Staying at/moving from the Valley. What's the business case?

Airman Brown

ken from bexley said:

I leave you to consider the words of Steve Bradshaw in regard to consultation in relation to ACV.
He has given a firm undertaking on the CAFC website........
“There are no current plans to move stadium, and of course we would always give fans the opportunity to have their say in the event that such a situation arose, so the club would support proposals that would formalise this right to consultation.”
Read more at http://www.cafc.co.uk/news/article/20130722-have-a-say-in-the-valleys-future-935037.aspx#TBLyLFaPrKprAbEx.99

I do not remember the club ever stating that publicly?...... as a matter of policy.
If nothing else the application of ACV has produced this, and quite possibly a consultation period.
Not a perfect situation, but better than nothing, which your post alludes to?

Ken, I support the ACV application, but what on earth makes you think an undertaking from Bradshaw is worth anything? He hasn't even got the respect of the people who work for him.

nth_london_addick

So out of the 4 DRF only 1 the non english went to charlton because it was his local team

the other 2 went due to family and 1 who went with someone who has CAFC in his blood i pressume

so how is it flawed ,

ken from bexley

Airman Brown said:

ken from bexley said:

I leave you to consider the words of Steve Bradshaw in regard to consultation in relation to ACV.
He has given a firm undertaking on the CAFC website........
“There are no current plans to move stadium, and of course we would always give fans the opportunity to have their say in the event that such a situation arose, so the club would support proposals that would formalise this right to consultation.”
Read more at http://www.cafc.co.uk/news/article/20130722-have-a-say-in-the-valleys-future-935037.aspx#TBLyLFaPrKprAbEx.99

I do not remember the club ever stating that publicly?...... as a matter of policy.
If nothing else the application of ACV has produced this, and quite possibly a consultation period.
Not a perfect situation, but better than nothing, which your post alludes to?

Ken, I support the ACV application, but what on earth makes you think an undertaking from Bradshaw is worth anything? He hasn't even got the respect of the people who work for him.

I am sure you do Airman, for someone who fought so hard to return to the valley 20 years ago.
If people wish to go on the CAFC website and be unsincere, then I think that will be a serious breach of trust if they subsequently do not deliver there words into action.
I think there position will be very difficult to have any credability, let alone authority, and let's admit it it aint too high in the first place if we take your position.

As you support the ACV that was my main point. Steve Bradshaw's comments are in addition to the application.
They are for him to uphold, and implement.If they are empty words why state them?.
So what is your message to the supporters Rick, I assume it is to sign up for the ACV as we have both done?
See Bradshaw's comments as a 'side order' to the main dish on the menu?..... if they are hard for you to swallow........

Airman Brown

ken from bexley said:

Airman Brown said:

ken from bexley said:

I leave you to consider the words of Steve Bradshaw in regard to consultation in relation to ACV.
He has given a firm undertaking on the CAFC website........
“There are no current plans to move stadium, and of course we would always give fans the opportunity to have their say in the event that such a situation arose, so the club would support proposals that would formalise this right to consultation.”
Read more at http://www.cafc.co.uk/news/article/20130722-have-a-say-in-the-valleys-future-935037.aspx#TBLyLFaPrKprAbEx.99

I do not remember the club ever stating that publicly?...... as a matter of policy.
If nothing else the application of ACV has produced this, and quite possibly a consultation period.
Not a perfect situation, but better than nothing, which your post alludes to?

Ken, I support the ACV application, but what on earth makes you think an undertaking from Bradshaw is worth anything? He hasn't even got the respect of the people who work for him.

I am sure you do Airman, for someone who fought so hard to return to the valley 20 years ago.
If people wish to go on the CAFC website and be unsincere, then I think that will be a serious breach of trust if they subsequently do not deliver there words into action.
I think there position will be very difficult to have any credability, let alone authority, and let's admit it it aint too high in the first place if we take your position.

As you support the ACV that was my main point. Steve Bradshaw's comments are in addition to the application.
They are for him to uphold, and implement.If they are empty words why state them?.
So what is your message to the supporters Rick, I assume it is to sign up for the ACV as we have both done?
See Bradshaw's comments as a 'side order' to the main dish on the menu?..... if they are hard for you to swallow........

