CARD My struggle this season, the approach isn't working as they need numbers. they also need to listen more to the fan base that they are supposed to represent.
What happened to events like the Woolwich meeting? have one of these every month where people can turn up and voice there opinions.
You do talk some shit. The Woolwich meeting was organised by CAS Trust. They represent fans. CARD doesn't represent the fan base; it acts as a focal point (but not the only one) for fans protests.
In addition P -The key point is that somebody has to make an offer that appeals to RD until that happens we're stuck with him. Protest might make him more amenable to the sale but so far any offers have not met his threshold.
Many of you have misunderstood my situation, someone who entered this shop behind me threatened to punch the protester which is when the police get involved. I repeat that idiots like this protester will start to cause divisions between supporters, which is the last thing we need.
Many of you have misunderstood my situation, someone who entered this shop behind me threatened to punch the protester which is when the police get involved. I repeat that idiots like this protester will start to cause divisions between supporters, which is the last thing we need.
The protestor didn't cause the police to almost get involved then? The person entering the shop did.
Surely the point Granpa is making is that he just wants to go to the game (that he has spent money on) and ENJOY it as he sees fit without having it disrupted in any way by someone else "telling" or "asking" him to do something - be it don't spend money, stand up and shout, stay late and protest etc?
It does seem that those that are heavily involved in the protesting do have a "protest or else" attitude - as is shown by some of the comments back to a quite reasonable post by Granpa.......as they say, surely we don't need a divide among the supporters - either be against the regime or don't, it doesn't matter, just don't force your issue on anyone else
*queue multiple negative posts "telling" me im wrong ;-)
Many of you have misunderstood my situation, someone who entered this shop behind me threatened to punch the protester which is when the police get involved. I repeat that idiots like this protester will start to cause divisions between supporters, which is the last thing we need.
I'm surprised no one has mentioned this before. A protester was threatened and the police got involved??
CARD My struggle this season, the approach isn't working as they need numbers. they also need to listen more to the fan base that they are supposed to represent.
What happened to events like the Woolwich meeting? have one of these every month where people can turn up and voice there opinions.
What is it that you think the fan base are saying that they are not listening to?
The point I'm trying to make is that the fans don't have a voice with regards to the CARD protests. They should open up the forum so people can partake.
Surely the point Granpa is making is that he just wants to go to the game (that he has spent money on) and ENJOY it as he sees fit without having it disrupted in any way by someone else "telling" or "asking" him to do something - be it don't spend money, stand up and shout, stay late and protest etc?
It does seem that those that are heavily involved in the protesting do have a "protest or else" attitude - as is shown by some of the comments back to a quite reasonable post by Granpa.......as they say, surely we don't need a divide among the supporters - either be against the regime or don't, it doesn't matter, just don't force your issue on anyone else
*queue multiple negative posts "telling" me im wrong ;-)
Well that ain't going to happen until Duchatelet goes. A big part of protesting is to be seen and heard, to get your message out. If the protests consisted of people talking to themselves there'd be no point.
Many of you have misunderstood my situation, someone who entered this shop behind me threatened to punch the protester which is when the police get involved. I repeat that idiots like this protester will start to cause divisions between supporters, which is the last thing we need.
So the peaceful protester is at fault, not the violent regime supporter? Riiiight...
Surely the point Granpa is making is that he just wants to go to the game (that he has spent money on) and ENJOY it as he sees fit without having it disrupted in any way by someone else "telling" or "asking" him to do something - be it don't spend money, stand up and shout, stay late and protest etc?
It does seem that those that are heavily involved in the protesting do have a "protest or else" attitude - as is shown by some of the comments back to a quite reasonable post by Granpa.......as they say, surely we don't need a divide among the supporters - either be against the regime or don't, it doesn't matter, just don't force your issue on anyone else
*queue multiple negative posts "telling" me im wrong ;-)
Well that ain't going to happen until Duchatelet goes. A big part of protesting is to be seen and heard, to get your message out. If the protests consisted of people talking to themselves there'd be no point.
Sadly the line above in bold reads like those that want RD gone are going to spoil the whole experience for everyone until they get what they want. I know I have come to that conclusion on my own and it is likely that isn't what you, actually, mean but it does indicate why some of those that are not interested in protesting are getting fed up with many of those that are.
