Love Bowyer and think he will turn it round just need the platform of a solid defence back and we will start winning again ridiculous to talk about getting rid of him COYR
Who would we get in though ? karel Freye? Jose Riga? Guy Luzon? Russel Slade? Bob Peters? Karl the Bin Dipper?
Who is out there that would come to a third division club and could do a better job with the current wage caps etc?
I say give Bow this transfer window and see where we are at seasons end.
I'd welcome Jose Riga back. Just seemed to keep things simple for the players (like Curbishley and Lawrence did) and seemed very calm.
But if LB is to continue, he just needs to make us as solid as he can and hope that Schwartz can nick us a goal here and there for a couple of much-needed 1-0's
Bowyers comments last night with regards to Maddison’s injury were utterly outrageous and one of the worst things I can ever remember a CAFC manager saying.
To me he has the subconscious desire to turn the squad of players into replicas of him.
Yes he was a fine player (no he wasn’t as good as he probably thinks - 1 England cap?)... but his game was based on aggression and hard work. We don’t need 11 clones - we need a mix.
When you consider his make up as a human being off the pitch (allegations of racial abuse, assaulting fast food staff, fighting team mates on the pitch) we should perhaps not be surprised that the human relations side of management is now proving a step too far.
Have had issue with Bowyers selections and player positions last month or so, but yesterday’s team was much better and the loss for this one was on the players.
HOWEVER, you cannot come out and say you don't care if one of your players is seriously injured.
You expect your players to go out and play for you and you then say that ? wouldn’t be surprised if we hear of reports of the team expressing their unease as such comments
The team was better and probably requires tweaking. Morgan didn't work in that formation for some reason. JFC was ok. Against Rochdale I'd put Williams in for Morgan and start Aneke. We need to allow them to build some understanding. Gilbey isn't there yet, but I think he is getting closer.
It’s the emotional, ill-thought, post match comments from Bowyer that I’m finding increasingly hard to look past.
Bad performances and runs of form are forgivable - that’s football.
The comments we’re seeing/hearing week after week at the moment, however, are serving no other purpose than to put another nail in the coffin of his future and our season each time they’re made.
You can turnaround a season if you’ve got the players and fans on board. You can’t turn a season around publicly pushing fans and players under the bus, whilst taking no responsibility yourself.
The squad is not good enough, simple as that. I would imagine Bowyer has lost it a lot over the past year and I don’t blame him. He probably finds it hard to except that players cannot do the things he found easy to do. After all he played at level this squad will never get close to. I doubt Bowyer was all that optimistic with the players before we were rid of the previous owners. He was able to bring a few in but again with the salary cap I doubt he would have been jumping for joy. With an owner who clearly wants success I think we have allowed ourselves to dream a little more than we should, I certainly find it frustrating to watch players not do the simple stuff. Maybe Bowyer should be a better than that in interviews but he is clearly frustrated by the same basic mistakes each game. I’d be happy to just get this season over and draw a line under things. A proper pre-season with a rethink of the playing staff like Chris Powell did a few years back.
Have we improved this season? No, albeit with whats gone on he gets a bit of credit but with the players we have at our disposal we should be at least competitive
Who would we get in though ? karel Freye? Jose Riga? Guy Luzon? Russel Slade? Bob Peters? Karl the Bin Dipper?
Who is out there that would come to a third division club and could do a better job with the current wage caps etc?
I say give Bow this transfer window and see where we are at seasons end.
I'd welcome Jose Riga back. Just seemed to keep things simple for the players (like Curbishley and Lawrence did) and seemed very calm.
But if LB is to continue, he just needs to make us as solid as he can and hope that Schwartz can nick us a goal here and there for a couple of much-needed 1-0's
I liked Jose, but he’s very tainted by association with Roland - no thanks.
The question is do we wait till the end of the season with Bowyer and fail to go up and then get in a new manager or do we do do something now ?
I don’t think TS will do the latter but you never know ?
Agree, I don’t think TS will. That being said, we shouldn’t think that just because Sandgaard comes across as this fun, big hearted almost philanthropic type of bloke that he will put up with nonsense. He’s a successful businessman and I doubt he got that way by suffering fools gladly, particularly if it impacts his business plan.
Bowyer isn't the brightest bloke in the world and his limited vocabulary hinders him when talking to the press. This is exaggerated when he can not express himself as he would would like in times such as yesterday when he is frustrated. He sounded like a moody 14 year old (on a bad day). We are setting him up for a fall if asking him to talk to Valley Pass after every game.
For what it's worth. Maddison is a wrongun. His negative influence on the team (particular those on the periphery of the first 11) and challenge to Bowyer's authority on a daily basis has weakened Bowyer's position. It was an error to bring him to the club.
