1 the fact that a great number of this country are concerned with the scale of immigration and the impact it is having in changing / potentially changing, the fabric and culture of this country. No doubt some of those backing this will indeed be racist. The vast majority are not though and those opposed dubbing this as some form of racist bandwagon are completely missing the point.
2 that a lot of people are not particularly enthralled with the fact 'Europe' appears to have so much power over our laws, trade etc, plus the beurocracy etc that goes with it, and that generally we are 'shrinking' as a dominant, achieving nation
His plain speaking 'stick it up em' approach appeals greatly to those who feel politicians are completely a breed of their own that simply pay lip service, and hollow heavily spun words with no real gumption.
Of course, it's very easy to be a shouty renegade on the outside when it is simply words. Following through when getting the opportunity would have course be a very different story. UKIP has simply nothing more than a good frontman for shaking the apple cart. No other policies, no real structure or appealing individuals other than Farrage.
This little circus I can't see running for much longer. The real shame is that the main parties are simply plain scared of properly addressing the immigration / changing culture issue, and sadly never will. I have a fear that one day it will be too late.
1 the fact that a great number of this country are concerned with the scale of immigration and the impact it is having in changing / potentially changing, the fabric and culture of this country. No doubt some of those backing this will indeed be racist. The vast majority are not though and those opposed dubbing this as some form of racist bandwagon are completely missing the point.
Why then does he suggest that there should be more immigration from non-EU countries?
1 the fact that a great number of this country are concerned with the scale of immigration and the impact it is having in changing / potentially changing, the fabric and culture of this country. No doubt some of those backing this will indeed be racist. The vast majority are not though and those opposed dubbing this as some form of racist bandwagon are completely missing the point.
Why then does he suggest that there should be more immigration from non-EU countries?
Because he is highlighting the importance of 'good' immigration
The obvious "good" immigration is already covered by UK Border Agency rules on visas and sponsorships, and these could be expanded if further skills were required or good. He seems to want more non-Europeans in the UK, who would be lower skilled (or less scarce-skilled) than the existing non-European migrants. Seems a strange approach for a party concerned about immigration.
Because if milliband was in charge of this country then we would look as week and vulnerable just like Putin likes to exploit
Not a statement of fact that Putin would
Then why hasn't he invaded Malta, Greece, Cyprus, Portugal, Ireland, etc?
You might be able to argue that with Milliband in charge he wouldn't take any notice when we told him not to invade, say, Georgia, but he hasn't taken any notice of Cameron over The Crimea, has he? Basically, we're an ex-imperial power with very little influence and massive delusions of grandeur, and no-one in their right mind would want to invade us because they'd just end up having to deal with the problems.
1 the fact that a great number of this country are concerned with the scale of immigration and the impact it is having in changing / potentially changing, the fabric and culture of this country. No doubt some of those backing this will indeed be racist. The vast majority are not though and those opposed dubbing this as some form of racist bandwagon are completely missing the point.
2 that a lot of people are not particularly enthralled with the fact 'Europe' appears to have so much power over our laws, trade etc, plus the beurocracy etc that goes with it, and that generally we are 'shrinking' as a dominant, achieving nation
His plain speaking 'stick it up em' approach appeals greatly to those who feel politicians are completely a breed of their own that simply pay lip service, and hollow heavily spun words with no real gumption.
Of course, it's very easy to be a shouty renegade on the outside when it is simply words. Following through when getting the opportunity would have course be a very different story. UKIP has simply nothing more than a good frontman for shaking the apple cart. No other policies, no real structure or appealing individuals other than Farrage.
This little circus I can't see running for much longer. The real shame is that the main parties are simply plain scared of properly addressing the immigration / changing culture issue, and sadly never will. I have a fear that one day it will be too late.
Spot on AFKA! What is killing the lib dems is the challenge of being in power. What will challenge UKIP is winning seats and being held to account. To give a local example we have our own Farragistas here on Charlton Life with a handful of posters forever posting negative shit about our club, our Board and our future without ever proposing a rational alternative.
On a serious note there is a common challenge for all western democracies to address how we utilise the Web for information and communications to engage a significant majority in building solutions for this century.
For reasons I won't go into I have had the opportunity and privilege to meet people with real insight into the challenges for our children and our children's children. I can assure you that arguing about being in the EU or Scots nats wanting independence is simply a massive distraction!
The future of health, benefits, pensions and education are far more critical. If people choose to be led by dodgy arguments then their fate will be decided by the elite without consultation.
One can apply that to our football club, our council, our government and Europe.