Just out of interest who are the losers if a fan punches a protester? Who are the losers if the protester's friends proceed to beat up an old fella in front of his grandchildren?
Surely the best approach is to avoid these incidents happening in the first place? I wasn't there but I have heard those involved in CARD be very animated towards those that don't agree with them. That's fine but if someone you don't know does that it can lead to confrontation and in that event no one comes out looking good.
CARD My struggle this season, the approach isn't working as they need numbers. they also need to listen more to the fan base that they are supposed to represent.
What happened to events like the Woolwich meeting? have one of these every month where people can turn up and voice there opinions.
You do talk some shit. The Woolwich meeting was organised by CAS Trust. They represent fans. CARD doesn't represent the fan base; it acts as a focal point (but not the only one) for fans protests.
CARD My struggle this season, the approach isn't working as they need numbers. they also need to listen more to the fan base that they are supposed to represent.
What happened to events like the Woolwich meeting? have one of these every month where people can turn up and voice there opinions.
Why don't you organise one yourself? Forcing the regime out will require different approaches from different people; you seem to be expecting a lot of one group when you could be testing the water yourself to see if people want to follow your methods.
CARD My struggle this season, the approach isn't working as they need numbers. they also need to listen more to the fan base that they are supposed to represent.
What happened to events like the Woolwich meeting? have one of these every month where people can turn up and voice there opinions.
You do talk some shit. The Woolwich meeting was organised by CAS Trust. They represent fans. CARD doesn't represent the fan base; it acts as a focal point (but not the only one) for fans protests.
That will be news to many people.
That may be the case, I still want to know what is it that you think the fan base are saying that they are not listening to?
CARD My struggle this season, the approach isn't working as they need numbers. they also need to listen more to the fan base that they are supposed to represent.
What happened to events like the Woolwich meeting? have one of these every month where people can turn up and voice there opinions.
You do talk some shit. The Woolwich meeting was organised by CAS Trust. They represent fans. CARD doesn't represent the fan base; it acts as a focal point (but not the only one) for fans protests.
That will be news to many people.
That may be the case, I still want to know what is it that you think the fan base are saying that they are not listening to?
CARD My struggle this season, the approach isn't working as they need numbers. they also need to listen more to the fan base that they are supposed to represent.
What happened to events like the Woolwich meeting? have one of these every month where people can turn up and voice there opinions.
Why don't you organise one yourself? Forcing the regime out will require different approaches from different people; you seem to be expecting a lot of one group when you could be testing the water yourself to see if people want to follow your methods.
We currently have several protests arranged. Thanks.
Clearly, the only protests that have made any impact have been the ones in Belgium.
Really? Is the club up for sale?
I am just quoting this again as it deserves to be re-iterated. Pres, your protest was admirable, but thus far has proved as fruitless as the efforts of CARD that you deride.
I've never 'derided' them AA, just my opinion that they 1) Havnt done enough (as the focal point) at the key stage (in my opinion) , being the start of the season. And 2) They aren't transparent enough - thus my comment about them sending out runners from behind a curtain in the Italian Restaurant. For example, I havnt got the slightest idea who is in it,when it meets, what its plans are etc.etc. Now, there may well be very valid reasons for being so.
In terms of value of protests , I think you'll find that there are a lot of people out there who believe that the Belgian protests gave more bang for the bucks (considering that they were all funded out of the individuals pockets) - they appeared to create the few cracks in RD/KM's armour (happy to be proved wrong on that), ie... KM's rant at London presentation RD's supposed comments about being 'annoyed' by our St Truiden leaflet distribution. RD's programme rant.
As Henry keeps on saying , this is a marathon not a sprint - and I think we all understand that , but maybe I'm just an impatient person, who wants these bar stewards out of OUR club ASAP- and the quicker I think i can accelerate that, then maybe the bigger risk I might take. It might not be to the taste of the softly,softly approach bunch, but I can assure you that 1) It will be within the law and 2) It might not be to the liking of CARD. But , I tell you what, if someone starts suggesting sending flowers to someone along the way, then that's gonna get right up my nose, coz this aint no fecking barndance anymore.
