He owns the director debt AB but i don’t believe it risses yearly or does it
If he owns it and it does t increase annually he may as well ignore it as it’s not due for being paid unless he chooses too or we get promoted to prem
I honestly think we are all convinced that he will sell due to the losses
I don’t agree I think the bloke is vindictive and spiteful enough to just run us in the way he is currently until he finds someone like him who was willing to pay what Is deemed favourable and to ignore the directors debt until it’s due for paying
He won’t move unless the other parties come closer to his value or solution for the debt
The director loans don’t rise.
No, but unless the Aussies are underwriting the delay the cost to him of owning the club continues to do so.
Of course, though a few more sales and a sell on from Lookman could potentially cover costs for a few months.
So here we are, two weeks away from the new season and still no done deal. Whatever happened to "it will be announced when we know what division we are in"?
The meeting was the first public appearance or naming of Lieven De Turck who, as well as representing the club in takeover talks, appears to be acting CEO, FD and head of making ridiculous cuts such as youth team breakfasts and not turning light on during the three days a week he is in the UK.
LDT's statements to the Fans Forum, the supporters' group being much derided in the run up to the meeting but getting an update if nothing else, left people asking for more but according to the regime bean counter:
- The club is satisfied the Australians have the money to purchase the club - The Australians haven’t been granted exclusivity. It is possible the other party could still purchase the club but they still have certain issues of their own to resolve. The club can’t go in to more detail on these issues because of the NDA - The sale agreed with the Australians does not include Staprix retaining The Valley or Sparrows Lane. - There are no issues with regard to former director's loans. - The only issue holding up the process is EFL approval.
However, the Aussies, according to @Airman Brown, privately dispute that there are no issues with the former director loans although they appear to accept that there is still some paperwork to be signed off by the EFL. What the delay with the EFL is, why it is an issue and when it might be resolved all remain unclear.
It was suggested that Duchatelet had only in June made an offer to the seven former directors and then for only 25% of the value, which was rejected by at least some of them. Airman Brown suggested that at least some of the old directors are in no mind to do any favours for either Duchatelet or Richard Murray, who has £3m of the £7m loan himself, and is still believed by some to be part of a, depending on your outlook, very shy or very mythical, British consortium.
@Davidsmith added weight to this view of the situation when he posted "He (Duchatelet) agreed a deal and said he would sort out those Loans without knowing what Ex Directors would say, unless he was told by one that they wouldn’t be a problem. Then guess what there was."
A "rumour" that appeared to originate with Colin Sams/Bexley Boy set yet another deadline, this time that nothing would happen until after the Norwich game on 28 July. Why this was the case wasn't made clear.
Lee Bowyer held an unannounced Q & A at the new kit launch and said that he was meeting with Richard Murray the next day (Friday 20) to learn about progress on the takeover. Lee publicly stated that he didn't feel the uncertainty over the takeover was impacting on player recruitment but he later said that any sale of Josh Magennis was out of his hands.
But with no firm news and little new information that thread continued in what we must now refer to as the @Scoham Takeover Infinity Loop which said poster accurately described as
1. Someone posts they’ve heard the deal may go through next week.
2. Excitement builds as we get close to the deadline.
3. Deadline passes. Nothing is said by the club or reported by the local media.
4. Discussions on here around reasons for the delay amongst more puns, gifs etc.
5. A few agree they have doubts about the Aussies or the deal even going through.
6. Others post that the Aussies aren’t the enemy, RD is to blame etc.
@ShootersHillGuru I have believed that there is some truth in "RD doesn't know what he bought from the spivs" for a while. It's one of a number of plusable causes of what information we do know.
@ShootersHillGuru I have believed that there is some truth in "RD doesn't know what he bought from the spivs" for a while. It's one of a number of plusable causes of what information we do know.
I also believe this as the daft old duffer seemed to acquire us very quickly suggesting his due diligence wasn't thorough enough.
Sorry if my opinion goes against the grain but then a forum would be no good if we all agreed with each other.
I'm looking at this from purely a financial aspect. Assuming the stumbling block is just to do with the £7m ex-director loans then I agree its RD's problem to sort. However, he doesn't have the money to pay them now as the recent 25% offer shows. We don't have anymore saleable players that can command fees great enough to cover the ex-director loans & the only 2 that look like they can be sold (Magennis & Bauer) aren't attracting offers high enough. The longer the impasse continues the worse it gets......weak squad means worse results means worse position in league means relegation struggle means less fans....etc etc. Football is a unique business in the fact that in 2 weeks time its abilty to "trade" is massively affected for the next 5 months. If you were running M&S and you knew that by Aug 9th you had to have all your stock sorted for the autumn & winter and couldn't bring anymore in until the new year you'd be going hell for leather to get it done & have back up just in case.
