Moussa does not wipe the reserve club/'b' team theory clean away because we also have examples like Reza, AA and Koc, his signing dilutes things a bit, in a good way too.
I want to repeat something I've said (too often) before. We are not a feeder club, that is accepted, and we must not use that phrase in a muddled way.
However there is a lot, a great deal of, loads of even, of evidence that we are going to basically be a reserve team, or a convalescence centre, or a rehabilitation place, or a holding pen for players to get their fitness up, or make their stats look better WITH LITTLE OR NO REGARD AS TO THE RESULTS ACHIEVED BY CHARLTON ATHLETIC. As in if we scrape by and stay up that is enough.
I hope to goodness I am wrong, I really do hope to goodness I am wrong but I have heard on the quiet that results don't matter compared with the stuff I have written above, and then there is the actual evidence of what we know has taken place. Vetokele and PP are on long contracts so the value of the player is the resource to be deployed by RD.... they are essentially parked at Charlton.
PP himself, and Reza, and Astrid...and Loic, and Anil, and Thuram could all be said to have been sent to us for their benefit, not for our benefit, and Ben Haim is cluttering up the place at Liege so might as well park him over here.
I hope to goodness I am wrong, but no way are we a feeder club for the teams in the network, no way at all based on the evidence, but we are going to be a player farm/rehabilitation clinic/holding pen so that money can be generated from individual player development rather than team success.
sorry but what a pile of crap, 'I've heard on the quiet that results don't matter'
Others have posted stuff like me that also amounts to hearsay I admit to that.
I have dismissed a lot of what I have heard, but the mounting evidence is pointing in the direction that results won't matter that much. Anyway within my pile of crap I have repeated that I hope I am wrong, so Elthamaddick you don't need to get too worried about my contribution, which you have responded to in such an erudite and developed way.
With Southampton pocketing a small fortune for Shaw and Lalana you can see that it is possible to make money from player sales, maybe more possible than getting into the premier league. Indeed Cardiff gambled on the prem and it looks as if the subsequent windfall is not the solution for them necessarily, have they got tons of lucrative playing assets to sell now?
Yes 'results don't matter' is wrong in one way, unless you reverse the Crystal palace maxim that winning is everything. maybe results do matter, but only after financial restraint, player development, Academy exploitation and then, oh yes, results for the first team as a lower priority.
Maybe I should have written 'results do matter, but not that much'.
I suppose the mounting evidence as I see it (looking on wiki) is that he is indeed cluttering up the place at Standard de Liege, and it is convenient to ship him out to Charlton. I have made no reference as to whether he is, or will be, any good or not, but he is not particularly well used in Liege so he comes to us. Very much like the Standard bloke said in January (van de Saart?). So in that context if we sign Ben Haim to me it looks like mounting evidence that we can be treated like a reserve team.
I repeat, I hope I am wrong.
Again no evidence just your negative opinion. Who says he's 'cluttering up the place at Standard de Liege'? You do, no one else. So STILL no 'mounting evidence' that we are treated like a reserve team, absolutely none, except in your head. Why do people post such utter BS?
Yes it is indeed my opinion which you see as negative, indeed you see as 'utter BS'. I have described what I think is evidence and in your (positive?) opinion you think I am wrong.
So there we have it. We each have an opinion, and I am guessing here, but possibly you think he was a vital part of the Standard de Liege set up, and we are indeed fortunate to have him.
It seems as if my posts today have touched some nerves. Is it because if there is some credence that Charlton Athletic are a reserve set up then some of you wouldn't like it? The concept of reserve set ups...'B' teams, is all over everywhere at the moment, so it does not take many leaps to imagine that Charlton Athletic could become a glorified 'B' team. I repeat that I hope I am wrong, but if I am mainly right, we would become a bit of a laughing stock like Watford to the wider footballing world.
It is negative because you have no proof, it is bullshit, well because you made it up. You're guessing and scaremongering. Read back from your opening post, its all quoted here. Its just poison.
No I am not guessing and scaremongering, I am reaching a conclusion, yes an opinion, based on the evidence as it seems to me, isn't that what many people do? Why be scared anyway, there seem to be some Charlton supporters around who would be content if we were a reserve/'B' team?
I'm not doing it anymore. Its a waste of time and energy.
