There is a process. Time will tell but IMO we need to stick with a manager and enjoy the journey. I'll still be Charlton whatever happens. Need the lows to appreciate the highs. TC and Leaburn credit to the club tonight. COYA
Not sure I can enjoy the journey when we 'play' like this tbh
It is a shite watch, somewhat softened by 6 beers and a few gin & tonics .... But when I see the young players creating and influencing then that is a positive. When I see a reaction from some poor results, then that is a positive. Clearly Jones has the players support, and I know it took a while to click at Luton so he also needs to improve. But I know he did wonders at Luton, so he has the ability, but he needs the support to achieve that. Perhaps we need to see and give him the chance, the are all humans and I'll give him time to find the right pieces for the jigsaw.
If it takes a couple of seasons so be it. I just hope if he does achieve it, the club and structure is built alongside.
I would love it to be this season, and who knows. But Jones knows how to get promoted and how to get players to work for him, so he has my support while he is the manager of our club.
does he?
I've no idea really. But from the outside they ran a round alot and tried hard. Perhaps we a just in a shite patch. It happens, I have them all the time.
you and me both! At least you're optimistic - I need to try that more!
I try to be. But I'm as frustrated as everyone here. We need to be better, but I'm going for the long view. Willing to give the current lot a few seasons. I'm sure there will be a time when enough is enough, but in the meantime just look for the chinks of light.
Not sure I'll be the same if we are still in this appalling league in 2026.
We are 16 games into the season, have yet to score more than two goals in a match and have failed to win a game once the opposition have scored. Yes, we've won five matches without the opposition scoring but unless you're a Burnley (conceded just six goals in 17 matches), you won't be in the promotion shake up at the end of the season playing that way. It seems that Jones is trying to make us resilient by sacrificing flair which has resulted in dire football. The fact that Louie Barry, on loan from Villa, has scored just four goals less for Stockport than we have as a team says it all but, equally, he would not have found the net 13 times (22 in 38 appearances in the last two seasons) given the way we play.
The one seemingly surprising aspect of all of this is this is that Jones' early promotion sides were not that way inclined (Danny Hylton scored 21 goals in Jones' first season at the club albeit in League 2). Luton weren't promoted in his first season but the following year they were, finishing runners-up in scoring 94 goals. The very next season Luton made it back to back promotions although Jones left in the January to go to Stoke.
It is at Stoke that Jones' footballing philosophy appears to have changed. He lasted 10 months there with his side managing to win a very poor 6/38 matches and that included an unbeaten run of nine matches during which time they scored just five goals!!! He then went back to Luton where, in his first season, they finished 12th but scored less than a goal a game with just 41. In his second and only other full season second time round, Luton finished 6th but did so scoring 62 goals in 48 matches, losing in the two leg play-off to Huddersfield 2-1.
Jones left in November 2022 at which point Luton had managed 29 points in 20 games (1.45 points per game). It was under Rob Edwards that they were promoted, via the Play-Offs, having secured 51 points in 26 games (1.96 points per game) following Jones' departure. At Southampton Jones lasted just three months as they picked up 3/24 points during his tenure and scored just six goals in those eight matches and were relegated at the end of that season.
It appears that Jones in his second spell at Luton, then at Stoke and Southampton and now with us has tried to make his teams ones that don't concede, first and foremost. He wasn't given time to add a more attacking layer to that, if that was his intention in his last two jobs because those sides failed to keep clean sheets in the way that Parker has got Burnley to do. The debate is as to how long one allows things to carry on as they are but, with that constant revolving door of managers, perhaps we should take stock at the end of the season?
There next 2 months will define Jones era IMHO, if we carry on losing then he will be gone by January transfer window. If however he can use last night as a catalyst (and yes I know it wasnt a great performance but a win is a win and can have an effect around the place) if we build a bit of momentum and we are still within touching distance of the playoffs going in to Jan transfer window he has to use it wisely and shred his old thinking about loans etc.
The whole time we aren't realistically facing relegation i say keep him to the summer at least just as a point of pragmatism, it doesnt really work changing in the middle or before end of the season. Who realistically would we get and also gives the new manager the chance to come in and make his own changes, we have seen time and time again a manager comes in and decides some players arent for him but he cant get rid of them in the summer and it create a poor morale which effects the team on the pitch.