Perhaps we have technocratic government to out compete others. But they will outsource basic jobs and centralise wealth. Or we go for populist, nationalist anti foreigner (Belgian!) or we can look to build something with capitalism, democracy and a broad pan European ideal. If we don't build a model then another civilisation will and it will be vastly different to our European heritage.
1 the fact that a great number of this country are concerned with the scale of immigration and the impact it is having in changing / potentially changing, the fabric and culture of this country. No doubt some of those backing this will indeed be racist. The vast majority are not though and those opposed dubbing this as some form of racist bandwagon are completely missing the point.
2 that a lot of people are not particularly enthralled with the fact 'Europe' appears to have so much power over our laws, trade etc, plus the beurocracy etc that goes with it, and that generally we are 'shrinking' as a dominant, achieving nation
His plain speaking 'stick it up em' approach appeals greatly to those who feel politicians are completely a breed of their own that simply pay lip service, and hollow heavily spun words with no real gumption.
Of course, it's very easy to be a shouty renegade on the outside when it is simply words. Following through when getting the opportunity would have course be a very different story. UKIP has simply nothing more than a good frontman for shaking the apple cart. No other policies, no real structure or appealing individuals other than Farrage.
This little circus I can't see running for much longer. The real shame is that the main parties are simply plain scared of properly addressing the immigration / changing culture issue, and sadly never will. I have a fear that one day it will be too late.
I disagree and feel you've made that statement without properly researching the party. I would say Tim Aker, Patrick O'Flynn, Dianne James and Suzanne Evans all look to be bright, intellectual up and coming politicians. Suzanne Evans in particular who handles Andrew Neil so well in this YouTube clip: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YQXWUmagwm8
One is the leader of a party and therefore holds some real power within it.
Blunkett holds 0 power within the Labour party anymore and doesn't speak for them.
But its nice that you think there's some of crusade against Farage. If Cameron, Clegg or Miliband came out with racist views they'd be all over the front pages too.
Also, that entire 'riot' is a joke. Just two local groups of youths fighting and the Mail spins it into a migrant rant. Dire journalism.
One is the leader of a party and therefore holds some real power within it.
Blunkett holds 0 power within the Labour party anymore and doesn't speak for them.
But its nice that you think there's some of crusade against Farage. If Cameron, Clegg or Miliband came out with racist views they'd be all over the front pages too.
Also, that entire 'riot' is a joke. Just two local groups of youths fighting and the Mail spins it into a migrant rant. Dire journalism.
Ironic that even the blind can see there is a problem with immigration.
One is the leader of a party and therefore holds some real power within it.
Blunkett holds 0 power within the Labour party anymore and doesn't speak for them.
But its nice that you think there's some of crusade against Farage. If Cameron, Clegg or Miliband came out with racist views they'd be all over the front pages too.
Also, that entire 'riot' is a joke. Just two local groups of youths fighting and the Mail spins it into a migrant rant. Dire journalism.
Ironic that even the blind can see there is a problem with immigration.
there's always been a "problem with immigration". I'm old enough to remember Enoch Powell's "river of blood" speech. And furthermore, most European countries I can think of have a problem with "immigration". In the Czech Republic the objects of concern are Vietnamese, Russians and Ukrainians. In French villages it is often the British, many of whom have the nerve to use their rights as EU citizens to access the superior French healthcare system.
Its not a problem with immigration, immigration controlled can be a wonderful thing that can reap great benefits. The problem, is with mass, open door immigration, it is irresponsible and unsustainable.
Its not a problem with immigration, immigration controlled can be a wonderful thing that can reap great benefits. The problem, is with mass open door immigration, its irresponsible and unsustainable.
Leaving the EU and calling back the 3 million Brits that have left this country will cause you a bigger problem than immigration will ever cause.
Its not a problem with immigration, immigration controlled can be a wonderful thing that can reap great benefits. The problem, is with mass open door immigration, its irresponsible and unsustainable.
Leaving the EU and calling back the 3 million Brits that have left this country will cause you a bigger problem than immigration will ever cause.
That wouldn't happen. If we left the EU we wouldn't kick people out who have already settled and came here legally.
1 the fact that a great number of this country are concerned with the scale of immigration and the impact it is having in changing / potentially changing, the fabric and culture of this country. No doubt some of those backing this will indeed be racist. The vast majority are not though and those opposed dubbing this as some form of racist bandwagon are completely missing the point.
2 that a lot of people are not particularly enthralled with the fact 'Europe' appears to have so much power over our laws, trade etc, plus the beurocracy etc that goes with it, and that generally we are 'shrinking' as a dominant, achieving nation
His plain speaking 'stick it up em' approach appeals greatly to those who feel politicians are completely a breed of their own that simply pay lip service, and hollow heavily spun words with no real gumption.
