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the Spurs advantage

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  • IA said:

    25May98 said:

    25May98 said:

    sam3110 said:

    F*** spurs.

    Two bob a***holes who think they are a big club.

    Not won the title since 1961, and still counting.

    Talking of fans who think their club are bigger than they actually are, only last week someone on here described Charlton as the 4th or 5th biggest club in London (?????)

    Arsenal
    Chelsea
    Spurs
    West Ham
    Charlton
    Fulham
    QPR
    Millwall
    Brentford
    Leyton Orient
    Wimbledon
    Dagenham

    I'd say we're 5th
    Sorry to ruin your league table but PALACE?
    Yeah what about them... this is a list of teams in London, not Surrey!!
    I always thought SE25 stood for South East London. Is it really Surrey East?? If so that has made my day. Yes, we are fifth.

    And Palace are filth.
    Chelsea and Fulham have SW6 postcode. Doesn't mean they're in South London
    Agreed. You would think that big strip of water was a perfect way to divide North from South.


    Crystal Palace as an actual place name does not exist. It's Upper Norwood, South Norwood ect.....

    So, where do we place Palace in the league table of London teams? Are they bigger than Charlton? At this very moment maybe but historically? What if they win the cup? (my God this is depressing)
  • Riviera said:

    IA said:

    25May98 said:

    25May98 said:

    sam3110 said:

    F*** spurs.

    Two bob a***holes who think they are a big club.

    Not won the title since 1961, and still counting.

    Talking of fans who think their club are bigger than they actually are, only last week someone on here described Charlton as the 4th or 5th biggest club in London (?????)

    Arsenal
    Chelsea
    Spurs
    West Ham
    Charlton
    Fulham
    QPR
    Millwall
    Brentford
    Leyton Orient
    Wimbledon
    Dagenham

    I'd say we're 5th
    Sorry to ruin your league table but PALACE?
    Yeah what about them... this is a list of teams in London, not Surrey!!
    I always thought SE25 stood for South East London. Is it really Surrey East?? If so that has made my day. Yes, we are fifth.

    And Palace are filth.
    Chelsea and Fulham have SW6 postcode. Doesn't mean they're in South London
    And if you look at a map of London you'll see we are more East than South London.....
    I've always thought (and, for some reason, I was thinking about this the other day) that we're really East South London rather than South East London. If anyone asks where abouts I'm from I'll either say "south" or "south east" but never "east", therefore the part of London that Eltham/Greenwich/Charlton inhibit could more accurately be described as the East part of South London, not the South part of East London.

    I'm pretty sure none of that made sense in anywhere hut my own head.
  • 25May98 said:

    So, where do we place Palace in the league table of London teams?

    Nowhere, unless we're adding Watford, Accrington Stanley, PSG and Viktoria Plzen to the league table of London teams.
  • edited April 2016
    sam3110 said:

    F*** spurs.

    Two bob a***holes who think they are a big club.

    Not won the title since 1961, and still counting.

    Talking of fans who think their club are bigger than they actually are, only last week someone on here described Charlton as the 4th or 5th biggest club in London (?????)

    Arsenal
    Chelsea
    Spurs
    West Ham
    Charlton
    Fulham
    QPR
    Millwall
    Brentford
    Leyton Orient
    Wimbledon
    Dagenham

    I'd say we're 5th
    Stick palace in at 5th (and it pains me to say that) then I would say it was up for debate between you, QPR and Fulham.
    Personally would say Fulham are bigger. Only recently they was in the prem, recently played in a European cup final and regulars get 20k plus. And that's a genuine 20k. Same with QPR, only last season they was in the prem, regularly get a genuine 17k and would get more if their ground held more. A more realistic list that I think most neutrals would agree with would be....

    Arsenal
    Chelsea
    Spurs
    west ham
    palace
    Fulham
    QPR
    Charlton
    Millwall
    Brentford
    Leyton Orient
    Wimbledon
    Dagenham

    That would put you 8th and not even close to being "4th or 5th".

  • 25May98 said:

    IA said:

    25May98 said:

    25May98 said:

    sam3110 said:

    F*** spurs.

    Two bob a***holes who think they are a big club.

    Not won the title since 1961, and still counting.