Maddison is rotten to the core and how Bowyer untangles the situation and gets him out of the club or at least away from effecting the first team will be crucial to Bowyer getting the team cohesion somewhere near good enough to win games again.
I'm assuming this is based on inside knowledge (not being sarcastic btw, found your post interesting/intriguing).
Do you mean periphery of the first six, as no-one, not least the manager seems to have a clue who the first 11 are!!
Think he is just thinking too much. Perhaps because of his character trying to prove he knows best by changing the team members and formation to surprise / bring awe.
Just stick to a formation and decide on best XI. Learn from Lincoln, Accrington etc. Everyone is saying it including Curbs.
Last night from Bowyer was pure frustration. The Pearce mistake was shocking for a player of his experience. If my son did that playing u16s football as a centre half he would get it in the ear from me all week. Not good enough indeed. Accrington are a good side and to go 1-0 down to them with our current confidence level it was always going to be tough. But Maddison is a tough one. We all said on here how we dodged a bullet when he went to Hull. Nothing has changed. Very gifted footballer but he has issues. Bowyer is too honest and that was pure frustration coming out. But it is unprofessional and does not do him any favours?
Saying he doesn’t care about a players injury is a step too far. Maybe lockdown has had a bad effect on his mental health as his post match comments have been strange lately.
The question is do we wait till the end of the season with Bowyer and fail to go up and then get in a new manager or do we do do something now ?
I don’t think TS will do the latter but you never know ?
Agree, I don’t think TS will. That being said, we shouldn’t think that just because Sandgaard comes across as this fun, big hearted almost philanthropic type of bloke that he will put up with nonsense. He’s a successful businessman and I doubt he got that way by suffering fools gladly, particularly if it impacts his business plan.
TS has gone (for him) very quiet on social media. Like others, I think if we lose on Tuesday, TS will have to make a change to save the season. The salary cap is stunting his ambition and he wants to get out of this League at the first attempt. For the first time, sadly, I think Bowyer is no longer the manager to take us up.
I see the love for Bowyer as a home grown lad, but all this he has been loyal that I read, is a bit mystifying. When he took the managers job,it was on a poor salary, not disclosed, But, let’s assume it was what ever he was earning in his coaching role plus a little. Poor would be what £50,000 to £80,000. When he finally signed it was made public knowledge and LB HIMSELF said he got a X 6 increase in salary. So even taking the worse of £50,000, that puts him on £300,000 minimum There is no other manager being paid that in league 1.
If he is being paid like the best manager in this league, he needs to start showing the reason why. Because the evidence is that he clearly is not. And if I hear once more that Inniss &Famewo are the only reasons we are not table toppers, I will implode.
I think the feelings at the moment are heightened by the current situation we find ourselves in as individuals with covid, I don't know about you lot, but football is and was my day/evening away from shit, almost my escape.
We can only watch from a distance and have no sway or cant vent at a game or meet our mates and vent after a game over a pint etc....
Totally agree. I live alone and see very few people. Charlton games are my only real look forward to at the moment. How can I look forward to this dross and disappointment every week. I’m sure I’m not alone in saying that our team has become more important to me than at anytime in recent years, and what have we got. Basically the footballing equivalent of long COVID.
On paper we might have good players but are they the right characters? I would like Bowyer to be given a full summer transfer window to rebuild the squad, this season is a write off for me now.
Maybe i’m a bit spoilt but i’m tired of hearing at least we have a club to support. Does that mean we have to accept the utter dross on the pitch at the moment? And we were always unlikely to go bust In reality
I posted this in the match thread but probably more relevant here.
Most results come down to small margins and we have so many issues at the moment that it’s not surprising we’re struggling.
We don’t have a settled team, formation and style of play. Some reasons for this include:
1. Too many players who aren’t fit enough to play regularly. Look back at promotion winning squad and you’ll find several players made 30/40+ league starts.
2. Creative players who aren’t trusted so they never get a run of games, we’ll never see the best of them which is needed to develop that settled style of play. Williams and Maddison are both 27, they’re not going to drastically improve the defensive side of their game.
3. A manager more concerned with stopping the opposition. In the past Bowyer’s tweaks were effective. Now he looks like he’s trying to stumble upon something that works - we seem to be switching between a diamond, 3-5-2, 4-3-3 and 4-4-2 with each game. At least it looked like a much more normal line up last night, no Matthews at left back or Maatsen at right midfield.
4. Injuries to key players - Inniss, Famewo, Shinnie and Doughty. The original plan was to mainly use 4-3-3 - Pratley and Watson in front of Inniss and Famewo made us very hard to break down and strong defensively. Doughty gave us a pacey outlet which meant we could either get in behind teams if they pushed up or it would create space for us if they sat deeper. Fewer injuries or injuries to different players would have seen us stick with this plan and things could have been very different. Any club would find it harder with four important players out.