Of course, it's very easy to be a shouty renegade on the outside when it is simply words. Following through when getting the opportunity would have course be a very different story. UKIP has simply nothing more than a good frontman for shaking the apple cart. No other policies, no real structure or appealing individuals other than Farrage.
This little circus I can't see running for much longer. The real shame is that the main parties are simply plain scared of properly addressing the immigration / changing culture issue, and sadly never will. I have a fear that one day it will be too late.
I disagree and feel you've made that statement without properly researching the party. I would say Tim Aker, Patrick O'Flynn, Dianne James and Suzanne Evans all look to be bright, intellectual up and coming politicians. Suzanne Evans in particular who handles Andrew Neil so well in this YouTube clip:
That's nice. I've never heard of any of them.
That's UKIP's fault, not mine. I don't force UKIP to make Farage the centre of everything they do.
Would the promise not to kick out people who have settled legally (is this another UKIP policy they have never mentioned ever and would prefer not to discuss?) be extended to Romanians and Bulgarians, and the previous bunch from, say, Poland and Lithuania?
It doesnt matter what any of these front line, rent a policy, talking heads chunter.
Until my country invests in an adminstration that functions, the legislature is rendered obsolete.
You can have all the policies you want but until individuals are traceable, trackable and accountable for their actions, its all lip service.
Those that cling to infringment of civil liberty fail to see that even Orwell would be an advocate of ID cards if born in 1984
I dont care if ur black white or purple. I care if you are a dosser living off my graft.
Policies are meaningless without a competent civil service to enforce them. HMRC is "3rd world", Court system is "3rd world" local government is "3rd world" unless you live in Staffordshire.
Until we are able to know our neighbour and until we have enough social control to locate miscreants and either rehabilitate/punish/expel anti social behaviour, immigration policy is futile. Sure its easier to pick on Romanians, Somalians or whatever than invest in a system where all races, colors and creed are accountable.
This land has led the world on social cohesion before and it can do it again. Nobs like Nigel Farage cant. He is like Cecil Rhodes without the excuse of being born hundreds of years ago and without the Engineering skills All they share is a monster ego.
Say no to grifting, theieving caants wherever they are from, Lagos, Bucharest or Catford.
No, its not. Its your ignorance. If you watched programs like Daily Politics, Newsnight and Question Time you will have seen those names on many occasions. The media love Farage, because whether you like or loathe him he's an interesting character.
No one who came and settled here legally would get kicked out. Why would they, do you believe UKIP would kick them out then?
Thanks, the UKIP leaflet that arrived into my flat only had one person on it.
I've seen other talking heads from UKIP on TV, but not remembered their names because they weren't very interesting. I looked your list up, and still don't recognise them. Maybe I should have heard of Diane James losing Eastleigh if I followed that election. If it helps, I've never heard of the Labour or Lib Dem third candidates in the East of England constituency (Tim Aker is UKIP's third candidate there). The last one on your list doesn't even have a wiki page.
Question Time is a joke of a program anyway. Daily Politics is on when I'm at work. Newsnight is OK.
Its not a problem with immigration, immigration controlled can be a wonderful thing that can reap great benefits. The problem, is with mass open door immigration, its irresponsible and unsustainable.
Leaving the EU and calling back the 3 million Brits that have left this country will cause you a bigger problem than immigration will ever cause.
Its not a problem with immigration, immigration controlled can be a wonderful thing that can reap great benefits. The problem, is with mass open door immigration, its irresponsible and unsustainable.
Leaving the EU and calling back the 3 million Brits that have left this country will cause you a bigger problem than immigration will ever cause.
That wouldn't happen. If we left the EU we wouldn't kick people out who have already settled and came here legally.
You didn't even understand what he was talking about, did you? He's talking about British people who live happily in other countries in the EU. People like me.
I did actually, if you're there legally, have a job and are paying taxes it's not likely they'll kick you out. It's probably not in their interests to lose skilled British workers.
I dont think you can compare 3M returning expats to unregulated bods chancing their luck. Our problem is the inability to differentiate. But we were happy to take unskilled workers to do menial jobs when it suited us so I guess it cuts both ways.
Although i cant say i am happy @PragueAddick until i get MY seat back in the West Stand.
And if you people think Farage is jingoistic...you should see the politicians that poll 30% of the vote round these parts.
I did actually, if you're there legally, have a job and are paying taxes it's not likely they'll kick you out. It's probably not in their interests to lose skilled British workers.
