[cite]Posted By: Callumcafc[/cite]Well the proof is in myself really. I'm not exactly the greatest at football and when people knock me it takes it out of me. Thinking about thousands doing it is just awful
All that proves is your weakness, nothing else. If a few thousand (if that many) booing has such a negative effect on the players, how the hell do they ever perform at away games. How did Bailey play so well at Saarfend?
[cite]Posted By: mascot88[/cite], and pretending it does something positive is naive....
Nowhere near as naive as pretending it can never do any good.
People should be able to make their feelings known, if ANYONE else but in the sub par performances at work to the level our players have recently, a few people booing would be the absolute least of their problems.
[cite]Posted By: InspectorSands[/cite]Anyway, I want more police in my street, so I'm off to smash my neighbours' windows. That'll bring a reaction. T'ra.
[cite]Posted By: LenGlover[/cite]
Mind you our hard core of tossers used to do the same to Kishishev, Lisbie and sometimes Bryan Hughes, Darren Ambrose and Zheng Zhi.
I really thought that the one and only consolation of our sorry decline would be losing these types.
it's not a "premiership fan" thing. it's been there before Len.
when i first started going charlton without my dad, it was Mark Aizlewood who used to get it. (can't remember who the v sign was against).
[cite]Posted By: LenGlover[/cite]Fair enough Stu but if booing doesn't affect players adversely why do managers (not just Parky yesterday but others too) comment unfavourably on it?
To deflect attention away from their own shortcomings, very Pardew esque if you ask me.
I also don't recall saying booing NEVER has a negative effect on the players, what I said was to say it NEVER has a positive impact is stupid.
[cite]Posted By: mascot88[/cite]Oh here we go another one who supports booing but "doesnt boo"
[cite]Posted By: Stu of HU5[/cite]How did Bailey play so well at Saarfend?
Ah, but opposition boo'ing you is a completely different story. You don't have to go back there every other week and face it all over.
After a while it will get to anyone, no I don't have any concrete proof but it's clear that the negatives outweigh the positives. Players are human. Especially players of League One standard.
Simply suggesting that because no-one has any proof that boo'ing doesn't have a negative effect is enough reason that it is okay to boo is just a ridiculous logic.
Stu, the difference between southend and Bailey is its the awy fans booing him, that will give him strength, thats like an old girlfriend admitting she still has feelings fr you, booing your own players is like your girlfriend saying you shit in the sack.....
Stu we are third division, we have a third division team, with a third division manager, we are performing well in the third division we are 3rd....
Now you may have started supporting charlton when we were in the prem when we had money, and options and a great manager, this is the lowest ebb we have been for 30 yrs, so its almost all going to be "sub standard" we are sub standard we have sold everyone who was any good to keep the cluib a float....
support your team, end of, yor reverse psychology rubbish isnt going to do anything of value or else wed be booing from start to finish every game. Negativity breeds negativity, positivity breeds positivity....
Is reading not your strong point pal? I mean, it's pretty odd, you can't manage to read a simple statement like 'i myself don't boo' yet somehow have the ability to know exactly how and when I started supporting Charlton, odd.
[cite]Posted By: mascot88[/cite]we are performing well in the third division
We arent very good as I have said several times, but 3rd is still third.....
'
I just cant understand how you can defend booing, hence why I thought I might be from a different "school" to you......
Everyone who defends booing, doesnt boo themselves of course, rubbish I say....
Never booed anyone at a match apart from the opposition or the ref. Never even left a game early! Yeah I have a moan and get frustrated as much as the next guy but who dosen't? Support the team 100%. Playoffs here we come :)
"I wouldn't mind the odd kick up the arse from the fans if we occasionally tried a wall of sound kick-off to full time support once in while but i'm afraid as a group of fans we're all stick and no carrot these days. I wouldn't want to play in it."
Entirely agree with this. We aren't unique in booing but the lack of vocal support when things are going well combined with the vitriol we dish out when things go wrong is pretty unusual.
Even a few years when Spurs fans where seemingly constantly on the back of the players they could still get behind them and give terrific support if the team put on a performance. The same is true of Millwall and plenty of other clubs, we seem to be pretty unique in only being to raise an atmosphere to have a go at our own.
I'm looking forward to the new justification from people going to MK Dons, btw - "I'm going there to boo MY team, why should I care about anyone else?" :-)
[cite]Posted By: Stu of HU5[/cite]At the end of the day the ONLY thing that will stop people booing, would be the team performing
I was just wondering if any of the 21 (twenty one) teams below us in the league at this point in time actually boooed their own team?
