I was trying to post something earlier but had problems......
My view on the Irish problem (something I said a few months back would scupper any deal) is that the Good Friday Peace Agreement is just that. A Peace Agreement. It shouldn't be used as a pawn in the UK leaving the EU. I realise that it probably says a lot of things about a "united Ireland" and "shared issues" but that was merely a way round trying to please the warring factions (mainly the IRA & the Protestants). Both sides want Ireland to be 1 country (The north as part of the UK & the south a separate country). The rest of the UK is now being held to ransom, with unspoken threats that the Peace Agreement will fall apart if either side loses, and to me that is unacceptable. Brexit should continue without any border issue being agreed & the "Irish problem" sorted internally - firstly by a referendum asking both sides what they want (a united Ireland as part of the UK or as you were or all of Ireland as an independent country)
Awful idea. Why stoke up the divides in the nations all over again after it took so long to calm the situation down?
I was trying to post something earlier but had problems......
My view on the Irish problem (something I said a few months back would scupper any deal) is that the Good Friday Peace Agreement is just that. A Peace Agreement. It shouldn't be used as a pawn in the UK leaving the EU. I realise that it probably says a lot of things about a "united Ireland" and "shared issues" but that was merely a way round trying to please the warring factions (mainly the IRA & the Protestants). Both sides want Ireland to be 1 country (The north as part of the UK & the south a separate country). The rest of the UK is now being held to ransom, with unspoken threats that the Peace Agreement will fall apart if either side loses, and to me that is unacceptable. Brexit should continue without any border issue being agreed & the "Irish problem" sorted internally - firstly by a referendum asking both sides what they want (a united Ireland as part of the UK or as you were or all of Ireland as an independent country)
A lot of mistakes in this post. I would advise reading up what the Good Friday Agreement entails. It is not just a peace agreement.
I was trying to post something earlier but had problems......
My view on the Irish problem (something I said a few months back would scupper any deal) is that the Good Friday Peace Agreement is just that. A Peace Agreement. It shouldn't be used as a pawn in the UK leaving the EU. I realise that it probably says a lot of things about a "united Ireland" and "shared issues" but that was merely a way round trying to please the warring factions (mainly the IRA & the Protestants). Both sides want Ireland to be 1 country (The north as part of the UK & the south a separate country). The rest of the UK is now being held to ransom, with unspoken threats that the Peace Agreement will fall apart if either side loses, and to me that is unacceptable. Brexit should continue without any border issue being agreed & the "Irish problem" sorted internally - firstly by a referendum asking both sides what they want (a united Ireland as part of the UK or as you were or all of Ireland as an independent country)
Even if the Peace Agreement holds steadfast, the border is still a huge problem to manage.
I was trying to post something earlier but had problems......
My view on the Irish problem (something I said a few months back would scupper any deal) is that the Good Friday Peace Agreement is just that. A Peace Agreement. It shouldn't be used as a pawn in the UK leaving the EU. I realise that it probably says a lot of things about a "united Ireland" and "shared issues" but that was merely a way round trying to please the warring factions (mainly the IRA & the Protestants). Both sides want Ireland to be 1 country (The north as part of the UK & the south a separate country). The rest of the UK is now being held to ransom, with unspoken threats that the Peace Agreement will fall apart if either side loses, and to me that is unacceptable. Brexit should continue without any border issue being agreed & the "Irish problem" sorted internally - firstly by a referendum asking both sides what they want (a united Ireland as part of the UK or as you were or all of Ireland as an independent country)
I am sorry you had problems writing your post earlier - I hope everything is sorted out. However, I am now suffering several problems having read it.
Do you think a "Peace Agreement" (sic) should be taken into consideration when negotiating another agreement?
Do you really think "both sides" want Ireland "to be 1 country"? That seems a very odd reading of the situation of the last half-century or so.
Do you really think that the "Peace Agreement (sic) will fall apart if either side loses"?
