If he is so good why did nobody mention him on a wish list until last night?
He was mentioned couple of weeks ago when he was interviewed
Yes not by you though you know nothing twat. Last night you were spouting something along the lines of "the deal has been done, we all have the man we wanted and TS is flying over next week to announce it"
You were nowhere near to thinking it was BG and so much for TS coming over next week to announce it.
What a joke....... sacked Jackson for this........ I really give up. All will have been done on a spreadsheet, just like RD he'll never learn, too pig/big headed.
Is this a question or a statement? Was he 8th choice or numbe 1 target?
Rob7Lee is a very knowledgeable man, so I'm surprised at the extreme negativity. Has TS upset you Rob?
He's not upset me no, but people far more knowledgeable in the inner workings of this industry will tell you he's setting himself up to fail.
Like many successful business men/women he knows best, even in a field he had little knowledge of, much like RD he believes he (and his son) knows more than seasoned pro's who've been in and around the game for decades.
He might strike it lucky, much like RD did with Bowyer/Gallen etc - but ultimately luck has a finite lifespan and runs out very quickly!
Most seasons I like a little flutter on promotion, TBH the way things are going I'll probably hedge my bets and put some on relegation instead.
Theres a lot of stuff out there, you don't have to have inner knowledge in the club to work things out.
Luke Rooney, Ricky Lambert and Steve Parish have all praised Ben Garner either tonight or in the past as an excellent coach who can get his point across to players. A licence coach.
Ben Garner is another coach who started young after an injury put paid to a football playing career. He was born in Pembury, Kent. Not sure if it was personal issues but he had a break after a month in the job and Bristol Rovers didn't quite work out and it was Lambert who recommended Garner for that job.
The Swindon job he did very well as he had to bring so many players in as he only had a 7 a side team when he took over.
Good record with young players, and Zaha, Johnnie Williams, Nat Clyne are just a few of the young player he helped in their development at Palace.
Thomas Sandgaard may look on Twitter and change his mind; I wonder if that's why he told JR that interviewing is still going on ?
I believe he can do a good job but not if he is slagged off as soon as he loses his first game.
Pembury is my local hospital and I have been there a number of times over recent years and the place has been impeccable on each occasion if that helps to reassure anyone about Garner's appointment.
Listening to the last 20 minutes of that podcast you can absolutely see why Sandgaard will love Garner. He talks a lot about how and why data analysis should be used to compliment traditional scouting, not instead of, as well as player performance and talks specifically about the Brentford (and Brighton) model but stresses that any owner that wants to copy that has to be patient. Easy to forget Brentford are ten years into their model.
This isn’t a done deal, news leaked from Swindon as a hurry up. Compo deal agreed in principal.. but final decision hasn’t been made yet, as I understand
A very good article on Garner put up by @Scoham a couple of pages back. Recommended reading.
My take on it is that Garner is the man with all the tools to build a clubs infrastructure in the right way to ensure long term success and stability. I doubt though that Sandgaard will give him the necessary time should we fail to make the play offs next year.
Would have preferred Beale, Warburton or Taylor in that order but beggars can't be choosers. Welcome Ben.
What a joke....... sacked Jackson for this........ I really give up. All will have been done on a spreadsheet, just like RD he'll never learn, too pig/big headed.
Is this a question or a statement? Was he 8th choice or numbe 1 target?
Question, he certainly wasn't number one choice as he wasn't the first manager to be spoken to. But whether TS spoke to 3/5/10 or 100 I don't know.
But the same mistakes are being made time and time again, players bought on stats, now managers.
But despite Swindon being number 1 in almost every stat last season, they weren't top in the one that matters - promotion.......So a manager fail to get one off the best squads in league two out of the division, so we'll give him a go at getting us out of league one with in a relative terms arguably a worse squad...... Swindon only just made the playoffs by a point.
Aren't most managers employed on stats? Then you go on to say why he shouldn't get the job, based on stats!
If Swindon did have the best, or one of the best, squad in the divison the guy is a genius. They have 7 players on the first day of preason and were on the verg of being wound up.
MK Dons had similar stats and didn't get promoted and there would have been a wankfest if we got their manager...........
Which one of historically our successful managers has been appointed on stats? Powell, Curbs, Lawrence, Seed?
Much like players stats are a small part, do they fit in, right temperament, are they 'Charlton' - all those questions a Cubs and a Powell would look at as well as stats.
Yer Swindon had such a poor squad by the end of August they were 4th
Seed had one season as Secretary Manager of Clapton Orient when it was supposed to be Arsenal’s nursery club. He’d been mentored by Herbert Chapman, whom he’d know for a few years. The FA then ruled nursery clubs weren’t allowed, so the money dried up. His main aim then was to get 11 men on the pitch each week.
