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Bowyer progress at Birmingham
Comments
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Wonder if Aneke will be available on loan in January. Was worth a punt for Birmingham but not good enough to step up to the championship2
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LB's school of management. Aneke will do what he did in L1 in the Championship, just because "it's me".0
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Aneke hardly played for Bowyer in the Championship for us for one reason or another, whereas Leko and Bonne did
Bringing in Deeney just added another aging and not very mobile striker to their squad, was that really what they needed?3 -
I questioned previously why LB signed him. Last night he replaced one lump, Jutkiewicz, with another (Deeney) but left Aneke and Hogan on the bench.mendonca said:LB's school of management. Aneke will do what he did in L1 in the Championship, just because "it's me".
Birmingham bizarrely netted five times at Luton and that is as many as they've scored in all of their other 12 games put together and taking into account added time, the reality is that they haven't actually scored now for some 580 minutes. One can only imagine what Golfie would be saying if we went almost 10 hours without finding the back of the net!!!!1 -
Yup. A little cheeky loan bid in January should be on the cards.SouthWest_Addicks said:Wonder if Aneke will be available on loan in January. Was worth a punt for Birmingham but not good enough to step up to the championship3 -
Might be worth a go....but Tommy has just said the players aren't fit enough, so Aneke might not fit the bill!Fortune 82nd Minute said:
Yup. A little cheeky loan bid in January should be on the cards.SouthWest_Addicks said:Wonder if Aneke will be available on loan in January. Was worth a punt for Birmingham but not good enough to step up to the championship0 -
Wondering if Lee wants to come back to Charlton so he can learn off of Jacko 😂2
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I think some of you have short memories......we loaned FROM them Leko. Don't be surprised seeing him being recalled in January but not getting anyone back. That could really leave us up shit creek.Fortune 82nd Minute said:
Yup. A little cheeky loan bid in January should be on the cards.SouthWest_Addicks said:Wonder if Aneke will be available on loan in January. Was worth a punt for Birmingham but not good enough to step up to the championship0 -
Unless we buy himgolfaddick said:
I think some of you have short memories......we loaned FROM them Leko. Don't be surprised seeing him being recalled in January but not getting anyone back. That could really leave us up shit creek.Fortune 82nd Minute said:
Yup. A little cheeky loan bid in January should be on the cards.SouthWest_Addicks said:Wonder if Aneke will be available on loan in January. Was worth a punt for Birmingham but not good enough to step up to the championship
Certainly Leko seems personally happier with us than at Birmingham, though I imagine they will pay a lot more2 -
The fact we have loaned Leko from them wouldn't make the slightest difference in trying to get another player from them - assuming of course they don't want the second player and were happy to see him move on.golfaddick said:
I think some of you have short memories......we loaned FROM them Leko. Don't be surprised seeing him being recalled in January but not getting anyone back. That could really leave us up shit creek.Fortune 82nd Minute said:
Yup. A little cheeky loan bid in January should be on the cards.SouthWest_Addicks said:Wonder if Aneke will be available on loan in January. Was worth a punt for Birmingham but not good enough to step up to the championship
FWIW, I don't think there's a hope in hell they would want to loan Aneke back to us. Or that he would want to come. And I also don't think Leko will be going back - he didn't pull many trees up in his spell there and I suspect a few goals scored for us in League 1 is hardly going to mean they want him back in a hurry.0 -
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Tracey won't let him go a second time anyway8
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The only issue with that theory is how Leko has previously performed for Birmingham:golfaddick said:
I think some of you have short memories......we loaned FROM them Leko. Don't be surprised seeing him being recalled in January but not getting anyone back. That could really leave us up shit creek.Fortune 82nd Minute said:
Yup. A little cheeky loan bid in January should be on the cards.SouthWest_Addicks said:Wonder if Aneke will be available on loan in January. Was worth a punt for Birmingham but not good enough to step up to the championship
41 games
zero goals
zero assists
