Well there's a suprise.... Cant understand anyone wanting to leave this cosy club. Always act in the benefit of it's members.
Would you prefer to be in a club that acts against its members' interests?
No, hence why voted out.
Just to be clear, you're saying you voted to leave a club that works for the benefit of its members' interests, because you don't want to be in a club that works against its members' interests.
That strikes me as being somewhat muddled.
Read what my original post said... But take out there's a suprise.
OK. I'm left with: "Cant understand anyone wanting to leave this cosy club. Always act in the benefit of it's members". Which, to be frank, isn't much less baffling. Because a lot of people agree with this point. There really is not much point leaving a club that acts so clearly in its members' interests.
Perhaps it works in your head though.
Your deflecting the real issue of nepotism and breaking their own rules and procedures from Sepp Blatter I mean Mr Juncker....disgusting....
Perhaps that works in your head......Though.
Where does it say any rules were broken please?
I've read it again and, even though the article is critical (rightly) of the appointment, it seems to state that technically and legally it is compliant. If you were of a different mind set you might even see that this is in fact an example of the EU commission being held to account both by the press and MEP's. See also https://politico.eu/article/meps-parliament-to-debate-martin-selmayrs-appointment-european-commission/ for example.
Again I'm not doubting this all looks a bit dodgy. But neither is it unusual. You talk of nepotism, again rightly, but when the UK has an unelected second chamber packed full of individuals who sit there as a result of favours or financial contributions to politicians or parties I really don't think we're in any position whatsoever to start chucking stones about even if this example does suit your agenda.
Well there's a suprise.... Cant understand anyone wanting to leave this cosy club. Always act in the benefit of it's members.
Would you prefer to be in a club that acts against its members' interests?
No, hence why voted out.
Just to be clear, you're saying you voted to leave a club that works for the benefit of its members' interests, because you don't want to be in a club that works against its members' interests.
That strikes me as being somewhat muddled.
Read what my original post said... But take out there's a suprise.
OK. I'm left with: "Cant understand anyone wanting to leave this cosy club. Always act in the benefit of it's members". Which, to be frank, isn't much less baffling. Because a lot of people agree with this point. There really is not much point leaving a club that acts so clearly in its members' interests.
Perhaps it works in your head though.
Your deflecting the real issue of nepotism and breaking their own rules and procedures from Sepp Blatter I mean Mr Juncker....disgusting....
Perhaps that works in your head......Though.
My head is still full of why you want to leave a club that demonstrably works to protect its own members' interests.
AND that you voted to leave the EU because you would prefer to be in a club that works against its own members' interests.
The only conclusion I can draw that makes any sense is that you made a mistake. Did you?
Nepotism and corruption eh? The health minister Jeremy Hunt is fourth cousin to the Queen. His first cousin is Virginia Bottomley ex MP for South West Surrey and ex Tory Health Minister. Jeremy Hunt is MP for South West Surrey and, as mentioned, Tory health minister. Nothing dodgy there then.
Remainers, most notably @Bournemouth Addick , have been saying for a long time that consumer regulations are likely to be worse outside the EU. However, this is another issue where I've never felt that those supporting Brexit have properly understood what will be lost or how it could be adequately replaced. Who is going to monitor the Peruvian bivalve situation to ensure that we don't eat scallops laden with hepatitis? Who is going to maintain a bilateral agreement with Israel? Who is going to decide the certification requirements for marine gastropods?
It strikes me that there are two main possibilities with this. We could say that we we keep in line with the EU's regulations (after all, all our exports to Europe will have to comply anyway). That seems to be both the simplest and safest approach. If we do that though, the 'sovereignty' argument falls flat on its face. We'd be tying ourselves to a regulatory framework into which we would have precisely zero input.
Alternatively, we could scrap the EU standards and make things up as we go along. But who's going to do that? It's noticeable that it's very often the same people who want Brexit that complain about the size of the civil service. Could the current government (or any future one's for that matter) be trusted to take this seriously? Are MAFF fully geared up to taking on all this work? Or will it be cut back along with road repairs, library funding and social security as another part of the austerity agenda.
The EU is much maligned for being bureaucratic. Whilst I don't support bureaucracy for bureaucracy's sake, I do think that a very large part of what's labelled bureaucracy is actually very useful, detailed and thankless work. I applaud those in the EU (and HM Govt and local councils) who do so much to protect us. I only hope that in a couple of years time I can be quite so confident when I tuck in to a bowl of mussels that they won't be Turkish ones containing e-coli. Somehow I doubt it.
