As this is supposed to be an event for the fans, don't invite Km or any of the belgian hierarchy. Jason Euell could come as a representative of the club/management/staff.
When the cheerleaders were first suggested at a meeting several members of staff said that it would be a bad idea and not only had we tried it before but it was to much like Palace.
However, a couple of key members of staff pressed ahead with it and one even asked what is the problem with palace..!!
Once the event had finished and they received negative feedback they looked puzzled.
I find things line this strange, especially as some senior management believe that they fully understand what the customer wants.
This! So much this!
It's just the irredeemable stupidity of it all. Basic common sense. In everyday life, if you have to get someone a Christmas present and you're not sure, you ask them. You don't give them the first random piece of shite you can think of. Charlton are treating us like an annoying relative who they have to get something for but are too stupid/ignorant/arrogant to even make a half-arsed job of it.
Amongst my memories of last years POTY, beyond our table host Glasshalffull getting a bouquet from Katrien, are that the catering company are atrocious, and that the food was inexcusably poor, and also that when Katrien arrived she was in a very bad mood indeed. I know why that was by the way, but it might be better if others recognized that too. I infer from last year's malarkey that Katrien wants control of the event this year so as to not have any, what to her were, uncomfortable surprises. The club's stance on the POTY event this year has resonance with the stuff like house music in crossbars, or the disaster of the open day when Bob Peeters arrived, or cheerleaders, or dare I say it the sofa, or the pre match kids events. There is very little awareness from the club regarding what goes down well with fans. What some great minds at Charlton think of as innovative and creative, be that the way the big screen is used, the mascots, pitch hire adverts, miserably walking around the perimeter pre-match halfheartedly swaying flags, is at best all hit and miss, with only about a 2% hit rate. I have no clue as to who comes up with 'ideas' at the club, but I am certain these ideas are never road tested to any degree, or suggested to fans. It all smacks to me like the Apprentice contestant with the loudest voice and biggest ego shoving their stupid idea down the throats of everybody else and brooking no argument.
Mind you if they dreamed up some crowd pleasing event involving laundry baskets it might have potential, at least that idea has been road tested.
I've not been since RD & KM arrived and based on your feedback, I'm very glad I didn't.
Sorry @ross1, not a criticism of your statement, but, are the players are told what they can and can't do in their spare time ?
They would need permission to attend anything as an employee of the club. So depending on what they were attending and in what capacity, yes.
Blimey, thanks @iainment , didn't realize that. The jokes about North Korea may be not so funny now.......
Pretty standard condition nowadays. I work for a social housing organisation and if I was found to be purporting to represent them in public I could be disciplined.
Thanks again. How about, if, coincidentally, a few football supporters happened to be in a place, where, coincidentally, several people who happen to play for a football team happen to be ? Unlikely, granted, but could happen.
Sorry @ross1, not a criticism of your statement, but, are the players are told what they can and can't do in their spare time ?
They would need permission to attend anything as an employee of the club. So depending on what they were attending and in what capacity, yes.
Blimey, thanks @iainment , didn't realize that. The jokes about North Korea may be not so funny now.......
Pretty standard condition nowadays. I work for a social housing organisation and if I was found to be purporting to represent them in public I could be disciplined.
Thanks again. How about, if, coincidentally, a few football supporters happened to be in a place, where, coincidentally, several people who happen to play for a football team happen to be ? Unlikely, granted, but could happen.
It depends on how much of a bastard someone would be.
Sorry @ross1, not a criticism of your statement, but, are the players are told what they can and can't do in their spare time ?
They would need permission to attend anything as an employee of the club. So depending on what they were attending and in what capacity, yes.
Blimey, thanks @iainment , didn't realize that. The jokes about North Korea may be not so funny now.......
Pretty standard condition nowadays. I work for a social housing organisation and if I was found to be purporting to represent them in public I could be disciplined.
Thanks again. How about, if, coincidentally, a few football supporters happened to be in a place, where, coincidentally, several people who happen to play for a football team happen to be ? Unlikely, granted, but could happen.
It depends on how much of a bastard someone would be.
Sorry, as in me or as in players of any team doing what they would like ? Not having a pop at you, the club, or anyone, just find it weird that any player of any club should be told what they can and cannot do in their own time. Not sure how much some people could be.........
Sorry @ross1, not a criticism of your statement, but, are the players are told what they can and can't do in their spare time ?
They would need permission to attend anything as an employee of the club. So depending on what they were attending and in what capacity, yes.