5. Players not wanted by the manager. It’s become clear JFC and Williams took up their optional contract extensions rather than Bowyer choosing to keep them. He’d also sell Oshilaja if he could and despite signing him I’m sure he’d happily get rid of Bogle too. There may be more on the list that aren’t so obvious, Purrington for example. Last night he talked about wanting to shake it up - the players must have known that and it can’t help them put in their maximum for the club and Bowyer.
6. All of the above means the chances and goals are drying up. We created some chances last night but how many were ones you’d expect to score, rather than those you’d expect a goalkeeper to save? With Inniss out we also don’t threaten enough from set pieces, he’s either our target or a player who the opposition focus on which creates space for others.
7. We’re now on a long poor run of form, the players know it. At 2-0 down I had given up and knew we weren’t coming back. The players aren’t looking confident and happy, and I don’t see Bowyer regularly criticising individuals in public helping that.
We have 26 games to scrape together 20 or so points to ensure we’re in this league as a minimum next season.
With the contract situation and five loans we’ll have another huge rebuild in the summer. Hopefully the last major one for many years. I’d even seriously consider letting good players like Aneke go because he doesn’t appear capable of playing 90 minutes, never mind making 40+ starts over a season.
I’m sure there will be a lot more improvements behind the scenes to resolve some of the issues - reducing injuries, expanding our scouting network to look at more players etc which will all help.
Thinking ahead to next season Sandgaard has a big decision to make that I feel is best made over the next few weeks, either:
1. Bowyer is the right man and simply doesn’t have a good enough squad, including too many players who know they’re only here until the summer. I wouldn’t completely write him off, on the other hand he may need to accept that with the salary cap it’s very difficult to find quality attacking and creative players who also work hard, are very fit and don’t mind a tackle.
2. Get a new manager in so he has time to evaluate the squad and make plans for next season. Leaving it until May is far too late and will see yet another squad scraped together right up until deadline day, much like we saw this season and under Slade.
Whatever happens in the summer the plan has got be to see a squad put together just like we did in 2011, with the majority on 2/3 year contracts.
That squad had a great balance - a core of solid reliable players for this league (Jackson, Taylor, Hollands, Hayes), younger players on the up (Wiggins, Stepehens, Green, Evina), good undervalued players needing a move to rebuild their careers (Kermorgant, Morrison, Cort), include any academy players ready to step up (Solly, Wagstaff) and the odd experienced player as cover and as a good character around the squad (Hughes, Euell).
We don’t have that anything like that at the moment and it’s not going to be put together in this window.
I think TS has to ask gallen and gedy??? The following question
has lee lost the dressing room
if the answer is yes, he has no alternative but to bring on someone else
if the answer is no, then I think he will give bowyer until the end of the season
Totally agree. Despite what Bowyer said last night about Maddison, if he hasn't lost the dressing room I'd like to see him given a bit more time too. But if he has he has to go because you don't successfully turn that round.
Comments
But if LB is to continue, he just needs to make us as solid as he can and hope that Schwartz can nick us a goal here and there for a couple of much-needed 1-0's
Yes he was a fine player (no he wasn’t as good as he probably thinks - 1 England cap?)... but his game was based on aggression and hard work. We don’t need 11 clones - we need a mix.
When you consider his make up as a human being off the pitch (allegations of racial abuse, assaulting fast food staff, fighting team mates on the pitch) we should perhaps not be surprised that the human relations side of management is now proving a step too far.
He has to go.
The comments we’re seeing/hearing week after week at the moment, however, are serving no other purpose than to put another nail in the coffin of his future and our season each time they’re made.
I doubt Bowyer was all that optimistic with the players before we were rid of the previous owners. He was able to bring a few in but again with the salary cap I doubt he would have been jumping for joy.
With an owner who clearly wants success I think we have allowed ourselves to dream a little more than we should, I certainly find it frustrating to watch players not do the simple stuff. Maybe Bowyer should be a better than that in interviews but he is clearly frustrated by the same basic mistakes each game.
I’d be happy to just get this season over and draw a line under things. A proper pre-season with a rethink of the playing staff like Chris Powell did a few years back.
Whether that includes Jackson as well I am not sure.
I think another poor performance on Tuesday evening and it is probably the end.
Purrington - league one/championship
Maatsen - Premier League academy
Matthews - international football
Gunter - international football
Watson - championship
Shinnie - league one winner/championship
Gilbey - league one POTY
Williams - international football
Washington - international football/SFPL
Smyth - championship club
Bogle - league one/league two
Will people stop saying we have a weak squad. Every player has been successful at this level, or as played at a level above.
