[cite]Posted By: ken from bexley[/cite]The bbc radio commentator, was emphatic that it was not a penalty, and then began to change his mind, and started to blame the 'pillar' that may have effected his judgement.....
from 80 yards away it looked a penalty to me. but seeing as exeter were playing with 10 men at the time it also appeared like the ref was desperate to give it and punish charlton for being so cack.
Just come back from Exeter, perfomance was poor we lacked creative and looked afraid to shot, however, exeter looked happy shooting from 20 or so yards. The manner of the defeat is hard to take, First look at Benson looks okay poor service to him in the box. When will Francis cross a ball first time its painful to watch sometimes and ive never seen a ref change his mind so much before very poor ref very poor perfomance,
Actually hoping someone help me out i had a poor angle for the disallowed goal, was it a handball ? or another poor decison because the lino didnt give anything and looked confussed by decison
What do we expect from our strikers...at least Burton played in the prem where as our new strikers are nothing but lower league journeymen...we ain't going anywhere this season.
My view it was an even game that coul dhave gone either way, we got lucky, but from where I was sitting there was a leg out that any pro was going to go over. Although I have not seen it on the tv yet
I am not going to Hartlepool next week so hould be at the valley
[cite]Posted By: cafc_1993[/cite]Actually hoping someone help me out i had a poor angle for the disallowed goal, was it a handball ? or another poor decison because the lino didnt give anything and looked confussed by decison
yep, handball and there might have been a foul in there too. right decision was to disallow it
Parky was spot on - Llera should've cut out that ball over the top. I'm not sure about the penalty, commentator seemed sure it wasn't a pen but the view that the bbc gave did make it look like a penalty.
If the only option is to have Llera in defence, that unless playing a really poor team, with poor strikers then we have to play 451. It is the formation that provides him with s measure of protection. With Llera in a 442, we are always vulnerable. Maybe 352 would work. In static positions, Llera is pretty good, but we would need a fit Jackson on the left side of midfield.
Abbott did play 451 for Oldham.
Jon Fortune, you need to get your fitness up as soon as possible.
It looks like it is going to be a tough month.
Emergency loan for lb if Jackson is injured ? Fry in at CB ? Emergency CB loan ?
Right, my take on yesterdays game... from the Exter end as my mum got a disabled space there and the stewards would not let me transfer although i am a Charlton fan!
First half, we had a couple of chances: martin and then reid shortly afterwards. From where i was i really think martin should have finished the one on one. Then reid shot was blocked later on...as others have said there was no spark nor was there any creativity. Benson ran the channels well imo and won a fair few headers but once again like poeple have said Abbot didnt show. Second half, again a few chances but nothing came of them. Our goal was disallowed because Pavel controlled the ball with his arm before prodding it in. Agree that Akpo should have been introduced earlier. I was right behind the goal for the penalty and NO WAY imo should it have been a penalty. Elliot parried the shot then Llera got his foot in and won the ball but took some of the man. I guarantee if the incident had been down the other end and not in front of the home support (very loud) then it would not have been given.
A very frustrating day as these are the games we should be winning comfortably with this squad of players.. just hope Parky can turn things around Saturday or else i fear the boo boys will be out in full force come 4:45pm next weekend.
[cite]Posted By: oohaahmortimer[/cite]I'm sure the club apologists will be out saying how close we were to getting a point but is that really how low we've gone to being grateful to nearly get a point at exeter ffs
Are the players as good as we thought/ hoped ... Maybe not ... Do charlton continue to get players to under perform , only massively ..... Bad times
Anyway I see us 0% automatic promotion 25% play offs and 75% outside playoffs and another embarrassing season to add to the ever growing collection :-( .
i see 'automatic promotion' is at 0% oohaah. can you tell me when 'relegation dogfight' and 'relegated' will become categories.