The thing is, he'll be delighted with how we played yesterday. The way we went long with bodies around the strikers to play off the second balls, and then pressed is exactly how he wants us to play. Other than scoring more goals, I don't think there's much he would change. Someone said the NTT20 blokes called it 'sufferball' and it really is, but nobody is suffering more than us.
The thing is, he'll be delighted with how we played yesterday. The way we went long with bodies around the strikers to play off the second balls, and then pressed is exactly how he wants us to play. Other than scoring more goals, I don't think there's much he would change. Someone said the NTT20 blokes called it 'sufferball' and it really is, but nobody is suffering more than us.
I agree with this mate I can honestly say even if he gets us on a run and we start winning games I won’t be looking forward to watching it if we keep playing in this way. Football should be enjoyable to watch and this certainly isn’t imo
There is a process. Time will tell but IMO we need to stick with a manager and enjoy the journey. I'll still be Charlton whatever happens. Need the lows to appreciate the highs. TC and Leaburn credit to the club tonight. COYA
Not sure I can enjoy the journey when we 'play' like this tbh
It is a shite watch, somewhat softened by 6 beers and a few gin & tonics .... But when I see the young players creating and influencing then that is a positive. When I see a reaction from some poor results, then that is a positive. Clearly Jones has the players support, and I know it took a while to click at Luton so he also needs to improve. But I know he did wonders at Luton, so he has the ability, but he needs the support to achieve that. Perhaps we need to see and give him the chance, the are all humans and I'll give him time to find the right pieces for the jigsaw.
If it takes a couple of seasons so be it. I just hope if he does achieve it, the club and structure is built alongside.
I would love it to be this season, and who knows. But Jones knows how to get promoted and how to get players to work for him, so he has my support while he is the manager of our club.
does he?
I've no idea really. But from the outside they ran a round alot and tried hard. Perhaps we a just in a shite patch. It happens, I have them all the time.
Good that they ran around and tried - especially as they are paid to do that. That’s the equivalent of me turning my laptop on at work, replying to a few emails and logging back off again.
I think it's way too early to be thinking about ditching Jones tbh. Just for once I'd like to see what happens when we let a manager try to work through a problem, rather than just sacking them and hoping the next person in does better.
Just for comparison it's worth looking back at what Wycombe fans thought of Matt Bloomfield at the start of this year:
"I'm gobsmacked so many want to stick with him still. His record is awful, I want to say worst of anyone since we've been a league club, but I'm not sure, but can't be far off."
"I'm not vociferously Bloomfield Out but if there was a magic button to get rid of home without any financial drama, then I'd press it. It's not even the results for me, it's the tedious nature of the football... Previous managers have gone for lesser losing runs and entertainment reasons."
Their board stuck with him and now they're top of the table and the top goal-scorers in the division. He's on a 5-game winning streak and being linked with jobs in the Championship.
Before we got Appleton in, weren’t we rejected by Des Buckingham and Dave Challinor?
Who do people think will take this job on that’s any more likely to be successful than a bloke who already took a team from bottom half of League 2 to top six of the Championship?
This question is exactly the sort of incredibly lazy and inept coach-selection that is why we are where we are!! Honestly mate I do not know what planet you are on.
"this guy got somebody promoted from this division once, let's get him"
How about you expect the board of a football club to do some slightly more involved selection process, considering, for example:
- somebody's overall career achievements (i.e. 1 successful job, 2 catastrophic failures); - their personality; - their coaching and playing style; - their man management ability; - their press / fan engagement ability; - many other nuanced details that wouldn't be evident to us as fans.
And then make a selection. How do you think Ipswich chose Kieran Mckenna? It wasn't because he had previously got somebody promoted from this division.
Think you've missed the point of Callum's post. We DID do that and we got rejected by at least three names (including Ferguson who really knows how to get out of this league) and ended up with Jones because he was the best option left. What has changed to make that any different now?
To be fair, why would any of those leave their clubs at the time?
Peterborough are a much better ran club and been better than us at football in the last decade for around 8 of those years. He also probably has a good relationship with the owner, despite the dismissals.
Stockport are on the up, Challinor probably didn't want to leave a club where he's really built something, especially to a bang average team like us.
And Buckingham probably knew that if he was patient, a better run club who are better at football would come along and swoop him up.
Peterborough, Oxford and Stockport, all better run clubs than us, all far better at football. It is what it is.