    Talking of fans who think their club are bigger than they actually are, only last week someone on here described Charlton as the 4th or 5th biggest club in London (?????)

    Arsenal
    Chelsea
    Spurs
    West Ham
    Charlton
    Fulham
    QPR
    Millwall
    Brentford
    Leyton Orient
    Wimbledon
    Dagenham

    I'd say we're 5th
    Sorry to ruin your league table but PALACE?
    Yeah what about them... this is a list of teams in London, not Surrey!!
    I always thought SE25 stood for South East London. Is it really Surrey East?? If so that has made my day. Yes, we are fifth.

    And Palace are filth.
    Chelsea and Fulham have SW6 postcode. Doesn't mean they're in South London
    Agreed. You would think that big strip of water was a perfect way to divide North from South.

    Maybe if it was straight and ran through the middle.

  • sam3110 said:

    F*** spurs.

    Two bob a***holes who think they are a big club.

    Not won the title since 1961, and still counting.

    Talking of fans who think their club are bigger than they actually are, only last week someone on here described Charlton as the 4th or 5th biggest club in London (?????)

    Arsenal
    Chelsea
    Spurs
    West Ham
    Charlton
    Fulham
    QPR
    Millwall
    Brentford
    Leyton Orient
    Wimbledon
    Dagenham

    I'd say we're 5th
    Stick palace in at 5th (and it pains me to say that) then I would say it was up for debate between you, QPR and Fulham.
    Personally would say Fulham are bigger. Only recently they was in the prem, recently played in a European cup final and regulars get 20k plus. And that's a genuine 20k. Same with QPR, only last season they was in the prem, regularly get a genuine 17k and would get more if their ground held more. A more realistic list that I think most neutrals would agree with would be....

    Arsenal
    Chelsea
    Spurs
    west ham
    palace
    Fulham
    QPR
    Charlton
    Millwall
    Brentford
    Leyton Orient
    Wimbledon
    Dagenham

    That would put you 8th and not even close to being "4th or 5th".

    You've forgotten that we were in the Prem and "4th or 5th" ......... only 10 years ago.

  • sam3110 said:

    F*** spurs.

    Two bob a***holes who think they are a big club.

    Not won the title since 1961, and still counting.

    Talking of fans who think their club are bigger than they actually are, only last week someone on here described Charlton as the 4th or 5th biggest club in London (?????)

    Arsenal
    Chelsea
    Spurs
    West Ham
    Charlton
    Fulham
    QPR
    Millwall
    Brentford
    Leyton Orient
    Wimbledon
    Dagenham

    I'd say we're 5th
    Stick palace in at 5th (and it pains me to say that) then I would say it was up for debate between you, QPR and Fulham.
    Personally would say Fulham are bigger. Only recently they was in the prem, recently played in a European cup final and regulars get 20k plus. And that's a genuine 20k. Same with QPR, only last season they was in the prem, regularly get a genuine 17k and would get more if their ground held more. A more realistic list that I think most neutrals would agree with would be....

    Arsenal
    Chelsea
    Spurs
    west ham
    palace
    Fulham
    QPR
    Charlton
    Millwall
    Brentford
    Leyton Orient
    Wimbledon
    Dagenham

    That would put you 8th and not even close to being "4th or 5th".

    But taking entire history into account we were one the biggest teams in the land in the 40's, were in the Premiership longer than QPR and Palace, have a bigger ground, sold out most games when in the Premiership, finished higher in the league, and haven't been in the 4th tier for a long time.

    And Palace are the biggest team in Surrey, but are pushed hard by Woking and Staines Town.
  • Riviera said:

    25May98 said:

    IA said:

    25May98 said:

    25May98 said:

    sam3110 said:

    F*** spurs.

    Two bob a***holes who think they are a big club.

    Not won the title since 1961, and still counting.

    Talking of fans who think their club are bigger than they actually are, only last week someone on here described Charlton as the 4th or 5th biggest club in London (?????)

    Arsenal
    Chelsea
    Spurs
    West Ham
    Charlton
    Fulham
    QPR
    Millwall
    Brentford
    Leyton Orient
    Wimbledon
    Dagenham

    I'd say we're 5th
    Sorry to ruin your league table but PALACE?
    Yeah what about them... this is a list of teams in London, not Surrey!!
    I always thought SE25 stood for South East London. Is it really Surrey East?? If so that has made my day. Yes, we are fifth.