The Aussies, by not sorting the ex-director loans before now & leaving RD to do it, are just making things worse for themselves if & when they finally take over. £7m now (and maybe they could have even got this trimmed down to £5m if some of the ex-directors were happy to take a small cut) could be small beer compared to what it might cost to get us out of League 2. Yes, it might not be their debt, but its part & parcel of buying the club.
whats the saying about knowing the cost of something but the value of nothing.
So you are asking the Aussies to pay off the loans now when they don’t actually own that debt. Like getting someone to pay off your mortgage first before they then buy your house. And then the sale collapses.
It's just a well Golfie doesn't give financial advice
Nice summary Grapevine except for the bit about clear title. Why do new owners need to clear debentures not repayable until we are in Prem? Duchatalet bought us without doing so.
I think you answered your own question !
Look at the effing mess, because RD didn't buy us with clean title !
So here we are, two weeks away from the new season and still no done deal. Whatever happened to "it will be announced when we know what division we are in"?
The meeting was the first public appearance or naming of Lieven De Turck who, as well as representing the club in takeover talks, appears to be acting CEO, FD and head of making ridiculous cuts such as youth team breakfasts and not turning light on during the three days a week he is in the UK.
LDT's statements to the Fans Forum, the supporters' group being much derided in the run up to the meeting but getting an update if nothing else, left people asking for more but according to the regime bean counter:
- The club is satisfied the Australians have the money to purchase the club - The Australians haven’t been granted exclusivity. It is possible the other party could still purchase the club but they still have certain issues of their own to resolve. The club can’t go in to more detail on these issues because of the NDA - The sale agreed with the Australians does not include Staprix retaining The Valley or Sparrows Lane. - There are no issues with regard to former director's loans. - The only issue holding up the process is EFL approval.
However, the Aussies, according to @Airman Brown, privately dispute that there are no issues with the former director loans although they appear to accept that there is still some paperwork to be signed off by the EFL. What the delay with the EFL is, why it is an issue and when it might be resolved all remain unclear.
It was suggested that Duchatelet had only in June made an offer to the seven former directors and then for only 25% of the value, which was rejected by at least some of them. Airman Brown suggested that at least some of the old directors are in no mind to do any favours for either Duchatelet or Richard Murray, who has £3m of the £7m loan himself, and is still believed by some to be part of a, depending on your outlook, very shy or very mythical, British consortium.
A "rumour" that appeared to originate with Colin Sams/Bexley Boy set yet another deadline, this time that nothing would happen until after the Norwich game on 28 July. Why this was the case wasn't made clear.
Lee Bowyer held an unannounced Q & A at the new kit launch and said that he was meeting with Richard Murray the next day (Friday 20) to learn about progress on the takeover. Lee publicly stated that he didn't feel the uncertainty over the takeover was impacting on player recruitment but he later said that any sale of Josh Magennis was out of his hands.
But with no firm news and little new information that thread continued in what we must now refer to as the @Scoham Takeover Infinity Loop which said poster accurately described as
1. Someone posts they’ve heard the deal may go through next week.
2. Excitement builds as we get close to the deadline.
3. Deadline passes. Nothing is said by the club or reported by the local media.
4. Discussions on here around reasons for the delay amongst more puns, gifs etc.
5. A few agree they have doubts about the Aussies or the deal even going through.
6. Others post that the Aussies aren’t the enemy, RD is to blame etc.
Nothing at all I just can not see it ending well but don’t believe it’s an EFL issue I don’t believe it’s a paperwork issue
This is purely a money issue
And the longer it goes on the more we will suffer
The longer it goes on the more likely investment in the consortium could be pulled
And two shit chalets will just not give over a decent playing budget will sell anything that has value so that he is not funding the losses himself
We are past who blinks first this is worse than that
I’m certainly not saying you are wrong. You have an inside track. But.
What came out of the fans forum was a statement from one side of the equation. Namely the football club. I can see why they might want to apply pressure on the Aussies but the statement said that the problem was administrative not money. If it was as you say “purely money” wouldn’t it have applied more pressure on Muir and Co by saying that or at least implying that. They didn’t and said they are happy that the funds are in place.
