Keep your politics out of football, we don't need a flag. It destroys one of the beauties of football to be honest, I can be sitting at The Valley with a Guardian reader one side, a Daily Mail reader the other but we have something in common. We can hug, cheer and jump together... no politics.
Don't ruin that beauty.
On the subject of Guardian readers I'm still yet to meet a lifer on any of my away day ventures!
Just look for the swampy looking types with beards and glasses that spit everywhere when they talk.
its the same old numbers game again isnt it ! the same people who told us that no more than 6,000 Poles would come here and anyone who said they would was a racist/ bigot the very same people taking the moral high ground when they fucking lied to the whole population and knew they were doing it.
So how many should we take ? where should we put them ?
Using Labours own words in the last few days---10,000 ?? or as shall we forget what Corbyn let slip on TV this week we already take in 25,000 asylum seekers a YEAR.
Lets AGREE that 10,000 is enough. Is that a year ? or EVERY year.
Where do we put them ? Scotlands nice and big and the socialists up there would love em im sure.
I remember watching question time around the time of election and Nigel farage being all but laughed off of stage for stating that not thousands but millions would be fleeing the middle east.......
The reluctance of people to accept genuine refugees is a result of the cluster fuck our immigration system has been over the last couple of decades. If people thought that the refugees would be taken in and looked after temporarily before being sent home there'd be little protest but that's not how it works is it. The politicians and pressure groups who pushed for more and more immigration and screamed abuse at opponents should hang their heads in shame because they've poisoned the well for the people who really needed our help.
"Keep your politics out of football, we don't need a flag. It destroys one of the beauties of football to be honest, I can be sitting at The Valley with a Guardian reader one side, a Daily Mail reader the other but we have something in common. We can hug, cheer and jump together... no politics.
Don't ruin that beauty." Superb words LuckyReds.
As we live in a democratic country (I hope). There will be marches in London for people to express their views for and against, and reveal their banners.
When we come to the valley, it's for the Football and remembering the football family, sometimes with a minute silence.
As has been seen on this Thread and thousands of others that we all have different views on every subject under the sun not just on emotive threads.
This is what my dad and uncles fought for,just like many of your relatives. I can understand Wanting to get your families out but if we had lost the battle of Britain would the men and women have scarpered ?
Where do we put them ? Scotlands nice and big and the socialists up there would love em im sure.
Scotland is a good suggestion.
I'm sure you will support the investment in Scotland's infrastructure that would be needed. This investment could even entice companies to move to Scotland and some other immigrants would move there too. Win win.
I disagree with taking 10,000 as I don't think it will solve the problem - and would probably only make it worse. But it is at least a humanitarian response and Harman did explain how it could be down in a workable way. That is by everybody taking a share - which is ultimately what Germany is asking. My problem is that the more you take, the more people will take their place and that is not what is needed. But if it could make things better we would have a duty as human beings to do what we could. Now is the time to stop playing games and argue with each other and come up with a plan to sort out the ISIS problem. It would need to involve an alliance of some pretty unsavoury states/countries, but if we have learned anything over recent years, we should have learned that we can’t impose our own values on others. Saudi Arabia is a pretty unsavoury regime that have been our 'friends' for many years so it can be done. Saddam Hussain was an evil tyrant and deserved what he got, but dealing with him has caused more death, suffering and instabilty for us than leaving him in place would have. However distasteful the thought of that is. Our intervention on a sham assertion that he had weapons of mass destruction – which we all knew he didn’t was criminal. George Galloway was castigated for the position he took on Iraq with many citing him as a war criminal, but irrespective of his politics, he seems to be one of the few who understood the region and its inherent instabilities from the beginning. Reactions have to be less emotional and more calculated and pragmatic and we have to work out how this problem can be fixed rather than try to resolve around the edges.
Those that think all this isn't our problem, fail to realise the threat to our safety and security ISIS poses. The solution always has to be around dealing with the problem, not its effects.
Where do we put them ? Scotlands nice and big and the socialists up there would love em im sure.
Scotland is a good suggestion.
I'm sure you will support the investment in Scotland's infrastructure that would be needed. This investment could even entice companies to move to Scotland and some other immigrants would move there too. Win win.
Maybe the investment could come from a reduction in our overseas aid budget in order to fund what is required here.
Keep your politics out of football, we don't need a flag. It destroys one of the beauties of football to be honest, I can be sitting at The Valley with a Guardian readeir one side, a Daily Mail reader the other but we have something in common. We can hug, cheer and jump together... no politics.
