Nathan Jones is doing terrible. But I don’t want him sacked and we start yet another cycle.
For once, we go against our feelings and the modern football instant success lust and give someone some time.
It’ll be shit now, it might even get worse, but time, let’s give that a go now.
I don’t want the cycle , but you’re literally saying to keep someone who is clearly inept for the sake of not changing which
there is nothing absolutely zero to give us hope or indication that he can or will improve going forward
I’m saying he’s inept right now, but it’s still only been what 9 months? What’s to say there isn’t going to be an improvement if we actually back someone through a bad patch for once?
I’d asses it end of next season. I know it seems bonkers right now, but the managerial merry go round has to be stopped.
Nathan Jones is doing terrible. But I don’t want him sacked and we start yet another cycle.
For once, we go against our feelings and the modern football instant success lust and give someone some time.
It’ll be shit now, it might even get worse, but time, let’s give that a go now.
I don’t want the cycle , but you’re literally saying to keep someone who is clearly inept for the sake of not changing which
there is nothing absolutely zero to give us hope or indication that he can or will improve going forward
I’m saying he’s inept right now, but it’s still only been what 9 months? What’s to say there isn’t going to be an improvement if we actually back someone through a bad patch for once?
I’d asses it end of next season. I know it seems bonkers right now, but the managerial merry go round has to be stopped.
Leave it until next season and in league two we will dream of being in league one again.
Nathan Jones is doing terrible. But I don’t want him sacked and we start yet another cycle.
For once, we go against our feelings and the modern football instant success lust and give someone some time.
It’ll be shit now, it might even get worse, but time, let’s give that a go now.
I don’t want the cycle , but you’re literally saying to keep someone who is clearly inept for the sake of not changing which
there is nothing absolutely zero to give us hope or indication that he can or will improve going forward
I’m saying he’s inept right now, but it’s still only been what 9 months? What’s to say there isn’t going to be an improvement if we actually back someone through a bad patch for once?
I’d asses it end of next season. I know it seems bonkers right now, but the managerial merry go round has to be stopped.
Leave it until next season and in league two we will dream of being in league one again.
We do the league 2 flap every season. It won’t happen, relax.
Nathan Jones is doing terrible. But I don’t want him sacked and we start yet another cycle.
For once, we go against our feelings and the modern football instant success lust and give someone some time.
It’ll be shit now, it might even get worse, but time, let’s give that a go now.
I don’t want the cycle , but you’re literally saying to keep someone who is clearly inept for the sake of not changing which
there is nothing absolutely zero to give us hope or indication that he can or will improve going forward
I’m saying he’s inept right now, but it’s still only been what 9 months? What’s to say there isn’t going to be an improvement if we actually back someone through a bad patch for once?
I’d asses it end of next season. I know it seems bonkers right now, but the managerial merry go round has to be stopped.
I agree.
Jones was (seemingly)an excellent appointment at this level. He kept us up and we were all very pleased with this and rightly so.
Imo he's been dealt a bad hand with Dobson and May leaving.
Atm the signings have not worked.
If another manager was brought in and was abysmal after ten games fans would be wanting another change.
Jones has not been given a decent budget, the managers generally have not been a problem, it's the people running/ruining it.
Another season without enuff investment to come close. The new owners will cut and run. Means nothing to them. Worth a punt.
Jones doesn't strike me as the type of bloke who holds back on speaking his mind. If there was a lack of investment or funds weren't made available I'm sure he'd have told us about it by now. But he was very happy with the squad he assembled before a ball was kicked.
The truth is, he lacks the knowledge to sound out and assemble a top league one squad. And nor should he. He's a coach. He coaches players. I doubt he alone identified and bought in the players that enabled him to have success at Luton. Player identification and recruitment was/is Andy Scott's job. Turns out Scott is just as bad as Jones at assembling squads. And that is his main job!...and even more amazingly, he's still here.
So with a lack of knowledge. Jones has largely gone for what he knows best. The signs were there when he signed Lua Lua last season. He's gone for his comfort blanket players..and unfortunately for him and ultimately us,time hasn't been kind to them.
Nathan Jones is doing terrible. But I don’t want him sacked and we start yet another cycle.
For once, we go against our feelings and the modern football instant success lust and give someone some time.
It’ll be shit now, it might even get worse, but time, let’s give that a go now.
I don’t want the cycle , but you’re literally saying to keep someone who is clearly inept for the sake of not changing which
there is nothing absolutely zero to give us hope or indication that he can or will improve going forward
I’m saying he’s inept right now, but it’s still only been what 9 months? What’s to say there isn’t going to be an improvement if we actually back someone through a bad patch for once?
