Quality player but still think he sits third in the Scholes/Lampard/Gerrard debate
Don't agree with that, scholes and lampard played in some superb sides gerrard on the other hand has played in sides that have been pulled apart and reinvented but gerrard kept pulling the strings , and how many times did he pull Liverpool through , personally I thought he was the best midfield player in the world for at least 2 years but most importantly the man conducts himself in the proper manner .
I think out of the three Scholes is in a league of his own. The only thing Gerrard had over Scholes was goals. Take away the penalties and he's scoring the same, if not less then Scholes. And even with all those top class players in and out of united, Scholes still pulled the strings every season.
Only put Gerrard at the bottom of the list because Scholes and Lampard still looked like world class players at 36. Gerrards only 34 and already looks past it.
and if your talking about conducting yourself in the proper manner, I think thats Scholes in a nutshell
All about opinions that's why football is such a great game . Still rate Gerrard above both of them and nothing will change my mind.
Bang on, me too. A big game player (for Liverpool, anyway).
Gerrard / Lampard (and Scholes) are one of those real conversation dividers where people you think know their football onions can have completely polar views.
Personally, i think he was a fatastic club player, a real talisman leader who could take games by the scruff of the neck, and in terms of a box to box midfielder, will go down as a Premiership 'great', aided by being the most iconic player for a period for one of the biggest (though little achieving) clubs.
He could not though step it up to true world class level. No shame in that.
Club great yes, Prem League great yes, World class great no.
Gerrard / Lampard (and Scholes) are one of those real conversation dividers where people you think know their football onions can have completely polar views.
Personally, i think he was a fatastic club player, a real talisman leader who could take games by the scruff of the neck, and in terms of a box to box midfielder, will go down as a Premiership 'great', aided by being the most iconic player for a period for one of the biggest (though little achieving) clubs.
He could not though step it up to true world class level. No shame in that.
Club great yes, Prem League great yes, World class great no.
How are you defining "world class" here ? If you mean what a players done at international level then I'd argue none of those three ever replicated their club form for England.
Gerrard saved Liverpool's blushes on many occasions, but very rarely for England. I dislike Liverpool FC so much I can't see beyond my prejudices and find myself able to call him one of the best ever - very good, don't get me wrong - but no legend (outside Liverpool).
Gerrard / Lampard (and Scholes) are one of those real conversation dividers where people you think know their football onions can have completely polar views.
Personally, i think he was a fatastic club player, a real talisman leader who could take games by the scruff of the neck, and in terms of a box to box midfielder, will go down as a Premiership 'great', aided by being the most iconic player for a period for one of the biggest (though little achieving) clubs.
He could not though step it up to true world class level. No shame in that.
Club great yes, Prem League great yes, World class great no.
How are you defining "world class" here ? If you mean what a players done at international level then I'd argue none of those three ever replicated their club form for England.
I mean he has been a big impacting Prem league (great league in the world blah blah) player, but on an international stage he is not a Pirlo, Iniesta, Zavi, Toure etc.
Whether with better players around him he could have stepped up to the levels and international impact of say a Schweinsteiger, i don't know (baring in my mind i'll admit i've not really watched too much top level football over the last 4-5 years)
Gerrard / Lampard (and Scholes) are one of those real conversation dividers where people you think know their football onions can have completely polar views.
Personally, i think he was a fatastic club player, a real talisman leader who could take games by the scruff of the neck, and in terms of a box to box midfielder, will go down as a Premiership 'great', aided by being the most iconic player for a period for one of the biggest (though little achieving) clubs.
He could not though step it up to true world class level. No shame in that.
Club great yes, Prem League great yes, World class great no.
How are you defining "world class" here ? If you mean what a players done at international level then I'd argue none of those three ever replicated their club form for England.
I mean he has been a big impacting Prem league (great league in the world blah blah) player, but on an international stage he is not a Pirlo, Iniesta, Zavi, Toure etc.
Whether with better players around him he could have stepped up to the levels and international impact of say a Schweinsteiger, i don't know (baring in my mind i'll admit i've not really watched too much top level football over the last 4-5 years)
Ah right, fair enough - using that form of measurement I'd say no English player has really been world class then (certainly not in a Pirlo, Schweinsteiger level of success) in the time frame of Gerrards carreer.
For what it's worth I actually think Scholes was the best of the three and then there are decent arguments for both Lampard and Gerrard to be number two.
I think Gerrard has been a fantastic player for Liverpool, he's probably stayed too long at Liverpool to his own detriment , lesser players than him have ended up with League winners medals.
Problem is players like Gerrard set their own standards very high. So when he is not as swashbuckling for England as he is for Liverpool we feel let down. I remember him getting us out of trouble internationally quite a few times.
Scholes was a fantastic fulcrum and never gave the ball away. I'd have kept him playing forcibly after 2004 if I could have. I always got the impression Lampard and Gerrard were professional enough to accept being benched for a player like Scholes.
Gerrard / Lampard (and Scholes) are one of those real conversation dividers where people you think know their football onions can have completely polar views.
