spends. This means you and I, the fans, are responsible for the poor acquisitions of late. The photos above speak a thousand words. I was at both matches and would like to point out Harriotts joy at celebrating in front of the away faithful.