The message from corporal punishment and also smacking is that it is OK for big people to hit little people. Not really a main brexit issue though.
What about bringing back National Service? Solve the current recruitment problems and we are going to need more military to secure our borders
It's not an entirely crazy idea, provided we broaden the concept of what constitutes National Service (as the Germans did). There's even a useful policy there, IMHO.
If everyone was liable, after leaving school to in some way that did not teach little more than peeling spuds and how to kill people (instead doing things like assisting with social care, for example), it could really help the country, both in terms of social provision and social cohesion.
I'd suggest that, if a 12 month service was the norm, those that signed up for an additional 12 months (provided they met relevant standards) should have university fees waived.
Why should the armed services have to deal with the yoot of today? It ain't their problem
I agree with you. I wan't our armed services to be dedicated professional people who have volunteered to be there, have the right attitude and receive the proper training. It would counter-productive for the military to have to start running some high school extension scheme.
That said, I don't think we should be wedded to the idea that national service has to be military service. It would take lots of proper planning, but I don't see why there shouldn't be a form of national service doing work in the public interest in exchange for unemployment benefits (do they exist anymore?).
The idea is very appealing although would be fraught with problems. Perhaps the answer would be to make it voluntary enrolment with pay and significant post service benefits re housing, employment, tax breaks etc. Just off the top of my head but I’m sure it could work.
Stilton and English Cheddar for me. None of that foreign muck.
While I have no doubt that you are purchasing only West Country Farmhouse Cheddar (the one with the handy PDO status) or the like, sourced from your local artisanal/hipster Cheesemonger, it is worth pointing out that significant quantities of Cheddar sold in the UK (roughly a third) are produced in Ireland.
And I'm not sure how, in the the course of an ordinary supermarket shopping experience (with the possible exception of M&S), even where Cheddar is clearly (and possibly even accurately) labelled as produced in the UK, it would be that easy to avoid Scottish, Welsh, or Northern Irish cheeses, unless you are to buy PDO varieties.
Luckily, for Stilton, because it has PDO status, all cheeses called Stilton must be made with local milk in either Derbyshire, Leicestershire or Nottinghamshire.
Very useful thing that PDO designation....
Somerset actually. The Stilton designation well predates the EU. In fact I am sure we had Stilton before Monsieur De Gaulle, Mitterrand and Kohl.
Somerset Cheddar is covered by the West Country Farmhouse Cheddar PDO designation.
Yes, the Stilton name predates the EU, as does that of Cheddar, but Stilton has PDO status, which means that only those blue cheeses meeting the criteria for that designation may be called Stilton which is why that, while you may buy Irish Cheddar, you can only buy Cashel Blue, rather than Irish Stilton.
It is something of considerable value to Stilton producers (and, I would expect, dairy farmers within the catchment area) because it allows them enhanced income.
PDO (and PGI) designation is an EU initiative and is very successful, some non-EU products are covered (for a mix of EEA and accession countries, for which I'm assuming that Turkey is still an aceession state).
Protection of PDO status products outside the EU is largely achieved through bilateral treaties arranged by the EU.
Whether it continues to be applicable to UK produce will, no doubt, be one of the issues on which the razor-sharp intellect of, that fanatic about detail, David Davis will currently be trained - I look forward to his inevitable glorious success in persuading the EU to do precisely what it always wanted to do in this part, as in the other elements, of the Article 50 negotiations after Christmas...
Ah but you are overlooking the fact that Mr Davis will have Doctor Liam Fox assisting with the Trade negotiations (nudge, nudge, wink, wink, cough, cough, brown envelopes).
Or “the disgraced former defence secretary, Dr Liam Fox” to give him his proper title.
Be fair, we had to sack Mandelson dozens of times
More deflection.
If you read the story, Liam Fox is attempting to bury the details of any future trade negotiations with the US, not just while they are ongoing, but for years afterwards. So we won't know, just for example, whether there has been any discussions/agreement allowing GM crop producers access to the UK in time. Neither will Parliament be able to scrutinise the deal it seems. Another win for taking back control though eh?
This is the same Liam Fox btw who took his friend to work with him at the MOD, on official overseas trips, taking part in security meetings, etc. when he had no security clearance whatsoever IIRC. It's a shame he wasn't so keen on protecting who had proper access to classified information back then.
It staggers me that others are prepared to hand over such enormous unchecked influence over where this country is going, to individuals who should br nowhere near Parliament, let alone be in the Cabinet.
He won't be in Government by the time full Brexit happens, nor will many of the talking heads of today.
I hope you're right on that, yet you seem very happy for the "talking heads" around today to lead our country down some really stupid avenues? These effects will last decades not until the next election.
And that's before we get to the likes of Lynn Truss facing down huge multinationals looking to exploit our economic weakness in rolling back our current safeguards, etc.
I agree, Brexit is all about the decades, not the next few years. Decades where the population of the UK will top out at 70m and then (hopefully) start a steady reduction back to a manageable figure.
It probably won't affect me, I will be in Catalonia with my blue passport.
Not your place in France then?
No, I prefer the Spanos to the Frenchies.
However the question after brexit is, what do the Spanos think about you?
Probably the same, maybe worse - unlikely to be better than at present. But who cares ? Anyway, I'm heading to Catalonia (prob won't be Spain by then) because I like the way they are so pro-EU that they sent their main man to Brussels before he even got elected
Again you have missed the point.
