How did this nation ever win two world wars? Never thought I'd see so much flapping, panicking and pant-pissing over a decent though not world-class Championship defender leaving for pastures new. Some of you need to calm the f**k down. ( ;-) )
How did this nation ever win two world wars? Never thought I'd see so much flapping, panicking and pant-pissing over a decent though not world-class Championship defender leaving for pastures new. Some of you need to calm the f**k down. ( ;-) )
Well maybe if we had some Americans (Josh Harris) riding in to save the day then we'd all feel a bit more confident about success :-)
How did this nation ever win two world wars? Never thought I'd see so much flapping, panicking and pant-pissing over a decent though not world-class Championship defender leaving for pastures new. Some of you need to calm the f**k down. ( ;-) )
Well maybe if we had some Americans (Josh Harris) riding in to save the day then we'd all feel a bit more confident about success :-)
Ok. Having seen Poyet in the youth team & the pre season friendly at Bromley. I think Poyet improved from being not good enough for the first team to being our best player. A jump of over 18 places.
Dervite improved from being about 8th best to 5th best. About 3 places.
Just my opinion.
Like I say I'm sure Barca will be putting in a late bid for Dervite :-)
I'm not sure why a couple of guys, don't get my logic.
If Evina went from being a non 1st team regular, to being the POTY, surely he would have been the most improved ?
I preferred Green, but really. We lose 6 million a year. Bolton lose millions for every season they were in the premier. And we should be competing with them, over a patchy champ player? A four year contract?
I'm glad we've got a club. Over paying for average players, is the economics of having to find some other fool every two years to lose 30 million. I'm glad whether it fails or not Duchatelet has an mo, which won't have the absolute inevetibility of receivership in two years w.
Bankrupt country, bankrupt clubs, and bankrupt brains.
With a goal difference of -20 (MINUS TWENTY) I would have thought any defensive player would be under scrutiny.
FFS, reading the Evina thread you would have thought he was Roberto Carlos....
DD was alright, but not much more than that.
This however most of the goal difference was the impotent strike forces fault. We had a poor team last year so it seems a good idea to change players this summer imo
Real shame. And I do lay this at RD's door - those of you blaming the chuckle brothers are beginning to sound like the current government blaming everything wrong on Labour still. Ultimately, once you are in power, you make the decisions and carry the can. Entirely within RD's control to negotiate with DD and the others we would all like to keep - especially when we are seemingly losing out to close rivals in terms of league position. As Henry says, if RD gets the credit for signing up Wiggins and Jackson, then he also takes the rap when we fail to re-sign solid players.
I do also agree we have to stay calm and wait and see, but a bit more of the soul of the club goes for me every time we say good-bye to a player who has shown commitment and no little ability in his time here. I've tried to "buy the dream" of better replacements eg Astrit, but he hasn't lasted very long either on the pitch or within the club...
Bloody hell, being compared to David Cameon now. In all honestly though Weegie what shoud we do. We've offered three years on a salary we consider appropriate. Bolton offer four years and probably a bit more money. Should we say we raise you to five years and an extra grand a week? Should we hell as like. We should offer what we consider right and stick to it. We are to,d tha with FFP we have to live within our means and that players wages will be falling as a result. We can't cave in the first time someone rejects a contract. Maybe Devite is being greedy. After all Jacko and Wiggins were happy with the terms offered. Maybe the Club feels that with the money available they can do better. I'd have liked Dorian to have stayed but I'm not sure he is even worth a three year contract yet alone four and its not as if we are losing a Mendonca or a Hunt. He's a centre half, he's replaceable.
I do agree we need to wait and see. Katrien said wait on judge on what happens this summer. She also said they want their business done by end of June. Let's see where we are on 1st July.
So another mercenary footballer has left our Club to earn a few bob more elsewhere. He won't be the last.
Happy we offered him a new improved contract - if he didn't feel it was good enough then we move on. RD has made it clear we pay what we can afford and I for one find it difficult to argue with that.