Remainers, most notably @Bournemouth Addick , have been saying for a long time that consumer regulations are likely to be worse outside the EU. However, this is another issue where I've never felt that those supporting Brexit have properly understood what will be lost or how it could be adequately replaced. Who is going to monitor the Peruvian bivalve situation to ensure that we don't eat scallops laden with hepatitis? Who is going to maintain a bilateral agreement with Israel? Who is going to decide the certification requirements for marine gastropods?
It strikes me that there are two main possibilities with this. We could say that we we keep in line with the EU's regulations (after all, all our exports to Europe will have to comply anyway). That seems to be both the simplest and safest approach. If we do that though, the 'sovereignty' argument falls flat on its face. We'd be tying ourselves to a regulatory framework into which we would have precisely zero input.
Alternatively, we could scrap the EU standards and make things up as we go along. But who's going to do that? It's noticeable that it's very often the same people who want Brexit that complain about the size of the civil service. Could the current government (or any future one's for that matter) be trusted to take this seriously? Are MAFF fully geared up to taking on all this work? Or will it be cut back along with road repairs, library funding and social security as another part of the austerity agenda.
The EU is much maligned for being bureaucratic. Whilst I don't support bureaucracy for bureaucracy's sake, I do think that a very large part of what's labelled bureaucracy is actually very useful, detailed and thankless work. I applaud those in the EU (and HM Govt and local councils) who do so much to protect us. I only hope that in a couple of years time I can be quite so confident when I tuck in to a bowl of mussels that they won't be Turkish ones containing e-coli. Somehow I doubt it.
Remainers, most notably @Bournemouth Addick , have been saying for a long time that consumer regulations are likely to be worse outside the EU. However, this is another issue where I've never felt that those supporting Brexit have properly understood what will be lost or how it could be adequately replaced. Who is going to monitor the Peruvian bivalve situation to ensure that we don't eat scallops laden with hepatitis? Who is going to maintain a bilateral agreement with Israel? Who is going to decide the certification requirements for marine gastropods?
It strikes me that there are two main possibilities with this. We could say that we we keep in line with the EU's regulations (after all, all our exports to Europe will have to comply anyway). That seems to be both the simplest and safest approach. If we do that though, the 'sovereignty' argument falls flat on its face. We'd be tying ourselves to a regulatory framework into which we would have precisely zero input.
Alternatively, we could scrap the EU standards and make things up as we go along. But who's going to do that? It's noticeable that it's very often the same people who want Brexit that complain about the size of the civil service. Could the current government (or any future one's for that matter) be trusted to take this seriously? Are MAFF fully geared up to taking on all this work? Or will it be cut back along with road repairs, library funding and social security as another part of the austerity agenda.
The EU is much maligned for being bureaucratic. Whilst I don't support bureaucracy for bureaucracy's sake, I do think that a very large part of what's labelled bureaucracy is actually very useful, detailed and thankless work. I applaud those in the EU (and HM Govt and local councils) who do so much to protect us. I only hope that in a couple of years time I can be quite so confident when I tuck in to a bowl of mussels that they won't be Turkish ones containing e-coli. Somehow I doubt it.
I imagine the answer from many will be "I don't eat shellfish"...
Remainers, most notably @Bournemouth Addick , have been saying for a long time that consumer regulations are likely to be worse outside the EU. However, this is another issue where I've never felt that those supporting Brexit have properly understood what will be lost or how it could be adequately replaced. Who is going to monitor the Peruvian bivalve situation to ensure that we don't eat scallops laden with hepatitis? Who is going to maintain a bilateral agreement with Israel? Who is going to decide the certification requirements for marine gastropods?
It strikes me that there are two main possibilities with this. We could say that we we keep in line with the EU's regulations (after all, all our exports to Europe will have to comply anyway). That seems to be both the simplest and safest approach. If we do that though, the 'sovereignty' argument falls flat on its face. We'd be tying ourselves to a regulatory framework into which we would have precisely zero input.
Alternatively, we could scrap the EU standards and make things up as we go along. But who's going to do that? It's noticeable that it's very often the same people who want Brexit that complain about the size of the civil service. Could the current government (or any future one's for that matter) be trusted to take this seriously? Are MAFF fully geared up to taking on all this work? Or will it be cut back along with road repairs, library funding and social security as another part of the austerity agenda.
