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Supporters trust meet with KM and RM

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  • It's a start and Rome wasn't built in a day. Keep talking, keep engaging. The Trust aren't the only group out there. There needs to be involvement of the supporter club branches if schemes like Target 20,000 are going to be succesful. Small steps will soon turn big strides ...
  • Good that the trust has started to get some kind of dialogue going.
  • edited November 2015
    Can I humbly suggest that a new survey (soz) is done to gauge how Trust and non-Trust members feel about the situation now?
  • Why didn't the trust tell any of there members about this meeting before attending it?
  • _MrDick said:

    The Trust aren't the only group out there. There needs to be involvement of the supporter club branches

    Don't forget Syd
  • protests should now increase. Miere and the Trust are welcome to each other but new owners is still the only solution.
  • edited November 2015

    Off_it said:

    Why does it matter Henry? Seriously, I don't get it.

    It's actually a pretty important question.

    If the meeting was in the pipeline but not yet scheduled before the fans meeting, I would have an issue with that.
    I learnt a lesson pretty early on in an advertising agency that you do not count on anything, be it a meeting, an approval, delivery of campaign proposal, whatever, until you have rock solid, incontrovertible evidence that it is actually happening. Failure to be prudent in that way results in, at minimum, you ending up looking bloody stupid, and possibly worse, making bad decisions because you counted on something happening that did not happen.
    OK, last comment on this (maybe) but what you seem to be saying, rather cryptically, is that "the meeting" was provisionally arranged at the time of the trust AGM but not 100% confirmed.

    Hence Rikofold and SE9Addick being happy to say that the meeting wasn't, as I said, "scheduled" ie a firm date hadn't been confirmed

    But it seems the meeting was in the pipeline enough for it to be mentioned as at least a distinct possibility at the AGM. Hence the reluctance to say anything other than that the meeting wasn't "scheduled".

    It would have been better had the trust headline been "Board agree to set up Target 20k group and reform fans forum" rather than focusing on the fact that they had had a meeting.

    Regardless of how the Trust has managed this the move towards setting up the T20k group and reforming the fans forum are both steps forwards.

    Fans are right to be cynical about how much input and commitment there will be from KM but the proof of the pudding will be in the eating.

    The fans need to prove to KM that they have something valuable and constructive to offer and KM needs to prove that she is willing to listen and accept that ideas and experience from outside Belgium and her small coterie of trusted managers have value and will help her and the club.

    We shall see.
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  • cafc999 said:

    Why didn't the trust tell any of there members about this meeting before attending it?

    Why do you feel they have to? I'm a member and I'm happy to receive information after a meeting, it makes no difference to me that I didn't know there was a meeting scheduled.
  • it's a real mess isn't it. I can see why the Trust want dialogue and I understand why some want to protest. I just don't see the dialogue leading anywhere, I just see it as lip service by the Club so it appears they are listening/willing to change but ultimately nothing will change

    So in that case you are only really protesting for them to leave if you see no improvement value whatsoever in dialogue. Is that right?

    The two aspects, protest / dialogue do not have to be mutually joined, and nor do the individuals group leading / supporting imo
    I'm not protesting for them to leave as I don't think there is a viable alternative out there with the funds available to buy RD out, even if he wanted out.

    I'm protesting for them to recognise that their vision isn't working. If you want to increase attendances then having a decent Manager and a squad fit for purpose is a good start. You won't increase crowds if those you bring in witness the dross we have over the last two seasons, they will come once but not again.

    I'm all for dialogue if I thought they were serious but I don't.



  • kentred2 said:

    protests should now increase. Miere and the Trust are welcome to each other but new owners is still the only solution.

    Ok so is anyone looking to get some new owners? Maybe the Trust can add to Ackworths work and do that as well. It will also enable us to set criteria for new owners, because once we replace this lot, we'll have another lot and as Portsmouth have shown new owners replacing old owners does not mean better owners.
  • Off_it said:

    Why does it matter Henry? Seriously, I don't get it.

    It's actually a pretty important question.

    If the meeting was in the pipeline but not yet scheduled before the fans meeting, I would have an issue with that.
    I learnt a lesson pretty early on in an advertising agency that you do not count on anything, be it a meeting, an approval, delivery of campaign proposal, whatever, until you have rock solid, incontrovertible evidence that it is actually happening. Failure to be prudent in that way results in, at minimum, you ending up looking bloody stupid, and possibly worse, making bad decisions because you counted on something happening that did not happen.
    Judging by that response you've had more than one meeting with Katrien :wink:
  • cafc999 said:

    Why didn't the trust tell any of there members about this meeting before attending it?