The UK and Irish Governments are signatories to - and accountable for - the Good Friday Agreement. The EU is in support of the Good Friday Agreement, including (but not limited to) the avoidance of a hard border and the continuation of the Common Travel Area. These two are mutually exclusive if the UK moves away from any regulations maintained by the EU. In other words, if we (the UK) "take back control" of regulations and of our borders, we will immediately be in direct conflict with either or both of these issues. However, if we remain in the situation we currently have today (membership of the EU) both of these clauses (and all other GFA issues) cease to be issues. Do you think the UK and Irish population are able to deliver a referendum verdict that takes into consideration all of these issues and delivers an exquisite, permanent and implementable solution? Are you happy that the precise flavour of Brexit that this type of plebiscite would deliver would de facto mean that the UK is not taking back control, we're sharing it with foreigners. And are you happy that the only - the ONLY - option on any such a ballot that would be deliverable, guarantee there is no threat to the GFA and ensure a simple, easy-to-implement, quick, inexpensive solution, would be the single-word option, "Remain"?
I was trying to post something earlier but had problems......
My view on the Irish problem (something I said a few months back would scupper any deal) is that the Good Friday Peace Agreement is just that. A Peace Agreement. It shouldn't be used as a pawn in the UK leaving the EU. I realise that it probably says a lot of things about a "united Ireland" and "shared issues" but that was merely a way round trying to please the warring factions (mainly the IRA & the Protestants). Both sides want Ireland to be 1 country (The north as part of the UK & the south a separate country). The rest of the UK is now being held to ransom, with unspoken threats that the Peace Agreement will fall apart if either side loses, and to me that is unacceptable. Brexit should continue without any border issue being agreed & the "Irish problem" sorted internally - firstly by a referendum asking both sides what they want (a united Ireland as part of the UK or as you were or all of Ireland as an independent country)
You do realise that Ireland is not part of the UK? Any referendum on the future which contains the three questions that you posit is, by definition, not sorting the Irish question internally (I'm not a gambling man, so I'll bet every penny I have that the first option would not be a vote winner).
The nature of the Good Friday Agreement is that, as an internationally ratified Treaty, it is not something that can be addressed unilaterally. It seeks to have issues addressed on several different levels, including all-Ireland and Britain-Ireland bases, all underpinned by common membership of the EU.
Both the UK and Ireland have equal rights, acting as guarantors, and both made concessions to bring about the, admittedly flawed, peace process. It's not simply a peace treaty between warring factions.
The Irish Government and the EU, supporting Ireland, want to ensure that Brexit does nothing to undermine the peace process and the GFA. The UK Government says that it will achieve this by having an open border, policed by technology (much of which is untried or even purely speculative).
The Irish and EU request is for the UK to explain how will this be achieved in practice, and commit to an outline arrangement that would support this - their concerns are both legal and technical, not just political - they are also wholly legitimate. The wording thrown out by the DUP's strop was something that would have facilitated as seamless a border as possible in the event of no deal on future trading relationships, a safety net for hundreds of businesses.
Because the EU considered it an important question, it decided that it had to be addressed, if not solved, as part of the preliminary negotiations on exiting the EU. If the UK wants any negotiated exit deal, and the chance of a future trade deal, it has to address these concerns. Brexit, at least an orderly one, cannot continue without the border question being addressed.
So, I really don't think that your idea holds much hope of success.
If the UK wishes to renege on its obligations under the Good Friday Agreement, it can do so, bit it should recognise that decisions made in, relative, haste about Ireland by British Governments have a history of being repented at leisure (partition itself being one, IMHO). I would suggest, however, that to be seen to withdraw from the GFA would not be beneficial to the UK either reputationally or in respect of future negotiations.
The most powerful warnings about the potential for violence as a result of Brexit have been the police, including today in Armagh, in front of the HoC Select Committee. I doubt if you can claim that they are trying to hold anyone to ransom. I don't know about you, but I'd really prefer for nothing to happen that would let them be proved right.