Blimey, thanks @iainment , didn't realize that. The jokes about North Korea may be not so funny now.......
Pretty standard condition nowadays. I work for a social housing organisation and if I was found to be purporting to represent them in public I could be disciplined.
Thanks again. How about, if, coincidentally, a few football supporters happened to be in a place, where, coincidentally, several people who happen to play for a football team happen to be ? Unlikely, granted, but could happen.
It depends on how much of a bastard someone would be.
Sorry, as in me or as in players of any team doing what they would like ? Not having a pop at you, the club, or anyone, just find it weird that any player of any club should be told what they can and cannot do in their own time. If the "bastard" Quote was aimed at me, not on Son.
As a meeting it lacked a decent chairperson who really should have been beginning the issue with who tabled the motion/subject and then allow debate and then what action would be taken and this to be followed up at the next meeting. There should have been ,by the chairperson, the actions agreed upon at the previous meeting and asking the persons responsible to present their requesated actions to the meeting. Yes it is a forum/ a discussion but if you, say, are asking for clarification on strategy or anything else (eg.net earnings on player sales and purchases) then that could be produced prior to the next meeting for discussion. The written text presented at the start of the meeting should have been given with the explanation that any items in this text can be cited for discussion in the next meeting after people have had the chance to read and think about it. There was little initiative given by the fans themselves and I would suggest a text handed out by rikofold at the next meeting with all the data produced from the survey /questionnaires he has overseen that again can be put as a discussion topic for the next meeting. THE FANS NEED TO TAKE THE INITIATIVE IN A FANS FORUM NOT THE CLUB. So in a way we are letting ourselves down by a. not turning up (apparently some fans decided not to go) b. not seizing the initiative in these meetings. The fact that the fans did not do this means that the club takes the initiative, sets the tone of the meeting, and makes it feel like it is an intimidating place to be.
I think it is fine that this meeting has club employees in it – but there is more of an issue that there are not other meetings with more fans. Some points were made but it was all very corporate. The club shouldn’t pretend that it is a dialogue with fans. It was good that Meire was challenged on her comments, but the chap doing so was a bit on his own. She was suggesting that people who have judged her hadn’t seen the video, but he said he had seen the video and interpreted it badly. He explained about the comments about the fans representing only one third of revenue that was part of those comments and she didn’t explain these. I thought it was an opportunity for her to apologise on record, but it was everybody else’s fault as usual. She could have easily said in Dublin, something like– ‘when I say weird I mean weird in a good way, as it is better they protest than just walk away’. But hearing what she said before and after the weird bit – it wasn’t praising the fans she was doing, it was more sarcastically lampooning them, and she can’t weedle out of that.
The rubbish about communicating better and this meeting being part of that. Having your employess tell everybody how great you are shows you like to employ yes men – and women, rather than represents good communications. Skirting over the difficult questions, which are what all the protests are about, is not communicating. I thought, with no disrespect, some of the dissenting voices could have been clearer. I mean, it is lazy to make out it is about money – but this point wasn’t challenged sufficiently. The point is it is about how managers are sacked and appointed, and how players are recruited that the fans take issue with. I would like to have heard a proper discussion about why Riga was sacked, why Powell wasn’t allowed to get on with it for a period with his own players, why Fraeye was appointed, why the squad has been so weak in this season and last that we have had to put out teams that were beaten before the match kicked off. These are valid questions and are not about money, but are about how the club is run. Taking previous comments from Meire, we feel we know the answer to that, which is, that is how the owner wants to run his club and it is his club to do as he likes with. That is why we are protesting. If that isn’t the case we need to be told, but we know that it is the case and the crazy decisions are out there for all to see, the press to comment on and laugh at, and us to protest about.
As a meeting it lacked a decent chairperson who really should have been beginning the issue with who tabled the motion/subject and then allow debate and then what action would be taken and this to be followed up at the next meeting. There should have been ,by the chairperson, the actions agreed upon at the previous meeting and asking the persons responsible to present their requesated actions to the meeting. Yes it is a forum/ a discussion but if you, say, are asking for clarification on strategy or anything else (eg.net earnings on player sales and purchases) then that could be produced prior to the next meeting for discussion. The written text presented at the start of the meeting should have been given with the explanation that any items in this text can be cited for discussion in the next meeting after people have had the chance to read and think about it. There was little initiative given by the fans themselves and I would suggest a text handed out by rikofold at the next meeting with all the data produced from the survey /questionnaires he has overseen that again can be put as a discussion topic for the next meeting. THE FANS NEED TO TAKE THE INITIATIVE IN A FANS FORUM NOT THE CLUB. So in a way we are letting ourselves down by a. not turning up (apparently some fans decided not to go) b. not seizing the initiative in these meetings. The fact that the fans did not do this means that the club takes the initiative, sets the tone of the meeting, and makes it feel like it is an intimidating place to be.
watching it further through (doing it in various sittings) and katrien shakes her head when (i believe its rikofold?) says we've got worse despite paying 9 million net on transfers.