The EU is much maligned for being bureaucratic. Whilst I don't support bureaucracy for bureaucracy's sake, I do think that a very large part of what's labelled bureaucracy is actually very useful, detailed and thankless work. I applaud those in the EU (and HM Govt and local councils) who do so much to protect us. I only hope that in a couple of years time I can be quite so confident when I tuck in to a bowl of mussels that they won't be Turkish ones containing e-coli. Somehow I doubt it.
Don't worry. It will all be done by technology.
Govey won’t let us down. You can trust him to make sure all will be well.
Nepotism and corruption eh? The health minister Jeremy Hunt is fourth cousin to the Queen. His first cousin is Virginia Bottomley ex MP for South West Surrey and ex Tory Health Minister. Jeremy Hunt is MP for South West Surrey and, as mentioned, Tory health minister. Nothing dodgy there then.
You forgot the most relevant one to Charlton fans
Baronness Brady of Knightsbridge.
Why TF "Knightsbridge"? No clue. But I am sure she thinks it sounds better than Grays.
Nepotism and corruption eh? The health minister Jeremy Hunt is fourth cousin to the Queen. His first cousin is Virginia Bottomley ex MP for South West Surrey and ex Tory Health Minister. Jeremy Hunt is MP for South West Surrey and, as mentioned, Tory health minister. Nothing dodgy there then.
You forgot the most relevant one to Charlton fans
Baronness Brady of Knightsbridge.
Why TF "Knightsbridge"? No clue. But I am sure she thinks it sounds better than Grays Isle of Dogs.
Remainers, most notably @Bournemouth Addick , have been saying for a long time that consumer regulations are likely to be worse outside the EU. However, this is another issue where I've never felt that those supporting Brexit have properly understood what will be lost or how it could be adequately replaced. Who is going to monitor the Peruvian bivalve situation to ensure that we don't eat scallops laden with hepatitis? Who is going to maintain a bilateral agreement with Israel? Who is going to decide the certification requirements for marine gastropods?
It strikes me that there are two main possibilities with this. We could say that we we keep in line with the EU's regulations (after all, all our exports to Europe will have to comply anyway). That seems to be both the simplest and safest approach. If we do that though, the 'sovereignty' argument falls flat on its face. We'd be tying ourselves to a regulatory framework into which we would have precisely zero input.
Alternatively, we could scrap the EU standards and make things up as we go along. But who's going to do that? It's noticeable that it's very often the same people who want Brexit that complain about the size of the civil service. Could the current government (or any future one's for that matter) be trusted to take this seriously? Are MAFF fully geared up to taking on all this work? Or will it be cut back along with road repairs, library funding and social security as another part of the austerity agenda.
The EU is much maligned for being bureaucratic. Whilst I don't support bureaucracy for bureaucracy's sake, I do think that a very large part of what's labelled bureaucracy is actually very useful, detailed and thankless work. I applaud those in the EU (and HM Govt and local councils) who do so much to protect us. I only hope that in a couple of years time I can be quite so confident when I tuck in to a bowl of mussels that they won't be Turkish ones containing e-coli. Somehow I doubt it.
Joking aside there won't be many people outside the trades/industries directly affected by these measures aware this has been going on for years in order to protect them and us as consumers and legitimate businesses. This is of course just one tiny part of the measures in place to protect us that will need replicating in some fashion.
As @Chizz states there are some on here who are under the misunderstanding all this can be done by some computer in an office somewhere rather than an EHO, TSO, Meat Inspector, etc. carrying out physical checks in situ as happens now. Given that this government has already delivered massive cuts to the regulatory services responsible for carry out these inspections and enforcement and it's an ageing workforce, with few councils replacing those experienced staff retiring, it's all going to go wrong very quickly after we leave in my opinion.
Not only will there not be enough regulatory staff to implement and enforce the new rules and procedures that being outside the EU/SM will result in but neither will they be resourced to provide even the current reduced levels of support and guidance to businesses who will be left wading through the changes coming on their own.
It might have been an idea if the government had consulted with these regulators before or even during the referendum but whatever...I'm sure Leavers have a secret plan up to sort all this just waiting to be hauled up from a mussel bed somewhere.
Well there's a suprise.... Cant understand anyone wanting to leave this cosy club. Always act in the benefit of it's members.
Would you prefer to be in a club that acts against its members' interests?
No, hence why voted out.
Just to be clear, you're saying you voted to leave a club that works for the benefit of its members' interests, because you don't want to be in a club that works against its members' interests.
That strikes me as being somewhat muddled.
Read what my original post said... But take out there's a suprise.