If anyone is holding the UK to ransom, it's the DUP, already recipients of a tidy sum and instructing the UK Prime Minister on what she may be allowed do.
A lot of people say have no deal and trade on WTO rules. The HQ of the WTO (world trade organisation) is in Geneva. To join a country has to first apply and it takes an average of five years to be accepted. It took Russia 18 years. There are rules and regulations to be followed, and according to my skim read research it may be that the WTO wouldn't allow the UK to join if joining conflicted with the Good Friday Agreement. I might have this all wrong and the UK might already be a member, a bit unsure of this.
Yep, we've been a WTO member since 1995.
The problem is agreeing the WTO schedules. I mean, what could go wrong??? It's not like anyone would seek to maximise their leverage or even veto in such simple negotiations...
A lot of people say have no deal and trade on WTO rules. The HQ of the WTO (world trade organisation) is in Geneva. To join a country has to first apply and it takes an average of five years to be accepted. It took Russia 18 years. There are rules and regulations to be followed, and according to my skim read research it may be that the WTO wouldn't allow the UK to join if joining conflicted with the Good Friday Agreement. I might have this all wrong and the UK might already be a member, a bit unsure of this.
Yep, we've been a WTO member since 1995.
I don't think it is quite as simple as that. I think our membership is mixed up with (or through) our EU membership. It may be a simple matter of rejoining as a single entity or it may not be.
I was trying to post something earlier but had problems......
My view on the Irish problem (something I said a few months back would scupper any deal) is that the Good Friday Peace Agreement is just that. A Peace Agreement. It shouldn't be used as a pawn in the UK leaving the EU. I realise that it probably says a lot of things about a "united Ireland" and "shared issues" but that was merely a way round trying to please the warring factions (mainly the IRA & the Protestants). Both sides want Ireland to be 1 country (The north as part of the UK & the south a separate country). The rest of the UK is now being held to ransom, with unspoken threats that the Peace Agreement will fall apart if either side loses, and to me that is unacceptable. Brexit should continue without any border issue being agreed & the "Irish problem" sorted internally - firstly by a referendum asking both sides what they want (a united Ireland as part of the UK or as you were or all of Ireland as an independent country)
Jeez H. Have we not had enough trouble with barmy referenda? I can't believe anyone could possibly see one as the solution to a political problem after all this.
I was trying to post something earlier but had problems......
My view on the Irish problem (something I said a few months back would scupper any deal) is that the Good Friday Peace Agreement is just that. A Peace Agreement. It shouldn't be used as a pawn in the UK leaving the EU. I realise that it probably says a lot of things about a "united Ireland" and "shared issues" but that was merely a way round trying to please the warring factions (mainly the IRA & the Protestants). Both sides want Ireland to be 1 country (The north as part of the UK & the south a separate country). The rest of the UK is now being held to ransom, with unspoken threats that the Peace Agreement will fall apart if either side loses, and to me that is unacceptable. Brexit should continue without any border issue being agreed & the "Irish problem" sorted internally - firstly by a referendum asking both sides what they want (a united Ireland as part of the UK or as you were or all of Ireland as an independent country)
Jeez H. Have we not had enough trouble with barmy referenda? I can't believe anyone could possibly see one as the solution to a political problem after all this.
Isn't that what we voted for in our referendum, just this sort of scenario?
I was trying to post something earlier but had problems......
My view on the Irish problem (something I said a few months back would scupper any deal) is that the Good Friday Peace Agreement is just that. A Peace Agreement. It shouldn't be used as a pawn in the UK leaving the EU. I realise that it probably says a lot of things about a "united Ireland" and "shared issues" but that was merely a way round trying to please the warring factions (mainly the IRA & the Protestants). Both sides want Ireland to be 1 country (The north as part of the UK & the south a separate country). The rest of the UK is now being held to ransom, with unspoken threats that the Peace Agreement will fall apart if either side loses, and to me that is unacceptable. Brexit should continue without any border issue being agreed & the "Irish problem" sorted internally - firstly by a referendum asking both sides what they want (a united Ireland as part of the UK or as you were or all of Ireland as an independent country)
Jeez H. Have we not had enough trouble with barmy referenda? I can't believe anyone could possibly see one as the solution to a political problem after all this.