I don't believe there's a single person left who has faith in Nathan Jones based on the football we are seeing, it's solely because of his Luton times.
But that's my point, what's changed? What manager would come in now to what appears to be a poisoned chalice?
Nothing, we are s**t and have leeches everywhere in the club.
I was mainly saying there's no harm in getting rejected by those managers, as they had better hands on them at the time.
Based on what I've seen so far, I refuse to believe that out of two hundred thousand qualified football coaches, that not one of them could serve up better football. It's lazy by the owners and people making the big decisions to think otherwise.
Same as the players, signing absolute horses**t season after season. Where are the people in house with football knowledge. It's a joke.
To be honest I think “leeches everywhere in the club” is actually totally wrong. Please can you tell me who or at least where these parasitic worms are sucking the blood out of the club.
Well that's one of the problems, where do you start when there's so much to be accounted for over the years.
Whoever thought it was a good idea to appoint Appleton, whoever sanctions the woeful signings we make for starters. Some of these players are leeches, but that's nothing new we have had that issue for going on 15 years.
Whoever gave the go ahead for bloody half and half Wrexham scarves.
To answer your question with another question, could you honestly state a bunch of positives around the club right now? Like who are the positive figures who can make a genuine impact for this club in the mid-term future.
Of course there will be good people in the club, but as far as the people in the positions who can actually have an influence on the direction of this club, where are the positives? Who do you think is a valuable asset to us?
So incompetent and poor performers but no leeches.
Well, a leech by definition is 'a person who takes advantage of others for their own benefit, often without giving anything in return'.
I'd say if you're telling fans that we have a top budget, are wanting promotion and fans can expect to see a team to be proud of, while being paid to do so, as we sit 14th being a pile of s**t, it's fair enough to call those people making these statements leeches.
You can be pedantic, but that's what they are to me until I see our club look like one to be proud of again.
You still haven’t addressed Leeches everywhere in the club. I’m guessing you’re alluding to Methven and Scott but don’t have to bottle to say it.
The bottle? I've been vocal since they got through the door that I don't trust them. Until I start seeing our club move in the right direction, that stance won't change. If it ever does, I'll put my hands up and say I was wrong, as I always will.
I said on Charlton Live they're chancers, which I apologised to Louis for as I understand that's a more professional platform, I challenged his (Charlie Methvens) bulls**t at Bromley Addicks while being as peaceful as possible, and I've said multiple times on other people's videos and on here that we are going nowhere with them making decisions. I still stand by that as the evidence is overwhelmingly against them at previous clubs.
There's also this:
If I don't think you have Charltons best interests at heart, I will speak my mind. Question my bloody minerals mate
The thing is, he'll be delighted with how we played yesterday. The way we went long with bodies around the strikers to play off the second balls, and then pressed is exactly how he wants us to play. Other than scoring more goals, I don't think there's much he would change. Someone said the NTT20 blokes called it 'sufferball' and it really is, but nobody is suffering more than us.
Going direct and then playing off the second balls isn't necessarily a bad thing. It worked extremely well for Bolton, albeit knocking on for 30 years ago now (gulp!). The problem is we are not showing as having the players to make it work right now. Bolton went long to Kevin Davis and fed off the scraps, but the players feeding off the scraps were people like Jay Jay Okocha and Djorkaeff. It was agricultural to get the ball into the final third, but once they had the ball in there they could "play". We currently totally lack those players who can "play".
Something about Rodwell in interviews really gives me bad vibes. Smugness maybe?
He's not very popular among Boston United, Scunthorpe, or Sunderland fans. Can't remember if Peterborough fans also have issues with him.
If you do enough digging online, and check other message boards, you'll find a fair few negative comments about him.
Never got a good vibe from him, similar to Matt Southall.
As one Sunderland fan put it, football must be one of the only careers where you can be incompetent, but still land yourself another job. The fit and proper persons test is a farce.
I think it's way too early to be thinking about ditching Jones tbh. Just for once I'd like to see what happens when we let a manager try to work through a problem, rather than just sacking them and hoping the next person in does better.
Just for comparison it's worth looking back at what Wycombe fans thought of Matt Bloomfield at the start of this year:
"I'm gobsmacked so many want to stick with him still. His record is awful, I want to say worst of anyone since we've been a league club, but I'm not sure, but can't be far off."
