Meanwhile, the execrable Rebecca Long-Bailey, the Shadow "Busines"s Minister was on the Today programme this morning. I can't link you to any clip. This tweet well explains why no such clip exists
I was quite happy to hear her though. It took me back to my Polytechnic days. Classic SWP student empty rhetoric and double-speak. "Kick art this Torree guvnment" etc, albeit in a Northern accent. Sorry @Cordoban Addick but this Labour front bench is utterly second-rate.
@PragueAddick . It's alright mate that cracking team of Lib Dem centrists will surely save the day.
Or we can have some kind of British Macron (Macgrath?) who can set up a centrist party as that all seems to be going swimmingly.
DUP firing a warning shot across Teresa Mays bow. With it seemingly now impossible to make tweaks and changes to the deal, it now seems certain that the DUP will vote against. Not sure how they can be bought this time. By the same token. The five cabinet brexiters who are supporting (ha ha) May but want her to change tack also now look like they can’t have the changes they seek re negotiated. What now from them ? Do they now jump ship because it’s obvious they don’t back the deal as is or hang in there against their convictions. Things are so fluid and changing almost by the minute. Will the fact that getting her deal through the house has just got harder have any impact on the wavering MP’s thinking of writing to the 1922 committee?
Meanwhile, the execrable Rebecca Long-Bailey, the Shadow "Busines"s Minister was on the Today programme this morning. I can't link you to any clip. This tweet well explains why no such clip exists
I was quite happy to hear her though. It took me back to my Polytechnic days. Classic SWP student empty rhetoric and double-speak. "Kick art this Torree guvnment" etc, albeit in a Northern accent. Sorry @Cordoban Addick but this Labour front bench is utterly second-rate.
@PragueAddick . It's alright mate that cracking team of Lib Dem centrists will surely save the day.
Or we can have some kind of British Macron (Macgrath?) who can set up a centrist party as that all seems to be going swimmingly.
I'm pretty certain if the electorate had woken up and voted Lib Dem, even at the last election, we wouldn't be in this world of shyte.
Historians will look back and shake their heads wondering why so many millions slept walked into voting for Corbyn and May when they could see what paltry nonsense was on offer and the weak party characters destined for office.
I'm wondering if this shower would have happened even if the Tories were still in a coalition with the lib Dems... I'm no fan of the coalition, but seeing everything that's happened since makes me long for those days
I'm wondering if this shower would have happened even if the Tories were still in a coalition with the lib Dems... I'm no fan of the coalition, but seeing everything that's happened since makes me long for those days
It's clear that Cameron expected to have to re-enter coalition after the 2015 election, and that that coalition would have stymied his fake negotiation and then referendum.
Sadly, he proved rather more successful than some of us would have liked.
That said, the coalition that the Lib Dems should have gone for in 2010 was with Labour - because Gordon Brown was more desperate, he was offering a bigger prize in committing to introduction of PR, rather than Cameron's weedy AV referendum.
Clegg was played (he should have learnt from Parliamentary history - the IPP under Parnell in particular).
Meanwhile, the execrable Rebecca Long-Bailey, the Shadow "Busines"s Minister was on the Today programme this morning. I can't link you to any clip. This tweet well explains why no such clip exists
I was quite happy to hear her though. It took me back to my Polytechnic days. Classic SWP student empty rhetoric and double-speak. "Kick art this Torree guvnment" etc, albeit in a Northern accent. Sorry @Cordoban Addick but this Labour front bench is utterly second-rate.
@PragueAddick . It's alright mate that cracking team of Lib Dem centrists will surely save the day.
Or we can have some kind of British Macron (Macgrath?) who can set up a centrist party as that all seems to be going swimmingly.
I'm pretty certain if the electorate had woken up and voted Lib Dem, even at the last election, we wouldn't be in this world of shyte.
Historians will look back and shake their heads wondering why so many millions slept walked into voting for Corbyn and May when they could see what paltry nonsense was on offer and the weak party characters destined for office.
The Lib Dems are like Danny Green, the longer they are on the sidelines the better they become.
I'm wondering if this shower would have happened even if the Tories were still in a coalition with the lib Dems... I'm no fan of the coalition, but seeing everything that's happened since makes me long for those days
The Lib Dems, saving us from the excesses of Tory party policy since errrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr never.
Watching the news tonight they are mentioning some sort of sign off summit on Sunday? Does that mean the withdrawal agreement is meant to be going through parliament this week? If so, what day?
I assume that people don't trust the Libdems enough to vote for them.
For me it’s not an issue of trust. I don’t trust any of them. The reality is that there can only be either a Conservative or Labour government and voting Lib Dem is like pissing in the wind.
I'm wondering if this shower would have happened even if the Tories were still in a coalition with the lib Dems... I'm no fan of the coalition, but seeing everything that's happened since makes me long for those days
The Lib Dems, saving us from the excesses of Tory party policy since errrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr never.
