May I advise that we make this a members only thread.
I was going to suggest that a few pages ago but then thought what's the point. Anyone that wants to see that there are serious issues has had plenty floating on here for over a fortnight now and at some point people outside of this forum need to see things for themselves.
lets just hope it all gets sorted what ever it is, im still quite confused about whats happend where and with who. im sure at some point the club will release a statement if things are bad, surely?
We're trying to run the club like newcastle I reckon, to get players in that are youngish and who will have a decent sell on value , don't know if newcastle have invested much in their youth policy
lets just hope it all gets sorted what ever it is, im still quite confused about whats happend where and with who. im sure at some point the club will release a statement if things are bad, surely?
I suppose it is a question of those releasing/sanctioning/drafting the statement not wanting to implicate any of their own actions.
I mean we all watched the QPR documentary for an idea of how the top can control communications, didn't we?
Glad you're here, even though I'll have to knock off, its nearly 1.00 here.
Do you understand why there was a 4m op. deficit last season? Was it that we ran such an expensive squad? Its certainly true that whenever I got a programme we seemed to have ten more bodies in our squad than the oppo.
Right..so we got promoted. There is at least some TV money..is it 3m? and some extra matchday revenue, at the very least from bigger away support. So we would break even if we didnt add to the squad. So any deficit is based on a presumed addition to squad costs. Nobody forces us to do that. (except perhaps us the fans).
I guess my question is..in the Champ, aside from our current squad costs, do we have costs that other clubs such as Watford, Palace, Millwall don't have? And they don't have more revenue than us...you get my question? (but I appreciate you may not have the answer)
Prague - do we not have a number of promotion contractual obligations, e.g. basic salary rises, bonus triggers, perhaps even transfer add-ons for all those "undisclosed" signings? Perhaps that is part of the problem.
Glad you're here, even though I'll have to knock off, its nearly 1.00 here.
Do you understand why there was a 4m op. deficit last season? Was it that we ran such an expensive squad? Its certainly true that whenever I got a programme we seemed to have ten more bodies in our squad than the oppo.
Right..so we got promoted. There is at least some TV money..is it 3m? and some extra matchday revenue, at the very least from bigger away support. So we would break even if we didnt add to the squad. So any deficit is based on a presumed addition to squad costs. Nobody forces us to do that. (except perhaps us the fans).
I guess my question is..in the Champ, aside from our current squad costs, do we have costs that other clubs such as Watford, Palace, Millwall don't have? And they don't have more revenue than us...you get my question? (but I appreciate you may not have the answer)
Millwall and Palace both run largish defecits that are covered by their owners.
If there is any form of Board 'infighting' going on, there won't be any statement coming out to 'clear things up' until the situation is sorted and even when it is, we won't have the full picture.
It's just really sad that having had such a magnificent season, there's a risk that we may be hitting the accelerator whilst in reverse gear whether due to misinformation or character clashes.
I've always tried to tackle business by getting to the root of problems and implementing solutions that help to not only resolve what is currently at stake, but also move the business forward. You can only hope that the combined intellect amongst our current Board either collectively agrees a solution or that they produce one which kills the root of the problem before stablising.
If KC has been involved for the last 18 months, it may help further to understand who his front man is - does anybody truly know? If KC has been involved and he had been backing what has transpired to be the instigator of the current situation, rather than the side we'd more likely support, then for the first time since all this started, I would be very concerned. Deadlock at Board level could force us down a terrible road through circumstance alone.
This club's rollercoaster ride never seems to stop does it.
Basically our suppose income from last season in certain area's was missed used.? With our current squad and other promotion clauses, we just about break even financially in the championship There has been some kind of miss-comunication. or disagreement among a few people on the board Because of this our current investors(Who ever they are) Have pulled out with immediate effect leaving us pennyless and completely screwed Which means we need to find new investment? Or this X person on the board needs to leave so we can have our old investment back?
Surely if we are as close to administration as some might be suggesting then that would mean everyone who has invested losing most and perhaps all of what they have recently invested .creditors would be concerned with any security that they might have taken and where their claim ranks against others in the administration of course.no idea who fits in where in all of this but one thing is for certain : can it really be in anyone's mind to think "unless I get exactly what I want and bollox to anyone else ,this club is going into admin and I don' t mind losing everything I put in ". Don' t see that myself unless some or all of the people involved don't in fact have the money to play the particularly worrying game of brinksmanship against one another that might now be unfolding .i am guessing that someone's bluff is being /could soon be called.very interesting to see who that is and who in fact is doing the calling /they are able to do the calling.got to have ice running through your veins for this stuff though.
Millwall and Palace both run largish defecits that are covered by their owners.
right so here is the gap in my understanding.