There's the rub - its a political problem & it shouldn't be. We are leaving the EU and therefore should have a border between the UK & the EU - Simple. Everyone says that they're shouldn't be a "hard border" between Northern Ireland & ROI - why not ?? If France left the EU would there be such an uproar about building a border between them & Spain, or them & Germany ? I doubt it. Its purely down to "not wanting to upset the Good Friday Agreement" but sorry, that's a smokescreen. Yes, I admit I haven't read all the ins & outs of said agreement (and acknowledged this in my OP) but it seems that because of the "troubles" we can't move forward. Look at Israel & Palestine. I heard today that there is a consensus that Jerusalem should be some sort of neutral area (not part of either country) so as to avoid all the problems there. Ireland is a similar problem. I grew up with the IRA bombing & maiming UK citizens (ask yourself why there aren't any waste paper bins at London train stations) & I fear that the UK Government is putting Brexit at risk because they don't want to "upset" the Irish. We are leaving the EU & therefore there needs to some sort of border in Ireland. I would prefer a hard border (mainly to stop anyone flying into Dublin, hiring a car & simply driving to Belfast & bobs your uncle they're in the UK) but could live with some sort of "invisible" border as long as there is some sort of checks somewhere along the line.
I was trying to post something earlier but had problems......
My view on the Irish problem (something I said a few months back would scupper any deal) is that the Good Friday Peace Agreement is just that. A Peace Agreement. It shouldn't be used as a pawn in the UK leaving the EU. I realise that it probably says a lot of things about a "united Ireland" and "shared issues" but that was merely a way round trying to please the warring factions (mainly the IRA & the Protestants). Both sides want Ireland to be 1 country (The north as part of the UK & the south a separate country). The rest of the UK is now being held to ransom, with unspoken threats that the Peace Agreement will fall apart if either side loses, and to me that is unacceptable. Brexit should continue without any border issue being agreed & the "Irish problem" sorted internally - firstly by a referendum asking both sides what they want (a united Ireland as part of the UK or as you were or all of Ireland as an independent country)
So our answer to having one ridiculous referendum is to hold another where we ask (if I've understood correctly) the people of the Irish Republic if they'd like to re-join the United Kingdom ?
I was trying to post something earlier but had problems......
My view on the Irish problem (something I said a few months back would scupper any deal) is that the Good Friday Peace Agreement is just that. A Peace Agreement. It shouldn't be used as a pawn in the UK leaving the EU. I realise that it probably says a lot of things about a "united Ireland" and "shared issues" but that was merely a way round trying to please the warring factions (mainly the IRA & the Protestants). Both sides want Ireland to be 1 country (The north as part of the UK & the south a separate country). The rest of the UK is now being held to ransom, with unspoken threats that the Peace Agreement will fall apart if either side loses, and to me that is unacceptable. Brexit should continue without any border issue being agreed & the "Irish problem" sorted internally - firstly by a referendum asking both sides what they want (a united Ireland as part of the UK or as you were or all of Ireland as an independent country)
Jeez H. Have we not had enough trouble with barmy referenda? I can't believe anyone could possibly see one as the solution to a political problem after all this.