I want to repeat something I've said (too often) before. We are not a feeder club, that is accepted, and we must not use that phrase in a muddled way.
However there is a lot, a great deal of, loads of even, of evidence that we are going to basically be a reserve team, or a convalescence centre, or a rehabilitation place, or a holding pen for players to get their fitness up, or make their stats look better WITH LITTLE OR NO REGARD AS TO THE RESULTS ACHIEVED BY CHARLTON ATHLETIC. As in if we scrape by and stay up that is enough.
I hope to goodness I am wrong, I really do hope to goodness I am wrong but I have heard on the quiet that results don't matter compared with the stuff I have written above, and then there is the actual evidence of what we know has taken place. Vetokele and PP are on long contracts so the value of the player is the resource to be deployed by RD.... they are essentially parked at Charlton.
PP himself, and Reza, and Astrid...and Loic, and Anil, and Thuram could all be said to have been sent to us for their benefit, not for our benefit, and Ben Haim is cluttering up the place at Liege so might as well park him over here.
I hope to goodness I am wrong, but no way are we a feeder club for the teams in the network, no way at all based on the evidence, but we are going to be a player farm/rehabilitation clinic/holding pen so that money can be generated from individual player development rather than team success.
sorry but what a pile of crap, 'I've heard on the quiet that results don't matter'
Others have posted stuff like me that also amounts to hearsay I admit to that.
I have dismissed a lot of what I have heard, but the mounting evidence is pointing in the direction that results won't matter that much. Anyway within my pile of crap I have repeated that I hope I am wrong, so Elthamaddick you don't need to get too worried about my contribution, which you have responded to in such an erudite and developed way.
With Southampton pocketing a small fortune for Shaw and Lalana you can see that it is possible to make money from player sales, maybe more possible than getting into the premier league. Indeed Cardiff gambled on the prem and it looks as if the subsequent windfall is not the solution for them necessarily, have they got tons of lucrative playing assets to sell now?
Yes 'results don't matter' is wrong in one way, unless you reverse the Crystal palace maxim that winning is everything. maybe results do matter, but only after financial restraint, player development, Academy exploitation and then, oh yes, results for the first team as a lower priority.
Maybe I should have written 'results do matter, but not that much'.
I suppose the mounting evidence as I see it (looking on wiki) is that he is indeed cluttering up the place at Standard de Liege, and it is convenient to ship him out to Charlton. I have made no reference as to whether he is, or will be, any good or not, but he is not particularly well used in Liege so he comes to us. Very much like the Standard bloke said in January (van de Saart?). So in that context if we sign Ben Haim to me it looks like mounting evidence that we can be treated like a reserve team.
I repeat, I hope I am wrong.
Again no evidence just your negative opinion. Who says he's 'cluttering up the place at Standard de Liege'? You do, no one else. So STILL no 'mounting evidence' that we are treated like a reserve team, absolutely none, except in your head. Why do people post such utter BS?
Yes it is indeed my opinion which you see as negative, indeed you see as 'utter BS'. I have described what I think is evidence and in your (positive?) opinion you think I am wrong.
So there we have it. We each have an opinion, and I am guessing here, but possibly you think he was a vital part of the Standard de Liege set up, and we are indeed fortunate to have him.
It seems as if my posts today have touched some nerves. Is it because if there is some credence that Charlton Athletic are a reserve set up then some of you wouldn't like it? The concept of reserve set ups...'B' teams, is all over everywhere at the moment, so it does not take many leaps to imagine that Charlton Athletic could become a glorified 'B' team. I repeat that I hope I am wrong, but if I am mainly right, we would become a bit of a laughing stock like Watford to the wider footballing world.
It is negative because you have no proof, it is bullshit, well because you made it up. You're guessing and scaremongering. Read back from your opening post, its all quoted here. Its just poison.
No I am not guessing and scaremongering, I am reaching a conclusion, yes an opinion, based on the evidence as it seems to me, isn't that what many people do? Why be scared anyway, there seem to be some Charlton supporters around who would be content if we were a reserve/'B' team?
I'm not doing it anymore. Its a waste of time and energy.
Moussa does not wipe the reserve club/'b' team theory clean away because we also have examples like Reza, AA and Koc, his signing dilutes things a bit, in a good way too.