“Annual income twenty pounds, annual expenditure nineteen six, result happiness. Annual income twenty pounds, annual expenditure twenty pound ought and six, result misery.”
Good luck Dorian ( if true ) and thanks for giving your best in a Charlton shirt.
I'm guessing Morro , Hamer & Poyet are next , i hope we have a cunning back up plan , which does not include parachuting Riga in for the last 10 games.
I'm disapponted if this is true as I really like Dervite. That said, we need to remember as players leave that they were part of a squad that nearly got relegated. Absolutely no one in our squad who may be candidates for departure is irreplaceable, regardless of how much we liked them with the possible - but only possible - exception of Poyet. It all depends on the calibre of replacements of course but onwards and upwards
If Harriott was sold 5 weeks ago people would be saying good luck hope it works out in league one, fwd 5 weeks and it would be fecking Roland what are you doing? Calm down people its only May the 15th, shouldn't we all be concentrating on another dazzling performance from England next month, chill out all will be ok.
Some of the negativity on this thread is just so depressing. Despite RD saving us from the moronic & hopeless Chuckle Brothers, giving us solid financial security for the first time in years, saving us from certain relegation by appointing JR, buying us a brand new pitch & investing heavily at the Academy, some people are still lining up to have a pop just because one average player is leaving as he got a better offer elsewhere. Some of you must have been really disappointed that we actually stayed up last year!!
Roland really knows how to divide the supporters. I am willing to give time to see what happens, barr Riga the onfield player contract / negotiations have not been in anyway impressive. Off field with pitch, sponsor and academy developments are good but does that mean that Charlton supporters have to be happy with a mediocre / league 1 football team ? The litmus test of being a Charlton supporter is not to have to have total faith in Roland. On onfield players contracts, Roland has not earn't that trust yet.
I think the next 2 months will see the proof of the Roland pudding. Charlton supporters should keep their heads until then, but I do understand some Charlton supporters concern about the level of his ambition.
I'm disapponted if this is true as I really like Dervite. That said, we need to remember as players leave that they were part of a squad that nearly got relegated. Absolutely no one in our squad who may be candidates for departure is irreplaceable, regardless of how much we liked them with the possible - but only possible - exception of Poyet. It all depends on the calibre of replacements of course but onwards and upwards
Blaming the better players in the team for being in the relegation zone is wrong. It was the weaknesses up front, right midfield, and creative midfield were the main reasons for being in the relegation zone.
If Harriott was sold 5 weeks ago people would be saying good luck hope it works out in league one, fwd 5 weeks and it would be fecking Roland what are you doing? Calm down people its only May the 15th, shouldn't we all be concentrating on another dazzling performance from England next month, chill out all will be ok.
Good job the world cup is there to distract us all next month. Hopefully by the end of it, Charlton will have a half way decent team. It will be a whole lot clearer by then in any case what kind team, the owners think is acceptable.
I'm disapponted if this is true as I really like Dervite. That said, we need to remember as players leave that they were part of a squad that nearly got relegated. Absolutely no one in our squad who may be candidates for departure is irreplaceable, regardless of how much we liked them with the possible - but only possible - exception of Poyet. It all depends on the calibre of replacements of course but onwards and upwards
Blaming the better players in the team for being in the relegation zone is wrong. It was the weaknesses up front, right midfield, and creative midfield were the main reasons for being in the relegation zone.
Yep, you are right about that on reflection. But I think we can aspire to finding another centre half at least as good as DD, much as I'll miss him.
He is a decent centre back, probably a mid to top Championship level. However, we did concede a fair number of goals with him in the team. Also he was absolutely bullied by Deeney, bounced off him twice and ended up on the floor.
If he was offered a three year deal then I think that is pretty fair in the current climate. Bolton offered him more so he moves on.
Just caught up with the news and my instinctive reaction was one of disappointment. However, on reflection, my view is that it will only be possible to judge this development, if it's confirmed, once we've seen the bigger picture. Hopefully, we'll learn more over the next several weeks.