OK. I'm left with: "Cant understand anyone wanting to leave this cosy club. Always act in the benefit of it's members". Which, to be frank, isn't much less baffling. Because a lot of people agree with this point. There really is not much point leaving a club that acts so clearly in its members' interests.
Perhaps it works in your head though.
Your deflecting the real issue of nepotism and breaking their own rules and procedures from Sepp Blatter I mean Mr Juncker....disgusting....
Perhaps that works in your head......Though.
My head is still full of why you want to leave a club that demonstrably works to protect its own members' interests.
AND that you voted to leave the EU because you would prefer to be in a club that works against its own members' interests.
The only conclusion I can draw that makes any sense is that you made a mistake. Did you?
Remainers, most notably @Bournemouth Addick , have been saying for a long time that consumer regulations are likely to be worse outside the EU. However, this is another issue where I've never felt that those supporting Brexit have properly understood what will be lost or how it could be adequately replaced. Who is going to monitor the Peruvian bivalve situation to ensure that we don't eat scallops laden with hepatitis? Who is going to maintain a bilateral agreement with Israel? Who is going to decide the certification requirements for marine gastropods?
It strikes me that there are two main possibilities with this. We could say that we we keep in line with the EU's regulations (after all, all our exports to Europe will have to comply anyway). That seems to be both the simplest and safest approach. If we do that though, the 'sovereignty' argument falls flat on its face. We'd be tying ourselves to a regulatory framework into which we would have precisely zero input.
Alternatively, we could scrap the EU standards and make things up as we go along. But who's going to do that? It's noticeable that it's very often the same people who want Brexit that complain about the size of the civil service. Could the current government (or any future one's for that matter) be trusted to take this seriously? Are MAFF fully geared up to taking on all this work? Or will it be cut back along with road repairs, library funding and social security as another part of the austerity agenda.
The EU is much maligned for being bureaucratic. Whilst I don't support bureaucracy for bureaucracy's sake, I do think that a very large part of what's labelled bureaucracy is actually very useful, detailed and thankless work. I applaud those in the EU (and HM Govt and local councils) who do so much to protect us. I only hope that in a couple of years time I can be quite so confident when I tuck in to a bowl of mussels that they won't be Turkish ones containing e-coli. Somehow I doubt it.
Nobody voted to leave the single market! Tory MPs have tried to place an amendment to stop us leaving the Customs Union but that has been postponed indefinitely for it will blow the Government "strategy" apart. Meanwhile the EU have stated categorically that there can be no more discussions without resolving the Irish border. Many of us believe that the only solution to the Irish border is a Customs Union (now Labour policy) and a single market in goods to ensure uniformity and protect all of those regulations.
There is an ongoing dispute within the Labour Party about when and whether Labour should shift to being openly in favour of the Single Market. At present Sir Keir Starmer has a very clear view that the outcome of Brexit should make us no worse off.
The remain campaign under Cameron and Osborne was project fear going on about how much people might lose financially. There was hardly a mention of the common standards and consumer protection - Why? They didn't want a Norway option and because Leave had successfully conflated EU regulation with a loss of sovereignty and national identity. This as opposed to pooling sovereignty with common agreements. As you state, the natural outcome of leaving common standards is to then establish your own bureaucracy to create agreements, negotiate them and then police them. That wasn't part of the Leave proposition, nor was it costed. That we enter this phase now calculating the real meanin is a consequence of the process - thank goodness we have a Parliamentary democracy and not an authoritarian President so this can be debated and resolved.
Two thirds of the country wish to remain in the single market and customs union and one hopes that this is where we end up at the end of the process. Nobody voted to abolish the "common market" Leaving the CU & SM is damaging to our manufacturing base and to our consumer rights - let us be very clear: those advocating leave everything wish to deregulate and bring down corporation tax in a race to the bottom in order to compete through undercutting. And then where is the money for infrasture, the NHS and the rest of public services going to come from?
Reading a piece by Slavoj Zizek over cofee this morning (as one does!) the view is that these stresses and tensions within the capitalist system are symptoms of a massive shake up to come. The UK tussle over what Brexit means, the outcome of the Italian elections and the European elections of June 2019 will shape our futures for some time to come. Not in terms of mere GDP but the direction of travel for the 2020s. The political philosophy of Western Europe is up for grabs and the tradition social democratic parties have slipped from 30% of the vote down to 20%. That was where I came across Zizek for he was a guest on This Week last Thursday discussing the fall of the centre left - powerful stuff and something that people have now woken up to across Europe. Not least our fellow fan @Southbank
Nepotism and corruption eh? The health minister Jeremy Hunt is fourth cousin to the Queen. His first cousin is Virginia Bottomley ex MP for South West Surrey and ex Tory Health Minister. Jeremy Hunt is MP for South West Surrey and, as mentioned, Tory health minister. Nothing dodgy there then.