Moussa does not wipe the reserve club/'b' team theory clean away because we also have examples like Reza, AA and Koc, his signing dilutes things a bit, in a good way too.
Ventokele???
Ventokele came from a Danish club, Reza, Anil, AA were from Standard de Liege, and Ben Haim is a player at Standard de Liege.
Moussa does not wipe the reserve club/'b' team theory clean away because we also have examples like Reza, AA and Koc, his signing dilutes things a bit, in a good way too.
Ventokele???
Ventokele came from a Danish club, Reza, Anil, AA were from Standard de Liege, and Ben Haim is a player at Standard de Liege.
yeah I know where he came from, but he was bought for a large sum of money specifically for us. Not the doings of a reserve side.
Moussa does not wipe the reserve club/'b' team theory clean away because we also have examples like Reza, AA and Koc, his signing dilutes things a bit, in a good way too.
Ventokele???
Ventokele came from a Danish club, Reza, Anil, AA were from Standard de Liege, and Ben Haim is a player at Standard de Liege.
Did you experiment with acid in the 60s? Starting to think you are having flashbacks and are living in some weird alternative reality.
So what if they are from Belgium, or Denmark or are Belgian, maybe we should just buy lower standard English players, oh, wait, we've fricking done that for the last 7/8 years and let's be honest, how many have gone on to better things, or, been any good for us. Belgian football is in such decline as well and English football is amazing....
Really is a lot of people who can't get over the Powell thing.
Moussa does not wipe the reserve club/'b' team theory clean away because we also have examples like Reza, AA and Koc, his signing dilutes things a bit, in a good way too.
Ventokele???
Ventokele came from a Danish club, Reza, Anil, AA were from Standard de Liege, and Ben Haim is a player at Standard de Liege.
Did you experiment with acid in the 60s? Starting to think you are having flashbacks and are living in some weird alternative reality.
So what if they are from Belgium, or Denmark or are Belgian, maybe we should just buy lower standard English players, oh, wait, we've fricking done that for the last 7/8 years and let's be honest, how many have gone on to better things, or, been any good for us. Belgian football is in such decline as well and English football is amazing....
Really is a lot of people who can't get over the Powell thing.
Moussa does not wipe the reserve club/'b' team theory clean away because we also have examples like Reza, AA and Koc, his signing dilutes things a bit, in a good way too.
Did you see that Francois de Sart has left Standard de Liege? It seems his contract wasn't renewed.
Any thoughts on what that might mean? I'd suggest that it's at least possible that its telling us that Duchatelet wasn't happy with what happened in January. What do you think?
My take has always been that the loan moves in January were a screw up. Whoever was advising Duchatelet simply underestimated the Championship. I had no evidence for this view. It just seemed more plausible than a Machiavellian plot in which we were a feeder team, B team, being relegated to save money on the purchase price, and where the owner was picking the team. These notions were always absurd because they made no sense. Why on earth would Duchatelet buy Charlton and then operate this way?
That said, fair enough, some people need more concrete evidence. I'd suggest that we are now seeing this and there comes a point where we should all laugh at the pathetic Martin Samuel article that caused such a stir and simply move on.
The team is strengthening - a lot of unknowns which could be good or bad. If it all comes together we could be challenging and if it doesn't we could be fighting relegation - hopefully it is the former but it will be one of the hardest seasons to predict. If Solly, Wiggins and Morro stay healthy the defence with a couple of additions looks healthy. A 3 million CL striker has to be decent. 4- 3-3 Belgian blueprint here we come - looking at the world cup - it may be a positive.
I'd suggest that it's at least possible that its telling us that Duchatelet wasn't happy with what happened in January. What do you think?
My take has always been that the loan moves in January were a screw up. Whoever was advising Duchatelet simply underestimated the Championship. I had no evidence for this view. It just seemed more plausible than a Machiavellian plot in which we were a feeder team, B team, being relegated to save money on the purchase price, and where the owner was picking the team. These notions were always absurd because they made no sense. Why on earth would Duchatelet buy Charlton and then operate this way?
Can we expect Roland to make an apology to the management team that told him the error of his ways at the time?
In January everything was so new and sudden that lots of people were not picking their words carefully, and that is what Francois de Sart did, and he was faced with quite a cute and clever interviewer. However de Sart may have exposed a degree of thinking that made up a portion of the puzzle inadvertently, it certainly unsettled me, but I wouldn't think he left Standard de Liege because of it.