You know this thing called freedom of movement, which allowed loads of Brits, often pensioners, to decamp to Spain ? Often without bothering to learn a word of Spanish, and often opting to live in a cocoon of English pubs, fish and chip shops and bowls clubs? And then pissing off the Spanish because they were clogging up the local health systems by congregating in certain areas? Brexit means it's all over. They might or might not let you stay. It won't be your choice. It will be theirs. They've taken back control.
Stilton and English Cheddar for me. None of that foreign muck.
While I have no doubt that you are purchasing only West Country Farmhouse Cheddar (the one with the handy PDO status) or the like, sourced from your local artisanal/hipster Cheesemonger, it is worth pointing out that significant quantities of Cheddar sold in the UK (roughly a third) are produced in Ireland.
And I'm not sure how, in the the course of an ordinary supermarket shopping experience (with the possible exception of M&S), even where Cheddar is clearly (and possibly even accurately) labelled as produced in the UK, it would be that easy to avoid Scottish, Welsh, or Northern Irish cheeses, unless you are to buy PDO varieties.
Luckily, for Stilton, because it has PDO status, all cheeses called Stilton must be made with local milk in either Derbyshire, Leicestershire or Nottinghamshire.
Very useful thing that PDO designation....
Somerset actually. The Stilton designation well predates the EU. In fact I am sure we had Stilton before Monsieur De Gaulle, Mitterrand and Kohl.
Somerset Cheddar is covered by the West Country Farmhouse Cheddar PDO designation.
Yes, the Stilton name predates the EU, as does that of Cheddar, but Stilton has PDO status, which means that only those blue cheeses meeting the criteria for that designation may be called Stilton which is why that, while you may buy Irish Cheddar, you can only buy Cashel Blue, rather than Irish Stilton.
It is something of considerable value to Stilton producers (and, I would expect, dairy farmers within the catchment area) because it allows them enhanced income.
PDO (and PGI) designation is an EU initiative and is very successful, some non-EU products are covered (for a mix of EEA and accession countries, for which I'm assuming that Turkey is still an aceession state).
Protection of PDO status products outside the EU is largely achieved through bilateral treaties arranged by the EU.
Whether it continues to be applicable to UK produce will, no doubt, be one of the issues on which the razor-sharp intellect of, that fanatic about detail, David Davis will currently be trained - I look forward to his inevitable glorious success in persuading the EU to do precisely what it always wanted to do in this part, as in the other elements, of the Article 50 negotiations after Christmas...
Ah but you are overlooking the fact that Mr Davis will have Doctor Liam Fox assisting with the Trade negotiations (nudge, nudge, wink, wink, cough, cough, brown envelopes).
Or “the disgraced former defence secretary, Dr Liam Fox” to give him his proper title.
Be fair, we had to sack Mandelson dozens of times
More deflection.
If you read the story, Liam Fox is attempting to bury the details of any future trade negotiations with the US, not just while they are ongoing, but for years afterwards. So we won't know, just for example, whether there has been any discussions/agreement allowing GM crop producers access to the UK in time. Neither will Parliament be able to scrutinise the deal it seems. Another win for taking back control though eh?
This is the same Liam Fox btw who took his friend to work with him at the MOD, on official overseas trips, taking part in security meetings, etc. when he had no security clearance whatsoever IIRC. It's a shame he wasn't so keen on protecting who had proper access to classified information back then.
It staggers me that others are prepared to hand over such enormous unchecked influence over where this country is going, to individuals who should br nowhere near Parliament, let alone be in the Cabinet.
He won't be in Government by the time full Brexit happens, nor will many of the talking heads of today.
I hope you're right on that, yet you seem very happy for the "talking heads" around today to lead our country down some really stupid avenues? These effects will last decades not until the next election.
And that's before we get to the likes of Lynn Truss facing down huge multinationals looking to exploit our economic weakness in rolling back our current safeguards, etc.
I agree, Brexit is all about the decades, not the next few years. Decades where the population of the UK will top out at 70m and then (hopefully) start a steady reduction back to a manageable figure.
It probably won't affect me, I will be in Catalonia with my blue passport.
Not your place in France then?
No, I prefer the Spanos to the Frenchies.
However the question after brexit is, what do the Spanos think about you?
Probably the same, maybe worse - unlikely to be better than at present. But who cares ? Anyway, I'm heading to Catalonia (prob won't be Spain by then) because I like the way they are so pro-EU that they sent their main man to Brussels before he even got elected
Again you have missed the point.
You know this thing called freedom of movement, which allowed loads of Brits, often pensioners, to decamp to Spain ? Often without bothering to learn a word of Spanish, and often opting to live in a cocoon of English pubs, fish and chip shops and bowls clubs? And then pissing off the Spanish because they were clogging up the local health systems by congregating in certain areas? Brexit means it's all over. They might or might not let you stay. It won't be your choice. It will be theirs. They've taken back control.
My current passport actually expires in May next year. Presumably this would mean I’m going to get a burgundy one next year and will have that for 10 years
Not that it matters much at the moment. The only destinations I seem to be taking time off for are League one football grounds
My current passport actually expires in May next year. Presumably this would mean I’m going to get a burgundy one next year and will have that for 10 years
Not that it matters much at the moment. The only destinations I seem to be taking time off for are League one football grounds
The roll out of the new blue passport is virtually upon us right now. An application in May would certainly result in the new version.