    And Palace are filth.
    Chelsea and Fulham have SW6 postcode. Doesn't mean they're in South London
    Agreed. You would think that big strip of water was a perfect way to divide North from South.

    Maybe if it was straight and ran through the middle.

    Are there any areas south of the Thames with a 'N' postcode? Southbank is further North than Chelsea, Fulham etc....but it is still SE1 (I think).
  • Is how I'd work out the size of clubs in London...

    Your remembered for what you win, not how many fans you pack into the Stadium each season...

    Ultimately it was difficult to put the top six in order based on the trophies they'd won but because Arsenal have so many titles I thought it would be difficult to place Chelsea above them based on one Champions League title whilst Charlton come ahead of Queens Park Rangers because the FA Cup is a bigger competition than the League Cup.

    England: Top Flight / FA Cup / League Cup
    Europe: Champions League / UEFA Cup / Cup-Winners Cup

    Arsenal ... 27-Titles (England) / 1-Title (Europe) / 59k Attendance
    Chelsea ... 17-Titles (England) / 4-Titles (Europe) / 41k Attendance
    Tottenham Hotspur ... 14-Titles (England) / 3-Titles (Europe) / 35k Attendance
    West Ham United ... 3-Titles (England) / 0-Titles (Europe) / 34k Attendance
    Charlton Athletic ... 1-Title (England) / 0-Titles (Europe) / 15k Attendance
    Queens Park Rangers ... 1-Titles (England) / 0-Titles (Europe) / 15k Attendance

    Crystal Palace ... 0-Titles (England or Europe) / 24k Attendance
    Fulham ... 0-Titles (England or Europe) / 17k Attendance
    Brentford ... 0-Titles (England or Europe) / 10k Attendance
    Millwall ... 0-Titles (England or Europe) / 9k Attendance
    Leyton Orient ... 0-Titles (England or Europe) / 5k Attendance
    AFC Wimbledon ... 0-Titles (England or Europe) / 4k Attendance
    Dagenham & Redbridge ... 0-Titles (England or Europe) / 1k Attendance
  • 25May98 said:



    Are there any areas south of the Thames with a 'N' postcode? Southbank is further North than Chelsea, Fulham etc....but it is still SE1 (I think).

    No, all N postcodes are properly north, none of them even border the river
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  • rina said:

    25May98 said:



    Are there any areas south of the Thames with a 'N' postcode? Southbank is further North than Chelsea, Fulham etc....but it is still SE1 (I think).

    No, all N postcodes are properly north, none of them even border the river
    There must be some NE postcodes near the river

    ;-)
  • edited April 2016
    Skysports: Harry, that's got to be hard to take?
    Kane:
    https://twitter.com/WestHamUtdDave/status/724702518727593984

    (Apologies I can't seem to post the actual clip, so the link goes to it - a four second giggle.)
  • sam3110 said:

    F*** spurs.

    Two bob a***holes who think they are a big club.

    Not won the title since 1961, and still counting.

    Talking of fans who think their club are bigger than they actually are, only last week someone on here described Charlton as the 4th or 5th biggest club in London (?????)

    Arsenal
    Chelsea
    Spurs
    West Ham
    Charlton
    Fulham
    QPR
    Millwall
    Brentford
    Leyton Orient
    Wimbledon
    Dagenham

    I'd say we're 5th
    Stick palace in at 5th (and it pains me to say that) then I would say it was up for debate between you, QPR and Fulham.
    Personally would say Fulham are bigger. Only recently they was in the prem, recently played in a European cup final and regulars get 20k plus. And that's a genuine 20k. Same with QPR, only last season they was in the prem, regularly get a genuine 17k and would get more if their ground held more. A more realistic list that I think most neutrals would agree with would be....

    Arsenal
    Chelsea
    Spurs
    west ham
    palace
    Fulham
    QPR
    Charlton
    Millwall
    Brentford
    Leyton Orient
    Wimbledon
    Dagenham

    That would put you 8th and not even close to being "4th or 5th".

    Fulham have never had a "genuine" 20k in their history. Their support is made up of tourists..
  • And Leicester deserve this for "claridge in the last minute"

    Birmingham will win it one day for "Stern John in the last minute"

    Hopefully that team with Jon Fortune as well.
  • sam3110 said:

    F*** spurs.