Seems to me and this is just my not itk take on things is that RD can’t sell at this point due to technicalities from before his purchase that need resolving. Not money but perhaps even clear ownership of assets. Obscured from view by Slater and Jiminez in the BVI. I doubt the £7 million former directors debt is solely responsible for holding up this deal happening.
The outstanding £7M directors loans could easily be described as administrative rather than money, if an owner wished to describe it as such. (Ok it's political language but ykwim).
Would it be funny or horrific if the old nutter doesn’t actually own half of what he’s trying to sell because he thought he was to clever to have to do proper DD.
He owns the director debt AB but i don’t believe it risses yearly or does it
If he owns it and it does t increase annually he may as well ignore it as it’s not due for being paid unless he chooses too or we get promoted to prem
I honestly think we are all convinced that he will sell due to the losses
I don’t agree I think the bloke is vindictive and spiteful enough to just run us in the way he is currently until he finds someone like him who was willing to pay what Is deemed favourable and to ignore the directors debt until it’s due for paying
He won’t move unless the other parties come closer to his value or solution for the debt
The director loans don’t rise.
The directors loans don't rise, so the amount outstanding is reducing in real terms, as it is getting eroded by inflation.
Would it be funny or horrific if the old nutter doesn’t actually own half of what he’s trying to sell because he thought he was to clever to have to do proper DD.
It would be fucking horrific, but I don't doubt it's a possibility.
He owns the director debt AB but i don’t believe it risses yearly or does it
If he owns it and it does t increase annually he may as well ignore it as it’s not due for being paid unless he chooses too or we get promoted to prem
I honestly think we are all convinced that he will sell due to the losses
I don’t agree I think the bloke is vindictive and spiteful enough to just run us in the way he is currently until he finds someone like him who was willing to pay what Is deemed favourable and to ignore the directors debt until it’s due for paying
He won’t move unless the other parties come closer to his value or solution for the debt
The director loans don’t rise.
The directors loans don't rise, so the amount outstanding is reducing in real terms, as it is getting eroded by inflation.
Their multi millionaires they don’t care and inflation is 2.4%, Rolands debt is rising too at the rate of at least £1mn a month he has been farting around with this deal for a year, that’s £12mn wasted he could have paid them off and be £5mn better off.
He owns the director debt AB but i don’t believe it risses yearly or does it
If he owns it and it does t increase annually he may as well ignore it as it’s not due for being paid unless he chooses too or we get promoted to prem
I honestly think we are all convinced that he will sell due to the losses
I don’t agree I think the bloke is vindictive and spiteful enough to just run us in the way he is currently until he finds someone like him who was willing to pay what Is deemed favourable and to ignore the directors debt until it’s due for paying
He won’t move unless the other parties come closer to his value or solution for the debt
The director loans don’t rise.
The directors loans don't rise, so the amount outstanding is reducing in real terms, as it is getting eroded by inflation.
Their multi millionaires they don’t care and inflation is 2.4%, Rolands debt is rising too at the rate of at least £1mn a month he has been farting around with this deal for a year, that’s £12mn wasted he could have paid them off and be £5mn better off.
So you are saying that it’s the Director loans that are holding this up ?
Would it be funny or horrific if the old nutter doesn’t actually own half of what he’s trying to sell because he thought he was to clever to have to do proper DD.
It would be very funny but horrific for the supporters.
Something does not stack up with this drawn out affair and I feel it is going to come back and bite the supporters on their bottoms.
If the former directors really believed in the prospects for the club under the Aussies, wouldn’t they prefer to wait for payment and get their full money back when we reach the Premier League?
If the former directors really believed in the prospects for the club under the Aussies, wouldn’t they prefer to wait for payment and get their full money back when we reach the Premier League?
Probably, but they may want to buy clear title to secure there own monies or to secure future loans.
Would it be funny or horrific if the old nutter doesn’t actually own half of what he’s trying to sell because he thought he was to clever to have to do proper DD.
It would be very funny but horrific for the supporters.
Something does not stack up with this drawn out affair and I feel it is going to come back and bite the supporters on their bottoms.
Would it be funny or horrific if the old nutter doesn’t actually own half of what he’s trying to sell because he thought he was to clever to have to do proper DD.
It would be very funny but horrific for the supporters.
Something does not stack up with this drawn out affair and I feel it is going to come back and bite the supporters on their bottoms.
After 11000 comments finally a decent one
So does this mean that you will return your season ticket for a refund?