My passport runs out in April. Think I will put in my renewal application early in the new year and hope to get the EU style passport for the next 10 years. I would find the blue style little englander passport highly embarrassing to have to carry for the next 10 years.
By the time I have to renew again enough of the racist morons will have died off so the Brexit result will, I hope, have been reversed!
My passport runs out in April. Think I will put in my renewal application early in the new year and hope to get the EU style passport for the next 10 years. I would find the blue style little englander passport highly embarrassing to have to carry for the next 10 years.
By the time I have to renew again enough of the racist morons will have died off so the Brexit result will, I hope, have been reversed!
Stilton and English Cheddar for me. None of that foreign muck.
While I have no doubt that you are purchasing only West Country Farmhouse Cheddar (the one with the handy PDO status) or the like, sourced from your local artisanal/hipster Cheesemonger, it is worth pointing out that significant quantities of Cheddar sold in the UK (roughly a third) are produced in Ireland.
And I'm not sure how, in the the course of an ordinary supermarket shopping experience (with the possible exception of M&S), even where Cheddar is clearly (and possibly even accurately) labelled as produced in the UK, it would be that easy to avoid Scottish, Welsh, or Northern Irish cheeses, unless you are to buy PDO varieties.
Luckily, for Stilton, because it has PDO status, all cheeses called Stilton must be made with local milk in either Derbyshire, Leicestershire or Nottinghamshire.
Very useful thing that PDO designation....
Somerset actually. The Stilton designation well predates the EU. In fact I am sure we had Stilton before Monsieur De Gaulle, Mitterrand and Kohl.
Somerset Cheddar is covered by the West Country Farmhouse Cheddar PDO designation.
Yes, the Stilton name predates the EU, as does that of Cheddar, but Stilton has PDO status, which means that only those blue cheeses meeting the criteria for that designation may be called Stilton which is why that, while you may buy Irish Cheddar, you can only buy Cashel Blue, rather than Irish Stilton.
It is something of considerable value to Stilton producers (and, I would expect, dairy farmers within the catchment area) because it allows them enhanced income.
PDO (and PGI) designation is an EU initiative and is very successful, some non-EU products are covered (for a mix of EEA and accession countries, for which I'm assuming that Turkey is still an aceession state).
Protection of PDO status products outside the EU is largely achieved through bilateral treaties arranged by the EU.
Whether it continues to be applicable to UK produce will, no doubt, be one of the issues on which the razor-sharp intellect of, that fanatic about detail, David Davis will currently be trained - I look forward to his inevitable glorious success in persuading the EU to do precisely what it always wanted to do in this part, as in the other elements, of the Article 50 negotiations after Christmas...
Ah but you are overlooking the fact that Mr Davis will have Doctor Liam Fox assisting with the Trade negotiations (nudge, nudge, wink, wink, cough, cough, brown envelopes).
Or “the disgraced former defence secretary, Dr Liam Fox” to give him his proper title.
Be fair, we had to sack Mandelson dozens of times
More deflection.
If you read the story, Liam Fox is attempting to bury the details of any future trade negotiations with the US, not just while they are ongoing, but for years afterwards. So we won't know, just for example, whether there has been any discussions/agreement allowing GM crop producers access to the UK in time. Neither will Parliament be able to scrutinise the deal it seems. Another win for taking back control though eh?
This is the same Liam Fox btw who took his friend to work with him at the MOD, on official overseas trips, taking part in security meetings, etc. when he had no security clearance whatsoever IIRC. It's a shame he wasn't so keen on protecting who had proper access to classified information back then.
It staggers me that others are prepared to hand over such enormous unchecked influence over where this country is going, to individuals who should br nowhere near Parliament, let alone be in the Cabinet.
He won't be in Government by the time full Brexit happens, nor will many of the talking heads of today.
I hope you're right on that, yet you seem very happy for the "talking heads" around today to lead our country down some really stupid avenues? These effects will last decades not until the next election.
And that's before we get to the likes of Lynn Truss facing down huge multinationals looking to exploit our economic weakness in rolling back our current safeguards, etc.
I agree, Brexit is all about the decades, not the next few years. Decades where the population of the UK will top out at 70m and then (hopefully) start a steady reduction back to a manageable figure.
It probably won't affect me, I will be in Catalonia with my blue passport.
Not your place in France then?
No, I prefer the Spanos to the Frenchies.
However the question after brexit is, what do the Spanos think about you?
Probably the same, maybe worse - unlikely to be better than at present. But who cares ? Anyway, I'm heading to Catalonia (prob won't be Spain by then) because I like the way they are so pro-EU that they sent their main man to Brussels before he even got elected
Again you have missed the point.
You know this thing called freedom of movement, which allowed loads of Brits, often pensioners, to decamp to Spain ? Often without bothering to learn a word of Spanish, and often opting to live in a cocoon of English pubs, fish and chip shops and bowls clubs? And then pissing off the Spanish because they were clogging up the local health systems by congregating in certain areas? Brexit means it's all over. They might or might not let you stay. It won't be your choice. It will be theirs. They've taken back control.
Sources?
Why would you need a source? Try seeking to relocate to Melbourne without being on the list of approved tradespeople. Barcelona will be no different after Brexit, why would it be?