Ken, my point is that Bradshaw's a nobody. He's not a director, he left mighty Colchester under a cloud, and I doubt if he'll last much longer at The Valley the way he's going.

To put it another way, his views carry no more authority on such matters than mine when I was on the staff.

ken from bexley

I know Airman .....but there are only 3 directors and you never hear of Richard Murray speaking on behalf of CAFC on such matters on the club website, nor would I expect to.
TJ has never spoken if I am correct, and Slater has only occassionally done so.
Without a Press officer at present...... who would you expect to comment?
Steve Bradshaw is effectively the person dealing with these matters, which I am sure you are aware.
I am only to pleased to speak to any CAFC employee, as the liason officer, before Christmas few of them would do so?
Mind you in the past few of them did, you being an exception along with Dave Archer and Matt Wright and there hands were somewhat 'tied'.

Covered End

"There are no current plans to move stadium", means sod all.

Maybe there wasn't when he said it, but so what. There may easily be the following day, or tomorrow or next week.

It means nothing, nowt, nada.

Airman Brown

ken from bexley said:

I know Airman .....but there are only 3 directors and you never hear of Richard Murray speaking on behalf of CAFC on such matters on the club website, nor would I expect to.
TJ has never spoken if I am correct, and Slater has only occassionally done so.
Without a Press officer at present...... who would you expect to comment?
Steve Bradshaw is effectively the person dealing with these matters, which I am sure you are aware.
I am only to pleased to speak to any CAFC employee, as the liason officer, before Christmas few of them would do so?
Mind you in the past few of them did, you being an exception along with Dave Archer and Matt Wright and there hands were somewhat 'tied'.

There are four directors and if no one else is willing I'd expect to hear it from the executive vice chair - but evidently he's a Trappist monk.

RalphMilnesgut

Still not sure why, if there is space elsewhere, why some other business just does not build houses there. What is the business case for someone buying the Valley site rather than just buying the peninsula site? I understand why the Silent Board would want to sell but not why it makes sense for a developer to buy. BTW if we have a Trappist on the Board, the beer fans might be able to look forward to better Ale

ShootersHillGuru

Airman Brown said:

ken from bexley said:

I know Airman .....but there are only 3 directors and you never hear of Richard Murray speaking on behalf of CAFC on such matters on the club website, nor would I expect to.
TJ has never spoken if I am correct, and Slater has only occassionally done so.
Without a Press officer at present...... who would you expect to comment?
Steve Bradshaw is effectively the person dealing with these matters, which I am sure you are aware.
I am only to pleased to speak to any CAFC employee, as the liason officer, before Christmas few of them would do so?
Mind you in the past few of them did, you being an exception along with Dave Archer and Matt Wright and there hands were somewhat 'tied'.

There are four directors and if no one else is willing I'd expect to hear it from the executive vice chair - but evidently he's a Trappist monk.

Trappist Monk. No wonder he can't speak. That beers lethal.

ken from bexley

Covered End said:

"There are no current plans to move stadium", means sod all.

Maybe there wasn't when he said it, but so what. There may easily be the following day, or tomorrow or next week.

It means nothing, nowt, nada.

Oh I thought that CAFC were part of a 'proposal' to move to the peninsular/Macro site?.
Of course it does not mean that tommorow afternoon at 4pm the club will NOT announce a ground share with Westham at the Olympic stadium, or some such idea?
I have enough trouble getting a response out of CAFC to confirm arrangements, and the thought of getting them to deny 'rumours' I feel is not going to happen.
Even when Airman was there, they rarely responded to concerns/enquiries of a business nature. I know I tried ? ( and we all know I have bored people to death with my previous comments of who I worked for haven't we?...... althought at the time it was the Financial Times newspaper ?)

Stig

razil

Have to say I think the statement is better than nowt, and technically it means not only is acv not going to be opposed, but also that the FA and other bodies are in support.

So it has some value. Clearly it is not cast iron but then again what is whomever gives it, with creative wording

DRF

nth london addick said:

So out of the 4 DRF only 1 the non english went to charlton because it was his local team

the other 2 went due to family and 1 who went with someone who has CAFC in his blood i pressume

so how is it flawed ,

Whilst I suppose I didn't mention it, the third person did in fact have other neighbours and friends who supported other teams. As a youngster he went with various people to Fulham, Liverpool and West Ham, maybe others he's not mentioned, of these he chose Charlton to be his team. You specifically said people only went if they had in it in their blood.