Don't ruin that beauty.
And you call yourself Lucky? Yon need a refund pal
The film on the news last night of the little boy was undeniably sad.
Why were they fleeing the safe haven of Turkey though ?
The little boy was a Syrian Kurd named Aylan Kurdi from the Syrian Kurdish town of Kobane - which you may remember was the site of months long fighting between ISIS and Kurdish fighters that effectively destroyed the town.
You may have also noticed on the news that Turkey has been bombing Kurdish fighters in Syria and Iraq and that in the run up to new elections in Turkey the current government has unilaterally ended a ceasefire with the Kurdish PKK - so I imagine many Kurds do not regard Turkey as either 'safe' or a 'haven'.
Maybe if a billion pounds a year in illegal benefits wasn't claimed in this country by people scamming the system , for disability benefits, we could help people in genuine need.
Maybe if we get persuade big corporations to contribute more tax into the system , instead of paying nothing, we could help more people.
Politicans of any colour are too weak & have failed to sort out our own country, how we can envisage sorting out another countries problems i don't know?
Maybe if a billion pounds a year in illegal benefits wasn't claimed in this country by people scamming the system , for disability benefits, we could help people in genuine need.
Maybe if we get persuade big corporations to contribute more tax into the system , instead of paying nothing, we could help more people.
Politicans of any colour are too weak & have failed to sort out our own country, how we can envisage sorting out another countries problems i don't know?
“The Department for Work and Pensions estimates that £1.2bn was lost to benefits fraud in 2013/14, or 0.7 per cent of total benefits spending" [of which 'disability benefits' - Employment and Support Allowance & Disability Living Allowance – are said to account for £200 million]
"That’s the same amount as the year before, it’s a lot less than is lost in other developed countries.....and it’s less than the £1.5bn NOT paid out to people who are eligible for various benefits but don’t claim them.
By contrast, HMRC’s most recent estimate of the annual “tax gap” – the money lost to the state through people not paying as much as they should – was £34bn”.
This topic just shows how influenced by the media we are, one tragic picture and all of a sudden there's international uproar about the situation. Of course the media will be showing the women and children suffering. As bad as the situation is in some places they won't be showing the 1000's of men making there way through Europe to the promised land will they... Yes we are probably able to accept a small amount of legal refugees, however we cannot afford to let in the masses that other EU countries are.
I don't see why we shouldn't though. There is a purpose-built facility in the Midlands that can house 25,000 people and is staffed to ensure they are kept fed and safe and children are given adequate support and education.
The image that has spread around the world of the boy on the beach is for propaganda purposes.
Yes, the human thing is to help people out but why not help yourselves first and deal with children going to school with no breakfast, people sleeping on the streets, revitalize low income areas.
Also, as stated by other members why does the UK get seemingly more refugee's then say Portugal? I understand why they are fleeing but when they get to a "safe" country they do not follow the process about registering there first and just want to get onto Germany or another country with benefits.
Why flee to european countries when other middle eastern countries as not taking any, would it not make sense to go somewhere where you speak the same language and have the same cultural values? It would be less stressful i am sure.
For the people that do have a genuine claim and i am sure there are large amounts of them then this is what should happen. You come and we 'the government' would allocate where you can go within the country. Thusly you would not be a burden on the larger cities that already have a dense enough population. Take Canada for instance, lots of land but everyone tends to settle in Toronto, Montreal or Vancouver. Well how about we spread the wealth to Winnipeg, Halifax, St. Johns. If it is all and well truely about escaping for fear of your life from the country your fleeing then i am sure you wont mind living out in Plymouth
Keep your politics out of football, we don't need a flag. It destroys one of the beauties of football to be honest, I can be sitting at The Valley with a Guardian reader one side, a Daily Mail reader the other but we have something in common. We can hug, cheer and jump together... no politics.
Don't ruin that beauty.
On the subject of Guardian readers I'm still yet to meet a lifer on any of my away day ventures!
I used to go regularly away and would always have The Guardian in my rucksack.
Maybe if a billion pounds a year in illegal benefits wasn't claimed in this country by people scamming the system , for disability benefits, we could help people in genuine need.
Maybe if we get persuade big corporations to contribute more tax into the system , instead of paying nothing, we could help more people.
Politicans of any colour are too weak & have failed to sort out our own country, how we can envisage sorting out another countries problems i don't know?