I’d asses it end of next season. I know it seems bonkers right now, but the managerial merry go round has to be stopped.
Leave it until next season and in league two we will dream of being in league one again.
We do the league 2 flap every season. It won’t happen, relax.
I’m relaxing with a gallon of wine here, however imho if Nathan is still with us next season it will be in division two.
Nathan Jones is doing terrible. But I don’t want him sacked and we start yet another cycle.
For once, we go against our feelings and the modern football instant success lust and give someone some time.
It’ll be shit now, it might even get worse, but time, let’s give that a go now.
I don’t want the cycle , but you’re literally saying to keep someone who is clearly inept for the sake of not changing which
there is nothing absolutely zero to give us hope or indication that he can or will improve going forward
I’m saying he’s inept right now, but it’s still only been what 9 months? What’s to say there isn’t going to be an improvement if we actually back someone through a bad patch for once?
I’d asses it end of next season. I know it seems bonkers right now, but the managerial merry go round has to be stopped.
It’s about the clear ineptitude though. If they’re clearly a fool then you can’t keep them just for the sake of keeping them.
we would have been much better - and in my opinion now - would be much better stopping the rot with a young hungry determined manager who seems to have the personality and self reflection to at least have scope to prove, which would have been Jackson or Holden.
Jones is a thoroughly dislikeable stubborn egomaniac.
Don’t think sacking him is the answer. But the recruitment has been a disgrace again and the lack of flair and general attacking movement needs to be sorted.
Another season without enuff investment to come close. The new owners will cut and run. Means nothing to them. Worth a punt.
Birmingham Peterborough Wrexham
The only teams who spent more than us, yet we are still 14th and closer to relegation than playing offs, not about investment but about who NJ bought and what he has done with those players
Mitchell the only good signing in the summer Berry has been decent in patches but never starts oddly. Godden may turn out decent but still waiting to see.
No one else has looked good even Mannion who started well started making a few mistakes before his injury and I would put below AMB in the pecking order(although neither are good enough IMO to be number 1 for a promotion chasing team)
I’m not sure you can spin this as the owners fault. They’ve brought in a manager who has excelled at this level. Unfortunately, what was missed was the underlying factors for success which in this case I thi no may have been Mick Hartford and Phil Chaple
I supported his appointment, but it is looking awful at the moment. Terrible football that gets results is fine. Free flowing, entertaining football that sometimes ends in defeat is forgivable. Shit, ugly football that ends in defeat is toxic.
If the alternative is a serial failure like Appleton then I’d say give Jones more time.
We basically need to get lucky with an untested manager who turns out to be a genius.
Said it a hundred times on here, I know, but the acid test for a manager is can they arrest a slide and turn a side’s form around for the better. We’re sliding downhill fast right now and I’m not at all convinced NJ has ten answers but now is when he must show his mettle or he will be gone by Christmas, imo.
I thought it was a good appointment at the time but I guess I never realised what atrocious football he sets his teams up to play. Getting the ball forward quickly and playing on the front foot is great but this looks aimless and making our midfield look shit.
I think we have to stick it out this season with Jones and hope he can get things moving in the right direction because by God we have churned some managers and we’ve tried everything, ex captains, journeymen, young managers and nothing has worked. Not sure what that says about the club but for me just too much turmoil on the ownership side and no strategy, particularly in putting a squad together.
I think someone could get more out of these players but I don’t know who that is and I’m not sure our SMT do either. I’d stick rather than twist at the moment. It’s painful to watch on many levels right now.
Charlie and chums will not want to sack a third manager. It will not look very good on them.
Then there is the remaining 3.5 years of a contract to pay off.
I'm guessing it will be a 12 months pay-off in the termination clause.
The SMT and owners will naturally be reluctant to sack Jones, although ultimately it's a results business and, to compound matters, the football served up has been pretty dreadful to watch. It's all very well talking about giving him another window or two, but the acid test is whether the owners are going to trust Jones' judgment and invest further in more player acquisitions. I personally have real doubts that he can turn the current position around and, even if more talent was made available to him in January or next summer, I am not confident that he could deploy it to good effect given his primordial tactical approach.
I also do wonder if the majority of the players have any real belief in Jones' 'game plan' and what he is telling them.