At the end of the season Orient had made a profit of £5, so he he had to let the entire squad go, as he couldn’t afford to pay summer wages.
JS then sat next to Albert Glikstein at the banquet held by Arsenal to celebrate their title win (purely because the seating was arranged alphabetically).
The Charlton owner was bemoaning the club’s relegation, and asked if JS had been lucky in football. He virtually offered Seed the job there and then. JS had offered to do the job without a contract, while he proved himself.
In the modern era I think the only advantage in having ex Charlton players as manager is that the fans will give them more time. I suspect Garner may not have that luxury unfortunately, so let’s hope he can hit the ground running.
Interesting stats .. from league two last season Swindon were first in all the attacking areas goals , shots , procession , shots on target .
Yes Ronnie, those stats were interesting last night when they were posted multiple times on here, tell us something we don't already know................................................something that is true.
A very good article on Garner put up by @Scoham a couple of pages back. Recommended reading.
My take on it is that Garner is the man with all the tools to build a clubs infrastructure in the right way to ensure long term success and stability. I doubt though that Sandgaard will give him the necessary time should we fail to make the play offs next year.
Would have preferred Beale, Warburton or Taylor in that order but beggars can't be choosers. Welcome Ben.
Agree with this and as much as I hate to admit it, Palace have been a well run club for about a decade now. Garner progressed quickly there and has seen and experienced what a good infrastructure looks and feels like.
What a joke....... sacked Jackson for this........ I really give up. All will have been done on a spreadsheet, just like RD he'll never learn, too pig/big headed.
Is this a question or a statement? Was he 8th choice or numbe 1 target?
Question, he certainly wasn't number one choice as he wasn't the first manager to be spoken to. But whether TS spoke to 3/5/10 or 100 I don't know.
But the same mistakes are being made time and time again, players bought on stats, now managers.
But despite Swindon being number 1 in almost every stat last season, they weren't top in the one that matters - promotion.......So a manager fail to get one off the best squads in league two out of the division, so we'll give him a go at getting us out of league one with in a relative terms arguably a worse squad...... Swindon only just made the playoffs by a point.
They may have only made the playoffs by a point, but they were only 3 points off automatic promotion too. League 2 was ridiculously tight at the top of the table this year. Tranmere who finished 9th were only 9 points off top spot.
I know I shouldn't be but, but I'm a bit surprised by the outpouring of negativity if it's Garner. I admit I also didn't jump for joy straight away because I'd not really thought about him as an option, but looking and reading a bit more it seems logical. He took over a Swindon team that had just been relegated, gutted and had been staring into the abyss. Their penniless owner transferred his shares on 20th July 2021 and Garner was appointed the next day. When he joined they didn't have a manager (obviously), assistant manager, chief executive or director of football. Their goalkeeping coach was looking after the first team (completely irrelevant to this, but the goalkeeping coach Steve Mildenhall is best known for having to have his ballbag sewn back up at half-time on his debut for Swindon. Fun fact!) and they had 7 contracted players having been under a transfer embargo. The first game of their season was due to take place on 7th August, just over two weeks later.
In the end Swindon had to sign 13 players on permanents in the summer and brought in 4 loans. One of those loans was called Alex Gilbert, so you can react to that however feels best for you.This is a club that had been on the edge, under a transfer embargo, penniless, almost entirely without a squad and licking the wounds of a psychologically damaging relegation season the year before and they finished 6th, just 3 points off automatics. When we look at what we have to do this season, we're a good couple of years ahead of where Swindon were when he started there, but there's some similarities. A team that had been through ownership turmoil, transfer embargoes, key management positions emptied, relegation and very public ownership squabbles, hardly any players in the squad and no real core to it. Garner came in and seemingly handled those things. We have 17 players. Two of them are goalkeepers, one is Kirk who may not want to come back and one is Purrington who is out of contract and may still leave. Also, the players that are there are mostly about as much use as Mildenhall's nutsack. Add to that Garner apparently playing the type of football the owner wants and you have a manager who can seemingly take a club that needs a huge influx of new players while the structure rebuilds around him and still do a good job. They won the first leg of their play-off and then lost on penalties; Bowyer relied on Tommy Rowe bottling his pen to get us to the Championship so it's not a huge stretch to imagine that things could have been different for Swindon there. Sure, this has all happened at L2 level, but I don't remember there being quite so many negative responses to Matt Taylor, a manager who took four years to end up just 3 points higher than Garner with a far more stable set-up and build. I think Taylor is definitely benefiting from being a former player at a very good time for the club. I'd be very happy to have Taylor too incidentally, but I feel like a lot of the reactions to Garner is more that a lot had their hearts set on Beale and haven't stopped to think about why Garner could be chosen. I've also seen a lot of 'may as well have kept Jackson then' comments (mostly on the hellscape that is Twitter, but from people I normally wouldn't associate with the usual Twitter frothing), which make no sense. Garner got a team to the Play-Offs and apparently improved a lot of players. Jackson kept us from getting relegated from League One and didn't really improve the team or build a structured way of playing. No matter how you slice it Garner is coming off a successful season and Jackson is coming off a failed one. Sad for Jacko and I hope he does brilliantly at Wimbledon but they're not the same. If Garner does come in then I get it, and I'll hope he does well for us.