    Two bob a***holes who think they are a big club.

    Not won the title since 1961, and still counting.

    Talking of fans who think their club are bigger than they actually are, only last week someone on here described Charlton as the 4th or 5th biggest club in London (?????)

    Arsenal
    Chelsea
    Spurs
    West Ham
    Charlton
    Fulham
    QPR
    Millwall
    Brentford
    Leyton Orient
    Wimbledon
    Dagenham

    I'd say we're 5th
    Stick palace in at 5th (and it pains me to say that) then I would say it was up for debate between you, QPR and Fulham.
    Personally would say Fulham are bigger. Only recently they was in the prem, recently played in a European cup final and regulars get 20k plus. And that's a genuine 20k. Same with QPR, only last season they was in the prem, regularly get a genuine 17k and would get more if their ground held more. A more realistic list that I think most neutrals would agree with would be....

    Arsenal
    Chelsea
    Spurs
    west ham
    palace
    Fulham
    QPR
    Charlton
    Millwall
    Brentford
    Leyton Orient
    Wimbledon
    Dagenham

    That would put you 8th and not even close to being "4th or 5th".

    Fulham a genuine 20k with their neutral end and being the most popular ground for away fans? They're inbetween us and millwall. Not much between Charlton and QPR so I give it to us on alphabetical order! And palace aren't a London club.
  • Haha, NE postcodes. Very funny.

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/London_postal_district

    If you extract the SE25 molar at the bottom and put it into the Croydon postal district the map looks better. You couldn't take SE7 out like that.

    Proper London.

    Crystal palace is unfortunately a named area along with the norwoods at least on my maps app.
  • With all the doom and gloom down at the valley recently, along comes Millwallfan with another cracker to cheer us all up.

    Couldn't make it up!
  • I think the amount of seasons in the top flight has to be a major factor - which pushes us higher.

    I just hope Man Utd win the cup so at least we still have that advantage...and when we won the cup no-one fielded weakened teams it was THE CUP.
  • What Palace, Charlton, QPR and Fulham have in common is that all have had and will have decent spells in the top flight, but none can be considered permanent members, or largely permanent like West Ham, who've been relegated but generally come up again.

    I remember QPR nearing winning the title in the 70s, I remember them in the 3rd tier.
    Fulham had many years in the top flight and provided Cohen to the WC66 team, but nearly fell out of the league.

    Is how I'd work out the size of clubs in London...

    Your remembered for what you win, not how many fans you pack into the Stadium each season...

    Ultimately it was difficult to put the top six in order based on the trophies they'd won but because Arsenal have so many titles I thought it would be difficult to place Chelsea above them based on one Champions League title whilst Charlton come ahead of Queens Park Rangers because the FA Cup is a bigger competition than the League Cup.

    England: Top Flight / FA Cup / League Cup
    Europe: Champions League / UEFA Cup / Cup-Winners Cup

    Arsenal ... 27-Titles (England) / 1-Title (Europe) / 59k Attendance
    Chelsea ... 17-Titles (England) / 4-Titles (Europe) / 41k Attendance
    Tottenham Hotspur ... 14-Titles (England) / 3-Titles (Europe) / 35k Attendance
    West Ham United ... 3-Titles (England) / 0-Titles (Europe) / 34k Attendance
    Charlton Athletic ... 1-Title (England) / 0-Titles (Europe) / 15k Attendance
    Queens Park Rangers ... 1-Titles (England) / 0-Titles (Europe) / 15k Attendance

    Crystal Palace ... 0-Titles (England or Europe) / 24k Attendance
    Fulham ... 0-Titles (England or Europe) / 17k Attendance
    Brentford ... 0-Titles (England or Europe) / 10k Attendance
    Millwall ... 0-Titles (England or Europe) / 9k Attendance
    Leyton Orient ... 0-Titles (England or Europe) / 5k Attendance
    AFC Wimbledon ... 0-Titles (England or Europe) / 4k Attendance
    Dagenham & Redbridge ... 0-Titles (England or Europe) / 1k Attendance

    The problem with using trophies as a criteria, is that some clubs have won a lot of trophies, but a long time ago. Trophies in the 19th century, when a lot of clubs didn't exist are easier.