Currently I understand that Cash walked because he'd been misled about the scale of the commitment he had to make in order to see an ROI. So presumably, that was triggered by seeing the budget for this season. It differed to what he'd been led to believe. So what had he been led to believe, and by whom? There are two things I recall - but correct me if Im wrong people.
1. Slater early last season said that the business plan assumed a playoff spot (and lets face it, only a nutter would have banked on auto promotion}. So in business terms, if Cash had a 5 year plan sold to him, we're ahead of the game.
2. RM told one of our meetings that while we have a 4m deficit in the 3rd div, we break even in the Champ. Now, RM has 20 years experience in football and has run a series of good quality companies, subject to the scrutiny of the Stock Exchange. Presumably, what he told us, was in the plan sold to Kevin Cash.
So I think Im at least clearer about my big question. Why exactly has Cash been taken by surprise about the scale of commitment required, this season and beyond?
While on the subject of administration... who would appoint? Would we get the breathing space until we defaulted on a Bank facility, e.g. the security over the ground and SL, or would a particularly well secured backer-creditor blink first?
This is how I have read into it. The only other factor I suspect is that the loss of £1m in TV money against a backdrop of getting promotio after 1 year and triggering a heap of contract extensions or automatic pay rises has not helped - but merely speculation based on piecing together threads on here.
The Five have heard the stories about treasure at The Valley, but they never thought they were really true! When they discover a bad coin, the myth becomes real. Who does the treasure belong to? The gang are determined to find out...but so is someone else.
OR
Hurrah! It's holiday time, and the Famous Five are spending it at watching Euro 2012 in innocence. Most exciting of all, they've made a new friend—a real pilot: Airman Brown! But when he appears with top secret information, the Five are puzzled. Could the new investor be a fraud?
The Five have heard the stories about treasure at The Valley, but they never thought they were really true! When they discover a bad coin, the myth becomes real. Who does the treasure belong to? The gang are determined to find out...but so is someone else.
OR
Hurrah! It's holiday time, and the Famous Five are spending it at watching Euro 2012 in innocence. Most exciting of all, they've made a new friend—a real pilot: Airman Brown! But when he appears with top secret information, the Five are puzzled. Could the new investor be a fraud?
Glad you're here, even though I'll have to knock off, its nearly 1.00 here.
Do you understand why there was a 4m op. deficit last season? Was it that we ran such an expensive squad? Its certainly true that whenever I got a programme we seemed to have ten more bodies in our squad than the oppo.
Right..so we got promoted. There is at least some TV money..is it 3m? and some extra matchday revenue, at the very least from bigger away support. So we would break even if we didnt add to the squad. So any deficit is based on a presumed addition to squad costs. Nobody forces us to do that. (except perhaps us the fans).
I guess my question is..in the Champ, aside from our current squad costs, do we have costs that other clubs such as Watford, Palace, Millwall don't have? And they don't have more revenue than us...you get my question? (but I appreciate you may not have the answer)
Yes but rick just said that to keep our squad the same will need an input.
Millwall and Palace both run largish defecits that are covered by their owners.
right so here is the gap in my understanding.
Currently I understand that Cash walked because he'd been misled about the scale of the commitment he had to make in order to see an ROI. So presumably, that was triggered by seeing the budget for this season. It differed to what he'd been led to believe. So what had he been led to believe, and by whom? There are two things I recall - but correct me if Im wrong people.
1. Slater early last season said that the business plan assumed a playoff spot (and lets face it, only a nutter would have banked on auto promotion}. So in business terms, if Cash had a 5 year plan sold to him, we're ahead of the game.
2. RM told one of our meetings that while we have a 4m deficit in the 3rd div, we break even in the Champ. Now, RM has 20 years experience in football and has run a series of good quality companies, subject to the scrutiny of the Stock Exchange. Presumably, what he told us, was in the plan sold to Kevin Cash.
So I think Im at least clearer about my big question. Why exactly has Cash been taken by surprise about the scale of commitment required, this season and beyond?
Sounds about right, my guess is that the Cash is very hands off and someone on the board sold him wildly optimistic projections for our income in the championship which he swallowed. We know about the TV revenue shortfall but maybe potential commercial and season ticket revenues were grossly overstated as well. If you assume that this is the case then perhaps it's almost as much about what he feels is a breach of trust as the actual figures involved and that is why he has lost faith in the whole project.
But I would think that RM knew what figures were submitted to Cash. In fact he must have produced them, as Cash was part of the consortium RM sold to. I cannot believe that RM would have spun him such a dodgy bunch of figures. Something else is in the mixer here.
But I would think that RM knew what figures were submitted to Cash. In fact he must have produced them, as Cash was part of the consortium RM sold to. I cannot believe that RM would have spun him such a dodgy bunch of figures. Something else is in the mixer here.