The French, for example, would not "kick out" UK citizens living there if the UK withdrew from Europe but they WOULD withdraw all of the social benefits such as free (and top-class) healthcare and state education that UK citizens can currently access in France. That would obviously make it near impossible for anyone but very rich Britons to continue living there.
We have already seen a very large number of UK expats head back to the UK from France/Spain because of the economic downturn in those countries and an exit from the EU would bring many more home and put even more pressure on UK house prices and social services, especially health.
In addition, another small example of the consequences of a UK withdrawal from Europe would also make UK telecoms companies exempt from the EU's regulations prohibiting them from price gouging subscribers on international roaming charges, the telcos HATE the regulations on roaming because they have cost them a LOT of money and actually protect consumers.
An exit from the EU would make it much harder for the UK government to make those free-loading American corporate arseholes like Apple, Google, Amazon etc. pay their fair share of taxes, they can easily escape the UK exchequer by off-shoring but its not so easy if the whole of Europe is chasing you and taking action against your activities.
Generally if you're an ex pat you will have private health insurance anyway and if you have kids they're either dual nationality or the company you work for pays for their education. So sillly statement that you need to be 'very rich'
Ex pats returning has always happened and always will - I bet more have left these shores than returned over the past few years though. Most of the 3m ex pats are retired anyway.
So telecoms companies 'may' put up their prices? Another 5p a minute on your 'phone call really isn't a constructive arguement for not voting for a particular party.
American Coorporate arseholes don't pay their taxes anyway, so what's the difference?
Your characterisation of "expats" fits well with the gin soaked miserable whining bastards I met during a stopover in Singapore in the 80s. It has very little in common with so many people like me who have settled in Continental Europe in the last 20 years. There are far far more people out here than your idea of a small coterie of privileged corporate managers suggests. They are all ages, all income ranges. Including some lowlife, unfortunately.
I doubt this matters to you, and I admit it is difficult to believe unless you are out here and seeing it on a daily basis, but i just wanted to try and explain it to you. Ormy is right.
Comments
He's tapped two things very cleverly
1 the fact that a great number of this country are concerned with the scale of immigration and the impact it is having in changing / potentially changing, the fabric and culture of this country. No doubt some of those backing this will indeed be racist. The vast majority are not though and those opposed dubbing this as some form of racist bandwagon are completely missing the point.
2 that a lot of people are not particularly enthralled with the fact 'Europe' appears to have so much power over our laws, trade etc, plus the beurocracy etc that goes with it, and that generally we are 'shrinking' as a dominant, achieving nation
His plain speaking 'stick it up em' approach appeals greatly to those who feel politicians are completely a breed of their own that simply pay lip service, and hollow heavily spun words with no real gumption.
Of course, it's very easy to be a shouty renegade on the outside when it is simply words. Following through when getting the opportunity would have course be a very different story. UKIP has simply nothing more than a good frontman for shaking the apple cart. No other policies, no real structure or appealing individuals other than Farrage.
This little circus I can't see running for much longer. The real shame is that the main parties are simply plain scared of properly addressing the immigration / changing culture issue, and sadly never will. I have a fear that one day it will be too late.
You might be able to argue that with Milliband in charge he wouldn't take any notice when we told him not to invade, say, Georgia, but he hasn't taken any notice of Cameron over The Crimea, has he? Basically, we're an ex-imperial power with very little influence and massive delusions of grandeur, and no-one in their right mind would want to invade us because they'd just end up having to deal with the problems.
What is killing the lib dems is the challenge of being in power. What will challenge UKIP is winning seats and being held to account.
To give a local example we have our own Farragistas here on Charlton Life with a handful of posters forever posting negative shit about our club, our Board and our future without ever proposing a rational alternative.
On a serious note there is a common challenge for all western democracies to address how we utilise the Web for information and communications to engage a significant majority in building solutions for this century.
For reasons I won't go into I have had the opportunity and privilege to meet people with real insight into the challenges for our children and our children's children. I can assure you that arguing about being in the EU or Scots nats wanting independence is simply a massive distraction!
The future of health, benefits, pensions and education are far more critical. If people choose to be led by dodgy arguments then their fate will be decided by the elite without consultation.
One can apply that to our football club, our council, our government and Europe.
Perhaps we have technocratic government to out compete others. But they will outsource basic jobs and centralise wealth. Or we go for populist, nationalist anti foreigner (Belgian!) or we can look to build something with capitalism, democracy and a broad pan European ideal. If we don't build a model then another civilisation will and it will be vastly different to our European heritage.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-27477374
Seems to be pretty harmonious in Sheffield.
http://dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2634014/Mass-brawl-erupts-rival-groups-youths-area-former-Home-Secretary-David-Blunkett-warned-rioting-influx-Roma-immigrants.html
One is the leader of a party and therefore holds some real power within it.