Yes... But i would not stick up for them... I would say the same... You lot say negative things about Farage , Fox, and Johnson, don't like the last two, but dare anyone say anything about your bent god, Juncker you don't like it.
Two thirds of the country wish to remain in the single market and customs unionand one hopes that this is where we end up at the end of the process.
Just so that I am clear, and do not misrepresent your personal stance, what political process do you now believe is the best one to deliver this scenario, which politicians can we best support to help deliver it? And how will they go about it, exactly, in your route to achieving this outcome?
I am firmly backing the Umunna-Soubry - Lib Dem camp. What about you?
Nepotism and corruption eh? The health minister Jeremy Hunt is fourth cousin to the Queen. His first cousin is Virginia Bottomley ex MP for South West Surrey and ex Tory Health Minister. Jeremy Hunt is MP for South West Surrey and, as mentioned, Tory health minister. Nothing dodgy there then.
Yes... But i would not stick up for them... I would say the same... You lot say negative things about Farage , Fox, and Johnson, don't like the last two, but dare anyone say anything about your bent god, Juncker you don't like it.
Sure, but it's not really about the individuals for they are simply agents of change as well as bureaucrats trying to manage the system. The reality is that, as per my post above, we have significant faultlines in the system itself and social democrats are losing voter share because their base has no confidence in their ability to represent their interests.
Farage has been quite brilliant in both presenting a case and making himself unplayable in the Conservative Party. That the likes of Fox, Gove and Johnson are allied to his cause has caused horror amongst Tory remainers and will possibly split the party in half.
Nepotism and corruption eh? The health minister Jeremy Hunt is fourth cousin to the Queen. His first cousin is Virginia Bottomley ex MP for South West Surrey and ex Tory Health Minister. Jeremy Hunt is MP for South West Surrey and, as mentioned, Tory health minister. Nothing dodgy there then.
Yes... But i would not stick up for them... I would say the same... You lot say negative things about Farage , Fox, and Johnson, don't like the last two, but dare anyone say anything about your bent god, Juncker you don't like it.
Have you evidence for what my likes or dislikes of Junker are? Have you got a rope sorted, and a whacking great big saw too, so you can make good your promise to tow the Republic of Ireland to mid Atlantic? Such a plan indicates you care very deeply despite saying 'nobody cares'.
Nepotism and corruption eh? The health minister Jeremy Hunt is fourth cousin to the Queen. His first cousin is Virginia Bottomley ex MP for South West Surrey and ex Tory Health Minister. Jeremy Hunt is MP for South West Surrey and, as mentioned, Tory health minister. Nothing dodgy there then.
Yes... But i would not stick up for them... I would say the same... You lot say negative things about Farage , Fox, and Johnson, don't like the last two, but dare anyone say anything about your bent god, Juncker you don't like it.
Blimey you're really flogging this dead horse aren't you? Can somebody please give Chippy the argument on Junker he's looking for because so far not one poster has argued anything other than what's gone on is dodgy as...
Nepotism and corruption eh? The health minister Jeremy Hunt is fourth cousin to the Queen. His first cousin is Virginia Bottomley ex MP for South West Surrey and ex Tory Health Minister. Jeremy Hunt is MP for South West Surrey and, as mentioned, Tory health minister. Nothing dodgy there then.
Yes... But i would not stick up for them... I would say the same... You lot say negative things about Farage , Fox, and Johnson, don't like the last two, but dare anyone say anything about your bent god, Juncker you don't like it.
Chippy, it's about time you understood - there is only one Bent god.
Two thirds of the country wish to remain in the single market and customs unionand one hopes that this is where we end up at the end of the process.
Just so that I am clear, and do not misrepresent your personal stance, what political process do you now believe is the best one to deliver this scenario, which politicians can we best support to help deliver it? And how will they go about it, exactly, in your route to achieving this outcome?
I am firmly backing the Umunna-Soubry - Lib Dem camp. What about you?
If you do not wish to misrepresent my "personal stance" then don't. You choose! And if you want to continue to argue with your fellow fans with your arms flapping around like a windmill then that is also up to you. We can all see that you speak from the position of a Blairite neoliberal whose writings would not be misplaced in the Daily Mail for that is your style. You personalise, conflate, cite some personal experience or even that font of all wisdon, Twitter! And always seek to challenge anybody with whom you have a disagreement.