And even if, as you suggest, he is invalid because he went with other peopl who had it in their blood that still leaves one in four.

Do you believe it is not worth promoting the club to increase the attendance by 25%?

DRF

RalphMilnesgut said:

Still not sure why, if there is space elsewhere, why some other business just does not build houses there. What is the business case for someone buying the Valley site rather than just buying the peninsula site? I understand why the Silent Board would want to sell but not why it makes sense for a developer to buy. BTW if we have a Trappist on the Board, the beer fans might be able to look forward to better Ale

The Peninsula is polluted ground and there is a limit to the number of residences which can be built on it. They removed an amount of top soil in order to build commercially but the ground would need to be further decontaminated to be fit for more housing, which wouldn't be commercially viable. That is why they are adding as many commercial properties on the site as possible. The Valley however is a brown field site which could be used for housing.

se9addick

razil said:

Have to say I think the statement is better than nowt, and technically it means not only is acv not going to be opposed, but also that the FA and other bodies are in support.

So it has some value. Clearly it is not cast iron but then again what is whomever gives it, with creative wording

Correct. That's actually one of the main things that makes our ACV application stronger than others, that it isn't opposed by the property owner, unlike Oxfors and Manchester United. This was definitely something the chaps from Greenwich Council picked up on when me and Ken met them on Wednesday.

Anyway, quick ACV update here;

http://www.castrust.org/2013/08/acv-campaign-the-story-so-far/

nth_london_addick

we will agree to disagree DRF

RalphMilnesgut

Thanks DRF

SidewaysInOz

Championship chief refuses to rule out moving from historic stadium owned by much-maligned former owner | talkSPORT

Having fought so hard to get back to the Valley I really hope this doesn't have legs.

AndyG

I think this is more of a negotiation tactic. If the vendor thinks you are willing to move and leave them owning an empty property that they can do nothing with they are more likely to want to do a deal with the tenants 

The Red Robin

SidewaysInOz said:

Championship chief refuses to rule out moving from historic stadium owned by much-maligned former owner | talkSPORT

Having fought so hard to get back to the Valley I really hope this doesn't have legs.

I recommend listening to the interview. It’s not what he says really and I don’t think moving is a real possibility. And I’d expect and hope all fans would fight any move. 

msomerton

Moving would be a big blow to support. They need to agree a long term lease with The Duchalet family.
Then get on with any changes to the ground they think will improve it.
A move out and then building a new stadium is expensive. Given what Brentford spent on their new stadium 
would say about£100 million for a new 15000 to 17000 stadium, and where is there room for that is South East London.

carly burn

Never ever wanted to move away, but if it meant getting away from the clutches of Duchatelet then so be it.

IanJRO

Has anyone ever considered a new stadium on the peninsular? 

msomerton

You would think though if you had the money to buy a piece of land and then develop a stadium , then you have the money to  buy the freehold.

bobmunro

AndyG said:

I think this is more of a negotiation tactic. If the vendor thinks you are willing to move and leave them owning an empty property that they can do nothing with they are more likely to want to do a deal with the tenants 

This, this, this.

jimmymelrose

When asked if the club could move away from The Valley, he said: “It’s always a possibility. I think the desire would be to stay at The Valley. It’s a brilliant ground and great atmosphere. It’s fit for purpose.

“But we want certainty of tenure.”

Chill out, he doesn’t WANT to leave.

thanks for the link

Dippenhall

So he could have said - “Never any possibility of leaving the Valley we’ll pay whatever Douchbag demands for acquiring the stadium”

Or he could have said what he said.

Chill.

up_the_valley

Still can't believe that after the Sehurst and Upton Park years we are essentially in the same position as we were then - having to pay someone else to use their stadium. Absolute joke.

ElfsborgAddick

It'll be cheaper to pay Dushitelet than moving.

up_the_valley

ElfsborgAddick said:

It'll be cheaper to pay Dushitelet than moving.

Just say a new stadium with say a 40k capacity would cost 200m, are we better off just paying the 50m he wants for The Valley and training ground? Of course The Valley doesn't have much room for possible expansion.