Doubt it.
Wrong.
[cite]Posted By: mascot88[/cite]We arent very good as I have said several times, but 3rd is still third.....
'
I just cant understand how you can defend booing, hence why I thought I might be from a different "school" to you......
Everyone who defends booing, doesnt boo themselves of course, rubbish I say....
As we was still 4th two season ago, remember how that ended up? What did Parky learn 2 years ago to stop that happening again, nothing, woud be my guess.
I'm not defending booing, nor am I saying it's right, what I'm saying is, to claim that it can only ever have a negative effect on a player is not only wrong, but plain stupid.
Stop reading what you want to read and start reading whats being written.
Even a few years when Spurs fans where seemingly constantly on the back of the players they could still get behind them and give terrific support if the team put on a performance. The same is true of Millwall and plenty of other clubs, we seem to be pretty unique in only being to raise an atmosphere to have a go at our own.
There's a couple of young lads who sit next to us at their most animated when they're unhappy. It doesn't take much to get them booing, and booing at the top of their voices like they're on stage. I don't get it.
The away game I've been too in the past few years, none of their support get on their teams back as we do. The Valley is a crap place to play football if you are a Charlton player. I wish and hope it changes but I doubt it will. Some guy running in the east stand yesterday at half time shouting he is ashamed to support Charlton
, despite being unlucky to be behind imo.
I say well done Parky having a go yesterday, it's gone on for too long, and if Parkys little rant yesterday helps us in the remaining nine games the better. God knows what things will be like f we go behind in games vs Colchester, Leeds and Norwich...
Even a few years when Spurs fans where seemingly constantly on the back of the players they could still get behind them and give terrific support if the team put on a performance. The same is true of Millwall and plenty of other clubs, we seem to be pretty unique in only being to raise an atmosphere to have a go at our own.
There's a couple of young lads who sit next to us at their most animated when they're unhappy. It doesn't take much to get them booing, and booing at the top of their voices like they're on stage. I don't get it.
This is where I get totally lost as well.
Some people do seem to be happier when we're doing badly. Shocking really.
[cite]Posted By: BigRedEvil[/cite]I say well done Parky having a go yesterday, it's gone on for too long, and if Parkys little rant yesterday helps us in the remaining nine games the better. God knows what things will be like f we go behind in games vs Colchester, Leeds and Norwich...
If Pards had come out with the same load of tripe you'd all be spitting feathers but as its nice old polite (useless) Parky, it's fine.
I must admit to booing my team once against Wycombe in the Carling cup, at full time.
It had absolutely no effect on the team performance for that game but it did let out my frustration at such a poor performance against a team three divisions below us.
We are now a third division team, with third division players and all I want or expect to see is the players giving their all.
If you truly believe that Mooney doesn't give it everytime you must be blind.
He just doesn't stop running the whole game and tries. Ok he may not be Wayne Rooney, but he tries.
How can you boo him for that, FFs.
" to claim that it can only ever have a negative effect on a player is not only wrong, but plain stupid."
Confessions of a booer....
it is a horrible envirnement when things arent going well and things havnt been going well for years.....
If you think your own fans booing you week in week out and then to go to a new low and to boo a player BEFORE you have even kicked a ball is going to do anything positive you are deluded...again
I've read this thread and I'm with the majority, booing is totally wrong. After all we all want the same thing, a successful team. We can help or hinder and at the moment a load of t**ts are hindering a potential promotion push. Let get behind the team and the manager!
I give up, no point trying to discuss things with someone who won't, or can't read whats actually being written.
I've not once said that booing is always good thing. It's not complicated, jesus man.
I'd imagine (although can't be sure, as I wasnt one of the ones booing) that most of those booing Mooney prior to the game, where more angerd at the fact that Shelvey was not playing and after an absolute disgusting performance last week, Mooney unfairly caught the brunt of that frustration.
[cite]Posted By: mascot88[/cite]
If you think your own fans booing you week in week out and then to go to a new low and to boo a player BEFORE you have even kicked a ball is going to do anything positive you are deluded...again
I don't know if you're aware of this fella, but Mooney scored yesterday, so I'd say that was pretty conclusive evidence that it CAN (read can, not always) have a positive impact of the team. Of course, you could claim that the booing had no effect on him at all at the goal was simply down to his own ability. There called opinions, everyones allowed them and everyoned can express them.