He also looks like he's gone into self-preservation mode and is trying to preserve what is left of his reputation by deflecting blame elsewhere. If the current malaise continues and we are sleepwalking into a relegation fight, then the club will have to act; if we're safe, in or around mid-table, I think he'll stay until the end of the season but I believe there'll be a parting of the ways next summer.
I’m not sure you can spin this as the owners fault. They’ve brought in a manager who has excelled at this level. Unfortunately, what was missed was the underlying factors for success which in this case I thi no may have been Mick Hartford and Phil Chaple
Last season he brought back Paul Hart as his assistant. Paul Hart retired at the end of August.
I see Ainsworth Shrewsburys beat Birmingham today in his first game, he worked miracles at Wycombe and is a very likeable guy, I would have had him at Charlton
He’s not piped up and slagged the fans off or even praised them for the patience shown it’s been utter shit all season bar a performance or two bluffer been called and he’s got no hand
That prick brought on Hylton again sack him instantly. Shitty Luton prick
Said it from the moment he brought him on against Wrexham. We went from a league one team to a non-league team. Mates rates. Its fucking scandalous.
He keeps saying "If Danny signed for this club five years ago, he'd have been a terrific signing for this club."
What on earth does it matter if he'd have been good five years ago.
Hylton should obviously be nowhere near the team as he is way past it, but wasn't he signed with the intention of him having a coaching role? Ultimately he is the 7th choice striker for a league one club so the expectations there would be pretty low anyway. I doubt many league one sides even have 7 strikers, never mind one that is any good.
We can't even put Mbick or Casey on the bench because they are also injured.
If we go back to the start of the season, we were solid, but drab and lacked one vital element, a creative spark. Since then, Leaburn has returned, which should have actually improved the forward line. Granted, we miss Jones badly, but a centre half being out temporarily, shouldn't derail a whole season.
Everything has fallen apart because we have never found that missing creative spark, it simply doesn't exist at the club at this time, due to terrible recruitment. You cannot win games if you cannot score a goal in the first half of a game, and are always having to come from behind, or waiting to bring on subs in the 65th minute of games.
Attack is the best form of defence.
But we simply cannot retain the ball in the final third. There is a disconnect between the midfield and forward line. It needed to be identified and fixed early on before the rot set in, before players started losing confidence and stop giving 100%. That didn't happen and we are now in a downward spiral with Jones clutching at straws.
I’m not sure you can spin this as the owners fault. They’ve brought in a manager who has excelled at this level. Unfortunately, what was missed was the underlying factors for success which in this case I thi no may have been Mick Hartford and Phil Chaple
It depends who is responsible for the awful recruitment . If Jones picked all of those players, then it’s not their fault. Ultimately we know that some of tgen were his choices as some are his Luton mates but Ahadme / Docherty et al might not have been his choices .
Anyway , I can’t stand him - the football is horrendous and he talks absolute garbage .
If we go back to the start of the season, we were solid, but drab and lacked one vital element, a creative spark. Since then, Leaburn has returned, which should have actually improved the forward line. Granted, we miss Jones badly, but a centre half being out temporarily, shouldn't derail a whole season.
Everything has fallen apart because we have never found that missing creative spark, it simply doesn't exist at the club at this time, due to terrible recruitment. You cannot win games if you cannot score a goal in the first half of a game, and are always having to come from behind, or waiting to bring on subs in the 65th minute of games.
Attack is the best form of defence.
But we simply cannot retain the ball in the final third. There is a disconnect between the midfield and forward line. It needed to be identified and fixed early on before the rot set in, before players started losing confidence and stop giving 100%. That didn't happen and we are now in a downward spiral with Jones clutching at straws.
Aside from 2-3 games we've been poor all season. Even when we were sneaking 1-0 wins early on in the season, there was always the nagging doubt 'this is ok whilst we're winning but what happens when the luck runs out or we concede goals'. And now that's happened.
Basically if we concede a goal then we're screwed because not once all season in the league have we won a game when we've conceded.
Has anyone asked NJ what's happened to his fabled high press? Despite sacrificing every ounce of creativity I haven't seen us putting opposition defences under sustained pressure when they've got the ball and what's worse on the few occasions we've half heartedly given it a go we've been played through so easily its embarrassing. Time to accept the guy's a dud and move on.
Who would we get if we did sack him? We need stability.
I have no idea who we bring in. I just wonder when the inflexion point arises that Jones' (stability's) defenders start to ask the question....is it worth keeping a rubbish manager just in case we hire another rubbish manager?