Or put it another way, we are Brexiting because too many Manuels are stopping good British waiters from getting a job. Why will the Spanish behave differently towards a Phil, unless he's got something they need?
My passport runs out in April. Think I will put in my renewal application early in the new year and hope to get the EU style passport for the next 10 years. I would find the blue style little englander passport highly embarrassing to have to carry for the next 10 years.
By the time I have to renew again enough of the racist morons will have died off so the Brexit result will, I hope, have been reversed!
My passport runs out in April. Think I will put in my renewal application early in the new year and hope to get the EU style passport for the next 10 years. I would find the blue style little englander passport highly embarrassing to have to carry for the next 10 years.
By the time I have to renew again enough of the racist morons will have died off so the Brexit result will, I hope, have been reversed!
You okay hun?
How many times are you going to use that exact response? Are there voices in your head telling you it is funny even after the 100th time you have used it?
My passport runs out in April. Think I will put in my renewal application early in the new year and hope to get the EU style passport for the next 10 years. I would find the blue style little englander passport highly embarrassing to have to carry for the next 10 years.
By the time I have to renew again enough of the racist morons will have died off so the Brexit result will, I hope, have been reversed!
You okay hun?
How many times are you going to use that exact response? Are there voices in your head telling you it is funny even after the 100th time you have used it?
It's only about the 2nd time I've ever used it, Hun
My current passport actually expires in May next year. Presumably this would mean I’m going to get a burgundy one next year and will have that for 10 years
Not that it matters much at the moment. The only destinations I seem to be taking time off for are League one football grounds
The roll out of the new blue passport is virtually upon us right now. An application in May would certainly result in the new version.
My passport runs out in April. Think I will put in my renewal application early in the new year and hope to get the EU style passport for the next 10 years. I would find the blue style little englander passport highly embarrassing to have to carry for the next 10 years.
By the time I have to renew again enough of the racist morons will have died off so the Brexit result will, I hope, have been reversed!
Apply for an Irish one. Job done.
Better still, get the Irish passport card. My one fits into my wallet.
My passport runs out in April. Think I will put in my renewal application early in the new year and hope to get the EU style passport for the next 10 years. I would find the blue style little englander passport highly embarrassing to have to carry for the next 10 years.
By the time I have to renew again enough of the racist morons will have died off so the Brexit result will, I hope, have been reversed!
Apply for an Irish one. Job done.
Better still, get the Irish passport card. My one fits into my wallet.
Can't we get a different colour? If I had a yellow passport I' bowl through customs, one arm aloft, over extended into a very English two finger salute, singing rule Britannia and shoving Johnny foreigner out of the way. If I tried that with a blue one, I'd break my hip
Stilton and English Cheddar for me. None of that foreign muck.
While I have no doubt that you are purchasing only West Country Farmhouse Cheddar (the one with the handy PDO status) or the like, sourced from your local artisanal/hipster Cheesemonger, it is worth pointing out that significant quantities of Cheddar sold in the UK (roughly a third) are produced in Ireland.
And I'm not sure how, in the the course of an ordinary supermarket shopping experience (with the possible exception of M&S), even where Cheddar is clearly (and possibly even accurately) labelled as produced in the UK, it would be that easy to avoid Scottish, Welsh, or Northern Irish cheeses, unless you are to buy PDO varieties.
Luckily, for Stilton, because it has PDO status, all cheeses called Stilton must be made with local milk in either Derbyshire, Leicestershire or Nottinghamshire.
Very useful thing that PDO designation....
Somerset actually. The Stilton designation well predates the EU. In fact I am sure we had Stilton before Monsieur De Gaulle, Mitterrand and Kohl.
Somerset Cheddar is covered by the West Country Farmhouse Cheddar PDO designation.
Yes, the Stilton name predates the EU, as does that of Cheddar, but Stilton has PDO status, which means that only those blue cheeses meeting the criteria for that designation may be called Stilton which is why that, while you may buy Irish Cheddar, you can only buy Cashel Blue, rather than Irish Stilton.
It is something of considerable value to Stilton producers (and, I would expect, dairy farmers within the catchment area) because it allows them enhanced income.
PDO (and PGI) designation is an EU initiative and is very successful, some non-EU products are covered (for a mix of EEA and accession countries, for which I'm assuming that Turkey is still an aceession state).
Protection of PDO status products outside the EU is largely achieved through bilateral treaties arranged by the EU.
Whether it continues to be applicable to UK produce will, no doubt, be one of the issues on which the razor-sharp intellect of, that fanatic about detail, David Davis will currently be trained - I look forward to his inevitable glorious success in persuading the EU to do precisely what it always wanted to do in this part, as in the other elements, of the Article 50 negotiations after Christmas...
Ah but you are overlooking the fact that Mr Davis will have Doctor Liam Fox assisting with the Trade negotiations (nudge, nudge, wink, wink, cough, cough, brown envelopes).
Or “the disgraced former defence secretary, Dr Liam Fox” to give him his proper title.
Be fair, we had to sack Mandelson dozens of times
More deflection.
If you read the story, Liam Fox is attempting to bury the details of any future trade negotiations with the US, not just while they are ongoing, but for years afterwards. So we won't know, just for example, whether there has been any discussions/agreement allowing GM crop producers access to the UK in time. Neither will Parliament be able to scrutinise the deal it seems. Another win for taking back control though eh?