There's the rub - its a political problem & it shouldn't be. We are leaving the EU and therefore should have a border between the UK & the EU - Simple. Everyone says that they're shouldn't be a "hard border" between Northern Ireland & ROI - why not ?? If France left the EU would there be such an uproar about building a border between them & Spain, or them & Germany ? I doubt it. Its purely down to "not wanting to upset the Good Friday Agreement" but sorry, that's a smokescreen. Yes, I admit I haven't read all the ins & outs of said agreement (and acknowledged this in my OP) but it seems that because of the "troubles" we can't move forward. Look at Israel & Palestine. I heard today that there is a consensus that Jerusalem should be some sort of neutral area (not part of either country) so as to avoid all the problems there. Ireland is a similar problem. I grew up with the IRA bombing & maiming UK citizens (ask yourself why there aren't any waste paper bins at London train stations) & I fear that the UK Government is putting Brexit at risk because they don't want to "upset" the Irish. We are leaving the EU & therefore there needs to some sort of border in Ireland. I would prefer a hard border (mainly to stop anyone flying into Dublin, hiring a car & simply driving to Belfast & bobs your uncle they're in the UK) but could live with some sort of "invisible" border as long as there is some sort of checks somewhere along the line.
I understand this hard border point of view. Leaving aside the enormous ramifications of the Good Friday Agreement I want to use your analogy about driving from Dublin to Belfast. There is a 410KM land border with at least 300 crossing points, some a simple bridge between what amounts to two halves of the same village, some homes and farms span the actual border, one road crosses the border four times in ten minutes driving, animals wander to and fro across the border, oh and Northern Irish citizens are able to have both a British and ROI passport. Look at the practicalities! The question then becomes how do you manage the practicalities, and how much money will it cost?
The chap advocating a United States of Europe is from some junior party being brought in to prop up a government, the senior party in the relationship would never really let them have any influence...
Find it funny that the pro-EU supporters 5 years ago denied there is going to be a EU Army and a United States of Europe but it is becoming more and more true month by month.
Find it funny that the pro-EU supporters 5 years ago denied there is going to be a EU Army and a United States of Europe but it is becoming more and more true month by month.
More and more of zero is still zero.
Don't believe everything you read on Stormfront/Breitbart/Britain First etc.
Find it funny that the pro-EU supporters 5 years ago denied there is going to be a EU Army and a United States of Europe but it is becoming more and more true month by month.
Spain would be out like a shot if there was even the faintest chance of this, as I'm sure would every other country. Will never happen. European countries value their national identity just as much as the UK and various countries fought to achieve it in living memory.
Find it funny that the pro-EU supporters 5 years ago denied there is going to be a EU Army and a United States of Europe but it is becoming more and more true month by month.
Find it funny that the pro-EU supporters 5 years ago denied there is going to be a EU Army and a United States of Europe but it is becoming more and more true month by month.
Just to put this in context, you're the person that doesn't believe in global warming aren't you?
Find it funny that the pro-EU supporters 5 years ago denied there is going to be a EU Army and a United States of Europe but it is becoming more and more true month by month.
Ever heard of NATO?
If there is to be an EU army then sobeit - I'm sure they would be unlikely to declare war against the other EU member who wouldn't take part (good job we had the veto). If there is going to be a United States of Europe then sobeit - it would not have included the UK whilst the UK could still have been a member of the EU (good job we had the veto). Anyway we can compete against a United States of Europe - we have the USA who will never put America first, and the old Empire - no grudges there. Oh hang on a minute....
I was trying to post something earlier but had problems......
My view on the Irish problem (something I said a few months back would scupper any deal) is that the Good Friday Peace Agreement is just that. A Peace Agreement. It shouldn't be used as a pawn in the UK leaving the EU. I realise that it probably says a lot of things about a "united Ireland" and "shared issues" but that was merely a way round trying to please the warring factions (mainly the IRA & the Protestants). Both sides want Ireland to be 1 country (The north as part of the UK & the south a separate country). The rest of the UK is now being held to ransom, with unspoken threats that the Peace Agreement will fall apart if either side loses, and to me that is unacceptable. Brexit should continue without any border issue being agreed & the "Irish problem" sorted internally - firstly by a referendum asking both sides what they want (a united Ireland as part of the UK or as you were or all of Ireland as an independent country)
Jeez H. Have we not had enough trouble with barmy referenda? I can't believe anyone could possibly see one as the solution to a political problem after all this.