You can probably roughly work it out. If we're losing £6-7m a year and there's been an operating loss funding requirement over that time of £8.3m, presumably most of all of the difference is outgoing transfers, around £4-6m.
You can probably roughly work it out. If we're losing £6-7m a year and there's been an operating loss funding requirement over that time of £8.3m, presumably most of all of the difference is outgoing transfers, around £4-6m.
If this is a true figure then why put a spin on it? It is the bullshit that winds me up....along with everthing else☺
I've made that point to David Joyes. I do think the club shoot themselves in the foot because their default position seems to be to be as guarded as possible.
watching it further through (doing it in various sittings) and katrien shakes her head when (i believe its rikofold?) says we've got worse despite paying 9 million net on transfers.
What planet is she living on?
Unbelievable... It's like she keeps telling lies and now it's got to the point where she believes them as truth...
You can probably roughly work it out. If we're losing £6-7m a year and there's been an operating loss funding requirement over that time of £8.3m, presumably most of all of the difference is outgoing transfers, around £4-6m.
It's going to be higher than that. You can draw some conclusions from the declared profit on player sales of £6.1m in the last two published years since logically the income can't be less than the profit - and there is only Button and Shelvey add-on that falls before RD which is mostly offset by Wiggins, whose fee was in the current accounting period as he was sold in August 2015. I covered this in VOTV123, but income is likely to be close to spending on fees. RD could even be ahead as Joyes will also be counting fees RD paid himself for Reza, Tucudean, Nego in his £9m - it's clear from the 2014 accounts there was a substantial fee for Reza and something for Nego.
You can probably roughly work it out. If we're losing £6-7m a year and there's been an operating loss funding requirement over that time of £8.3m, presumably most of all of the difference is outgoing transfers, around £4-6m.
It's going to be higher than that. You can draw some conclusions from the declared profit on player sales of £6.1m in the last two published years since logically the income can't be less than the profit - and there is only Button and Shelvey add-on that falls before RD which is mostly offset by Wiggins, whose fee was in the current accounting period as he was sold in August 2015. I covered this in VOTV123, but income is likely to be close to spending on fees. RD could even be ahead as Joyes will also be counting fees RD paid himself for Reza, Tucudean, Nego in his £9m - it's clear from the 2014 accounts there was a substantial fee for Reza and something for Nego.
Well that would mean either that some incoming fees haven't been accounted for or operating loss is much higher?
You can probably roughly work it out. If we're losing £6-7m a year and there's been an operating loss funding requirement over that time of £8.3m, presumably most of all of the difference is outgoing transfers, around £4-6m.
It's going to be higher than that. You can draw some conclusions from the declared profit on player sales of £6.1m in the last two published years since logically the income can't be less than the profit - and there is only Button and Shelvey add-on that falls before RD which is mostly offset by Wiggins, whose fee was in the current accounting period as he was sold in August 2015. I covered this in VOTV123, but income is likely to be close to spending on fees. RD could even be ahead as Joyes will also be counting fees RD paid himself for Reza, Tucudean, Nego in his £9m - it's clear from the 2014 accounts there was a substantial fee for Reza and something for Nego.
Well that would mean either that some incoming fees haven't been accounted for or operating loss is much higher?
We need to see the audited accounts for 2014/15 before we can reach any conclusions. What they say and what's in the programme will only be a version of the truth. The fact remains that for there to be a £6.1m profit on transfers there has to be a minimum of £6.1m in income - unless someone better qualified than me can explain why not (i have been through it with a qualified accountant who has relevant experience though). From that you have to deduct the July 1st 2013-Jan 4th 2014 profit, i.e. any on Button (fee and cost are likely to cancel out) and the Shelvey additions, then add Wiggins, reported to be £750k fee having signed on a Bosman, from recollection. Finally, take into account the amortisation of the Vetokele, Reza, Polish Pete and any other fees for players signed and not sold, which would reduce the stated profit, i.e. it has to be considerably more than £6.1m to start with.