If the former directors really believed in the prospects for the club under the Aussies, wouldn’t they prefer to wait for payment and get their full money back when we reach the Premier League?
That might well be the case. But if you had agreed a price - would you really want to have to find another £7m if and when you made the Premier League?
If the former directors really believed in the prospects for the club under the Aussies, wouldn’t they prefer to wait for payment and get their full money back when we reach the Premier League?
No , why would they believe in prospects, they never met them, never been approached by them on their loans and their last 3 experiences under Murray, Slater and Roland have been shit. If I was them I would not budge an inch. This is Rolands problem not theirs, they have been constantly ignored , banned and as the Clubs major creditors treated with disrespect. They have all been very quiet and respectful and in leaving their loans in basically stopped Club from Admin in 2010, in my opinion they deserve every penny back and Roland needs to take his medicine for bad management on the chin.
So here we are, two weeks away from the new season and still no done deal. Whatever happened to "it will be announced when we know what division we are in"?
The meeting was the first public appearance or naming of Lieven De Turck who, as well as representing the club in takeover talks, appears to be acting CEO, FD and head of making ridiculous cuts such as youth team breakfasts and not turning light on during the three days a week he is in the UK.
LDT's statements to the Fans Forum, the supporters' group being much derided in the run up to the meeting but getting an update if nothing else, left people asking for more but according to the regime bean counter:
- The club is satisfied the Australians have the money to purchase the club - The Australians haven’t been granted exclusivity. It is possible the other party could still purchase the club but they still have certain issues of their own to resolve. The club can’t go in to more detail on these issues because of the NDA - The sale agreed with the Australians does not include Staprix retaining The Valley or Sparrows Lane. - There are no issues with regard to former director's loans. - The only issue holding up the process is EFL approval.
However, the Aussies, according to @Airman Brown, privately dispute that there are no issues with the former director loans although they appear to accept that there is still some paperwork to be signed off by the EFL. What the delay with the EFL is, why it is an issue and when it might be resolved all remain unclear.
It was suggested that Duchatelet had only in June made an offer to the seven former directors and then for only 25% of the value, which was rejected by at least some of them. Airman Brown suggested that at least some of the old directors are in no mind to do any favours for either Duchatelet or Richard Murray, who has £3m of the £7m loan himself, and is still believed by some to be part of a, depending on your outlook, very shy or very mythical, British consortium.
A "rumour" that appeared to originate with Colin Sams/Bexley Boy set yet another deadline, this time that nothing would happen until after the Norwich game on 28 July. Why this was the case wasn't made clear.
Lee Bowyer held an unannounced Q & A at the new kit launch and said that he was meeting with Richard Murray the next day (Friday 20) to learn about progress on the takeover. Lee publicly stated that he didn't feel the uncertainty over the takeover was impacting on player recruitment but he later said that any sale of Josh Magennis was out of his hands.
But with no firm news and little new information that thread continued in what we must now refer to as the @Scoham Takeover Infinity Loop which said poster accurately described as
1. Someone posts they’ve heard the deal may go through next week.
2. Excitement builds as we get close to the deadline.
3. Deadline passes. Nothing is said by the club or reported by the local media.
4. Discussions on here around reasons for the delay amongst more puns, gifs etc.
5. A few agree they have doubts about the Aussies or the deal even going through.
6. Others post that the Aussies aren’t the enemy, RD is to blame etc.
He owns the director debt AB but i don’t believe it risses yearly or does it
If he owns it and it does t increase annually he may as well ignore it as it’s not due for being paid unless he chooses too or we get promoted to prem
I honestly think we are all convinced that he will sell due to the losses
I don’t agree I think the bloke is vindictive and spiteful enough to just run us in the way he is currently until he finds someone like him who was willing to pay what Is deemed favourable and to ignore the directors debt until it’s due for paying
He won’t move unless the other parties come closer to his value or solution for the debt
The director loans don’t rise.
The directors loans don't rise, so the amount outstanding is reducing in real terms, as it is getting eroded by inflation.
Their multi millionaires they don’t care and inflation is 2.4%, Rolands debt is rising too at the rate of at least £1mn a month he has been farting around with this deal for a year, that’s £12mn wasted he could have paid them off and be £5mn better off.
So you are saying that it’s the Director loans that are holding this up ?
Only Roland knows that, but he agreed a deal and said he would sort out those Loans without knowing what Ex Directors would say, unless he was told by one that they wouldn’t be a problem. Then guess what there was .