"I'm not vociferously Bloomfield Out but if there was a magic button to get rid of home without any financial drama, then I'd press it. It's not even the results for me, it's the tedious nature of the football... Previous managers have gone for lesser losing runs and entertainment reasons."
Their board stuck with him and now they're top of the table and the top goal-scorers in the division. He's on a 5-game winning streak and being linked with jobs in the Championship.
Fans always talk about style of football and how much it matters when their team isn't winning but in reality no-one actually cares if you're winning games.
If we were winning under Jones everyone would be loving the "passion, commitment and work rate" and forgetting the rest.
It's no coincidence that the last time people say they enjoyed watching Charlton was in 2019 under Bowyer and before that 2012 under Powell.
Neither of them were or are tactical geniuses - ask fans of other clubs they managed about their tactics and they'll tell you it was poor, because they didn't win.
Ultimately, win games and every football fan can trick themselves into believing the football is good.
I think it's way too early to be thinking about ditching Jones tbh. Just for once I'd like to see what happens when we let a manager try to work through a problem, rather than just sacking them and hoping the next person in does better.
Just for comparison it's worth looking back at what Wycombe fans thought of Matt Bloomfield at the start of this year:
"I'm gobsmacked so many want to stick with him still. His record is awful, I want to say worst of anyone since we've been a league club, but I'm not sure, but can't be far off."
"I'm not vociferously Bloomfield Out but if there was a magic button to get rid of home without any financial drama, then I'd press it. It's not even the results for me, it's the tedious nature of the football... Previous managers have gone for lesser losing runs and entertainment reasons."
Their board stuck with him and now they're top of the table and the top goal-scorers in the division. He's on a 5-game winning streak and being linked with jobs in the Championship.
Fans always talk about style of football and how much it matters when their team isn't winning but in reality no-one actually cares if you're winning games.
If we were winning under Jones everyone would be loving the "passion, commitment and work rate" and forgetting the rest.
It's no coincidence that the last time people say they enjoyed watching Charlton was in 2019 under Bowyer and before that 2012 under Powell.
Neither of them were or are tactical geniuses - ask fans of other clubs they managed about their tactics and they'll tell you it was poor, because they didn't win.
Ultimately, win games and every football fan can trick themselves into believing the football is good.
It's a results business. The rest is fluff. Few managers who consistently win games get sacked, and we'd be looking at their track records begging them to come to us.
I think it's way too early to be thinking about ditching Jones tbh. Just for once I'd like to see what happens when we let a manager try to work through a problem, rather than just sacking them and hoping the next person in does better.
Just for comparison it's worth looking back at what Wycombe fans thought of Matt Bloomfield at the start of this year:
"I'm gobsmacked so many want to stick with him still. His record is awful, I want to say worst of anyone since we've been a league club, but I'm not sure, but can't be far off."
"I'm not vociferously Bloomfield Out but if there was a magic button to get rid of home without any financial drama, then I'd press it. It's not even the results for me, it's the tedious nature of the football... Previous managers have gone for lesser losing runs and entertainment reasons."
Their board stuck with him and now they're top of the table and the top goal-scorers in the division. He's on a 5-game winning streak and being linked with jobs in the Championship.
Fans always talk about style of football and how much it matters when their team isn't winning but in reality no-one actually cares if you're winning games.
If we were winning under Jones everyone would be loving the "passion, commitment and work rate" and forgetting the rest.
It's no coincidence that the last time people say they enjoyed watching Charlton was in 2019 under Bowyer and before that 2012 under Powell.
Neither of them were or are tactical geniuses - ask fans of other clubs they managed about their tactics and they'll tell you it was poor, because they didn't win.
Ultimately, win games and every football fan can trick themselves into believing the football is good.
I'm not sure. Look at Derby, their fans were complaining about the manager and tactics all season. And they got promoted - their fans would say without ever really playing that well.
The football can be bad but the performances can still be good. If the team is hoofing it up but creating a lot, then it's much more tolerable.
One of the worst performances in living memory last night and the gaffer thought it was ‘positive’ …
Absolutely ridiculous!! I’m not a NJ out subscriber as I think we need stability that is why I’m preying he can find a way within himself to quit trying to play goofball because unless he does we will lose more games than we win and then he will be sacked
I think it's way too early to be thinking about ditching Jones tbh. Just for once I'd like to see what happens when we let a manager try to work through a problem, rather than just sacking them and hoping the next person in does better.