CARD My struggle this season, the approach isn't working as they need numbers. they also need to listen more to the fan base that they are supposed to represent.
What happened to events like the Woolwich meeting? have one of these every month where people can turn up and voice there opinions.
You do talk some shit. The Woolwich meeting was organised by CAS Trust. They represent fans. CARD doesn't represent the fan base; it acts as a focal point (but not the only one) for fans protests.
That will be news to many people.
That may be the case, I still want to know what is it that you think the fan base are saying that they are not listening to?
I already explained what I meant to you.
Sorry, missed it. It does not answer my question, your original statement was quite specific in intimating that there is a particular route that the fan base wish to go down that is being ignored. CARD are the fans, as already stated they are open to any idea or suggestion, there's no closed shop, anyone can join in.
CARD My struggle this season, the approach isn't working as they need numbers. they also need to listen more to the fan base that they are supposed to represent.
What happened to events like the Woolwich meeting? have one of these every month where people can turn up and voice there opinions.
You do talk some shit. The Woolwich meeting was organised by CAS Trust. They represent fans. CARD doesn't represent the fan base; it acts as a focal point (but not the only one) for fans protests.
That will be news to many people.
That may be the case, I still want to know what is it that you think the fan base are saying that they are not listening to?
I already explained what I meant to you.
Sorry, missed it. It does not answer my question, your original statement was quite specific in intimating that there is a particular route that the fan base wish to go down that is being ignored. CARD are the fans, as already stated they are open to any idea or suggestion, there's no closed shop, anyone can join in.
But that's not what DAVO has said (who is a member of CARD)
The point really is how can we gauge what the fan base want when they don't have a platform to raise it.
I don't presume to know what the majority of the fan base want - but we are certainly not unified - we are split down the middle on the season ticket front.
I don't see the point of an argument between the actions of CARD and their supporters and the "Belgium" group. Both sets of actions are complimentary and hopefully will help to get the common sought solution.
I have many read many posts on CL in past months from the "Belgium" group, putting down CARD and their actions, which in turn has naturally led to a necessary defensive response from CARD. I simply don't understand it given we seek a common goal.
The actions of the "Belgium" group abroad were fine for me, but that single action is not a silver bullet to success. The debacle of the pitch invasion has not helped their cause and I would have thought that they would stop knocking CARD, which seems to be their prime aim at the moment, and get on with their future planned actions.
Togetherness please, no more infighting, no more one upmanship.
Clearly, the only protests that have made any impact have been the ones in Belgium.
Really? Is the club up for sale?
I am just quoting this again as it deserves to be re-iterated. Pres, your protest was admirable, but thus far has proved as fruitless as the efforts of CARD that you deride.
I've never 'derided' them AA, just my opinion that they 1) Havnt done enough (as the focal point) at the key stage (in my opinion) , being the start of the season. And 2) They aren't transparent enough - thus my comment about them sending out runners from behind a curtain in the Italian Restaurant. For example, I havnt got the slightest idea who is in it,when it meets, what its plans are etc.etc. Now, there may well be very valid reasons for being so.
In terms of value of protests , I think you'll find that there are a lot of people out there who believe that the Belgian protests gave more bang for the bucks (considering that they were all funded out of the individuals pockets) - they appeared to create the few cracks in RD/KM's armour (happy to be proved wrong on that), ie... KM's rant at London presentation RD's supposed comments about being 'annoyed' by our St Truiden leaflet distribution. RD's programme rant.
As Henry keeps on saying , this is a marathon not a sprint - and I think we all understand that , but maybe I'm just an impatient person, who wants these bar stewards out of OUR club ASAP- and the quicker I think i can accelerate that, then maybe the bigger risk I might take. It might not be to the taste of the softly,softly approach bunch, but I can assure you that 1) It will be within the law and 2) It might not be to the liking of CARD. But , I tell you what, if someone starts suggesting sending flowers to someone along the way, then that's gonna get right up my nose, coz this aint no fecking barndance anymore.
I don't understand this transparency business. Have you or C4FC4L1f3 or anyone else taking this tack been refused entry to a CARD meeting? Did you tell everyone on here what your plans were for Belgium? (You may have done, and I just didn't see it).