If you add to the de Sart comment some subsequent events it is not too difficult to be alarmed.
yet.
We also have lots of positives, the recent signings and the improvements at the Valley could be said to be positives for sure. This leaves me in a rather ambivalent position, very alert and sensitive to stuff that suggests a reserve/'b' team scenario, but then again intrigued by the apparent ambition and the newness occurring.
Jose Riga himself said it was normal for fans to be suspicious of the new.
Then we have the finances. If we can leave the detail aside for a moment, I would like to consider the financial benefits of player churn against the benefits of promotion. Getting promotion is a much more difficult ask than churning players to turn a decent buck. Player enhancement, if you have a reputation for doing it pretty well, can possibly ensure a longer term, and more reliable income stream than relying on going up and down leagues and TV money, especially when success brings bigger contract demands from players.
I said in another post somewhere that I feel as if I am shifting uneasily from buttock to buttock over all this, and I am attempting to add a personal perspective to events, although other posters dismiss what I write with one line put downs, or that I am Powell obsessed, or anti Duchatelet. In addition I know I couldn't afford to buy Charlton so what does it matter what any of us think it is RD's enterprise isn't it?
I don't think I am pro this or anti that, but I do think that there are some eternals that we can use to properly measure things and they may well be:
Season ticket sales. Attendances. Goals scored. Points gained. League position. Cup runs. A playable pitch. Results against Millwall Going bust.
Other stuff is more elusive, like Academy success, or the prettiness of the football, or how we are perceived. or the aesthetics of the stadium.
For me the overarching measure is winning matches, because that is why I have bought a season ticket.
In January everything was so new and sudden that lots of people were not picking their words carefully, and that is what Francois de Sart did, and he was faced with quite a cute and clever interviewer. However de Sart may have exposed a degree of thinking that made up a portion of the puzzle inadvertently, it certainly unsettled me, but I wouldn't think he left Standard de Liege because of it.
If you add to the de Sart comment some subsequent events it is not too difficult to be alarmed.
yet.
We also have lots of positives, the recent signings and the improvements at the Valley could be said to be positives for sure. This leaves me in a rather ambivalent position, very alert and sensitive to stuff that suggests a reserve/'b' team scenario, but then again intrigued by the apparent ambition and the newness occurring.
Jose Riga himself said it was normal for fans to be suspicious of the new.
Then we have the finances. If we can leave the detail aside for a moment, I would like to consider the financial benefits of player churn against the benefits of promotion. Getting promotion is a much more difficult ask than churning players to turn a decent buck. Player enhancement, if you have a reputation for doing it pretty well, can possibly ensure a longer term, and more reliable income stream than relying on going up and down leagues and TV money, especially when success brings bigger contract demands from players.
I said in another post somewhere that I feel as if I am shifting uneasily from buttock to buttock over all this, and I am attempting to add a personal perspective to events, although other posters dismiss what I write with one line put downs, or that I am Powell obsessed, or anti Duchatelet. In addition I know I couldn't afford to buy Charlton so what does it matter what any of us think it is RD's enterprise isn't it?
I don't think I am pro this or anti that, but I do think that there are some eternals that we can use to properly measure things and they may well be:
Season ticket sales. Attendances. Goals scored. Points gained. League position. Cup runs. A playable pitch. Results against Millwall Going bust.
Other stuff is more elusive, like Academy success, or the prettiness of the football, or how we are perceived. or the aesthetics of the stadium.
For me the overarching measure is winning matches, because that is why I have bought a season ticket.
That is a fair comment Seth and though we have had disagreements on other threads/subjects I can see where you are coming from and I think we probably agree on more than I thought was the case. I personally feel that the network is going to be put to work in the favour of Charlton - whether RD has changed his priorities given Liege's relatively poor season or was always going to switch his attention to the (potentially) bigger bucks of the English game I do not know, but I am pretty confident that the aim is to be successful and raise the value of the club and the players - I just cannot agree we are a feeder/reserve club as I can't believe there weren't cheaper, easier options even in the Championship if that was Roland's sole end game.