Blunkett holds 0 power within the Labour party anymore and doesn't speak for them.
But its nice that you think there's some of crusade against Farage. If Cameron, Clegg or Miliband came out with racist views they'd be all over the front pages too.
Also, that entire 'riot' is a joke. Just two local groups of youths fighting and the Mail spins it into a migrant rant. Dire journalism.
That's UKIP's fault, not mine. I don't force UKIP to make Farage the centre of everything they do.
Would the promise not to kick out people who have settled legally (is this another UKIP policy they have never mentioned ever and would prefer not to discuss?) be extended to Romanians and Bulgarians, and the previous bunch from, say, Poland and Lithuania?
Until my country invests in an adminstration that functions, the legislature is rendered obsolete.
You can have all the policies you want but until individuals are traceable, trackable and accountable for their actions, its all lip service.
Those that cling to infringment of civil liberty fail to see that even Orwell would be an advocate of ID cards if born in 1984
I dont care if ur black white or purple. I care if you are a dosser living off my graft.
Policies are meaningless without a competent civil service to enforce them. HMRC is "3rd world", Court system is "3rd world" local government is "3rd world" unless you live in Staffordshire.
Until we are able to know our neighbour and until we have enough social control to locate miscreants and either rehabilitate/punish/expel anti social behaviour, immigration policy is futile. Sure its easier to pick on Romanians, Somalians or whatever than invest in a system where all races, colors and creed are accountable.
This land has led the world on social cohesion before and it can do it again. Nobs like Nigel Farage cant. He is like Cecil Rhodes without the excuse of being born hundreds of years ago and without the Engineering skills
Say no to grifting, theieving caants wherever they are from, Lagos, Bucharest or Catford.
No one who came and settled here legally would get kicked out. Why would they, do you believe UKIP would kick them out then?
I've seen other talking heads from UKIP on TV, but not remembered their names because they weren't very interesting. I looked your list up, and still don't recognise them. Maybe I should have heard of Diane James losing Eastleigh if I followed that election. If it helps, I've never heard of the Labour or Lib Dem third candidates in the East of England constituency (Tim Aker is UKIP's third candidate there). The last one on your list doesn't even have a wiki page.
Question Time is a joke of a program anyway. Daily Politics is on when I'm at work. Newsnight is OK.
Although I am not EU, merely EEA .
I dont think you can compare 3M returning expats to unregulated bods chancing their luck. Our problem is the inability to differentiate. But we were happy to take unskilled workers to do menial jobs when it suited us so I guess it cuts both ways.
Although i cant say i am happy @PragueAddick until i get MY seat back in the West Stand.
And if you people think Farage is jingoistic...you should see the politicians that poll 30% of the vote round these parts.
@onebigwideworld
We have already seen a very large number of UK expats head back to the UK from France/Spain because of the economic downturn in those countries and an exit from the EU would bring many more home and put even more pressure on UK house prices and social services, especially health.
In addition, another small example of the consequences of a UK withdrawal from Europe would also make UK telecoms companies exempt from the EU's regulations prohibiting them from price gouging subscribers on international roaming charges, the telcos HATE the regulations on roaming because they have cost them a LOT of money and actually protect consumers.
An exit from the EU would make it much harder for the UK government to make those free-loading American corporate arseholes like Apple, Google, Amazon etc. pay their fair share of taxes, they can easily escape the UK exchequer by off-shoring but its not so easy if the whole of Europe is chasing you and taking action against your activities.
http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/2014/05/21/should-you-vote-ukip-flowchart_n_5363204.html?utm_hp_ref=tw
Ex pats returning has always happened and always will - I bet more have left these shores than returned over the past few years though. Most of the 3m ex pats are retired anyway.
So telecoms companies 'may' put up their prices? Another 5p a minute on your 'phone call really isn't a constructive arguement for not voting for a particular party.
American Coorporate arseholes don't pay their taxes anyway, so what's the difference?
Will you be voting today Ormi?
Your characterisation of "expats" fits well with the gin soaked miserable whining bastards I met during a stopover in Singapore in the 80s. It has very little in common with so many people like me who have settled in Continental Europe in the last 20 years. There are far far more people out here than your idea of a small coterie of privileged corporate managers suggests. They are all ages, all income ranges. Including some lowlife, unfortunately.
I doubt this matters to you, and I admit it is difficult to believe unless you are out here and seeing it on a daily basis, but i just wanted to try and explain it to you. Ormy is right.