Just for comparison it's worth looking back at what Wycombe fans thought of Matt Bloomfield at the start of this year:
"I'm gobsmacked so many want to stick with him still. His record is awful, I want to say worst of anyone since we've been a league club, but I'm not sure, but can't be far off."
"I'm not vociferously Bloomfield Out but if there was a magic button to get rid of home without any financial drama, then I'd press it. It's not even the results for me, it's the tedious nature of the football... Previous managers have gone for lesser losing runs and entertainment reasons."
Their board stuck with him and now they're top of the table and the top goal-scorers in the division. He's on a 5-game winning streak and being linked with jobs in the Championship.
Fans always talk about style of football and how much it matters when their team isn't winning but in reality no-one actually cares if you're winning games.
If we were winning under Jones everyone would be loving the "passion, commitment and work rate" and forgetting the rest.
It's no coincidence that the last time people say they enjoyed watching Charlton was in 2019 under Bowyer and before that 2012 under Powell.
Neither of them were or are tactical geniuses - ask fans of other clubs they managed about their tactics and they'll tell you it was poor, because they didn't win.
Ultimately, win games and every football fan can trick themselves into believing the football is good.
You might have had a point, but the simple fact is that we won last night and no-one was saying they didn't care about the style of play. Sure, winning sugar coats a bitter pill but if the football is boring it will remain boring whatever the result.
I think it's way too early to be thinking about ditching Jones tbh. Just for once I'd like to see what happens when we let a manager try to work through a problem, rather than just sacking them and hoping the next person in does better.
Just for comparison it's worth looking back at what Wycombe fans thought of Matt Bloomfield at the start of this year:
"I'm gobsmacked so many want to stick with him still. His record is awful, I want to say worst of anyone since we've been a league club, but I'm not sure, but can't be far off."
"I'm not vociferously Bloomfield Out but if there was a magic button to get rid of home without any financial drama, then I'd press it. It's not even the results for me, it's the tedious nature of the football... Previous managers have gone for lesser losing runs and entertainment reasons."
Their board stuck with him and now they're top of the table and the top goal-scorers in the division. He's on a 5-game winning streak and being linked with jobs in the Championship.
Fans always talk about style of football and how much it matters when their team isn't winning but in reality no-one actually cares if you're winning games.
If we were winning under Jones everyone would be loving the "passion, commitment and work rate" and forgetting the rest.
It's no coincidence that the last time people say they enjoyed watching Charlton was in 2019 under Bowyer and before that 2012 under Powell.
Neither of them were or are tactical geniuses - ask fans of other clubs they managed about their tactics and they'll tell you it was poor, because they didn't win.
Ultimately, win games and every football fan can trick themselves into believing the football is good.
I recall a fair few fans on here complaining about the style of play when we won our first three games of the season, AFKA touched on it in a post recently as well and got dozens of likes for it.
I was massively excited when Jones was appointed and was willing to deal with last season's style of play as a means to an end and a quick fix to get us safe, expecting this summer to be about building a side to play a more attractive and expansive style of football. Alas I think the football has got even worse and these major signings with championship reputations and big experience just haven't panned out at all. I'll give him Alex Mitchell, Edwards and Godden as summer arrivals that have at least shown they'll be good signings.
I just don't know where this goes - he's too stubborn to change the style of play , i don't expect us to suddenly be a buccaneering 433 with Dixon and TC flanking Leaburn as we pass teams off the pitch with 40 pass moves but the current style of play is some of the worst I've seen. I also wonder how long his methods will last with the players before they suss him out like Southampton and Stoke did.
I really don't want to be back on the managerial merry-go-round again because it makes the club look like a laughing stock but Jones has to turn this around and fast. If Jones doesn't turn this around then I expect Scott and Rodwell to go with him because it's been a complete disaster recruitment wise both managerially and on the player front.
We ended up with Appleton and Jones because we’re already a laughing stock. No decent manager will touch us. We need to to get rid of Scott, Rodwell and Methven, otherwise it’s going to be the same disastrous recruitment and washed up, desperate managers.
One of the worst performances in living memory last night and the gaffer thought it was ‘positive’ …
This is why people need to realise it’s not possible for Jones to change or adapt. So he’s not the person to commit to in terms of stopping this cycle of sacking.