This is the same Liam Fox btw who took his friend to work with him at the MOD, on official overseas trips, taking part in security meetings, etc. when he had no security clearance whatsoever IIRC. It's a shame he wasn't so keen on protecting who had proper access to classified information back then.
It staggers me that others are prepared to hand over such enormous unchecked influence over where this country is going, to individuals who should br nowhere near Parliament, let alone be in the Cabinet.
He won't be in Government by the time full Brexit happens, nor will many of the talking heads of today.
I hope you're right on that, yet you seem very happy for the "talking heads" around today to lead our country down some really stupid avenues? These effects will last decades not until the next election.
And that's before we get to the likes of Lynn Truss facing down huge multinationals looking to exploit our economic weakness in rolling back our current safeguards, etc.
I agree, Brexit is all about the decades, not the next few years. Decades where the population of the UK will top out at 70m and then (hopefully) start a steady reduction back to a manageable figure.
It probably won't affect me, I will be in Catalonia with my blue passport.
Not your place in France then?
No, I prefer the Spanos to the Frenchies.
However the question after brexit is, what do the Spanos think about you?
Probably the same, maybe worse - unlikely to be better than at present. But who cares ? Anyway, I'm heading to Catalonia (prob won't be Spain by then) because I like the way they are so pro-EU that they sent their main man to Brussels before he even got elected
Again you have missed the point.
You know this thing called freedom of movement, which allowed loads of Brits, often pensioners, to decamp to Spain ? Often without bothering to learn a word of Spanish, and often opting to live in a cocoon of English pubs, fish and chip shops and bowls clubs? And then pissing off the Spanish because they were clogging up the local health systems by congregating in certain areas? Brexit means it's all over. They might or might not let you stay. It won't be your choice. It will be theirs. They've taken back control.
Sources?
Why would you need a source? Try seeking to relocate to Melbourne without being on the list of approved tradespeople. Barcelona will be no different after Brexit, why would it be?
Or put it another way, we are Brexiting because too many Manuels are stopping good British waiters from getting a job. Why will the Spanish behave differently towards a Phil, unless he's got something they need?
Too right, exactly how things should be. Why the hell should Betty and Bill be able to move to Spain and be totally dependant on a country they've contributed nothing towards. Surely that situation should show exactly how ridiculous the entire freedom of movement thing is.
If you want to retire to Thailand, it's perfectly possible, they even offer a retirement visa, however you need to be able to prove you can support yourself, that requires $25k to be deposited in a Thai bank, or you can prove a monthly income of $2k. Of course this is far less ideal than just moving and being a burden to the host country but seems perfectly reasonable to me.
Stilton and English Cheddar for me. None of that foreign muck.
While I have no doubt that you are purchasing only West Country Farmhouse Cheddar (the one with the handy PDO status) or the like, sourced from your local artisanal/hipster Cheesemonger, it is worth pointing out that significant quantities of Cheddar sold in the UK (roughly a third) are produced in Ireland.
And I'm not sure how, in the the course of an ordinary supermarket shopping experience (with the possible exception of M&S), even where Cheddar is clearly (and possibly even accurately) labelled as produced in the UK, it would be that easy to avoid Scottish, Welsh, or Northern Irish cheeses, unless you are to buy PDO varieties.
Luckily, for Stilton, because it has PDO status, all cheeses called Stilton must be made with local milk in either Derbyshire, Leicestershire or Nottinghamshire.
Very useful thing that PDO designation....
Somerset actually. The Stilton designation well predates the EU. In fact I am sure we had Stilton before Monsieur De Gaulle, Mitterrand and Kohl.
Somerset Cheddar is covered by the West Country Farmhouse Cheddar PDO designation.
Yes, the Stilton name predates the EU, as does that of Cheddar, but Stilton has PDO status, which means that only those blue cheeses meeting the criteria for that designation may be called Stilton which is why that, while you may buy Irish Cheddar, you can only buy Cashel Blue, rather than Irish Stilton.
It is something of considerable value to Stilton producers (and, I would expect, dairy farmers within the catchment area) because it allows them enhanced income.
PDO (and PGI) designation is an EU initiative and is very successful, some non-EU products are covered (for a mix of EEA and accession countries, for which I'm assuming that Turkey is still an aceession state).
Protection of PDO status products outside the EU is largely achieved through bilateral treaties arranged by the EU.
Whether it continues to be applicable to UK produce will, no doubt, be one of the issues on which the razor-sharp intellect of, that fanatic about detail, David Davis will currently be trained - I look forward to his inevitable glorious success in persuading the EU to do precisely what it always wanted to do in this part, as in the other elements, of the Article 50 negotiations after Christmas...
Ah but you are overlooking the fact that Mr Davis will have Doctor Liam Fox assisting with the Trade negotiations (nudge, nudge, wink, wink, cough, cough, brown envelopes).
Or “the disgraced former defence secretary, Dr Liam Fox” to give him his proper title.
Be fair, we had to sack Mandelson dozens of times
More deflection.
If you read the story, Liam Fox is attempting to bury the details of any future trade negotiations with the US, not just while they are ongoing, but for years afterwards. So we won't know, just for example, whether there has been any discussions/agreement allowing GM crop producers access to the UK in time. Neither will Parliament be able to scrutinise the deal it seems. Another win for taking back control though eh?