Jacko injured ? Was on the bench and came on so he was dropped, fairly imo. We lack creativity in central midfield. I was happy with the starting line-up, although maybe unfair on Waggy but either he or Martin had to make way, except for CM. However, I don't think Racon is the answer either. Can Martin play there alongside Semedo, why not? Parky missed a chance against D&R to try various things but didn't. He has worked wonders putting this squad together on a shoestring and has really put his neck on the line over Benson, must have really persuded Murray that Benno was the missing link and the man to fire us out of this League. However, he isn't the missing link. That is CM and needs addressing with a loan signing imo. I'm convinced Benson and Abbott can score goals for us but we need to create chances for them. Parky I'm afraid is tactically inept and I can't see him getting us out of this League. Too one dimensional and not even a Plan B yet alone any other ideas. Two duff signings for me - Francis and McCormack. A creative midfielder would have been a far better bet with Racon, Stav as cover and maybe even Jackson and Martin. Poor performance and we got what we deserved.
PS Hope Akpo recovers soon. Looked like delayed concussion to me.
That was a typical / average Charlton away performance , it wasn't good and it wasn't bad, it deserved a point & the game was petering out in added on time before Llera screwed up. I felt a bit sorry for the other players tbh as they had earnt and I thought they had got a well fought point.
Not sure what the answers are, but here are our problems :-
Elliot - still not convinced by him, but he's ok.
Francis - Ok he hopefully will improve, but he's nowhere near as good as Richardson was, he's not even as good as Solly atm.
With Youga out as well and unlikely to return IMO, we have no attacking full backs.
Llera - a complete liability, always has been, always will be. Plays one good game then costs us points the next. I'd not play him again, unless there is NO alternative. Fry, Fortune or Semedo must be a safer bet at CH.
Dailly , Doc, Jackson, Fry ,Youga are all good enough at this level.
Semedo & McCormack are not creative enough & if we are to play them two, then we can't afford to play 2 wingers. Personally, I'd start with Reid and not start Martin or Waggy. Martin is looking like Sam - some will say that's good others will think not.
Benson may prove good, so may Abbott, but Abbott's not looking good atm. However, Parky did say he wanted to start Abbott against D&R, but couldn't as he was carrying an injury.
The league atm looks wide open. If we can get it right, we could make the top 2, although I don't expect it.
My prediction is 6th, because I believe we should improve.
It cheered me up seeing Sheff W this afternoon who looked no better than us and they are top !
Also, Soton the other expected danger are also doing poorly & Swindon are bottom!
In summary, I think we'll end up top half and hopefully make the play offs.
I think this weekend has proved, if nothing else that league one will be very tight this season. At the start of the season many people would've said Southampton, Sheffield Wednesday, Huddersfield, us and Peterborough would be in and around the top 5. Well this weekend those 5 amassed 1 point between them. This league is wide open. We've had a bad start but we're only 3 points off the top. A win next saturday and things are looking up again.
Not often I agree with Large but the 2 players on view yesterday that worry me most are Francis & McCormack. Very disapponted in the latter after a decent first showing against Bournemouth - little bite & liable to get a yellow with his short fuse. Totally bottled a challenge in the second half, presumably because he feared a red.
Francis.....How long does he need to get match fit ??? Think Solly deserves another go on Saturday .
Hopefully Christian will be back sooner rather than later (" The Mask " ?) and Parky will be able to field a settled side that includes Fry and Jackson.
Was it just me? I thought that Exeter pitch was really narrow, and there wasn't space out wide for 2 touchline hugging wingers. It didn't suit our game the way our team is set up, but Exeter showed tactically how to make their pitch work for them. Didn't we do our homework?
Why do we play so deep/defend much of the match on our 18 yard line?
Okay, our 2 CBs lack pace and that way they don't get exposed, but we get trapped into our own half allowing opponents to dominate midfield and carry the game to us, always being in shooting range to take a pop at our goal. IMO we should play higher up the pitch.
Semedo and McCormack are quite possibly instructed to sit in front of our defence. And they do, usually very well.
No doubt the idea is to give us a solid anchor in midfield, protect the soft underbelly of our defence, and feed the wingers.
But there needs to be more balance between defending and creativity at CM.
Semedo and Ally Mac seem too similar - and offer very little going forward.
Everyone back for a corner ......grrr. If there is one tactic that frustrates me, this is the one. If we pull everyone back into our box, we of course have literally no one up on the halfway line as an outlet to relieve pressure or to start a counter attack.
Also, instead of their leaving defenders back to mark and cover our forward, opponents push up their spare defenders into our box. It's schoolboy stuff - we're making it unneccessarily hard for ourselves.