I think it's way too early to be thinking about ditching Jones tbh. Just for once I'd like to see what happens when we let a manager try to work through a problem, rather than just sacking them and hoping the next person in does better.
Just for comparison it's worth looking back at what Wycombe fans thought of Matt Bloomfield at the start of this year:
"I'm gobsmacked so many want to stick with him still. His record is awful, I want to say worst of anyone since we've been a league club, but I'm not sure, but can't be far off."
"I'm not vociferously Bloomfield Out but if there was a magic button to get rid of home without any financial drama, then I'd press it. It's not even the results for me, it's the tedious nature of the football... Previous managers have gone for lesser losing runs and entertainment reasons."
Their board stuck with him and now they're top of the table and the top goal-scorers in the division. He's on a 5-game winning streak and being linked with jobs in the Championship.
Fans always talk about style of football and how much it matters when their team isn't winning but in reality no-one actually cares if you're winning games.
If we were winning under Jones everyone would be loving the "passion, commitment and work rate" and forgetting the rest.
It's no coincidence that the last time people say they enjoyed watching Charlton was in 2019 under Bowyer and before that 2012 under Powell.
Neither of them were or are tactical geniuses - ask fans of other clubs they managed about their tactics and they'll tell you it was poor, because they didn't win.
Ultimately, win games and every football fan can trick themselves into believing the football is good.
I recall a fair few fans on here complaining about the style of play when we won our first three games of the season, AFKA touched on it in a post recently as well and got dozens of likes for it.
You must be misremembering… the entire forum was buzzing after our third win of the season - citing exactly the things I called out. Desire, commitment, hard work…
I think it's way too early to be thinking about ditching Jones tbh. Just for once I'd like to see what happens when we let a manager try to work through a problem, rather than just sacking them and hoping the next person in does better.
Just for comparison it's worth looking back at what Wycombe fans thought of Matt Bloomfield at the start of this year:
"I'm gobsmacked so many want to stick with him still. His record is awful, I want to say worst of anyone since we've been a league club, but I'm not sure, but can't be far off."
"I'm not vociferously Bloomfield Out but if there was a magic button to get rid of home without any financial drama, then I'd press it. It's not even the results for me, it's the tedious nature of the football... Previous managers have gone for lesser losing runs and entertainment reasons."
Their board stuck with him and now they're top of the table and the top goal-scorers in the division. He's on a 5-game winning streak and being linked with jobs in the Championship.
Fans always talk about style of football and how much it matters when their team isn't winning but in reality no-one actually cares if you're winning games.
If we were winning under Jones everyone would be loving the "passion, commitment and work rate" and forgetting the rest.
It's no coincidence that the last time people say they enjoyed watching Charlton was in 2019 under Bowyer and before that 2012 under Powell.
Neither of them were or are tactical geniuses - ask fans of other clubs they managed about their tactics and they'll tell you it was poor, because they didn't win.
Ultimately, win games and every football fan can trick themselves into believing the football is good.
I recall a fair few fans on here complaining about the style of play when we won our first three games of the season, AFKA touched on it in a post recently as well and got dozens of likes for it.
You must be misremembering… the entire forum was buzzing after our third win of the season - citing exactly the things I called out. Desire, commitment, hard work…
Not exactly true. You’ve picked out the Bolton game, which was our “better” performance and against one of the divisions overwhelming favourites so despite not controlling the game it felt like a great result to graft our way past them; I think everybody accepts you can’t play offensive football every single game and sometimes the ugly is required for a result.
However, there were many people questioning the football against both Wigan and Orient. I made posts comparing it to Southgate’s England and said I didn’t think we could succeed like this. Everyone around me at the Wigan game was sighing and going this is effing dire on 70 mins until we nicked the goal.
You’re right for most , and me, winning is the key thing, but the point is it is extremely rare to win/succeed over long term/ a whole season if you are playing shite.
One of the worst performances in living memory last night and the gaffer thought it was ‘positive’ …
It might have been pony but he is the manager of a team that just won their first game for a while and a team that are clearly low on confidence. What do you expect him to say; they were shit, we are shit, the football is dull and we were lucky to scrape through against the worst team in L1 history?
Any sensible manager will always put a positive spin on a win.
It was way more naive of him to call out fans after the Birmingham victory and remove the focus from the win than for him to put a positive spin on a won game.
Happens with every manager when the crowd start to turn, fans tune in to pick holes in the post match conference no matter what is said.