So which of these were Lib Dem initiatives and which were Tory, in your expert opinion? The allocation of 0.7% of GDP to International Development, both in practice and as law The raising of the Income Tax personal allowance from £6475 to £10,600 Steve Webb delivered the “triple lock” on the State Pension Nick Clegg saw through the pupil premium of (eventually) £1320 per primary school child and £935 for secondary children to reduce the attainment gap in England and Wales A £2.5 billion banking levy Free school meals for infant-school children and in the first three years in primary school in England Vince Cable vetoed a proposed “fire-at-will” employment law Stopping welfare cuts and ensuring benefits kept up with inflation Same sex marriage legislation 15 hours free child care for disadvantaged children Prohibition of the export of chemicals to where it is known they may be used to carry out the death penalty 5p charge on plastic bags.
Many 'experts' on here predicted the coalition wouldn't last 3 months.
Watching the news tonight they are mentioning some sort of sign off summit on Sunday? Does that mean the withdrawal agreement is meant to be going through parliament this week? If so, what day?
I don't think so.
It's signed off by the EU27 leaders & T May and is then ratified across the EU. It remains a draft agreement at this stage.
A Parliamentary debate before Sunday would be potentially a waste of time, as the draft agreement could be amended on Sunday.
I'm wondering if this shower would have happened even if the Tories were still in a coalition with the lib Dems... I'm no fan of the coalition, but seeing everything that's happened since makes me long for those days
It's clear that Cameron expected to have to re-enter coalition after the 2015 election, and that that coalition would have stymied his fake negotiation and then referendum.
Sadly, he proved rather more successful than some of us would have liked.
That said, the coalition that the Lib Dems should have gone for in 2010 was with Labour - because Gordon Brown was more desperate, he was offering a bigger prize in committing to introduction of PR, rather than Cameron's weedy AV referendum.
Clegg was played (he should have learnt from Parliamentary history - the IPP under Parnell in particular).
Played from beginning to end, I voted for the feckers too, never again.
Watching the news tonight they are mentioning some sort of sign off summit on Sunday? Does that mean the withdrawal agreement is meant to be going through parliament this week? If so, what day?
I don't think so.
It's signed off by the EU27 leaders & T May and is then ratified across the EU. It remains a draft agreement at this stage.
A Parliamentary debate before Sunday would be potentially a waste of time, as the draft agreement could be amended on Sunday.
Thanks Norn, I’m just trying to get my head around the mechanics now. There’s a lot of noise
I assume that people don't trust the Libdems enough to vote for them.
For me it’s not an issue of trust. I don’t trust any of them. The reality is that there can only be either a Conservative or Labour government and voting Lib Dem is like pissing in the wind.
As P Weller said, the people get what the people want. It's not gone very well though, has it? Be you a Tory Or Labour brexiteer or remainer. With the Lib Dems in power the time, expense and effort wasted on Brexit could have been channeled to far better ends, mainly reducing inequality.
Would Brexit have happened if the Lib Dems were voted in? judging by the post vote apocalypse on here and posters attitude to the LibDems you do wonder why voting for them is seen as pissing in the wind.
I still think it's extraordinary that, even on this thread, people seem unable to distinguish Theresa May and Teresa May. They're very, very different people. In fact, apart from their names being homonyms, the only thing they seem to have in common is that neither would appear to be capable of running the country.
I'm wondering if this shower would have happened even if the Tories were still in a coalition with the lib Dems... I'm no fan of the coalition, but seeing everything that's happened since makes me long for those days
The Lib Dems, saving us from the excesses of Tory party policy since errrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr never.
So which of these were Lib Dem initiatives and which were Tory, in your expert opinion? The allocation of 0.7% of GDP to International Development, both in practice and as law The raising of the Income Tax personal allowance from £6475 to £10,600 Steve Webb delivered the “triple lock” on the State Pension Nick Clegg saw through the pupil premium of (eventually) £1320 per primary school child and £935 for secondary children to reduce the attainment gap in England and Wales A £2.5 billion banking levy Free school meals for infant-school children and in the first three years in primary school in England Vince Cable vetoed a proposed “fire-at-will” employment law Stopping welfare cuts and ensuring benefits kept up with inflation Same sex marriage legislation 15 hours free child care for disadvantaged children Prohibition of the export of chemicals to where it is known they may be used to carry out the death penalty 5p charge on plastic bags.
Many 'experts' on here predicted the coalition wouldn't last 3 months.
I don't know, can you tell me. A bit thin for a list of achievements though isn't it?
Which of these things happened during the coalition?
Disastrous pursuit of austerity as a policy, I will let you list all those affected, you have a talent for it. Austerity creating the environment that allowed the idea of Brexit to flourish. Don't let people tell you it was about immigration. Complete bodge up of PR vote meaning we have lost the opportunity for a generation to have a more democratic electoral system.