It's actually worse than Aneke's record in the Championship. Therein. perhaps, lies the reason why they were happy to let him go2 -
But if you compare Aneke to Leko overall in the championship...Addick Addict said:
The only issue with that theory is how Leko has previously performed for Birmingham:golfaddick said:
I think some of you have short memories......we loaned FROM them Leko. Don't be surprised seeing him being recalled in January but not getting anyone back. That could really leave us up shit creek.Fortune 82nd Minute said:
Yup. A little cheeky loan bid in January should be on the cards.SouthWest_Addicks said:Wonder if Aneke will be available on loan in January. Was worth a punt for Birmingham but not good enough to step up to the championship
41 games
zero goals
zero assists
It's actually worse than Aneke's record in the Championship. Therein. perhaps, lies the reason why they were happy to let him go
AnekeP30, GS2, A2 (1GS per 15)
Leko
P72, GS5, A5 (14.4GS per 15)
Difference is Leko's played all across the pitch in those games. (Except defence).0 -
I’m willing to bet Bow won’t be in charge at the start of next season.1
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Adkins will replace him and keep them up with a brilliant last 10 games of the season.ShootersHillGuru said:I’m willing to bet Bow won’t be in charge at the start of next season.11 -
Newcastle calling?ShootersHillGuru said:I’m willing to bet Bow won’t be in charge at the start of next season.6 -
Leko's record was, indeed, a lot better for us than for Birmingham. My point was more questioning why Birmingham and Bowyer in particular would want him back when he hasn't had a goal or assist in 41 appearances for them. I'm also struggling to think of any players that Bowyer has welcomed back once he's sent them out on loan. Bowyer doesn't want someone back who he doesn't think will fit his system which, let's face it, is all about conceding possession, stopping the opposition from scoring and hoping that his side nicks one at the other end.Dazzler21 said:
But if you compare Aneke to Leko overall in the championship...Addick Addict said:
The only issue with that theory is how Leko has previously performed for Birmingham:golfaddick said:
I think some of you have short memories......we loaned FROM them Leko. Don't be surprised seeing him being recalled in January but not getting anyone back. That could really leave us up shit creek.Fortune 82nd Minute said:
Yup. A little cheeky loan bid in January should be on the cards.SouthWest_Addicks said:Wonder if Aneke will be available on loan in January. Was worth a punt for Birmingham but not good enough to step up to the championship
41 games
zero goals
zero assists
It's actually worse than Aneke's record in the Championship. Therein. perhaps, lies the reason why they were happy to let him go
AnekeP30, GS2, A2 (1GS per 15)
Leko
P72, GS5, A5 (14.4GS per 15)
Difference is Leko's played all across the pitch in those games. (Except defence).
But, perhaps, the most telling thing is what Leko himself said on his return:
“I just feel right at home here, the whole club, the fans, everyone is just welcoming. I really love it here, I love playing here."
It might be a dig at Birmingham or simply an expression of the fact that the Club and specifically the likes of Tracy Leaburn actually made him feel wanted.2 -
It's interesting that both Adkins and Bowyer got "new manager" bounce at their new clubs last season
Bowyer's continued for a few weeks at the beginning of this season, but that good start has faded badly now3 -
Yeah, it is so interesting. Guess it shows that over the long term coaching and tactics far outweigh the ability for a new manager to get an extra % out of the players.killerandflash said:It's interesting that both Adkins and Bowyer got "new manager" bounce at their new clubs last season
Bowyer's continued for a few weeks at the beginning of this season, but that good start has faded badly nowI do hope JJ has some new ideas (or is allowed to coach his new ideas).1 -
On last Sunday's MOTD2 they talked about Brentford and the massive profit they've made on buying and selling players (Konsa being one of them). A great scouting system is part of the reason, but just as importantly they also improve players, by coaching them well. The likes of Maupay, Konsa, Watkins, Benrahma all got better after they joined BrentfordFishCostaFortune said:
Yeah, it is so interesting. Guess it shows that over the long term coaching and tactics far outweigh the ability for a new manager to get an extra % out of the players.killerandflash said:It's interesting that both Adkins and Bowyer got "new manager" bounce at their new clubs last season
Bowyer's continued for a few weeks at the beginning of this season, but that good start has faded badly nowI do hope JJ has some new ideas (or is allowed to coach his new ideas).