On the surface, offering a four-year deal to a player who, until very recently, could not even claim to be a regular for a side in the bottom third of the Championship is nuts, if indeed that's what Bolton have done. You'd think that an Owner who is now so far underwater financially he's approaching the Mariana Trench would have understood that by now. On the surface, we're wise not to create troublesome long-term liabilities of the type contracts like this can easily become.
However, as I tried to argue in the rambling piece I wrote for TNT6, success for the Duchatelet model will, ultimately, be all about execution not strategy and that, in turn, will require sound judgement and decision making about players, especially if budgets are to be deliberately tight. If Dervite continues to improve and becomes a "top" player we'll have made a mistake. If he's never better than an average Championship centre back, then the mistake is Bolton's. At this stage it's hard to know whose judgement we can trust.
Similarly, a four-year deal commits scare wage bill for four years, obviously, reducing the funding available for other players and flexibility. That's good news if "better value for money" players can be signed, ideally on shorter contracts, but risky if those players cannot be identified or if when they arrive they are simply not good enough.
Right now the Jury is out on all of this. The classic stance in this situation is to be "cautiously optimistic" and that's where I am at this point, but I do anticipate an anxious few months. First, as we observe the restructuring of the squad this summer and then second as we see how the team assembled fares when the battle begins again in August.
Hope this is only a rumour. Dorien was excellent and played a great part is us staying up! Surely we could match an offer by Bolton (allegedly £170 million plus in debt)? If this is true and with no manager/head coach as yet, not a good way of selling extra season tickets! Maybe Iran have a decent defender we can get on the cheap!
I agree that if we offered him three years and he found better elsewhere then so be it that he leaves. Pity because I liked him and thought he had a touch of class about him. What happens now is the real test though. We currently have Morrison who could also be leaving and no one else as I assume Cort is not going to be offered anything. That means that in the next seven weeks we need to sign at least two championship quality centre backs and hope Morrison stays. Fourth choice will fall on youth ? Need to get that right because if we don't have quality at centre back then we are in for another torrid season.
I agree that if we offered him three years and he found better elsewhere then so be it that he leaves. Pity because I liked him and thought he had a touch of class about him. What happens now is the real test though. We currently have Morrison who could also be leaving and no one else as I assume Cort is not going to be offered anything. That means that in the next seven weeks we need to sign at least two championship quality centre backs and hope Morrison stays. Fourth choice will fall on youth ? Need to get that right because if we don't have quality at centre back then we are in for another torrid season.
No need to worry about a fourth choice youth product SHG, Harry Lennon is your man and probably will be knocking on the door for a starting birth. It's not just CB though is it it's the spine of the team at keeper (if Hamer goes) and centre forward that needs strengthening but it's early days still not halfway through May yet which gives RD & KM 6 weeks to meet their deadlines. On the contrary with right signings we could be in for a very exciting season in the top half of the table.
I will join the RD love in when I see some evidence to do so. I really will - I have gone into the summer with serious doubts about him - based on his dealings since taking over the club but I am willing to change my mind. Maybe he saved the club from extinction, so if we end up in League 2 we should just be happy about that, but I am looking for some signs that we can move forwards on the pitch, making going to watch my team a little more pleasurable than it has been for the last 7 or 8 years!
I am viewing it all as an imaginary set of scales. On one side there is the positives and on the other the negatives. So on the negative side we have selling Kermogant when we were in danger of relegation (1kg), selling Stephens (500g), Thuram and others (500g), Missing out on any decent loans (500g), sacking and not backing Powell (1kg), using Kermogant and Stephens money on a player that can't get in our reserves (500g), and the first of the close season news is Dervitte going (500g). So that's 4.5 kg on the negative side. On the positive side I'll be generous. Bringing in Riga (1.5kg), AA (500g), Wiggins and JJ signing contracts (1kg) - so I make us 1.5 kg to make up on the scales before I start to consider being positive about him. That would probably be more than covered if Riga, Poyet, hamer and Morro get signed up. If we make some decent signings in addition, that will also be positive weights. But if they don't and the signings are like the last window (all bullshit - we tried to buy him and tried to loan him etc...) Then that negative side will become pretty overwhelming.