Personally, i think he was a fatastic club player, a real talisman leader who could take games by the scruff of the neck, and in terms of a box to box midfielder, will go down as a Premiership 'great', aided by being the most iconic player for a period for one of the biggest (though little achieving) clubs.
He could not though step it up to true world class level. No shame in that.
Club great yes, Prem League great yes, World class great no.
Totally agree with this.
One of the best English domestic players that I have seen.
A world class great is somebody like Zidane. Gerrard has never been near that level (not many have).
Will be a big loss to the premiership but an even bigger loss to Liverpool. Good luck replacing him.
Problem is players like Gerrard set their own standards very high. So when he is not as swashbuckling for England as he is for Liverpool we feel let down. I remember him getting us out of trouble internationally quite a few times.
Scholes was a fantastic fulcrum and never gave the ball away. I'd have kept him playing forcibly after 2004 if I could have. I always got the impression Lampard and Gerrard were professional enough to accept being benched for a player like Scholes.
This is not a smart arse challenge Carts, but I am struggling to remember a Beckham ( v Greece) or Gazza (v Scotland) or Platt (v Belgium) moment. Can you remind me of the ones where Gerrard did similar? I am sure you are right, but perhaps my anti-Liverpool bias has caused a blind spot...
Off the top of my head, Andorra (I know!) USA, Sweden at the world cup in Germany and im sure it was his goal that put daylight between us and ze germans in the Olympic stadium as well as a great performance with Scholes in midfield.
I fully understand why you would have anti-bin dipper glasses on haha
IMO, the best english player we've had in this country for the last 20 years. Team should have been built around him rather than being shunted on the wings or beind the striker, in his best pos in CM.
On Radio 5, a top journo has just said his best 2 seasons for Liverpool was when he played on the wing or when he played in the num 10 role behind the main striker.
I do have to laugh every time a pundit has come out saying he has shown such loyalty to Liverpool. Apart from that time he wanted to go to Chelsea but was "persuaded" to stay.
That aside, great player, been one of the Prem greats and perhaps wasn't world class at his peak but wasn't far off.
If that shot from Gerrard had gone wide of the post in stoppage time in the 2006 Cup Final and Hammers had seen it out we would never have got that clown who has a wank over himself every time he sees his own reflection. He would have got a lifetime contract at Upton Park or Olympic Stadium as will be in a couple of years. Uncle Les may have stayed longer or not. We would have had somebody different who would have done different things and we may have stayed in the Prem or not. Maybe we would not have got relegated to League 1. We may still have been continually in the Championship or gone back up. We may not have had Powelly as manager or Yann or Jacko or the rest of that gang. But saying that, we would have had different legends for fans to say the words "Move On!" about. It's amazing how events elsewhere have an impact of things at your club.
But Stevie G, what a legend for Liverpool and what a loyal club man. I'll never forget how almost one handily he won the Champions League for Liverpool. It's a shame he couldn't quite bring the Premier League title to Anfield. That is unless Liverpool have such a massive run and topple everyone. But sadly, I reckon that is unlikely.
Great servant for Liverpool. Probably past his best about 5 seasons ago and should have moved on to try to 'refresh'. However, one of the most over rated players when putting on an England shirt.......he was truly poor compared to his Club form. He has been struggling this season and it's a good move for both him and Liverpool. As for comparisons to Scholes and Lampard, IMO he's not worthy of that comparison
If that shot from Gerrard had gone wide of the post in stoppage time in the 2006 Cup Final and Hammers had seen it out we would never have got that clown who has a wank over himself every time he sees his own reflection. He would have got a lifetime contract at Upton Park or Olympic Stadium as will be in a couple of years. Uncle Les may have stayed longer or not. We would have had somebody different who would have done different things and we may have stayed in the Prem or not. Maybe we would not have got relegated to League 1. We may still have been continually in the Championship or gone back up. We may not have had Powelly as manager or Yann or Jacko or the rest of that gang. But saying that, we would have had different legends for fans to say the words "Move On!" about. It's amazing how events elsewhere have an impact of things at your club.
But Stevie G, what a legend for Liverpool and what a loyal club man. I'll never forget how almost one handily he won the Champions League for Liverpool. It's a shame he couldn't quite bring the Premier League title to Anfield. That is unless Liverpool have such a massive run and topple everyone. But sadly, I reckon that is unlikely.
I'll have a pint of what you have been drinking... And I have had a few myself tonight.
When you think back to the time when the England midfield had available the likes of Scholes, Lampard, Gerrard, Beckham and Joe Cole at their peak, it's a shame we never managed to get the right combination on the pitch.
Joe Cole ??? Wtf even at his peak and I don't mean the odd 5 minute spell this fella was a show pony bluff and does not deserve to be mentioned in the same breath as the other 4 imo
If that shot from Gerrard had gone wide of the post in stoppage time in the 2006 Cup Final and Hammers had seen it out we would never have got that clown who has a wank over himself every time he sees his own reflection. He would have got a lifetime contract at Upton Park or Olympic Stadium as will be in a couple of years. Uncle Les may have stayed longer or not. We would have had somebody different who would have done different things and we may have stayed in the Prem or not. Maybe we would not have got relegated to League 1. We may still have been continually in the Championship or gone back up. We may not have had Powelly as manager or Yann or Jacko or the rest of that gang. But saying that, we would have had different legends for fans to say the words "Move On!" about. It's amazing how events elsewhere have an impact of things at your club.