I take it that people who believe that Mooney's positive performance yesterday was down to the management, and not a response to the fans, must also believe that Parky and co aren't doing a good job. Mooney and others have been rubbish for ages, so if only management are responsible for the positives they must also be responsible for all the negatives; therefore the fans booing makes no odds either way.....You can't have it both ways.
Thats right Stu, the booing of mooney was the reason he smacked one in, muppet......
Ill let keith tell you he thinks, and just to make sure you dont misunderstand it, when he says get behing the team hes not talking about booing them before theve kivked a ball...he also expalains what most of us know that its a topsy turvey life supporting charltn which some of our newer fans seem unable to accept.
Stu you will never convince me booing is anything othr than negative and shows us up as having some very poor and weak supporters....
Booing is just divisive and wrong. I deplore it. Things are and have not been great but ffs lets all pull together as the alternative will pull this great club apart. Nine matches left of this season for us to get it back together both on and off the field. As of now I stop moaning about the management and players and get 100% behind the players in my teams colours. COYR
None of us are suggesting its the fans fault that we wouldnt go up, we all know we are not particularly good, the debate is about wheterh booing can be productive at any point and the answer is NO.....
and as Keith has just explained if you watch the vid, he has told us what works and what would help, booing wasnt on the list, and booing even before a layer kicks a ball, now that is disgusting matey.....
[cite]Posted By: floydandharvey[/cite]Are the booers casual fans or season ticket holders? If the latter, can they not be identified via CCTV and banned (not permanently, but just for one or two games in the hope that would 'rehabilitate' them). I appreciate this is difficult with the Medieval paper season tickets we still have. The sooner we switch to swipe cards - heck, even Millwall have those - the better for situations like this. Would be very easy for the club to identify a booer from his seat on the CCTV and electronically block his swipe card from working for the next game or two. Sure, they could buy another ticket, but that in itself is punishment too (they'll soon realise that every time they boo they effectively get 'fined' the cost of another ticket). Just an idea.
Banning season ticket holders for viewing their opnion? Holy crap, where was you born, nazi Germany????
All a bit rich coming from someone who by their own admitance goes to more non league games than Charlton ones, thereby offering the club little to support at all (vocal or financial)
Also, have you ever actually used one of those god damn awful swipe cards? They're an absolute pain in the arse! Added to the fact we'd lose a ton of revenue due to adults buying juniror season tickets. With swipe cards there's almost no way whatsoever of stopping that happening.
we may well have to look at the swipe cards, as once weve booed out team to promotion the demand for tickets may well go up, and to get back into the prem we will need loads more fans to keep the heavy booing going to really push us on to return to the premiership.... night
Comments
So when you get a truly awful performance that stinks the ground out, the jeers lose their power because the players have heard it all before.
If you're at the end of your tether, don't start trying to drag everyone else down to a fragile mental state.
All that proves is your weakness, nothing else. If a few thousand (if that many) booing has such a negative effect on the players, how the hell do they ever perform at away games. How did Bailey play so well at Saarfend?
Nowhere near as naive as pretending it can never do any good.
People should be able to make their feelings known, if ANYONE else but in the sub par performances at work to the level our players have recently, a few people booing would be the absolute least of their problems.
Bang on the money
it's not a "premiership fan" thing. it's been there before Len.
when i first started going charlton without my dad, it was Mark Aizlewood who used to get it. (can't remember who the v sign was against).
To deflect attention away from their own shortcomings, very Pardew esque if you ask me.
I also don't recall saying booing NEVER has a negative effect on the players, what I said was to say it NEVER has a positive impact is stupid.
I support booing? Really, thats news to me.
Ah, but opposition boo'ing you is a completely different story. You don't have to go back there every other week and face it all over.
After a while it will get to anyone, no I don't have any concrete proof but it's clear that the negatives outweigh the positives. Players are human. Especially players of League One standard.
Simply suggesting that because no-one has any proof that boo'ing doesn't have a negative effect is enough reason that it is okay to boo is just a ridiculous logic.
Stu we are third division, we have a third division team, with a third division manager, we are performing well in the third division we are 3rd....
Now you may have started supporting charlton when we were in the prem when we had money, and options and a great manager, this is the lowest ebb we have been for 30 yrs, so its almost all going to be "sub standard" we are sub standard we have sold everyone who was any good to keep the cluib a float....
support your team, end of, yor reverse psychology rubbish isnt going to do anything of value or else wed be booing from start to finish every game. Negativity breeds negativity, positivity breeds positivity....
