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Dorian Dervite signing for Bolton
Comments
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Yep conveniently cut out the facts I used to support my point, but fair enough, you're entitled to your opinion.falconwood_1 said:
Sorry but that is a load of rubbish.Addickted4life said:
The defense was one of the few consistent positives of this season afalconwood_1 said:With a goal difference of -20 (MINUS TWENTY) I would have thought any defensive player would be under scrutiny.
FFS, reading the Evina thread you would have thought he was Roberto Carlos....
DD was alright, but not much more than that.0 -
Really? He brought in a manager that kept us in the Champ.The Red Robin said:
None of them are irreplaceable, IF we are looking to bring quality in. But RD hasn't so far.Madz said:I like Dervite and he is good for a goal or 2 a season, but he is not irreplaceable. If he stayed i'd be pleased, if he left i'd be disappointed but not majorly concerned. would be more concerned losing Morrison who is a better defender and needs someone solid (like a younger Cort) alongside him.
Also, Katrien admitted that they did not know the quality of the Championship when they recruited players, and that they don't intend to make that same mistake again. I for one am prepared to support them.3 -
I was referring to him not replacing the players he has let go.scabbyhorse said:
yeh bloody Roland, bloody useless.The Red Robin said:
None of them are irreplaceable, IF we are looking to bring quality in. But RD hasn't so far.Madz said:I like Dervite and he is good for a goal or 2 a season, but he is not irreplaceable. If he stayed i'd be pleased, if he left i'd be disappointed but not majorly concerned. would be more concerned losing Morrison who is a better defender and needs someone solid (like a younger Cort) alongside him.
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Fair point.Callumcafc said:
I think it is wholly unfair to judge the new owners based on one January transfer window. A window where it is recognised that player values are masssively inflated. RD in the end managed to do enough to keep us in the division, despite perhaps underestimating it with his reinforcements from the network.The Red Robin said:
Because evidence so far suggests otherwise doesn't it? Where were the adequate replacements for Yann or Stephens?Callumcafc said:
Why do you think that?The Red Robin said:
This is the trouble though isn't it? We won't.Callumcafc said:RD is a shrewd businessman and we will only offer these players what we think they are worth. It will mean that some will leave following the contract run-down debacle that was left by Jimenez, Slater & co.
Dervite, as he is, is a middling Championship centre back. If Bolton are prepared to pay more than us for his services then what can we really do about it? Let's move on, find a decent replacement and start afresh.
As a comparison, Slater & Jimenez joined in January of the 2010/11 season. We signed a bargain BWP from in-administration-Plymouth alongside loan signings of Dean Parrett, Frank Nouble, Fede Bessone and Nathan Ecclestone. Hardly the strongest indicator of the summer to come.0 -
Tell him not to do it Marvin!6 -
RD has as much to do with Kermogant, Hamer, Morrison and Dervite not signing a new contract as he has (to his credit) to do with Jackson and Wiggins signing new ones. The previous owners didn't do us any favours, but Duchatelet's had nearly 5 months to sort out the contracts so he's got no excuse.Greenie said:
BTW RD had nothing to do with DD's contract, that was TJ and MS so those with an agenda need to get their facts right.
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What did you want him to do? Stick a gun to their heads?MrLargo said:
RD has as much to do with Kermogant, Hamer, Morrison and Dervite not signing a new contract as he has (to his credit) to do with Jackson and Wiggins signing new ones. The previous owners didn't do us any favours, but Duchatelet's had nearly 5 months to sort out the contracts so he's got no excuse.Greenie said:
BTW RD had nothing to do with DD's contract, that was TJ and MS so those with an agenda need to get their facts right.1 -
I don't think so, he didn't even know what league we were going to be in until 2 weeks ago. So how in God's name can he offer contracts?MrLargo said:
RD has as much to do with Kermogant, Hamer, Morrison and Dervite not signing a new contract as he has (to his credit) to do with Jackson and Wiggins signing new ones. The previous owners didn't do us any favours, but Duchatelet's had nearly 5 months to sort out the contracts so he's got no excuse.Greenie said:
BTW RD had nothing to do with DD's contract, that was TJ and MS so those with an agenda need to get their facts right.