    Why it will never work.
  • edited November 2015

    cafc999 said:

    Why didn't the trust tell any of there members about this meeting before attending it?

    Why do you feel they have to? I'm a member and I'm happy to receive information after a meeting, it makes no difference to me that I didn't know there was a meeting scheduled.
    Me too.

    What I'm not happy about is that the Trust went out of their way to emphatically deny any such meeting was to take place or indeed, even in the pipeline.

    Why would they do that?
    What did they hope to achieve by denying it?
    Who told them to keep it hush hush?
    And most importantly, if it was agreed to be confidential, why did three separate people let Henry know?

    I'm sure KM has noted that last point.

  • Surely it's a good thing if the club is starting to communicate more?
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  • Addickted said:

    cafc999 said:

    Why didn't the trust tell any of there members about this meeting before attending it?

    Why do you feel they have to? I'm a member and I'm happy to receive information after a meeting, it makes no difference to me that I didn't know there was a meeting scheduled.
    Me too.

    What I'm not happy about is that the Trust went out of their way to emphatically deny any such meeting was to take place or indeed, even in the pipeline.

    Why would they do that?
    What did they hope to achieve by denying it?
    Who told them to keep it hush hush?
    And most importantly, if it was agreed to be confidential, why did three separate people let Henry know?

    I'm sure KM has noted that last point.

    Perhaps more alarmingly... did the Trust fear that an over-zealous approach to the Fans Meeting would jeopardise this meeting ever being arranged?

    I can't see how it would have been anything other than impossible to not have this in the back of their mind when questioning and challenging answers.

    Given the role the Trust played in developing the themes of questions with other Fans Representatives... the neutrality of the Fans Meeting should be questioned.

    As supporters, trust members or both there should be clear answers on this.
  • deary me... this is one of those moments when I'd like to walk away from cafc (because of comments like this) far worse than our club being victim to the experiments of a mega rich eccentric
  • all good points
  • edited November 2015
    but wrong, the themes were commonly developed in particular by Grapevine - not on the Trust, as well as others, also deeply insulting to the intelligence of the Fans Forum people you @LargeAddick are so often claiming to defend, the level of cynicism, bickering and shit slinging on here just beggars belief.

    If you can't see that this is a tricky situation, with no easy answer, and extremely to hard to retain a positive agenda, then you need to open your eyes a bit.
  • razil said:

    deary me... this is one of those moments when I'd like to walk away from cafc (because of comments like this) far worse than our club being victim to the experiments of a mega rich eccentric

    Really? That's a surprisingly childish reaction to a genuine question.

    Do you not think that the approach taken by the Trust to *potentially* have a meeting with the club and not disclose it whilst playing a role in the Fans Meeting could be perceived a conflict of interest?

    As it happens I believe positive dialogue is a good step forward and I have no issue with that - just the way it has all transpired doesn't look good.
  • razil said:

    but wrong, the themes were commonly developed in particular by Grapevine - not on the Trust, as well as others, also deeply insulting to the intelligence of the Fans Forum people you @LargeAddick are so often claiming to defend, the level of cynicism, bickering and shit slinging on here just beggars belief.

    If you can't see that this is a tricky situation, with no easy answer, and extremely to hard to retain a positive agenda, then you need to open your eyes a bit.

    and you need to get a thicker skin
  • Nicholas said:

    Has anyone actually told them if they brought enough decent players and a decent manager and worked on making the club successful on the pitch then all their target 20000, their hospitality, and other crap they are trying to get us to buy into will actually be a success then and not before.

    Nutshell.
  • Your 4th point was a pretty strong and outrageous accusation, as well deeply insulting to other members of the FF, and not an accurate portrayal of what happened on this message board involving a wide range of groups and individuals.


    If the sort of relationship and access we want a Trust to have is on a par with the Supporters' Director, we have to put some faith in that group, wouldn't you agree? Perhaps participate in the process, maybe go to some meetings like the AGM, and respect the confidences of such meetings, maybe even talk to people direct, most of them are known.

    I don't necessarily agree with everything they do, but I've taken the time to talk to the TB and believe them to have a great deal of integrity.
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