There's the rub - its a political problem & it shouldn't be. We are leaving the EU and therefore should have a border between the UK & the EU - Simple. Everyone says that they're shouldn't be a "hard border" between Northern Ireland & ROI - why not ?? If France left the EU would there be such an uproar about building a border between them & Spain, or them & Germany ? I doubt it. Its purely down to "not wanting to upset the Good Friday Agreement" but sorry, that's a smokescreen. Yes, I admit I haven't read all the ins & outs of said agreement (and acknowledged this in my OP) but it seems that because of the "troubles" we can't move forward. Look at Israel & Palestine. I heard today that there is a consensus that Jerusalem should be some sort of neutral area (not part of either country) so as to avoid all the problems there. Ireland is a similar problem. I grew up with the IRA bombing & maiming UK citizens (ask yourself why there aren't any waste paper bins at London train stations) & I fear that the UK Government is putting Brexit at risk because they don't want to "upset" the Irish. We are leaving the EU & therefore there needs to some sort of border in Ireland. I would prefer a hard border (mainly to stop anyone flying into Dublin, hiring a car & simply driving to Belfast & bobs your uncle they're in the UK) but could live with some sort of "invisible" border as long as there is some sort of checks somewhere along the line.
But there are now bins at stations in London and one could argue it’s because of the Good Friday agreement and all the diplomacy and peace efforts that have gone into getting the situation to a tenable point that this is the case.
A hard boarder could give you a throw back to days gone by, you just don’t know.
We already have a high threat level of terrorism without poking a hornet’s nest
I’ll admit I was just a kid growing up during the IRA bombing years, but what they achieved to negotiate and maintain peace is easily undone. You referenced Israel and Palestine. One idiotic comment is probably going to spark bloodshed. One wrong move over the Irish boarder could have similar consequences
I was trying to post something earlier but had problems......
My view on the Irish problem (something I said a few months back would scupper any deal) is that the Good Friday Peace Agreement is just that. A Peace Agreement. It shouldn't be used as a pawn in the UK leaving the EU. I realise that it probably says a lot of things about a "united Ireland" and "shared issues" but that was merely a way round trying to please the warring factions (mainly the IRA & the Protestants). Both sides want Ireland to be 1 country (The north as part of the UK & the south a separate country). The rest of the UK is now being held to ransom, with unspoken threats that the Peace Agreement will fall apart if either side loses, and to me that is unacceptable. Brexit should continue without any border issue being agreed & the "Irish problem" sorted internally - firstly by a referendum asking both sides what they want (a united Ireland as part of the UK or as you were or all of Ireland as an independent country)
Jeez H. Have we not had enough trouble with barmy referenda? I can't believe anyone could possibly see one as the solution to a political problem after all this.
There's the rub - its a political problem & it shouldn't be. We are leaving the EU and therefore should have a border between the UK & the EU - Simple. Everyone says that they're shouldn't be a "hard border" between Northern Ireland & ROI - why not ?? If France left the EU would there be such an uproar about building a border between them & Spain, or them & Germany ? I doubt it. Its purely down to "not wanting to upset the Good Friday Agreement" but sorry, that's a smokescreen. Yes, I admit I haven't read all the ins & outs of said agreement (and acknowledged this in my OP) but it seems that because of the "troubles" we can't move forward. Look at Israel & Palestine. I heard today that there is a consensus that Jerusalem should be some sort of neutral area (not part of either country) so as to avoid all the problems there. Ireland is a similar problem. I grew up with the IRA bombing & maiming UK citizens (ask yourself why there aren't any waste paper bins at London train stations) & I fear that the UK Government is putting Brexit at risk because they don't want to "upset" the Irish. We are leaving the EU & therefore there needs to some sort of border in Ireland. I would prefer a hard border (mainly to stop anyone flying into Dublin, hiring a car & simply driving to Belfast & bobs your uncle they're in the UK) but could live with some sort of "invisible" border as long as there is some sort of checks somewhere along the line.