Please explain. (BTW, I can't do the Yann crap again, those that know, know)0 -
Just a little heads up, expect spinning tea cups this summer. After all the spinning, you'll either come away feeling pretty sick and threaten to never go again or you'll get an adrenaline rush and be chomping at the bit for the next ride. This exit means little to me until we know who replaces him, which RD/KM seem keen to sort out by end of June (ready for pre-season). Gradual improvement equals gradually improved standard of player and I think this is what we will see. I personally hope the door opens to some more youth players too, as our graduates full me with total pride.8
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Very good shout Pavo. This.0
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The players took a chance by letting their contracts run down but now they are free agents, they are free to explore all avenues. I don't think RD is the kind of man to throw money blindly at these players and in fact I'm glad we're not going to be one of those clubs that does.
Dervite went to see what was there and got a presumably juicy salary on a long deal. Good luck to the guy.
Don't get me wrong, I'd have loved to have kept DD into the next couple of seasons but I wouldn't have offered him £10,000 p/w to do so.3 -
I'll wait to see who gets signed before complaining/praising these decisions.
Would've liked Dervite to stay, but if he's planned this for a while there's little RD or anyone else can really do about it. Bolton are above us in the table so he may see it as a step up.0 -
Clubs can always afford to offer bigger contracts to players when out of contract because no transfer fee ect and players often go because they usually get a singing on fee aswell as the agent getting a fee , it's a shame because he was a good player but I'm sure Bolton probably doubled our offer don't forget their still getting parachute money from the prem and like someone else said there in debt for a reason I.e big wages.MrLargo said:
RD has as much to do with Kermogant, Hamer, Morrison and Dervite not signing a new contract as he has (to his credit) to do with Jackson and Wiggins signing new ones. The previous owners didn't do us any favours, but Duchatelet's had nearly 5 months to sort out the contracts so he's got no excuse.Greenie said:
BTW RD had nothing to do with DD's contract, that was TJ and MS so those with an agenda need to get their facts right.
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The same way he offered contracts to Wiggins and Jackson which were both signed before anyone knew what division we'd be in. I don't understand why you think he couldn't negotiate a contract with Dervite when he'd already negotiated new contracts with 2 of our other senior players.Greenie said:
I don't think so, he didn't even know what league we were going to be in until 2 weeks ago. So how in God's name can he offer contracts?MrLargo said:
RD has as much to do with Kermogant, Hamer, Morrison and Dervite not signing a new contract as he has (to his credit) to do with Jackson and Wiggins signing new ones. The previous owners didn't do us any favours, but Duchatelet's had nearly 5 months to sort out the contracts so he's got no excuse.Greenie said:
BTW RD had nothing to do with DD's contract, that was TJ and MS so those with an agenda need to get their facts right.
Please explain.0 -
Lets wait and see who comes in and keep a sense of perspective here.Although I liked Dorian he is not irreplaceable.
Two years ago Dorian was an injury prone free transfer. Some Spurs supporters have expressed surprise he was able to rebuild his career,so bad was his injury. It was even suggested by some that we took him on without a medical on a play as you play deal because a proposed move to Huddersfield fell through over fitness concerns.Last season he did enough to earn a new one year deal.
Although Bolton have debt,I understand that most of it is 'friendly' . The Trotters will have 'cleared out' some Premiership dead wood like Chris Eagles this summer off their wage bill . Remember they will still be receiving reduced parachute payments for another 2 seasons. Whilst I cannot see them signing Wiggins off of us for a fee , I imagine that similar to their signing of Liam Trotter from the Spanners they will be competitive in the free transfer market this window.
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Offer them a realistic deal so that they'd stay, rather than letting them go for zilch and then bringing in a few more Negos, Thurams and Kocs to replace them.Callumcafc said:
What did you want him to do? Stick a gun to their heads?MrLargo said:
RD has as much to do with Kermogant, Hamer, Morrison and Dervite not signing a new contract as he has (to his credit) to do with Jackson and Wiggins signing new ones. The previous owners didn't do us any favours, but Duchatelet's had nearly 5 months to sort out the contracts so he's got no excuse.Greenie said:
BTW RD had nothing to do with DD's contract, that was TJ and MS so those with an agenda need to get their facts right.1 -
Because its down to choices and spending wisely, as a supporter, I assume you go to most matches, would you have preferred to keep Wiggins and Jacko or sell both and keep the likes of Dervite when you don't know what league you are going to be in.MrLargo said:
The same way he offered contracts to Wiggins and Jackson which were both signed before anyone knew what division we'd be in. I don't understand why you think he couldn't negotiate a contract with Dervite when he'd already negotiated new contracts with 2 of our other senior players.Greenie said:
I don't think so, he didn't even know what league we were going to be in until 2 weeks ago. So how in God's name can he offer contracts?MrLargo said:
RD has as much to do with Kermogant, Hamer, Morrison and Dervite not signing a new contract as he has (to his credit) to do with Jackson and Wiggins signing new ones. The previous owners didn't do us any favours, but Duchatelet's had nearly 5 months to sort out the contracts so he's got no excuse.Greenie said:
BTW RD had nothing to do with DD's contract, that was TJ and MS so those with an agenda need to get their facts right.