As I said I voted LD in 2010 I am as gutted as you by how crap they were.
I'm wondering if this shower would have happened even if the Tories were still in a coalition with the lib Dems... I'm no fan of the coalition, but seeing everything that's happened since makes me long for those days
The Lib Dems, saving us from the excesses of Tory party policy since errrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr never.
So which of these were Lib Dem initiatives and which were Tory, in your expert opinion? The allocation of 0.7% of GDP to International Development, both in practice and as law The raising of the Income Tax personal allowance from £6475 to £10,600 Steve Webb delivered the “triple lock” on the State Pension Nick Clegg saw through the pupil premium of (eventually) £1320 per primary school child and £935 for secondary children to reduce the attainment gap in England and Wales A £2.5 billion banking levy Free school meals for infant-school children and in the first three years in primary school in England Vince Cable vetoed a proposed “fire-at-will” employment law Stopping welfare cuts and ensuring benefits kept up with inflation Same sex marriage legislation 15 hours free child care for disadvantaged children Prohibition of the export of chemicals to where it is known they may be used to carry out the death penalty 5p charge on plastic bags.
Many 'experts' on here predicted the coalition wouldn't last 3 months.
I don't know, can you tell me. A bit thin for a list of achievements though isn't it?
Which of these things happened during the coalition?
Disastrous pursuit of austerity as a policy, I will let you list all those affected, you have a talent for it. Austerity creating the environment that allowed the idea of Brexit to flourish. Don't let people tell you it was about immigration. Complete bodge up of PR vote meaning we have lost the opportunity for a generation to have a more democratic electoral system.
As I said I voted LD in 2010 I am as gutted as you by how crap they were.
I think it's a case of "how shitter could it have been?" I voted LD and would rather they told the Tories to do one for what it's worth
Ok. Thanks. I must have opened that thread and accidentally flagged his post.
Yes I thought it was a mistake Red.....I PM’d you twice but got no reply, so I thought if I flagged you I might get a response.....which it did. See you’ve removed the flag and I have done likewise.....problem solved. Thanks and all the best mate.
I'm wondering if this shower would have happened even if the Tories were still in a coalition with the lib Dems... I'm no fan of the coalition, but seeing everything that's happened since makes me long for those days
It's clear that Cameron expected to have to re-enter coalition after the 2015 election, and that that coalition would have stymied his fake negotiation and then referendum.
Sadly, he proved rather more successful than some of us would have liked.
That said, the coalition that the Lib Dems should have gone for in 2010 was with Labour - because Gordon Brown was more desperate, he was offering a bigger prize in committing to introduction of PR, rather than Cameron's weedy AV referendum.
Clegg was played (he should have learnt from Parliamentary history - the IPP under Parnell in particular).
I get the point entirely but the numbers for a Lab-Lib Coalition were not there and you had the problem of what to do with Gordon Brown.
You'd have been looking at 315 Lab + Lib and then needing the six SNP on-board (there might be a price for that)....and then cobbling together another six from Plaid Cymru, SDLP, Greens and Alliance.
Theoretically they could have got to around 329 but can you imagine the deals you'd need to strike with the SNP, Plaid Cymru and maybe SDLP to get them on board?
I'm wondering if this shower would have happened even if the Tories were still in a coalition with the lib Dems... I'm no fan of the coalition, but seeing everything that's happened since makes me long for those days
It's clear that Cameron expected to have to re-enter coalition after the 2015 election, and that that coalition would have stymied his fake negotiation and then referendum.
Sadly, he proved rather more successful than some of us would have liked.
That said, the coalition that the Lib Dems should have gone for in 2010 was with Labour - because Gordon Brown was more desperate, he was offering a bigger prize in committing to introduction of PR, rather than Cameron's weedy AV referendum.
Clegg was played (he should have learnt from Parliamentary history - the IPP under Parnell in particular).
I get the point entirely but the numbers for a Lab-Lib Coalition were not there and you had the problem of what to do with Gordon Brown.
You'd have been looking at 315 Lab + Lib and then needing the six SNP on-board (there might be a price for that)....and then cobbling together another six from Plaid Cymru, SDLP, Greens and Alliance.
Theoretically they could have got to around 329 but can you imagine the deals you'd need to strike with the SNP, Plaid Cymru and maybe SDLP to get them on board?
I'm not suggesting that it would have been easy for Labour to have managed a coalition, but that would not necessarily be a bad thing. Such coalitions are more manageable and common than you might think.
You're also talking about a number of parties unlikely to ally themselves with the Conservatives, so, even without a formal alliance, such a government might be more stable than you'd expect.
And, it is worth pointing out that not all political partners operate like the DUP.