Not just challenge but you aim to belittle them in front of the audience by questioning their qualification and knowledge to even discuss the matter. Even their ability to read your views and your perspective. Mine is not an isolated experience for I am perhaps the fifth such fan to have experienced your particular approach in the last week. As @Big_Bad_World said the other day:
No. There is a difference between playing the game you mention and not wanting to play your games. The way in which you approach others, with sly little digs to try and get them to engage in your game of superiority, is quite an ugly thing to see/watch.
I choose to take no part in it. If that irks you and leads you to make wild assumptions and level accusations against me then you carry on. It affects me not.
Two thirds of the country wish to remain in the single market and customs unionand one hopes that this is where we end up at the end of the process.
Just so that I am clear, and do not misrepresent your personal stance, what political process do you now believe is the best one to deliver this scenario, which politicians can we best support to help deliver it? And how will they go about it, exactly, in your route to achieving this outcome?
I am firmly backing the Umunna-Soubry - Lib Dem camp. What about you?
If you do not wish to misrepresent my "personal stance" then don't. You choose! And if you want to continue to argue with your fellow fans with your arms flapping around like a windmill then that is also up to you. We can all see that you speak from the position of a Blairite neoliberal whose writings would not be misplaced in the Daily Mail for that is your style. You personalise, conflate, cite some personal experience or even that font of all wisdon, Twitter! And always seek to challenge anybody with whom you have a disagreement.
Not just challenge but you aim to belittle them in front of the audience by questioning their qualification and knowledge to even discuss the matter. Even their ability to read your views and your perspective. Mine is not an isolated experience for I am perhaps the fifth such fan to have experienced your particular approach in the last week. As @Big_Bad_World said the other day:
No. There is a difference between playing the game you mention and not wanting to play your games. The way in which you approach others, with sly little digs to try and get them to engage in your game of superiority, is quite an ugly thing to see/watch.
I choose to take no part in it. If that irks you and leads you to make wild assumptions and level accusations against me then you carry on. It affects me not.
Nepotism and corruption eh? The health minister Jeremy Hunt is fourth cousin to the Queen. His first cousin is Virginia Bottomley ex MP for South West Surrey and ex Tory Health Minister. Jeremy Hunt is MP for South West Surrey and, as mentioned, Tory health minister. Nothing dodgy there then.
Yes... But i would not stick up for them... I would say the same... You lot say negative things about Farage , Fox, and Johnson, don't like the last two, but dare anyone say anything about your bent god, Juncker you don't like it.
Blimey you're really flogging this dead horse aren't you? Can somebody please give Chippy the argument on Junker he's looking for because so far not one poster has argued anything other than what's gone on is dodgy as...
Well...lets hear no more comments then about Farage/Fox/Johnson then your Lordship...who put you in charge....see how long you can keep quiet.
Nepotism and corruption eh? The health minister Jeremy Hunt is fourth cousin to the Queen. His first cousin is Virginia Bottomley ex MP for South West Surrey and ex Tory Health Minister. Jeremy Hunt is MP for South West Surrey and, as mentioned, Tory health minister. Nothing dodgy there then.
Yes... But i would not stick up for them... I would say the same... You lot say negative things about Farage , Fox, and Johnson, don't like the last two, but dare anyone say anything about your bent god, Juncker you don't like it.
Chippy, it's about time you understood - there is only one Bent god.
Nepotism and corruption eh? The health minister Jeremy Hunt is fourth cousin to the Queen. His first cousin is Virginia Bottomley ex MP for South West Surrey and ex Tory Health Minister. Jeremy Hunt is MP for South West Surrey and, as mentioned, Tory health minister. Nothing dodgy there then.
Yes... But i would not stick up for them... I would say the same... You lot say negative things about Farage , Fox, and Johnson, don't like the last two, but dare anyone say anything about your bent god, Juncker you don't like it.
Have you evidence for what my likes or dislikes of Junker are? Have you got a rope sorted, and a whacking great big saw too, so you can make good your promise to tow the Republic of Ireland to mid Atlantic? Such a plan indicates you care very deeply despite saying 'nobody cares'.
Your ok then questioning everyone else's views with blanket statements, but your immune from it.
Nepotism and corruption eh? The health minister Jeremy Hunt is fourth cousin to the Queen. His first cousin is Virginia Bottomley ex MP for South West Surrey and ex Tory Health Minister. Jeremy Hunt is MP for South West Surrey and, as mentioned, Tory health minister. Nothing dodgy there then.