I too am nervous, as despite my generally positive outlook I am not blind to the chance the network 'experiment' COULD backfire badly - but I am confident at the moment it will not. I don't blame others if they don't share this confidence - but I do think that going into the season with the expectation of failure in football terms is only going to hold the club back when getting behind Bob, the players and the club could give us the boost between survival and challenging for the top six. I am expecting comfortable survival, and potentially a push for the play offs, but as long as the team plays cohesively and positively, I will be content - for the time being.
In January everything was so new and sudden that lots of people were not picking their words carefully, and that is what Francois de Sart did, and he was faced with quite a cute and clever interviewer. However de Sart may have exposed a degree of thinking that made up a portion of the puzzle inadvertently, it certainly unsettled me, but I wouldn't think he left Standard de Liege because of it.
If you add to the de Sart comment some subsequent events it is not too difficult to be alarmed.
yet.
We also have lots of positives, the recent signings and the improvements at the Valley could be said to be positives for sure. This leaves me in a rather ambivalent position, very alert and sensitive to stuff that suggests a reserve/'b' team scenario, but then again intrigued by the apparent ambition and the newness occurring.
Jose Riga himself said it was normal for fans to be suspicious of the new.
Then we have the finances. If we can leave the detail aside for a moment, I would like to consider the financial benefits of player churn against the benefits of promotion. Getting promotion is a much more difficult ask than churning players to turn a decent buck. Player enhancement, if you have a reputation for doing it pretty well, can possibly ensure a longer term, and more reliable income stream than relying on going up and down leagues and TV money, especially when success brings bigger contract demands from players.
I said in another post somewhere that I feel as if I am shifting uneasily from buttock to buttock over all this, and I am attempting to add a personal perspective to events, although other posters dismiss what I write with one line put downs, or that I am Powell obsessed, or anti Duchatelet. In addition I know I couldn't afford to buy Charlton so what does it matter what any of us think it is RD's enterprise isn't it?
I don't think I am pro this or anti that, but I do think that there are some eternals that we can use to properly measure things and they may well be:
Season ticket sales. Attendances. Goals scored. Points gained. League position. Cup runs. A playable pitch. Results against Millwall Going bust.
Other stuff is more elusive, like Academy success, or the prettiness of the football, or how we are perceived. or the aesthetics of the stadium.
For me the overarching measure is winning matches, because that is why I have bought a season ticket.
That is a fair comment Seth and though we have had disagreements on other threads/subjects I can see where you are coming from and I think we probably agree on more than I thought was the case. I personally feel that the network is going to be put to work in the favour of Charlton - whether RD has changed his priorities given Liege's relatively poor season or was always going to switch his attention to the (potentially) bigger bucks of the English game I do not know, but I am pretty confident that the aim is to be successful and raise the value of the club and the players - I just cannot agree we are a feeder/reserve club as I can't believe there weren't cheaper, easier options even in the Championship if that was Roland's sole end game.
I too am nervous, as despite my generally positive outlook I am not blind to the chance the network 'experiment' COULD backfire badly - but I am confident at the moment it will not. I don't blame others if they don't share this confidence - but I do think that going into the season with the expectation of failure in football terms is only going to hold the club back when getting behind Bob, the players and the club could give us the boost between survival and challenging for the top six. I am expecting comfortable survival, and potentially a push for the play offs, but as long as the team plays cohesively and positively, I will be content - for the time being.
Yes a good post.
For some reason I feel more enthusiastic getting behind Big Bob than I did for Jose Riga, yes weird I know. I will be willing us on from the off no question about that.
However I want us to win, especially at home, and I don't feel much like cutting Bob and the players much slack if we bomb badly. Someone said that some bookies have us odds on for relegation, I actually think we could strangely be odds on for promotion...I haven't a clue. But if I spend next season continually walking out of the Valley with a rhythm that says lose one, draw one, win occasionally, then getting behind Bob Peeters and the boys is going to be a tough ask.
In January everything was so new and sudden that lots of people were not picking their words carefully, and that is what Francois de Sart did, and he was faced with quite a cute and clever interviewer. However de Sart may have exposed a degree of thinking that made up a portion of the puzzle inadvertently, it certainly unsettled me, but I wouldn't think he left Standard de Liege because of it.
If you add to the de Sart comment some subsequent events it is not too difficult to be alarmed.
yet.