I don't see the point of an argument between the actions of CARD and their supporters and the "Belgium" group. Both sets of actions are complimentary and hopefully will help to get the common sought solution.
I have many read many posts on CL in past months from the "Belgium" group, putting down CARD and their actions, which in turn has naturally led to a necessary defensive response from CARD. I simply don't understand it given we seek a common goal.
The actions of the "Belgium" group abroad were fine for me, but that single action is not a silver bullet to success. The debacle of the pitch invasion has not helped their cause and I would have thought that they would stop knocking CARD, which seems to be their prime aim at the moment, and get on with their future planned actions.
Togetherness please, no more infighting, no more one upmanship.
We have nothing against card truly - several people that went to Belgium are part of CARD.
But people question things and that is healthy. It is also I believe a healthy competition to raise the bar of the protests.
Surely the point Granpa is making is that he just wants to go to the game (that he has spent money on) and ENJOY it as he sees fit without having it disrupted in any way by someone else "telling" or "asking" him to do something - be it don't spend money, stand up and shout, stay late and protest etc?
It does seem that those that are heavily involved in the protesting do have a "protest or else" attitude - as is shown by some of the comments back to a quite reasonable post by Granpa.......as they say, surely we don't need a divide among the supporters - either be against the regime or don't, it doesn't matter, just don't force your issue on anyone else
*queue multiple negative posts "telling" me im wrong ;-)
Clearly, the only protests that have made any impact have been the ones in Belgium.
Really? Is the club up for sale?
I am just quoting this again as it deserves to be re-iterated. Pres, your protest was admirable, but thus far has proved as fruitless as the efforts of CARD that you deride.
I've never 'derided' them AA, just my opinion that they 1) Havnt done enough (as the focal point) at the key stage (in my opinion) , being the start of the season. And 2) They aren't transparent enough - thus my comment about them sending out runners from behind a curtain in the Italian Restaurant. For example, I havnt got the slightest idea who is in it,when it meets, what its plans are etc.etc. Now, there may well be very valid reasons for being so.
In terms of value of protests , I think you'll find that there are a lot of people out there who believe that the Belgian protests gave more bang for the bucks (considering that they were all funded out of the individuals pockets) - they appeared to create the few cracks in RD/KM's armour (happy to be proved wrong on that), ie... KM's rant at London presentation RD's supposed comments about being 'annoyed' by our St Truiden leaflet distribution. RD's programme rant.
As Henry keeps on saying , this is a marathon not a sprint - and I think we all understand that , but maybe I'm just an impatient person, who wants these bar stewards out of OUR club ASAP- and the quicker I think i can accelerate that, then maybe the bigger risk I might take. It might not be to the taste of the softly,softly approach bunch, but I can assure you that 1) It will be within the law and 2) It might not be to the liking of CARD. But , I tell you what, if someone starts suggesting sending flowers to someone along the way, then that's gonna get right up my nose, coz this aint no fecking barndance anymore.
What does this mean?
Are you suggesting that the result (however you manage to assess it) provided better value for money than other projects?
Are you suggesting that the result offered better value for money on the basis that it was funded by those that went and, therefore, didn't come out of the CARD budget?
I only ask as the thread that was started to assess how popular knocking on her parent's house was gave me the impression that it was not what most fans want done in their name.
I am not an attention seeker (not that there is anything wrong with being one) I value my anonymity and would never want to be recognised for, well anything really. That is something that others aspire to but there are many like me that do their little bit but want to keep under the radar. Because I am a little more 'shy' I don't, personally, understand why some feel the need to tell others what they have done and even less to criticise others' efforts.
I'm sure that we all want the same thing, even if some of us have a different idea about what is necessary and/or acceptable to achieve it.
Clearly, the only protests that have made any impact have been the ones in Belgium.
Really? Is the club up for sale?
I am just quoting this again as it deserves to be re-iterated. Pres, your protest was admirable, but thus far has proved as fruitless as the efforts of CARD that you deride.