    Even in the 20th century, Huddersfield won 3 straight titles and an FA Cup in the 1920s, but you wouldn't say that makes them a big club now.

    I personally think Spurs are bigger than Chelsea
    1) They would (and will) get much bigger crowds than Chelsea in a bigger stadium
    2) Chelsea's success is mainly recent, and as a direct result of a super rich owner.
  • I just think the problem using attendances is the fact that no one remembers them...

    i.e. What happened in 2012...? - Oh yeah we got an average of 20k fans coming through the turnstiles... Anything else? - Erm didnt we win something?... Nope cant remember

    Understand what you mean about some trophies being won in the 19th Century though...

    i.e. Preston won the FA Cup in 1889 but look how many teams were in the First Round; https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1888–89_FA_Cup
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  • I just think the problem using attendances is the fact that no one remembers them...

    i.e. What happened in 2012...? - Oh yeah we got an average of 20k fans coming through the turnstiles... Anything else? - Erm didnt we win something?... Nope cant remember

    Understand what you mean about some trophies being won in the 19th Century though...

    i.e. Preston won the FA Cup in 1889 but look how many teams were in the First Round; https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1888–89_FA_Cup

    The other modern development is the "Top 4 finish" success, i.e. finish 4th in the PL and it's probably at the time considered more of an achievement than winning the League Cup!
  • sam3110 said:



    But taking entire history into account we were one the biggest teams in the land in the 40's, were in the Premiership longer than QPR and Palace, have a bigger ground, sold out most games when in the Premiership, finished higher in the league, and haven't been in the 4th tier for a long time.

    We haven't ever been in the 4th tier since we entered League football , unlike our scummy neighbours and the Croydon geeks
  • sam3110 said:



    But taking entire history into account we were one the biggest teams in the land in the 40's, were in the Premiership longer than QPR and Palace, have a bigger ground, sold out most games when in the Premiership, finished higher in the league, and haven't been in the 4th tier for a long time.

    We haven't ever been in the 4th tier since we entered League football , unlike our scummy neighbours and the Croydon geeks
    another glorious achievement for our dear leader beckons
  • sam3110 said:



    But taking entire history into account we were one the biggest teams in the land in the 40's, were in the Premiership longer than QPR and Palace, have a bigger ground, sold out most games when in the Premiership, finished higher in the league, and haven't been in the 4th tier for a long time.

    We haven't ever been in the 4th tier since we entered League football , unlike our scummy neighbours and the Croydon geeks
    Bookmarked :smiley:

  • sam3110 said:



    But taking entire history into account we were one the biggest teams in the land in the 40's, were in the Premiership longer than QPR and Palace, have a bigger ground, sold out most games when in the Premiership, finished higher in the league, and haven't been in the 4th tier for a long time.

    We haven't ever been in the 4th tier since we entered League football , unlike our scummy neighbours and the Croydon geeks
    Bookmarked :smiley:

    This time next year I reckon MF, if these Belgian lunatics are still here.
  • IA said:

    25May98 said:

    25May98 said:

    sam3110 said:

    F*** spurs.

    Two bob a***holes who think they are a big club.

    Not won the title since 1961, and still counting.

    Talking of fans who think their club are bigger than they actually are, only last week someone on here described Charlton as the 4th or 5th biggest club in London (?????)

    Arsenal
    Chelsea
    Spurs
    West Ham
    Charlton
    Fulham
    QPR
    Millwall
    Brentford
    Leyton Orient
    Wimbledon
    Dagenham

    I'd say we're 5th
    Sorry to ruin your league table but PALACE?
    Yeah what about them... this is a list of teams in London, not Surrey!!
    I always thought SE25 stood for South East London. Is it really Surrey East?? If so that has made my day. Yes, we are fifth.

    And Palace are filth.
    Chelsea and Fulham have SW6 postcode. Doesn't mean they're in South London
    South London means south of the river. And in London.

    How South London lost its S postcode: http://deserter.co.uk/2016/04/looking-for-south-london/
  • regarding spurs finishing above arsenal as @JohnBoyUK mentioned

    think spurs will

    chelsea - lose.
    saints - draw.
    newcastle - win.
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