But there are now bins at stations in London and one could argue it’s because of the Good Friday agreement and all the diplomacy and peace efforts that have gone into getting the situation to a tenable point that this is the case.
A hard boarder could give you a throw back to days gone by, you just don’t know.
We already have a high threat level of terrorism without poking a hornet’s nest
I’ll admit I was just a kid growing up during the IRA bombing years, but what they achieved to negotiate and maintain peace is easily undone. You referenced Israel and Palestine. One idiotic comment is probably going to spark bloodshed. One wrong move over the Irish boarder could have similar consequences
There are no bins still at Basingstoke station... And they had a bomb put in the bog about 30 years ago. You have to take your rubbish on the train to get rid of it.
Further to my above comment it’s brexit arrogance and ignorance. Everything that’s happening is because it’s not been thought through. So many people going to vote on a subject even the most sagacious of us didn’t have enough facts
Fine to exercise a vote when given the choice and you have to respect people’s choices, but fuck me, should we have ever been given the vote in the first place without the U.K. government giving us a warts n all, full cavity, microscopic diagnosis
Suddenly a nation of people found themselves with a monumental choice that is going to impact them in a hugely profound way, and I don’t care how intelligent or knowledgeable some of us think we are, we’ve been asked to opt for something that’s beyond our comprehension (in my opinion)
Spain would be out like a shot if there was even the faintest chance of this, as I'm sure would every other country. Will never happen. European countries value their national identity just as much as the UK and various countries fought to achieve it in living memory.
Well lets face it...they have taken away their currencies (a national identity taken away), some laws and powers from each Country so it's slowly leading to a United States Of Europe.
I'm not saying it is 100% going to happen but this is the EU's mindset, they want this dream to become a reality. I voted out last year as I felt the EU has got too much power and the UK can govern and trade by ourselves.
Find it funny that the pro-EU supporters 5 years ago denied there is going to be a EU Army and a United States of Europe but it is becoming more and more true month by month.
Just to put this in context, you're the person that doesn't believe in global warming aren't you?
Comments
Do you think a "Peace Agreement" (sic) should be taken into consideration when negotiating another agreement?
Do you really think "both sides" want Ireland "to be 1 country"? That seems a very odd reading of the situation of the last half-century or so.
Do you really think that the "Peace Agreement (sic) will fall apart if either side loses"?
The UK and Irish Governments are signatories to - and accountable for - the Good Friday Agreement. The EU is in support of the Good Friday Agreement, including (but not limited to) the avoidance of a hard border and the continuation of the Common Travel Area. These two are mutually exclusive if the UK moves away from any regulations maintained by the EU. In other words, if we (the UK) "take back control" of regulations and of our borders, we will immediately be in direct conflict with either or both of these issues. However, if we remain in the situation we currently have today (membership of the EU) both of these clauses (and all other GFA issues) cease to be issues. Do you think the UK and Irish population are able to deliver a referendum verdict that takes into consideration all of these issues and delivers an exquisite, permanent and implementable solution? Are you happy that the precise flavour of Brexit that this type of plebiscite would deliver would de facto mean that the UK is not taking back control, we're sharing it with foreigners. And are you happy that the only - the ONLY - option on any such a ballot that would be deliverable, guarantee there is no threat to the GFA and ensure a simple, easy-to-implement, quick, inexpensive solution, would be the single-word option, "Remain"?
The nature of the Good Friday Agreement is that, as an internationally ratified Treaty, it is not something that can be addressed unilaterally. It seeks to have issues addressed on several different levels, including all-Ireland and Britain-Ireland bases, all underpinned by common membership of the EU.
Both the UK and Ireland have equal rights, acting as guarantors, and both made concessions to bring about the, admittedly flawed, peace process. It's not simply a peace treaty between warring factions.