Comments
I've got to stop reading this wretched thread. I've just wasted an hour and a half of a beautiful Sunday morning! Grrrrrr!
So here we are, two weeks away from the new season and still no done deal. Whatever happened to "it will be announced when we know what division we are in"?
What's happened in the past few weeks then?
The fans forum met on 11 July and the minutes from this one agenda meeting can be found here https://www.cafc.co.uk/news/view/5b4642efe6562/club-answer-questions-from-fan-representatives-about-takeover
The meeting was the first public appearance or naming of Lieven De Turck who, as well as representing the club in takeover talks, appears to be acting CEO, FD and head of making ridiculous cuts such as youth team breakfasts and not turning light on during the three days a week he is in the UK.
LDT's statements to the Fans Forum, the supporters' group being much derided in the run up to the meeting but getting an update if nothing else, left people asking for more but according to the regime bean counter:
- The club is satisfied the Australians have the money to purchase the club
- The Australians haven’t been granted exclusivity. It is possible the other party could still purchase the club but they still have certain issues of their own to resolve. The club can’t go in to more detail on these issues because of the NDA
- The sale agreed with the Australians does not include Staprix retaining The Valley or Sparrows Lane.
- There are no issues with regard to former director's loans.
- The only issue holding up the process is EFL approval.
However, the Aussies, according to @Airman Brown, privately dispute that there are no issues with the former director loans although they appear to accept that there is still some paperwork to be signed off by the EFL. What the delay with the EFL is, why it is an issue and when it might be resolved all remain unclear.
It was suggested that Duchatelet had only in June made an offer to the seven former directors and then for only 25% of the value, which was rejected by at least some of them. Airman Brown suggested that at least some of the old directors are in no mind to do any favours for either Duchatelet or Richard Murray, who has £3m of the £7m loan himself, and is still believed by some to be part of a, depending on your outlook, very shy or very mythical, British consortium.
@Davidsmith added weight to this view of the situation when he posted "He (Duchatelet) agreed a deal and said he would sort out those Loans without knowing what Ex Directors would say, unless he was told by one that they wouldn’t be a problem.
Then guess what there was."
@harveys_gardener did some research on the AFC group and found new names attached to the firm although most appeared to be lawyers rather than potential owners. Read more on page 1089 http://forum.charltonlife.com/discussion/77551/sale-of-charlton-pg-946-statement-from-club-expecting-a-takeover-of-the-club-to-be-completed/p1089
A "rumour" that appeared to originate with Colin Sams/Bexley Boy set yet another deadline, this time that nothing would happen until after the Norwich game on 28 July. Why this was the case wasn't made clear.
@Grapevine49 wrote an essay far too long for a summary but still very much worth the read. In essence he debunked the argument, put forward by a few posters, that the Aussies were in anyway responsible for or to blame for the directors loans not being settled. Read it in full here http://forum.charltonlife.com/discussion/77551/sale-of-charlton-pg-946-statement-from-club-expecting-a-takeover-of-the-club-to-be-completed/p1105
Lee Bowyer held an unannounced Q & A at the new kit launch and said that he was meeting with Richard Murray the next day (Friday 20) to learn about progress on the takeover. Lee publicly stated that he didn't feel the uncertainty over the takeover was impacting on player recruitment but he later said that any sale of Josh Magennis was out of his hands.
But with no firm news and little new information that thread continued in what we must now refer to as the @Scoham Takeover Infinity Loop which said poster accurately described as
1. Someone posts they’ve heard the deal may go through next week.
2. Excitement builds as we get close to the deadline.
3. Deadline passes. Nothing is said by the club or reported by the local media.
4. Discussions on here around reasons for the delay amongst more puns, gifs etc.
5. A few agree they have doubts about the Aussies or the deal even going through.
6. Others post that the Aussies aren’t the enemy, RD is to blame etc.
Repeat.
Over to you @AFKABartram
Look at the effing mess, because RD didn't buy us with clean title !
Something does not stack up with this drawn out affair and I feel it is going to come back and bite the supporters on their bottoms.
I take it you are agreeing with my 'decent' post.
If I was them I would not budge an inch.
This is Rolands problem not theirs, they have been constantly ignored , banned and as the Clubs major creditors treated with disrespect.
They have all been very quiet and respectful and in leaving their loans in basically stopped Club from Admin in 2010, in my opinion they deserve every penny back and Roland needs to take his medicine for bad management on the chin.
I'd hate to see how many volumes the full-length version ran for ...
Then guess what there was .