This is the same Liam Fox btw who took his friend to work with him at the MOD, on official overseas trips, taking part in security meetings, etc. when he had no security clearance whatsoever IIRC. It's a shame he wasn't so keen on protecting who had proper access to classified information back then.
It staggers me that others are prepared to hand over such enormous unchecked influence over where this country is going, to individuals who should br nowhere near Parliament, let alone be in the Cabinet.
He won't be in Government by the time full Brexit happens, nor will many of the talking heads of today.
I hope you're right on that, yet you seem very happy for the "talking heads" around today to lead our country down some really stupid avenues? These effects will last decades not until the next election.
And that's before we get to the likes of Lynn Truss facing down huge multinationals looking to exploit our economic weakness in rolling back our current safeguards, etc.
I agree, Brexit is all about the decades, not the next few years. Decades where the population of the UK will top out at 70m and then (hopefully) start a steady reduction back to a manageable figure.
It probably won't affect me, I will be in Catalonia with my blue passport.
Not your place in France then?
No, I prefer the Spanos to the Frenchies.
However the question after brexit is, what do the Spanos think about you?
Probably the same, maybe worse - unlikely to be better than at present. But who cares ? Anyway, I'm heading to Catalonia (prob won't be Spain by then) because I like the way they are so pro-EU that they sent their main man to Brussels before he even got elected
Again you have missed the point.
You know this thing called freedom of movement, which allowed loads of Brits, often pensioners, to decamp to Spain ? Often without bothering to learn a word of Spanish, and often opting to live in a cocoon of English pubs, fish and chip shops and bowls clubs? And then pissing off the Spanish because they were clogging up the local health systems by congregating in certain areas? Brexit means it's all over. They might or might not let you stay. It won't be your choice. It will be theirs. They've taken back control.
Sources?
Why would you need a source? Try seeking to relocate to Melbourne without being on the list of approved tradespeople. Barcelona will be no different after Brexit, why would it be?
Or put it another way, we are Brexiting because too many Manuels are stopping good British waiters from getting a job. Why will the Spanish behave differently towards a Phil, unless he's got something they need?
Too right, exactly how things should be. Why the hell should Betty and Bill be able to move to Spain and be totally dependant on a country they've contributed nothing towards. Surely that situation should show exactly how ridiculous the entire freedom of movement thing is.
If you want to retire to Thailand, it's perfectly possible, they even offer a retirement visa, however you need to be able to prove you can support yourself, that requires $25k to be deposited in a Thai bank, or you can prove a monthly income of $2k. Of course this is far less ideal than just moving and being a burden to the host country but seems perfectly reasonable to me.
You seem completely clueless about the EU and the concept of freedom of movement.
Stilton and English Cheddar for me. None of that foreign muck.
While I have no doubt that you are purchasing only West Country Farmhouse Cheddar (the one with the handy PDO status) or the like, sourced from your local artisanal/hipster Cheesemonger, it is worth pointing out that significant quantities of Cheddar sold in the UK (roughly a third) are produced in Ireland.
And I'm not sure how, in the the course of an ordinary supermarket shopping experience (with the possible exception of M&S), even where Cheddar is clearly (and possibly even accurately) labelled as produced in the UK, it would be that easy to avoid Scottish, Welsh, or Northern Irish cheeses, unless you are to buy PDO varieties.
Luckily, for Stilton, because it has PDO status, all cheeses called Stilton must be made with local milk in either Derbyshire, Leicestershire or Nottinghamshire.
Very useful thing that PDO designation....
Somerset actually. The Stilton designation well predates the EU. In fact I am sure we had Stilton before Monsieur De Gaulle, Mitterrand and Kohl.
Somerset Cheddar is covered by the West Country Farmhouse Cheddar PDO designation.
Yes, the Stilton name predates the EU, as does that of Cheddar, but Stilton has PDO status, which means that only those blue cheeses meeting the criteria for that designation may be called Stilton which is why that, while you may buy Irish Cheddar, you can only buy Cashel Blue, rather than Irish Stilton.
It is something of considerable value to Stilton producers (and, I would expect, dairy farmers within the catchment area) because it allows them enhanced income.
PDO (and PGI) designation is an EU initiative and is very successful, some non-EU products are covered (for a mix of EEA and accession countries, for which I'm assuming that Turkey is still an aceession state).
Protection of PDO status products outside the EU is largely achieved through bilateral treaties arranged by the EU.
Whether it continues to be applicable to UK produce will, no doubt, be one of the issues on which the razor-sharp intellect of, that fanatic about detail, David Davis will currently be trained - I look forward to his inevitable glorious success in persuading the EU to do precisely what it always wanted to do in this part, as in the other elements, of the Article 50 negotiations after Christmas...
Ah but you are overlooking the fact that Mr Davis will have Doctor Liam Fox assisting with the Trade negotiations (nudge, nudge, wink, wink, cough, cough, brown envelopes).
Or “the disgraced former defence secretary, Dr Liam Fox” to give him his proper title.
Be fair, we had to sack Mandelson dozens of times
More deflection.
If you read the story, Liam Fox is attempting to bury the details of any future trade negotiations with the US, not just while they are ongoing, but for years afterwards. So we won't know, just for example, whether there has been any discussions/agreement allowing GM crop producers access to the UK in time. Neither will Parliament be able to scrutinise the deal it seems. Another win for taking back control though eh?