Accrington have a striker from non league who bullied us last night ffs.
Do you mean periphery of the first six, as no-one, not least the manager seems to have a clue who the first 11 are!!
Everyone is saying it including Curbs.
Accrington are a good side and to go 1-0 down to them with our current confidence level it was always going to be tough.
But Maddison is a tough one. We all said on here how we dodged a bullet when he went to Hull. Nothing has changed. Very gifted footballer but he has issues. Bowyer is too honest and that was pure frustration coming out. But it is unprofessional and does not do him any favours?
has lee lost the dressing room
if the answer is yes, he has no alternative but to bring on someone else
if the answer is no, then I think he will give bowyer until the end of the season
But its also worth remembering we've had our joint worst seasons in this tier since 1974 when we finished 13th in both 2011 and 2017
That was when Parkinson was replaced with Powell and Slade was replaced with Robinson mid-season
Its why Bowyer gets until the end of the season for me and doesnt just get a "he has until October" time frame as thats just weird
I think if Bowyer goes now, our season is done... Could argue our season is done now anyway!!
Simon Church was a Welsh international, so is Levit.
Most results come down to small margins and we have so many issues at the moment that it’s not surprising we’re struggling.
We don’t have a settled team, formation and style of play. Some reasons for this include:
1. Too many players who aren’t fit enough to play regularly. Look back at promotion winning squad and you’ll find several players made 30/40+ league starts.
3. A manager more concerned with stopping the opposition. In the past Bowyer’s tweaks were effective. Now he looks like he’s trying to stumble upon something that works - we seem to be switching between a diamond, 3-5-2, 4-3-3 and 4-4-2 with each game. At least it looked like a much more normal line up last night, no Matthews at left back or Maatsen at right midfield.
4. Injuries to key players - Inniss, Famewo, Shinnie and Doughty. The original plan was to mainly use 4-3-3 - Pratley and Watson in front of Inniss and Famewo made us very hard to break down and strong defensively. Doughty gave us a pacey outlet which meant we could either get in behind teams if they pushed up or it would create space for us if they sat deeper. Fewer injuries or injuries to different players would have seen us stick with this plan and things could have been very different. Any club would find it harder with four important players out.
5. Players not wanted by the manager. It’s become clear JFC and Williams took up their optional contract extensions rather than Bowyer choosing to keep them. He’d also sell Oshilaja if he could and despite signing him I’m sure he’d happily get rid of Bogle too. There may be more on the list that aren’t so obvious, Purrington for example. Last night he talked about wanting to shake it up - the players must have known that and it can’t help them put in their maximum for the club and Bowyer.
6. All of the above means the chances and goals are drying up. We created some chances last night but how many were ones you’d expect to score, rather than those you’d expect a goalkeeper to save? With Inniss out we also don’t threaten enough from set pieces, he’s either our target or a player who the opposition focus on which creates space for others.
7. We’re now on a long poor run of form, the players know it. At 2-0 down I had given up and knew we weren’t coming back. The players aren’t looking confident and happy, and I don’t see Bowyer regularly criticising individuals in public helping that.
We have 26 games to scrape together 20 or so points to ensure we’re in this league as a minimum next season.
With the contract situation and five loans we’ll have another huge rebuild in the summer. Hopefully the last major one for many years. I’d even seriously consider letting good players like Aneke go because he doesn’t appear capable of playing 90 minutes, never mind making 40+ starts over a season.
I’m sure there will be a lot more improvements behind the scenes to resolve some of the issues - reducing injuries, expanding our scouting network to look at more players etc which will all help.
Thinking ahead to next season Sandgaard has a big decision to make that I feel is best made over the next few weeks, either:
1. Bowyer is the right man and simply doesn’t have a good enough squad, including too many players who know they’re only here until the summer. I wouldn’t completely write him off, on the other hand he may need to accept that with the salary cap it’s very difficult to find quality attacking and creative players who also work hard, are very fit and don’t mind a tackle.
2. Get a new manager in so he has time to evaluate the squad and make plans for next season. Leaving it until May is far too late and will see yet another squad scraped together right up until deadline day, much like we saw this season and under Slade.
Whatever happens in the summer the plan has got be to see a squad put together just like we did in 2011, with the majority on 2/3 year contracts.
That squad had a great balance - a core of solid reliable players for this league (Jackson, Taylor, Hollands, Hayes), younger players on the up (Wiggins, Stepehens, Green, Evina), good undervalued players needing a move to rebuild their careers (Kermorgant, Morrison, Cort), include any academy players ready to step up (Solly, Wagstaff) and the odd experienced player as cover and as a good character around the squad (Hughes, Euell).
We don’t have that anything like that at the moment and it’s not going to be put together in this window.