I've never 'derided' them AA, just my opinion that they 1) Havnt done enough (as the focal point) at the key stage (in my opinion) , being the start of the season. And 2) They aren't transparent enough - thus my comment about them sending out runners from behind a curtain in the Italian Restaurant. For example, I havnt got the slightest idea who is in it,when it meets, what its plans are etc.etc. Now, there may well be very valid reasons for being so.
In terms of value of protests , I think you'll find that there are a lot of people out there who believe that the Belgian protests gave more bang for the bucks (considering that they were all funded out of the individuals pockets) - they appeared to create the few cracks in RD/KM's armour (happy to be proved wrong on that), ie... KM's rant at London presentation RD's supposed comments about being 'annoyed' by our St Truiden leaflet distribution. RD's programme rant.
As Henry keeps on saying , this is a marathon not a sprint - and I think we all understand that , but maybe I'm just an impatient person, who wants these bar stewards out of OUR club ASAP- and the quicker I think i can accelerate that, then maybe the bigger risk I might take. It might not be to the taste of the softly,softly approach bunch, but I can assure you that 1) It will be within the law and 2) It might not be to the liking of CARD. But , I tell you what, if someone starts suggesting sending flowers to someone along the way, then that's gonna get right up my nose, coz this aint no fecking barndance anymore.
I don't understand this transparency business. Have you or C4FC4L1f3 or anyone else taking this tack been refused entry to a CARD meeting? Did you tell everyone on here what your plans were for Belgium? (You may have done, and I just didn't see it).
Not sure mate, for certain, I have never been contacted re anything CARD related (probably don't want me as they clearly see me as a bit of a renegade , lol), though as Neil points out, some of the Belgian20 are CARD members (apparently). None of us have any anti-CARD stance , just opinions that things might have been done differently - its not an Anti-CARD stance. With regard to publishing the Belgian trip, we (for obvious reasons) didn't explicitly publish our plans (some of the plans only formulated on the day !) - but we did, on several occasions, both cryptically and openly , advertise on CL for people to come and join us in out Belgian protest, without giving the game away. Many people expressed an interest , and many people dropped out at last minute, but we knew that would happen. So, yes, we did publish our (very) rough plans.
As one who has protested both in Belgium and on Card organised events, could I ask people to calm down a bit. Ultimately we share the same goal, to remove the current regime. The last thing we want to do is waste our energy arguing amongst ourselves, Roland and Katrien would love that.
If KM and RD read this thread they will be laughing their socks off. Surely we all have one goal and that's to get new owners. Arguing amongst ourselves is is a sure way for that not to happen. It feels , compared to 3 months ago , that there are big fractures occurring in the fan base and that cannot be good.
Surely the point Granpa is making is that he just wants to go to the game (that he has spent money on) and ENJOY it as he sees fit without having it disrupted in any way by someone else "telling" or "asking" him to do something - be it don't spend money, stand up and shout, stay late and protest etc?
It does seem that those that are heavily involved in the protesting do have a "protest or else" attitude - as is shown by some of the comments back to a quite reasonable post by Granpa.......as they say, surely we don't need a divide among the supporters - either be against the regime or don't, it doesn't matter, just don't force your issue on anyone else
*queue multiple negative posts "telling" me im wrong ;-)
Well that ain't going to happen until Duchatelet goes. A big part of protesting is to be seen and heard, to get your message out. If the protests consisted of people talking to themselves there'd be no point.
Sadly the line above in bold reads like those that want RD gone are going to spoil the whole experience for everyone until they get what they want. I know I have come to that conclusion on my own and it is likely that isn't what you, actually, mean but it does indicate why some of those that are not interested in protesting are getting fed up with many of those that are.
Just out of interest who are the losers if a fan punches a protester? Who are the losers if the protester's friends proceed to beat up an old fella in front of his grandchildren?
Surely the best approach is to avoid these incidents happening in the first place? I wasn't there but I have heard those involved in CARD be very animated towards those that don't agree with them. That's fine but if someone you don't know does that it can lead to confrontation and in that event no one comes out looking good.
I can only comment on the numerous times I have handed out leaflets, beach balls, stress balls etc with various different people on each occasion and everyone has been very polite to those they are handing stuff out to. I have had many fans who are not anti regime stop to engage in dialogue and at the end we have agreed to disagree and parted amically. However, I have also had quite a few tell me to 'fuck off', 'stick it up my arse', 'shove it you fat c--t' etc etc. Any animosity has come from those who are not anti regime whilst CARD supporters have been very respectful to everyone.