We're in desperate need of a player to put their foot on the ball in midfield, look up and pick a forward pass on the floor. We might be Third Division but IMO it really is the crucial thing lacking in the team right now. It is so bleeding obvious.
The wingers for all their huff and puff, aren't really producing. Up front, Abbott took up some good positions, but hardly saw the ball.
Same with Benson, although he kept dropping deep to run the channels. Impressed with his hunger and appetite to link up play, but where was the service?
Some people comment we don't need to play with 2 big centre forwards, but Benno plays a very different but complimentary game with Abbott. I don't see why these 2 can't play well in tandem, but for crying out loud they need a service. We invariably play with 2 wingers, but where are the crosses into the box?
We never looked like losing.......and we never looked like winning. We didn't play badly, but we were so pedestrian, lacking creativity. We desperately needed someone creative in CM to put their foot on the ball, link play and drive the team forward.
[cite]Posted By: Oggy Red[/cite]We never looked like losing.......and we never looked like winning. We didn't play badly, but we were so pedestrian, lacking creativity. We desperately needed someone creative in CM to put their foot on the ball, link play and drive the team forward.
could have dispensed with the rest of the waffle and done something worthwhile in that half an hour ;-))
A number of factors that contributed to Saturday's defeat in my view. The least influencing factor, but the one that left me most frustrated was our travelling support's lack of voice all game. We didn't act as half an extra man, let alone the 12th. Admittedly, the home fans were not much better, but we and I could have done more on that front.
To the crux, up front we probably have two players that are capable of netting more goals than our forward last year, but we now have what appears some very similar options up front - good in the air, reliant on crosses for goals. For all his faults, Mooney was technically more gifted and could run at players like Martin does for us, with a view to scoring a goal or providing an assist. He offered something a bit beyond this level, was just awfully inconsistent.
If we create some chances, crosses, I think we will get goals, but the training and set up must play to our new striker's strengths. All too often on Saturday, Martin, Reid (less so) and then Wagstaff ran down the wing, cut in, jinked and then shot wide rather than taking the ball on 1st time with a dangerous cross to the near or back stick. Of course you need to be able to mix it up, but 1st time crossing has to be a focus in training surely. The likes of Benson and maybe Abbott you know will feed well off of it.
Llera needs some 'reserve' games to build confidence and re-focus the art of simple defending. Scr*w 40 to 60 yard raking passes, left to right field, let's have a player that clears effectively and does not dally on the ball. However boring this may sound, I would rather he hit row z every time he clears when he plays for the rest of the season than him tw*t about around the ball. His misreading of the ball and not clearing it in stoppage time definitely led to that penalty, which as we know he also conceded. He looked shaky and if JJ was fit enough to come on 2nd half, I'd have moved Fry to centre half and would have put JJ at left back.
Centre mid, too much of the same thing. We need a Racon or JJ sat in alongside Semedo (my preference). I like McCormack don't get me wrong, but Racon and JJ can both tackle, so adding the ability to jink away from an opponent mid field and open something up is pretty crucial in my view.
One last thing, if Francis was Southend's POTY last season, he must have something to offer, so we may need to give him a few more games yet. I seem to remember Sweaty Balmer taking a while to settle when he first came to us all those years ago, but after he had 6 or so games under his belt, he calmed down and started giving us something to support and be proud of.
I just wish our next game was Wednesday night. A few days training and then we want them out there fighting for their next win. Roll on Saturday - I will bring my voice - as should we all!
[cite]Posted By: Oggy Red[/cite]Was it just me? I thought that Exeter pitch was really narrow, and there wasn't space out wide for 2 touchline hugging wingers. It didn't suit our game the way our team is set up, but Exeter showed tactically how to make their pitch work for them. Didn't we do our homework?
Why do we play so deep/defend much of the match on our 18 yard line?
Okay, our 2 CBs lack pace and that way they don't get exposed, but we get trapped into our own half allowing opponents to dominate midfield and carry the game to us, always being in shooting range to take a pop at our goal. IMO we should play higher up the pitch.
Spot on Oggy! Going back the last two seasons, even when we have a comfortable win, we never actually maintain any pressure on a side and having some decent alternatives on the bench doesn't always mean you can change a game with subs. It's a shame their goal came so late, as we probably needed to match them up 3-5-2 but were reluctant to do so when we could still get something out of the game. I worry for our future bacause I have NEVER seen Parky instructing our back-line to push up like so many other managers do. Does he not realise this tactical change or does he just not like it?