We may indeed hire an equally bad manager but I'm willing to risk it because I'm absolutely certain (and have been for months) that we unquestionably have a rubbish manager now.
Jones was hounded out of Stoke and Southampton for playing the Panglossian village idiot whilst serving up football that's almost impossibly bad to watch. With every vacancy he fills, his success at Luton becomes increasingly mystifying and more and more of a stark anomaly as opposed to something we can be confident he will replicate given time. I'd love to call him a one trick pony but he's actually just pony. Our lack of Plan B is less concerning than a nine month tenure that has yet to produce a Plan A.
I'm not paying to watch any more of this dirge. I said after the Bristol Rovers game that Jones' 'style' of play could easily see us beat Brum 1-0 but equally make us highly likely to lose 1-0 to Exeter. I'm hardly Nostradamus but fans need to stop reading individual results and smell the coffee. What you're watching every week is unacceptable. Yes, his style of play means we will be safe from relegation. We will scrape together enough ugly points to stay up (we might even do it next game...it's not us turning a corner) but this team which he has put together, playing the football he wants them to play, are less creative than your average brick and he is entirely to blame for that. These professional players train all week to produce these performances, game after game after game, having taken all their instructions from him.
I can handle us struggling if we're at least trying to play football but I've no idea under what false illusions fans are still turning up at matches. We're going nowhere and there's not even a pretense of entertainment or excitement. If the reason for attending is loyalty to the club then it should extend to calling for this manager to be axed. I said it once and I'll keep parroting it, stability does not bring success, it is success that brings stability. There is no sense in obstinately backing the wrong man out of a faith in stability. There is no point in fearing change will bring about failure, when you've been watching nine months of seriously flawed failure under NJ.
Nail on head. I didn’t want t him in the first place. He’s a clown.
PWR, those who advocate sacking NJ, who do you suggest comes in? There is no outstanding candidate that I can see that's realistic. We keep changing managers on a far to regular basis, and it hasn't worked! We've been crap for years, we've tried up and coming managers, in Garner, Jackson, and Holden. We've tried old stagers in Slade and Appleton. We keep sacking them and their replacements, after a new manager bounce, then flop and off we go again. When NJ was appointed a large majority of fans were happy, me included, he dragged us out of the mire last season and we started this season quite well, albeit the football was poor, but we ground out positive results. Now we're playing poor and losing, so it seems our natural reaction is to shuffle the deckchairs again. What's to say another person at the helm will have any different outcome, only Bowyer, recently has had any success and that didn't last! We, apparently, have filthy rich owners, so why was recruitment so poor in the summer. We know NJ wanted at least 2 quality keepers, he didnt get them, what else did he want that he didn't get. No one, me included, knows the truth about May and Dobbo and why they left, CBT had gone before NJ arrived. My thoughts are to get rid of Scott, CM and Rodwell, get a proper DoF in and ask the owners to back NJ and the new DoF to get quality players in during January. Transfer or loan out, Docherty, Gillesphey, Anderson and Kanu, send A.Campbell, Potts back to whence they came. Bring in a leftsided CB to play alongside Jones and Ramsay, get 2 playmakers in to play in midfield, leave Hylton as a coach only, get in a proven young striker, and use the PL for quality loans. Give NJ the full season and have faith in him to deliver. Sorry for the long post, but we can't keep changing managers it's not worked, and as the old saying goes, 'If u keep doing what you've always done, you'll always get the same results you've always got' (or words to that effect).
Comments
Jones was (seemingly)an excellent appointment at this level. He kept us up and we were all very pleased with this and rightly so.
Imo he's been dealt a bad hand with Dobson and May leaving.
Atm the signings have not worked.
If another manager was brought in and was abysmal after ten games fans would be wanting another change.
Jones has not been given a decent budget, the managers generally have not been a problem, it's the people running/ruining it.
If there was a lack of investment or funds weren't made available I'm sure he'd have told us about it by now.
But he was very happy with the squad he assembled before a ball was kicked.
The truth is, he lacks the knowledge to sound out and assemble a top league one squad.
And nor should he. He's a coach. He coaches players.
I doubt he alone identified and bought in the players that enabled him to have success at Luton.
Player identification and recruitment was/is Andy Scott's job.
Turns out Scott is just as bad as Jones at assembling squads. And that is his main job!...and even more amazingly, he's still here.
So with a lack of knowledge. Jones has largely gone for what he knows best. The signs were there when he signed Lua Lua last season.