Really? You think so? Delluded.
'
I just cant understand how you can defend booing, hence why I thought I might be from a different "school" to you......
Everyone who defends booing, doesnt boo themselves of course, rubbish I say....
I was just wondering if any of the 21 (twenty one) teams below us in the league at this point in time actually boooed their own team?
Doubt it.
Entirely agree with this. We aren't unique in booing but the lack of vocal support when things are going well combined with the vitriol we dish out when things go wrong is pretty unusual.
Even a few years when Spurs fans where seemingly constantly on the back of the players they could still get behind them and give terrific support if the team put on a performance. The same is true of Millwall and plenty of other clubs, we seem to be pretty unique in only being to raise an atmosphere to have a go at our own.
Wrong.
As we was still 4th two season ago, remember how that ended up? What did Parky learn 2 years ago to stop that happening again, nothing, woud be my guess.
I'm not defending booing, nor am I saying it's right, what I'm saying is, to claim that it can only ever have a negative effect on a player is not only wrong, but plain stupid.
Stop reading what you want to read and start reading whats being written.
There's a couple of young lads who sit next to us at their most animated when they're unhappy. It doesn't take much to get them booing, and booing at the top of their voices like they're on stage. I don't get it.
, despite being unlucky to be behind imo.
I say well done Parky having a go yesterday, it's gone on for too long, and if Parkys little rant yesterday helps us in the remaining nine games the better. God knows what things will be like f we go behind in games vs Colchester, Leeds and Norwich...
This is where I get totally lost as well.
Some people do seem to be happier when we're doing badly. Shocking really.
If Pards had come out with the same load of tripe you'd all be spitting feathers but as its nice old polite (useless) Parky, it's fine.
It had absolutely no effect on the team performance for that game but it did let out my frustration at such a poor performance against a team three divisions below us.
We are now a third division team, with third division players and all I want or expect to see is the players giving their all.
If you truly believe that Mooney doesn't give it everytime you must be blind.
He just doesn't stop running the whole game and tries. Ok he may not be Wayne Rooney, but he tries.
How can you boo him for that, FFs.
Confessions of a booer....
it is a horrible envirnement when things arent going well and things havnt been going well for years.....
If you think your own fans booing you week in week out and then to go to a new low and to boo a player BEFORE you have even kicked a ball is going to do anything positive you are deluded...again
I've not once said that booing is always good thing. It's not complicated, jesus man.
I'd imagine (although can't be sure, as I wasnt one of the ones booing) that most of those booing Mooney prior to the game, where more angerd at the fact that Shelvey was not playing and after an absolute disgusting performance last week, Mooney unfairly caught the brunt of that frustration.
I don't know if you're aware of this fella, but Mooney scored yesterday, so I'd say that was pretty conclusive evidence that it CAN (read can, not always) have a positive impact of the team. Of course, you could claim that the booing had no effect on him at all at the goal was simply down to his own ability. There called opinions, everyones allowed them and everyoned can express them.
Ill let keith tell you he thinks, and just to make sure you dont misunderstand it, when he says get behing the team hes not talking about booing them before theve kivked a ball...he also expalains what most of us know that its a topsy turvey life supporting charltn which some of our newer fans seem unable to accept.
Stu you will never convince me booing is anything othr than negative and shows us up as having some very poor and weak supporters....
I dont think he values booing like you do mate, I dont think he thinks that it "can" help....
Ill stick with Keiths view thanks.... "stick by us" Kieth says.....
im off to bed its 1am, feel free to tear me to shreds in my absense....
Are you seriously suggesting that every single person booing yesterday was onje of your termed "premiership fans"??
It might have been, it might not have been, you don't know the answer anymore than I do.
I know one things for sure, the idea that when we don't get promoted it will be even 1% the fans fault is absolutely disgusting.
and as Keith has just explained if you watch the vid, he has told us what works and what would help, booing wasnt on the list, and booing even before a layer kicks a ball, now that is disgusting matey.....
Banning season ticket holders for viewing their opnion? Holy crap, where was you born, nazi Germany????
All a bit rich coming from someone who by their own admitance goes to more non league games than Charlton ones, thereby offering the club little to support at all (vocal or financial)
Also, have you ever actually used one of those god damn awful swipe cards? They're an absolute pain in the arse! Added to the fact we'd lose a ton of revenue due to adults buying juniror season tickets. With swipe cards there's almost no way whatsoever of stopping that happening.