Please explain.
Given the potentially limited money if we had have got relegated I know who i would have signed.
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How do you know for sure we didn't offer a realistic increase (eg 7.5k p/w, pulling numbers out thin air here) in March but DD said he'd rather wait and see what else he can get? I'd reckon he could be getting anything up to 15k p/w with a decent signing fee from Bolton.1
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Now this is where you're argument falls down.MrLargo said:
Offer them a realistic deal so that they'd stay, rather than letting them go for zilch and then bringing in a few more Negos, Thurams and Kocs to replace them.Callumcafc said:
What did you want him to do? Stick a gun to their heads?MrLargo said:
RD has as much to do with Kermogant, Hamer, Morrison and Dervite not signing a new contract as he has (to his credit) to do with Jackson and Wiggins signing new ones. The previous owners didn't do us any favours, but Duchatelet's had nearly 5 months to sort out the contracts so he's got no excuse.Greenie said:
BTW RD had nothing to do with DD's contract, that was TJ and MS so those with an agenda need to get their facts right.
You are unhappy because you assume we will bring in worse.
Surely a sensible approach is to wait and see ?5 -
Adios dorian, you were better than wood but not as good as morro.
Can we do better than you? Yes we can
Thanks for the memories0 -
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Greenie said:
I don't think so, he didn't even know what league we were going to be in until 2 weeks ago. So how in God's name can he offer contracts?MrLargo said:
RD has as much to do with Kermogant, Hamer, Morrison and Dervite not signing a new contract as he has (to his credit) to do with Jackson and Wiggins signing new ones. The previous owners didn't do us any favours, but Duchatelet's had nearly 5 months to sort out the contracts so he's got no excuse.Greenie said:
BTW RD had nothing to do with DD's contract, that was TJ and MS so those with an agenda need to get their facts right.
Please explain.
Offered contracts to JJ and Wiggins so it was clearly possible.
It takes two to tango. RD can offer contracts and most likely did but the players choose to sign or not. In this case the response was "not", it seems.
But if RD gets a plus for signing up JJ and RW then the opposite has to apply when Dervite doesn't.
The reality is that RD (or any owner) isn't in total control, the players have a big say. He's also competing with other clubs with different budgets. To a certain degree he can control that as he makes the decisions over how much of his own money to invest.
IMO RD needs to be judged over all the deals in and out over the summer not just this one deal. But he can and should be open to fair criticism.
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Bolton (Forest and Blackburn) may well fail FFP guidelines in December which means they will not be able to sign new players in January - if the league sticks to the rules agreed at the start. That means this is Bolton's last chance to sign players until they get their annual losses under control.
On a different note I think it is too early to judge the legacy left by Slater and Jiminez - for every 25 year old first teamer who is out of contract they managed to sign an U23 player on a long term deal.1 -
Funny old game 4 months ago most would not of give a flying feck if Dorian left.3
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Bar Poyet.seriously_red said:Bolton (Forest and Blackburn) may well fail FFP guidelines in December which means they will not be able to sign new players in January - if the league sticks to the rules agreed at the start. That means this is Bolton's last chance to sign players until they get their annual losses under control.
On a different note I think it is too early to judge the legacy left by Slater and Jiminez - for every 25 year old first teamer who is out of contract they managed to sign an U23 player on a long term deal.0 -
I didn't know we had to choose between them. If Roland is so skint that he couldn't afford to field a team including Jackson, Wiggins and Dervite in League 1 then we are properly f*%ked. I was worried about an influx of Standard Liege reserves, now I'm starting to think we'll be watching a team of Belgian foreign exchange students next season.Greenie said:
Because its down to choices and spending wisely, as a supporter, I assume you go to most matches, would you have preferred to keep Wiggins and Jacko or sell both and keep the likes of Dervite when you don't know what league you are going to be in.MrLargo said:
The same way he offered contracts to Wiggins and Jackson which were both signed before anyone knew what division we'd be in. I don't understand why you think he couldn't negotiate a contract with Dervite when he'd already negotiated new contracts with 2 of our other senior players.Greenie said:
I don't think so, he didn't even know what league we were going to be in until 2 weeks ago. So how in God's name can he offer contracts?MrLargo said:
RD has as much to do with Kermogant, Hamer, Morrison and Dervite not signing a new contract as he has (to his credit) to do with Jackson and Wiggins signing new ones. The previous owners didn't do us any favours, but Duchatelet's had nearly 5 months to sort out the contracts so he's got no excuse.Greenie said:
BTW RD had nothing to do with DD's contract, that was TJ and MS so those with an agenda need to get their facts right.