Yes... But i would not stick up for them... I would say the same... You lot say negative things about Farage , Fox, and Johnson, don't like the last two, but dare anyone say anything about your bent god, Juncker you don't like it.
Blimey you're really flogging this dead horse aren't you? Can somebody please give Chippy the argument on Junker he's looking for because so far not one poster has argued anything other than what's gone on is dodgy as...
Well...lets hear no more comments then about Farage/Fox/Johnson then your Lordship...who put you in charge....see how long you can keep quiet.
Nepotism and corruption eh? The health minister Jeremy Hunt is fourth cousin to the Queen. His first cousin is Virginia Bottomley ex MP for South West Surrey and ex Tory Health Minister. Jeremy Hunt is MP for South West Surrey and, as mentioned, Tory health minister. Nothing dodgy there then.
Yes... But i would not stick up for them... I would say the same... You lot say negative things about Farage , Fox, and Johnson, don't like the last two, but dare anyone say anything about your bent god, Juncker you don't like it.
Blimey you're really flogging this dead horse aren't you? Can somebody please give Chippy the argument on Junker he's looking for because so far not one poster has argued anything other than what's gone on is dodgy as...
Well...lets hear no more comments then about Farage/Fox/Johnson then your Lordship...who put you in charge....see how long you can keep quiet.
British racing festivals 'face ruin from a hard Brexit' amid warning no provision has been made for the free movement of horses once the UK leaves the EU - Britain, Ireland and France allow horses through only with a vet certificate - Gove is involved in stand-off with Brussels over plans to axe current agreement - He argues that the deal, struck in the 1960s, should be honoured after Brexit
Comments
I've read it again and, even though the article is critical (rightly) of the appointment, it seems to state that technically and legally it is compliant. If you were of a different mind set you might even see that this is in fact an example of the EU commission being held to account both by the press and MEP's. See also https://politico.eu/article/meps-parliament-to-debate-martin-selmayrs-appointment-european-commission/ for example.
Again I'm not doubting this all looks a bit dodgy. But neither is it unusual. You talk of nepotism, again rightly, but when the UK has an unelected second chamber packed full of individuals who sit there as a result of favours or financial contributions to politicians or parties I really don't think we're in any position whatsoever to start chucking stones about even if this example does suit your agenda.
AND that you voted to leave the EU because you would prefer to be in a club that works against its own members' interests.
The only conclusion I can draw that makes any sense is that you made a mistake. Did you?
The health minister Jeremy Hunt is fourth cousin to the Queen.
His first cousin is Virginia Bottomley ex MP for South West Surrey and ex Tory Health Minister.
Jeremy Hunt is MP for South West Surrey and, as mentioned, Tory health minister.
Nothing dodgy there then.
Remainers, most notably @Bournemouth Addick , have been saying for a long time that consumer regulations are likely to be worse outside the EU. However, this is another issue where I've never felt that those supporting Brexit have properly understood what will be lost or how it could be adequately replaced. Who is going to monitor the Peruvian bivalve situation to ensure that we don't eat scallops laden with hepatitis? Who is going to maintain a bilateral agreement with Israel? Who is going to decide the certification requirements for marine gastropods?
It strikes me that there are two main possibilities with this. We could say that we we keep in line with the EU's regulations (after all, all our exports to Europe will have to comply anyway). That seems to be both the simplest and safest approach. If we do that though, the 'sovereignty' argument falls flat on its face. We'd be tying ourselves to a regulatory framework into which we would have precisely zero input.
Alternatively, we could scrap the EU standards and make things up as we go along. But who's going to do that? It's noticeable that it's very often the same people who want Brexit that complain about the size of the civil service. Could the current government (or any future one's for that matter) be trusted to take this seriously? Are MAFF fully geared up to taking on all this work? Or will it be cut back along with road repairs, library funding and social security as another part of the austerity agenda.
The EU is much maligned for being bureaucratic. Whilst I don't support bureaucracy for bureaucracy's sake, I do think that a very large part of what's labelled bureaucracy is actually very useful, detailed and thankless work. I applaud those in the EU (and HM Govt and local councils) who do so much to protect us. I only hope that in a couple of years time I can be quite so confident when I tuck in to a bowl of mussels that they won't be Turkish ones containing e-coli. Somehow I doubt it.
Baronness Brady of Knightsbridge.
Why TF "Knightsbridge"? No clue. But I am sure she thinks it sounds better than Grays.