We also have lots of positives, the recent signings and the improvements at the Valley could be said to be positives for sure. This leaves me in a rather ambivalent position, very alert and sensitive to stuff that suggests a reserve/'b' team scenario, but then again intrigued by the apparent ambition and the newness occurring.
Jose Riga himself said it was normal for fans to be suspicious of the new.
Then we have the finances. If we can leave the detail aside for a moment, I would like to consider the financial benefits of player churn against the benefits of promotion. Getting promotion is a much more difficult ask than churning players to turn a decent buck. Player enhancement, if you have a reputation for doing it pretty well, can possibly ensure a longer term, and more reliable income stream than relying on going up and down leagues and TV money, especially when success brings bigger contract demands from players.
I said in another post somewhere that I feel as if I am shifting uneasily from buttock to buttock over all this, and I am attempting to add a personal perspective to events, although other posters dismiss what I write with one line put downs, or that I am Powell obsessed, or anti Duchatelet. In addition I know I couldn't afford to buy Charlton so what does it matter what any of us think it is RD's enterprise isn't it?
I don't think I am pro this or anti that, but I do think that there are some eternals that we can use to properly measure things and they may well be:
Season ticket sales. Attendances. Goals scored. Points gained. League position. Cup runs. A playable pitch. Results against Millwall Going bust.
Other stuff is more elusive, like Academy success, or the prettiness of the football, or how we are perceived. or the aesthetics of the stadium.
For me the overarching measure is winning matches, because that is why I have bought a season ticket.
That is a fair comment Seth and though we have had disagreements on other threads/subjects I can see where you are coming from and I think we probably agree on more than I thought was the case. I personally feel that the network is going to be put to work in the favour of Charlton - whether RD has changed his priorities given Liege's relatively poor season or was always going to switch his attention to the (potentially) bigger bucks of the English game I do not know, but I am pretty confident that the aim is to be successful and raise the value of the club and the players - I just cannot agree we are a feeder/reserve club as I can't believe there weren't cheaper, easier options even in the Championship if that was Roland's sole end game.
I too am nervous, as despite my generally positive outlook I am not blind to the chance the network 'experiment' COULD backfire badly - but I am confident at the moment it will not. I don't blame others if they don't share this confidence - but I do think that going into the season with the expectation of failure in football terms is only going to hold the club back when getting behind Bob, the players and the club could give us the boost between survival and challenging for the top six. I am expecting comfortable survival, and potentially a push for the play offs, but as long as the team plays cohesively and positively, I will be content - for the time being.
Yes a good post.
For some reason I feel more enthusiastic getting behind Big Bob than I did for Jose Riga, yes weird I know. I will be willing us on from the off no question about that.
However I want us to win, especially at home, and I don't feel much like cutting Bob and the players much slack if we bomb badly. Someone said that some bookies have us odds on for relegation, I actually think we could strangely be odds on for promotion...I haven't a clue. But if I spend next season continually walking out of the Valley with a rhythm that says lose one, draw one, win occasionally, then getting behind Bob Peeters and the boys is going to be a tough ask.
That's the kind of form we started the season in, and maintained right up until January last season. Whether Powell was handicapped, hit his personal limit, or somewhere in between, for my money we looked a lot better as a team when RD stepped in and appointed his own man - who he was more willing to trust personally and financially. Ultimately, it was successful and for that reason I feel he has earned the right to roll the dice again with this new appointment. We play awful, turgid football and bring in flood of hasbeens on loan and I assure you I will protest as much as anyone... but I think getting behind everyone at the club from the board down is the best way forward right now.
I agree that there could be reasons for concern and Seth obviously had a conversation which made him think there was. I've had conversations that make me think otherwise but I certainly understand and respect what Seth is saying.
I personally haven't seen you having a constant pop at The new regime (apart from when Riga was first appointed) unlike other posters and think that your posts 9/10 are balanced between the two.
I feel like there's a bit more optimism flowing through the club and forum now and it's great to see. Although I can see why people are still a bit concerned.
So what if they are from Belgium, or Denmark or are Belgian, maybe we should just buy lower standard English players, oh, wait, we've fricking done that for the last 7/8 years and let's be honest, how many have gone on to better things, or, been any good for us. Belgian football is in such decline as well and English football is amazing....
Really is a lot of people who can't get over the Powell thing.