OK. I'm done for tonight.
Not doubting the numbers given by RM during the takeover (which presumably would have been current and historic), surely it would have been up to Cash's frontmen to do the projections for the various future scenarios? That seems to be where things have fallen apart.
Will someone Please confirm what is going on. I'm absolutely fed up of this cryptic crap. So we are are in the shit? Why? We are heading for administration - how comes ? Please will someone who claims to be in the know just spell it out! You don't have to name sources , just let your fellow fans know what's , what. The secrecy and extremely vague comments just feel like scare mongering and it's pissing me ( and others ) off .if we are in trouble we need to all stick together but all that is happening at the moment is that the fans feel out of the CL loop . If you have anything concrete to say , say it. If not leave your cryptic comment for tomorrows crossword . Charlton till I die.
Will someone Please confirm what is going on. I'm absolutely fed up of this cryptic crap. So we are are in the shit? Why? We are heading for administration - how comes ? Please will someone who claims to be in the know just spell it out! You don't have to name sources , just let your fellow fans know what's , what. The secrecy and extremely vague comments just feel like scare mongering and it's pissing me ( and others ) off .if we are in trouble we need to all stick together but all that is happening at the moment is that the fans feel out of the CL loop . If you have anything concrete to say , say it. If not leave your cryptic comment for tomorrows crossword . Charlton till I die.
Beds, I've been out all day and come back to what seems like thousands of posts, I've managed to catch up by skimming through failing that there are plenty of good summaries in this thread, or do you need someone to come along and read it to you as well?
Comments
I mean we all watched the QPR documentary for an idea of how the top can control communications, didn't we?
In simple terms damages are assessed on the potential size of the audience. Members Only restricts that potential audience.
Glad you're here, even though I'll have to knock off, its nearly 1.00 here.
Do you understand why there was a 4m op. deficit last season? Was it that we ran such an expensive squad? Its certainly true that whenever I got a programme we seemed to have ten more bodies in our squad than the oppo.
Right..so we got promoted. There is at least some TV money..is it 3m? and some extra matchday revenue, at the very least from bigger away support. So we would break even if we didnt add to the squad. So any deficit is based on a presumed addition to squad costs. Nobody forces us to do that. (except perhaps us the fans).
I guess my question is..in the Champ, aside from our current squad costs, do we have costs that other clubs such as Watford, Palace, Millwall don't have? And they don't have more revenue than us...you get my question? (but I appreciate you may not have the answer)
They've obviously taken the piss with the Vegas bar bill ....
It's just really sad that having had such a magnificent season, there's a risk that we may be hitting the accelerator whilst in reverse gear whether due to misinformation or character clashes.
I've always tried to tackle business by getting to the root of problems and implementing solutions that help to not only resolve what is currently at stake, but also move the business forward. You can only hope that the combined intellect amongst our current Board either collectively agrees a solution or that they produce one which kills the root of the problem before stablising.
If KC has been involved for the last 18 months, it may help further to understand who his front man is - does anybody truly know? If KC has been involved and he had been backing what has transpired to be the instigator of the current situation, rather than the side we'd more likely support, then for the first time since all this started, I would be very concerned. Deadlock at Board level could force us down a terrible road through circumstance alone.
This club's rollercoaster ride never seems to stop does it.
Basically our suppose income from last season in certain area's was missed used.?
With our current squad and other promotion clauses, we just about break even financially in the championship
There has been some kind of miss-comunication. or disagreement among a few people on the board
Because of this our current investors(Who ever they are) Have pulled out with immediate effect leaving us pennyless and completely screwed
Which means we need to find new investment?
Or this X person on the board needs to leave so we can have our old investment back?
is that at all close to what we thinks going on>?
OR
Hurrah! It's holiday time, and the Famous Five are spending it at watching Euro 2012 in innocence. Most exciting of all, they've made a new friend—a real pilot: Airman Brown! But when he appears with top secret information, the Five are puzzled. Could the new investor be a fraud?
But I would think that RM knew what figures were submitted to Cash. In fact he must have produced them, as Cash was part of the consortium RM sold to. I cannot believe that RM would have spun him such a dodgy bunch of figures. Something else is in the mixer here.
OK. I'm done for tonight.
Please will someone who claims to be in the know just spell it out!
You don't have to name sources , just let your fellow fans know what's , what.
The secrecy and extremely vague comments just feel like scare mongering and it's pissing me ( and others ) off .if we are in trouble we need to all stick together but all that is happening at the moment is that the fans feel out of the CL loop . If you have anything concrete to say , say it. If not leave your cryptic comment for tomorrows crossword .
Charlton till I die.