Comments
The person entering the shop did.
What a ridiculous thing to say.
It does seem that those that are heavily involved in the protesting do have a "protest or else" attitude - as is shown by some of the comments back to a quite reasonable post by Granpa.......as they say, surely we don't need a divide among the supporters - either be against the regime or don't, it doesn't matter, just don't force your issue on anyone else
*queue multiple negative posts "telling" me im wrong ;-)
prickfella who threatened to punch the protestorA big part of protesting is to be seen and heard, to get your message out. If the protests consisted of people talking to themselves there'd be no point.
Just out of interest who are the losers if a fan punches a protester? Who are the losers if the protester's friends proceed to beat up an old fella in front of his grandchildren?
Surely the best approach is to avoid these incidents happening in the first place? I wasn't there but I have heard those involved in CARD be very animated towards those that don't agree with them. That's fine but if someone you don't know does that it can lead to confrontation and in that event no one comes out looking good.
In terms of value of protests , I think you'll find that there are a lot of people out there who believe that the Belgian protests gave more bang for the bucks (considering that they were all funded out of the individuals pockets) - they appeared to create the few cracks in RD/KM's armour (happy to be proved wrong on that), ie...
KM's rant at London presentation
RD's supposed comments about being 'annoyed' by our St Truiden leaflet distribution.
RD's programme rant.
As Henry keeps on saying , this is a marathon not a sprint - and I think we all understand that , but maybe I'm just an impatient person, who wants these bar stewards out of OUR club ASAP- and the quicker I think i can accelerate that, then maybe the bigger risk I might take. It might not be to the taste of the softly,softly approach bunch, but I can assure you that 1) It will be within the law and 2) It might not be to the liking of CARD.
But , I tell you what, if someone starts suggesting sending flowers to someone along the way, then that's gonna get right up my nose, coz this aint no fecking barndance anymore.
The point really is how can we gauge what the fan base want when they don't have a platform to raise it.
I don't presume to know what the majority of the fan base want - but we are certainly not unified - we are split down the middle on the season ticket front.
more needs to be done to work together.
I have many read many posts on CL in past months from the "Belgium" group, putting down CARD and their actions, which in turn has naturally led to a necessary defensive response from CARD. I simply don't understand it given we seek a common goal.
The actions of the "Belgium" group abroad were fine for me, but that single action is not a silver bullet to success. The debacle of the pitch invasion has not helped their cause and I would have thought that they would stop knocking CARD, which seems to be their prime aim at the moment, and get on with their future planned actions.
Togetherness please, no more infighting, no more one upmanship.
But people question things and that is healthy. It is also I believe a healthy competition to raise the bar of the protests.
Are you suggesting that the result (however you manage to assess it) provided better value for money than other projects?
Are you suggesting that the result offered better value for money on the basis that it was funded by those that went and, therefore, didn't come out of the CARD budget?
I only ask as the thread that was started to assess how popular knocking on her parent's house was gave me the impression that it was not what most fans want done in their name.
I am not an attention seeker (not that there is anything wrong with being one) I value my anonymity and would never want to be recognised for, well anything really. That is something that others aspire to but there are many like me that do their little bit but want to keep under the radar. Because I am a little more 'shy' I don't, personally, understand why some feel the need to tell others what they have done and even less to criticise others' efforts.
I'm sure that we all want the same thing, even if some of us have a different idea about what is necessary and/or acceptable to achieve it.
With regard to publishing the Belgian trip, we (for obvious reasons) didn't explicitly publish our plans (some of the plans only formulated on the day !) - but we did, on several occasions, both cryptically and openly , advertise on CL for people to come and join us in out Belgian protest, without giving the game away. Many people expressed an interest , and many people dropped out at last minute, but we knew that would happen. So, yes, we did publish our (very) rough plans.
Surely we all have one goal and that's to get new owners. Arguing amongst ourselves is is a sure way for that not to happen.
It feels , compared to 3 months ago , that there are big fractures occurring in the fan base and that cannot be good.