This isn’t a done deal, news leaked from Swindon as a hurry up. Compo deal agreed in principal.. but final decision hasn’t been made yet, as I understand
makes sense now if Swindon have leaked the story, they will want it sorted one way of the other asap to then begin their own process (if needed)
Just to clear up the rubbish that's being written about Garner's love in with Davison.
This was a coach of a League 2 team who needed a bit of help to get promoted. He turned to Davison who, at the time, was having a decent time with us (although his form had dipped by the time he went) and was affordable for a League 2 team.
That doesn't mean that he believes Davison is the man to take us into the Championship. That also isn't the reason we kept Davison and got rid of Washington.
I don't think Jackson will be signing Juan Castillo for Wimbledon just because he signed him for us. It doesn't work like that.
This isn’t a done deal, news leaked from Swindon as a hurry up. Compo deal agreed in principal.. but final decision hasn’t been made yet, as I understand
Why not just say that a Sandgaard told you that?
Nothing wrong with that and thanks for sharing but it was either MS or TS who told you that.
It's funny because if you look at Garner's journey, his work ethic, what he achieved as a coach, and as an assistant head coach - and how he likes to think outside the box, continue to educate himself, as well as how he talks about player development and coaching techniques he is very similar to Beale (who was the candidate I wanted based on basically the fact that Gerrard waxed lyrical about him).
The major difference between those two is Garner has actually been the head coach at a couple of clubs, one which didn't go well (they didn't even have training pitches etc), and one where he took a basket case of a club with only 7 players and turned them into the best attacking team in the league almost seeing them promoted.
Again, it is fine that you think he might be underwhelming compared to some other names thrown out there, but it is not by any stretch of the imagination a nobody who has come completely out of left field. He is an ambitious, young, progressive manager who has a large body of successful work behind him.
This isn’t a done deal, news leaked from Swindon as a hurry up. Compo deal agreed in principal.. but final decision hasn’t been made yet, as I understand
Why not just say that a Sandgaard told you that?
Nothing wrong with that and thanks for sharing but it was either MS or TS who told you that.
Haven’t spoke to TS for a while, since International fan forum.. 😉
This isn’t a done deal, news leaked from Swindon as a hurry up. Compo deal agreed in principal.. but final decision hasn’t been made yet, as I understand
Why not just say that a Sandgaard told you that?
Nothing wrong with that and thanks for sharing but it was either MS or TS who told you that.
Haven’t spoke to TS for a while, since International fan forum.. 😉
What a joke....... sacked Jackson for this........ I really give up. All will have been done on a spreadsheet, just like RD he'll never learn, too pig/big headed.
Is this a question or a statement? Was he 8th choice or numbe 1 target?
Question, he certainly wasn't number one choice as he wasn't the first manager to be spoken to. But whether TS spoke to 3/5/10 or 100 I don't know.
But the same mistakes are being made time and time again, players bought on stats, now managers.
But despite Swindon being number 1 in almost every stat last season, they weren't top in the one that matters - promotion.......So a manager fail to get one off the best squads in league two out of the division, so we'll give him a go at getting us out of league one with in a relative terms arguably a worse squad...... Swindon only just made the playoffs by a point.
Why would the first manager TS interviewed be his first choice, and how do we know he even had a ‘first choice’? Sounds to me like they interviewed, and if the rumours are true, are still interviewing lots of candidates.
Maybe they went into it with a complete open mind and wanted to hear from as many managers as possible which is why the process is taking as long as it is.
Secondly, and this is complete ignorance on my part due to my lack of knowledge, but what do you know about the Swindon team and it’s players to say they had one of the best squads in the league? From what I read they had 7 players at the beginning of the season, and had been in somewhat of a downward spiral.
If you believe that then IMHO you are deluded. TS much like RD has a very small pool of managers who will work under his 'set up', especially in League one, which he is now finding. Garner wasn't first choice or even 5th, but he may well be one of the few prepared to work under the set up provided by TS and MS.
I love how you state this like it’s undeniable fact. You know as much as anyone else.
Maybe, maybe not.
I’m very surprised at the line you are taking here. I presume you have good reasons for it, as it’s quite unsettling. On the face of it, I’m not sure how you could have access to the full recruitment long-list, which is what you imply.