Please explain.
Given the potentially limited money if we had have got relegated I know who i would have signed.2 -
cant see anyone re -signing or joining until we/they know the masterplan ...for starters the new "head coach"
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seriously_red
3:00PM
Bolton (Forest and Blackburn) may well fail FFP guidelines in December which means they will not be able to sign new players in January - if the league sticks to the rules agreed at the start.
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It is a big if, if the league sticks to the rules regarding FFP and it will be a surprise if there is not a legal challenge (similar to Barcelona) which postpones the whole thing for a season. That if the FFP works at all. I am not sure what comfort that Bolton, Forest and Blackburn will not be able to sign players if God forbid, Charlton are in another relegation scrap with a weak team.
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No it doesn't Henry, I don't think RD gets a minus, not by a long chalk. If RD had a figure in mind for his premium players (Wiggins, Jacko) then the figure would be less for the more average players. So maybe he offered DD a contract that he felt DD was worth, knowing that there are a lot of better players than DD around. Also notwithstanding that maybe Powell and later Riga have voiced their collective opinions that DD was replaceable. Of course DD might have wanted to leave no matter what was offered.Henry Irving said:Greenie said:
I don't think so, he didn't even know what league we were going to be in until 2 weeks ago. So how in God's name can he offer contracts?MrLargo said:
RD has as much to do with Kermogant, Hamer, Morrison and Dervite not signing a new contract as he has (to his credit) to do with Jackson and Wiggins signing new ones. The previous owners didn't do us any favours, but Duchatelet's had nearly 5 months to sort out the contracts so he's got no excuse.Greenie said:
BTW RD had nothing to do with DD's contract, that was TJ and MS so those with an agenda need to get their facts right.
Please explain.
Offered contracts to JJ and Wiggins so it was clearly possible.
It takes two to tango. RD can offer contracts and most likely did but the players choose to sign or not. In this case the response was "not", it seems.
But if RD gets a plus for signing up JJ and RW then the opposite has to apply when Dervite doesn't.
The reality is that RD (or any owner) isn't in total control, the players have a big say. He's also competing with other clubs with different budgets. To a certain degree he can control that as he makes the decisions over how much of his own money to invest.
IMO RD needs to be judged over all the deals in and out over the summer not just this one deal. But he can and should be open to fair criticism.
I agree with your final comment, but I will support him in his purchases and the handling of the purse strings while he is the owner, unless he does not sign anyone and we field the under 15's on the first day of the season.1 -
MrLargo take a deep breath.MrLargo said:
I didn't know we had to choose between them. If Roland is so skint that he couldn't afford to field a team including Jackson, Wiggins and Dervite in League 1 then we are properly f*%ked. I was worried about an influx of Standard Liege reserves, now I'm starting to think we'll be watching a team of Belgian foreign exchange students next season.Greenie said:
Because its down to choices and spending wisely, as a supporter, I assume you go to most matches, would you have preferred to keep Wiggins and Jacko or sell both and keep the likes of Dervite when you don't know what league you are going to be in.MrLargo said:
The same way he offered contracts to Wiggins and Jackson which were both signed before anyone knew what division we'd be in. I don't understand why you think he couldn't negotiate a contract with Dervite when he'd already negotiated new contracts with 2 of our other senior players.Greenie said:
I don't think so, he didn't even know what league we were going to be in until 2 weeks ago. So how in God's name can he offer contracts?MrLargo said:
RD has as much to do with Kermogant, Hamer, Morrison and Dervite not signing a new contract as he has (to his credit) to do with Jackson and Wiggins signing new ones. The previous owners didn't do us any favours, but Duchatelet's had nearly 5 months to sort out the contracts so he's got no excuse.Greenie said:
BTW RD had nothing to do with DD's contract, that was TJ and MS so those with an agenda need to get their facts right.
Please explain.
Given the potentially limited money if we had have got relegated I know who i would have signed.
Just because RD doesn't want to match terms that Bolton offer. It doesn't mean we shall be signing Belgian foreign exchange students.
If they want to get in The Prem, then we should be getting better value.
We really need to wait & see.
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Blimey, have we just let Beckehbauer go?
He was an 'OK' CB. Would hope that we're looking for better than him anyway!3