Congratulations to everyone who got through that video. I lasted 12 mins when I decided I'd rather do this:
I didn't manage it. I couldn't stand looking at her face and listening to her yap for longer than 10 minutes. Thanks to all who have commented in this thread which has outlined all the major points.
Key is the strategy of breaking even. Cloud cuckoo land with our infrastructure and academy unless you can unearth a couple of Gomez every year and sell them for what they are worth rather than £3.5m. They need to be grilled on how they expect to achieve it, especially with support (income) dwindling while maintaining a product that people want to watch. Financials, I don't think we'll understand until he exits but the loan interest is ominous. Doubt Gartside has similar at Bolton or Abramovic.
They still think it is about performance on the pitch and a failure to communicate (Cool Hand Luke fan).
After 2 years I am no wiser as to their strategy unless it is RD playing real life football manager by trading players most of whom have been discarded and not fit for purpose. Watch academy players before they play in the Premiership? She claimed her Dublin interview; weird; customers; had been twisted by social media and then proceeded to give her actual words a spin on what she actually said.
Like to see a video of the next July/August fans forum when they have done their new budgets based on ST sales, regardless of whether we are in this division or lower. We'll have Roly's chauffer watching Belgian sunday park football for our new squad.
Finally, not only KM came across as being incompetent. The chair was inadequate as mentioned above. The handout being dished out rather than being on everyones place to be digested and resonses prepared while meeting called to order, the imbalance of fans/staff, and how much are they paying talentless Tony? Only the CFO came across as someone adept and only because he was dodging bullets while appearing to give answers. I've seen managers on £40k give better run meetings to discuss strategies and how to achieve them. All a PR nonsense. Wonder if RD was impressed?
Comments
It's just the irredeemable stupidity of it all. Basic common sense. In everyday life, if you have to get someone a Christmas present and you're not sure, you ask them. You don't give them the first random piece of shite you can think of. Charlton are treating us like an annoying relative who they have to get something for but are too stupid/ignorant/arrogant to even make a half-arsed job of it.
Ticket manager used to work for Palace and won an employee of the month award whilst she was there,
How about, if, coincidentally, a few football supporters happened to be in a place, where, coincidentally, several people who happen to play for a football team happen to be ?
Unlikely, granted, but could happen.
Not having a pop at you, the club, or anyone, just find it weird that any player of any club should be told what they can and cannot do in their own time.
Not sure how much some people could be.........
The rubbish about communicating better and this meeting being part of that. Having your employess tell everybody how great you are shows you like to employ yes men – and women, rather than represents good communications. Skirting over the difficult questions, which are what all the protests are about, is not communicating. I thought, with no disrespect, some of the dissenting voices could have been clearer. I mean, it is lazy to make out it is about money – but this point wasn’t challenged sufficiently. The point is it is about how managers are sacked and appointed, and how players are recruited that the fans take issue with. I would like to have heard a proper discussion about why Riga was sacked, why Powell wasn’t allowed to get on with it for a period with his own players, why Fraeye was appointed, why the squad has been so weak in this season and last that we have had to put out teams that were beaten before the match kicked off. These are valid questions and are not about money, but are about how the club is run. Taking previous comments from Meire, we feel we know the answer to that, which is, that is how the owner wants to run his club and it is his club to do as he likes with. That is why we are protesting. If that isn’t the case we need to be told, but we know that it is the case and the crazy decisions are out there for all to see, the press to comment on and laugh at, and us to protest about.
What planet is she living on?
They still think it is about performance on the pitch and a failure to communicate (Cool Hand Luke fan).
After 2 years I am no wiser as to their strategy unless it is RD playing real life football manager by trading players most of whom have been discarded and not fit for purpose. Watch academy players before they play in the Premiership? She claimed her Dublin interview; weird; customers; had been twisted by social media and then proceeded to give her actual words a spin on what she actually said.
Like to see a video of the next July/August fans forum when they have done their new budgets based on ST sales, regardless of whether we are in this division or lower. We'll have Roly's chauffer watching Belgian sunday park football for our new squad.
Finally, not only KM came across as being incompetent. The chair was inadequate as mentioned above. The handout being dished out rather than being on everyones place to be digested and resonses prepared while meeting called to order, the imbalance of fans/staff, and how much are they paying talentless Tony? Only the CFO came across as someone adept and only because he was dodging bullets while appearing to give answers. I've seen managers on £40k give better run meetings to discuss strategies and how to achieve them. All a PR nonsense. Wonder if RD was impressed?