My apparent negativity clearly tires some people - but I am merely somebody who is looking for the evidence to be positive and calling what I see and when I see it, I will be positive! I want and hope to be. It worries me that I haven't seen too much reason yet. We stayed up but I think we were lucky - if we lost at Sheff Wed, which we nearly did, it could easily have been different. As Airman said earlier in the season, this would have been the most needless relegation in our history. I really concur with that view and I see RD as the man who nearly made it happen. I hope he acts to change my view.
I will join the RD love in when I see some evidence to do so. I really will - I have gone into the summer with serious doubts about him - based on his dealings since taking over the club but I am willing to change my mind. Maybe he saved the club from extinction, so if we end up in League 2 we should just be happy about that, but I am looking for some signs that we can move forwards on the pitch, making going to watch my team a little more pleasurable than it has been for the last 7 or 8 years!
I am viewing it all as an imaginary set of scales. On one side there is the positives and on the other the negatives. So on the negative side we have selling Kermogant when we were in danger of relegation (1kg), selling Stephens (500g), Thuram and others (500g), Missing out on any decent loans (500g), sacking and not backing Powell (1kg), using Kermogant and Stephens money on a player that can't get in our reserves (500g), and the first of the close season news is Dervitte going (500g). So that's 4.5 kg on the negative side. On the positive side I'll be generous. Bringing in Riga (1.5kg), AA (500g), Wiggins and JJ signing contracts (1kg) - so I make us 1.5 kg to make up on the scales before I start to consider being positive about him. That would probably be more than covered if Riga, Poyet, hamer and Morro get signed up. If we make some decent signings in addition, that will also be positive weights. But if they don't and the signings are like the last window (all bullshit - we tried to buy him and tried to loan him etc...) Then that negative side will become pretty overwhelming.
My apparent negativity clearly tires some people - but I am merely somebody who is looking for the evidence to be positive and calling what I see and when I see it, I will be it! It worries me that I haven't seen too much reason yet. We stayed up but I think we were lucky - if we lost at Sheff Wed, which we nearly did, it could easily have been different. As Airman said earlier in the season, this would have been the most needless relegation in our history. I really concur with that view and I see RD as the man who nearly made it happen. I hope he acts to change my view.
You could just as easily argue that RD was the man that stopped a needless relegation and in fact regardless of your weights the fact is that we did avoid it when under Powell and including Yann and Dale we were looking very poor indeed.
I agree that the proof of RD will be what happens with signing of players but that is not confined to who they might be but more importantly how they gel on the pitch and under whose guidance.
I like you maintain a watching brief but don't feel as negative as you obviously do.
Comments
Quick, someone bomb Pearl Harbour!!!!!
Dervite improved from being about 8th best to 5th best. About 3 places.
Just my opinion.
Like I say I'm sure Barca will be putting in a late bid for Dervite :-)
I'm not sure why a couple of guys, don't get my logic.
If Evina went from being a non 1st team regular, to being the POTY, surely he would have been the most improved ?
But he didn't. Poyet did.
I'm glad we've got a club. Over paying for average players, is the economics of having to find some other fool every two years to lose 30 million. I'm glad whether it fails or not Duchatelet has an mo, which won't have the absolute inevetibility of receivership in two years w.
Bankrupt country, bankrupt clubs, and bankrupt brains.
I do agree we need to wait and see. Katrien said wait on judge on what happens this summer. She also said they want their business done by end of June. Let's see where we are on 1st July.
Happy we offered him a new improved contract - if he didn't feel it was good enough then we move on. RD has made it clear we pay what we can afford and I for one find it difficult to argue with that.
“Annual income twenty pounds, annual expenditure nineteen six, result happiness. Annual income twenty pounds, annual expenditure twenty pound ought and six, result misery.”
DD was one of my stand out players last season in terms of consistency in a poor one overall.