He's gone for his comfort blanket players..and unfortunately for him and ultimately us,time hasn't been kind to them.
we would have been much better - and in my opinion now - would be much better stopping the rot with a young hungry determined manager who seems to have the personality and self reflection to at least have scope to prove, which would have been Jackson or Holden.
Peterborough
Wrexham
The only teams who spent more than us, yet we are still 14th and closer to relegation than playing offs, not about investment but about who NJ bought and what he has done with those players
Mitchell the only good signing in the summer
Berry has been decent in patches but never starts oddly.
Godden may turn out decent but still waiting to see.
No one else has looked good even Mannion who started well started making a few mistakes before his injury and I would put below AMB in the pecking order(although neither are good enough IMO to be number 1 for a promotion chasing team)
Gas
Docherty
Hylton
Potts
Campbell
All absolute useless and waste of money
I think we have to stick it out this season with Jones and hope he can get things moving in the right direction because by God we have churned some managers and we’ve tried everything, ex captains, journeymen, young managers and nothing has worked. Not sure what that says about the club but for me just too much turmoil on the ownership side and no strategy, particularly in putting a squad together.
I think someone could get more out of these players but I don’t know who that is and I’m not sure our SMT do either. I’d stick rather than twist at the moment. It’s painful to watch on many levels right now.
Then there is the remaining 3.5 years of a contract to pay off.
The SMT and owners will naturally be reluctant to sack Jones, although ultimately it's a results business and, to compound matters, the football served up has been pretty dreadful to watch. It's all very well talking about giving him another window or two, but the acid test is whether the owners are going to trust Jones' judgment and invest further in more player acquisitions. I personally have real doubts that he can turn the current position around and, even if more talent was made available to him in January or next summer, I am not confident that he could deploy it to good effect given his primordial tactical approach.
I also do wonder if the majority of the players have any real belief in Jones' 'game plan' and what he is telling them.
He also looks like he's gone into self-preservation mode and is trying to preserve what is left of his reputation by deflecting blame elsewhere. If the current malaise continues and we are sleepwalking into a relegation fight, then the club will have to act; if we're safe, in or around mid-table, I think he'll stay until the end of the season but I believe there'll be a parting of the ways next summer.
Paul Hart retired at the end of August.
Is that a factor?
has failed at every single job elsewhere
his replacement at Luton got them to the Prem
it’s been utter shit all season bar a performance or two
bluffer been called and he’s got no hand
We can't even put Mbick or Casey on the bench because they are also injured.
Since then, Leaburn has returned, which should have actually improved the forward line.
Granted, we miss Jones badly, but a centre half being out temporarily, shouldn't derail a whole season.
Everything has fallen apart because we have never found that missing creative spark, it simply doesn't exist at the club at this time, due to terrible recruitment.
You cannot win games if you cannot score a goal in the first half of a game, and are always having to come from behind, or waiting to bring on subs in the 65th minute of games.
Attack is the best form of defence.
But we simply cannot retain the ball in the final third. There is a disconnect between the midfield and forward line. It needed to be identified and fixed early on before the rot set in, before players started losing confidence and stop giving 100%.
That didn't happen and we are now in a downward spiral with Jones clutching at straws.
Basically if we concede a goal then we're screwed because not once all season in the league have we won a game when we've conceded.
When NJ was appointed a large majority of fans were happy, me included, he dragged us out of the mire last season and we started this season quite well, albeit the football was poor, but we ground out positive results.
Now we're playing poor and losing, so it seems our natural reaction is to shuffle the deckchairs again. What's to say another person at the helm will have any different outcome, only Bowyer, recently has had any success and that didn't last!
We, apparently, have filthy rich owners, so why was recruitment so poor in the summer. We know NJ wanted at least 2 quality keepers, he didnt get them, what else did he want that he didn't get. No one, me included, knows the truth about May and Dobbo and why they left, CBT had gone before NJ arrived.
My thoughts are to get rid of Scott, CM and Rodwell, get a proper DoF in and ask the owners to back NJ and the new DoF to get quality players in during January.
Transfer or loan out, Docherty, Gillesphey, Anderson and Kanu, send A.Campbell, Potts back to whence they came.
Bring in a leftsided CB to play alongside Jones and Ramsay, get 2 playmakers in to play in midfield, leave Hylton as a coach only, get in a proven young striker, and use the PL for quality loans.
Give NJ the full season and have faith in him to deliver.
Sorry for the long post, but we can't keep changing managers it's not worked, and as the old saying goes, 'If u keep doing what you've always done, you'll always get the same results you've always got' (or words to that effect).