Comments
from 80 yards away it looked a penalty to me. but seeing as exeter were playing with 10 men at the time it also appeared like the ref was desperate to give it and punish charlton for being so cack.
Bad luck but the sort you see given a fair bit without any card shown (quite rightly)
Not clear from the film, but player was going away from goal and it was a rash tackle from Llerra.
My view it was an even game that coul dhave gone either way, we got lucky, but from where I was sitting there was a leg out that any pro was going to go over. Although I have not seen it on the tv yet
I am not going to Hartlepool next week so hould be at the valley
yep, handball and there might have been a foul in there too. right decision was to disallow it
Therefore Doc / Llera was his only option . Next week it can't be though.
Abbott did play 451 for Oldham.
Jon Fortune, you need to get your fitness up as soon as possible.
It looks like it is going to be a tough month.
Emergency loan for lb if Jackson is injured ? Fry in at CB ? Emergency CB loan ?
First half, we had a couple of chances: martin and then reid shortly afterwards. From where i was i really think martin should have finished the one on one. Then reid shot was blocked later on...as others have said there was no spark nor was there any creativity. Benson ran the channels well imo and won a fair few headers but once again like poeple have said Abbot didnt show.
Second half, again a few chances but nothing came of them. Our goal was disallowed because Pavel controlled the ball with his arm before prodding it in. Agree that Akpo should have been introduced earlier. I was right behind the goal for the penalty and NO WAY imo should it have been a penalty. Elliot parried the shot then Llera got his foot in and won the ball but took some of the man. I guarantee if the incident had been down the other end and not in front of the home support (very loud) then it would not have been given.
A very frustrating day as these are the games we should be winning comfortably with this squad of players.. just hope Parky can turn things around Saturday or else i fear the boo boys will be out in full force come 4:45pm next weekend.
Still....could be a southampton fan ;)
i see 'automatic promotion' is at 0% oohaah. can you tell me when 'relegation dogfight' and 'relegated' will become categories.
PS Hope Akpo recovers soon. Looked like delayed concussion to me.
That was a typical / average Charlton away performance , it wasn't good and it wasn't bad, it deserved a point & the game was petering out in added on time before Llera screwed up. I felt a bit sorry for the other players tbh as they had earnt and I thought they had got a well fought point.
Not sure what the answers are, but here are our problems :-
Elliot - still not convinced by him, but he's ok.
Francis - Ok he hopefully will improve, but he's nowhere near as good as Richardson was, he's not even as good as Solly atm.
With Youga out as well and unlikely to return IMO, we have no attacking full backs.
Llera - a complete liability, always has been, always will be. Plays one good game then costs us points the next. I'd not play him again, unless there is NO alternative. Fry, Fortune or Semedo must be a safer bet at CH.
Dailly , Doc, Jackson, Fry ,Youga are all good enough at this level.
Semedo & McCormack are not creative enough & if we are to play them two, then we can't afford to play 2 wingers. Personally, I'd start with Reid and not start Martin or Waggy. Martin is looking like Sam - some will say that's good others will think not.
Benson may prove good, so may Abbott, but Abbott's not looking good atm. However, Parky did say he wanted to start Abbott against D&R, but couldn't as he was carrying an injury.
The league atm looks wide open. If we can get it right, we could make the top 2, although I don't expect it.
My prediction is 6th, because I believe we should improve.
It cheered me up seeing Sheff W this afternoon who looked no better than us and they are top !
Also, Soton the other expected danger are also doing poorly & Swindon are bottom!
In summary, I think we'll end up top half and hopefully make the play offs.
DON'T YOU REALISE, CAN'T YOU SEE - YOU'RE ALL GOING TO DIE!
Francis.....How long does he need to get match fit ??? Think Solly deserves another go on Saturday .
Hopefully Christian will be back sooner rather than later (" The Mask " ?) and Parky will be able to field a settled side that includes Fry and Jackson.
Why do we play so deep/defend much of the match on our 18 yard line?