“The Department for Work and Pensions estimates that £1.2bn was lost to benefits fraud in 2013/14, or 0.7 per cent of total benefits spending" [of which 'disability benefits' - Employment and Support Allowance & Disability Living Allowance – are said to account for £200 million]
"That’s the same amount as the year before, it’s a lot less than is lost in other developed countries.....and it’s less than the £1.5bn NOT paid out to people who are eligible for various benefits but don’t claim them.
By contrast, HMRC’s most recent estimate of the annual “tax gap” – the money lost to the state through people not paying as much as they should – was £34bn”.
I remember reading that if the government wiped out benefit fraud, and at the same time made sure eligible people got the right amount, the total figure would rise, not fall!
Comments
So how many should we take ?
where should we put them ?
Using Labours own words in the last few days---10,000 ?? or as shall we forget what Corbyn let slip on TV this week we already take in 25,000 asylum seekers a YEAR.
Lets AGREE that 10,000 is enough. Is that a year ? or EVERY year.
Where do we put them ? Scotlands nice and big and the socialists up there would love em im sure.
or maybe the NUS could put the whole lot up ?
Don't ruin that beauty." Superb words LuckyReds.
As we live in a democratic country (I hope). There will be marches in London for people to express their views for and against, and reveal their banners.
When we come to the valley, it's for the Football and remembering the football family, sometimes with a minute silence.
As has been seen on this Thread and thousands of others that we all have different views on every subject under the sun not just on emotive threads.
This is what my dad and uncles fought for,just like many of your relatives.
I can understand Wanting to get your families out but if we had lost the battle of Britain would the men and women have scarpered ?
As Hitler invaded our country ?
I'm sure you will support the investment in Scotland's infrastructure that would be needed. This investment could even entice companies to move to Scotland and some other immigrants would move there too. Win win.
Those that think all this isn't our problem, fail to realise the threat to our safety and security ISIS poses. The solution always has to be around dealing with the problem, not its effects.
http://www.calaid.co.uk/
http://www.redcross.org.uk/syriacrisis?gclid=CJifn9OR28cCFVRsGwod4oEE1g
http://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/sep/03/refugee-crisis-what-can-you-do-to-help
You may have also noticed on the news that Turkey has been bombing Kurdish fighters in Syria and Iraq and that in the run up to new elections in Turkey the current government has unilaterally ended a ceasefire with the Kurdish PKK - so I imagine many Kurds do not regard Turkey as either 'safe' or a 'haven'.
Any other questions.....
Maybe if we get persuade big corporations to contribute more tax into the system , instead of paying nothing, we could help more people.
Politicans of any colour are too weak & have failed to sort out our own country, how we can envisage sorting out another countries problems i don't know?
https://twitter.com/richard_conway/status/639450121512591360
“The Department for Work and Pensions estimates that £1.2bn was lost to benefits fraud in 2013/14, or 0.7 per cent of total benefits spending" [of which 'disability benefits' - Employment and Support Allowance & Disability Living Allowance – are said to account for £200 million]
https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/371459/Statistical_Release.pdf
"That’s the same amount as the year before, it’s a lot less than is lost in other developed countries.....and it’s less than the £1.5bn NOT paid out to people who are eligible for various benefits but don’t claim them.
By contrast, HMRC’s most recent estimate of the annual “tax gap” – the money lost to the state through people not paying as much as they should – was £34bn”.
https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/364009/4382_Measuring_Tax_Gaps_2014_IW_v4B_accessible_20141014.pdf
Yes we are probably able to accept a small amount of legal refugees, however we cannot afford to let in the masses that other EU countries are.
The image that has spread around the world of the boy on the beach is for propaganda purposes.
Yes, the human thing is to help people out but why not help yourselves first and deal with children going to school with no breakfast, people sleeping on the streets, revitalize low income areas.
Also, as stated by other members why does the UK get seemingly more refugee's then say Portugal? I understand why they are fleeing but when they get to a "safe" country they do not follow the process about registering there first and just want to get onto Germany or another country with benefits.
Why flee to european countries when other middle eastern countries as not taking any, would it not make sense to go somewhere where you speak the same language and have the same cultural values? It would be less stressful i am sure.
For the people that do have a genuine claim and i am sure there are large amounts of them then this is what should happen. You come and we 'the government' would allocate where you can go within the country. Thusly you would not be a burden on the larger cities that already have a dense enough population. Take Canada for instance, lots of land but everyone tends to settle in Toronto, Montreal or Vancouver. Well how about we spread the wealth to Winnipeg, Halifax, St. Johns. If it is all and well truely about escaping for fear of your life from the country your fleeing then i am sure you wont mind living out in Plymouth