Until it went sour, under Bowyer we went through a period where we also improved players, even if it some were loanees, but over the last year we seem to be making players worse.5 -
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In Bowyer's case he has a game plan (which Adkins didn't seem to) that he sticks to. The issue is the classic "no plan B" and "strength overdone" syndrome that means when the game goes against him (and specifically the opposition scores) he actually has no methodology as to how to change things.killerandflash said:It's interesting that both Adkins and Bowyer got "new manager" bounce at their new clubs last season
Bowyer's continued for a few weeks at the beginning of this season, but that good start has faded badly now
His stats in this regard, so far as wins are concerned, are freakishly consistent -
At Birmingham:
2-1
2-0
1-0
2-1
1-0
1-0
5-0
2-0
Final season with us:
2-0
1-0
1-0
2-0
2-0
2-0
3-2
2-0
5-2
1-0
1-0
2-0
1-0
2-1
So, 17 of his last 22 wins as a Manager have resulted from clean sheets with all bar one of those wins without conceding being 1-0 or 2-0. The game we won 5-2 was against Wimbledon when Bowyer brought on Aneke and Williams after 53 minutes as we were losing 2-1 but that was a rare occasion when he actually let the handbrake off and only because he really had to.
Bowyer works on the premise that if his sides stop the opposition from scoring then they can't lose. Which is fine as long as they don't concede but as we found, following that spell last season when the Famewo/Inniss partnership worked so well together, once his sides start to leak goals he has no solution.
Which is where he is now at Birmingham - in the situation where because they can't score they can't win - 580 minutes without a goal of any description and not one goal in open play in the last seven matches. No team in the Championship has scored in fewer than the five games they have scored in either.
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Nice statistical analysis AA3
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Birmingham score two goals to beat Swansea at home yesterday. LB will be relieved to end the drought.2
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Amazing stats from that game. Birmingham had 15 shots with 6 of those on target whereas Swansea had 7 shots with just the one on target. But here's the thing. Birmingham only had 28% possession!Callumcafc said:Birmingham score two goals to beat Swansea at home yesterday. LB will be relieved to end the drought.4 -
I wanted Birmingham to fail as I found Bowyer's exit from us to be a bitter one and I blamed him for it.
I go back on that now and wish him all the best.
He gave us some great memories and I hope his managerial career is a successful one.
Hope Birmingham stay up and they solidify championship status...before they can then proceed with ambitious further investments.9 -
I imagine quite a few people's stances have softened on Bowyer since our recent experience with Adkins. Despite genuinely losing his mind, Bowyer kept us pretty competitive with a very small and limited squad. We started without enough players and then had to scratch around for whatever was available. Bogle up front, bad injury to Doughty changing how we wanted to play, constant injuries, Deji. Still despite that we were still in with a shout of the play-offs when he left and we were always competitive, just conceded loads of stupid goals, unlike under Adkins this season where you genuinely couldn't see what the plan was. We were disappointed with what we got off Bowyer last season but if he'd had a squad like this there's no way we would have been in the dropzone 14 games inDave2l said:I wanted Birmingham to fail as I found Bowyer's exit from us to be a bitter one and I blamed him for it.
I go back on that now and wish him all the best.
He gave us some great memories and I hope his managerial career is a successful one.
Hope Birmingham stay up and they solidify championship status...before they can then proceed with ambitious further investments.
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Given how similarly he's done at both Charlton and now Birmingham, and the limitations he's shown in both I think its safe to say that unless he undergoes some sort of reinvention he's probably at best a Championship manager who is perfectly suited for a club in a crisis needing an immediate rescue but perhaps not a man for the long term project.
But that's not necessarily a bad thing perhaps. I'm sure he'll probably have a fairly decent career, just probably not one spending years in the Premiership (as a manager/coach.)7 -
Bit harsh. Birmingham wasted their money on way over priced Brentford players, and way over priced foreigners. Plus they pay stupid large wages to average champ players. Lee's gone in, not had much budget, and from where I see par for them could be a relegation battle. If he makes mid-table with that squad and their resources I think he's over achieved.10
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Three wins in a row has turned things around a bit up there. Pushed themselves away from the drop and into the play-off chasing pack, in 13th but only two points off 6th.1
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I see that Chuks spent several hours at the local hospital today, bless him.
Those splinters were starting to turn nasty.....3