Okay, our 2 CBs lack pace and that way they don't get exposed, but we get trapped into our own half allowing opponents to dominate midfield and carry the game to us, always being in shooting range to take a pop at our goal. IMO we should play higher up the pitch.
Semedo and McCormack are quite possibly instructed to sit in front of our defence. And they do, usually very well.
No doubt the idea is to give us a solid anchor in midfield, protect the soft underbelly of our defence, and feed the wingers.
But there needs to be more balance between defending and creativity at CM.
Semedo and Ally Mac seem too similar - and offer very little going forward.
Everyone back for a corner ......grrr. If there is one tactic that frustrates me, this is the one. If we pull everyone back into our box, we of course have literally no one up on the halfway line as an outlet to relieve pressure or to start a counter attack.
Also, instead of their leaving defenders back to mark and cover our forward, opponents push up their spare defenders into our box. It's schoolboy stuff - we're making it unneccessarily hard for ourselves.
We're in desperate need of a player to put their foot on the ball in midfield, look up and pick a forward pass on the floor. We might be Third Division but IMO it really is the crucial thing lacking in the team right now. It is so bleeding obvious.
The wingers for all their huff and puff, aren't really producing. Up front, Abbott took up some good positions, but hardly saw the ball.
Same with Benson, although he kept dropping deep to run the channels. Impressed with his hunger and appetite to link up play, but where was the service?
Some people comment we don't need to play with 2 big centre forwards, but Benno plays a very different but complimentary game with Abbott. I don't see why these 2 can't play well in tandem, but for crying out loud they need a service. We invariably play with 2 wingers, but where are the crosses into the box?
We never looked like losing.......and we never looked like winning. We didn't play badly, but we were so pedestrian, lacking creativity. We desperately needed someone creative in CM to put their foot on the ball, link play and drive the team forward.
could have dispensed with the rest of the waffle and done something worthwhile in that half an hour ;-))
;o)
To the crux, up front we probably have two players that are capable of netting more goals than our forward last year, but we now have what appears some very similar options up front - good in the air, reliant on crosses for goals. For all his faults, Mooney was technically more gifted and could run at players like Martin does for us, with a view to scoring a goal or providing an assist. He offered something a bit beyond this level, was just awfully inconsistent.
If we create some chances, crosses, I think we will get goals, but the training and set up must play to our new striker's strengths. All too often on Saturday, Martin, Reid (less so) and then Wagstaff ran down the wing, cut in, jinked and then shot wide rather than taking the ball on 1st time with a dangerous cross to the near or back stick. Of course you need to be able to mix it up, but 1st time crossing has to be a focus in training surely. The likes of Benson and maybe Abbott you know will feed well off of it.
Llera needs some 'reserve' games to build confidence and re-focus the art of simple defending. Scr*w 40 to 60 yard raking passes, left to right field, let's have a player that clears effectively and does not dally on the ball. However boring this may sound, I would rather he hit row z every time he clears when he plays for the rest of the season than him tw*t about around the ball. His misreading of the ball and not clearing it in stoppage time definitely led to that penalty, which as we know he also conceded. He looked shaky and if JJ was fit enough to come on 2nd half, I'd have moved Fry to centre half and would have put JJ at left back.
Centre mid, too much of the same thing. We need a Racon or JJ sat in alongside Semedo (my preference). I like McCormack don't get me wrong, but Racon and JJ can both tackle, so adding the ability to jink away from an opponent mid field and open something up is pretty crucial in my view.
One last thing, if Francis was Southend's POTY last season, he must have something to offer, so we may need to give him a few more games yet. I seem to remember Sweaty Balmer taking a while to settle when he first came to us all those years ago, but after he had 6 or so games under his belt, he calmed down and started giving us something to support and be proud of.
I just wish our next game was Wednesday night. A few days training and then we want them out there fighting for their next win. Roll on Saturday - I will bring my voice - as should we all!
Spot on Oggy! Going back the last two seasons, even when we have a comfortable win, we never actually maintain any pressure on a side and having some decent alternatives on the bench doesn't always mean you can change a game with subs. It's a shame their goal came so late, as we probably needed to match them up 3-5-2 but were reluctant to do so when we could still get something out of the game. I worry for our future bacause I have NEVER seen Parky instructing our back-line to push up like so many other managers do. Does he not realise this tactical change or does he just not like it?