Heard he was looking to live in Yann's house in Greenwich too but obviously not the plan now.
I wish him good luck for his future career but sad that it seemingly won't be in SE7.
I'm guessing Morro , Hamer & Poyet are next , i hope we have a cunning back up plan , which does not include parachuting Riga in for the last 10 games.
Calm down people its only May the 15th, shouldn't we all be concentrating on another dazzling performance from England next month, chill out all will be ok.
I think the next 2 months will see the proof of the Roland pudding. Charlton supporters should keep their heads until then, but I do understand some Charlton supporters concern about the level of his ambition.
If he was offered a three year deal then I think that is pretty fair in the current climate. Bolton offered him more so he moves on.
On the surface, offering a four-year deal to a player who, until very recently, could not even claim to be a regular for a side in the bottom third of the Championship is nuts, if indeed that's what Bolton have done. You'd think that an Owner who is now so far underwater financially he's approaching the Mariana Trench would have understood that by now. On the surface, we're wise not to create troublesome long-term liabilities of the type contracts like this can easily become.
However, as I tried to argue in the rambling piece I wrote for TNT6, success for the Duchatelet model will, ultimately, be all about execution not strategy and that, in turn, will require sound judgement and decision making about players, especially if budgets are to be deliberately tight. If Dervite continues to improve and becomes a "top" player we'll have made a mistake. If he's never better than an average Championship centre back, then the mistake is Bolton's. At this stage it's hard to know whose judgement we can trust.
Similarly, a four-year deal commits scare wage bill for four years, obviously, reducing the funding available for other players and flexibility. That's good news if "better value for money" players can be signed, ideally on shorter contracts, but risky if those players cannot be identified or if when they arrive they are simply not good enough.
Right now the Jury is out on all of this. The classic stance in this situation is to be "cautiously optimistic" and that's where I am at this point, but I do anticipate an anxious few months. First, as we observe the restructuring of the squad this summer and then second as we see how the team assembled fares when the battle begins again in August.
Surely we could match an offer by Bolton (allegedly £170 million plus in debt)?
If this is true and with no manager/head coach as yet,
not a good way of selling extra season tickets!
Maybe Iran have a decent defender we can get on the cheap!
I am viewing it all as an imaginary set of scales. On one side there is the positives and on the other the negatives. So on the negative side we have selling Kermogant when we were in danger of relegation (1kg), selling Stephens (500g), Thuram and others (500g), Missing out on any decent loans (500g), sacking and not backing Powell (1kg), using Kermogant and Stephens money on a player that can't get in our reserves (500g), and the first of the close season news is Dervitte going (500g). So that's 4.5 kg on the negative side. On the positive side I'll be generous. Bringing in Riga (1.5kg), AA (500g), Wiggins and JJ signing contracts (1kg) - so I make us 1.5 kg to make up on the scales before I start to consider being positive about him. That would probably be more than covered if Riga, Poyet, hamer and Morro get signed up. If we make some decent signings in addition, that will also be positive weights. But if they don't and the signings are like the last window (all bullshit - we tried to buy him and tried to loan him etc...) Then that negative side will become pretty overwhelming.
My apparent negativity clearly tires some people - but I am merely somebody who is looking for the evidence to be positive and calling what I see and when I see it, I will be positive! I want and hope to be. It worries me that I haven't seen too much reason yet. We stayed up but I think we were lucky - if we lost at Sheff Wed, which we nearly did, it could easily have been different. As Airman said earlier in the season, this would have been the most needless relegation in our history. I really concur with that view and I see RD as the man who nearly made it happen. I hope he acts to change my view.
You could just as easily argue that RD was the man that stopped a needless relegation and in fact regardless of your weights the fact is that we did avoid it when under Powell and including Yann and Dale we were looking very poor indeed.
I agree that the proof of RD will be what happens with signing of players but that is not confined to who they might be but more importantly how they gel on the pitch and under whose guidance.
I like you maintain a watching brief but don't feel as negative as you obviously do.
Hope it's not true