Joking aside there won't be many people outside the trades/industries directly affected by these measures aware this has been going on for years in order to protect them and us as consumers and legitimate businesses. This is of course just one tiny part of the measures in place to protect us that will need replicating in some fashion.
As @Chizz states there are some on here who are under the misunderstanding all this can be done by some computer in an office somewhere rather than an EHO, TSO, Meat Inspector, etc. carrying out physical checks in situ as happens now. Given that this government has already delivered massive cuts to the regulatory services responsible for carry out these inspections and enforcement and it's an ageing workforce, with few councils replacing those experienced staff retiring, it's all going to go wrong very quickly after we leave in my opinion.
Not only will there not be enough regulatory staff to implement and enforce the new rules and procedures that being outside the EU/SM will result in but neither will they be resourced to provide even the current reduced levels of support and guidance to businesses who will be left wading through the changes coming on their own.
https://fginsight.com/news/news/swingeing-cuts-to-regulatory-agencies-putting-food-safety-at-risk-55177
It might have been an idea if the government had consulted with these regulators before or even during the referendum but whatever...I'm sure Leavers have a secret plan up to sort all this just waiting to be hauled up from a mussel bed somewhere.
There is an ongoing dispute within the Labour Party about when and whether Labour should shift to being openly in favour of the Single Market. At present Sir Keir Starmer has a very clear view that the outcome of Brexit should make us no worse off.
The remain campaign under Cameron and Osborne was project fear going on about how much people might lose financially. There was hardly a mention of the common standards and consumer protection - Why? They didn't want a Norway option and because Leave had successfully conflated EU regulation with a loss of sovereignty and national identity. This as opposed to pooling sovereignty with common agreements. As you state, the natural outcome of leaving common standards is to then establish your own bureaucracy to create agreements, negotiate them and then police them. That wasn't part of the Leave proposition, nor was it costed. That we enter this phase now calculating the real meanin is a consequence of the process - thank goodness we have a Parliamentary democracy and not an authoritarian President so this can be debated and resolved.
Two thirds of the country wish to remain in the single market and customs union and one hopes that this is where we end up at the end of the process. Nobody voted to abolish the "common market" Leaving the CU & SM is damaging to our manufacturing base and to our consumer rights - let us be very clear: those advocating leave everything wish to deregulate and bring down corporation tax in a race to the bottom in order to compete through undercutting. And then where is the money for infrasture, the NHS and the rest of public services going to come from?
Reading a piece by Slavoj Zizek over cofee this morning (as one does!) the view is that these stresses and tensions within the capitalist system are symptoms of a massive shake up to come. The UK tussle over what Brexit means, the outcome of the Italian elections and the European elections of June 2019 will shape our futures for some time to come. Not in terms of mere GDP but the direction of travel for the 2020s. The political philosophy of Western Europe is up for grabs and the tradition social democratic parties have slipped from 30% of the vote down to 20%. That was where I came across Zizek for he was a guest on This Week last Thursday discussing the fall of the centre left - powerful stuff and something that people have now woken up to across Europe. Not least our fellow fan @Southbank
Two thirds of the country wish to remain in the single market and customs union and one hopes that this is where we end up at the end of the process.
Just so that I am clear, and do not misrepresent your personal stance, what political process do you now believe is the best one to deliver this scenario, which politicians can we best support to help deliver it? And how will they go about it, exactly, in your route to achieving this outcome?
I am firmly backing the Umunna-Soubry - Lib Dem camp. What about you?
Farage has been quite brilliant in both presenting a case and making himself unplayable in the Conservative Party. That the likes of Fox, Gove and Johnson are allied to his cause has caused horror amongst Tory remainers and will possibly split the party in half.
Have you got a rope sorted, and a whacking great big saw too, so you can make good your promise to tow the Republic of Ireland to mid Atlantic? Such a plan indicates you care very deeply despite saying 'nobody cares'.
Chippy, it's about time you understood - there is only one Bent god.
Not just challenge but you aim to belittle them in front of the audience by questioning their qualification and knowledge to even discuss the matter. Even their ability to read your views and your perspective. Mine is not an isolated experience for I am perhaps the fifth such fan to have experienced your particular approach in the last week. As @Big_Bad_World said the other day:
British racing festivals 'face ruin from a hard Brexit' amid warning no provision has been made for the free movement of horses once the UK leaves the EU
- Britain, Ireland and France allow horses through only with a vet certificate
- Gove is involved in stand-off with Brussels over plans to axe current agreement
- He argues that the deal, struck in the 1960s, should be honoured after Brexit