So what if they are from Belgium, or Denmark or are Belgian, maybe we should just buy lower standard English players, oh, wait, we've fricking done that for the last 7/8 years and let's be honest, how many have gone on to better things, or, been any good for us. Belgian football is in such decline as well and English football is amazing....
Really is a lot of people who can't get over the Powell thing.
Comments
Really is a lot of people who can't get over the Powell thing.
oooh, you gonna flagged for that.
Any thoughts on what that might mean? I'd suggest that it's at least possible that its telling us that Duchatelet wasn't happy with what happened in January. What do you think?
My take has always been that the loan moves in January were a screw up. Whoever was advising Duchatelet simply underestimated the Championship. I had no evidence for this view. It just seemed more plausible than a Machiavellian plot in which we were a feeder team, B team, being relegated to save money on the purchase price, and where the owner was picking the team. These notions were always absurd because they made no sense. Why on earth would Duchatelet buy Charlton and then operate this way?
That said, fair enough, some people need more concrete evidence. I'd suggest that we are now seeing this and there comes a point where we should all laugh at the pathetic Martin Samuel article that caused such a stir and simply move on.
If you add to the de Sart comment some subsequent events it is not too difficult to be alarmed.
yet.
We also have lots of positives, the recent signings and the improvements at the Valley could be said to be positives for sure. This leaves me in a rather ambivalent position, very alert and sensitive to stuff that suggests a reserve/'b' team scenario, but then again intrigued by the apparent ambition and the newness occurring.
Jose Riga himself said it was normal for fans to be suspicious of the new.
Then we have the finances. If we can leave the detail aside for a moment, I would like to consider the financial benefits of player churn against the benefits of promotion. Getting promotion is a much more difficult ask than churning players to turn a decent buck. Player enhancement, if you have a reputation for doing it pretty well, can possibly ensure a longer term, and more reliable income stream than relying on going up and down leagues and TV money, especially when success brings bigger contract demands from players.
I said in another post somewhere that I feel as if I am shifting uneasily from buttock to buttock over all this, and I am attempting to add a personal perspective to events, although other posters dismiss what I write with one line put downs, or that I am Powell obsessed, or anti Duchatelet. In addition I know I couldn't afford to buy Charlton so what does it matter what any of us think it is RD's enterprise isn't it?
I don't think I am pro this or anti that, but I do think that there are some eternals that we can use to properly measure things and they may well be:
Season ticket sales.
Attendances.
Goals scored.
Points gained.
League position.
Cup runs.
A playable pitch.
Results against Millwall
Going bust.
Other stuff is more elusive, like Academy success, or the prettiness of the football, or how we are perceived. or the aesthetics of the stadium.
For me the overarching measure is winning matches, because that is why I have bought a season ticket.
I too am nervous, as despite my generally positive outlook I am not blind to the chance the network 'experiment' COULD backfire badly - but I am confident at the moment it will not. I don't blame others if they don't share this confidence - but I do think that going into the season with the expectation of failure in football terms is only going to hold the club back when getting behind Bob, the players and the club could give us the boost between survival and challenging for the top six. I am expecting comfortable survival, and potentially a push for the play offs, but as long as the team plays cohesively and positively, I will be content - for the time being.
For some reason I feel more enthusiastic getting behind Big Bob than I did for Jose Riga, yes weird I know. I will be willing us on from the off no question about that.
However I want us to win, especially at home, and I don't feel much like cutting Bob and the players much slack if we bomb badly. Someone said that some bookies have us odds on for relegation, I actually think we could strangely be odds on for promotion...I haven't a clue. But if I spend next season continually walking out of the Valley with a rhythm that says lose one, draw one, win occasionally, then getting behind Bob Peeters and the boys is going to be a tough ask.
:-)
I agree that there could be reasons for concern and Seth obviously had a conversation which made him think there was. I've had conversations that make me think otherwise but I certainly understand and respect what Seth is saying.
I personally haven't seen you having a constant pop at The new regime (apart from when Riga was first appointed) unlike other posters and think that your posts 9/10 are balanced between the two.
I feel like there's a bit more optimism flowing through the club and forum now and it's great to see. Although I can see why people are still a bit concerned.
Pope
Solly
Morro
Mancienne
Wiggins
Wilson
Moussa
Buyens/Jacko
Harriott
Reza
Vetekole