I'm not a Jones fan but some of the comments about him are getting a bit personal and tedious imo. Successful or not the guy obviously cares and does his best.
I think it's way too early to be thinking about ditching Jones tbh. Just for once I'd like to see what happens when we let a manager try to work through a problem, rather than just sacking them and hoping the next person in does better.
Just for comparison it's worth looking back at what Wycombe fans thought of Matt Bloomfield at the start of this year:
"I'm gobsmacked so many want to stick with him still. His record is awful, I want to say worst of anyone since we've been a league club, but I'm not sure, but can't be far off."
"I'm not vociferously Bloomfield Out but if there was a magic button to get rid of home without any financial drama, then I'd press it. It's not even the results for me, it's the tedious nature of the football... Previous managers have gone for lesser losing runs and entertainment reasons."
Their board stuck with him and now they're top of the table and the top goal-scorers in the division. He's on a 5-game winning streak and being linked with jobs in the Championship.
Fans always talk about style of football and how much it matters when their team isn't winning but in reality no-one actually cares if you're winning games.
If we were winning under Jones everyone would be loving the "passion, commitment and work rate" and forgetting the rest.
It's no coincidence that the last time people say they enjoyed watching Charlton was in 2019 under Bowyer and before that 2012 under Powell.
Neither of them were or are tactical geniuses - ask fans of other clubs they managed about their tactics and they'll tell you it was poor, because they didn't win.
Ultimately, win games and every football fan can trick themselves into believing the football is good.
I recall a fair few fans on here complaining about the style of play when we won our first three games of the season, AFKA touched on it in a post recently as well and got dozens of likes for it.
You must be misremembering… the entire forum was buzzing after our third win of the season - citing exactly the things I called out. Desire, commitment, hard work…
Try reading the match thread rather than the post match thread and you'll find that there were plenty of dissenting voices. People revise their opinions post-match to take account of the result, but that does not mean that they are satisfied whilst watching.
Retrospectively, most people aren't too bothered if we win. In the moment, they absolutely are.
One of the worst performances in living memory last night and the gaffer thought it was ‘positive’ …
It might have been pony but he is the manager of a team that just won their first game for a while and a team that are clearly low on confidence. What do you expect him to say; they were shit, we are shit, the football is dull and we were lucky to scrape through against the worst team in L1 history?
Any sensible manager will always put a positive spin on a win.
It was way more naive of him to call out fans after the Birmingham victory and remove the focus from the win than for him to put a positive spin on a won game.
Happens with every manager when the crowd start to turn, fans tune in to pick holes in the post match conference no matter what is said.
I'm not a Jones fan but some of the comments about him are getting a bit personal and tedious imo. Successful or not the guy obviously cares and does his best.
I agree he isn't going to come out and say it was shit but it would've been better if he'd just said something like 'i'm happy with the win but i know there are things we need to work on'.
His actual comment - "I didn’t mind too much about performance but I thought it was a positive performance. We’ve had 24 shots, 11 on target, five clear-cut chances. It’s a difficult place to come too as these are fighting for their lives." - kind of gives off the impression to anyone who didn't watch the game that we should've won it 4-0.
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The one seemingly surprising aspect of all of this is this is that Jones' early promotion sides were not that way inclined (Danny Hylton scored 21 goals in Jones' first season at the club albeit in League 2). Luton weren't promoted in his first season but the following year they were, finishing runners-up in scoring 94 goals. The very next season Luton made it back to back promotions although Jones left in the January to go to Stoke.
It is at Stoke that Jones' footballing philosophy appears to have changed. He lasted 10 months there with his side managing to win a very poor 6/38 matches and that included an unbeaten run of nine matches during which time they scored just five goals!!! He then went back to Luton where, in his first season, they finished 12th but scored less than a goal a game with just 41. In his second and only other full season second time round, Luton finished 6th but did so scoring 62 goals in 48 matches, losing in the two leg play-off to Huddersfield 2-1.
Jones left in November 2022 at which point Luton had managed 29 points in 20 games (1.45 points per game). It was under Rob Edwards that they were promoted, via the Play-Offs, having secured 51 points in 26 games (1.96 points per game) following Jones' departure. At Southampton Jones lasted just three months as they picked up 3/24 points during his tenure and scored just six goals in those eight matches and were relegated at the end of that season.