The Irish Government and the EU, supporting Ireland, want to ensure that Brexit does nothing to undermine the peace process and the GFA. The UK Government says that it will achieve this by having an open border, policed by technology (much of which is untried or even purely speculative).
The Irish and EU request is for the UK to explain how will this be achieved in practice, and commit to an outline arrangement that would support this - their concerns are both legal and technical, not just political - they are also wholly legitimate. The wording thrown out by the DUP's strop was something that would have facilitated as seamless a border as possible in the event of no deal on future trading relationships, a safety net for hundreds of businesses.
Because the EU considered it an important question, it decided that it had to be addressed, if not solved, as part of the preliminary negotiations on exiting the EU. If the UK wants any negotiated exit deal, and the chance of a future trade deal, it has to address these concerns. Brexit, at least an orderly one, cannot continue without the border question being addressed.
So, I really don't think that your idea holds much hope of success.
If the UK wishes to renege on its obligations under the Good Friday Agreement, it can do so, bit it should recognise that decisions made in, relative, haste about Ireland by British Governments have a history of being repented at leisure (partition itself being one, IMHO). I would suggest, however, that to be seen to withdraw from the GFA would not be beneficial to the UK either reputationally or in respect of future negotiations.
The most powerful warnings about the potential for violence as a result of Brexit have been the police, including today in Armagh, in front of the HoC Select Committee. I doubt if you can claim that they are trying to hold anyone to ransom. I don't know about you, but I'd really prefer for nothing to happen that would let them be proved right.
If anyone is holding the UK to ransom, it's the DUP, already recipients of a tidy sum and instructing the UK Prime Minister on what she may be allowed do.
"Blue passports"
Leaving aside the enormous ramifications of the Good Friday Agreement I want to use your analogy about driving from Dublin to Belfast.
There is a 410KM land border with at least 300 crossing points, some a simple bridge between what amounts to two halves of the same village, some homes and farms span the actual border, one road crosses the border four times in ten minutes driving, animals wander to and fro across the border, oh and Northern Irish citizens are able to have both a British and ROI passport.
Look at the practicalities!
The question then becomes how do you manage the practicalities, and how much money will it cost?
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/dec/07/martin-schulz-united-states-of-europe-germany-sdp
Find it funny that the pro-EU supporters 5 years ago denied there is going to be a EU Army and a United States of Europe but it is becoming more and more true month by month.
Don't believe everything you read on Stormfront/Breitbart/Britain First etc.
If there is to be an EU army then sobeit - I'm sure they would be unlikely to declare war against the other EU member who wouldn't take part (good job we had the veto). If there is going to be a United States of Europe then sobeit - it would not have included the UK whilst the UK could still have been a member of the EU (good job we had the veto). Anyway we can compete against a United States of Europe - we have the USA who will never put America first, and the old Empire - no grudges there. Oh hang on a minute....
A hard boarder could give you a throw back to days gone by, you just don’t know.
We already have a high threat level of terrorism without poking a hornet’s nest
I’ll admit I was just a kid growing up during the IRA bombing years, but what they achieved to negotiate and maintain peace is easily undone. You referenced Israel and Palestine. One idiotic comment is probably going to spark bloodshed. One wrong move over the Irish boarder could have similar consequences
Fine to exercise a vote when given the choice and you have to respect people’s choices, but fuck me, should we have ever been given the vote in the first place without the U.K. government giving us a warts n all, full cavity, microscopic diagnosis
Suddenly a nation of people found themselves with a monumental choice that is going to impact them in a hugely profound way, and I don’t care how intelligent or knowledgeable some of us think we are, we’ve been asked to opt for something that’s beyond our comprehension (in my opinion)
I'm not saying it is 100% going to happen but this is the EU's mindset, they want this dream to become a reality. I voted out last year as I felt the EU has got too much power and the UK can govern and trade by ourselves.
Border = line between two countries.
Some of the spelling, grammar, language on here pretty appalling!