Personally, also, I quite like Gordon Brown and, with Labour economic policies appearing to work before the 2010 election, who is to say that his image might not have been improved.
I like the idea of a coalition. Whilst I support Corbyn, I think it would be good for the country to have an alliance of the left. When you look at the last Labour manifesto, I don't think there isn't too much other socially motivated parties couldn't get behind.
Henry can party with his Lib Dem chums - and bemoan the fact that nobody will vote for them. And never quite undertsand why! It is becoming clear from statements from all parties that the house will not accept a hard Brexit. May is driving into the wall and us remainers have to let her.
BTW, the reason I was hoping for a failed coup against the Prime Minister, is there is going to be a point after the plan is defeated, where the hard Brexiters will be faced with supporting a second reading of May's plan or a referendum - they are hoping we will crash out, but if that doesn't happen, it is better they burn the bridges by the time that vote comes.
Comments
he it is
Or we can have some kind of British Macron (Macgrath?) who can set up a centrist party as that all seems to be going swimmingly.
Interesting times.
Historians will look back and shake their heads wondering why so many millions slept walked into voting for Corbyn and May when they could see what paltry nonsense was on offer and the weak party characters destined for office.
Sadly, he proved rather more successful than some of us would have liked.
That said, the coalition that the Lib Dems should have gone for in 2010 was with Labour - because Gordon Brown was more desperate, he was offering a bigger prize in committing to introduction of PR, rather than Cameron's weedy AV referendum.
Clegg was played (he should have learnt from Parliamentary history - the IPP under Parnell in particular).
The Lib Dems are like Danny Green, the longer they are on the sidelines the better they become.
Watching the news tonight they are mentioning some sort of sign off summit on Sunday? Does that mean the withdrawal agreement is meant to be going through parliament this week? If so, what day?
The allocation of 0.7% of GDP to International Development, both in practice and as law
The raising of the Income Tax personal allowance from £6475 to £10,600
Steve Webb delivered the “triple lock” on the State Pension
Nick Clegg saw through the pupil premium of (eventually) £1320 per primary school child and £935 for secondary children to reduce the attainment gap in England and Wales
A £2.5 billion banking levy
Free school meals for infant-school children and in the first three years in primary school in England
Vince Cable vetoed a proposed “fire-at-will” employment law
Stopping welfare cuts and ensuring benefits kept up with inflation
Same sex marriage legislation
15 hours free child care for disadvantaged children
Prohibition of the export of chemicals to where it is known they may be used to carry out the death penalty
5p charge on plastic bags.
Many 'experts' on here predicted the coalition wouldn't last 3 months.
It's signed off by the EU27 leaders & T May and is then ratified across the EU. It remains a draft agreement at this stage.
A Parliamentary debate before Sunday would be potentially a waste of time, as the draft agreement could be amended on Sunday.
It's not gone very well though, has it? Be you a Tory Or Labour brexiteer or remainer. With the Lib Dems in power the time, expense and effort wasted on Brexit could have been channeled to far better ends, mainly reducing inequality.
Would Brexit have happened if the Lib Dems were voted in?
judging by the post vote apocalypse on here and posters attitude to the LibDems you do wonder why voting for them is seen as pissing in the wind.
Which of these things happened during the coalition?
Disastrous pursuit of austerity as a policy, I will let you list all those affected, you have a talent for it.
Austerity creating the environment that allowed the idea of Brexit to flourish. Don't let people tell you it was about immigration.
Complete bodge up of PR vote meaning we have lost the opportunity for a generation to have a more democratic electoral system.
As I said I voted LD in 2010 I am as gutted as you by how crap they were.
I get the point entirely but the numbers for a Lab-Lib Coalition were not there and you had the problem of what to do with Gordon Brown.
You'd have been looking at 315 Lab + Lib and then needing the six SNP on-board (there might be a price for that)....and then cobbling together another six from Plaid Cymru, SDLP, Greens and Alliance.
Theoretically they could have got to around 329 but can you imagine the deals you'd need to strike with the SNP, Plaid Cymru and maybe SDLP to get them on board?
You're also talking about a number of parties unlikely to ally themselves with the Conservatives, so, even without a formal alliance, such a government might be more stable than you'd expect.
And, it is worth pointing out that not all political partners operate like the DUP.
Personally, also, I quite like Gordon Brown and, with Labour economic policies appearing to work before the 2010 election, who is to say that his image might not have been improved.
http://www.politics.co.uk/comment-analysis/2017/12/28/brexit-corbyn-is-playing-a-clever-long-game-that-could-benef
BTW, the reason I was hoping for a failed coup against the Prime Minister, is there is going to be a point after the plan is defeated, where the hard Brexiters will be faced with supporting a second reading of May's plan or a referendum - they are hoping we will crash out, but if that doesn't happen, it is better they burn the bridges by the time that vote comes.