It appears that Jones in his second spell at Luton, then at Stoke and Southampton and now with us has tried to make his teams ones that don't concede, first and foremost. He wasn't given time to add a more attacking layer to that, if that was his intention in his last two jobs because those sides failed to keep clean sheets in the way that Parker has got Burnley to do. The debate is as to how long one allows things to carry on as they are but, with that constant revolving door of managers, perhaps we should take stock at the end of the season?
The whole time we aren't realistically facing relegation i say keep him to the summer at least just as a point of pragmatism, it doesnt really work changing in the middle or before end of the season. Who realistically would we get and also gives the new manager the chance to come in and make his own changes, we have seen time and time again a manager comes in and decides some players arent for him but he cant get rid of them in the summer and it create a poor morale which effects the team on the pitch.
Just for comparison it's worth looking back at what Wycombe fans thought of Matt Bloomfield at the start of this year:
"I'm gobsmacked so many want to stick with him still. His record is awful, I want to say worst of anyone since we've been a league club, but I'm not sure, but can't be far off."
"I'm not vociferously Bloomfield Out but if there was a magic button to get rid of home without any financial drama, then I'd press it. It's not even the results for me, it's the tedious nature of the football... Previous managers have gone for lesser losing runs and entertainment reasons."
Their board stuck with him and now they're top of the table and the top goal-scorers in the division. He's on a 5-game winning streak and being linked with jobs in the Championship.
https://gasroom.org/discussion/8648/bloomfield-out/p2
https://gasroom.org/discussion/8648/bloomfield-out/p3
I said on Charlton Live they're chancers, which I apologised to Louis for as I understand that's a more professional platform, I challenged his (Charlie Methvens) bulls**t at Bromley Addicks while being as peaceful as possible, and I've said multiple times on other people's videos and on here that we are going nowhere with them making decisions. I still stand by that as the evidence is overwhelmingly against them at previous clubs.
There's also this:
If I don't think you have Charltons best interests at heart, I will speak my mind. Question my bloody minerals mate
If you do enough digging online, and check other message boards, you'll find a fair few negative comments about him.
Never got a good vibe from him, similar to Matt Southall.
As one Sunderland fan put it, football must be one of the only careers where you can be incompetent, but still land yourself another job. The fit and proper persons test is a farce.
If we were winning under Jones everyone would be loving the "passion, commitment and work rate" and forgetting the rest.
It's no coincidence that the last time people say they enjoyed watching Charlton was in 2019 under Bowyer and before that 2012 under Powell.
Neither of them were or are tactical geniuses - ask fans of other clubs they managed about their tactics and they'll tell you it was poor, because they didn't win.
Ultimately, win games and every football fan can trick themselves into believing the football is good.
The football can be bad but the performances can still be good. If the team is hoofing it up but creating a lot, then it's much more tolerable.
People don’t care. If you win.
https://forum.charltonlife.com/discussion/98453/post-match-thread-charlton-athletic-v-bolton-wanderers-saturday-24th-august-2024-ko-15-00/p1
However, there were many people questioning the football against both Wigan and Orient. I made posts comparing it to Southgate’s England and said I didn’t think we could succeed like this. Everyone around me at the Wigan game was sighing and going this is effing dire on 70 mins until we nicked the goal.
It might have been pony but he is the manager of a team that just won their first game for a while and a team that are clearly low on confidence. What do you expect him to say; they were shit, we are shit, the football is dull and we were lucky to scrape through against the worst team in L1 history?
Any sensible manager will always put a positive spin on a win.
It was way more naive of him to call out fans after the Birmingham victory and remove the focus from the win than for him to put a positive spin on a won game.
Happens with every manager when the crowd start to turn, fans tune in to pick holes in the post match conference no matter what is said.
I'm not a Jones fan but some of the comments about him are getting a bit personal and tedious imo. Successful or not the guy obviously cares and does his best.
Retrospectively, most people aren't too bothered if we win. In the moment, they absolutely are.
https://forum.charltonlife.com/discussion/98413/match-thread-charlton-athletic-v-leyton-orient-saturday-17th-august-2024-ko-12-30/p10
His actual comment - "I didn’t mind too much about performance but I thought it was a positive performance. We’ve had 24 shots, 11 on target, five clear-cut chances. It’s a difficult place to come too as these are fighting for their lives." - kind of gives off the impression to anyone who didn't watch the game that we should've won it 4-0.