This is the same Liam Fox btw who took his friend to work with him at the MOD, on official overseas trips, taking part in security meetings, etc. when he had no security clearance whatsoever IIRC. It's a shame he wasn't so keen on protecting who had proper access to classified information back then.
It staggers me that others are prepared to hand over such enormous unchecked influence over where this country is going, to individuals who should br nowhere near Parliament, let alone be in the Cabinet.
He won't be in Government by the time full Brexit happens, nor will many of the talking heads of today.
I hope you're right on that, yet you seem very happy for the "talking heads" around today to lead our country down some really stupid avenues? These effects will last decades not until the next election.
And that's before we get to the likes of Lynn Truss facing down huge multinationals looking to exploit our economic weakness in rolling back our current safeguards, etc.
I agree, Brexit is all about the decades, not the next few years. Decades where the population of the UK will top out at 70m and then (hopefully) start a steady reduction back to a manageable figure.
It probably won't affect me, I will be in Catalonia with my blue passport.
Not your place in France then?
No, I prefer the Spanos to the Frenchies.
However the question after brexit is, what do the Spanos think about you?
Probably the same, maybe worse - unlikely to be better than at present. But who cares ? Anyway, I'm heading to Catalonia (prob won't be Spain by then) because I like the way they are so pro-EU that they sent their main man to Brussels before he even got elected
Again you have missed the point.
You know this thing called freedom of movement, which allowed loads of Brits, often pensioners, to decamp to Spain ? Often without bothering to learn a word of Spanish, and often opting to live in a cocoon of English pubs, fish and chip shops and bowls clubs? And then pissing off the Spanish because they were clogging up the local health systems by congregating in certain areas? Brexit means it's all over. They might or might not let you stay. It won't be your choice. It will be theirs. They've taken back control.
Sources?
Why would you need a source? Try seeking to relocate to Melbourne without being on the list of approved tradespeople. Barcelona will be no different after Brexit, why would it be?
Or put it another way, we are Brexiting because too many Manuels are stopping good British waiters from getting a job. Why will the Spanish behave differently towards a Phil, unless he's got something they need?
Too right, exactly how things should be. Why the hell should Betty and Bill be able to move to Spain and be totally dependant on a country they've contributed nothing towards. Surely that situation should show exactly how ridiculous the entire freedom of movement thing is.
If you want to retire to Thailand, it's perfectly possible, they even offer a retirement visa, however you need to be able to prove you can support yourself, that requires $25k to be deposited in a Thai bank, or you can prove a monthly income of $2k. Of course this is far less ideal than just moving and being a burden to the host country but seems perfectly reasonable to me.
How is it any different to a Surrey-based person to go retire in the Lake District and be reliant on their services? That's what taxes are for. Some of our tax money goes to the UK government and some of it goes to the EU for this exact reason.
The problematic thing about almost every argument against freedom of movement within the EU is that the same argument could also apply against freedom of movement within the UK but for obvious reasons the argument falls apart when applied at a national level as opposed to a continental level. The arguments also fall apart at a continental level but most Brexiters seem to lack the lucidity to make the conceptual jump from national to continental.
Stilton and English Cheddar for me. None of that foreign muck.
While I have no doubt that you are purchasing only West Country Farmhouse Cheddar (the one with the handy PDO status) or the like, sourced from your local artisanal/hipster Cheesemonger, it is worth pointing out that significant quantities of Cheddar sold in the UK (roughly a third) are produced in Ireland.
And I'm not sure how, in the the course of an ordinary supermarket shopping experience (with the possible exception of M&S), even where Cheddar is clearly (and possibly even accurately) labelled as produced in the UK, it would be that easy to avoid Scottish, Welsh, or Northern Irish cheeses, unless you are to buy PDO varieties.
Luckily, for Stilton, because it has PDO status, all cheeses called Stilton must be made with local milk in either Derbyshire, Leicestershire or Nottinghamshire.
Very useful thing that PDO designation....
Somerset actually. The Stilton designation well predates the EU. In fact I am sure we had Stilton before Monsieur De Gaulle, Mitterrand and Kohl.
Somerset Cheddar is covered by the West Country Farmhouse Cheddar PDO designation.
Yes, the Stilton name predates the EU, as does that of Cheddar, but Stilton has PDO status, which means that only those blue cheeses meeting the criteria for that designation may be called Stilton which is why that, while you may buy Irish Cheddar, you can only buy Cashel Blue, rather than Irish Stilton.
It is something of considerable value to Stilton producers (and, I would expect, dairy farmers within the catchment area) because it allows them enhanced income.
PDO (and PGI) designation is an EU initiative and is very successful, some non-EU products are covered (for a mix of EEA and accession countries, for which I'm assuming that Turkey is still an aceession state).
Protection of PDO status products outside the EU is largely achieved through bilateral treaties arranged by the EU.
Whether it continues to be applicable to UK produce will, no doubt, be one of the issues on which the razor-sharp intellect of, that fanatic about detail, David Davis will currently be trained - I look forward to his inevitable glorious success in persuading the EU to do precisely what it always wanted to do in this part, as in the other elements, of the Article 50 negotiations after Christmas...