I certainly do not have access to any form of head coach recruitment list, but I am aware of a number of potentials who have been spoken to/sounded out, and I also know why some of them are not interested.
You have an owner and son wishing to dictate to seasoned professionals the style of play, a much lesser than normally expected input into player recruitment, this really is no different to the infamous email from RD and the diamond formation to Powell and how players were brought in. TS is a just a bit more friendly/cuddly and here (more!)
As I mentioned above, some seem to think Jackson was appointed due to his record as Caretaker, that's simply not the case, TS was unable to persuade anyone to come (that he wanted). Just remember he was appointed as Caretaker on 21st October and it wasn't until almost two months later he was given the permanent gig ............ on a very restrictive contract that TS knew was highly likely to mean he could remove Jackson at the end of the season easily and for minimum cost.
This is unsurprising yet very concerning.
Next few weeks/ months of the transfer window is integral in seeing whether we have any hope in hell of getting anywhere near the top of this miserable league.
If it's a repeat of the windows so far we better get used to trips to Accrington and Burton for the foreseeable.
Just to clear up the rubbish that's being written about Garner's love in with Davison.
This was a coach of a League 2 team who needed a bit of help to get promoted. He turned to Davison who, at the time, was having a decent time with us (although his form had dipped by the time he went) and was affordable for a League 2 team.
That doesn't mean that he believes Davison is the man to take us into the Championship. That also isn't the reason we kept Davison and got rid of Washington.
I don't think Jackson will be signing Juan Castillo for Wimbledon just because he signed him for us. It doesn't work like that.
Agree about Davison. Good example with Juan Castillo as he was a bad time keeper and his basic fitness was poor. ( That info did come from the dressing room)
Young players do lose their way especially when they have been at clubs like Chelsea who have so many players on their books that they lose motivation as they are paid too much money too young and just keep going out on loan.
Comments
You were nowhere near to thinking it was BG and so much for TS coming over next week to announce it.
Where's @Henry Irving when you need him...WIOTOS..
Like many successful business men/women he knows best, even in a field he had little knowledge of, much like RD he believes he (and his son) knows more than seasoned pro's who've been in and around the game for decades.
He might strike it lucky, much like RD did with Bowyer/Gallen etc - but ultimately luck has a finite lifespan and runs out very quickly!
Most seasons I like a little flutter on promotion, TBH the way things are going I'll probably hedge my bets and put some on relegation instead.
Theres a lot of stuff out there, you don't have to have inner knowledge in the club to work things out.
Pembury is my local hospital and I have been there a number of times over recent years and the place has been impeccable on each occasion if that helps to reassure anyone about Garner's appointment.
My take on it is that Garner is the man with all the tools to build a clubs infrastructure in the right way to ensure long term success and stability. I doubt though that Sandgaard will give him the necessary time should we fail to make the play offs next year.
Would have preferred Beale, Warburton or Taylor in that order but beggars can't be choosers. Welcome Ben.
The FA then ruled nursery clubs weren’t allowed, so the money dried up. His main aim then was to get 11 men on the pitch each week.
In the modern era I think the only advantage in having ex Charlton players as manager is that the fans will give them more time. I suspect Garner may not have that luxury unfortunately, so let’s hope he can hit the ground running.
This was a coach of a League 2 team who needed a bit of help to get promoted. He turned to Davison who, at the time, was having a decent time with us (although his form had dipped by the time he went) and was affordable for a League 2 team.
That doesn't mean that he believes Davison is the man to take us into the Championship. That also isn't the reason we kept Davison and got rid of Washington.
I don't think Jackson will be signing Juan Castillo for Wimbledon just because he signed him for us. It doesn't work like that.
Nothing wrong with that and thanks for sharing but it was either MS or TS who told you that.
The major difference between those two is Garner has actually been the head coach at a couple of clubs, one which didn't go well (they didn't even have training pitches etc), and one where he took a basket case of a club with only 7 players and turned them into the best attacking team in the league almost seeing them promoted.
Again, it is fine that you think he might be underwhelming compared to some other names thrown out there, but it is not by any stretch of the imagination a nobody who has come completely out of left field. He is an ambitious, young, progressive manager who has a large body of successful work behind him.
This is unsurprising yet very concerning.
Next few weeks/ months of the transfer window is integral in seeing whether we have any hope in hell of getting anywhere near the top of this miserable league.
If it's a repeat of the windows so far we better get used to trips to Accrington and Burton for the foreseeable.
Agree about Davison. Good example with
Juan Castillo as he was a bad time keeper and his basic fitness was poor. ( That info did come from the dressing room)
Young players do lose their way especially when they have been at clubs like Chelsea who have so many players on their books that they lose motivation as they are paid too much money too young and just keep going out on loan.