Interestingly Chris Sutton says this on the BBC feed...
The Dutch were in a different league tonight, they were slick and they played the ball better than England.
Do people agree or like me do people think that the Dutch mainly have to rely on the set pieces with van Dijk and de Ligt on the end of them...
Of course passing the ball about is all well and good provided you can do something with it, but apart from our errors I found the Netherlands extremely ordinary and certainly lacked the composure in front of goal like when they had the likes of Kluivert / van Persie / van Nistelrooy etc.
What would’ve happened if we’d won this ‘competition’ and what happens now we’re out? I still don’t understand
We'd have been awarded a trophy
Nothing else would have happened... These Finals are only to decide a winner of the competition and have no bearing on Euro 2020 or the Play-Offs to Qualify for it
The argument here is watch how we do at the Euros. Gareth has earned that with two semi finals, that I can accept.
If we go out early though with a massively talented squad, has anything really changed?And that is what I fear will happen.
Theres just too much being done wrong, from poor defensive coaching to simple subs (taking off our best attacking outlet tonight)
I want England to do more well then anything, and they should, but I just can’t see it under Gareth sadly.
What will be your approach if we reach the Quarters or Semi Final next year?
I agree that it would be a shocker if we went out any sooner depending on who / how we depart the tournament
It depends, I wouldn’t even mind if we went out QF playing some solid football, but I do want to see us compete with a big side in a major tournament.
Belgium, Croatia, Holland - they’ve all turned us over when it matters. Whether it be 352 or 433, these top teams and managers know how to exploit our flimsy football, we saw that again tonight.
I’ve wondered what dele alli brings to the table the last couple of seasons. Great with the ball at his feet, but not a great passer and doesn’t make great decisions imo
The Dutch have the best ‘core’ of a side maybe in world football.
They have no attack though, conceding 3 to them is shocking.
At least they were mistakes of our own doing though. I’m not happy about that but at least we know that a decent side like Netherlands can’t completely out play us.
Cutting out our silly errors is at least something we can have control over. It’s been a while since England have played that badly, and overall we weren’t dreadful - just a couple of stupid blunders.
Interestingly Chris Sutton says this on the BBC feed...
The Dutch were in a different league tonight, they were slick and they played the ball better than England.
Do people agree or like me do people think that the Dutch mainly have to rely on the set pieces with van Dijk and de Ligt on the end of them...
Of course passing the ball about is all well and good provided you can do something with it, but apart from our errors I found the Netherlands extremely ordinary and certainly lacked the composure in front of goal like when they had the likes of Kluivert / van Persie / van Nistelrooy etc.
Spot on. I thought the Netherlands were bang average and were restricted to knocking it around in our half with no attacking threat whatsoever. Saying that though I didn’t think we were up to much either, midfield was ropey. They gave us 1 goal and we gave them 2. Kyle Walker and Stones had shockers.
Interestingly Chris Sutton says this on the BBC feed...
The Dutch were in a different league tonight, they were slick and they played the ball better than England.
Do people agree or like me do people think that the Dutch mainly have to rely on the set pieces with van Dijk and de Ligt on the end of them...
Of course passing the ball about is all well and good provided you can do something with it, but apart from our errors I found the Netherlands extremely ordinary and certainly lacked the composure in front of goal like when they had the likes of Kluivert / van Persie / van Nistelrooy etc.
Chris Sutton is THE worst pundit I often have to remind myself that he ever played football at all!
I completely agree the Dutch rely heavily on set pieces. It was clear to see. I’m all for passing it out from the back if you have the players to do so. Continuing to do it ad nauseam when we clearly haven’t, only results in one thing, mistakes.
I know the European Finals last week are a factor, but I don't understand why you play a years worth of international matches to get down to the semi finals of a competition & then play a weakened team.
I was in the pub this evening (with no TV) and was asked by a Dutchman what the score was, and I told him (after looking at my phone) 2:1 to England, as at the time I checked on my phone the goal hadn't been disallowed
Interestingly Chris Sutton says this on the BBC feed...
The Dutch were in a different league tonight, they were slick and they played the ball better than England.
Do people agree or like me do people think that the Dutch mainly have to rely on the set pieces with van Dijk and de Ligt on the end of them...
Of course passing the ball about is all well and good provided you can do something with it, but apart from our errors I found the Netherlands extremely ordinary and certainly lacked the composure in front of goal like when they had the likes of Kluivert / van Persie / van Nistelrooy etc.
Chris Sutton is an anti English prick. The minute we listen to him is the minute I stop following football.
Still getting us further than any other Manager in over 20 years though...
Let’s be really honest, we didn’t play anyone good until Croatia, we lost
We have had a good 45 against Spain, that’s it.
Its all well and good saying Gareth can get us to a semi, but we won’t win anything with this man in charge.
Because we won anything with a big name like Eriksson or Capello?
Those two ruined the England team because they focused solely on the big names and didnt take a look at the youngsters coming through - Gareth is doing the opposite and probably would have named a different team for these finals (he this as much) had the U21 Championships not been the same summer
You're one of the only ones talking sense. Definitely a massive knee jerk reaction.
That being said, Gareth can make some bizarre tactical moves. I don't think he's the best manager in the world but we have been there with big names with a good team on paper and dont nothing.
Still getting us further than any other Manager in over 20 years though...
Let’s be really honest, we didn’t play anyone good until Croatia, we lost
We have had a good 45 against Spain, that’s it.
Its all well and good saying Gareth can get us to a semi, but we won’t win anything with this man in charge.