Ah but you are overlooking the fact that Mr Davis will have Doctor Liam Fox assisting with the Trade negotiations (nudge, nudge, wink, wink, cough, cough, brown envelopes).
Or “the disgraced former defence secretary, Dr Liam Fox” to give him his proper title.
Be fair, we had to sack Mandelson dozens of times
More deflection.
If you read the story, Liam Fox is attempting to bury the details of any future trade negotiations with the US, not just while they are ongoing, but for years afterwards. So we won't know, just for example, whether there has been any discussions/agreement allowing GM crop producers access to the UK in time. Neither will Parliament be able to scrutinise the deal it seems. Another win for taking back control though eh?
This is the same Liam Fox btw who took his friend to work with him at the MOD, on official overseas trips, taking part in security meetings, etc. when he had no security clearance whatsoever IIRC. It's a shame he wasn't so keen on protecting who had proper access to classified information back then.
It staggers me that others are prepared to hand over such enormous unchecked influence over where this country is going, to individuals who should br nowhere near Parliament, let alone be in the Cabinet.
He won't be in Government by the time full Brexit happens, nor will many of the talking heads of today.
I hope you're right on that, yet you seem very happy for the "talking heads" around today to lead our country down some really stupid avenues? These effects will last decades not until the next election.
And that's before we get to the likes of Lynn Truss facing down huge multinationals looking to exploit our economic weakness in rolling back our current safeguards, etc.
I agree, Brexit is all about the decades, not the next few years. Decades where the population of the UK will top out at 70m and then (hopefully) start a steady reduction back to a manageable figure.
It probably won't affect me, I will be in Catalonia with my blue passport.
Not your place in France then?
No, I prefer the Spanos to the Frenchies.
However the question after brexit is, what do the Spanos think about you?
Probably the same, maybe worse - unlikely to be better than at present. But who cares ? Anyway, I'm heading to Catalonia (prob won't be Spain by then) because I like the way they are so pro-EU that they sent their main man to Brussels before he even got elected
Again you have missed the point.
You know this thing called freedom of movement, which allowed loads of Brits, often pensioners, to decamp to Spain ? Often without bothering to learn a word of Spanish, and often opting to live in a cocoon of English pubs, fish and chip shops and bowls clubs? And then pissing off the Spanish because they were clogging up the local health systems by congregating in certain areas? Brexit means it's all over. They might or might not let you stay. It won't be your choice. It will be theirs. They've taken back control.
Sources?
Why would you need a source? Try seeking to relocate to Melbourne without being on the list of approved tradespeople. Barcelona will be no different after Brexit, why would it be?
Or put it another way, we are Brexiting because too many Manuels are stopping good British waiters from getting a job. Why will the Spanish behave differently towards a Phil, unless he's got something they need?
Too right, exactly how things should be. Why the hell should Betty and Bill be able to move to Spain and be totally dependant on a country they've contributed nothing towards. Surely that situation should show exactly how ridiculous the entire freedom of movement thing is.
If you want to retire to Thailand, it's perfectly possible, they even offer a retirement visa, however you need to be able to prove you can support yourself, that requires $25k to be deposited in a Thai bank, or you can prove a monthly income of $2k. Of course this is far less ideal than just moving and being a burden to the host country but seems perfectly reasonable to me.
You seem completely clueless about the EU and the concept of freedom of movement.
I understand exactly how it works, I just dont agree it's a good idea.
Comments
If everyone was liable, after leaving school to in some way that did not teach little more than peeling spuds and how to kill people (instead doing things like assisting with social care, for example), it could really help the country, both in terms of social provision and social cohesion.
I'd suggest that, if a 12 month service was the norm, those that signed up for an additional 12 months (provided they met relevant standards) should have university fees waived.
If I'd meant unpaid I would have said a National Voluntary Service.
That said, I don't think we should be wedded to the idea that national service has to be military service. It would take lots of proper planning, but I don't see why there shouldn't be a form of national service doing work in the public interest in exchange for unemployment benefits (do they exist anymore?).
You know this thing called freedom of movement, which allowed loads of Brits, often pensioners, to decamp to Spain ? Often without bothering to learn a word of Spanish, and often opting to live in a cocoon of English pubs, fish and chip shops and bowls clubs? And then pissing off the Spanish because they were clogging up the local health systems by congregating in certain areas? Brexit means it's all over. They might or might not let you stay. It won't be your choice. It will be theirs. They've taken back control.
Not that it matters much at the moment. The only destinations I seem to be taking time off for are League one football grounds
By the time I have to renew again enough of the racist morons will have died off so the Brexit result will, I hope, have been reversed!
Or put it another way, we are Brexiting because too many Manuels are stopping good British waiters from getting a job. Why will the Spanish behave differently towards a Phil, unless he's got something they need?
If you want to retire to Thailand, it's perfectly possible, they even offer a retirement visa, however you need to be able to prove you can support yourself, that requires $25k to be deposited in a Thai bank, or you can prove a monthly income of $2k. Of course this is far less ideal than just moving and being a burden to the host country but seems perfectly reasonable to me.
The problematic thing about almost every argument against freedom of movement within the EU is that the same argument could also apply against freedom of movement within the UK but for obvious reasons the argument falls apart when applied at a national level as opposed to a continental level. The arguments also fall apart at a continental level but most Brexiters seem to lack the lucidity to make the conceptual jump from national to continental.