But Stevie G, what a legend for Liverpool and what a loyal club man. I'll never forget how almost one handily he won the Champions League for Liverpool. It's a shame he couldn't quite bring the Premier League title to Anfield. That is unless Liverpool have such a massive run and topple everyone. But sadly, I reckon that is unlikely.
Blimey, there's a real "Sliding Doors" moment, had never considered that scenario.
Great club player, consistently under performed for England but really, really not worthy of the press coverage his announcement has generated. FFS he's off for a last payday and to see out his career in the US not flipping been found sneaking out of Teresa May's bedroom in the dead of night! Another five pages in the Telegraph today....grrrrr.
Off the top of my head, Andorra (I know!) USA, Sweden at the world cup in Germany and im sure it was his goal that put daylight between us and ze germans in the Olympic stadium as well as a great performance with Scholes in midfield.
I fully understand why you would have anti-bin dipper glasses on haha
Still struggling to remember most of them Carts - sadly the Germany one was overshadowed by his team mate's hat trick. Just done a ( thankfully short ) suck up on Soccer AM and they couldn't/didn't find an England goal to illustrate his greatness...
Great club player, consistently under performed for England but really, really not worthy of the press coverage his announcement has generated. FFS he's off for a last payday and to see out his career in the US not flipping been found sneaking out of Teresa May's bedroom in the dead of night! Another five pages in the Telegraph today....grrrrr.
The Telegraph sports pages are virtually a Liverpool fanzine so it's no surprise they've gone to town on this. I suspect the flags are flying at half mast and the staff have been given a day off to mourn.
Off the top of my head, Andorra (I know!) USA, Sweden at the world cup in Germany and im sure it was his goal that put daylight between us and ze germans in the Olympic stadium as well as a great performance with Scholes in midfield.
I fully understand why you would have anti-bin dipper glasses on haha
Still struggling to remember most of them Carts - sadly the Germany one was overshadowed by his team mate's hat trick. Just done a ( thankfully short ) suck up on Soccer AM and they couldn't/didn't find an England goal to illustrate his greatness...
Yeah fair one, I also will add he played brilliantly as an 18 year old against ze germans in 2000
Can definitely think of more Beckham and Scholes moments of craft for England which is a shame considering how many games he played
If that shot from Gerrard had gone wide of the post in stoppage time in the 2006 Cup Final and Hammers had seen it out we would never have got that clown who has a wank over himself every time he sees his own reflection. He would have got a lifetime contract at Upton Park or Olympic Stadium as will be in a couple of years. Uncle Les may have stayed longer or not. We would have had somebody different who would have done different things and we may have stayed in the Prem or not. Maybe we would not have got relegated to League 1. We may still have been continually in the Championship or gone back up. We may not have had Powelly as manager or Yann or Jacko or the rest of that gang. But saying that, we would have had different legends for fans to say the words "Move On!" about. It's amazing how events elsewhere have an impact of things at your club.
But Stevie G, what a legend for Liverpool and what a loyal club man. I'll never forget how almost one handily he won the Champions League for Liverpool. It's a shame he couldn't quite bring the Premier League title to Anfield. That is unless Liverpool have such a massive run and topple everyone. But sadly, I reckon that is unlikely.
Blimey, there's a real "Sliding Doors" moment, had never considered that scenario.
Comments
Personally, i think he was a fatastic club player, a real talisman leader who could take games by the scruff of the neck, and in terms of a box to box midfielder, will go down as a Premiership 'great', aided by being the most iconic player for a period for one of the biggest (though little achieving) clubs.
He could not though step it up to true world class level. No shame in that.
Club great yes, Prem League great yes, World class great no.
Whether with better players around him he could have stepped up to the levels and international impact of say a Schweinsteiger, i don't know (baring in my mind i'll admit i've not really watched too much top level football over the last 4-5 years)
For what it's worth I actually think Scholes was the best of the three and then there are decent arguments for both Lampard and Gerrard to be number two.
Scholes was a fantastic fulcrum and never gave the ball away. I'd have kept him playing forcibly after 2004 if I could have. I always got the impression Lampard and Gerrard were professional enough to accept being benched for a player like Scholes.
One of the best English domestic players that I have seen.
A world class great is somebody like Zidane. Gerrard has never been near that level (not many have).
Will be a big loss to the premiership but an even bigger loss to Liverpool. Good luck replacing him.
I fully understand why you would have anti-bin dipper glasses on haha
Game of opinions.
That aside, great player, been one of the Prem greats and perhaps wasn't world class at his peak but wasn't far off.
But Stevie G, what a legend for Liverpool and what a loyal club man. I'll never forget how almost one handily he won the Champions League for Liverpool. It's a shame he couldn't quite bring the Premier League title to Anfield. That is unless Liverpool have such a massive run and topple everyone. But sadly, I reckon that is unlikely.
Can definitely think of more Beckham and Scholes moments of craft for England which is a shame considering how many games he played