I don't know why posts like this get lols it's proper childish. Is he that wrong?
At the world cup semis yeah. But we lost to the only two good teams we played against. Colombia we struggled and they were missing their star man, Sweden is Sweden nothing special just disciplined and we lost our nerve against a Croatia side that only has a handful of good players.
Southgate is a top top bloke and I am not for a second entertaining the idea of him getting the chop but he is tactically naive and does have the issue England managers have had in the past, not being brave enough and keeping too many of the old guard.
Holland's weakness was clear as day tonight, their make shift right back Dumfries was a mess and Blind is hardly a quality fullback. We have Rashford, Sancho, Sterling. Players with frightening pace and trickery. Instead of taking on their weakness we play straight through the middle towards de Jong when we haven't got a centre mid near his level. Crosses weren't going to be effective, VVD and de Ligt are units. The best plan of play was looking for openings on the flanks, play low crosses and keep it on the ground and move it quick.
I don't think it's good enough, if Holland had our attacking line tonight it could have been 6/7 nil. We have the defenders (when Southgate shows the balls and drops Stones and Walker) we have a solid goalie, we have unreal options up front. Our weakness lies in the midfield. Why are we playing a system that relies on world class midfielders?
We either need to scrap the system and play to our strengths or stop playing these average players in the midfield and try and bring through the likes of Winks and Foden. Otherwise we never will win anything and it's a shame cause we could
Walker and Stones absolutely need to go, Stones is 6 years older than de Ligt and de Ligt is a much better defender already. He hasn't progressed he is being rucksacked by a world class man city midfield. Ditto Walker, pace saves him most of the time, Trent and Wan-Bissaka are both much better and younger. There is a reason Pep is in the transfer market for a new right back and partner for Laporte. It's so bloody obvious to see and if Southgate is the man to take us to the next level he will drop both for the Switzerland game
Comments
Fine margins
Not great performance, not quite good enough, dreadful mistakes at back and a few of them.
Holland will be a force I think in the next few years.
We will be there or there abouts....
C+ could do better...
Shocking everywhere - probably not.
Pickford was outstanding and let in 3 - that’s food for thought.
The Dutch were in a different league tonight, they were slick and they played the ball better than England.
Do people agree or like me do people think that the Dutch mainly have to rely on the set pieces with van Dijk and de Ligt on the end of them...
Of course passing the ball about is all well and good provided you can do something with it, but apart from our errors I found the Netherlands extremely ordinary and certainly lacked the composure in front of goal like when they had the likes of Kluivert / van Persie / van Nistelrooy etc.
If we go out early though with a massively talented squad, has anything really changed?And that is what I fear will happen.
Theres just too much being done wrong, from poor defensive coaching to simple subs (taking off our best attacking outlet tonight)
I want England to do more well then anything, and they should, but I just can’t see it under Gareth sadly.
Nothing else would have happened... These Finals are only to decide a winner of the competition and have no bearing on Euro 2020 or the Play-Offs to Qualify for it
I agree that it would be a shocker if we went out any sooner depending on who / how we depart the tournament
Who would you have instead for England?
They have no attack though, conceding 3 to them is shocking.
Belgium, Croatia, Holland - they’ve all turned us over when it matters. Whether it be 352 or 433, these top teams and managers know how to exploit our flimsy football, we saw that again tonight.
Cutting out our silly errors is at least something we can have control over. It’s been a while since England have played that badly, and overall we weren’t dreadful - just a couple of stupid blunders.
I completely agree the Dutch rely heavily on set pieces. It was clear to see.
I’m all for passing it out from the back if you have the players to do so.
Continuing to do it ad nauseam when we clearly haven’t, only results in one thing, mistakes.
After our last world cup campaign.
The Germans
The Dutch
The Italians
Have had a wake up call of epic proportions.
I may well have already seen the best England side in my lifetime!
No pressure game, play the youngsters and we could win that by 2 or 3
If we revert to the ‘safety’ of Stones and Walker down that right side I just don’t know
They played De Jong and De Ligt, we played Delph and Walker.
Fake news...
That being said, Gareth can make some bizarre tactical moves. I don't think he's the best manager in the world but we have been there with big names with a good team on paper and dont nothing.
At the world cup semis yeah. But we lost to the only two good teams we played against. Colombia we struggled and they were missing their star man, Sweden is Sweden nothing special just disciplined and we lost our nerve against a Croatia side that only has a handful of good players.
Southgate is a top top bloke and I am not for a second entertaining the idea of him getting the chop but he is tactically naive and does have the issue England managers have had in the past, not being brave enough and keeping too many of the old guard.
Holland's weakness was clear as day tonight, their make shift right back Dumfries was a mess and Blind is hardly a quality fullback. We have Rashford, Sancho, Sterling. Players with frightening pace and trickery. Instead of taking on their weakness we play straight through the middle towards de Jong when we haven't got a centre mid near his level. Crosses weren't going to be effective, VVD and de Ligt are units. The best plan of play was looking for openings on the flanks, play low crosses and keep it on the ground and move it quick.
I don't think it's good enough, if Holland had our attacking line tonight it could have been 6/7 nil. We have the defenders (when Southgate shows the balls and drops Stones and Walker) we have a solid goalie, we have unreal options up front. Our weakness lies in the midfield. Why are we playing a system that relies on world class midfielders?
We either need to scrap the system and play to our strengths or stop playing these average players in the midfield and try and bring through the likes of Winks and Foden. Otherwise we never will win anything and it's a shame cause we could